👨‍🏫 Guest Masterclass: An Experiential Introduction to Circling w/ Sofia-Jeanne

Hello. Hello. Good morning, guys. Morning, Catherine. Hey, Pablo. Hey, Ritz. Hey, Kevin. Hey, Peter. Hey, Michael.

Hey, Kieran.

So, while we give the others another minute or so, if you'd like to share what you're experiencing in this moment in three words in the chat. Okay. Good. Good morning. Good afternoon, everyone. Thank you for joining. I am. I'm very excited for today. This is one of my. Yeah, I think I'll be kind of participating in this as well myself. I'd love to introduce you all to Sophia Jean. I think I said that right.

You nailed it.

Great. Nailed it. And we are going to be exploring circling today. She is a relational psychologist, writer, and circling expert, and she does circling retreats all around the world, I believe. So with that, let's welcome Sophia Jean to the spotlight. I'll add myself as well. Welcome. It's great to have you here.

Thank you.

I'm excited maybe to kind of kick things off. Could you briefly describe how you discovered circling and why this practice or this modality has. Has landed with you so deeply?

Yeah, so I discovered circling pretty accidentally through some meditation friends of mine, lots of peer influence there. And a friend invited me to his living room one evening for circling. And I had no idea what circling was. And I don't know now if what we did was really circling, but we tried, you know, and we ended up really exploring, like, the experiences we were having as we were having them. And so instead of talking, as we often would, about politics or, you know, what we did yesterday or our plans for the future, we shared with each other, like, what was already happening for each of us. And it was just so interesting to explore that with other people because it was so uncommon. And at the same time, it's like what we're experiencing is always there with us, and we just usually don't say anything about it as if it's not even happening. But it's always influencing what we say and how we're relating. And the thing that I loved about it was that you got to bring that layer of experience into the interaction, which can help shape the interaction and also ends up unearthing a lot of interesting information that you just otherwise don't even know about yourself often or about other people. We make so many assumptions about what's happening for everyone else.

Yeah.

And what's happening for ourselves without ever really, like, checking those things. And I just loved how it brought a whole new, like, layer of possibility into relationship.

I love that. Was that at Maple, out of interest, that you discovered circling, was it?

No, this was Before Maple, but it was through Maple Friends. Okay, got it, got it. So there's a, there's a sideways influence.

Okay. And what would you love for people attending here to take away from today? What are some, some pieces that you imagine them walking away with?

I think there are two. There are two levels and I like to use computer analogies because for some reason they're very useful. And so on one hand they're like these really low level building blocks, mostly attentional, but also in terms of like, emotional capacity. And so we build the ability to notice what's happening for ourselves while we're having an interaction. And so that's one. The possibility for that is one takeaway because often in relationship we actually get quite sucked in to what's happening and we don't actually have the wherewithal to navigate it. And so the awareness piece actually lets you navigate the experience you're having while relating with someone else, which is just like a really powerful skill. And the other one is much more high level, which is that there's a lot of like, spontaneity and newness and satisfaction that can come when you relate with people in more open ways because you're able to regulate your own experience while being in relationship. And so there's that like the skill building, like it's possible to actually be aware of what's happening and stay with it. And it's also possible to start relating in ways that are like, more spontaneous and open and joyful with other people.

I love that. And I imagine for you guys listening, we've been doing a lot of interoceptive practice. And so you guys can think of this as like interoceptive practice whilst you're in relationality with, with someone else or other people. Beautiful. Well, how would you, for people wondering, how would you define or describe circling?

So one of the classic taglines is that circling is a group experience where we bring present moment awareness to what's happening in the moment. So kind of like I shared with the story of my intro to circling, instead of focusing on what happened yesterday or what happened, what's going to happen tomorrow, or even focusing on what we're thinking about all of it. Although that is a component we really focus on what am I experiencing right now, what are the body sensations, what are the emotions, and even like, what are the stories I'm telling about what's happening. Like, this is stupid, or I think that person is checked out, or wow, they look like they're having way too much fun. You know, all of those layers of what's happening right now for each of us. And so we just bring awareness to all of those things which usually are like sidelines or just kind of like under the surface occurrences.

Beautiful. I'm curious, does anyone in the group have any curiosities or questions that are arising? Feel free to raise your hand. Also write in the chat as we're. As we're going. And perhaps in the meantime, how do you imagine today unfolding? We have about like 80 minutes or so. What do you. What do you imagine the flow for today being?

