Jennifer Allwood (Author of Get Unstuck and Stay Unstuck)

Today's episode will begin in three minutes. But first I want to tell you about something crazy I'm doing for my new book, five Mere Christians. I've never seen an author do this before, but I'm giving a money back.

Guarantee on this book.

I'm so confident you're gonna love this book that if I'm wrong, if you pre order the book, you don't love it, I'm gonna send you a $20Amazon gift card as a money back guarantee. Why?

Two reasons.

One, this is a different book for me, right. I know this is a very different biography. What is Jordan Rayner doing? And I know it's risky, so I'm going to de risk it for you. Because listen, in my other books, Redeeming youg Time, the Sacredness of Secular Work, Master of One, etc, etc, I am telling you and me how we can glorify God in our work, but in five Mere Christians, I'm doing something very different. I'm showing you what that looks like practically through these unforgettable life stories of five Mere Christians from history. These are the top men and women that I would love to have on this podcast today if, you know, they weren't dead, right?

So that's the first reason this is.

A risk and I'm gonna de risk.

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Here's the second reason. I'm just confident you're gonna love this book. My friend Mark Batterson said, quote, five Mere Christians proves that biographies can be extremely entertaining, profoundly helpful, and mercifully short. If you're looking for a book that combines the punch of a great sermon with the pace of a great thriller, this is it. Highly recommended. End quote. But here's the thing. In order to qualify for this money back guarantee, you got to do two things. Step one, pre order five Mere Christians in any format, hardback, ebook, audiobook, whatever. And then step two, go to 5merechristians.com and fill out the form on that page and that's it. But you got to do it by midnight Eastern Time on May 9. By filling out that form, you'll also get all of the pre order bonuses listed on 5 mereChristians. Calm and be entered to win this crazy, epic trip for two to Europe. So visit 5meerchristians.com right now to sign up. Now, please enjoy today's episode. Hey friend. Welcome to the Mere Christians Podcast. I'm Jordan Raynor. How does the Gospel influence the work of mere Christians? Those of us who aren't pastors or religious professionals, but who work as special Forces officers, railroad conductors, and school guidance counselors. That's the question we explore every week. And today I'm posing it to Jennifer Allwood, a super talented painter turned entrepreneur turned coach to other Christian entrepreneurs. Jennifer and I recently sat down to talk about how to get unstuck professionally by mining the depths of scripture. We talked about why comparison is, yes, a thief of joy, but also a helpful teacher for those looking to get unstuck. And finally, we talked about how to replace the world's call to be confident with the biblical call to have courage and what the difference is between those things. I think you guys are going to thoroughly enjoy this conversation with my new friend, Jennifer Alwood.

Jennifer Allwood, welcome to the Mere Christians Podcast, Jordan.

Thank you so much for having me. I'm super excited. Honored to be here.

Yeah. I had so much fun on your show recently.

I know. That was so much fun. Thank you. It's fun that we can, like, kind of piggyback off each other on each other's program. So I love it.

I love it.

Hey, you spend a lot of time.

Helping Christian professionals, mere Christians, in the parlance of this podcast, get unstuck.

Stuck. How can the mere Christians listening know.

If they're stuck in the work God created them to do? What are the symptoms of being stuck?

Well, I think this is what I like to say. You just know when you're nowhere, Jordan. It's kind of like when you. It's kind of like when you ask a woman who, you know, has children or maybe she's never had children, you say, are you done having kids like most women know? And if they're like, I'm not sure, then you know that you're not. And so when it comes to, like, being stuck, stuck, I think that that's a hard question to maybe quantify the exact answer, because there can be so many things that happen. Right. Like one, you can feel really unfulfilled, too. You can feel really like, just spiritually, like unease, like a desire for something more. But I think it can look different. Getting stuck can look different for so many people. You can know that, like, you're made for this. You can know that you want more, but is it okay? You can know that maybe you're not setting the exact example for your children that you want to be. So I think it can, like, manifest itself in many different ways. But I think most people know, they just instinctively whether or not they feel stuck.

Yeah. And there's undoubtedly a myriad of symptoms of being stuck, also a myriad of different reasons why people get stuck.

But I'm particularly interested in the reasons that you think are unique or especially.

Acute for Christ followers, like what keeps Christians specifically feeling stuck professionally.

