Scaling an Agency from ZERO to $30k/mo In Less Than 12 Months - Wyatt Beemer

What's up, you guys? We are back. Sales Bro Pod. I think this is episode 19. Mr. Wyatt Beamer. Wyatt, thanks for coming on, man.

Yes, sir. Thanks for having me. Yes, sir.

Yeah, so this is gonna be a cool episode for the audience because I think you're the first guy on the podcast who like You didn't really start as a sales guy. It was kind of just like the natural progression of things that you had to do to have success where you wanted to. So for context for the viewers, would you mind kind of telling people like what you're up to right now?

Yeah, 100%. So right now I own and run and found a lead gen agency. It's around $30K a month. Kind of fluctuates because we run on commission. But right now I'm running that, been running that since late August or early August of last year. So not even a year, but coming up on a year. And I'm also a consultant in Agency Velocity, a community where we help people start and scale their lead generation agencies to $10K a month. So been doing that since February. So yeah, that's been awesome too.

Awesome.

You know, just helping people do it. And it's a whole nother ballgame. And Dylan, you're familiar with that because you have your community. And yeah, so it's been fun. It's been fun.

Yeah. Sweet, man. Yeah. And for anybody listening who doesn't know me or doesn't know why, because I'm sure like when your audience sees this, like they're probably not going to be as much on like sales side of things.

Right.

Wyatt and I first connected back in like summer of last year when like both of us were in really, really different spots than where we are now. And the way that I know Wyatt is he actually built my community landing page, which I still have today. It's a little bit upgraded, but the core pieces are still there.

And— Oh yeah.

Yeah, this was before You know, the lead gen thing was even— I don't know, maybe it was in the picture, maybe you were working on it, but—

Yeah, I think it was. I was like just getting out of it, and you're like, you're the last landing page I built, I'm pretty sure.

Yeah, cool. And you gave me a sweet deal, it was a no-brainer. So yeah, it's still running, still good. And then just being able to stay connected with yourself, like it's been cool. And then also we've done some like a little bit of back and forth referrals, stuff like that. I've definitely sent people your way. So yeah, for the viewers, um, it is cool to see like, hey, a year ago we were kind of both in separate, like, different places and we just stuck to it. And now we're, you know, I would say we're both doing pretty well.

Um, 100%.

Well, let's, let's take it back. Like, let's start from— let's start, uh, I don't know, how far back do we go?

Like, we can go to like the beginning. We can go like to the beginning. I haven't been in the game too long.

Yeah. When did you realize like online business was the path for you?

So that's a good question. So I mean, all throughout high school, never wanted to go to college. School was never for me. Eventually graduated high school. I applied to 2 colleges And filled out like one scholarship, right? My grades weren't like good enough to like really get a, like a, like a really good scholarship. So it wasn't for me. So I took a couple gap years.

Mm-hmm.

And I knew I wanted to start something on my own, but I kind of just waited for the time to come. I kind of, I didn't really search out for it or do research, which I think I should have done, but I think I was just lazy for, so for about like 2 years I was just working. I worked in construction, I worked in warehouses, I worked at like daycares. I had like probably 5 different jobs between that 2 years. I worked at a retirement home and I just knew like this 9 to 5 and having, having my own, like having a boss tell me what to do and just, it wasn't for me. I'm the type of person where I don't, if a boss isn't good, I don't respect you. And when I don't respect you, I don't, I'm like, I'm not even gonna like pay attention to you and I'm gonna disrespect, disrespect you. Like, and you know, I did my best, but I just knew it wasn't for me. I knew I wanted to create my own thing, have my own thing. So yeah, so I moved, I moved outta my parents' house in 2022, January. Excuse me. And then I moved in with a, a few buddies of mine and one of the guys there was actually kind of in the online business space. And he's actually like, he showed me receipts of like stuff he's done and stuff he's already been doing. So I'm like, man, like maybe I was like, okay, I think this is the opportunity I have. Like I've been waiting for it for like a few years and I'm like, man, I'm gonna, I'm gonna go for it. Right. So I went for it and in about, about a year, like a little bit over a year from that conversation happened, here we are. So.

Yeah. Yeah. What was your buddy doing?

So he was, he was a ghostwriter. He was ghostwriting for a few people on Twitter and I wasn't, I was really overthinking like what to do. 'Cause I was like, I don't wanna be a ghostwriter 'cause I'm a terrible writer. And then also there's like a bunch of options. And then I actually, yeah, like you said, like you mentioned before, I landed on web design 'cause I'm kind of like, back in the day, I would say I was a big artist. Like I would draw a lot. So I was like, okay, design and like copy, like I can like learn it. So that's what I landed on after like deciding between like 10 services. And I looked into sales too, but it didn't really, I don't like talking personally. I actually don't like really talking to people, but gotta do what you gotta do now.

