A/B Testing in HubSpot: Stop Guessing with Your Buyers, Start Winning

Do you live in a world filled with corporate data? Are you plagued by siloed apartments? Are your lackluster growth strategies demolishing your chances for success? Are you held captive by the evil menace Lord Lack? Lack of time, lack of strategy, and lack of the most important and powerful tool in your superhero tool belt knowledge. Never fear, Hub heroes. Get ready to don your cape and mask into action and become the hub hero your organization needs. Tune in each week to join the League of Extraordinary Inbound Heroes as we help you educate, empower, and execute Hub heroes. It's time to unite and activate your powers.

Well, howdy. Howdy, folks. How y' all doing today?

Just all good. You have no idea.

Wow. Everyone calls. Calm down.

I mean, about a 15.

I'm gonna need you to be in a seven.

That was some energy right there.

Wow.

Let's go.

I have all the energy in the world. No one can stop me.

Okay.

I'm all the way up.

All the way up.

Isn't there, like, nothing can't stop me. I'm all the way up a.

It's exactly.

It's almost like we're trying to get Gigachad going this morning first thing. Oh, God.

Jeez.

Okay.

It's amazing. Wow.

Don't worry about it.

Gigachad.

It was so close. It was so close.

Oh, my God.

It was so close.

I know.

It makes me so happy, but I feel like it just withholds it from me now. It depresses me.

Wait, it's here when you need it.

What the.

I got that thing Gigachad before. No, I have, but it just gets better every time.

It gets better every time, gentlemen.

Almost like your ab testing gets better every time.

Oh, Lord.

Does it or doesn't it?

I don't know. It depends how human you are when you do your a B testing.

George has let the proverbial HubSpot kitty cat out of the bag. Because this week, we are, in fact, talking about a B testing. So over the last two episodes, we've been talking about landing pages, right? And we were so surprised that we had never done any conversations about landing pages whatsoever. But then we also realized we hadn't talked about AB testing either. Like, guys, we're really. We're killing it, guys. Just absolutely killing it.

We're trying to have all the conversations. I'm just saying.

Trying to have.

I came in late to the game, so I can't be responsible for Chad.

Chad. Chad's basically saying, if I would have been here, that would have been the third episode.

I think you recall Chad being in every single audience of every single recording.

Right.

And neither Chad nor Gigachad ever made the point of. Hey, have you guys considered AB testing? You consider talking about it?

Oh, Chad.

No, I did say. Can we talk about Help Desk, though? I love Help Desk.

Oh, we, we need to make that a future episode. So. So the listeners, the viewers know. I definitely want to talk about campaigns because everything's changing and it's all new and we need to talk about Help Desk at a deeper level. Yeah, those are two future episodes.

Yeah.

I love the Help Desk team. They're so good.

Help Desk.

So this is going to be a very special episode of Hub Heroes. I can already feel it deep in the room. So originally we were going to be talking about AB testing as a part of landing pages, but then we realized obviously a B testing is not something that is anywhere near landing page specific. It is something that touches so many parts of the HubSpot platform and ecosystem. It needed its own episode. So what we're going to be doing is grounding ourselves today in what AB testing is at its core. Despite all the AI advancements in automation, quite frankly, the fundamental purpose of why it exists has never changed. But then we are going to start digging into a bit about what has changed. What? Where businesses and marketers are still getting it wrong and how to get the most out of AB testing inside of HubSpot. Gentlemen, are we ready?

Yeah. Let's go.

Oh my God. I got Max claps. I need scared or happy. I love Max claps.

All right, George, I'm excited.

I actually want to turn to you for the first question.

Yep.

So AB testing has been around forever, but its core value, even with all of the advancements we've seen, has never changed. So what is a B testing out at its simplest definition? And why is it still such a critical tool today?