So I'll give a little bit more intro on circling, and then the rest of it will basically be different practices. There'll be these building blocks that we'll develop. So we'll start more individual. We'll start with just noticing our own experience and starting to name elements of our experience. And then we'll bring that into dyads. We'll do a few different breakout groups and I'll provide either guidelines for your attention, like what to. What to place your attention with and to share about that, or what we call sentence stems, which a classic one that we use is like, right now I'm feeling blank. And you use that sentence stem to kind of prime yourself to share about your present moment experience. So we'll do a mixture of these kind of like sentence stems as well as like orienting principles or places to place your attention, like sensation or emotion or stories or thoughts. And so I'll give guidance around that. And then we'll get a chance to practice in smaller breakout groups some of those skills and just to see what happens. What's it like for you to share about your own experience, especially if it's uncommon. What's it like to ask other people about, like, what's actually going on for them right now and then like, how that impacts you, like when they say something that maybe you don't like, or maybe they say something that you really like and then you're like, oh, God, what do I do now? You know, and like, how you actually manage that entire experience. We'll play around with those things.

Nice.

A lot of it is just this, the relational attention and bringing awareness to where we're placing our attention and where we could place it if we wanted to be really happy.

Okay, I love that. Kieran, you have a question? Do you want to. Do you want to share that with the grouper?

Oh, sure. In the past, I feel like we focused on, especially in the dyads, what we're actually feeling. But I thought, Sophia, you kind of mentioned that you're also putting narrative layers on top of. Is that something we're trying to do? Or it's like it's okay if it happens or like, I guess there could be more guidance for that during the exercise.

Yeah, I can speak a little bit to that. It's a really great question and a really important one. Like, often, for example, if we do a sort of meditation that's very body based, we end up only being aware of our somatic experience. But there's actually this way you can intentionally tune into, for example, your emotional experience. But in the same way that you might have to practice in order to pay attention to your somatic or physical experience, you might also have to practice to pay attention to your emotional experience. Some of us just have emotional experiences all the time and other people don't. But it's really a matter of what you're paying attention to, not just about, like, it's not just like how you are, you know, it's like the pattern of your attention over time. And so if you're not used to paying attention to your emotion, then learning how to like, put your attention on that and feel like, am I feeling sadness? Am I feeling joy? Like, that'll be a new attentional skill. And the thought is the same one. Many of us are very tuned in to our thoughts and really like, believe our thoughts the instant they happen. And like, definitely reality, you know. And so there's just also that level that we can tune into, what stories am I telling about this? And so it's not so much that, like, you want to create that, but that it's really, really useful to have access, access to all three of those levels because usually they're happening in the background no matter what. And so like, for example, sometimes if I'm dealing with a difficult, like, tension, if I'm willing to experience whatever emotion is happening, the tension just itself goes away. And if I try to do it only physically, it's just torturous. But as soon as I'm like, oh, I'm just feeling sad and then I cry, the tension just releases. And the same thing can happen, like, cognitively. Like sometimes I'm just having a horrible feeling and then I realize, like, oh, I'm thinking that, like, I'm just not capable of this. And then when I notice, oh, that's why I'm having this horrible feeling, it's like, okay, this is manageable. And so all three of those levels work interactively. And being able to tune into them can give you more information about what's happening that help explain it?

Yeah, that was really useful. The cognitive layer is very noisy for me, so I often have lots of thoughts. And then it does feel like having to dive deeper. And so it's been a challenge to just only focus on body awareness in the past. So this will be interesting.

Yeah, totally. And one thing you can do, like, if there is a lot of noise, one thing what you're doing is to practice attention somewhere else. But you can also practice pulling out the parts of your cognitive experience that are the, like, the deepest or like, that are most informing what's happening. And so there's almost like, you can almost come up with, like, this thematic sense, like, all of these thoughts are arising because I'm really uncomfortable right now. And so then there's like, oh, what are they doing? What am I doing? What should I be doing? Oh, no. Oh, no. Ah. Ah. What's that over there? And your attention is just kind of like. And you're like, oh, I'm feeling really uncomfortable right now.

Beautiful. Well, I'm noticing excitement in my body and yeah, I have a story. This is going to be fun.

So thanks for your question, Kieran.

Yeah, thank you, Kieran. I'm gonna actually step back out of the spotlight and just fade into the. Into the background and over to. Over to you.