Me, I mean, it's maybe not expected, but me neither. Like I'm not a natural salesperson.

Right.

You know, everything I know, like, I had to make a real effort to learn and implement, which I think a lot of people come, they see like what sales can do and like being— what being good at sales can do for them. And then they're like, you know what, man, let me put my, my like introvert— introvertedness aside and just like make some money. That's what I did, literally.

Yeah, no, I think that's like a lot of people doubt themselves. Like when people wanna get into sales, people doubt themselves 'cause like, okay, I don't like talking to people. I don't like people. I'm introverted. I wanna just stay in the back and do my own thing. Like I don't wanna, I don't wanna do this, do that. But in reality, like those people have probably like, will probably do the best.

Yeah.

Yeah.

'Cause like it's, I feel like it's similar to like, and I guess this is with any skill, it's like, When you're working out, you bulk to cut, but if you just— I mean, you could lean bulk, but it just takes way longer. And if you just consume all this stuff in an attempt to learn and then you cut back what doesn't work, starting from zero, I think— I don't know, it's just more effective in my opinion.

Yup. Yep, 100%.

Why did you ultimately decide that web design was like not the thing for you?

That's a really good question. So I was doing my own outreach, building the personal brand on Twitter, you know, tips and tricks about landing pages, doing outreach, seeing people, seeing if people wanted landing pages. I did that for about a few months. And although my personal brand was doing okay, like no one really wanted or needed a landing page, right? It's very timing based. Like with you, you came to me because you needed one, right? And you knew me and you knew I like did the web design stuff. So it's, it's like off of referrals and just timing. And so when doing my own outreach, I— Like, I think I got like one yes out of probably the 500 messages I've sent on Twitter. And obviously 500 is not a lot, but like the young stupid me was like, you know what, this clearly doesn't work. So, but I switched it up. But yeah, I mean, I wanted big projects. I wanted something I could live off of and doing landing pages for $200, $500. And I was like, I'm not a fan of that. I want people to pay me thousands, right? So I'm like, what can I offer? What can I offer to people that, well, they will pay me thousands of dollars? Which I eventually landed on lead gen.

Yeah. How, uh, how big of a part in you getting to where you are today would you attribute, um, like Twitter to?

I would say a lot. Most of my clients didn't come— well, the web design clients mostly came from Twitter. They all came from Twitter. But all my lead gen clients, my lead gen, like my lead gen clients, they didn't come from Twitter. But I would say it played a pretty big role just because of all the good information that was on this, on the social media site. Like So many people were just bringing out so much value and like, right, they're doing it to build a personal brand, but it's real value. Like I was looking at everything, sales, lead gen, marketing, copywriting, anything you could, web design, whatever it may be. And also I wouldn't be in the position I am with Agency Velocity because I had a connection through Levi. I met Levi on Twitter. So if Twitter was never a thing, I wouldn't be in the position where I was at, right? So no, Twitter's been super, super huge. I'm not the biggest fan of the platform, but if you want to build a personal brand and network with and get some opportunities and get some customers, definitely the place to be.

Yeah, yeah, it was huge for me as well. Just like meeting the people that you meet. Like, I'm a coach on, you know, on a couple of teams, like agency growth things, and like, I wouldn't have had that Without Twitter. And obviously, you know, just like Agency Velocity, I mean, different structure, but I mean, primary traffic source, Twitter, for what you're doing and what I'm doing. Not for your agency, but for like the coaching. So it's been huge, been huge there.

It's been lots of opportunities came from Twitter, 100%.

Yeah. So when you stumbled across lead gen and you're like, oh, this is the thing that's gonna get people to pay thousands of dollars for me, like for the work that I do for them. Was it like a recommendation from like a homie or was it you were just on Twitter and you found like some giveaway or what was it?

Yeah, I think so. I kind of came to a decision. I'm like, man, you know what, web design isn't for me. And I didn't want to ask my buddy for advice just because I was like, you know what, I want to do my own research and see what I I would like and see what, you know, will essentially give me the most money, right? So I think just, I found it out, found out about lead generation just scrolling through Twitter honestly, and looking up a bunch of different industries and a bunch of different services that people were specializing in. And studying it, I realized that lead generation is like one of those industries, it's like, it's, there's always going to be a need no matter what, right?

Yeah.

Like web design was like, there's no need unless there's a need. But with lead generation, there's always a need 100% of the time. And it will be like that for a long, long time, right?

Yeah.

So I was like, okay, it's something that the market will always need. And people are willing to pay people thousands of dollars because I also saw screenshots of Twitter, you know, like lead gen agencies making like 50 G's a month. And I'm like, what are they? I'm like, what? I'm like, how's that? I'm like, if they can do it, I can do it too, right? So I think that was the thought process behind it.

Yeah. So you, how did you, how'd you land your first client? Was it, was it a cold email? Like what did that look like?

