Christine Griffin: Her Long Career in Disability Advocacy

At Highmark Health, we believe what makes us unique makes us better. Our differences broaden our perspectives and foster a variety of skills to complement each other, creating a stronger and more vibrant workforce. It's this belief that earned us recognition as the Best Place to Work for the 10th year for individuals with disabilities in a survey by the American Association of People with Disabilities and Disability:IN. We'll continue to celebrate and benefit from the inclusion of all people. To find out more, visit highmarkhealth.org. Welcome to Disability Matters with your host Joyce Bender. All comments, views, and opinions expressed on this show are solely those of the host, guest, and callers. Now the host of Disability Matters, here's Joyce Bender.

Hi everyone, welcome to Disability Matters with Joyce Bender. I am always so thrilled to be on with you. And I've been on a long time. Mm-hmm. Very long. I've been on, I think we were figuring out, for 22 years on this show. And I had my 1,000th episode only a few months ago. And we are now heard in 73 countries with listeners. And I have to First, thank all of my listeners right here in the United States. I want you to do me a favor. I want you to tell everyone you know about this show and listening to the show, and I will have great news. If you're seeing it now, we are live on YouTube. How exciting is that? So We just talked about my listeners around the world. I have no idea what's happening in Spain. But after the United States, Spain has the largest listening audience. You must have found out, Spain, that I'm learning Spanish on Duolingo. That must be it. But whatever it is, thank you so much. Wow. I'm really impressed. And then there are countries where there is sometimes only one listener, like Saudi Arabia, and one person can make a difference. I don't care, but please tell everyone about the show. Special shout out to Yoshiko Dart, which I've been doing for over 6 years, and you all know why. It gets me so upset. That people with disabilities, when they go to school— well, no, people without disabilities, when they go to school, they do not read about our history. Sometimes there may be a few paragraphs about the ADA, but if you would go out, you know, microphone, go down the street, "Hey, do you know who Justin Dart is?" the majority of people would say no. Therefore, I have that shout out to Yoshiko, who is the wife of the late, great Justin Dart, and who is herself a great champion. Yoshiko, lead on! And I know you're yelling back, lead on, because you always do. And I know you're going to be excited because of our guest today, Christine Griffin. But before I have Chris start, I just want to mention Highmark, such a great company. Do you know that through these past years they have sponsored the show, all these shows? Uh, and I mean, they do something very few people do in corporate America. They hire people, and they hire people with disabilities ongoing. They hire people with disabilities, uh, without me calling saying, please, please hire a person with a disability. Me, I don't say please, please, but you know what I'm saying. They call me. They are so awesome. Another example is this show. But I must tell you, I was very excited when I walked in here and knew my very first YouTube show visual would be with none other than Chris Griffin. First show that we are on YouTube. Chris, can't think of a better person that I would want to have on this show with me.

Joyce, thank you. Thank you. It's so great to be on the first ever Joyce Bender YouTube show. You know, when I think about the longevity of your show, you were a podcaster long before people even knew the term podcast. You've been doing this so long and sticking with it and really spreading the word about disability rights and advocacy across the world, frankly. So kudos to you and your team that put this together. It's an amazing accomplishment.

Thank you so much. And it is a team. It is a team. That has worked with me, including Aaron Keller, who is the head guy now at Voice America. Great, great supporter. He is so great. So thank you. And it is because of great guests like you, Chris, that we keep having people listen to this show. So everyone, if you don't know, I adore Chris Griffin. I've known her for a long time, but We have listeners around the world that do not know who you are. So, Chris, how about if you tell us your story, like where you went to school and on after that?