Cool. Okay. Well, hello, everyone. It's nice to see all of you in this way. I'm Sophia Jean, like Johnny mentioned. And my hope really is for today that we can surf our experiences together as they happen. And I know it's a tall challenge, but I'm hoping that at points we'll catch the wave, you know, And I also just want to say, like, whatever you can do to be comfortable and to stay with that experience, I just really want you to do that. And so if you need to, like, live stream your experience in the chat while it's happening, or if you're journaling or if you're petting your cat, or if you're, you know, checking out who else is in this room and, like, seeing what they're all about. Whatever helps you stay with, like, the aliveness of your attentional flow, just try to do that. That is the point of all of this, is to stay with the experience that you're having as you're having it. So even if you're, like, listening to me talking either vaguely or close up, just see if you can stay with your sense of what's happening in yourself and in relation to everyone else. Okay, so just to frame the relational sense of this practice, a lot of our, like, highest highs and lowest lows often happen with other people. And so like having a wonderful relationship or a wonderful interaction can just be like, so, so incredible. And then like having a terrible, crunchy interaction or relationship, or a relationship where there's a lot of conflict or a lot of misunderstanding can just be, it can be really low. And we're, we're just, we're so, so impacted by other people often especially our close relationships. And so the opportunity is to bring our attention to what's actually happening. It's, it's almost like the sense that in a relationship we're constantly throwing a ball back and forth and we do that through our body language, we do that through our verbal communication. But there's always, there are always things happening in relationship. And if we can start to see those things that are happening and practice like throwing the ball in specific ways and finding out what happens when we throw that kind of ball or when someone throws a certain kind of ball to us, hopefully we'll be able to understand how to navigate these relationships in ways that will be more wonderful perhaps than the way that we often do it. So that's the basic framing. And we'll mostly today be doing these building blocks because you kind of need to, you need to have the skill of being able to pay attention to yourself and being able to ask someone else what's going on for them before you can start to explore, like more free form versions of circling. Like the, the more advanced form of circling. You're just in a group of people and there's no specific guidance and there's no facilitation and there's this just kind of spontaneous arising of what's in the group field. But in order to do that in a way that actually increases awareness instead of just devolving into chaos, you really need to build the attentional skills first. So that's what we'll be practicing today. Okay, so in terms of getting comfortable zoom settings, hide yourself, you have yourself, you on. Choose the setting that feels comfortable to you. You can play around with it if you like. Seeing yourself, you can experience, you know, oh, well, that's. What's that like? And if you hide it, you can also see, oh, like how does that change my relationship? If you have speaker view, if you prefer gallery, whatever it is that will help you navigate your own experience, sometimes gallery can just be really overwhelming and you're just seeing a lot. But other times you're like, oh, who else is here? Like, that's kind of Cool. And so play with all of that as you, like, moderate your own experience and in the group. Okay. Second is physical. Try to be somewhat physically comfortable. If you're really physically uncomfortable, it just, it's really hard to interact with people in a way that will be, like, pleasing to you because you're just gonna be like, oh, when? When is it gonna be over? So I can finally be comfortable and, like, shut my computer and lie down on my couch. So if you wanna lie down on your couch, just, like, lie down on your couch and, like, put your video in a way that you're still in it, or turn off your video, that's totally fine too. But really, like, I want to emphasize that because it's so much easier to have good relationships when your body is more comfortable while you're having them. And so, like, we don't always need to be, like, lying down on the couch while we're talking to a friend. But especially on Zoom, like, you're like, oh, no, I have to stay on the frame. I have to, like, look this certain way. So whatever you can do to be comfortable, I just really, really encourage that. It'll make everything more enjoyable. And the last piece is the social setting. And so I actually want to start by encouraging you to look at who else is here. And you can do that by turning on your gallery view, under view and just, like, just look, look around. One of the benefits of Zoom is that no one knows if you're looking at them. And so you can actually just. You can look around and no one knows that you're looking at them or at their pictures. You can look at their pictures. You can even look at their names, like, oh, what kind of name is that? You know? But just see, see, like, take a moment to look around and see what you see. And you're welcome to keep your video off if you would rather. And you're also welcome to come on. You can notice your own reaction as you look around. You know, where does your attention go? What is it drawn to, like, all these different kinds of people and all these different kinds of places and see if there's anything you start imagining about other people. Oh, I bet they're. You can wonder about who might be looking at you, what they might be thinking, ah, who knows? You're welcome to share in the chat as well. Anything that's coming up and see how your own breath is doing. Also as you do this, are you still breathing? Did you stop breathing? What are you noticing? Where is your attention drawn? An interesting way to learn about ourselves. Just to see what do we want to pay attention to here. And, like, what when we see it, are we like, oh, you know, and just to be curious about that. What's happening? What's happening for us? Totally checking out the ladies. Are you still comfortable as your body seized up, John, to the smile? Totally smiles to me. Feel. I feel kind of like comforted, like, oh, it's okay. No one's mad at me. They're not mad at me at least. So while you're doing this, you can notice any physical sensations and you can notice any emotion. Make sure you notice at least one of each. All right, we're going to take this one step further. Going to ask you to choose one other person. They don't have to know that you chose them. You're just going to choose them in your mind. You can tell them if you want, but this is an exercise for you. So just choose someone else to focus your attention on. Just because there are a lot of people and it's a lot to look around, you can't really look at everyone at once. And so it can help to choose one person. It'll just be a minute or so. This is an extended exercise. And just let your attention rest with them for the moment. Just notice what emotions arise when you look at that person. You see if you can label them internally for yourself or you can put them in the chat if you'd like. What do you feel when you look at them? Often? Then we have a thought about our feeling. Oh, that's a good feeling to have. Oh, no, that's a bad feeling. I can't tell them about that one. And then switch. Choose someone else and do the same thing. What's going on? What's going on? As you switch your attention. What's going on as you look at the. This new person? Are you still breathing? What emotions are arising with sensation? We often don't have enough time to do this consciously when we're with people, but it's happening anyway in the background. And it can be so wonderful to be clear about what's happening