Yeah, first lead generation client. So this was, it was super interesting. So I was actually labeled like a, I forgot what I was labeled. I think like appointment setter or like whatever. Like it was my first client. Like I did cold email for them. I set up all the systems. But the pay and the structure was kind of weird. But yeah, it was a TikTok marketing agency. I ran some cold emails for them. It was like, I think it was like $50 a call and then like commission on the back end. So I did not get a lot of money from that. I didn't, well, first I didn't book them a lot of meetings, right? I didn't give them a good service. But I could see that it was something that he needed and really wanted and something that I could crack, something I could figure out, something I could write with the right strategy. But yeah, don't have that client anymore, but it was a really good learning experience. So yeah.

Yeah. And I mean, I think you've kind of found your niche now. I don't believe you're working with TikTok agencies anymore.

No.

What was it like going from like first client to first few to really finding like your place in the market? Like, what were some of the biggest, you know, lessons or challenges that you were facing?

Yeah, so I think with The TikTok marketing. So I, my first 2 clients were TikTok marketing agencies. And I realized that number one, it's saturated. Although you can crack saturated markets. I was a beginner. I was like 3, 4 months into this. And I was like, you know what, man, I don't have the experience for this. So I was like, you know what, I'm going to drop them. Like I'm going to switch to a different niche. And for those of you who don't know, I was once a student in Agency Velocity. So I joined Agency Velocity in August of 2022. And from there, we sat— I sat down with Levi and we chose a brand new niche. We chose IT/tech. So pretty, pretty broad, right? That's a lot of companies. That's software development, management, cybersecurity. What else? SaaS could be a part of that, right? So it was a pretty broad niche. So I started super broad with my niche and then got as many clients from that niche as I could. Well, not as many as I could because I got 6 or 7 from that, like from those campaigns. I don't remember the exact number, but 6 or 7. So yeah, and then I started doing outreach for all of them and essentially I did really well for some of them and I did really bad for some of them. And the ones I did bad for, I cut off and refunded. And the ones I did good for, I put all my focus and energy into them and their campaigns and their success. And it all went from, you know, blew up from there. Just putting all my time, money, and effort into clients I've been doing good for and actually get results for leads to you getting more money. So. Yeah.

Right now, are you kind of like working only within one niche or do you still have clients from like other niches that you were doing well for?

Yeah, right now. So right now I'm in one niche. I prefer not to say it, Dylan, if that's okay.

Yeah, yeah, I got you.

Yeah, yeah. So right now I'm servicing one niche, but right now I'm not too focused on taking on any more clients right now. But yeah, focus on one niche. And if anybody wants to come to me with, you know, if they want help with lead generation, I'm always happy to help. But Comes with a price, of course.

Yeah, 100%. Yeah. And you found— so what were you like when looking for that niche? Because I imagine a lot of, you know, just like agency owners or aspiring agency owners are going to be listening. Like, what were some of the biggest things you were looking for in that, like, the niche that, you know, you thought would be successful?

Yeah, 100%. So I mean, I think for all agency owners, it's like, I want to find that blue ocean niche, right? That niche that is easy, gets me a lot of money, and is untapped. Like those are, I think those are like the 3 pillars, right? That like you're looking for in a niche. So will I say that's the best strategy and the best way to go about it? No. But if you're looking for that, I mean, exactly what I did, right? Start broad. dive into a very broad niche. So like marketing's very broad, right? You have TikTok, Facebook, Google, right? That's super broad. Take on as many clients as you can from that niche. And like I said, do your best for all of them. Like how many clients? Let's say you have 10 clients, do your best for all 10. And then the ones you do bad for, cut them off, refund them, do whatever you need to do. And then once you're doing good for, you keep those, right? And then that turns into your sub-niche. So let's say I had a Google Ads agency and a TikTok marketing agency. I took them both on and say I crushed it for Google Ads, right? So it's like, okay, TikTok didn't go too well. I'm not right. We didn't book a lot of meetings. Okay, refund, drop them, whatever it means, hand them off to someone else, and then put your full focus into Google Ads, right? Go into Google Ads, do even better than what you're doing before, build out a case study, right? Record a new VSL. Boom. Now you've got your new sub-niche. So instead of your niche, your old niche being marketing, now it's Google Ads. And then you just kind of keep doing that, right? Because Google Ads is also a little broad, okay? Because now you have Google Ads for e-com, Google Ads for restaurants, whatever it may be. So you can just keep going until you find like that perfect sub-niche that you're killing it for, right? So I think that's how you could find that market that you're really looking for.

Yeah, a lot of beginners are probably in the spot where it's like maybe they had a little bit of success or they got a little traction and then it all fell apart. Now they're in the spot where it's like, all right, time to do it again, which, you know, I know both of us have probably experienced at one point in time.