All right. So thanks again for having me on your show. I grew up in a place called Dorchester, Massachusetts. It's an area of Boston. And I was one of 7 kids in a very close-knit community that really shaped my values. And after high school and a semester of college, I was unsure really about what I wanted to do with my life, and I joined the U.S. Army. It gave me— joining the Army gave me the opportunity to learn, mature, and ultimately get the GI Bill so that when I did know what I wanted to do when I grew up, I'd have the means by which to do it, to go back to college and get the degree I Finally figured out I wanted, um, and what I wanted to do when I got out of the Army was actually join, um, the second class of women to attend Massachusetts Maritime Academy, which is one of five maritime academies in the country. And I went with the idea that I would become an engineer and work as a marine engineer on merchant marine ships, vessels. Unfortunately, an auto accident ended that plan to work on ships, but not my pursuit of an engineering degree. I got that degree and I worked as an engineer for 10 years, and then I decided that I would go to law school. I always had a strong sense, especially since I became disabled, a strong sense of justice, and I was a good, effective advocate for myself. I knew that. I wanted to use my voice to really help stand up for other people who didn't always get a fair shot and who needed, you know, who needed an advocate. And becoming an attorney actually gave me the tools to do that in a meaningful way. So that's sort of the short version of how I ended up doing the work that I did as a disability rights attorney.

What is your— what did you say your degree was in? Before I had—

I got it. My undergrad degree was in marine engineering.

Yeah, what is that?

It's like a mechanical engineering degree with a marine application. So you're taking all the courses that an engineer, mechanical engineer would take, but you're also, you know, working on a ship. Each school has their own training vessel and you're learning all the time how to operate a A huge ship.

Yeah. Wow. That is really interesting.

Everyone thinks the captain's the most important person on the ship. It's not. It's the chief engineer. That's the person that's making that thing go. The captain's just up there steering the wheel.

No kidding.

I just want to set that straight.

Yes. Yeah. Yeah. I never knew that. That is very interesting.

Without the engine going, that captain isn't going to steer anywhere.

No. Well, isn't it always like that?

Yes.

That behind the scenes of whomever it is, there's a whole group that's really— that's why I always tell—

Yeah, the handsome guy in the white uniform, he's not making that ship move.

Well, I always say to nurses, okay, we know who runs the hospital. And it isn't the doctors. It's you. It's you nurses. You are the ones. That's who you talk to the most and that, you know, is there every minute helping you along. So you became an attorney because of your interest in civil rights, like disability rights, after your accident. Right, right. How did people— I have a question. I ask this all the time. Did you notice a difference as to how people dealt with you after the accident? Oh, when you were in a wheelchair, it was immediate.

So, you know, it's funny, I remember being in the hospital and having a friend come up and visit. And after sitting there talking to me for about 20 or 30 minutes, he looked at me and he said, I told everyone you'd be the same. So there were obviously even my friends were having discussions about how this was going to impact me and was I going to be the same person. And yes, I was. But it was striking to me how people treated me after that, whether it was people that knew me, people that, you know, were just acquaintances, or whether it was people that didn't know me at all. They did treat me differently than, you know, before the accident. I was walking around and I was treated, you know, I felt pretty equally, you know, I was a woman. So we had that going on. Other than that, you know, you were treated fairly equal. But after, after becoming paralyzed and using a wheelchair, you saw that people saw you as somehow less, less than— whether they had lower expectations of you or whether they thought less of you or whether they thought you had less abilities than they did. I really started seeing a difference in how people were treating me, and I didn't like it. And so I really— I think that was one of the catalysts for making me want to do the work that I ended up doing, that I didn't want to see other people treated in ways that, you know, whether they knew it or not, people were placing barriers in front of you. I really saw it in employment, especially even when I was graduating with a law degree from Boston College Law School. Some of the discrimination I encountered from law firms was shocking, to be perfectly honest with you. And so I really didn't want other people to face those types of barriers. And it was another thing that really motivated me. To, you know, it didn't make me shrink from society as I think it does for some people. It made me want to be out front even more saying, you know, hey, you know, I knew Joyce Bender right away that, you know, even when I went back to school and now I'm back at the same Mass Maritime Academy, only I'm in a wheelchair now and people would treat me differently. I had enough confidence in myself that I knew that that was their problem. Not mine. And, you know, I just, you know, I just let a lot of it go. I really did look at it as, you know, that's some problem you're going to have to overcome. I'll help you overcome it as much as I can, but I have to move on here. So I think I had enough confidence to recognize what it was and to be confident enough to say, this is something I want to help other people, not go through, uh, at least face differently, right?

Right. Um, yeah, because of course, myself included, Paula, Gerald, and of course Mary when she was still alive with us, if you would walk in someplace, we'd be saying, hey Chris, hey, how you doing? Whereas It's like that with your friends. Yeah, before, but then after you're in a wheelchair, it's more like, oh, hey Chris, you know, how's it going? How are you doing?

