Vernon and Ellen Landreth (Santa and Mrs. Claus)

Today's episode will begin in three minutes. But first I want to tell you about something crazy I'm doing for my new book, five Mere Christians. I've never seen an author do this before, but I'm giving a money back.

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Here's the second reason. I'm just confident you're gonna love this book. My friend Mark Batterson said, quote, five Mere Christians proves that biographies can be extremely entertaining, profoundly helpful, and mercifully short. If you're looking for a book that combines the punch of a great sermon with the pace of a great thriller, this is it. Highly recommended.

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Welcome to the Mere Christians podcast. Hi, I'm Jordan Raynor.

How does the Gospel influence the work of mere Christians?

Those of us who aren't pastors or religious professionals but who work as golf.

Pros, soldiers, and copywriters. That's the question we explore every week. And today I'm posing it to Ellen.

And Vernon Landreth, better known as Santa and Mrs. Claus. Santa and Mrs. Claus took time out of their busy Christmas preparations to to sit down and have a terrific and entertaining conversation with me.

We talked about why we should all.

Think of ourselves as secret Santas of sorts. All year long at work, we talked.

About how to take a there you.

Are versus a here I am approach to your work.

And we talked about. I learned something new in this episode, why Santa comes at night. I never heard this before.

Maybe you have, but I hadn't. I think you guys are going to love this short, fun, but inspiring and encouraging episode with Vernon and Ellen Landry. Mr. And Mrs. Claus, welcome to the podcast. I got to say, we've had some very famous listeners in our audience. I know there are a couple of CEOs, there's a Fortune 500 companies listening. We have professional athletes in the audience, Oscar winners, but none more famous than Santa and Mrs. Claus. Welcome to the show.

Thank you. Thank you.

Ellen, I know you've listened to the show before. I've got to ask, do you ever listen from Santa's sleigh? And what is Santa driving these days?

A Honda pilot?

A pickup truck?

What do we got?

Not from the sleigh because it only goes cries Christmas Eve.

Can fly Christmas Eve because Christmas Eve is where the magic is.

That's fair. That's fair. I get it. And we're definitely airing this show more frequently than Christmas Eve. I love this. I was reading in the bio that you guys have@the Santacuple.com which has got to be one of the best domain names of all time. You all have traveled all over the country for professional Santa training. And Vernon, I have to know what goes on at a professional Santa training. I think our listeners are dying to know too. What does this look like?

Classes, how to dress, how to take care of your beard, working with photographers. Sometimes photographers can be pretty bossy in charge type thing. Do's and don'ts about working with people, children, finances, charity work. Yeah, it's all kinds of things.

And there's workshops about puppetry that you can use about different books. Like we bought a book there that's just wonderful. And it's a great, great big book. So this really works good for a large group of children. And it's just a very fun book. It's just plus seeing all the Santas and all the Mrs. Glasses with their costumes. We had a parade in Downtown Branson with 800 of us, 800 Santas and Mrs. Clauses in full costume in July.

This is amazing. This is amazing. I think this is what Isaiah was talking about. We said, the glory of the nations. The Santa parade's got to be. Got to be a part of this. This is hilarious to me. Hey, Ellen, how does one get into the Santa business? How did this all start for you two?

It started just because Santa's had a beard for over 50 years, and the natural thing that it turns gray, and people started calling him Santa. And finally, I just had a brainstorm one day, and I said, vernon, why don't I make you a Santa costume? Because I'm a seamstress. And we did. And he just started doing volunteer things at our church, and then this and that, and people started asking him to do other things. And then we started charging. It was wonderful.

Just fell into it.

Yes. Yes.

I love this so much. Vernon, you served as a pastor for 35 years. Is that right, sir?

Yes.

That's all right. So to me, that makes your role of Santa so much more interesting.

Right.

Because I know a lot of Christians.

Who take this posture of condemning a lot of quote, unquote, worldly things. Commercial. The commercialization to Christmas. But you guys are leaning into it, and I love it. Tell us. Tell us a little bit about why. Vernon.

