"How to make your next virtual meeting... Feel Right"

You're listening to TFR, This Feels Right.

Hello and welcome to TFR, This Feels Right. We've got a really great show. I'm really excited about the show. This is This is so timely and this is going to be so helpful to everyone today. We've got Ciara Callahan, Melina Nakos, and Gary Brennan with us. I'm going to introduce them and tell you a little bit more about the show. But if you are new to TFR, This Feels Right, I'm your host, Joel Silverstone. And for over 20 years, I've been helping people in business and sometimes in life to be more influential using their communication skills, to not be manipulative. What that means is there's able to communicate the logic and most importantly connect to the emotion so the other person says, yeah, this feels right. And on our show, we always bring in leaders and experts who have been able to demonstrate and guide others on how they're able to shift behaviors, ideas, and actions. And today's show is, as I said, timely because we are talking about some big changes that have gone on in our world. And most importantly, technology has now taken over. We have gone virtual. And what that means for most of us is that's pretty intimidating. So with our panel of experts, we're going to make this easy. We're going to talk about 3 things. We're going to talk about general tips. We're going to talk about if you are leading a meeting or facilitating or presenting, what do you need to know? And if you're a participant, what do you need to know? So that will be our focus today. Listeners, I hope you'll get some value out of this. and you'll feel more confident and comfortable in using technology. We've got with us, as I said, Kira Callahan. And Kira is the founder of Conversation Gym. She is a soft skills specialist and executive coach. She's also a contributing writer to Huffington Post. And she works primarily with people within the financial services. We've got— Kira, let me check in with you. Kira, how are you feeling today?

I'm doing great, Joel. Really looking forward to this, actually, and helping Small business owners especially get really comfortable with the new reality. Perfect.

Thank you. And then let's go over to Melina. And before I introduce Melina, Melina, how are you feeling today?

I'm really excited to be here, Joel.

Great. Melina Nakos is the founder of Melina Nakos Coaching, and she is a communications coach. She helps leaders prepare for those big internal and external events. What she has seen is that leaders rarely get communication coaching. And that's often what holds them back from being promoted. And Melina wants to change that. Is that correct? Do I have that right?

100%.

Great. And then with us is Gary Brennan. Gary, how are you feeling today?

I'm feeling good. And I'm feeling actually excited and grateful to be involved with this. I think it's a great idea. So thanks for having me aboard.

Thank you so much. It is timely. Gary is a facilitator, communications coach. He is also a public speaking coach. And he is the founder of Between the Words. helping people to deliver excellent keynotes and engaging sales presentations. Did I have that right? Is that correct?

That's good. Yep, that's right.

What we all have in common is we also all have a background in the performing arts, whether it be writing or singing or acting. And so we're able to bring some of those ideas and skills to this conversation as well. So let's talk about this virtual world. Let's talk first about, about the general tips. So Melina, if you're ready, I'd like to ask you, You know, just in general, from a technology side, you know, looking at these virtual summits, whether we're in a meeting or we're presenting, what's just some general tips that we need to know?

Yeah, thanks, Joel. So I would say the basic thing is you just really have to consider when you're on camera what's being seen. A lot of people just don't think of that. They turn on the camera, often sort of surprised, and just go into their meetings versus saying, OK, wait a second, this isn't— candidly going anywhere for a while. So I better figure out how I'm going to present myself. So there are basic things like check what's in your frame. Is your laundry in the back? If it is, get rid of it. Do you have pictures that maybe you don't want people to see? They're very personal. They're family pictures. Whatever it is, deal with it. Set the tone for the environment you want to create. And then candidly, up your game in terms of how you present yourself. There's been a shocking amount of people, I think, that have said, you know what, I'm at home.

Mm-hmm.

what it is, and they show up in sweatpants and a sweatshirt, don't do their hair, don't put on makeup. And I kind of feel like if you would have gone to work like that, okay, but most of us tend to up our game and it's an expectation. So I would say show up the way you would show up at work. You don't necessarily have to wear a suit and tie, but a dress shirt, you like what you guys are wearing, I think that's much more appropriate.