Yeah, well, it is a critical tool today, which blows my mind how many people aren't actually doing it when they're paying for it inside their HubSpot portal. See how Chad just shook his head? If you're watching this, Chad went. Because he's been in portals. I've been in portals. It's there. It sits there quietly top left hand side of your email or top left hand side of your website pages or landing pages. And it quietly waits. Oh my God. Don't. Don't steal my thunder. Don't steal my thunder. Because. Because when I think about, well, you can steal my thunder. I love you, Chad. Okay, so here's the deal. When I Think about a B testing. First of all, it's usually like it's a marketing action. Historically, it's a marketing action. Okay. And it's about optimization and it's about experimentation. You're doing an experiment so that you can optimize the thing that you're trying to. Whether it's the to. To get them to click on a button, to get them to fill out a form, to get them to watch a video, whatever it is, you're. You're AB testing, you're experimenting to optimize the thing that you're trying to get them to do. So fundamentally, that's what it is. Now, Chad kind of let the cat out the bag like I did earlier. There's a whole lot of things in HubSpot that used to be just about marketing that are no longer just about marketing. Marketing and sales. By the way, this is one of the key fundamental reasons I want to talk about campaigns in the future, because campaigns used to be about your marketing campaigns, and it's different now. But. But we'll stick on a B testing because in. In HubSpot now you can do a B testing in sales sequences, which means the revenue driving motion of your organization. I don't care if the button's red or black. I do, actually. I don't care if it's a video or a photo. Actually, I do. I don't care if it's a longer form or a shorter form. I really actually do. But the fact that I can look at the templates that are at the bottom of the funnel, the decision stage, and a B test those to optimize cash flow. Oh, yeah. Okay. Now we're getting somewhere. Anyway, I'll shut up. We'll get everybody else's thoughts.

Well, actually, you're heading down the exact path that I want us to be walking down here. Right. Which is how has AB testing evolved? You started right there with this concept of some of these, whether we want to call them tools, practices, like a B testing is not something that's actually HubSpot specific. You could literally a B test in an offline world with different things. Right. But what I find fascinating about what you just stated is that there are so many practices and best practices that have typically been considered tools in the marketer's toolbox and now their capabilities and who therefore has expanded. So I think that's a really great place for us to start. And Chad and Max, I'd love to get your thoughts on this. Where we see a B testing having grown and expanded and changed I mean.

Grown and expanded and changed. I mean you've definitely seen it like expand in the HubSpot tool itself. Not only from a technological level. We had a B testing and then we have adaptive testing. And then isn't there some sort of new AI one, Right. Which is kind of like adaptive testing but like with AI. Right. But I also like how they're, I mean what George said about how they're expanding it to like give other people. Right. The ability to like do a B testing and not just have it so isolated of the marketers is nice. Right. But you know, I, I mean a B testing was one of those things where like I, I can't confidently say that like when I was a implementation specialist I ever had anyone in onboarding like run an actual legitimate A B test. Right. It was one of those things where it's like, yeah, you can do this thing and like you should do this thing because this teaches you how to be one, a better marketer, but two, how to optimize, you know, your high traffic situations that you have. Right. For conversions and all that kind of fun stuff. But like, I don't necessarily know if I ever saw anyone like take advantage of it. Not because it's a bad tool, it's just because I don't think it's something that like people so actively think about using all the time. And I wish they did more. Right. But yeah, it's, it's interesting. But I think most of the stuff that we've kind of seen has really just been more on like the technology side and less on the I don't know what it's used for side because it's really like when it comes down to it, like it's all in the name A, B testing, which works better, A or B. Like it's just. Yeah, I don't know how much more I could expand outside of the strategy, but I'm sure there's like different things people do that are way more, you know, into it than I am.

Well, the fun thing. So I want to, I want to jump in here, Chad. Then I'm going to be quiet and you can jump in here. The fun thing is before they change the CTA tool to the new CTA tool, back when it was the legacy CTA tool, I actually used to talk about multivariate testing because you could do an A, B and C version, right. And so like, I kind of wish that there was a little bit more of that that could start to happen because I again, this, the CTA tool, it's It'll get there, It'll get there. I mean, you can, you can do it now, but we might get back to where we were and especially with smart content. I digress, I digress. But, but here's the thing, here's the thing. I want to get back to something that you just kind of breezed over real quick, no pun intended, for all the three types. The three types of A B testing. Because you're right, Max. And hopefully people understand this one. A B testing, if you're in a pro account, then there's the. You can do five tests at one time. Right. Which is in the enterprise level. But there's also this where it'll try to find the next a B test for you, which is the AI powered version of this, where you basically, for I think it's landing pages, you set it up and it's. You do your A B test, but then you've got this stuff that spits out and said the next test you might want to do is. And that's pretty dang dope because it's looking at all the historical information to make suggestions to which now we get past or help with the strategy portion of like orange button versus black button or this headline versus that headline. Because it's, it's looking at how people are interacting with it along the way. So just, just know if you're, if you're like, oh, wait, wait, you can do that in HubSpot. Just go do some research on all the different ways of a B testing that you could be pulling off in your portal right now.