and often helps navigate it a little bit more smoothly. All right, feel free to free your attention of this one person. Do with your eyes whatever you wish at this point. And I'm just going to introduce one more inquiry that ends up being really important when we're with other people, which is this question of where my attention is between me and the other person or the other people. And some of us tend to, like, really pay attention to ourselves either, like, because I'm so amazing. Or like, because I'm so afraid of what's happening. Like, you get really self conscious and so like all of your attention is just over here, right? Either because you're like, wow, I'm doing a great job, or because you're like, oh no, what am I doing? And then for other people, like, we pour our attention into the other person and we're like, it's all about you, what's happening over there. And we lose track even what's here. And so just to notice how your attention flows between you and the other or between you and the group, are you like really in there, like looking at everyone? Are you still aware of yourself when you do that? Are you more like in your own space? And they're kind of like over there, but you're not really, you're not really attending to what's happening. Or is it somewhere in between? And just a notice here, but also in your relationship, how the attention flows between you and the other, how your attention flows. Did that make sense? Like thumbs up if it made sense. Thumbs down if you're like, what? I'll take it, I'll take it. We'll keep playing around with it. Okay, I am going to put a few of these guiding inquiries into the chat for those of you who might like to have a visual aid. Sorry for the poor formatting. I think you'll figure it out. And the point of those is that it can be helpful when we're doing kind of vague relational practices, to be like, what am I supposed to be doing right now? Because you can't just like talk about the weather and you can't just like notice your own body sensations. Like, there has to be more. Because if you're in a conversation with someone and you're only noticing your own body sensations, it's probably not going to be a great conversation, at least for them. You might be having a great time, right? But we have to start being able to share while staying with ourselves as well as being able to ask people about what's happening for them. And so these questions are kind of ways to start navigating your own experience and choosing where you're putting our attention. And so if at any point in the rest of the session you're like, oh, no, what should I do right now? You can come back to anything on this list. You can come back to a body sensation. You can come back to whatever your emotional state is. You can come back to the stories you might be having about it or the thoughts you might be having. And you can always ask, what am I experiencing right now? You can ask, what do I want? What am I longing for? What am I imagining about other people? And you can use those as levers to get more conscious clarity about the experience you are having. Okay, we're gonna kick it off now. So we're going to do. We're gonna do what I call emotional ping pong. Because it's a large group, we're going to start off by. We're gonna play it silently as a group, so we'll see how this goes. But emotional ping pong basically has to do with the fact that as soon as I say I'm nervous, it can change. And then all of a sudden I'm not feeling nervous anymore and I'm feeling something else. And our emotional experience often actually changes quite frequently. Not always. There are. I'm sure all of you experience enduring more enduring emotions, right? But emotional ping pong is this attempt to kind of catch your emotional experience as it moves along. For about a minute or two, you can either mute yourself and say it out loud because the practice is to express for yourself the emotion that you're having. And so you'll just say an emotion word. And then as soon as you say it, you just check back in again. What emotion am I feeling? And you say that emotion word and just keep trying that out. And you don't have. It doesn't. You don't have to be specific about it. It doesn't have to be like, exactly. Right. Just choose a general emotion word that's close enough to what you're feeling. You can also put it in the chat if you like. But just for a minute or two, we'll each kind of ride that emotional wave and try to tune in to the emotional experience and see how it changes or how it doesn't. If it doesn't. If you tend to have a really hard time feeling emotions, what you can do is you can actually choose them first and then try them on. And so if. When you check into your emotional space, you really can't. You're like, I just have no clue. What you can do is you can say, I'm feeling sad, and you can see if it feels at all true anywhere in your body. You can say, I'm feeling happy and see if it feels true to that land. I'm feeling nervous. I'm feeling afraid, happy, sad, scared, or happy, sad, afraid, or like some, some basic, basic ones you can always check. Wow, I just. I don't know what's going on Right now. So if you need that fallback, you can always take that. All right, so we'll start now. We'll just do one to two minutes. Either mute yourself and speak out loud or just type into the chat as you surf that emotional wave. And just try to keep noting. And so even if it's like, I don't know, if you have a few, I don't knows, then try out something, but just try to keep it moving along. Don't get too stuck on anyone. Put mine in the chat. All right, do a few more. Maybe note three more. Three more labeling. Awesome. Cool. So the, the reason that we do that is because it can kind of help like open the emotional pipe by your host, whatever it is, and you can one start to notice what emotions are actually there and also start to notice how they change because they, they really do change. Even if you think you only have one emotion for a really long time, there are moments when you don't. There will be these little moments peppered through of different. And that's important to know because if you don't know that, then otherwise you end up thinking that you're feeling something that you're not actually feeling. And it's, it's, it gets weird, you know, it's just unnecessary. So when you actually check in, you get to see what you're actually feeling, which can sometimes be a nice surprise and sometimes be a bummer, you know, but it helps to be honest about it. So we're going to start to thread these into full sentences because when you're sitting with someone, you're probably not going to be like, afraid, you know, they're going to be like, what are you doing? So we start to communicate in full sentences about the experience that we're having. And we'll do this just through a hand raising, I think, just to try it out. And I will put these in the chat. So these are three sentence stems. Like I mentioned sentence stems earlier, and they just, they help us start to segue our experience into conversation. So we have being with the group, I feel, we have hearing that I feel, which would be like when you hear someone else say something and you say, hearing that I feel, or right now I'm experiencing. And you don't always have to use these. Like it would be weird if you were like always speaking in sentence stems. Right. But they just kind of start helping us prime the sharing of our experience. So you're welcome to raise your hand and just. We'll do, we'll do a few rounds of these just Sharing whatever experience is arising. It can be one word. It can also be more than one word. It can be a whole sentence. Totally fine. And feel free to respond to each other as well. I noticed I started doing that in the chat when I saw other people's. It also affected my emotional response, you know, and so there can be this natural entraining that happens where we start responding to each other as well as to our own experience. Did that make sense? Any questions? Anyone want to kick us off? Yeah, go ahead, Michael.