I agree, Millie. I think, I think as you said, it's about setting the tone, which is so important. And your background and how you present yourself, whether you're a participant or whether you're presenting, it sets the tone for how this meeting is going to unfold. Gary, let's talk about now just in general, you know, lighting, camera angles, because lighting is such a tricky one for most people.

Mm-hmm. There are— the more crisp the light, the better you're going to present on frame. And so the color temperature you want is a bright white light compared to maybe what was a traditional living room light that would be a warmer glow. So there are, there are lights that you can get very inexpensively. One in particular is called a ring light.

Mm-hmm.

And it will give you that crisp white light that the camera lens really responds to so that you're not going to get yellow spikes of light in your frame. So you'll be well lit, well illuminated. You won't have to worry about it and it will actually enhance your production value, if you will, While on camera and your presentation will be clear.

Okay, so let's say, you know, nowadays it could be hard. You might be waiting weeks for a shipment of this light. I mean, maybe it'll come in 24 hours, maybe not. Maybe you don't have the money to invest in a light right now. What are some, some basic tips that maybe someone could do for lighting?

Okay, great question. Actually, it's going to be like a setup. What you want to approximate is daylight. Light is measured in a Kelvin temperature and daylight has the most Kelvin temperature. So if you are near a window, You're not going to face your lens into the window, but if you are sitting in front of a window or you have spill from a window, that daylight is going to bring up your temperature for you.

Right.

You don't want to put your camera lens into the window because you will then appear in silhouette. But if you have it coming from the side or you're standing in front of the window with the, with the lens on you, that window light will actually illuminate you fine.

Right. Better to have some light on you than to be backlit where you're just a silhouette.

Basically, you want to be seen.

Absolutely. While we have you, let's talk a bit about camera angle.

Okay. So what we are— for those that are watching, we have what is basically a medium close-up. Medium close-up, the bottom of the frame is just below chest level and you're giving yourself a little bit of headroom on top. You want to be in the middle of the camera so that your eyes are approximately 2/3 In the upper part.

I'm measuring, I'm measuring as you're speaking. Yeah.

Okay, so you want your eyes in the upper 2/3, right? And what that does is that gives you a good frame where you can be seen properly. And if you're in the center, it will give you nose room. Nose room is your distance from your nose to the edge of the camera frame. So you want to give yourself lots of nose room so that if you're looking to the side or you're grabbing a note just off the lens, they're not going to lose your head.

Right. So smart.

Eyes in the upper 2/3. You're seated in the middle. The bottom of the frame is just below the chest. The top of the frame is just above your head.

Love this. This goes back to Melina's point about setting the tone. Put yourself in the middle. Get yourself well lit. Melina?

And just to clarify, this might sound overwhelming, complex, all of the above. It's actually not. You just have to take the time ahead of time to set it up. And in particular, notice to Gary's point, the time of day. So if your meeting's at 4 o'clock, set yourself up at 4 o'clock the day before so you know what the light is out there.

That's good.

Yeah. Rehearse it.

Right. Don't surprise yourself. All right, Kira, let's talk, you know, your background, of course, is, you know, years ago you were singing. So let's talk about voice because it's something we don't maybe think about in the virtual world that we have to basically in the virtual, we have to put a little bit more oomph in our voice. So let's talk a bit about that.

Absolutely. Well, there are a few things to consider. First of all, as a participant or as somebody delivering, you're not always even going to be on camera. Sometimes you don't have the option to be on camera, which means that you don't have all of the visual cues in order to communicate, hey, I'm somebody who has authority. I'm somebody who's professional and speaks with warmth and that sort of thing. So you don't have the visual. All you have is the quality of your voice. So there are a few things for you to consider. So I decided for our meeting today that I would stand up. So I'm not sitting down, right? I'm standing up so that, that means my shoulders can be back. There's extra room for me to take a deep breath and my—

Hang on.

Why didn't you tell me this? I'm sitting down here. I should have been standing.

I don't know. It's the background. It's the singer in me. I thought, yeah, you know what? I'm just gonna do this.

That's smart.