Yeah, that pity look.

Yeah, a little pity. Yes. Well, I was with Chris right here in Pittsburgh, and she was in her car that she was driving to DC, and the guy at the hotel came out and he was saying to her Are you okay? I mean, do you really think you should be driving? Do you really think that? Do you think you should be in the car? Remember that?

Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. That is how—

I can't tell you how many people will still say to me something like, you drive? Like it's some miracle that has occurred. And it's like, oh my God. Yeah, I drive.

Yeah.

Technology is wonderful and it's been around a long time.

Yeah, Chris and I are a big joke, is that people say things to Chris like, good for you, you're out shopping, or you're out. Yeah, good for you. So you know what, folks, pity has to go, okay? Yeah, yeah, it's gotta go. You know, I live with epilepsy, but I do not want people— and they have, they've said things to me like, oh, Joyce, you have epilepsy, you don't even look sick. I mean, you look fine. I mean, all kinds of bizarre things. But really, we don't want pity. I always say, watch out when you hire us because we'll take your job.

Yeah, Joyce, I love you saying paychecks, not pity.

Paychecks, not pity.

Hand over the cash, we'll work, we'll earn the money, and don't pity us.

We're not looking for pity. Yeah, that's right. We don't want pity. And I also don't like When I— when someone does find employment and it's, oh, hey, I know this was the right thing to do, like it's a favor, like I'm doing you this favor, whereas it is the right thing to do, but it's a business investment. Yeah, we gotta get rid of this stigma, that's for sure. So, Chris, you worked at OPM and EEOC disability rights, but especially in employment.

Employment.

Right now, and if I fell, I'm going to tell her to listen to this show because my favorite story is when you ask for one. But before you tell that story, tell us about EEOC, you know, what you did there and what they do, and then about OPM.

All right, well, at EEOC, I— when I first became a commissioner, I was quite surprised to learn that the federal government wasn't doing a good job of hiring people with significant disabilities. I don't know why I was under some illusion that they did do a good job in comparison to other employers in the private sector. Well, in fact, it turns out when I saw the statistics, they weren't. So I, along with my team and a lot of other people, I didn't do this alone, but I created an initiative called LEAD. And a shout out to Yoshiko Dot, LEAD On, because We sort of stole that from her and from Justin. We called it LEAD, and it stood for Leadership for Employment of Americans with Disabilities. But the focus of that initiative was on the federal government. So we thought if the federal government can increase the hiring of people with significant disabilities and do it in an effective way, they have the tools to do it. Did it in an effective way. Wouldn't it be better to be able to turn to private sector employers and say, look, we can help you, we're from the government, we can help you, we know how to do this. And so we started this initiative and it really focused on awareness and education for federal agencies so that they would hire more people. And we worked on that the whole time I was at EEOC. But when I went over to the Office of Personnel Management as Deputy Director, under the Obama administration, we were able to take this another step forward. We worked, a whole team of us worked diligently on an executive order that President Obama signed on the 20th anniversary of the Americans with Disabilities Act. And this executive order required federal agencies to increase the employment of people and veterans with disabilities in the federal government by 100,000 over 5 years. And I'm happy to report that actually that goal was achieved. And Joyce, you and the folks at Bender were a big part of that happening because, you know, you were the agency that, that a lot of federal agencies turned to to get vetted referrals from that were eligible for the jobs that they had open. And so that was, that was really, that was a big accomplishment and something I'm very proud of to this day. And we worked on lots of other things at OPM, the retirement system and, you know, other necessary things. But this was really something special to me because of my passion for employment of people with disabilities.

And I have Really fantastic news that I think is so great. We found— we have a candidate that we recruited for a high-level position with a defense contractor, and she's so impressive, and she worked for the federal government 17 years. Do you know why she called us? Because when she was in the federal government at Homeland Security, She used the OPM shared list. Yeah.

And she said, where it is, right?

She did say that. She said, and it's gone. We don't have it. But she said, I hired people through that list and they were great. So I acquired a disability during COVID and I decided, huh, I'm calling Bender. That's how she came to be to us.

Great.

