Dr Anna Marie Frank : The Hidden Signs Your Nervous System Is Burnt Out

Today's guest is Annemarie Frank. You're in for an absolute treat. Dr. Annemarie, a huge welcome to the Habits of High Performers podcast. How are you doing?

I'm great. Thank you for having me. Honored to be here.

Oh, it's a joy. I've been following your work and we've got mutual friends, and I understand the work that you do makes a huge impact on people's lives. And you look at the whole person, you look at what, where they're at, where they're trying to get to, what's holding them back. So So if we start at the top, very tactically for the listener that's going, hey, what's one thing I should do on a daily basis? What's one habit, one ritual that can really help me to thrive? What would you say comes to mind first?

It's pretty boring, but getting quiet, sitting down or laying down, literally feeling your feet or your body on the ground and taking some deep breaths and just sitting in the frequency and the energy of gratitude or pure love, whatever feels good to you, and taking a few deep breaths to reset the nervous system.

I love that. It's interesting, 'cause so many people that go a million miles a minute, the high performers that are maybe listening right now, it's hard to think, "I can't slow down, I've gotta get up and run." But what you're saying is ground yourself before you begin running.

Mm-hmm. Yeah, I literally had to do it the other day. I was feeling just like really stressed, so many things going on, like just feeling so out of my body. And I was like, what? Like, I know better. I was actually listening to one of your podcasts about breathwork, and we talked about this the other day when I interviewed you on my podcast. And I went home that night and I like this— so there's an app called Soma. I was playing with that app. And I went through and I did some breathwork and meditation for about maybe an hour. I wasn't like checking the time, but I went through like 3 different breathwork and I literally felt so much better, so grounded. The next day I woke up so much more energy and just more clarity. And I think that, you know, as high performers, if we stay in that, that anxious amygdala part of our brain, what it does is it actually cuts us off from that prefrontal cortex, which is our executive function thinking. And as high performers, we need to access that and to have that ability and the creativity. And so, we lose those things when we are in a high stress state, even though it becomes kind of our normal to function at such a high level.

Of course. And I guess there's, we can function at that level for a little while, but when we sustain that, there's going to be some negative outcomes, I imagine. So, we chatted beforehand about tongues, about fingernails, et cetera. So what does the body start showing us? What are some of these signs that maybe we are dysregulated? Hey, James here. I wanted to take a quick moment to let you know about something. Look, I get asked to deliver keynotes and workshops for teams and companies all over the world, from London to Antarctica, from America to Australasia, from armies to small businesses to large corporates to sports teams. But I go in and deliver keynotes around the mindset of high performers, around the habits of high performers, about how we navigate change. If you would like me to come and speak to your team or speak at your conference or deliver a bespoke workshop, please get in touch with my team. Caroline@jjlaughlin.com will be able to help. I'll also make sure that we put that in the show notes.

Well, so first of all, if you are burning the candle at both ends, meaning you have so much going on, and, um, you may think, well, I thrive in that stressful state, or it's your normal. If you actually stick your tongue out and let it hang out and it is quivering and shaking, that is a sign that there is some adrenal stuff going on and your nervous system is saying, hey, I need a break. Also, if your hand— if you can't hold your hand still and just have it like out flat and it's kind of doing this, again, nervous system. Whether I'm meeting with clients via virtually or, um, uh, you know, if they're in person, I'll actually hold their hand and I can, I can feel their nervous system. Um, it gives us so much information on what could be going on, but those are two really, um, shows that you're in high stress. Also, people like their eyelids will start twitching quite a bit. And that can be sometimes from like allergens and things like that, or shifts in caffeine, but it also can be caused by stress. So again, the body is constantly talking to us. Heart palpitation, shortness of breath, laying there and feeling your heart beating really fast. These are signs that the body is saying, "I need you to take a minute." And often we just, we overlook these subtle signs that the body is giving us until the body speaks louder and louder and louder. And then eventually you're wondering why you're in the ER. You feel like you're having a heart attack and it's a panic attack. Hopefully it's a panic attack and not a heart attack. And, you know, your body will say, stop, I've been trying to give you this warning and you're not listening. So it'll, it'll speak louder until it brings you to your knees, unfortunately. But the body is, is intelligent and genius in that way. Because it's not sustainable.