When our kids were little, I was asked by the parent teacher association to be Santa. Fake beard. She trust him. And then as we got older, grandkids came and let me back up.

Yeah, that's fine.

I came from a church that didn't celebrate Christmas. My family didn't go to church. My parents. So we had Christmas at home. So I was kind of ambivalent the whole time. Then the idea. The whole world basically celebrates Christmas.

It's amazing. It's the one time of year everyone is talking about.

I mean, happiness.

Yeah. Maybe in the manger. All those Christmas carols. And my. Even very secular places play those Christmas carols. That's talking about our Lord.

Yeah.

So why not put Christ in Christmas? That was the idea. So we started talking about at church the colors of Christmas, what they stand for, the emblems, the trumpets, the angels, and the mission that they had to do. And doing a program for the children, and then even for the whole church. I would incorporate things about Christmas. When you listen to Christmas, the old Christmas hymns. One time I tried to sit down and take a verse from each hymn and tell the story of Jesus. And as I Did it? Well, that's stupid. The verses go through the whole program. Each song has the whole story there.

Yeah.

So it really is an evangelistic God honoring process of Christmas.

Yeah.

The hymns and all of that. So as, as we started getting into it more and more and decorating the church to represent all that God's gift of Jesus to the world means, and then left the ministry and doing other kinds of jobs and then falling into basically Santa and well, how can we do this really, to honor Christ?

Yeah.

Wear the cross on the Santa suit. Do you know the acronym for joy?

I don't. Tell me.

See here on his hat?

Yeah, I do.

It says joy. He also has a key, skeleton key.

That says joy to unlock Jesus first, other, second yourself last.

Pretty good rule for life.

Pretty good rule for life. And I quote, I just say, and look up Philippians chapter two. He tells people, second verse says, joy, but putting others first.

Yeah.

God, others, yourself.

And no matter where we are, what kind of a venue or home, he always, you know, they say, send it. Tell me about what's your key? So he pulls his key up and he says, what does it say? And then he says, this is the.

Secret to joy, to happiness, to world peace.

Yeah, that's what he says. And then he tells them what it means. And even people that aren't really Christian, they're like, oh, that's a good idea.

Yeah, I've never heard that before.

Yeah, that's so interesting. Yeah. Ellen, when you initially email me, you mentioned that your Santa, I love how you call him, your Santa, wears this cross around his neck when he dresses up as Santa. I'm curious, beyond that obvious expression of faith, how do you guys see yourselves as Christ followers approaching these roles as Santa and Mrs. Claus differently than other white bearded men might who are not followers of Jesus?

On our confirmation form that I send people, we have a line that says, is it okay to mention Jesus as a reason for the season? Yeah, I would say 90% of our clients say yes. I was surprised at that. Mostly the people that say no. It's like a corporate event where there's all kinds of religions. They don't want to do that. So we start out with that. And I have this year, I made a nativity set out of beanie bears. You know, little beanie bears.

Sure.

And costumes for the wise men, the shepherds, Mary and Joseph and the animals. And so a lot of people are asking for that. I tell them about it. And so I set up that thing and let the kids interact with it. And It's. We try to. We put that question on our confirmation form because we want to be able to share the nativity story and about Jesus. But the cross itself says so much. We have people that come up and say. And they take a hold of it and they say, I'm sure, like, that you have it. And they know when they see the cross, who we are.

Yeah, yeah. I love that so much in Jesus's words are coming to mind that they will know we are Christians by our love.

Right.

So, yes, by wearing the cross around her neck, but also by our love. I'm curious, Vernon, to hear from your perspective.

How do you think you guys love.

Your customers differently because of your understanding of the love you've been shown by Christ differently?

One of the problems of neurosurgeons is that God syndrome and Santas tend to be peacocks.

What do you mean by that? I love this.

I mean, look at me. Yes, I'm Santa.

Yes.