Yeah, yeah, that— I mean, that shared list, it was so great. It made it so much easier for companies to hire people with disabilities.

Yeah, this was a— this was great. It was really a resource for federal agencies to go to a list that of people that had already been vetted. They were Schedule A eligible. Schedule A, we won't go into it, but it's a tool by which the federal government can hire you in a non-competitive process, meaning they can hire you very quickly if they want to. So Joyce Bender's team would vet all these people, put them in categories. You could sort by, you could sort by if people wanted to relocate, you could sort by resume, by occupation. It was just a great but whether they had veteran status or not, it was just a great, great resource for federal agencies. So, and it helped them do what the executive order told them to do. And that was the point. Yeah.

So, when you started though, you found out to your surprise how low the percentage was of people with disabilities hired by the federal government. So when I said about, hi, she loves that one thing you used to do. Tell everyone what you would ask them when you would be asking them to hire someone.

Speaking to a group of either, it could be federal agencies, it could be private sector employers, and everyone had excuses for why they didn't hire people with disabilities. And I would say, they would say the goal was too high. They, you know, they were only at, this percent and to get to 2%. Can you imagine? To get to 2% was just too lofty a goal, blah, blah, blah. And I would look at them and I would say, could you just hire one? Commit right now to me to hiring one person with a disability. Can we all commit to that? And Hai likes to repeat that story. When people tell all the reasons why they can't do it, she'd say, can you just hire one?

Oh, I loved when you did that. I loved when you would do that. You know what? This is like when I spoke at Disability:IN, not this year, the year before, and said, and I want you to hire at least one person to all these, and then come and tell me next year. Well, hi, Mark.

Yeah. Hi, Mark. Well, hi, Maxalita. Hi, Maxalita. They believe, they know that this is a pool of talented people that they have great employees as a result of. So they know that we're a good pool of talent that they can tap into and that most other employers overlook, which is—

And you know what? They didn't hire one. They hired 34.

Isn't that great? I know.

Yeah, they are so awesome. They are the best. Well, it's almost time for our Mathis with the Mic news report. And I want to say we are the only place in the world where you can go every week, every single week, and find out what's the news, what's going on in the disability community. You know what? That makes me really proud when you think about that. I mean, I wish it was different. I wish you could turn on CNN and, oh, here's what's happening. But that isn't how it is. So Jennifer Mathis could not be with us today. Her segment's called Mathis on the Mic. However, Holly O'Donnell is with us today to talk about the news. And Holly, I have to give you credit, Holly. You came up with that title, Mathis on the Mic.

That's a good name.

Not me. Oh, that is a good one. That is a good name. And she had that for years in her mind.

8 years. 8 years.

That's good. Yeah. And for those of you, look, you get to see the beautiful Holly O'Donnell. So I can now tell you she is the CEO of Bazelon. Baselon Center Mental Health Law, and I am so proud to be on that board. And Chris, I know you know how prestigious that organization is.

Oh, absolutely. They're the premier legal consultants, advisors, lawyers, advocates, for people with mental health issues. They, they're always at the forefront of every policy issue, uh, for people with, uh, mental health issues. And, you know, the rest of us that worked in the legal services field all over the country were always looking to them to be, you know, lead, lead for all of us on a variety of issues. And you certainly got your hands full today, don't you, Holly? We do.

We do. So, Holly, what news do you have for us today?

Well, my first piece of news— thanks for having me on and letting me substitute for Jennifer Mathis. Uh, Christine, I am also from Dorchester.

Yeah, well, yeah, you're one of the O'Donnells, and Joyce was telling me before the show your father worked with Tip O'Neill. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

But I left when I was, um, 3.

Okay.

Yeah.

But anyway, so I'm from— Everyone's originally from Dorchester. Do you know that? You've seen the bumper sticker, right? Originally from Dorchester. Yeah.

Yeah. So I was happy to see that and happy to see your sign in the background.

Yes. Yeah.

Yeah. So Joyce, I'm going to talk about 3 different pieces of news. Okay. Is that allowed?

That's allowed.