Okay. So since I deal with mostly, you know, professional women in my business, I get to coach women on how to grow their small businesses online. So if we're talking about them, a lot of times Christian women will come to me, and there's an internal rub. They want more. They're not sure if they should feel guilty about that. They want to make more money, but they're not sure if that's biblical. Their heart is really for Jesus, and so their heart is for Jesus, and they're wondering if the emotions that they're feeling or the desires that they're having or the dreams that they have, like, are those in alignment? And the majority of the time, Jordan, I find that women like, our heart's desire is really to be in a position of, lord, I want to serve you. I want to make sure that I'm making decisions that line up with your word. I want to make sure that I'm doing what you want me to do. And what we're hopeful that happens is we're hopeful that there's, like, this megaphone from heaven. Heaven that could, of course, happen. But 99.9% of the time is not going to, you know, with specific Instructions on doing 1, 2, and 3 in your life or your business or what have you. And when we don't get that, then a lot of times we go into a waiting season, and we think, well, if I just pray hard enough, if I sit long enough, if I ask God, you know, to show something to me long enough, then I'll get some direction on what way to go, because momentum really is the way out of getting stuck or out of being stuck. And so. But we get in this position where we're like, lord, I'm waiting on you. I'm not going to do anything until I hear from you. And it's in that weight. A lot of times we also. We get almost stuck even more. It's like spiritual quicksand. And so our heart's position is correct, but we're not doing anything. And so, you know, we're fasting, we're praying or whatever, and then we're just getting stuck even harder. And then that creates this real rub, I think, especially inside of women, where we're like, lord, I'll do whatever it is that you want me to do. I just need to know what that is. So I think so often, if women would just be willing. Men or women? Either one. I coach mostly women, so that's why I speak to them. But if you'd be willing just to step out in faith and start taking some little tiny steps in the direction of the thing or the purpose or whatever that you think God may be, but you're not really sure, be calling you to do, understanding and believing that, you know what? I serve a God that is so big that if I am an absolute knucklehead, Jordan. And I'm going off to the right and God actually wanted me to go to the left, and I'm over here, you know, offering a course on how to cut hair, what God really wanted me to do. A monthly membership group on dog walking. Like, we serve a God big enough who's able to stop the bus, shift it, pivot it, and get you going back in the direction that you need to be going in. I think that would be so helpful because I think it's so often we have a heart to do what's right, but in just sitting and doing nothing and making no steps in any direction, we're actually even getting stuck even further.

Yeah, it's good. It's the perennial what is God's will For my life question. One of the best books I read in 2023 was the will of God is a Way of Life, which was recommended by a past guest here, Dave Evans, a co founder of EA Sports. And the gist of the book is basically, hey, if you're seeking the kingdom of heaven first, whatever you choose becomes God's will. Because whether you go path A or path B, his purposes will not be thwarted. Never.

Right? And so we have so much freedom to just go out and make decisions.

And get out of that quicksand of feeling stuck.

All right, we've started to get into.

The how to get unstuck, Right? This is part of it. Just, like, make a choice.

But can we go back to that for just one second? Because I have some thoughts even that I'd love to share with you even just a little bit further. Because one of the things that I tell women is that when you are trying to decide between A or B, or you're trying to figure out which direction to go or what to do, I think it's such a valuable prayer to say, Lord, it's biblical. Will you close the doors so tight that I'm not meant to walk through, that no man can open them? And will you swing wide open the doors so wide that no man can shut them? Because that's really helpful and being like, hey, Lord, I'm gonna start in this direction, but please like, direct my steps. And so I think that's super valuable. Another thing that I think is super valuable, and this is one of the things that I share with my children all the time. And I've got. I think we talked about this, my podcast. We've got four kiddos. They are 22 this week, 2016 and nine. So we've got a big, wide gap there. We're constantly telling our children, though, like, look, we don't serve a God of just rules so that we can have fun, but we do serve a God that offers us a playbox. Literally, like a sandbox. It's like, if you stay inside of these boundaries, like, have all the fun you want, this is, though, where you're going to have, you know, protection and favor and all good things. Right. You get outside of that box, and then things can get a little wonky. So when you're trying to make decisions for your life, the majority of the time, those decisions are still inside of that box. Right. It's not like we're trying to decide upon something that's, you know, clearly outside of the will of God and, you know, very unholy, dangerous, et cetera. It's literally between two things that I think sometimes God's like, you know what, Jen? I don't care if you do this or that. Like, I'm going to go with you whichever direction you prefer and you choose. I think sometimes we forget that we serve a God who allows us to make so many of our own decisions. And sometimes I wonder if we overcomplicate life and the gospel.

I think we frequently do this.

Yes.