Yeah. In the sales sequences, you can do ABCDE testing all the way up to five variants per sales sequence.

Geez, that's a lot of variants.

Yeah, seems like a lot. And I think that's where my brain goes when it comes to like a B testing in general, regardless of HubSpot is pretty much irrelevant unless measured right. Sometimes people just like to throw a little spaghett at the wall. And then we love spaghetti, you know. Yeah. A little spaghetti splat. And they like to just chuck that sucker at the wall and they're like, ah, there's like two noodles left. That must have worked maybe.

Oh, geez.

But I don't know what noodles those were. I just chucked a bunch of spaghetti at the wall.

I have a question. Do I say, Do I say that a lot? Throw spaghetti at the wall.

Baguette.

Yeah.

No, it's a very, Just common phrase in general.

Okay. It is curious.

I was just really happy that he.

Said Free real estate.

Yeah, I like that too. I like.

I may forgive, but I'll never forget. Speaking of mistakes.

Not on the wall. Oh, God.

Yeah. You're welcome. Thank you.

Was that a mistake?

I'm not the only one who can make really bad dad jokes, George.

See? See, you reminded me of this text I sent to my friend over the weekend. It was like two pictures of bees. One was a Canadian bee and one was a US bee. Be in it. Anyway.

Speaking of AB testing, Chad, I want to keep pulling on the thread that you were talking about here because we are not already off the rails at only 12 minutes into the show. We're doing great. This is called deep focus. Chad, you started talking about the spaghetti.

Yes, the spaghetti on Zival.

Okay, you know what? We'll reset this. Can I get a good gigachad saying never spaghett?

Never spaghett?

Yeah, that's what's up. I loved it. So anyway, I want to talk about the ways in which we're seeing people still make mistakes with it. Chad, I want you to pull a little bit more deeply on what you were talking about there. And then, George and Max, I want to hear from you because again, we have a lot of potential with a B testing. We have some expansiveness in terms of the abilities and places and context in which it can be used, but we're not always good with our toys and sometimes this is why we can't have nice things.

Yeah.

So where are people messing up?

Well, I mean, yeah, I think a lot of times, you know, people will try and not test something before they try and take it live. Right. And I think that leads back into, like, when in. In terms of HubSpot. Right. Because obviously we're. We're joking about the spaghetti on the wall, but it's. It's nice that in HubSpot and in the context of HubSpot that they bake in the reporting because it's baked into the tool. Doing the variant creation will measure the variant success. Right. And so it's super helpful that you have a little bit of analysis. But if you're doing an A B test, you have to, like, make a test plan and kind of define how long it should run and then go look at the success after that and then make tweaks as necessary. Like, if you're not going to think about it from a bit of an analytical perspective, then you just should just make tweaks when you feel like your audience is changing. I don't know, you know, like, or don't make Tweaks, but you need to like, actually come at it with analysis in, in some capacity. And the other thing that I think is interesting, and I think people might forget about is workflows have a random percentage branch now. So you can a B test just about anything you want with as many variants as you might want. Well, however many branches you could put in a random. But you could say, like do three branches. 33, 33, 33. Flip a property so you can report on, you know, custom property that reports on which branch of the workflow that thing went down. And you can make a custom A, B, C, whatever, right. That you want using workflows and report on it yourself. So the world of customization with the ability to create your own custom reports is not out of the question. You don't only have to use the baked in goodness of the HubSpot spaghetti.

I don't know why you said spaghetti if it's to me to ask like, where people are getting it wrong. I think that was the question.

It was. Okay, cool.

Just making sure.

Sorry, that's real dialed in today.