Okay, good. So first, I want— this time of year it's back to school. So children have started going back to school. I know that Pittsburgh Public Schools, like D.C. Public Schools, starts next Monday. And I looked and saw Boston Public Schools starts on September 5th, which is a Friday, which I don't understand, but it is back to school season. And we want to wish all the children and teachers and administrators a good school year. I also want to let folks know, and you might be reading about this in the news, that in terms of special education funding, advocates are warning that there could be significant numbers— hundreds is the thing, the word being used— of grants that may be terminated, which would be millions and millions of dollars. And this is funded through IDEA Part D. So I want to be clear that there's lots of formula money that will— that is not being interrupted, that is services for children with disabilities, and that's IDEA Part B. But the types of things that are in the grants in Part D are research, parent supports for children with disabilities, trainings, for example. And that money goes to SEAs, which are state education agencies, nonprofits, and researchers. So most of them are in the middle— I think this is right— of their 5-year cycle, and their money has not been received yet. And the fiscal year, as we all know, starts on October 1st. So right now there's a lot of advocacy around this to make sure that these, these supports that are funded by IDEA Part D continue to receive funding. So that's my first piece of news. My second piece of news, because you know that the Bazelon Center is located in Washington, D.C., and you know that I live on Capitol Hill, 9 blocks from the Capitol, that on August 11th, there was an executive order issued by the president titled "Restoring Law and Order to the District of Columbia." And everybody's following this, I assume, in the news like we are, but I wanted, I know we talk a lot about homelessness Joyce Bender. And so I wanted to talk about some of the things that we know so far, which is that there have been encampments that have been cleared and destroyed, and property has been destroyed of a lot of unhoused people located in the District of Columbia.

Oh no, that's terrible.

Yeah, we're monitoring for disability rights concerns since the White House spokesperson said they will offer people treatment and take them to the hospital or jail if they refuse. Um, we're not aware of, um, them taking a lot of people to the hospital, but we and others are monitoring this, and we also really want to emphasize that the executive order wrongly suggests that homelessness and mental illness are inextricably linked with crime and suggests that institutionalization is the primary solution that should be used to address homelessness. And, you know, we know this is not true. I just read an opinion in Washington Post that was talking about housing first and how important it is. But it is a, um, it's a really sensitive, um, time here. And, you know, I grew up here, um, in the District of Columbia.

Yes, because just as you're alluding to, many people with mental health disabilities who are homeless are You know, just wrapped up in all of this. Let's just get everyone and get them off the street and either go to a hospital or who knows, jail or, you know, an institution or whatever could happen. But the homeless people are people. This is just a situation that has happened that is very unfortunate. But yes, that is scary. And I did wonder what you were seeing, because I saw on the news today, and I think it's being— I think there's a lawsuit to try to stop this, but the 3 different states were sending their troops to DC.

National Guard. Yes.

And I was trying to envision— 3 different states are sending in their own National Guard to further these efforts in DC. It's horrible.

And I was trying to picture that. I mean, is there even room for all these people? Like, I'm thinking, well, where are you going to go? I mean, where will they go?

I mean, most people that are walking around the District right now, I mean, I can look out on 15th Street and, you know, it looks like a normal day. By Union Station, there are a lot of— there's a lot of National Guard. But I was up really, really early this morning. And I drove by, and at 5:30 in the morning, there was not any National Guard.

So, um, I wonder what they— as a National Guard, you join the National Guard, do you think you're going to end up, you know, stripping homeless encampments and destroying people's lives? I mean, is that really— don't you think half of them are saying, what did I sign up for?

I know I haven't spoken to anyone. I do know a few people that are in the National Guard, but I don't know if they've been called up yet. And then, I mean, this is just one piece of the executive order. Yeah. But Joyce, I wanted to bring it up to you because it's news in terms of some of the things that we're doing here in DC, and it's obviously a big national issue.

Yeah, scary.

And then the third piece of news, um, is that, you know, I believe it's important to come together and to celebrate. And I want to mention our— the Bazelon Center's awards, which will be on September 17th. Christine, if you happen to be in DC, we would love to have you join us, and it will be at the Press Club. And last year Joyce Bender got an award, and this year we will be celebrating the 35th anniversary of the ADA.

And Congressman Hoyer will be there, right?

Yes, he will.

Great.