Because we're like, I don't know, God. I don't know. I'm waiting on you. And God's like, well, I'm just waiting on you, sis. Like, make a decision and I'm there. Either direction, either one is fine with me, and I have to remember it. I know I told you this on my podcast, that if I try to remember God as God the father, like, in the position of parent, it helps me to understand his goodness so much more. Because I know, like, when I look at my kids, I have a child in college, for instance, and if he had said, you know, mom, dad, I'm thinking about this one or this one, we would have been like, well, either one's good, Easton. You know, we don't care. What do you want, honey? Like, what is your heart saying? What is your passion? What are you feeling like, and, you know, we're going to support you either direction. And I think so often God does that same thing with us. He's like, jordan, I don't care. Write this book or write that one. Either way. I'm with you either way. It's blessed and favored in all of the things. And I think if we would maybe keep that in mind, it would help us to make decisions easier and. And to get unstuck if we have become stuck.

Yeah, it's good. Yeah. I really enjoyed your book, Get Unstuck and Stand Stuck. And you said, quote, when I am at my most stuck, it helps me to go back to my Bible and remind myself of who God says I am, end quote. And then get this great list of who God says we are. But what you just said is the primary one, your beloved child through Christ. You're an adopted child of God. And from that position of belovedness, I think we could start to see the freedom God has given us as his children to just go choose anything in the sandbox to do for his glory and the good of others and our joy. Amen.

Amen. And what happens when we don't choose and we get into that position of being stuck? Because we are never like an island in the stream. And, you know, unless we're Kenny Rogers and Dolly Parton, we're never just like Kenny Rogers reference.

Man, put that on the bingo sheet, y'. All. That was great.

We're never islands in the street. So there's always, like. As believers, there's always a ripple effect. It. So if I get stuck, for instance, and mom is not living up to her ability, Mom's not making decisions. Mom's not like, you know, doing the things that I know. Maybe God's calling me to do, or I'm just not feeling like I'm, you know, being useful, et cetera. And so instinctively, the people in my household, they will inevitably feel that, you know what I mean? Because it's like, it affects every area of your life when you're just. When you're feeling so stuck. And so that will rub off on my children. It will rub off on my spouse. They'll be able to sense, you know, mom's discontent or what have you. Well, then what happens, too, is there's so many people that are watching our lives, whether it's on social media, whether it's, you know, listening to our podcast, whether it's the neighbors that live next to you that you go to the bus stop with in the morning. There are people, you know, just they're observing, right? And a lot of those non believers. And so instinctively, when you're not having some breakthroughs in your life and you're becoming really stuck and you're in, like, you know, just that quicksand, other people are definitely being affected by that is so it's never just all about us. There's always, like, this ripple effect because I firmly believe, especially like in the area of business and coaching women, that there are so many women that they literally just need to be able to, like, do something, try something, close down something, start something. Because there are people that are watching you and often, like, the only way they figure out kind of how to, like, fight their own dragons is by watching you fight yours. So I think that it would be so helpful if we also just keep in mind, like, it's not just me. If I'm getting stuck, the people around me are getting stuck as well. And that for me, because sometimes I have to think of my own motivators. That's a big motivator for me. When I think about. I've been in this coaching space online for 10 years now, and it's gotten harder, not easier. Social media has gotten, you know, harder, not easier. The cost of owning a business has gone up, not down. And there's times I'm like, you know what? I am tired and I am 52 and I have a lot of kids still. And there's days I think I don't want to get up and coach women. Today, I mean, I'm just being, you know, completely transparent. But one of the things that gets me out of bed is knowing that. Okay, But I also, like, there's a dependence on me. Not in a bad way, but I have to remember, like, it's not all just about me. There's this ripple effect that if I don't get up in the thing, do the thing that I'm supposed to be doing that I feel like God's calling me to right now. And maybe I'm right, maybe I'm wrong. But if I don't do that, who's going to be losing? Because I'm not willing to step in today and do what I'm supposed to be doing. And that for me, is a huge motivator. Not out of guilt or manipulation, but just of this, like, really deep, like, oh, gosh, I need to really take this position and this platform and what you've given me, Lord, like, really seriously.

Yeah, that's good. That's really good. I love the way that you reframe the way that others think about us in this specific instance. And.

But also on the issue of comparison.

I thought this was really interesting. In the book, you talk about the comparison trap. I wrote a devotional series last year for the Word Before Work podcast, separate podcast on biblical ways to escape the comparison trap. Because as you say in your own book, comparison is a quote, thief of joy, end quote.