What are things we can do? Obviously, rest is non-negotiable, but what are other things that we can do to help if we are seeing those shaky hands, shaky tongue, etc.?

Well, tapping is a really great thing that you can do. Say you're somebody who is burning the candle at both ends and you're exhausted, like totally, like the worst, right? Like, for a long time you were doing all the things, but now you're like burnt out. On your chest, right at your collarbones, you have right here— if people are watching the video, you can see, um, this is your K27 meridian point, kidney meridian point. If you actually tap this, uh, this part on your chest, this will give you energy. Now, if you tap this point and you take 10 deep breaths, not only do you reset your nervous system, but you're also going to help with internal energy. Maybe you're not exhausted, but you're feeling pretty anxious. You can actually grab like behind your arm, your tricep, take all your fingers and push into the back of your arm where your tricep is and kind of palpate. If you're tender there, that's a sign. You shouldn't be tender. And then underneath your armpit, again, if you're watching the video, with your other hand underneath the armpit, it's like you're hugging yourself. One hand is behind the tricep, one hand's under the armpit, and you're pushing in those points like they're little buttons. And you're holding and making like little circles. And if that's sore, that's a sign that, you know, you're, you're probably anxious. But taking deep breaths and holding those points for— I'll have some people when they lay in bed at night, they just literally, this is like you hug yourself, push on those points, 10 deep breaths, then you fall asleep. And that will help reset the nervous system and just really support the body in, in getting in that rest-digest state.

It's interesting you say that, Dr. Annemarie. So like, I definitely feel tender in both of those areas. And so I travel a lot and I find on travel days, which today is one of those, that I'm a little bit more heightened. So I'm going to try those tonight when I get to the hotel, get settled. I'm going to try that. I'm going to do both points and 10 deep breaths and I'll let you know. Now, what about these fingernails? You talked about something about fingernails. What do they tell us?

Well, um, your fingernails— I actually don't have any nail polish on today, so I can see mine very well. Um, your nail bed should be smooth. There shouldn't be any vertical rigid lines. If there are, that can be signs of digestion disruption, needing more fatty acids. If you have like white dots on your fingernails, uh, little white dots all around can be mineral deficiencies. Sometimes we can see allergens in the fingernails. And then also at the base of each fingernail, um, except for the pinky, you have that little half dome. You see that little dome at the base? Well, you should have that on your thumb and 3 of your fingers, not on the pinky. If you have it on the pinky, usually that is somebody who is high stress. Now, having those domes on the thumb and the 3 fingers is a great sign. That's a sign that you have some good vitality. But some people don't have those anymore. Their domes are gone. And so they could be lacking vitality in the body.

So interestingly, I'm sure everyone that's listening is now looking at their nails, right? I was doing the same and I have those vertical ridges going on. And interestingly, about a year and a half ago, they said, oh, we think you've got a bit of diverticulosis.

Oh yeah, stick your tongue out, if you will, if you're willing to, 'cause I can see you. Okay, yeah, you have really good coloring on your tongue. You do have a little scalloping on the side of the tongue, which is liver. Also, I want you drinking a little bit more water and make sure you have enough minerals so water goes into your cells, because we can drink a lot of water and it goes right through us.

I drink like 3 liters of water a day, or maybe more, some— no, but no minerals, right?

So you need the minerals. And when you— this is Good information, everyone. Every— when you urinate, your urine should be the color of straw. It should not be clear. If it's clear, you could be flushing the minerals you even do.

Always clear.

Yeah, you want it to be like a little bit of straw color. Not— if you're taking B vitamins, it'll be a little bit bright yellow for sure. Um, but, but yeah, so that's a sign of the scalloping liver support. And then yes, with the fingernails, that digestion support is needed for you. And then getting more of those minerals in is going helpful, but your tongue does have a really nice color to it, which is great. If people have like a lot of coating over their tongue, it can be yellow, it could be white. That's again, that's just the tip of the iceberg of what could be going on internally in the body. So, you know, when your digestive system is all about processing mental and emotional demands, dealing with the pressures of life, and then your gut also is, you know, your second brain, if not your first brain. And so when our digestion isn't well, then our brain cannot be functioning at its highest and best.