I want the photographer, I want the parents to look at the children to see the joy in their eyes. So I try to hold the children forward. Now, I learned from a photographer, I need to be looking at the camera all the time so that they're not looking for photos where my eyes are open or I'm looking the other way. But I want them to see the kids. I want the joy to be the kids. That's love. Smiling, holding my arms out, hugging the kids, even during COVID if they allowed a lot of them stop them.

Sure.

We do love these kids when you go there. And we are Christians, and that is everything we do. And so, wow, this is a great way to do it.

Yeah. I actually think that's a really practical expression, Vernon.

Right.

I mean, it's going back to your joy acronym. Jesus first, others second, myself last, like, walking into the room instead of like, here I am. To quote my friend Josh Straub, who's a great psychologist, like, it's not here I am, it's there you are. It's walking in the room and making others the focal point of the scene, whether you're Santa or a barista or a marketer in corporate America.

Right, right, Exactly.

Something I've started seeing when children come up to us. You know, they're kind of. Some of them are kind of bashful. And I say, I'm so glad we get to see you. Instead of saying, come see Santa, say, oh, I'm so glad. Will you take a picture with us?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's subtle, but that's significant.

Right.

I was Reading on your website. I actually think this is a great example of how you guys are set apart in this work. You guys have this hilarious and helpful tips for an extraordinary visit for the Santa couple. And on there you share this request from Santa to parents about calling their children naughty. Can what do you guys share a little bit about that request and kind of the thinking behind it with our listeners? Because I actually think this is in a way redemptive and different from the way we typically think of naughty and nice and how Santa judges kids.

So Santa loves all children and you don't have to be perfect.

He tells.

I just want you to do the best you can. How are you doing this year? Have you made progress? Are you learning your manners? Are you behaving? Are you proud of yourself? Well, I'm proud of you too. That kind of thing.

Just kind of want to make them the hero in the. In our conversation.

Yeah, it's just a very Jesus like way of approaching the Santa conversation. My wife and I have had this conversation before regarding Santa or the elf on the shelf, whatever. These things have a way of, I think subtly but very powerfully communicating a very works based mindset to our kids. Right, Vernon, it looks like you agree. Talk, talk more about this.

Well, we're saved by grace. We're saved by Jesus Christ. The perfect gift of God is Jesus. He loves us. He loves all people. He loves the Ukrainians and the Russians. Amen. He loves the people who are being killed in Sudan as well as those who are doing the killing.

Yes.

So he wants us all to be saved. Yes. He wants to get rid of the ugliness. We want world peace. He wants world peace. It's going to happen when we quit being selfish and doing our own thing, doing for him and for each other. What you said a little while ago I wanted to go back to that. Please. If you're going to hire somebody to clean your house, you want to have some confidence that they're not there to steal or checking your house out for what they might steal. Santa requests sometimes. Would you be a bad Santa for us? Absolutely not. So you're not. Sometimes there are women that come up and want to do a suggestive pose with Santa. Well, sometimes it happens so fast there's no way I can stop it.

Sure.

But if I can, I stop that because that's not godly. That's not something Jesus would want.

Yeah.

So we want to keep that separate. We want Santa to be, you know, the story of Santa, St Nicholas and where it all comes from. And I love to tell that story.

Let's. I don't want to assume that our listeners know, though. Would you share it with us?

Well, St. Nicholas was born around 270 A.D. his parents were believers. They were wealthy. They passed away, left him the fortune. He shared it with the poor. James says we are pure religion, undefiled as the visit fatherless and the widows keep ourselves unspotted from the world. So, of course, no bad sentence. He was arrested, Diocletian, tortured, didn't give up the faith. Constantine released him, became a bishop, Catholicism first. Pope Paul, that starts about then became notorious because of his giving. Why is Santa come Christmas Eve at night? Well, Nicholas knew that you're not supposed to broadcast your good deeds. Do your good deeds secretly, and your father in heaven will reward you. So do it for God's reward, not man. So I come at night, and so I tell people. Nicholas wanted to follow God's example of giving. And when you give secretly, you are doing the same thing that God wants you to do and that Nicholas does. So Nicholas got caught. People found out he was doing this, and they began to imitate him. And then, well, who did that? Who gave those people the money? Who shared the food? Must have been Nicholas. Well, it wasn't. So I became famous, and I have to show up for pictures. But the idea is to be a Secret Santa. And when you do your good deeds secretly, then you're being just like Santa, who's trying to be like Jesus or like God.

