David Holmberg: Highmark Grows Standard to Hire Disabled in 2025

Welcome to Disability Matters with your host Joyce Bender. All comments, views, and opinions expressed on the show are solely those of the host, guest, and callers. Now the host of Disability Matters, here's Joyce Bender. Well, hello everyone and Happy New Year. I am so excited. With all the guests we already have planned, you won't believe this, but yes, through September we have guests scheduled. Through September. You know, this is year 22. 22 years we've been on the air. Hard to believe. Um, interesting, someone that was in human resources years ago at Highmark, Ty Alexander, Joyce Bender was my first guest ever of all time. I probably had with my family, maybe, who knows, 5 people listening. But, you know, we've come a long way since then. And you know who I owe that to? I owe that to you, my listeners. You are so loyal. You know what really amazed me is in December of this past year, I found out that when Perijude Ratajkic gets on and does a newscast and she asks for something, for example, she asked my listeners to please call Senator Bob Casey before he leaves and thank him for everything he did for the disability community. And Harry at Disability Rights Pennsylvania, which that's where Advocacy Matters is posted, in other words, the on-demand printout of our radio show, you can't believe how many calls they were getting, and it was from the radio show. So once again, I love all of you. I so appreciate your loyalty, and to my listeners around the world, okay, so I'm going to read the countries with the most listeners. Of course, the United States, we know, would be at the top. But then Australia. Thank you, Australia. The number of listeners in Australia has increased. Canada, Japan, Japan and Germany. You are, after the United States, the countries with the most listeners. Netherlands, India, Indonesia, the Philippines, Israel, Austria, United Kingdom, Russian Federation, New Zealand, Brazil. Brazil, that has to be you, Richard Roberts from the U.S. State Department. I love you so much. You know, Richard went with me to the first time I met him. He's with the State Department. Is when the U.S. State Department asked me to go to South Korea. What I do is I go and I'm with the diplomat from the State Department the entire week. And I go to schools, companies, disability rights groups, businesses. I go everywhere through the country. Speaking to people with disabilities, that's when I first met Richard. And you know what, he's like, he's a disability rights advocate because then when I went to Japan, he had moved to Japan. So, you know, I went to Okinawa first and I got to be with him before we went to the mainland into Tokyo. And he and Gang Yong-chan in South Korea are such great disability rights leader, and Richard is such a close friend. So, in Brazil, Richard, can't wait to come there and see you. I'll tell you a little joke I have with the State Department. I mean, I take this seriously. I'm representing the United States of America. I'm not going on vacation. So when I go, you know, I have to tell them what I want in the program, and I want every day, morning to night, morning to night. And they set all of these meetings up so that the State Department started telling, like when I went to Indonesia and I went to Kazakhstan, they told them, okay, look, we've got to warn you, this isn't one of these people like, I'm coming to go on vacation and I'm done at 5. You know, she's going to be wanting to go all day, all night. And sure enough, They started telling me when I go, oh yeah, we know, we were warned about you. We were warned, we're going to get tired. But Brazil, love you. Singapore, China, Latvia, Romania, Ireland, Spain, Colombia, Zambia, Poland, and Nigeria. Now there are a couple companies, countries that I know, such as Colombia, that only has one person listening. One. You've heard me say it before, I'll say it again. I started, it was just one person that met with one person that made a decision, and now thousands of people with disabilities have found employment around the world. Look what I'm doing with the State Department and this radio show. My point is one person can make a difference. If you go to other people in your country that are English-speaking and let them know about this show, you know, in Asia, for example, there's pervasive shame if you have a disability. You can make that difference. So once again, thank you. And of course, who has been my lead sponsor for years? None other than that great company, Highmark health. And as we're starting 2025, if you haven't listened to the past shows, several years now I call this January the Power Month, and I always start with David Holmberg. Now, I want to say this, you know, a lot of CEOs, it would be like, I don't have time, or can this person do this? He every single year has been willing to do this. I can't speak highly enough of Highmark Health. You know the only thing I feel terrible about? There aren't other Highmark Health. As a matter of fact, there isn't one company I know anywhere that has done what they've done. Just to put in perspective, guess what this year is? It is the 30th anniversary of Bender Consulting Services. And guess how I got started? As you know, I live with epilepsy, but I started with Highmark. Just so you know, Bill Lowry retired and he took me to lunch to meet John Rouse. And he retired and he set up a breakfast with Kim Maloney. And he retired and then I met with Bill Winkenwerder. Now keep in mind, These are all CEOs of Highmark. And then I got to meet David Holmberg. Oh my God. Talk about taking it over the top, as you'll hear me give you some examples. But where could you find a company, really, through all those years, every CEO has stood behind me. It is absolutely remarkable. And that is why, David, it is my great honor to have you kick off the year at our 30th anniversary for, uh, for our 22nd year on the air. And, um, welcome. I can't thank you enough, my listeners around the world, because you know what we do here is replicated in other countries. So thank you so much. Welcome. And I guess let's start with you. Let's hear about you, your story, like where you grew up, went to college. And one question I do have, because I talked to your close friend Karen Hanlon and other people about this, my new question, what do you think prepared you for this role? In your life, I mean, what do you think were the things that prepared you to be the CEO of a huge corporation like Highmark. So, David, welcome. I'll turn it over to you.