Yeah.

How many, like, let's call it iterations, like how many times did you have to tweak your offer, to tweak your market, like change what you're doing before you could get to a spot Where you're like, this one is it.

Right. Yeah. I mean, I think I'm always, I'm continuously changing my offer, changing, like, not, I wouldn't say niches, I stick with a niche obviously, but like, you know, switching the market, like the offer, like I'm continuously doing that just because I have to adapt to the market, right? So every time I built a case study, like I got a case study, I built goes out to a new landing page or VSL, whatever it may be, right? I, what's it called? I lost my train of thought. Say the question again.

Like, I was just wondering like the iteration process.

Oh, like, right. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay.

So how many times before you—

how many times? I'd say every few months I did. I mean, 'cause we had TikTok, right? So my landing page was like, okay, we help TikTok agencies, like, get more clients. So it's like, okay, I dropped my TikTok, now I'm focusing on IT. Okay, now I'm like, hey, I help IT companies do this, this, and that. Okay, then we dial that dial down even more. I did good for software development. So I was like, okay, now I help software development companies get this amount of money. So it was ever, like, ever so just continuously changing. And I was just, excuse me, I was just adapting to, essentially how the market was reacting to like me and my service. So it's like, okay, I killed it for software development. I'm going to build out a software development case study. I'm going to put that in a VSL. I'm going to put on my landing page. I'm going to put that in my email, my emails, right? To software developers. Like, hey, we helped a software development company do this, this, this, and that. So I'd say continuously changing. But yeah, I'd say every few months is a good time to kind of look. at your offer and your niche and like what you're doing and just kind of analyze some things and see if you need to tweak anything, change anything. So yeah.

Yeah, I think, I think that's a lot of people, or a lot of people that are newer aren't really expecting that and they probably should be. Like, chances of you getting it right on attempt number 1, like while it can happen, it's very, very slim.

Very, very slim. Correct.

So I wanna, I wanna talk a little bit more about sales. Um, and don't worry, we're not gonna, we're not gonna drill objections or anything. But you, you said earlier in the call, like, you know, you're not really like the guy who's gonna go and you're not like the golden retriever. Like, you're not gonna go and like strike up conversations. Like, you're more kind of to yourself, similar to me.

Mm-hmm.

Um, what's I mean, going from the early days of like first clients to now, like, you know, really gaining some traction and having the team and stuff, like what are some of your biggest sales takeaways so far?

Yeah, so a little background on like my sales. So obviously, like we said before, no experience whatsoever in sales before I got in the game. And yeah, so when I first started my IT niche, like that campaign, I got a lot of discovery calls. So I'm like, at the time I was like 20 years old, 19, however old I was. I think I was, yeah, I was 19. Wait, 19 or 20, doesn't matter. Yeah, I'm hopping on these calls, you know, with these like million-dollar companies. I don't know what I'm doing, right? So I'm just going through it like a structure. Blah blah blah. And I, my first ten calls, I closed five, right? No sales experience, like didn't didn't know what I was doing. I'm talking to million-dollar companies. I'm sitting in, I'm sitting in basically a dorm room on Zoom calls, right? So I'm like, man, like I had to think. Like few months go by, I have these clients and clients are coming to me and I'm closing. I'm like, man, I'm had to think. I'm like, why? Why is there so much success? Like why is like why is this kind of like easy for me, right? Like So I'm like, man, like if you have a no-brainer offer, sales is very, very easy, very, very easy, a very no-brainer and a proven offer, right? So my offer is like, hey, we'll get you these leads, you have to pay per call, and if we don't hit this criteria, I'll pay you back. And we've done it for this, this, this, and that company, right? And they're like, okay, like it's hard for them to say no to that. Right? Because every company needs lead generation, right? And that's also another key factor is like how, like whatever you're selling, how much does the market want, right? Like if you were to sell for software development, that'd be a little tricky. They're bigger deals, it's very timing based. It's not really a need to the market, right? It's just something nice to have. So I think my biggest takeaway is definitely having When you're selling something, having a no-brainer offer, a proven offer, and sales really becomes easy because I had no idea what I was doing. Like Dylan said, I don't know how to handle objections. I would just say the first thing that came to my mind in the call, right? So yeah, I think that was one of my biggest takeaways, 100%. Yeah.

And as someone who's primarily in sales and I've sold a bunch of different things, Like, dude, there's been times where I'm, you know, closing on one team and I'm closing like over 40%, and I'm like, dude, I'm the fucking— I'm the man. Like, I'm the top salesman, all that. And then maybe I go sell something else and it's like the whole team including myself is below like 10%. We're like 5%, which is not good at all.

Doesn't— that doesn't add up. That doesn't add up.