No, I am dialed in. I just wanted to make sure I wasn't imagining things because spaghetti threw me way off. Yeah, now I can't stop thinking of it. All right, anyway, don't, don't. Spaghetti. No. Okay, cool. So I think the, the, the big thing is, is like, don't forget about what it is you can learn through AB testing, right. It's almost never just about, oh, how can I get this, like one page to perform better? Like, sure, sometimes it is. But also like, you got to think about what am I, what am I learning that I can apply to other stuff that I'm doing from this specific example that I may be testing? Right. So it's like, you know, you're AB testing like an email, right? And you're like, oh, it says this subject line versus this subject line. Right? Well, what you learn shouldn't end there, right? And be like, oh, yeah, I made it. So, you know, eventually more of the better subject line went out. Right. It's like, no, no, no. What, what was it about that subject line that you think worked and that you proved in your experiment? Right. Because again, every single time you do an A B test, you're doing an experiment, Right. Typically, any good experiment has a what hypothesis? Right. That you're trying to test. Sure. Are there situations where you have like, evergreen pages or things that live there for a long time and have a super high volume of traffic and you're trying to optimize it over time. Absolutely. Just make sure you're carrying those, you know, things that you're learning in that hypothesis that you tested and applying it to other things that you're doing. Right. Don't just kind of leave, don't walk away from a B test without any sort of, like, knowledge that you can apply to other things. Right. The second thing too is if you're not getting a lot of traffic or a high volume of anything that's going to give you any sort of good data about an a B test, either don't run it because it's probably not worth it, or don't put that much stock in the results. Right. So, for example, if, if you're like just starting out your blog, okay, and you're getting no traffic, and you're like, oh, I'm gonna test, I'm gonna, I'm gonna ab test this CTA at the end of the blog post. Probably not worth your time, right? Because if you're not getting traffic there, there's really nothing that you're gonna learn from an a B test. Right. So, like, I'd say if you haven't already focused on getting a high volume of traffic or an high engagement rate with your emails, right. It's probably not worth a B testing things there. Right. And put that effort and time and mental calories towards what can we do to get better traffic. So if we are going to do an A B test later on, right. We're actually getting a lot of at bats to get some good data at a higher volume and a larger sample size. Right?

Yeah. So I, I think this. Liz, I think there's some great stuff that both Chad and Max said. I just want to bullet point this a little bit so that people have the breadcrumbs that they can chase down later after the episode. So we talked in here, you know, testing too many variables at once, that's a big issue. We talked about not running the test long enough. Meaning if you aren't getting a lot of traffic, just know that you're going to have to run the test longer to get something that's actually going to be valuable. Also ignoring the sample size, Max literally just said, I think Chad said it in a way where, like, you have to have enough humans for it to make sense. The other thing is when you're, when you're testing something, it needs to be important. So another bullet point is don't be maybe testing vanity metrics like, don't be. Make sure that it's relevant to, like, conversion or Cash flow. And then the last one is, yeah, I do that AB testing, meaning they, like, set it up, but they never went back and they didn't learn from the results of it like they did. Yeah, it's running in HubSpot. Check done. Like, those are the five things that I would say, run those bullet points and kind of think about those at a deeper level with everything that Chad and Max said kind of in those directions.

Can I come at this from the content strategist point of view? Because it's a little less nerdy.

No, no, no, you're lying. You're lying.

I'm just kidding.

I'm kidding, I'm kidding. Go ahead.

No spaghetti for you. No, I'm just kidding. One noodle. I think about this in a maybe a grossly oversimplified way, but when I think about what makes a great AB test, it reminds me of what actually makes a great piece of content. In that you are very specific about exactly what it is you're testing and who you're testing it with. Because too often I have sat in working sessions and brainstorming where it's, well, we just want to see which one performs better, what performs better, how? What are the precise differences that you have between each? Why did you make those choices? To your point, what have you hypothesized, Max? Right. Like, what are the specific hypotheses that you are trying to test? And I think sometimes people think that takes, like, oh, we got to move fast. We got to break things quickly. It's like, nope, if you're going to test. Actually test something, don't just throw something out there and go, well, we'll see how it performs. Because here's the thing. If it doesn't perform, you won't know why. If it does perform, you won't know why. So you won't. You will either not be able to avoid the mistakes that you made or replicate the successes that you have if your testing is just arbitrary. That's my two cents.

Brilliant.

Agreed.

Thanks, guys.

Agreed.

So let's keep moving on. What are some of the best ways to use a B testing within HubSpot? Now, George and Chad and Max, I know you've already gotten into some nerdy stuff, but I want us to go another nerd layer deeper. Take us on a journey. George, do you want to kick us off?