That's so helpful to know. I've gone on this mission around my digestive system. So I was in Italy in April, had a little bit of issues with the tummy there one day. And since that, it hasn't been right. And so I've had all the scans and it's all looking good. And so now I'm like, okay, where do I go next? What would your next kind of conversation be with me?

Well, one thing is I would really love an up-close photo of your eyes, and I want to see if you have these things called radial furrows in your eyes, um, and then checking a point on the body for parasites. So maybe you have got a little bug or a little something that really just kind of disrupted the microbiome and in your gut health. And so usually if those things are happening, I, I do have two products that I formulated myself that I'll have people take Or I'll let them know what are the raw ingredients that are really going to target and help. Um, so like for example, mastic gum is a really good, um, ingredient. It's one of the main ingredients in one of my products called Bloatless You, because mastic gum, you, you ingest it and it like strengthens that gut lining over time, which is good. So think of that as like your weightlifter, right? And our gut lining can, you know, you don't want anything to permeate it. Um, and due to toxins and stress and things like that, our we can have essentially weak guts, weak gut lining. And then I married it with 3 different herbs, um, and these herbs go in and think of them as like cleaning house. They're like sweeping things up, um, because every day when we eat, we ingest viruses, funguses, bacterias. And here's the kicker for high performers: if you're having gut issues and you're having reflux, silent reflux or acid reflux, and you're taking Tums or Prilosec or something like that to deal with that reflux because it's very uncomfortable, the challenge becomes is you start to make it so you don't have the acidity in your gut that you need to kill off those pathogens. There's a reason why our stomach acid is a 1.5 to 3.0 pH, and that's because when you ingest food and you ingest fruits, vegetables, burger, whatever you're eating, It's going to kill the bad junk. And if you don't have the proper pH because you're trying to get rid of— I, I use air quotes— trying to get rid of the acid reflux, you're putting yourself at risk. And so what I like to do is we clean up the gut and we clean up that reflux in a natural way that's going to allow you to keep that acidity so that sphincter at the base of your esophagus will close. Because it stays open. That's why you're getting reflux. And for it to close, you need to have your gut reach a certain pH, and that signals, close this. Well, if your pH isn't where it's supposed to be, that baby stays open.

Hmm.

So we wanna close that. So anyway, so the next step for you, I would of course ask more questions, figure out what's going on. Because that disruption, I would most likely use some different herbs and things to support those microbes, feed the good gut microbes and then get rid of any junk that maybe came along, whether it was a parasite or fungus, bacteria, something that didn't sit well with you.

That's so helpful. Yeah, I'm about to do a full microbiome map, I think in the next month to see what's going on and see different— if there is parasites and— yeah, so I'll let you know how that goes.

Okay, cool.

For the person that is traveling a lot, struggling with sleep, maybe on the edge of burnout. What's, what's your advice for them?

Well, I think that when we're on the verge of burnout and we're not sleeping, it's because we're out of alignment. We're most likely saying yes to things that we should be saying no to. Most likely we're chasing the carrot. Well, if I, once I get through this thing and then I get through that, then I'll take time to rest. And we all know that, that doesn't happen. Um, so I think it's a matter of taking some inventory, like, what is it that I really want in this season of my life? Because the seasons of our life, things can change. And I think that the old way of— I'll just speak for myself— like, the old way of how I was functioning no longer serves me in the second half of my life. And so I've had to really take a step back and You know, I shared some of this with you, like, what is it that I truly want with my life? Like, what— I can't be doing all the things, and I don't want to be doing all the things because it comes at such a cost that it's just, it's not worth it to me. So I do think when we are burning out and we're not sleeping well, again, these are signs that the body is trying to say you need to take some inventory. We need to slow down. We need step back. And I think that, you know, telling an entrepreneur or suggesting that we slow down is like, wait a minute, how dare you? Like, I've got all these things happening. And, um, I think it was David Olson— this is years ago, like, I don't know, 20 years ago— he wrote the book The Slight Edge, and he had this quote in there, slow down to go fast. And I didn't get it then, but I get it now. And I think that that is a really important piece to really consider.

What does it mean to you right now in this stage of your life to slow down to go fast? How do you apply that?