And especially if we're talking about energy, you really want to bring across energy in your meetings, especially if you are the person who is leading. So it doesn't mean I'm going to be sort of a fake hyperactive kind of version of me. It means that I've got my feet planted firmly on the ground. I'm speaking, I got my shoulders back, and I'm connected to the ideas I'm communicating. So that's going to give me the energy to make a strong impression. And whether people can see me or whether they can't see me, it's going to come across well.

Yeah, I love that idea of standing. I think that makes total sense. This is— I'm using a desktop. But if you are using a laptop or your phone, this is a great tip, especially if you know you're presenting, I think. Because I think you said is that your feet are grounded. And as we all know, when your feet are grounded, there's much more energy than getting comfortable or slouching in a chair.

Yeah, that's right. And just to close that actually, because of course not everybody can sort out the standing, right? A lot of the time we will be seated. So if that's the case, sit on the edge of your chair so that you're not collapsed back, right? Sit on the edge of your chair so that you've got— you can move your arms freely and it just makes more room for your chest and you can take that deep breath and have better vocal production.

Okay, there you go, Kira. I just moved to the edge of my seat and already my shoulders became much more square in the camera. And my, my, my voice has become more even stronger. Great tip. Sit on the edge of your seat. While I got you, I think that ties into body language. Let's talk about in general body language, Kira.

Well, I guess this is something related to earlier what Melina was alluding to, which is how do you show up at work? You know, and if you're doing a presentation in front of a boardroom, how do you prepare? How do you walk into that room? So when we're moving ourselves into this digital platform and you are communicating as a professional, really that is the mindset that you want to carry into this digital platform. I'm actually at work here. That's what I should be thinking. I'm at work. I'm here to influence and communicate well. And so that means having good posture. It means, you know, noticing that I'm not slouching down like this or leaning too much here.

Right.

Or staring off to the side. I have my attention where it should be. So all of those things are subtle body language pieces that really communicate, whether it's just by your voice or whether it's what people see.

Yeah, I think the thing about this virtual world is that there's nowhere to hide, right? So the camera captures everything, every thought, as we have seen in other reports and other sort of these sort of virtual videos that have gone out. Let's go now to the idea now that we're leading this presentation. So I'm facilitating the meeting or I'm doing a presentation. Gary, you know, if I'm, if I'm leading this presentation, you know, how, how should I tee it off? What are some of the things that I should be telling everyone as we tee off this meeting?

I would likely go over some protocols. The first recommendation is you would send maybe an agenda ahead of time so that people would, would know what to expect. One of the pieces is to get on maybe 15 minutes early and And find out where, depending on the platform, where the chat box is, because the chat box is a great way for you to communicate questions as a participant. So if I was going to tee off the meeting, I would say, find the chat box because that's how we're going to talk to each other. Secondly, there is an icon with a microphone. Put that on mute unless you're invited specifically by name to volunteer a comment, and you can communicate that through your chat box, but you might want to mute the, uh, the microphone. And then also give a running time of how long everybody is going to be on, uh, on this meeting. So if you were to go in order, it would be, we're going to be on for 30 minutes.

Right.

Use the chat box to communicate and mute your mic. And then it would depend on the protocol whether or not you're actually going to say, we're also going to record this because we'll be able to review it later if you have to leave, if there's a technical problem. But that would depend on the specifics of your culture and what you felt comfortable doing.

Yeah, you know, so it sounds so basic, but think— but thinking about your audience, you know, when we're doing it live, you're always making sure it's relevant for your audience. Same thing. Now your audience is virtual and they want to know, am I going to have to speak? Am I going to be on camera, not on camera? Just let them know. Make them feel comfortable, as comfortable as possible.

Yeah, if I can add to that.

Yes, of course.

Let them know ahead of time. Right. Because I was just coaching someone and they said, oh, you want the camera on? And I thought in my head, I was like, of course I do. We have the option.

Right.

And she wasn't expecting it. And it feels almost cruel to do that to someone if they're not expecting it.

Because everything we just said about setting the tone and maybe the laundry's in the background. Yeah.

Yeah.

Maybe your partner's eating a big thing of nachos in the background.

Totally.

Exactly.

We don't need to see that.

Exactly.