Yeah. So it's like it truly is about the offer. Right now I'm in a Good spot where, you know, I'm still a sales rep for a company and I have my own offers. And luckily the offers on my end and the team's end are like, they're very good and they're very easy to sell. What, how do you, I guess when you restructure your offer, you decide, hey, let me try this for a little bit. Let me reach out to these people. Like, have there been times— and I mean, I know there have been times, but like, can you kind of talk on the times where you realize that the offer wasn't good enough? Like, were you having like quote-unquote sales slumps, or like, how do you know that the offer is really resonating with your market besides Google Chrome?

Right, that's a good question. That's a good question. I think it comes with testing, honestly. Like, because, so my brother at the time when I was selling my lead generation services and I had like a 50% close rate, he was selling solar, right? And he would close around like 20, 25, which is like pretty good, right? But he came to me and I told him this. I'm like, yeah, man, like I had 10 calls, I closed 5 of them. Like it was pretty easy. And he was like, He's like, what? He's like, how is that even like possible? Like you, you don't have any experience in sales, like blah blah blah. So I'm like, I don't know. And he came to the conclusion as well that you have to, you have to have a no-brainer offer. Like it just doesn't make sense for them to say no. So I think the biggest thing is just testing. Like if you take 10 sales calls on an offer, all 10 are qualified, and you're a skilled salesman, and you close 1 out of 10, In my opinion, that's probably not a good offer. What makes a good offer? I mean, I would say measurable end result in timeframe with a unique mechanism and a guarantee in place, right? I think that's what makes up an offer, right? Because if you go to software development companies, most of their offers are like, we build apps and you have to pay me $250 grand. And it's like, that's not an offer, right? So that's why it's kind of harder for them. to hop on calls with somewhat warm prospects and close just because of that. They don't have a real measurable offer and defined offer. So yeah.

What are some things that you've seen to work really well selling to, you know, larger businesses? Like any tips or tricks that you've put to use and had good results with?

Yeah, I mean, Let me think about that one. It depends on the prospect. I've talked to, I've talked to a lot of rich companies and some of them are really cool and some of them are willing to pay. But I think honestly the biggest thing with those bigger companies is proof and case studies. Because I've asked for, like I've, I had a call with a company that was doing like $30 Ms a year, right? Loads of money, right? And the reason I say it depends on the prospect, because these guys were very, very stingy. Like they told me this, like in the call, like they barely paid, they barely like spent thousands on like services. So I'm like, okay, so that's why I say it depends on the prospect.

Mm-hmm.

But another thing they asked me was like, hey, do you have any proof that You've done this? And at the time I didn't have case studies for that specific industry. So I'm like, man, I don't, like I really don't. I was like, man, I was like, and then he was just like, yeah, I mean, if you can't prove to me that you've done it, right? Like it's gonna be hard. So I'm like, okay. So what I did was just show him that I've been booking calls for myself. I booked 5 calls in like a week. Well, I booked like 10 calls in like, I think 10 calls in like 2 days, something like that. Right. So a lot of calls. So he's like, okay, you saw, he saw that I can do it. I didn't tell him I was doing it for myself. I just showed him some campaign stats, right? And he was like, okay. And like he paid me and he usually never pays. And he didn't even want to hop on the call if there was like a setup fee. But he paid because he saw proof that I could do it. And we got that client and we did pretty good for him. So it was a good, yeah. But I think that's the biggest thing, just like proof you can do it. That comes with a good offer, but also comes with a proven offer, right? So—

Yeah. How did you— I don't know, maybe you did like completely commission because I think you said in the beginning you were doing like pay-per-call or I don't know your structure. But when you didn't have results, you didn't have testimonials, like is that what you did? You kind of Not work for free, but like made it a complete no-brainer.

Yeah, complete no-brainer. So this is what we— so this is what you— I actually didn't do this, but this is what I would do differently if I had no case studies, no proof. So what I would do is do a small— I would do a small commitment fee. So like I'd say $500 to $1,000, because when people don't pay you, to me, red flag client. I'm not taking them on no matter how much Opportunities there are there, I'm not going to take them on just because I've had experience where people don't pay setup fees and they're not committed. They don't want to win. They're not going to put any effort in. They're not going to communicate to you. So I wouldn't do that. So what I would do is do like a $500 to $1,000 setup fee just because people can afford that. There's not much to lose on their end, especially if they're rich, right? If they're broke, it might hurt them a little bit, but don't work with broke clients. So, and then the rest of your setup fees. So like a setup fee in a lead generation agency is like $2,000 to $3,000. You plug in that $1,500 or $2,000 you have left into the, like the first 5 to 10 calls. So the first 5 to 10 calls would be like $500, and then however much that adds up. And then after that, it'd be like $250, if that makes sense.

Mm-hmm.

So that's like completely no-brainer. And then obviously On top of that, you place a guarantee. If we don't get you this many calls slash clients, then we'll refund you everything, right?

Yeah.