I'll pick two so that I'm not taking, like, everything from everybody. One, I think that. And when we don't talk a lot about this on this podcast, which we probably should actually, I don't know if we've ever done an episode on HubSpot ads. But with this, with that being said, like you should definitely be ab testing your ads. Different headlines, images, the offer that you're actually putting out there to see like what gets the most clicks and conversions. So definitely HubSpot ads and a B testing should be a thing that you're kind of leaning into. The other one I'll say is emails. It's just a no brainer to me to be ab testing emails. The preview text, the subject line, the image versus video, the, you know, black button versus orange button, the personalization versus no personalization. Like see what your audience actually engages with from an email perspective. Because again, I'm a, I'm a firm believer that email is still a viable and very powerful channel when done properly. So emails and ads. I must have had the, the vowels on my mind to ena is what you should be paying attention to. Well, it's a Texas standoff. Chad or Max, which one of you're going next?

Go ahead, Chad. Sure.

Yeah. I mean for me, one of the things that. Sorry, it was super anticlimactic there. Yeah. One of the things that I think is not really easily able to be AB tested would be SMS messages inside of like a sales sequence because sequences don't offer the ability to like send a message. However, workflows can be aware of what steps a sequence is on or like how many emails have been sent or whatever. So you can kind of like kajigger your way into understanding where you are in the sequence and what sequence that a contact is enrolled in and fire off SMS messages and do a little bit of a B testing as mentioned using the random percentage branches that I was talking about. That can be particularly helpful for like actually, hey, we have this particular, you know, engagement sequence for leads coming in and we want to throw SMS messages in there and you know, go from there. Right. And be able to measure that. So that's like technically one of the things that I think you can do that can be particularly helpful that people probably wouldn't natively try and go out of their way to do if. If SMS is a big part of your messaging channel that doesn't like. Because here's the thing, I love that HubSpot has marketing SMS, but it's not in line with sales sequences because it's not from the rep. It's from a HubSpot SMS number that can do the super marketing SMS and is approved for that or whatever. But your team is going to call them if. If phone is another one of your channels. Again, we kind of have like a bit of a specialized channel set, I suppose, in the industry that I'm in. But calling and SMS messaging from the same phone number is, like, very helpful because it builds trust with the person that you're trying to reach out to, which is where marketing SMS really, I feel like, loses a lot of steam.

I say, like, start by testing the things that you can most broadly apply to all this stuff that you're doing. Right? Like, so, for example, figuring out, like, what CTA style resonates the best and gets people to click on it, right? Because that's something that you could easily apply to like, a million other things you do on your site or like any other place that you're like, putting a cta, right? It's like, hey, we're starting to get some traffic. Let's like, really nail down which, like, you know, color gets clicks, which, you know, what sort of verbiage gets clicks, what sort of placement gets clicks, right? Because then every time you're using a, you know, CTA and like, a different page that you build and you've run that test a couple of times and got some really good data, you can be like, you know what? Like, I just know that I need to put the CTA above the fold and have it be bright red and in this font, right? Instead of, like, having to retest that theory every single time, right? And try to find, like, the most, you know, sort of, like common things first that you can apply most often. Right, right. And get those tests under your belt is probably the best sort of, like, piece of advice I can give. Right? And then, of course, I think the classic thing, and I don't know how much we've actually, like, said it, but, like, test one thing. That's one thing. That's one thing. Don't, don't change. Don't let. Don't change the subject line and the CTA in the email. Just change one thing, right? But also be very, you know, specific about what it is that you're testing and understand what, okay, if I change this thing, I'm looking for this specific metric to change, right? So, for example, the body of your email isn't affecting the open rate. That's just a subject line, right? So like, if you want to say, I want to see how the open rate changes, just change the subject line, right? You know, it's just so, like, be. Be very precise. Do not change a bunch of shit. Because if you do you don't know what it is that changed the metric max.

I love that you're like, guys, gals, have a strategy, understand what your goal is and do a B testing, not a B guessing. That's what you're not trying to do.

Yeah.

The title of this episode is A B testing, not a B guessing. Also, here's something that came to my mind while you guys were talking. And I may or may have not thought of this before, but with the new Multi Step forms tool, I started to think, wouldn't it be interesting if I actually created somewhat of what would be the same form, although I had the steps in different orders to see if it mattered in the order in which I'm actually asking the questions to how far? Because like you, you can now see on multi step forms, like how far in the step that they made it or steps that they made it. So maybe you see like everybody's falling off at like number three, step three. And so now you clone that form and you move the steps around to where step three becomes like step six. And now all of a sudden you see that you get everybody to complete that four more. Because you created a different flow of steps that you could a B test. And the goal was to try to get more conversions. Like that gets real interesting to me.