All right. So, Malia, while I have you, let's talk about, you know, talking about setting up the client before the technology fail. You know, we're all nervous about the technology, about, you know, will this— what's going to happen? So, and you've had some experiences where people are struggling with the technology. So let's hear some thoughts around that.

Yeah, I mean, I think we have to be really honest with ourselves that, A, we weren't leveraging the technology historically because we could do face-to-face. So now we're leveraging it. And a couple of things are happening. One is we're not used to it, so we're not prepared for it. 2 is the bandwidth of technology. It's just whether it's at home, we don't have the proper bandwidth because we never had to use video before, or just society.

Right.

You know, if you look at Zoom or WebEx, they are being bombarded with everybody using them. So they're, they're not as stable as they were before. So you've got to plan for that. And a couple of things I say is download the app that you're going to be using on one device to begin with, but then have another backup and make sure you're logged in to both of them and that you have the contact, you know, the login information on both so you don't have to go fishing for the email. Because if one crashes, I mean, I recently lost a client for her whole coaching session because her computer of all things kept crashing. And I finally said to her, I know IT is good. I mean, IT, all these companies, their IT department is bogged down.

Right.

So I said to her, okay, so use your phone, use the data of her phone because then you're not banking on the company, the organization's technology. And she was like, ah! So you just have to plan for it. And honestly, I just don't think any of us understandably expected to be in this position, but we are. And once again, we're not— it's not going anywhere. So we just have to get ahead of it now, or at least catch up.

I just want to say, Melina, you know, here I am, supposedly an expert. I've actually never— it's never occurred to me that I should be You know, logging on and having my app downloaded on 2 different devices. That's, that's such a pro tip. And to build in redundancies. I love that idea. Just to, you know, save your butt ahead of time. I love it.

Yeah.

And because candidly, if the domino effect is the impact it has on you because your client, your employee missed everything. So now you've got somebody that's out of the loop. So you now have to take time to catch them up. So it's a major time waster.

Yeah.

No.

And, you know, and all that— what I've noticed with all this, you know, like Netflix, for example, has lowered— it's no longer— the shows are no longer in high def because so many people are streaming Netflix. So they've lowered the capacity. So I find at home when we're all working from home to tell everyone you're— when you're on a meeting, they can't be on the internet. I found that's made a huge difference. If someone's trying to stream a movie while we're speaking, I have found that interferes with the connection. So be the sole person using the internet at home.

Oh, I got to interrupt for one second. Consider a mesh network.

What's that?

So there you go. So a mesh network— Orbi has them, Google has them, many companies have them. They're the next level of Wi-Fi. It's a more stable network. And I have them in my house and it stabilizes the the Wi-Fi signal across the house. And picture mesh, it's much more stable. So it's sort of the next level. It's not cheap. But in this day and age, it's almost, I would argue, a must to make this more effective for your work.

Yeah, if you're on this vehicle a lot, doing a lot of virtual, and this is your bread and butter, absolutely sounds like an important investment. Kira, let's— I want to ask you another question before I want to ask you earlier. I know you have a great way of thinking of who's at the party, so to speak. Right? So who's sort of sitting around the conference table? So talk to us a bit about that.

Yeah, absolutely. So I feel if I'm going to be able to engage everybody personally and I'm not in the room with them, I needed to have some way to visualize that. So for the folks who are with us on camera, I'm just going to give you— here's an example of what I do. So this is— I've drawn a round circle, which to me is like the boardroom table.

Right.

I just draw it with a marker and I put everyone's name around it as though we were in the room. So it enables me to be able to call on people personally. And it's just much more— it's much warmer. And I find, you know, and if we're audio only, then that's even more powerful because people can feel invisible And people can tune out, right? It's easy for people to multitask and get distracted by something. So the more we can pull them back in with a meaningful question directed to them, the more we can actually use their name to sort of call them back, the more value everybody is going to get out of that meeting.

What I like about that, Kira, is that, you know, I know, you know, technology is not your home.

No, it's not.