So yeah. And then you have to do everything in your power to overdeliver essentially.

Yeah, I've worked with a lot of lead gen guys. Like I've sold lead gen before and I've worked, like I've kind of helped a lot of people like with their offers and stuff. And lead gen is one of those where there's so many like Areas you can tweak an offer. Like with a coaching program, it's like, let's make it more expensive or let's add this. But like with lead gen, there's like startups.

There's so many variables you can do.

Share pay-per-call retainers. Yeah, guarantees, like whether you're guaranteeing calls or revenue or pipeline. Like there's so many moving parts. Right.

And this is how, this is how I know It's an offer. So closing, Dylan, wait, as a salesman, does do retainer, the selling retainer, like a retainer offer, is that a little bit harder?

Is selling a retainer for like—

Like instead of like a pay-per-call or like setup or like a one-time payment, like is that a little bit more difficult?

I mean, I would say yeah, like it depends, right? I'm leaning towards like yes because anything that's like pay-per-performance is just an easier sell.

Right, it's no-brainer, it's performance-based. You get paid if you get results. So the— like I'm saying this because I now charge retainer. I don't do setup fees, I don't do Performance-based. Well, I mean, technically I do because I also add some commission and small paper calls. But I charge a retainer and my close rate went from 50% to 40%, right? Not much of a difference, still a really good close rate. That's because I had a no-brainer offer and a proven— I showed them I've done it before like 5 to 10 different times. So it comes down to a good offer. And approve an offer, right? And there wasn't a lot of objections. There wasn't a lot of objections on pricing, which surprised me because once I changed my offer, I thought like, man, I'm going to be closing like 10, 15%, something like that, 10, 20, which is still not terrible, but I'm like, it's still lower, but it didn't change much. So that's when I was like, oh man, like this just has to be like, I'm showing them I've done it a million times and I can do it for them too.

So yeah, it's like the perceived value. Like, you can double the price of something and people will still buy it because, I mean, if it's more expensive, they see it as more of like a luxury and they're like, oh shoot, this is exclusive, like, I want that, you know?

Right.

And obviously you have the results. What's, uh, at this point I'm sure you've had some referrals, maybe some inbound leads. What's the difference in closing like an outbound lead that you sourced via cold email versus like, hey, my buddy with this business wants to talk to you?

Oh yeah, that's a good question. So I actually have had a client like that before. So people on email or people through outbound, whatever way you're doing outbound, they're definitely a little bit warmer just because Like they've showed interest. Like it's kind of like, I don't know, it's like you reach out to them cold and now they're warm. Like you turn them warm, right?

Yeah.

So I'd say, but the difference from inbound, like I've had people come to me wanting my services. And I think the main difference, I think the inbound is an easier close in my opinion, because with a personal brand like me and you have, If people see the credibility you have and you show that through your posts, through your whatever, whatever it may be, like it's a pretty easy close. Like it's not too hard. They know you can do it because they follow you and they, and they've seen, like even if they went through your website, you have case studies on your website. It's like, okay, this guy clearly knows what he's doing. It's right there in my face. Then you, they come to you, hey, my buddy wants this service. And then you get in contact. It's like, sweet, pay, pay, pay whatever, like whatever you're charging, right? They're like, sweet, let's do it. So in my personal experience, inbound's pretty easily, pretty easy on close.

Yeah, and I love how you like, I love how you are where you are by not liking sales because like the more that I get into sales, the more I'm, and especially in this like high-ticket services and coaching space, The more I'm starting to realize, like, dude, more of this— like, it's less about sales ability and it's more about your offer. It's more about your results. Um, and maybe you've heard that before, but you can put like an absolutely terrible salesperson— like, let's say, um, I don't know, like, think of like the Apple Store. It's like you put the freaking high— like the high school dropout, like just this dude who has nothing going, but he's gonna sell like iPhones like hotcakes versus if you put like, if you put like a really, really good sales rep on a poor offer, like, I don't know, they launched some—

Like a BlackBerry.

It's BlackBerry.

Yeah.

Like they're not gonna sell any of them. So I like that you like really nail it down to offer, case studies, testimonials, and then Just being able, like, yes, you have to be competent on a sales call. You can't be an idiot, right?

But at that point, you're solving a pain. And that's the main thing about like a discovery call, right? As you know, like you're digging the pain, you're solving it. That's the way I think about sales. I'm pretty laid back. I don't really do scripts. I'm just like, hey, we're figuring out a problem and we're gonna see if I can fix it, right?

Yeah.

So am I the right doctor for your sickness, essentially?

Yeah, once you have that, the offer dialed in and the case studies, like it becomes more about not messing up the call than like winning the call. 'Cause like you already have the upper hand when you have that experience.

Yep.

I wanna ask you like for your agency, for the agency guys listening, like have you found the most success with like the 2-call close model?