Yeah.

Children, what's a good gift you could give to your parents? Could you clean up your room without being asked? Could you help around the house? Secret things. There's a great thing on Facebook we read a few years ago about a lady's son who was reaching the age where he didn't believe. And she took him out for a Coke and said, all right, I want you to think of somebody who needs something. Well, they'd been leaving the home, and they'd see a lady neighbor lady shuffling out to the elderly lady, to the mailbox to get her paper, barefoot in the cold. And he said, she really needs slippers. So they hid in a bush and watched and guessed at the size of her shoes and went out. He went out with his own money with mom and bought slippers, wrapped them, took them to the door, knocked on it and ran and hid. He came out and got him. Next time they saw her, she was wearing the slippers. And it made him feel so good. And so he became the giver. And learning that Santa wasn't Quote, real was not a problem. Yeah, he understood. And it wasn't heartbreaking. Well, of course, justifying Santa as a. As a minister of the gospel and truth, St. Nicholas, in that story, helped me. That gave me permission to be. Dress up like Santa and pretend to promote Jesus.

I love that so much. I think that's so helpful. And I'm thinking about our listeners who are wrapping up 2022 are, you know, gonna take a break and come back to their offices in January. And I love that question. I love the way of framing this, like, how can you be a secret Santa of sorts in your place of work? What are the secret things to Jesus talks so much about giving, secretly serving, secretly praying.

That's your right hand. Know what your left hand does?

That's exactly right.

So thinking about this, I think that's.

A really helpful prompt to be thinking about what are the secret things we can be doing in our offices, in our places of work, to bless other people. And being content, even if it's never, especially if it's never recognized, is because that's often what triggers that eternal reward.

Hey, I want.

I want to go back to what we were talking about a couple of minutes ago about this. Asking parents not to play the naughty Santa card and Santa's not going to come visit you. Do you think that that can plant? I mean, that's such a winsome idea. Like, I remember going to Santa as a kid and hearing, you better watch out, you better not cry. You better not. I'm telling you why. Right?

But I think it's a winsome message.

To kids when you, as Mrs. Claus or you, as Mr. Claus, can look a kid in the eye and say, hey, Santa loves all children, whether you're naughty or nice. Ellen, do you think that can plant, even if you don't say it explicitly, a desire for the true and better Santa, if you will, the desire for Jesus that loves us perfectly, regardless of our sin.

That's the whole idea. We have a little red book that's from the elves, little red velvet book. And I asked parents to give me positive things about each child. And I write that down and, and bring it. And I. And so you should see their faces glow when I read these things that the elves have written down so we won't forget them. So when they tell us they want us, you know, they need to clean up the room or this or that, you know, we just. We look for the positive things. And some of those things we can say, well, in doing things for others, like cleaning up your room, and, you know, kind of get it in there, but never, never, ever scolding them, always praising them for the best things about them, because that's what. Let me give you an example. When I was in seventh grade, every Friday we had crafts and we had to bring things from home for crafts. And every week I brought those things home, I mean, to school that we needed. And one day, I remember the teacher was standing, she said, I wish all of you could be like Ellen. She never forgets to bring the things for crafts. Well, I remember everybody looking at me and you know what? Everybody started bringing those things. You know, it's just praise in front of other people is even elevates it to just like telling Vernon I like something about him, but see it in front of other people. Genuine praise. And that's what we're trying to do.