But I love how you pointed out that comparison is also a teacher that.

Can help you get unstuck. Can you explain what you mean by that?

Well, I think, like, so this is super interesting. Almost two years ago, I decided one day, Jordan, I woke up and I thought, you know what I need? I need to become a life coach. I'd been a business coach for, you know, 10 years. It was eight or nine years at that point. And I thought to myself, I want to get actually licensed as a life coach. Because, first of all, I don't think that there's enough Christian life coaches, number one. But I knew that what I was doing in my business coaching was life coaching a lot of times, because I can't help a woman, like, build her bank account and build her business if she still has things, like, in her heart, like where she's scared to make money and she's not even okay with working or what have you. So a lot of times I need to address life things before we can get to the business thing. So I actually got my life coaching certification and named that program. I was doing a life coaching group for a while, and it was called Reframed. So I love that you just see me reframe some things, because I think that's my way of dealing with the fact that otherwise I can just really get in my head. So I have to sometimes convince myself to look at things differently. And so for me, if I'm looking at comparison and I'm thinking, man, that girl, you know, in terms of a measuring stick, she is killing it. And I am absolutely looking ridiculous over here. And she's younger, and she's gone further already, and she's been at this less time. And. And so then what that ends up doing, inevitably, is I just feel worse about myself. I perform worse. You know, it is a thief of joy. And I obviously didn't make that statement up somebody else way smarter than I did. But instead, if I will flip that and I'll be like, okay, what actually did she do? Let me look. And just as an observer, like, why has she gotten so far ahead of me as if it's a contest and, you know, a Race, which it is not. But, like, what did she do? And also, what can I learn from that? And what can I take from her story and not try to do things the way she did? But what did she do differently? Not from a tactile point point, but did she see an opening in the market that I didn't? Did she try something that I've never had the guts to try, et cetera, et cetera? And what I also try to remind myself when it comes to comparison is that comparison basically insinuates that we are in a race against one another. And so I think, especially a lot of times for women, we think, okay, she's further ahead. And so that means I'm behind. And then I wonder who I'm in front of. And then there's people, and it's like this, you know, we kind of line each other up mentally, which is never going to take us to a good place. Never going to take us to a good place. And so.

And totally unbiblical.

Yes, absolutely. I even think the same thing. From a strategic standpoint. When I have women that are in my coaching groups, a lot of times, Jordan, they'll say things to me like, you know, I'm just so behind on, you know, so behind in your content. So behind. And I'm like, wait, wait, wait. Like, so behind means this is a race and there is no race. Like, go at whatever pace you need to, not at a race with anybody. And so if I'll try to look at somebody that is, you know, a quote unquote competitor and really notice what is she doing really well also, maybe where do I see some points that she's not doing well? And is there an opportunity for me there that just helps me to get out of that comparison trap that will inevitably just make me want to eat like raw chocolate chip cookie dough and. And take a nap versus, you know, get up, pull up my pants, and, you know, do the things that God's asking me to do.

So it's good. It's really good. I think my favorite part of your book is where you pointed out that once we get unstuck, right, get clear on what we think God is calling us to do, or just make a decision to pick a path. He said, quote, you don't need to feel confident to do it. You may not feel qualified, but you could be confident in the one who did the asking. End quote. Amen. Say more, please. Riff off of this and preach for yes.

So I hear the word confidence, and I just instinctively kind of throw up in my mouth a little bit because.

I do too look at Paul's letters, right? Paul was boasting in all of his weaknesses, everything the world tells him to hide.