Well, taking the time like I did the other day to just get horizontal and breathe and meditate. And yeah, there was 50 things I could be doing. Both of my kids were home at the house and I could have been making dinner. I could have, you know, like there's always the checklist. But it's like, nope, I get to slow down, pump the brakes. And then once I got out of my meditation, I was like talking to the kids and we were having dinner and I, we actually played cards and it was just, it was just fun. But I, I wouldn't have had the capacity or the energy to do that. Most likely I would've just sat on the couch and been like, okay, I don't wanna be bothered for a minute. So I think That is like this most important thing is like it just will give you that extra boost to be able to go into the next thing that you need to do with the right energy versus the exhausted energy. Because we can show up and do a lot of things, but if we're showing up and doing them and it's only 20% or it's only 30% of our energy, that environment will feel it. And I believe in the frequency that we vibrate at. That's another thing I like to talk about and how we show up, our intention. And again, if we are on empty, we are not going to show up with that vibratory frequency to attract and achieve the things that we truly desire.

Makes total sense to me. And you talk a lot about the mind as well. So, we've talked obviously about the physical body, but What role does our mind play and how can we actually influence that?

So, I call our mind the inner pharmacy because every single day, based on your thoughts alone, you are choosing what chemicals to dispense, what prescription you are writing yourself. We can change our biochemistry in 150 to 300 milliseconds by shifting a single thought alone. Now, this is powerful. Your thoughts are instructing your cells on what to do. And so I think often we forget that our mind is literally the most powerful computer that has ever existed. Like, people are all excited about AI, and there's some benefits to it and all the great things with AI, but AI only happened because of what we have— our intelligence. My friend Courtney McDermott, she calls it the original intelligence, that software that we have. And when we don't use it, when we ignore that inner intelligence it can be very destructive. And so, you know, the mind is literally— I would say it's the strongest pharmacy on planet Earth. And so what are you choosing to dispense? And often people have these narratives running in their mind, and these narratives are usually based on their past. And the narratives they run on their mind based on past events, they usually attach it with a chemistry of negativity. And so when they think of that thought, they are re-dispensing the pill, the prescription to feel bad, feel like, you know, you've wasted time, feel shame, feel, you know, grief, feel all these things. And then you show up and your actions will be in the vein of those chemicals. So what if those past events that happened— something I work with clients on— what if we go to those past events and we can't change the past? We all know that. But what if we change the meaning we're giving that past event? What if we change the biochemical response so when that past comes up, we have a different biochemical reaction? Now, here's the interesting thing that science has proven. Our memories and what really happened, over 50% of the time, it's not true. If you keep telling yourself something over and over and over again, you start to create neural pathways that that is in fact what happened and that is in fact the true thing. So I mean, that's one way to do it.

It's wild, right? It's incredible to think that. And I've seen this research as well to go most of your memory is actually not factual and it's not 100% on the money. But I think this is interesting for the listener to go, okay, so my body does have all these chemicals that I can actually create through thought alone. So for me, I guess in the mornings, every morning, it's gratitude practice, it's writing, you know, where I'm focused, where I'm headed towards, what I'm excited about. Are those things helpful? Are there any other specific tools that you would recommend for clients to go, this is how you create better thoughts that create better chemicals that go into your body?

Yeah, I think one of the things that we can also miss out on is the thought and the gratitude for the relationships we have. Often we can sit there and think about, you know, the next million-dollar idea, the next event, the next slam dunk, whatever contract we're about to get signed. But I think it's really important to sit in gratitude with the relationships that we have because One thing I've noticed, it can get very lonely as you are leveling up and really working on yourself. Um, the air gets thin, a lot of people will say. And yes, that is true, but it's also true that we can sit in gratitude with the relationships that we still— that we have that are fulfilling us. Because at the root of all of us It is wired in our DNA for connection, for community. And, you know, back in the day, if you were rejected by your tribe, you didn't survive. So what I think has happened though in the modern world is we have been trying to avoid rejection by getting external validation. Versus truly connecting with people. So external validation, look at the car I drive, look at what I just created, look at me, look at me, look at me. I want you to like accept me, want me, I'm good enough, right? Like it's like this energy of I'm proving myself for that external validation versus the true connection of this is me, this is what I do, I love it. If you want to try it, great. If not, that's okay. I'm showing up with my soul first, with this connection, gratitude, attitude, versus what can I get from you, look at what I have. And, and so, and by the way, I've, I've played in both arenas, and I will tell you, the protector piece that says I'm gonna external validation, I want to prove to you, prove to you, a lot of times it's a protector piece because it's like, well, if I— the more I do and the more I achieve then the more people we think will accept us and like us, but it's actually not true. It's more of the connector piece of showing up with your soul, not trying to prove yourself to anyone, not trying to convince anyone of anything, being in gratitude and really helping people. That's where we get true connection. And, um, this is something I'm actually going to give a TED Talk on this, but this is something I've been really looking at. And high achievers, I do think because we get a lot of, you know, our dopamine through that external validation and it can be lonely and it can—