And for most of us, it's— for a lot of us, it's not. I won't say most of— for a lot of us it's not. So I like the idea of the old school of just, you know, a visual of a piece of paper writing down the people who are in this meeting and put them around a table so that if you're leading it, or even if you're a participant, just having a sense of who's in the room and who you can communicate with. And I like this. As a leader, it's so important to not just have, you know, blah blah blah blah blah, to be able to go, Jamir, What are your thoughts on that, to be able to call on people and not have to switch screens?

Yeah. And I think one other thing about that is that sometimes when people are, let's say they're not necessarily outgoing, they're more introvert than extrovert, then they really can absent themselves from the engagement in the meeting. And so if you've got that visual for yourself written down and you've got the 2 or 3 people who always raise their hand, who always contribute, Yes. It's easy to fall back on just listening to them because for us it's like, oh, thank God somebody's contributing, right?

Yes.

But in fact, it's important for us to have that visual to go, oh geez, you know, I haven't heard from Neil in a while, or Joanne is— I wonder if she's still here. You know, this is a way to make sure that they stay engaged too.

Yeah, you could even put like little tick marks next to the person, like how many times they've spoken.

Yeah.

Melina, you had another idea as well?

Yeah, something to add. If someone isn't going to use their camera, you can set the expectation ahead of time that they, instead of having the phone emblem or symbol, that they actually have to post a picture of themselves.

Right.

So you see them there. Right. It's so basic and simple, and it takes 5 minutes, 2 minutes to find a picture of yourself. And that helps the facilitator. It helps them kind of go, OK, who is that? Because sometimes it doesn't show up who the name is. It just gives a phone number.

That's right. Or a code or something.

Yeah.

Oh, it's 345. Who's 345?

No idea.

Yeah.

But it's also comforting if you're part of a team to also see your colleague, Jamir or Neil or Jessica is there. And there's the picture of them. And it's comforting to see that when there hasn't been a lot of contact. All right. So let's pause here with our little— we're going to take a little break here with something that we like to call Improv Improve Your Communication Style. All right, so Kira, Melina, Gary, are you ready? And I'll explain what we're gonna do.

Sure.

Sort of.

Yes, sir.

All right, well, we're talking about— we're gonna— after our break, we're gonna talk about, from a participant point of view, what are some things that they can do. But while we're in the— wearing the leadership hat, we're leading this meeting, one of the things is, you know, what can we do as an icebreaker or create some team building or create some sort of interactivity? So let's do a little exercise here that we like to call One Word at a Time. So what's going to happen is we're going to come up with a title for the story, and then I will say one word, then we'll go to Kira, who'll say one more word, Melina will say another word, Gary will say another word. We'll go around twice, and Gary is going to end with you. You'll be the last person to speak when we've gone around twice. The story has to make sense. We have to listen to each other, and we can only say one word. We cannot control the story. We don't know where it's going to go. All right, since we don't have an audience, I'll ask you, the 3 of you, any ideas for the title of this story?

Stuck at home.

How'd you come up with that?

Because everyone is.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, we are all stuck at home. All right, great.

Let's take it.

Let's have some water. All right, so I will start, then Kyra, Melina, Gary. We'll go around twice. Gary, it ends with you. Got it?

Okay.

All right, here we go.

Tuesday, I went out to the bathroom.

And—

Oh, but it has to end with you!

Well—

Oh, did we not go around twice?

No!

All right, uh, all right, so I went to the bathroom and—

And—

I—

Discovered—

A—

Light.

Perfect.

I went to the bathroom and I discovered a light. Absolutely great. It just goes to show I wasn't even listening and I was facilitating this.

Lovely.

Well done, everyone. Give everyone a round of applause. Tap yourself on the back. Great. So yeah, team building, it's not about getting it perfect. We had some fun. The most important thing is that we listened to each other. We got our heart rate going. We got our adrenaline going. We're a little bit more engaged. We're a little bit more awake. We're a little bit more alive. And that's what you want to do in these virtual meetings, any meeting in general. With these virtuals, you have a little bit more permission to have a little bit of fun too with it, right? Because we're giving ourselves that permission that we're all struggling a little bit right now, and it's important to still have some fun into these meetings.

Bring some levity.