Well, thank you very much, Joyce. I'm not sure what to do with all that other than to say, you know, you're a real dynamo and you're the reason why all these programs have been successful because, you know, you continue to advocate for those who may need a hand up and who haven't had a chance. And so, I appreciate that. You know, I consider myself very fortunate that I'm in a role where I can have an impact. Highmark is a $30 billion health— integrated healthcare system that's an insurer, has a hospital system, 14 hospitals, thousands of clinicians, actually over 20,000 taking care of people. And, you know, and it's a real privilege to have those kinds of opportunities. And when you have a seat like I do, a chair that I get to sit in every day and make decisions, With that opportunity comes the responsibility and accountability to do things the right way and make a difference and have an impact on people. And so, I take that very seriously. I think, you know, to answer your question, you know, whether it was sort of how did I get here or what do I think about success, you know, the number one reason is because of adversity. You know, I had adversity early in my life. Grew up in an environment where it was a little bit more challenging, not as hard as many people have. But what became very clear to me was that I wanted more. I wanted to be a better person. I wanted to accomplish more. And I thought maybe I had a shot at that. But in order to do that, I needed to first overcome adversity and learn how to have a strong work ethic, learn how to, you know, self-rescue, if you want to call it that, you know, and not allow, you know, the environment to define me, but instead put myself in a position where I can have an impact. And, you know, along the way, what I realized was there truly are people out there who want to help. And, you know, you have to identify the people that are willing to give you a hand up or give you an opportunity. But you have to show up. You have to arrange that. And so, as I sit here today, I work really hard to make sure that others have those same kinds of opportunities as we try to deliver for the customers who we serve.

Well, you know, I know you would be saying all of this because our theme for the year, for those of you that do not know, From around 2002, I think it is, we started this. We're gonna have a theme every year with quotes every month that I send out to all the current and past employees. Like, the first theme was character, and my hope is that with these quotes, not only will it empower people but even help them at work and/or their personal life. And this year Our theme is humility. And by the way, if you're a teacher, educator, speaker, whatever, and you're looking for great quotes, benderconsult.com, go to insights, and you will see all of the quotes through the years. Our quote to kick off the year: Humility is not thinking less of yourself, It's thinking of yourself less. C.S. Lewis. Humility is not thinking less of yourself. It's thinking of yourself less. And David, that is you. I can't begin to tell you the number of people at Highmark or that know you that when they talk about you say, David is very humble, including board members of Highmark. That have said that to me. And of course, your colleagues, you know, Karen Hanlon, your number 2 person, just loves working for you. They all do. But people, that's— and I know here I've got a story for everyone. I love this story, is that forever with all the CEOs, we go out for a holiday breakfast. You know, David and I will be going out because we frequently go out in January. So My executive assistant Carol, last year and the year before, she came in and said, okay, normally I either go to David's office, the conference room there, or Carol says, he told me where we're going. I said, okay, where am I going? Kelly O's. Now, if you haven't been to a Kelly O's, unless you've been in Pittsburgh, best city in America. You probably have not been to Kelly O's, but may I tell you, I love diners. I mean, no matter where I go, what city, I love diners, love them. And Kelly O's is awesome. But when Karen said David Holmberg, CEO of Highmark, said, we'll go to Kelly O's, guess what I did? I made her call back. I said, Carol, you got that wrong somehow. That must be something else. Nope, she didn't get it wrong. And when I went in, David said, why do you think this is unusual? I said, look around, do you see other CEOs here? No, of course not. You see them at our Duquesne Club. Yoni, I even see people walking out in the streets that are CEOs that I know. Here he is, Kelly O's with hot sauce, another thing that I love. And that is my point about humility. You know, that made my day, David.

Well, thank you very much. It made my day because they have great pancakes. But, you know, no matter what country you're in, no matter what city you're in, you know, there's always places, local places that you get the opportunity to be with the people. And Kelly O's is one of those places. It's a crossroads of America. I used to go to a place in Fort Worth, Texas, when I lived down there that was very similar, where regardless of what your background was, regardless of what your skin color was, regardless of what your story was, everybody was welcome. And everybody understood that, you know, that first of all, that the waitresses were in charge. And I mean that sincerely. Yeah. And, you know, and you treated them with respect and they treated you with respect. But what everybody really understood, and I think what I love about Kelly O's is Everybody's equal. And you'll see construction people, you'll see business people, you'll see women with children. And it's a place where you can have great food. Everybody's equal. People don't get into your business and everybody has an opportunity. And so, that's why I love to go there. And the food's great and the coffee's good. You know, you, uh, you know, they stand for something, and, and, uh, and that's the kind of place that I like to be.