I love it so much. Hey, Vernon, we mentioned that you served as a. As a pastor of a local church. This, this podcast is all in a large way about debunking some really bad theology about work that people grew up believing in the church. I'm curious, from your perspective, what are some of the most common misconceptions about work that you as a pastor had to help your. Your congregants through over the decades?

Interesting question.

You know, I think we've grown in our understanding of that through, through the years that people used to say, you got to go in the ministry if you want to serve the Lord. You got to be a missionary if you want to serve the Lord. And you have helped us even understand that even more that, hey, we've got to do it wherever.

My dad, there are nine of us children. Wow. He worked three jobs, mom raised nine kids. Dad to carpenter. He worked at a gas station weekends and he taught carpentry class for apprentice. So I really didn't know my dad well, but carpentry is honest living, and I served as an apprentice. I've always had that comprehension that whatever you do is good wait tables or mop the floors or everything because God gave man work before the fall dress and keep the garden. So I've always had that understanding and I've tried to encourage that in the churches. And even today, before COVID we could go to the hospital on Christmas day and volunteer, go visit patients and bring cheer. Elderly patients particularly would frequently weep when they saw us on Christmas day. I knew you'd come, they'd say, and pass out candy canes and. Which the hospitals provided because the dangers. But to take pictures with the cleanup staff, the janitorial staff, the nurses, and not just the patients to thank them for being there on Christmas Day, that kind of thing. Work is honorable. Yeah, I've always felt that way and I still do.

Yeah. And answer your question, it does 100%. And what a great example, taking the time not to just take pictures with the patients, take pictures with the staff, just honoring their work that they get to do, have to do on that day. Ellen, I'm so honored by your words, saying that my work has helped you understand more robust theology of work. I think one of the most valuable gifts that you and Santa could give our listeners this Christmas is an encouragement as to how their work as mere Christians matters to God. Santa's already alluded to this. Vernon. Ellen, I want to give you a chance to encourage our listeners about the importance of their work in the world.

Well, if nobody worked at the coffee shop, I wouldn't be able to stop and get a great cup of coffee.

You are keeping Mrs. Claus caffeinated barista.

And this is the truth.

Often when we're at different places, I mean, not just in our costumes, but people are working in a certain job. And I know that's a menial task and it must not be comfortable. And I. I just say thank you for working because this is what. Where would we be if you didn't do this job? It's just very important. I just try to encourage people to not feel like they're just doing a boring job, but that it has. It's serving me, and I'm thankful for that.

Yeah, go ahead.

That's food. Somebody's mopping the floor. Good. Good job. Nice work.

I think a lot of times we can over complicate this connection between faith and work. I was reading Wayne Grudem, the great theologian, editor of the ESV Bible. I was reading his commentary the other day on Genesis 1:28, where God issues the first commission to humankind to fill and subdue the earth. And Grudem, translate this, translates that word subdue to mean, quote, to make the earth more useful for human beings benefit and enjoyment. End quote. And so the barista. That's exactly what that barista is doing. That barista is taking the raw materials of creation. The coffee bean, the. The almond that makes my almond milk, the paper, the trees that made up that cup and combines them together for my benefit and my enjoyment, and that is obedience to God's word. If done in ways that are in accordance with God's commands, that simple, everyday, ordinary act matters in the grand scheme of eternity because God sees it. And Psalm 37, 23 says he delights in every detail of our lives. Even that detail. Even you guys taking a photograph with the janitorial staff at a hospital. I love it so much. It's such a great encouragement. Hey, Mr. And Mrs. Claus. We wrap up every episode of the podcast with three questions. First, I'm curious. Which books do you guys find yourselves recommending or maybe giving away the most frequently these days?

We wrote down some. The names of some. One that we.

You came prepared. You brought a list. You checked it twice. You're ready to go.

We read this book years ago, and we're so impressed with it, and it's called Dream Big by Henrietta Mears. Oh, my goodness. That was so wonderful. Recently, I just have. I mostly just listen now so you can get a lot done. A lot. Read Dawes about Dawson Troutman.

Yeah.