Yep, exactly.

With who you're reaching out to?

100%, just because, so for lead generation, it is very specific. Like if we can't, if someone doesn't have a proven offer, a proven case study, right? Like then we, it's gonna be hard to help them. We can, but it's gonna be hard. So the reason for that is because I always wanted, I was a big fan of one-call closing just because I don't like wasting time, but continuously taking calls, I'm like, okay, I actually do have to take this discovery call. Just because I have to understand this company to see if I can actually help them and not screw them over and screw myself over at the same time. Because if I can help you, I'm gonna be able to ask you questions and figure out if I really can, right? So yeah, that's what we run and that's what we teach in Agency Velocity.

So yeah. Yeah, I think it's like a hot topic right now. Like, oh, the one-call close. I talked for 30 minutes and I collected $5,000 or whatever. Like there's a time and a place for it. And if you try, there will be times where the 2-call close can be a 1-call close. But if it's not one of those times and you try to make it that, like you could blow the deal, you know?

100%.

And there are, on the flip end of that, like if you're running the 1-call close model and they genuinely need a second call and you don't allow them that, like dude, they could have bought but you blew the deal because you tried to push too hard. You know, it's about just reading the room, and that's just sales.

Yeah, reading the room. Yep, exactly.

Yeah, so let's see what, what's, uh, what's a good thing to cover. So I want to talk about, um, because a lot of the audience— I mean, my audience, they're like sales guys, and the common progression is like get some cash flow in sales, learn the skill, and then go and build something, right? Um, in, in your program, do you see a lot of people come from like sales background and then they're like, hey, I wanna, I wanna build something that's my own? Or like, what, what would your advice be for those people coming from that background?

Yeah, yeah, 100%. Yeah, so we have a lot of people from a lot of different backgrounds, sales included. Um, And I think like as a lead generation like agency and someone who owns that, I'd say sales is one of the most important skills to learn, to learn in the beginning, right? Learn how to sell something, sell something, you'll make a lot of money. But yeah, so people who have that sales experience and are looking to build something out, right? In my opinion, I don't think there's any specific thing you should do. I think it's really up to you. Because that's what my brother's doing right now. So I'll tell you a little bit about his story and it connects a lot to this. So my brother was a part of Closer Cartel, I'm sure you've heard of that. And he was learning sales from that group. And it didn't, like, it taught him a lot, but he didn't get like opportunities from it. So like, so to say, but he learned sales, he joined Solar Sales, and he killed that and crushed that. But his main goal was like, okay, I'm gonna learn this skill and I'm gonna go build something on my own. And so he's in a spot right now where he's building up an agency of his own. And essentially, he used to be a barber and he's helping barbers launch, like, basically get more clients, like just marketing for barbers, right?

Cool.

And he already has a client. He's been going on this, he's been working on this for like I don't know, a month, right? And he has that selling skill where it was easy. He hopped on the call, bang, bada boom, bada bang. He's been through it 1,000 times, right? So I think it's really up to you and what your desires are. Because some people who are probably in your community probably have backgrounds in other things. Like maybe it's something in like sports, maybe they played football growing up or something, right? It's like, okay, now you can go sell football gear, who knows? Like, is that really what, if that's really what you want to do. So I think it's up to the person. I don't think there's, Anything. There's nothing holding them back. And it could be anything. It could be an agency, it could be whatever, right? I think it's ultimately up to them. So you can go sell anything now.

So yeah, and then definitely like one thing that I've, I mean, I've had the opportunity to do is like if you are the sales piece, like just partner up with somebody Who knows the other piece that you're missing, whether that's lead gen, whether that's operations backend, you know, all that kind of stuff. And then, you know, honestly, like doing business with somebody else, it's just easier, bro. Like you can do more.

Way easier.

You got 2 minds, like as long as the person is somebody you wanna do business with, like it's 2 people to think things over, like 2 sets of eyes. Double the work.

Exactly.

I know you have people on your team now. I don't know, like, I think you're like the main guy. Like, you don't have a co-founder or anything, right?

Mm-mm.

It's a lot.

I'd say, I'd say, yeah, it's a lot. I'd say it's a mistake on my end. I personally, I'm not too focused on my agency right now. Everything kind of runs on itself. So I'm not necessarily looking for like a co-founder or like an extra mind. But I think it's super, super beneficial. One, well, there's another, a lot of benefits like you just said, but I think that one of the benefits I see, main benefits I see in getting a co-founder is just how much workload you can actually take. So like right now, like our capacity, like we could probably get to like, like my team right now, we could probably get to like 10, 15. That's about max, right? But with 2 minds or even more, you could get to 100. And what does that mean? That means more money, right? So yeah, 100%.

You said you're not like, your agency is kind of on autopilot. Are you, you're mostly focused on the coaching side of things?

Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Cool.