And toxic too. Like when you look at people who are driven extrinsically, money, status, power, fame, yeah, they're getting results and they're growing, but they're lacking this intrinsic driver, which is, you know, doing things for pleasure and joy and connection. And I think the highest performers that live in the game and play the game at the highest level for the longest period of time have this beautiful balance of extrinsic and intrinsic. We all need some money. We all need some power over our own lives. But if that becomes everything, it's toxic, right?

Yeah, 100%.

And I think— May I ask you—

Oh, go ahead.

Yes, may I ask you, Dr. Annemarie, evening routines. We all talk about morning routines and what time to start them and how methodical they should be. But I think morning routines are useless unless you've got a good evening routine.

Yeah.

What does a really good evening routine look like for the nervous system?

That's great. Well, definitely a shower. So just letting the water hit the body is very therapeutic. A lot of people talk about how they like get different thoughts in their mind when they're in the shower and ideas, which is really great because you're there, your guard's down, you're allowing your body to just relax and just be. So I think taking a shower is really great. And I like to mess with the temperature. So if you're going to go a little bit hot or if you're going to go a little cold at the end, the body likes that little bit of shock just for, for brief, you know, 30 seconds to a minute. And so definitely showering, also making sure like the room is very dark because you don't want external stimulation. And a lot of people don't I don't think that they know that you actually have, uh, light sensors on your skin. So like, if you— you can wear the blindfold over your eyes, but if your skin is being exposed to light from, you know, blinking blue things on a TV or whatever, um, that you have in your bedroom— I like— in my bedroom, I don't— we don't have any electronics. Like, the phones go in the bathroom. And they're plugged in. I don't have a TV. Well, I will take it back. The only thing I have is this BEMER PEMF mat that I sleep on, and that's the only thing that's plugged in. But the darkness in the room and then making sure your room is nice and cool is really important.

What's this mat you sleep on, may I ask?

Yeah, it's called BEMER technology. So, it helps with vasomotion and it helps separate red blood cells so oxygen and nutrients can attach. And, it gets rid of some of your metabolic waste, but it also helps to ground you. So, just as you would put your bare feet on the grass or on the dirt or in the ocean, it kind of grounds you. That helps eliminate inflammation and waste in the body.

That's incredible. We'll put a link, we'll find it wherever it is, we'll put a link in the show notes for people to go check it out.

Yeah, for sure. There's a lot of PEMF mats out there. This technology is— and I've tried a lot of different companies, but we use this at my wellness center as well. So I love the technology that it has. So, but yeah, so nice shower, change the temperature in the shower, go from hot to cold and dark room. Lay down, make sure you take some breaths. No electronics in the room if possible, which it is possible. And if you do have any lights like on anything, whether it's like the TV or whatnot, take electrical tape and put it over that light. So it's, you know how some devices just like, they're like always giving off light. So do that. When I go to a hotel room, I unplug the alarm clock.

Like, why? I do it every time. First thing I do, boom.

They're always so bright, and I'm just like, nope. Because, I mean, obviously we have phones now, and so, you know, the phone is, is what the alarm will go off. But, but yeah, that external light is, is going to be— it's, it's stimulating, and we're trying to not be stimulated when we go to bed. I am a big, um, I love binaural beats and playing frequencies. I can play them in my bathroom from my phone. So I'm playing those different frequencies, which is great as well. I love like white noise. I like to have my— I'm the one that likes to have my fan on, you know.