And how his. The people that he interacted were the same people with Henrietta Mirrors, Billy Graham, and on and on. Oh, my goodness. I was so challenged by Dawson's life. It was just totally consumed with the Lord and teaching people the real gospel, you know, sharing the gospel, and everybody knows, needs to know how to do that. That's really encouraging to me. Another one I've just read is A Chance to Die by Amy Carmichael.

Yeah, yeah.

And I love Things that Matter by Joshua Becker.

Oh, great book.

Yeah. Yeah.

I love Jeff. We had Josh on the podcast talking about that. That book. It was great. Yeah, that's a heck of a list.

Well, Vernon had some, too. We also have read together and listened Hudson Taylor in the. And we love Booker T. Washington, George Washington Carver. Those stories of people taking George Washington Carver, you know, taking peanuts and doing amazing things.

One of the interesting things about George Washington Carver, you know, the rewriting of history, his biblical faith is being taken out of his biography by modern writers. Sure. It's so Sad.

Carver Season 1 of the Mere Christians podcast on the New Earth is going to feature an interview with George Washington Carver. Lord willing, I want to. I want to talk to George Washington Carver on the New Earth and unpack how his faith influences work. Because he was brilliant. Brilliant. And there was a very, very deep connection between his understanding of Genesis 1 and the work he did as a farmer. All right, so not on the New Earth, present day. Who would you guys most like to hear on this podcast talking about how their faith influences the work they do in the world?

Several.

Oh, great. Give them all to me.

My pence.

It's a good answer. That's a good answer.

Yeah.

He just Wrote a book about this. I haven't read it.

Yeah. And I also thought of Jim Daly.

Yeah, that's on the family.

Yeah, I thought of a. You know, instead of just such well known names.

Yeah.

We attended Boise Bible College here in Boise. And there's a staff member now. His name is Cody Christensen and he teaches at the college. He's so involved with the kids in their lives. And we just found out he is a leader in this, a group called, I think it's called Adventurers or something. It's like beyond Boy Scouts. It's for young adults. And. And they were at an event where we were performing a Santa Mrs. Claus and they were volunteering. And that's part of their things is volunteer at different community things. Anybody?

Interesting. That's an interesting name.

I like that.

All right, Mr. Mrs. Claus, you guys get the last word before our audience signs off on the podcast for Christmas. You're talking to an audience of mere Christians who are doing a lot of different work. Some of them are janitors, some of them are carpenters, some of them are CEOs. What they share is a desire to do their work in a way that glorifies God. What do you want to leave them with before we hang up?

So being Santa, Mrs. Claus, I mean, we really, we love those kids when we go see them. And Santa's often said, Santa loves you.

God takes the least of these, the treatment of the least of these personally.

Oh, that's my saying. God takes the treatment, our treatment of others personally. I mean, that's what it says, as you've done in the least of these. And so we try to help people understand that.

I love that so much. Ellen Vernon, I want to commend you for the exceptional work you guys do every day, but especially during the Christmas season, for the glory of God and the good of others. Thank you for showing kids just a glimpse and a taste of grace rather than works based righteousness.

And yeah, for caring for these kids.

And just loving them. Well, in your simple obedience to love your neighbor as yourself. Hey listeners, if you want to learn more, especially if you're in the Boise, Idaho area, go check out the Santa Couple attheSantaCOUPLE.com. guys, thank you for taking time out of your busy Christmas preparation with the elves to hang out with us on the podcast today.

Thank you. We're. We're happy to do it.

God bless you.

I hope you guys had as much fun listening to that episode as I did making it. What a joy these two were. Hey, Merry Christmas, everybody. Why don't you take a moment before you turn this episode off to praise and worship God for the fact that God is with us. He was with us physically here on earth in the person of Jesus. He's with us today through the power of the Holy Spirit and will one day be with us physically once again on the new earth where we will all long enjoy the work of our hands to the glory of Christ, Christ the king. See Isaiah 65. I love you guys. I love making this show for you. Thank you for tuning in. I'll see you next week.

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