The big thing I'm wondering, right, is what can you actually like, what are you specifically testing in sequences? Is it like entire branches or is it just like different templates?

Email. Each individual email template can be ABCDE tested.

So it's not like you can test the time difference.

No, the delay can't change.

You can't change the delay.

Just the content of the email or the body or, or the subject or something.

And I love that Chad said, just because, by the way, that could be a lot. But yes, it is. It is the templates that you're able test.

Yep, got it. Okay, so it's not a whole. It's not like you can be like.

Oh, 10 days versus eight days, three days versus.

Okay, got it.

All right.

Although HubSpot, if you're listening, please listen to us.

Yeah, it.

I mean the sequences themselves give. You could dupe the sequence and change the time frames with the same content and report on each sequence over the same time frame yourself. And that's just an A B test in and of itself. It's just not a baked in, you know, baked in baker.

Right.

For a baked in spaghetti thrower.

Yeah. So I heard Chad say. This is Chad saying to every HubSpot user, clone your sequence and send 500 one day and 500 the next day and see. No, I'm just kidding. That's not what Chad said. That's not what Chad said. Do not.

Do not say to throw that much spaghetti.

Don't do that.

I'm just joking.

I can't.

Gentlemen, how are we doing?

Max is great.

Fantastic. I want to look to you, George, to help us kind of rein it in, but I also know that we're.

In trouble then, but go ahead.

Well, actually, I think I might be able to get you dialed in because we're about to talk about one of your favorite topics, which is we're talking about cheesecake. I'm hungry, man.

Right. Well, that's what I used to get when I go to, like, a place where I get spaghetti is.

And we're talking about the cheesecake of the inbound world. And that's mindsets. Talking about mindsets, right? Yeah, we're talking about all of these different ways you can use a B testing. We're talking about mistakes, we're talking about recommendations, we're talking about different teams who should be considering using a B testing. Right. But none of it works unless you're approaching these tools with the correct mindset. So I'd love to hear from you. What are the right ways to approach AB testing strategically? How should teams decide what's worth testing versus what's just a distraction?

Well, it all comes down to the humans, right? And what you're trying to do is you're trying to create a better experience. Like AB testing is part of the experience engine. And so if. If it touches human, if they have to go through it, if they have to read it, if they have to click on it, if you truly believe in your heart of hearts that the product, the service, the solution that you provide is going to make their life better, then a B testing the. The flow, the journey along the way is you're doing it because you're doing it from a human love, caring perspective, not this, like, cold mathematical sales and marketing measurement.

Right?

And so that right there, that mindset just dictates the way that you do this differently. And I think that if I think about mindsets, two things come out of this, is one, you've got to be ultimately curious, right? I've already talked about caring. You're caring about the journey and creating the best experience possible. Now you're curious about what you can tweak and how that changes the experience that they're having. And then I think the third mindset that I'll end with here is just being a learn it all and taking the time to actually look at what you've been delivered based on the test that you've gotten so that you can take action on the insights to again, make that experience better as they move forward. So that's where my brain goes with that. And actually I did get kind of.

Serious with that, so maybe deserve some cheesecake now.

Yeah, I'm gonna Cheesecake Factory it is tonight. Let's go party.

Max and Chad, what about you guys? What do you think?

Oh, he's walking away. No, like I'm trying to, like, I'm trying to, I'm trying to like, like I don't want to sound repetitive, right? Because I think a B testing is inherently this, like I say it's this simple thing, but like you can build some pretty complicated A B test. Yeah, um, it's, it's, I think it's one of those things that is very easy to obsess over it and also waste a lot of time on it too. Right. So just be careful. You know what I mean? Like, like, you know, there's some things that you just spend way too much time on in HubSpot that don't, that don't yield you a lot or that you take like way too seriously. Right. You know, it's, don't, don't let a B testing consume you if there's other things that you should be focusing on. Right. I think AB testing is somewhat of a, of a luxury that if you're doing really, really well with other stuff, then it kind of opens up the door for AB testing to become relevant to you. Right. But I feel like there's a lot of things you should probably nail down first before you get hyper obsessive over a B testing. Right? Such as creating content that people actually like and get to your site. If you've done that and you have a lot of traffic, then you've like unlocked the quest to go figure out a B testing. If you haven't, it's not relevant to you. Yeah, it's like, that's okay and that's okay, right? So even what you test, right? If your open rate sucks, why are you AB testing? Click rate on your emails, right? Like if you're sending your emails to garbage and no one's opening it, why are you doing a click through rate test, buddy? Right? So just, just ask yourself, have I earned the right to a B test this yet?