Yeah, ticking us off. I. I feel a little anxious.

Right now. I feel confused.

Right now. I'm experiencing a desire to jump up, but also to hide.

Being with the group. I feel restless.

Right now.

I'm experiencing confusion.

Being with the group and not facilitating. I feel mischievous and playful.

Hearing that, I feel very warm. I feel connected being with the group. I also feel connected being with the group. I'm feeling curious and fascinated at that hilarity and absurdity and connection and vulnerability of this group. Zoom. Sharing experience. Awesome. Excellent work. You all are naturals, clearly. So I think that I will shuttle you off. Or ocean. We shuttle you off into groups of three and you'll practice these things together so you can practice being with you. I feel. Hearing that I feel right now, I'm experiencing. And you can also just practice the one words if that's how it happens. Sensation, emotion, a thought or a story that feel manageable. Any questions before you go?

What's the time duration?

Yeah, so we'll. You'll have about 10 minutes to play around with these and then a few extra minutes afterwards to debrief. It can be nice to come out of the structure and talk about it together because you're not always going to be in that mode. So play with it for about 10 minutes, see what happens, and then take a few minutes afterwards. We'll send you a note just to talk about it together. What? What. What was it like? What happened? What? You know, what was weird? What was cool? Whatever it is that comes up at the end.

Hearing that, I feel very excited.

All right, let me know when you're ready. Go for it. Take it away. Welcome back, everyone. We'll do what I call a harvest. I did not come up with that word. I don't even know if I like it that much, but it's pretty useful. So we'll do a harvest, which is when we just share bits of the experience that we had. Anything that struck us, that we thought was cool, anything that we didn't like. The place that you have Come after that experience, you're welcome to share stream of consciousness or share small pieces, however strikes you. Yes, Pablo.

Yeah, I. I'm feeling incredibly alive, which is so awesome. In contrast of how I started the call and this. This metaphor that came to my mind during the deep reading is that I'm bringing my toys to the space. And my toys are my thoughts, my feelings, my physical sensations. And then the other person, if they choose to, they can play with that and try them on for size or just see how they impact. So it was really what's really cool to play with my direct experience and someone else's direct experience, and how much fun just came out of that. Thank you.

We do this. We do this thing in some of my groups. You do this. It looks a little silly, but it basically means me too, or I resonate. And it's kind of an easy way to show, like. Yeah, I felt that too. Without 50 people talking at once. Yes. Oh, gosh. Ianis.