What do you, I know you're a coach, but like, do you, are you doing anything else for Agency Velocity?

So for Agency Velocity, yeah. So I'm a coach slash consultant. I'm currently kind of transitioning to head of product. So everything that we have in the program, just making sure it's up to date, good, as best as we can get it. So right now that's what we're doing. That's what I'm doing. But yeah, so right now I'm focused on that. It's taking up a lot of my time, but it's a lot, a lot of fun. We've been killing it. Clients have been killing it. So yeah. Yeah.

Cool. Cool. Cool. Well, we'll wrap it up here in a bit. I wanna ask you though, like, now that you know this skill of lead generation and you know how to, you know, how to get by on sales calls and you know how to, you know, run a service, like, if everything, everything that you had done up to this point kind of got wiped out except what you know, like, what, what would you What would you do to restart? Would you do the same thing? Would you do something else?

I would 100% do the same thing because 2 things that I know and I've had, I have experience in, lead generation and sales. I've sold probably, I'm only 21 and I sold probably, I don't know, I would say around $40,000, $50,000 in deals.

Right.

So it's pretty young. But number one thing I would do is definitely start outreach for myself. I would definitely do lead generation and I would hop on those sales calls and I'd be confident because number one, I have Agency Velocity where we're learning together and we're building together and we learn from each other. And so from there, I've been getting better at sales even though I don't take a lot of sales calls, right? So now if that even went away, I still have that content. So I take those sales calls and I'd probably have a higher, I'd probably have a higher close rate in my opinion. I think so. So 100%, that's what I would do is start a service-based business, hop on sales calls. I already know how to sell. I've done it, not hundreds, but probably around 50, 50, 60. So yeah, so I'd be pretty confident in offering a service and selling it. So 100%. Cool.

Yeah, I mean, that's, that's the cool thing about like what you and I do. Like, you, you learn the skill. If everything, you know, hit the fan tomorrow, you could just do it again.

I can bounce back. You can repeat, rinse and repeat. It's the same thing we've been doing, right?

Yeah. It, it definitely takes a different mind though, man, because a lot of people, you know, if that were to happen to them, if they're in like a job or something Like, oh, I lost my job, like I'm done for. But like, I feel, and maybe Twitter is a part of the reason, 'cause you're just opened up to so many more ideas and things.

Right.

But yeah, man, if you know like your value and what you can provide for a company, like it's not the end of the world if you have to try again.

Yeah, I mean, it's the same thing with you, Dylan. Like if everything went away, Dude, you know you could go hop on a good offer and sell it and make some good money.

Yeah.

So that's the importance of these skills that we're learning. Because I know like a lot about lead generation and a decent amount of sales, I'm confident I will not run out of money. Obviously if the internet went down today and, but yeah, obviously then. But for a long time, I'm pretty sure I'm not gonna run out of money. I know how to like, 'cause I mean the number one thing is selling it. If I didn't know how to sell it, At all, it'd be pretty hard. I could probably still do it because it's a good offer. But if you learn how to sell something, a good product with a good offer, you're not gonna run out of money if everything just like went down the drain today.

Yeah. And then if you lost all that but you still had the network, like you and I both have pretty, pretty solid networks. Like dude, I always like, I'm in the same boat as you. It's like if everything I had went to shit but I still knew the people I knew, Within 48 hours, I'd have a sales job guaranteed.

Boom.

And it'd be a good one.

So I'd say within— I would say within 24 hours, I'd have a— I would have a call booked. Yeah, a discovery call booked.

That's a fast turnaround. Yeah, man. Well, um, let's, let's wrap it there. I think that was good. That was cool, cool perspective, um, from, you know, not a natural sales guy, but someone who's had some success in sales and Scaling a service-based business. I know you have a couple of offerings for the people, so let the people know, where do they find you? Where do they work with you?

Yeah, so you can find me on Twitter, Instagram, YouTube. Right now I offer Agency Velocity, a consulting company where we help aspiring lead generation owners to scale to $10K per month in 92 days or less. So that will be in the bio of my Twitter. And my Instagram and on my YouTube videos. And also I have a pretty cheap course, $3 course on how to start and scale a lead generation agency. Only $3, has everything you need to start and scale a lead generation agency. One of the best, some of the best content I've ever released. So yeah, make sure to check those out.

Sweet. Yeah, if you guys, I mean, a lot of, I've seen a lot of sales guys go into lead generation. If you're at that point where it's you, You've got the cash flow and you're looking for the next thing. I mean, there's a lot of things out there, but like Wyatt said, lead generation is, it's not going away anytime soon unless the internet goes down. We're gonna have bigger problems to deal with then, but we'll wrap it up there. So I think episode 19 with Mr. Wyatt. I appreciate you coming on, man.

Heck yeah. Thank you so much for having me, Dylan. Appreciate it so much.