Levity, that's the word. Thank you. I just doubled my vocabulary. Let's go now to wearing the participant's hat. So, you know, we talked about leading it. We talked about general tips. Now what happens if you've You've got the invite. You're coming in as a participant. So Gary, you're going to talk a little bit about how to use this chat box. Like, what is this for and how can we use this chat box as a participant?

The chat box, I think it's a great tool because if your mic is muted, depending on the protocol of the meeting, you can, you can provide a question within the chat box, type it out, and not feel that you're interrupting the meeting.

Right.

There may be an assistant who's actually monitoring the chat box while the facilitator runs the meeting so that you'll know that you're being heard and seen through your question. And it also will be seen by everyone else, which gives an opportunity for some commentary on top of your subject. It may be that you asked a question and that will promote someone else to maybe dovetail on your question Or give an example. So it actually is a great way at increasing everyone's engagement wherein the— you won't be interrupting anybody or you won't have to feel that you're interrupting anybody.

Yeah, this is actually a bonus to have this chat box because you always talk about the conversations in the hallway that happened after the meeting. This is your chance to have that conversation in the hallway right here, right now.

Great.

And not feel like you're being rude because if someone— if you're leading this and maybe you got someone to be a moderator Then the moderator is dealing with this and the person leading it can just focus on that. And the moderator will, will say, we've got a few questions here. Or, or maybe they didn't realize that they froze or something's on the screen or they can't see something or something relevant has come up. So I, you know, feel— I think what you're saying is, you know, feel confident and comfortable to use that chat box. It's a great tool.

That's right.

Okay. So Melina, you know, as the participant, All of a sudden, you're now an on-camera actor. All of a sudden, now we're on camera.

Yes.

So this is a challenge because a lot of people are not used to being on camera. And they don't realize maybe they're making some faux pas or some mistakes that they may not be conscious of. So let's talk a bit about that.

Yeah.

I mean, I think to Gary's point, the frame can be very unforgiving. So things you could get away with live where, you know, you check out the window just because you can. And you're not distracting, you're not pulling focus from a meeting. When there's just these screens in front of you, it is hard to miss as a facilitator somebody going like that.

Right.

And it becomes unintentionally insulting. And once again, I'm someone who has a very short attention span. So I literally have to close all of my apps. I have to turn off all of my notifications and I really have to find a way to engage Be present. And something that can be a giveaway for you is if you do keep your apps open. Like, it just happened to me yesterday when I was working with someone virtually, and this is what I witnessed.

All right, they're reading their emails.

It's so hard to miss. It seems so unintentional, but because they weren't seeing themselves because they had their mail program open, they didn't realize how obvious it was. So you really— it's going to be a new a new— it's a new medium. It's something new that we have to get used to. But I don't know if you've noticed, whether it's fitness apps or fitness videos or even meetings, how much shorter they are now.

Sure.

And that takes into account that we just don't have the attention span to sit there. It's not feasible. It's just not logical to ask somebody to sit here and be present for that long. So they've— in a way, we've gotten more time back in our day because our meetings are tighter. So it's in our best interest In your best interest, it's for the facilitator as well to be present. And something that Gary said is, you know, the facilitator ideally is going to leverage that chat function.

Yeah.

So they're going to be asking questions of you. And if you stepped away or if you're checking your mail, that chat question that's sitting there waiting for everybody to reply to, it's going to be very apparent when you haven't answered it. So it's just, it's in everybody's interest to make this medium work.

Yes.

You know, that actually brings up a thought for me, which is because, you know, it's hard for us. We're not leaving our 4 walls. You know, we've got some meetings and we've got whatever other distractions that are happening in our lives, not to mention whatever stresses, financial, business, otherwise. So if we are participating, a good idea to be a good participant and also get value out of that meeting is to set an intention. So if I'm showing up as a participant, am I tuning into something because, you know, it was a course that I purchased? If that's the case, great. Decide ahead of time, what are the 3 nuggets that I really need to get from this, you know, live webinar?

Yeah.

Or if it's a business meeting and I know my boss is going to be there, what is my intention about how I want to contribute and how I want to show up and what I want to get out of that meeting? So just to give ourselves a little bit of focus to help keep us present. So like Melina was saying, we don't absent ourselves or just get distracted.