Janis. Yes.

Yeah, I. What made an impression of me is how. How safe my body felt really fast. I mean, I was. I was hitting my stomach, garbling and yawning. And I appreciate the fact that we didn't have to go into story. And the amount of intimacy that developed was so quick compared to the time that I knew those people. And then I'm really here to experience, to. To experiment without outside this, the space.

I'm really grateful for the practice. Yeah, we call it gorilla circling when you do circling moves with people in the wild. Awesome. Thank you, Michael.

Yeah, thank you for that. I found it surprisingly enjoyable and engaging, and it was very interesting how quickly that connection developed. It seemed like the narratives that we tend to share, the stories that we tend to share, almost get in the way. They tend to be a mask. And when we get more in touch with our present experience like this, it was so much easier to connect, and it felt really flowing. Really enjoyable overall. And it was interesting. When we went into the debrief, it was almost like, well, how is the debrief really to be much different? I mean, we added a little bit more. A little bit more to it, but. But honestly, not. Not much. It felt very. Just a similar continuation. And I find myself very kind of drawn in, into continuing this practice, just in general. It almost feels like it's pulling me in, in a sense. So just. Just really grateful and really appreciate it.

Yo, what up? Thank you. I have no idea. Yeah, my screen's not on there for my camera. Okay.

Really?

No. Explain yourself. Ashley, phone call. Oh, no. Do we have voices from the other side coming through to us? The astral plane, perhaps? Oh, no, we're not supposed to hear that. Okay. Sneha, I'm so sorry. I probably butchered that. Will you say, tell me how to say your name? And then you. You got it perfectly. Yes.

Neha it is.

Phew. Yeah.

We were discussing this in. In my group as well, and I think for all of us, like, what was. What was surprising was how it felt so complementary in a way to interoception in being able to pay attention and. And respond and see how responding to other people and what they were saying almost not just help that feeling ripple through the group and build more connection, but also help almost hone that focus and sharpen the sense of interception within ourselves as well.

Totally. Yeah. Yeah.

I felt like I was, you know, I was one of those people that put confused quite a bit in the chat before the practice. And it feels like it's a lot more clear to me now after having gone through the process and. And definitely in the smaller group.

Thank you.

And then it's just an observation, but considering that that's having it. So we were just two in our group, and considering that that's having a conversation with a complete and total stranger, it's just a little bit mind blowing for me to think how connected and almost intimate that conversation became and how quickly it got there. So, yeah, it's awesome experience. Very, very cool.

Thank you.

Thank you. Well.

Yeah, I. I was pretty skeptical coming in. I was in, like, a really frustrated place, but it was a lot better than I thought. I, at one point, you know, just kind of felt my anger, like, drop away and started laughing. I was very surprised. Yeah. So it's cool. Thank you.

Very cool.

Yeah.

Yeah. That kind of reminds me of something that happened in our session as well. We. We did a small breakout group in the main room, Johnny and Ocean and I. And there was this moment where things shifted. Can I share about it? Johnny and Ocean, just. This is kind of a tricky moment because I'm like, I'm putting. I'm really putting you on the spot, like, and I don't know you well enough to know if you would be comfortable saying no right now. But I'm gonna hope that, like, because it's not any personal information that, you know, we'll talk about it later if anything goes wrong. Okay. So something that happened in our group is that I'll tell my own. My own perspective on it. They might have very different perspectives on it, but we went from kind of, like sitting kind of still and naming things to this turn where we actually got up and started moving. Like, I was just like, oh, you know, like, shaking my body. And when all of us started moving, there was this shift from, like, having to, I think, Johnny, you said, like, having to be in the middle of the frame to, like, really feeling free just to, you know, be in your own, like, actual physical space. And there's this way that, like, we have the shift in the norms sometimes where we go from, like, this, like, implicit shared group assumption that we have to do this a certain way to, like, the freedom of, like, how do I actually want to move right now? And, like, can that be okay here, too? And that can be a really, like. Like a sort of, like, liberating experience. I think Ocean, you said, like, it, like, freed up some energy. Like when you're not trying to do that thing that's supposed to look the way that you're supposed to look on Zoom or something. Like, cool. Okay, so we are going to try out one more in the full group and then we'll do one more, probably slightly shorter breakout. And this, this is the part where it becomes even more relational because so far we've been sharing ourselves and we've been sharing the impact other people have on Earth. So we say, I feel this or hearing that. We show the impact I feel. And we haven't done as much about what we think might be going on for the other person or what we want to know about the other person. And so these, these prompts kind of bring it to the next level of relationality. So the first one is just to say, hello, person. You can name someone in the room I'm feeling curious about you. What's going on for you right now? What are you experiencing? And so it's a little edgier, right, because you're, like, calling someone out first. You're telling them that you're paying attention to them, which, like, primarily was occluded by Zoom. And then you're also asking them what's going on with them, and you have no idea what's going on with them, and you have no idea what they will tell you. Right? And so it gets. It gets a little. It gets a little bit more unknown, but also it gets interesting because you get to share where your attention is going and you get to find out what's happening on the other side of it. So we'll do a few rounds of that. And let's do it. Let's do a raised hand style. Just so it doesn't get too cacophonous. So if there's. If. If you're willing. If you're willing to be one of the brave souls, put up your hand and you can say, I'm feeling curious about. And then name someone out and ask, what are you experiencing right now? I'll put that in here. And the second part of that is that if someone calls on you and someone says, I'm curious about you, you don't have to say anything. In circling. We're. We're very serious about. There's no obligation to respond. There's never any obligation to share your internal experience. There's never, never any obligation to even acknowledge that someone asked you a question. Right. Like, we lift. We lift the relational obligations, but we stay with the honesty of our own response. Right. And so if someone says your name, you don't have to say anything, but if you'd like to, you can share what's actually happening. Like, it's okay to share what's actually happening if you would like. All right, enough talk. Pablo, thank you.