My partner Caroline's the same, you know, if there's something that can kind of— I think when she was young, she had to have a fan on all the time just to get to sleep. And yes, it makes sense. There was a— I'll— Alfredo, there's like a certain frequency of sounds that help with healing. And so I think you've mentioned that you actually quite like those in the background when you're active. Amazing.

Yeah. So like the binaural beats or just like hertz, like 528 hertz is the frequency of love and just Yeah, just playing those. The other day I was like wanting drums. I was like thinking, I want, I'm like, I want drums. And I actually was laying in bed breathing. This, people might think I'm weird, but I don't really care. Uh, I was like hitting my chest and I was like getting a rhythm and breathing. And, um, something about drums was just like coming through for me and it was like, it was really nice to, as a drummer, sit in that energy.

Relate to that.

Oh yeah, you're a drummer.

Yeah, since I was 9, you know, I relate to it and it's weird. I drum with my teeth so nobody ever sees it, but I play like whole medleys with my teeth, with my toes. I play drums, fingernails constantly drumming, and I think it's just quite soothing for whatever reason.

Yeah. Oh, that's so interesting. Oh my gosh. Yeah, absolutely.

We can both be weird together. It's all good.

Yeah, I love it. I love it.

Now, I just want to, want to be mindful of your time, but also want people to connect with you. So, Dr. Annemarie, I'll put all of your socials down below, but also for someone who wants to go deep, like I know a lot of people who listen to the show, they're like, they don't want surface level. They actually want to go really deep with their health, their nervous system, their mindset. Is there anything you can do to support them?

Yeah, I mean, I do one-on-one sessions with clients. From all over the world. So we can do this remotely via Zoom, but just be prepared that if you want to go deep with me, I will ask you to send me a photo of your tongue, of your fingernails, of your eyes, of your ears, of your face with no makeup or no glasses. Um, and we do, we, we take a deep, deep dive and like, what is your body trying to share? And, and wanting you to know. And then from there, I ask you a lot of questions and we just, we try to figure out how do we optimize your, not just your mind and your body, but the frequency, the energy, the signaling that you're giving, giving out to the world because it matters.

100%. Well, for the person that wants to go deep, please go to the show notes and connect with Dr. Annemarie Frank. We also chatted just before we hit record. You've created this awesome assessment so that we can learn more about ourselves. Can you just tell me a little bit more about that?

Yeah, so it's just a quick, it says it's a 7-minute assessment. I mean, honestly, I think it probably most people, it takes them like 3 to 5 minutes, but you just answer some questions and it's gonna spit back to you different brain types. So, you know, if you're an anxious person, it's probably not great that you're doing HIIT training, high-intensity interval training. So I try to figure out based on the answers you give me, you know, what brain type are you? What are the best exercises for your brain type? Maybe nutraceuticals. Here's some books to check out. So based on your answers, you know, if you were in front of me and answered these questions in these ways, these might be some suggestions that I would give you, um, in real time. So it's just a great way. It'll give you a PDF, so download that PDF, print it out. It's just, again, it's just another tool with some ideas and tips for you to like optimize your mind, body, and energy to the highest level that you can.

Thank you. And folks, that is free and it is in the show notes right now. So just take the 3 to 5 minutes, go and do it, learn something about your brain and your body and get some very specific tips that will help you and how you operate in this world. So, Dr. Annemarie, I want to say a huge thanks. I've still got one last question for you. So if you were to fast forward many years into the future and you were highly aware that it was your last day here on Earth and someone very young that you love dearly came into that room and said, "Anna-Marie, what do I do to lead my life on purpose?" What would you say to them?

I would say, listen to that inner teacher. Listen to that subtle nudge, that little voice that is there that loves you, that is there to guide you, because it is— it's literally the, the inner teacher. And I think we can get so busy and so bombarded with so many things that we stop listening to ourselves and to that inner calling. And I have lost myself many times in my life when I wasn't listening. And there's been some painful lessons with that. And so the older I get, the more I'm like, okay, I'm humbled by that inner voice and so grateful for it. So I would say that.

That's incredible. Thank you so much for sharing that. And thank you for what you do for all of us and what you put out into the world. All the links are below, folks. Go check out Dr. Annemarie Frank, and I look forward to our next conversation, Dr. Annemarie.

Yeah, thanks, James.