Yeah, I think that's so good because that goes into our unconscious intentions and the camera is going to pick up the unconscious intentions. You know, it's like, I don't really like this person speaking, so my eyes are going to start rolling unconsciously. But if you make a conscious intention, which is I'm going to be present, I want to get 2 or 3 things out of this meeting. So important to help you keep you focused. Kira, while I have you, let— just before we sort of talk to our final note here, our final thoughts, you know, what, you know, whether you're leading or not, you know, what, what's something we should be talking about from an empathy standpoint? Is this like a time to be selling, or, you know, there's a lot of mixed messages out there. Someone who is, you know, running a small business.

Well, that is a really, really good question because Okay, yes, this virus has ripped its way through the whole economy. It's thrown our livelihoods, you know, completely off track. And so naturally, you know, that hits you at a survival level, right? So that means part of our minds, of course, are going to be, how can I bring in more business right now? But when we come from that survival place, how we interact with our clients, even if, of course, we also want to be of service, Yeah. That survival fear is going to drive a certain energy and a certain kind of manipulative question, which is so opposite from your— the whole purpose of your show here, Joel.

Right.

You know, but it's going to be driving a kind of question that is going to be off-putting to clients. So really what we want to do is lead with empathy right now. So we want to be asking our clients how we can serve. And by the way, when you do that, it really takes the pressure off of you. Because if you're in panic mode, and by the way, I can speak to this personally. You know, the first 2 or 3 weeks when this landed, I was absolutely in panic mode. I was. And I was thinking, oh my God, you know, what can I create right now that I can sell?

Yeah.

I absolutely was. And so it really took me a little while to bump out of that and realize, my God, Kira, instead of Guessing, why don't you ask? So each of us can lead with empathy and have conversations with our clients that really start with, how are you? How are you managing? And what do you need from me right now? And I think that's gonna ground us in a good place.

Yeah.

And, and really connect with our clients.

I think so.

Yeah.

Heads are nodding, Gary and Melina. Yeah. Any thoughts on that?

Yeah. Um, if I may.

Sure.

When we're in that panic mode, we don't have an opportunity to be empathetic because we're thinking of, as Kira said, about survival.

Right.

And it releases something called cortisol, which gets you into that panic flight move.

Yeah.

That can lower actually your immunity system, which makes you vulnerable to the normal stuff that we, our bodies fight. To get you out of that fright, if you actually act in the service of somebody— hey, how can I help you?— it pulls you out of that place.

Right.

And it strengthens you. And it's through empathy, because there are people that are risking their lives on the front lines in hospitals and so many different services that are, are helping things. If we can adjust our mindset to say, I'm here in the service of That empathy actually is healthier. It can also give you perspective, and it also helps the other person that you're addressing get out of that flight. So it's really the best of our better angels, if you will, through empathy that we can change the conversation from panic and then deal with things that we need to in a way that don't feel threatened.

Right. That's great.

Melina, any thoughts?

Yeah, I support everything that everybody's been saying. And to that point, piggybacking on both what Kira and Gary said, I have suggested to my clients, have check-ins one-on-one with your direct reports.

Mm-hmm.

Because the coffee chats, the water cooler chats aren't happening. And those conversations where, like, how's your dog? How's your grandma doing? Those aren't happening at all because nobody wants to do that on a big virtual camera meeting. So it's important to set those up. Not only have a, let's say, a huddle every day at 8:30 for 15 minutes with the team, but then book time in everybody's calendar at least once a week to say, how's it going? Talk to me. We haven't spoken this week. What are you working on personally, professionally? And holy moly, if that doesn't take them out of the cortisol, out of the stress.

Yeah.

And take you out of it because you're in service of, I don't know what will.

No, good points. My challenge is because there's no sports on, I'm not sure what to talk about with people. I say, how about, how about those Canadiens? You think they're gonna make the playoffs?

Maybe next year.