Jennifer, I'm feeling wondrous about you right now, and I'd love to hear what's the temperature in your room?

Oh, the temperature in the room. So right now I'm experiencing irony, I guess, because I'm so bundled up. It's probably. I don't know, it's probably 55 Fahrenheit. It's cool. It's very cool up here. Thank you for asking. Anyone else want to give it a go? It's not that scary. People are usually pretty nice. Not always, but usually. Janice, Go for it.

Jasmine, I'm feeling curious about you. What are you experiencing right now?

Hi. Honest and group. I'm feeling like I was trying to look boring, not interesting. I'm feeling like I was trying to look not interesting. And I feel like this is a fun game, and I'm very entertained by it. Thank you. And I will. I will go next. Catherine, I am loving your glasses and the bright art behind you and your beautiful plants. And I'm feeling curious about how you're feeling.

Hearing that. I'm feeling nervous to have to speak in front of the group and.

Amused.

That people find my glasses amusing. Well, we find my glasses interesting.

It's a.

It's something I hear a lot, and I like. I like that.

I'll.

I'll take the lead then. Kevin, I'm feeling curious about you. What's.

What's.

What are you experiencing right now?

Oh, a little nervousness. Being. Being Called on, but also just a lot of wonder and excitement about doing, you know, about this call today and the exercises we're doing. And, yeah, I think that's kind of where I'm at. I. I am interested in going next. Pablo, I. I just gotta know. I can't wait to hear what's going on with you right now.

Thank you, Kevin. Hearing that just magnified this experience of expansion that I have in my body. And my hands are sweaty.

Ah.

And I feel like I'm in direct experience Wonderland. And Sophia, as I noticed that you are nodding, curious, what is it like to be you? Right.

Wow.

Awesome.

Okay, I'm going to give you one last sentence stem, and this is by far the most revealing that we have done. And Ocean, I'm going to have you put them all in rooms again, be a little bit shorter. We'll do 10 full minutes. So we'll give you, you know, five to seven minutes to play around with it and then a few minutes to debrief. And I just put in the chat. It's this. So you say this to someone else. You say, I imagine that you are experiencing anger, sadness, frustration, tension, whatever it is. Is that right? And so the idea that we're often assuming or guessing what other people are feeling, but usually we don't share our assumption, and we definitely don't check if it's right. And so it gives us these two tools, which is to out ourselves in our projections and what we're imagining someone else is feeling, and then also to find out is it right. And sometimes we'll be right and sometimes we'll be wrong. And this way we get to actually hone our ability to understand another person. And it differs between people. Some people will cry when they're happy, and some people will cry and they'll be sad. Right. Like you can't. You can't map it one to one. But it's a. It's a way to learn, to learn about each other and to find out. So, Ocean, would you shuttle them off again? Yeah. Any preference on same rooms or different groups? Do this if you want the same room and this if you want a different one. We'll just do a quick. We'll do a quick. Different groups. Different groups go different.

Yeah.

All right. Good question about. Keep it brief. Yeah. Try to do a feeling or a state. Like one sentence, probably. You don't have to get too elaborate to start with. It'll be easier if you start simple. Welcome. Welcome. Welcome back. Welcome, welcome. Welcome back. Welcome back. All right, we'll do our. We'll do our closing harvest, which means share. If you want to share, you're welcome to share non verbally too. You can just, you know, wiggle your body around and we'll interpret your dance as. We will. Yeah, go ahead, Yana.