Yeah. Yes. I just want to— oh, he is. Listen, if you, you know, go to Bazelon.org, is that right? All right, yes, B-A-Z as in zebra, B-A-Z-E-L-O-N, uh, dot org. You don't want to miss this. I mean, I love it, and not just because I got an award and I was so— Eve Hill, the chair, I think that is the most moving speech introduction anyone has ever given me. I mean, it was so honored. Uh, but anytime I've gone, it's always so exciting and so great. And, um, who are the other people that you have there?

They're being announced. We haven't quite done it yet, but we have them all lined up.

Oh, okay. So you do always have them. Okay, but you always have a moderator of some type.

I'm not That's what I mean.

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. And just— Yeah, just go if you can and go to Bazelon. And you know what? I encourage you to make a donation because yes, I have a not-for-profit, but you know, we all need to support each other. I mean, the Epilepsy Association, I'm the chair of, and they are always supporting things I'm involved with.— but I support Bazelon. But think about what they're talking about here. I mean, these are serious things. So, you know, bazelon.org, donate. But that gala will be fantastic. I can't wait. Thank you, Holly.

Thank you. Thanks for letting me sub. It was nice to meet you, Christine.

Nice to meet you. Take care, Holly.

Bye, Holly. Bye-bye. So what did you think about all that, Chris?

Oh, very interesting. And I, you know, I, I, there's just so much unknown and, and, um, ahead that's scary. And, and, um, I, I, I, it's just hard to know what to do, who can do it, who can be effective. But, you know, organizations like Bazelon, there aren't many organizations out there fighting for the rights of people with mental health issues. And you can see what's happening to them right on the streets of D.C. And it's, you know, and they need, they need a good advocacy organization like Bazelon to help them do it. So it is a good cause to support. They do great work. Again, they were always the leaders, you know, whenever we were, even in Massachusetts, thinking about a particular issue or a lawsuit, we were consulting with the folks at Bazelon to make sure that we were doing the right thing and moving in the right direction and not making bad law for the future. And Jennifer Mathis is a gem. It's so great that she's back at Baselon. She really is an amazing lawyer and advocate.

So yeah, she is, she is a jewel. Well, a great thing that happened to me several years ago is Chris Griffin, who is, by the way, very well known in the disability community, a giant in the area of disability rights, and I love her. So now that I've told you all this, how thrilled do you think I was when she wanted to partner with me with Bender Consulting Services? And her whole area of retained search is still employment. As you know, I'm in employment, uh, but I find employment— we're a national company, and we find employment for people in healthcare, AI, we're doing a lot in AI now, procurement, all human resources, healthcare a lot, and it's so exciting. But we also have Chris heads up doing all the retained search. So Chris, why don't you talk about what you do and then about any opportunities you have available?

Okay, so in partnership with Joyce and the folks at Bender Consulting, I work to help connect organizations with talented executives, many of whom, or all of whom, actually have disabilities. And the focus isn't so much on disability, it's on the fact that they have the skills and qualifications necessary for these executive-level positions. And we're focused not only filling leadership positions, but also in making sure that disability is part of the diversity conversation at the highest levels. And so it's incredibly rewarding work. I love, you know, of course, working with Joyce Bender and her team, but I love it because it directly changes the face of leadership. And so we have some interesting positions that I'm working on right now. And should I launch into— tell you about those? Okay. So we're conducting searches of our top nonprofit and advocacy organizations. And one I'd really like to focus on now is the the president CEO position that's open at United Spinal. So this is an amazing organization that focuses on advocacy and services for people with spinal cord injury, spinal cord disorders, and in effect all wheelchair users benefit from the work that they do. So in essence, they are representing all wheelchair users in the, uh, in the country. And this position is a remote position that's a great opportunity for someone who's got not only good management skills, good fundraising skills. Holly knows what it takes to be the executive at the top of one of these organizations. It takes a lot of great skills. They have over 50 chapters across the country. This person would be responsible for not only the 35 staff, managing the staff and the budget of about $4 million, but also, you know, interacting with the important stakeholders across the country and their donors, the members. It's a membership organization. If you haven't seen their website, it is stellar. So unitedspinal.org. I just watched a video on there that, that really in-depth talked to you about as a wheelchair user what you should be thinking about when you're buying a vehicle to drive. And it was— I wish I had seen it years ago. They have all sorts of videos. They publish the award-winning New Mobility magazine. If you've ever seen that, you can get that online. Membership is free. I mean, it's just an amazing organization that's full of information and resources for people with disabilities, but specifically people who are wheelchair users. So that position is open and people can, if you want to apply, or you know someone, reach out to them and tell them this job is open. It just became open as of today and it'll be on Benda's website. Benderconsulting.com. It will also be on unitedspinal.org's website, but you would send a resume and cover letter to me, cgriffin@benderconsult.com, and that's how you apply. Resume, cover letter, you know, tell me in your cover letter why, you know, you'd be a great fit for this position, and I can send anyone the job announcement so you see in more detail what people are looking for. But that announcement will be up on Bender's website as well as United Spinal. So, this is a great opportunity for somebody with a national focus on advocacy issues.