Well, I, I think, Max, you're spitting gold. Because everything in my brain when I hear you talking about, like, you need to know your priorities. Mm. Like, are you sitting there doing that a B testing and your sales pipeline stages suck, then probably go fix your sales pipeline stages and a B test afterwards. Like, but. But priorities. Chad. Yeah, Chad, what's your thoughts?

I just think don't fret and end up throwing spaghetti.

I don't giga chat long enough. It's never long enough.

It's never long enough.

I don't know.

I just gotta put the music on in the background and we'll just do the show to the music.

That might awesome and annoying at the same time, depending on who you are.

Right.

I love it.

Anyway, no, just don't, don't get all scared and start throwing spaghetti, you know.

Like, don't be scared.

Don't be scared. Yeah, yeah.

Just have a plan, be measured, be ordered. When you've graduated and leveled up, when you're at the third quest in the quest chain, you know, and you finally can do that. There you go, people. People will understand. George.

I'm old because I immediately went to Legends of Zelda for some reason, and I'm like, wait, that's probably not talking about.

I would say one thing I would throw out there in terms of a mindset to keep in mind is like, you can have a high impact AB test where literally the difference between the two things that you're testing is maybe a phrase, maybe it's a line. You do not have to have two completely different contrasting things in order to run a test. So remember to be precise and be specific and understand that small changes can have very large outsized outcomes. I hope you're mine, George. George. Yeah, buddy.

Yeah.

How you doing?

I. I'm doing great. My brain went to. To so I don't know why my brain went there, but I literally was thinking about how I wish people understood this was not a pass fail. Like, we come sharing historical baggage of the word testing or taking a test like. And so then there's this like, well, that was a failure. No, it was a lesson learned. And like, when it's a B testing, I think you have to fundamentally lean into. I'm not trying to pass or fail anything. I'm just trying to learn lessons and optimize along the way. And I almost want to say, I wish more humans.

Oh yeah, test.

Would a B test their life a little bit more?

Oh, geez, brother. That's just. That just means have accountability for yourself. Well.

I feel like that could be taken about 17 different ways.

Never lets us live broadcast on LinkedIn. And once again, I want to point out it is not me and I did not do this.

Ah, yes. Yes. Okay.

Thank you, thank you, thank you.

Go ahead and ask your last question.

Noah.

Cut that out.

George, don't you dare.

Yeah, no. Remember, if you're ever laughing at this podcast, 99% of the time, just cut it out.

This is why we don't do it live.

Yep, we've tried.

We've tried, George.

Land the plane. Take this bus of crazies back home. If somebody listening to this episode only takes one thing away from it, what should it be and why? And watch this be the time. Now that you want to tell me 15 things?

No.

Are you following directions?

One thing. Yeah.

With the sub thing.

No. Testing.

Let me have this.

Yeah, right. A B. Testing is your secret weapon. It's your choice to pick it up and use it or not. The amount that you can impact your organization, the amount that you can impact the users who are going through your flow. It depends on if you're willing to pick up your secret weapon on a daily basis and just experiment and learn lessons. So why aren't you doing it? Okay, Hub Heroes, we've reached the end of another episode. Will Lord Lack continue to loom over the community, or will we be able to defeat him in the next episode of the Hub Heroes podcast? Make sure you tune in and find out. In the next episode, make sure you head over to thehubheroes.com to get the latest episodes and become part of the League of Heroes. Heroes. FYI, if you're part of the League of Heroes, you'll get the show notes right in your inbox and they come with some hidden power up potential as well. Make sure you share this podcast with a friend. Leave a review if you like what you're listening to, and use the hashtag Hub Heroes Podcast on any of the socials and let us know what strategy conversation you'd like to listen into next. Until next time. When we when we meet and combine our forces, remember to be a happy, helpful, humble human. And of course, always be looking for a way to be someone's hero.