I was really excited by that exercise actually because it's. I was like a detective trying to infer how the other person felt based on their facial expressions and their energy that I was receiving. And I found it really useful because it's like I haven't done that a lot and depending on the family background of every person, it's like are not calibrated. So it's. This was a space where the person could actually say something and they felt safe and not defensive when I was guessing. So it was like a great experience experiment to practice more.

Very cool. Yeah. I also just want to encourage if anyone who hasn't shared would like to share, do so. Ritz. Yes.

Mine's more of a question for you. I'm very curious, I really am very, very curious about how circling has impacted you and your ability to be able to get in touch with your own feelings. Because it seems like you're very in touch with your feelings from this call and you seem very healthy and well attuned and friendly and open and joyous. So that's, that's, that's my experience and I'm very, very curious to find out whether this is a practice that develops that.

Yeah, I mean, I think it's kind of like what I said in the beginning, but certainly kind of like ripped off the band aid of like what interactions can be about. And like now if I feel nervous or if I'm feeling weird, like I'll just tell the person and it's not always appropriate. Like depending on the context, there are times where you just, you're not going to tell the person what you're feeling, but you can still know that for yourself and decide how to respond to it instead of just having the nervousness kind of implicitly informing your strange, your ensuing strange behavior. Right. And so a lot of the time it is cool to share it. And even in sharing it you kind of, you get to the next natural part of the conversation and I think just that move from like kind of like what happened in with Johnny and Oceanide, that move from like I have to stay in the middle of the screen and be still or I have to talk about the weather or like I'm not allowed to say what I'm really feeling and I'm not allowed to ask the other person what they're feeling. Like ripping off the band aid of all of those, like, undiscussable, I feel like, is part of what, like, what's circling helped me realize just that there's so much more that we can share and ask each other about. That can be really beautiful. And getting to practice that with a group is cool. And then getting to take that into your relationships is, like, even. Even cooler. And you have to, like, teach other people a bit. You know, some people are just naturals and, like, you'll do it and they'll be like, oh, yeah. And then I was feeling this and that and, like, you know, and other people, you kind of have to invite them, draw them into it, into that, like, sense of safety. Martin.

Hey there.

Thank you, Sophia. It's really, really interesting. I've sort of feel like I've grown in the last hour.

Excellent.

But it was. It's more of an open question to maybe Johnny and Ocean as well, because I thought. I think this is something that I'd like to do more of, like, maybe on a more regular basis and if there was an opportunity to have a group, even if it's ad hoc, that we can do this sort of thing and open it up and bring more people on a ongoing basis. So I think it's really fun. Again, I think the most out of the idea that you said about breaking free from the little screen, you know, we're all here in a digital way and sat like this and we have to, like. Actually, I just quite like to stand up and bounce around, and I'm going to take that into other calls and my work with coaching and things. So being more expressive in a digital space is what I've taken the most from today.

Thank you. Yeah, totally. So I. I've been offering Circling online on Monday evenings. It's a. I usually cap it at about 12 people, so it's a pretty small group. And I've been doing that. I've been doing that particular group by donation. I have other groups that I do by paying, but maybe I can send. I can send some other resources and options to Johnny afterwards and can share them with all of you.

I'll also just briefly mention that the interceptive dojos that we're doing three times a week are essentially a version of this. It's slightly different prompt, but the intention is very much the same. And they may evolve into something more like this as well. And Ocean and I were just saying that we'd love to have almost like an alumni circling interoceptive, dojo type community evolve. So, yeah, that's very much alive for us too. It feels like we were saying, it's like a beautiful integration of all of the different elements and practices in a kind of spontaneous, emergent, interesting space.

Ronnie, will you. Will you close us out? Sure.

So when I started this meeting, I was nervous.

I wasn't sure how I would do in both exercises, but what I gained is how open we were or how open even. Even my first group was with each other. And even with my second group, how.

Immediately we were connected and we were.

Vulnerable to share, you know, maybe some things which we would not share with strangers, if that makes sense. Yeah, totally Beautiful. All right, thank you. Thank you all. Anything else? Johnny?

I am noticing a lot of appreciation arise for you for leading us through this, and, yeah, very grateful and curious how it will ripple out. So thank you so much for sharing this and being so free flowing and kind of demonstrating what that kind of fluidity looks like.

Yeah.

So thank you.

Bring it into your lives. Don't make them better.

All right, let's. Let's close off with the jazz hands thing.

Bye, everyone. Thanks so much.

Thanks so much, everyone. Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.