Yeah. And so. And what's interesting to me is you're talking to me a lot about book number two, which I forget I even have book number two. Can I just say that out loud? Because my big boss of you and Get Unstuck and stay Unstuck was kind of the follow up to that. It's like a coffee table book. But I have a full chapter in Fear is not the boss of you about the difference between confidence and courage. Because I think, especially in America, we are being sold the lie. And you can't go to a grocery store and not look at, you know, the magazines that are sitting right there and not see this. But the lie is that you have to feel and be confident before you do. That's the lie. When you're confident, then this is going to happen. When you're whatever. And it's like leading with confidence. And that is like, so backwards. And again, God often shows me things, like in perspective to parenting, because, like, if we were to look at one of our four children, the first time we took them outside, my husband and I tried to teach them to ride a bike, for example, they're not confident about riding a bike. They've never ridden a bike before. So there is no part of me that as a good mother that would stand there and say, you know, Ava, Grace, I cannot believe that you're nervous about this. You just need to get on there and, like, be confident. Like, you know, get it together. You should be confident right now. Like, it doesn't even make sense. And so what happens then is women, especially the women I'm coaching, they're coming into business. They're launching a course for the first time or coaching or whatever. And they're thinking, okay, as soon as I feel confident, then, you know, I'm going to go ahead and do the thing. Well, how can you ever, like, feel a certain way other than, oh, my gosh, I hope this works, or I don't know, or what have you when it's the first time that you do it, something. There's nobody that feels confident the first time they do something. And so the lie is that as soon as your feelings line up, then you're going to be good to go. And the truth of the matter is, is our feelings are liars. The majority of the time, my feelings lie to me, Jordan. And that, that's no Lie. I have to. It's no lie that my feelings lie to me. I have to constantly remind myself, like, don't believe that, Jen. Don't think that. Jen, I know you want to feel, like, irritated right now. Don't do that. I know that you're feeling left out, you're feeling lesser than you're feeling, whatever. Like, if I listen to my feelings emotionally, I would be just an absolute basket case. So I'm constantly having to remind myself my feelings are liars the majority of the time. And it's not confidence that should be my goal. It's always courage.

How does the gospel produce that type of courage in you at work? How does it help you stay on the right side of that confidence courage gap? Because there's a big difference between these two things.

There is, but one leads to the other. Because I think that so often, if you will just be courageous enough to do the thing, sometimes you will actually end up. The confidence will follow and not all the time. One of the things. Let me give you an example. One of the things I wrote about in Fear is not the boss of you is how When I was 39, I went to a triathlon with a girlfriend of mine. She wanted me to go watch a friend of hers. And, you know, I don't consider myself an athlete. I, you know, played sports in high school, but, you know, at that point, I was 39, three kids, ate a lot of mashed potatoes, etc. So we go watch this triathlon and I'm seeing. I don't tell the whole story, but there's this woman that's Obviously in her late 70s, early 80s, it competes in the triathlon. And I'm watching this woman get out of the lake, Jordan. And I'm thinking, oh, my gosh, I really need to get my life together. Like, she was amazing. I'm crying watching this woman who's, you know, obviously well past my age, double my age, finish a triathlon. And it was so inspiring. And I thought to myself, you know what I'm going to do? I turned 40 next summer on the same weekend that this triathlon is. Every single year, I'm going to sign up for a triathlon. That's what I'm going to do. And then my next thought was, oh, shoot, I forgot, I can't swim. And so when I was 39, I hired somebody, a swim instructor, to teach me how to swim for the first time in my life. I had never been able to even, you know, put my face underwater without, like, choking. And So I spent six months with a swim instructor and then for my 40th birthday was going to do my first triathlon. It was a really cool thing. The Today show back when Matt Lauer was on there, they sent out like a crew to like interview me on women turning 40 in a different way. And I was in spandex on national television. It was like a whole thing. And I'm all excited and great and the triathlon starts and I had a panic attack in the lake and I had to like rest, you know, on a boogie board and try to get my life together and finish the triathlon and immediately signed up for another one. Had a panic attack on that one, Jordan. And I kept telling myself, okay, you know, the next one, I'm not going to have a panic attack. I'm going to get the confidence that I need in the water that I'm not going to die and I'll be fine. Well, I ended up doing 10 triathlons in like a six year period. And I had a panic attack in every single one of them. And including the one where I was not in the lake, I was in a. I was in a swimming pool and still had a panic attack. And so what I'm trying to say is I was courageous enough to sign up. I kept hoping that I would become a confident swimmer and I never actually did. But it wasn't really about the confidence to do that. It was really just being courageous enough to do the thing I felt like God was asking me to do. That has showed up in my business over and over. Because I remember at the time thinking, lord, whatcha doing here? We've got a lot of kids. It feels like a whole lot that you're asking me to do to triathlon. It was just a gut feeling. It wasn't like an audible voice from heaven. I ended up doing 10 of them and kind of wondering why it's such a random thing for a non athlete. What I learned through that experience, like one of the many lessons that God gave me is that my feelings are just not always going to line up like I want them to. But a lot of times God's just asking us to step out in faith. And that includes me in my business. A lot of times, you know, whether it's offering a new program, whether it's when I first started to really like prophesy to women in my coaching group. I mean, that was. I can remember the day it happened. I can remember the first day I asked a woman in my group, hey, could I pray for you? We were you know, in a meeting, I had 2, 300 women in this group that I paid coaching group. And I felt like the Holy Spirit said, you know, you need to ask this woman if you can pray for her. And I was like, oh, geez, what are we doing here, Lord? This is a hard right turn. And so, you know, there was no confidence that that was going to go okay. There was nothing, you know, other than, can I be courageous enough to do what I feel like I'm supposed to be doing right this second and then just see what God does with that? And over and over, he has proven himself so faithful. If I will just forget about how I feel and forget being confident and just focus on being courageous on his back.