And that is a very— so you all know this— very powerful.

Very.

Highly thought of role. And, uh, you know, if you know anyone, benderconsult.com— send them to benderconsult.com. And even if it isn't you and you know someone, you need to tell them. And if you have any questions, you can get in touch with Chris at cgriffin@benderconsult.com. C and then G as in Riffin.com. Chris, what else are you working on?

Well, I'm also working on a search right now. We're nearing the end. This is the executive director position for the California Foundation for Independent Living Centers. So California, being the large state that it is, has about 28 independent living centers that serve, you know, the variety of areas where they're each located, but they have a trade association called California Foundation of Independent Living Centers, and every state has this. So every state has their group of independent living centers in an association that acts as their— it could be a conduit for grants that they applied for jointly. It could be a— it's really an education educational and technical assistance provider for the network of all the independent living centers and all of the executive directors of these ILCs, the members along with their employees. So they hold conferences, they do a lot of, like I said, training and technical assistance. But they have an interesting thing I learned about out in California. They have a a grant that comes from the energy companies for preparedness for disasters. And so they were able to do that work and the energy companies actually fund it. And so that money goes through the association and gets distributed out to the different independent living centers. I thought that was— I know I love learning about that. I thought, oh my God, every state should be Oh yeah, that is awesome. I know, what a great resource, huh? So, yeah, so I'm working on that too, and, and it's, and it's, and I love the work. Like I said, it's, you know, we're helping at Bender, we're helping change the face of employment for people with disabilities across the country from entry level all the way up to the executive level positions.

So, Chris, what is the, what is the process like? Say, for example, I'm interested in, you receive my resume. Resume, then what would happen?

Well, I would review the resume, and then I would— if you meet qualifications, I would recommend to the search committee that I conduct a screening interview with you. And if they agree, I would conduct that interview. And then based on people who have gone through a screening interview and rise to the next level of what the search committee considers skilled and qualified for the position, then they would extend an offer of an interview. So they'll be very selective about who they interview. They only want to interview people that are truly— they think can, can do the job. And then once— there'll probably be a second round of interviews for very few candidates, and then ultimately the board— the search committee will recommend to the board who they think should be the, the next exec, the next president and CEO of United Spinal.

And I, I just want to explain, I want to explain retained search. Yeah, another word, Chris alone has this contract. Bender Consulting has this contract. So if you're interested, you have to send your resume to Chris. It's not that you hang up and send it to United Spinal because they'll just end up sending it to Chris.

Send it to me, right?

Yes, yes. And the other thing is that, you know, we are representing— Chris is representing this great organization. So we're not like an employment agency. This is different. This is— we've been given this search to go find the person, and I will be so happy if someone listening to the show would be selected That would be so awesome because then you could say, yes, I met Chris Griffin through Disability Matters, and wouldn't that be just awesome? Chris, are there any other things you want to add to what I just said?

No, I just, I think people should get a sense that you said we're not just any employment agency. We're not. We are so committed to this and passionate about it that it's, you know, for me to be able to work with United Spinal to help them find their next leader, I take this as, it's so personal and so important. And so, you know, it's not just a job, it's a passion that we have to ensure that United Spinal has the next leader for many years to come who is just an amazing advocate for people with spinal cord injury, spinal cord disorder, or any wheelchair user that's out there. This is, this is a commitment and a passion.