Yeah, nothing to say. All right, on our final note here, let's, let's leave everybody with a You know, a final thought. You know, our show is about making technology— make this easy, have these conversations with everybody, feel comfortable, feel confident. So let's go around and get our final thought. My final thought about this is, like we've all said, and I think this is so important, get on the technology early, play around with it, maybe look at backgrounds, play with lighting, get a feel for it, find where the chat— find— play with all the buttons. Get a feel for it so you feel comfortable.

Yeah. To that end, also give yourself a little bit of empathy.

Right.

And really realize, boy, I mean, it's, it's, you can't state this enough. You are not alone. I mean, the majority of people are going through the same freakout and disorientation that you're going through right now. So review this recording a few times. Pull a few of those tips out. Don't do the whole perfectionist thing. Just kind of let yourself suck at it for a while. Yeah. The more you do it and try, the better you'll get at it. And we're at the stage of this right now where I think people are probably pretty forgiving.

Absolutely. Good point. Melina?

Yeah, I would say because it is a visual medium, put your best foot forward. So Look at your backgrounds. How are you presenting yourself? Honestly, people are going to be looking at your mug for half an hour to an hour. So why not put your best version of yourself up there?

Set the tone, as you said.

Yeah.

Gary?

I think there are 2 things. I think you're going to, as a speaker, if you're presenting or if you're running the meeting, you're going to have an awful lot in common with those who are watching. Because everybody's getting used to this technology and using it more so than they had before. So you have a great common ground to start with, and it's not a bad idea to acknowledge that, that things may not go well and you're figuring it out just like they are. It gives everybody permission to take the pressure off and without surrendering, putting their best foot forward. And the second piece is a technical one. When you have content that you need to cover, Stick it in a Post-it note just off frame.

Great.

Put it in bullet points so that if there's something that you want to talk about, you can grab it, rehearse it beforehand, and then during your meeting, you can just simply grab it and stay connected with people. So a little bit of preparation of what you want to talk about, bullet point it, and take the pressure off yourself to get it right. Just do your best, as Melina said, and your humanity will take you through.

Right. Well, did you have a—

yeah.

Yeah, I'm laughing because, uh, On the Waterfront, remember that movie?

Yes, Marlon Brando.

Yeah.

Yeah, Marlon Brando. Apparently he could not memorize his lines and he literally would put Post-it notes on the other actors' foreheads, on like the door window, everything. So it's like, hey, nobody can see, you can get away with it, leverage it.

Yeah, well, you know what, and maybe that's the future of live meetings too, where we'll just put Post-it notes on people. That could be a team building thing. I want to thank everybody. And you know what, Malini, you brought up a point earlier about reaching out one-on-one. So that being said, maybe after people listen to us, they want to reach out one-on-one to you and just ask for some little bit of help or guidance. So Kira, let's start with you. Kira, where can people reach out to you and connect with you?

Yeah, absolutely. So the best place to find me is on LinkedIn. So LinkedIn slash in slash Kira Callahan.

Perfect. Melina, where can we, where can we connect with you if we want to?

Yeah, you can find me at www.melinanakos.com, the Nakos with a C, not a K. Perfect. Thank you.

And Gary?

You can find me at garybrennan.ca. And my company name is Between the Words. So if you want to email me, betweenthewords@garybrennan.ca. And on LinkedIn.

And on LinkedIn.

Perfect.

Yeah, when all else fails, we can, we can find everyone on LinkedIn.

Message me on LinkedIn.

Well, listen, thank you so much for your time. This was great. You know, I mean, I think people are going to feel much more confident and comfortable that this is doable. And there's actually some benefits to doing virtual, as we heard, some, some little cheat things that you can do that we can't get away with in real life. So this is— I'm Joel Silverstone. This has been This Feels Right. We look forward to speaking with you next week. Thank you so much for listening, and if this felt right and you would like to see this interview, then come on over to our YouTube page at youtube.com/thisfeelsrightpodcast or join the conversation with our Facebook group group at facebook.com/thisfeelsrightpodcast. Or if you just want more influencing tips and communication skills, then please connect with me on LinkedIn, Joel Silverstone, or come on over to Silverstone Communications at www.joelsilverstone.com. I look forward to connecting with you.