Good. That's really good. I love it. Jennifer, three questions. We wrap up every episode with number one, which books do you find yourself recommending or gifting most frequently to others? Like, if we pulled open your Amazon order history, what book showing up over and over again.

Okay, well, and I thought about this. I knew you were going to ask me this, because I know you asked people this and answer is really, like, not very sexy, in all honesty. So a lot of times I'll send women my book because it really is about getting unstuck. And not the second one, but the first one one fears, not the boss. So a lot of times in my DMs, and, you know, I'll know women that. That could be really helpful to them, not for book sales, but just because I know it will be helpful. But the book that I actually recommend the most is called Crash the Chatterbox by Pastor Steven Fertig. And it's probably a good 12 to 15 years old, but it was so life changing for me the first time that I read that. My husband got it for me for a Christmas gift years and years ago, and it basically just goes through this. Like, the Chatterbox is that voice we all have in our head that says, you're not good enough, you're not smart enough. You're never going to get any better than this. You're never going to outgrow, you know, your hometown. You're never going to be able to make any money. You're never like, that's the Chatterbox. And that book absolutely changed my life.

It's good. I like it. Who do you want to hear in this podcast talking about how the gospel shapes the work they do in the world?

Have you had Ed Mylett on this podcast?

No.

Okay, so Ed is in the business space, same space that I am. He's A business coach with a way larger platform than I have. He has a huge following, a hugely successful business. But I listened to him, and I'm like, he is such a. Such a marketplace minister because he's unapologetic about his Christian faith. He does not lead with that at all. But yet he's, like, putting it out there. And, you know, in his own conversations, like on his podcast to people, I'm like, oh, that was good. That was really good, the way he said that to a person that, you know, I know is not a Christ follower. He's just so good at that. And so I would love to hear him on your podcast. I think he'd be a great guest.

Hey, Jennifer, before we sign off, you're.

Talking to this global audience of mere Christians, very diverse vocationally, some of them entrepreneurs, some of them doctors, and some of them mechanics. What's one thing you want to reiterate to them before we sign off?

Let's go back to what we already talked about, which was just that I think feeling confident about things should never be our goal. But being courageous, I think just produces such better fruit. And especially if you're someone who is stuck, the very number one first thing that you can do to get unstuck is there has to be, like, a disruptor of some sort. If you almost picture Jordan, did you ever, when you were little, I think you're way younger than me, but did you ever put, like, a card on the wheel of your bicycle?

I did not.

You did not?

I am. I am a good bit younger. Yeah. No.

Okay. So, you know, it's 52, a lot older, but anyway, we would take a clothespin, and we would clothespin a card into, like, the spokes of our bicycle. And it's just. It's like a disruptor. It comes in and it, like, makes a noise and just kind of disrupts the way the tire is supposed to go. And so if you're someone who's, like, on a spiral of feeling stuck in life, whether it's in business, whether it's personally, whether it's in your walk with the Lord, having something like kind of come in and disrupt that, that is the biggest thing, the first thing that you could do in order to get out of that season of feel like there has to be something more, and you just feel so stuck. So some sort of forward momentum, do something to disrupt that, make some decision today, one thing today, one small decision that can then lead you into bigger ones that'll help to get you unstuck.

And our courage, I would argue, is rooted in Romans 8:38. I'm convinced that neither death nor life, nor angels, nor demons, nor the present, nor the future, nor any powers, neither height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation will be able to separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord. Right? And so we have courage to move and get unstuck and move forward and persevere in the good works that God has prepared in advance for us to do.

Jennifer, I want to commend you for the great work you do for the.

Glory of God and the good of others for helping us get unstuck by.

Leading us back to our Heavenly Father and the source of all wisdom and truth. Guys, Jennifer is the author of some.

Great books including Get Unstuck and Stay Unstuck and what's the book I see competing with Call to Great all the Time on Amazon?

Fear is not the boss of you.

Fear is not the boss of you. I love it. Jennifer thank you for hanging with us today.

Jordan, thank you so much. It's a pleasure to have been here. Thank you.

Hey, if you're loving the Mere Christians.

Podcast, do me a favor and take.

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