Yeah, me too. And that is, that is absolutely great when you think that the person that you place in that position is going to impact so many lives, right? So again, benderconsult.com. One last thing about this, if you're listening to the show or you work for a— if you're the chair or you work for an organization such as Lupus, American Heart Association, arthritis, any group like that, we do work with groups that represent a specific disability. So we'll find the person that fits that position. As a matter of fact, Chris, you did. You found the person for the autism organization, Autistic Self Advocacy Network.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, he's doing great there.

So yeah, yeah, that is so awesome. Well, Chris, a little final couple things about you. Okay, who is your role model? I know this is a hard role model.

You know, I thought about this for a while, and there's, you know, I can think of lots of people I could name, you included. So, but I would have to say my role model was Senator Ted Kennedy, and he was, you know, just a tireless advocate for civil rights and disability rights. I had the privilege of knowing him, and he had a profound impact on my career. He was incredibly supportive and encouraged me. From the first day I met him right up to, you know, when he died. And he really gave me the confidence to, you know, move forward as a leader. And his belief in fairness and inclusion continues to really inspire me every day. So I'd have to say Senator Ted Kennedy, you know.

Yes. Did, and he nominated you for the position at EEOC.

He encouraged me to become a commissioner at EEOC, you know, and he was the one that nominated me and promoted me to be, you know, he nominated, but it's really the president that nominates and the Senate confirms. But if he hadn't pushed me forward, you know, that would not have happened, you know.

So yeah, he, he was on my life and the whole disability community because I was thinking, is it this? We people would go to him.

Yeah.

You know, and then, and Senator Harkin also, but it was Senator Kennedy at the beginning that something happened.

No idea all the stuff that he did. For the disability community, and he just did it. You know, he didn't have to be convinced. He didn't have to, you know, be lobbied the hell out of or anything like that. He knew when something was right and good for people with disabilities, he was all on board.

Yeah, he was. And now we know his son Ted.

Yeah, yeah.

Who also is in disability rights.

Right.

Exactly. So, Chris, what message do you have for our listeners today?

Well, I think, you know, probably most of your listeners know this, but it'd always be a saying that, you know, disability is part of the human experience and inclusion benefits everybody. And if you're a person with a disability, you shouldn't let barriers define your future. What you can and cannot do, your talent, your voice, you know, they're needed and they're needed within the community. So please, you know, come forward and be an advocate for yourself, but for others if you can. If you're an employer, I would say don't miss the opportunity to hire people with disabilities in your organization. Together, you know, with employers, we can build a workforce and a society And I've always hopped on this, that I really think employment is the key to this. A society that reflects the richness of all people, including people with disabilities. So disability is part of the human experience and inclusion benefits everyone. And if you're a person with a disability, don't let the barriers and the discrimination define your future.

Amen to that. Well, Chris, what a pleasure to have you on the show today. I know, I love it, I love it. You were the first YouTube— see, we look like CNN. Yeah, people watch this.

Yeah, we're like CNN glasses.

Well, we end every show with a quote, and today it is the— I'm going to read this to you. The Americans with Disabilities Act will end the American apartheid. Oh, I love that. The act has the potential to become one of the greatest civil rights laws of our generation. Disabled citizens deserve the opportunity to work for a living, ride a bus, have access to public and commercial buildings, and do all the other things that the rest of us take for granted. Mindless physical barriers and outdated social attitudes have made them second-class citizens for far too long. This legislation is a bill of rights for the disabled, and America will be a better and fairer nation because of it. And Chris, I somehow knew that role model would be Senator Ted Kennedy. And that quote is from Senator—

isn't that great?

Yes, yes.

I didn't even tell you, so that's—

no, no, I just thought, you know what, I know who's going to be that role model. Um, and you know what though, the Americans with Disabilities will end The American apartheid. You know, what a great speaker and orator also.

Yeah, well, we have a ways to go, but we should all be working hard to make his statement come true.

That's right. We also end every show by reminding you what you should do every day. And in the words of Mary Brooker, That is choose joy. This is Joyce Bender. Have a great day. Talk to you all next week.

Voice America would like to thank you for tuning in. Please join us next Tuesday at 11 AM Pacific time and 2 PM Eastern time for another installment of Disability Matters, right here on the Voice America Variety channel. We are the leader in live internet talk radio. VoiceAmerica.com.