So being that, as I told you, he's humble, I will also tell you he's generous, because I happen to know that during this whole COVID, you know, a lot of waitresses, people, they all lost their jobs. So when they did get back, very few people going. He always went. David kept going, and guess what? He gave extremely generous tips. That's what I mean about people, as he said earlier, that remember the least of these.

That's very kind of you, Joyce Bender Bender. You know, again, I consider myself very fortunate that along my way at different times people put an arm around my shoulder or coached me up when I needed to be coached, gave me advice, gave me tough love or tough feedback when I needed it.. And, you know, during the pandemic, there were a lot of folks out there who were fighting just to hang on. And I'm a real believer, and again, you know, this concept of hand up, not hand out. And I think that's something that you've, you know, you've certainly proposed in your work. And, you know, those folks at that restaurant were a perfect example. They were working hard. They were trying to to fight and make it through the pandemic. And I think it's our responsibility when you see people doing the right things to try to maybe give them a little bit of a support that will get them to the next day and help them figure things out.

Mm-hmm. Well, I agree with you, but you really walk the talk, David. You do. I know, I've seen it, I know how you are, and I just love and respect you for everything you do. But I want to talk about Highmark. You were talking about the size. Oh my goodness, you know what? I was here in Pittsburgh, and before there was a Fifth Avenue place, I remember driving past on Penn Avenue or wherever that was, and look, there was this small building Blue Cross of Western Pennsylvania. I mean, I never dreamt that it would become this high mark in that beautiful building, Fifth Avenue Place. Um, but it seems you continue to grow. I know all the Buffalo Bills fans love you so much because you have that Highmark Stadium in New York, but more importantly The company has continued to grow in so many different areas. Could you talk about that for a minute?

Well, sure. I mean, you know, again, the people that you mentioned before, you know, who have been in the CEO seat and literally tens of thousands of people before all of us who worked with Highmark set a really strong foundation. And so Highmark is, you know, one of the largest Blue Cross Blue Shield insurers in the country. We founded the Allegheny Health Network, which is a hospital system here in Western Pennsylvania, Western New York that has been very successful at making a difference for millions of people who they've served as patients. And in addition to that, we have a number of businesses, including a company called United Concordia Dental, which is a dental insurance company that operates not only in the United States, but in many other places in the world, and a variety of other entities. So, we serve about 7 million people every year, and we like to think that we play at least an important role in making sure that people have the capabilities that they need in order to take care of their families, they have the information that they need in order to make better choices for their own care and their lifestyle, and that we help people live the lives that they want to live. And so, we're, you know, we're pretty excited about that. The organization's doubled in size in the last few years, and I think that reflects the fact that people value what we're doing, and maybe, just maybe, we're able to make a difference in helping them be successful.

Well, I think, and even board members have talked about this, how you have been so innovative and changed the way you're operating at Highmark, such as this focus on the patient experience. So I wanted you to, and by the way, AHN, people with disabilities, I've gotta tell you, this is a hospital where when you go in, you're seen as a patient if you need help. But if not, you're seen as someone— you go to the hospital to get healthcare, whatever it is, not I have epilepsy, I go into the hospital because I've broken my arm and the doctor thinks of you as just a patient. This is what happens in healthcare. This medical model where no matter If the person maybe is deaf, and they go for their annual physical, and there are doctors that see that person, not as a person that's in good health, but as a sick person. Why? They're deaf. So, that's not Highmark. That is not Highmark. Highmark helped me. If you don't know, I got started, I told you this is our 30th anniversary. I went to Bill Lowry, the CEO, and said, "Bill, would you stand behind me and bring on board 6 people with disabilities and keep them on contract for 3 years?" Guess how long it took him? Because today, if I go to companies, this is what I'd hear. "Go to procurement. We have to go to legal. We have to go to HR. We have to go to everywhere." One day, one day, that's all. One day, one day, one man, one decision. And when I would be in another country, such as I'll probably be going to Brunei, and I'm so ashamed that I had to say, what, where is that? Like, I didn't even realize where this country was. Uh, but when I am in another country, I'll think Bill has passed away. I wrote an op-ed, "One Man, One Decision," and I'll think he would never have believed it when he made that one decision that thousands of people with disabilities would gain employment, that I'd have this radio show, that I'd be speaking around the world. That's why, listen, what I told you in other countries, remember what I said? One person can make a difference. So, David, tell me, what is the focus on patient experience?

Well, Joyce Bender, I mean, you know, whenever anybody is in, you know, in a situation where they need to see a doctor or they need to go to a hospital and something needs to happen, you know, there was an author who said once, you know, what people really want to know when they're laying on a hospital bed or a gurney is, you know, is, am I going to be okay? And before they get there, they want to know, how much am I going to owe and where do I go? And so, you know, it's one of the few things that we do in the world that we purchase, you know, healthcare, that we don't have a lot of choice. We tend to, you know, be told where we have to go and all those kinds of things. And whereas in the rest of the things that you do, you know, if you decide you want to get a sweater or or a pair of slacks, you go to a store, you pick it out. If they don't have what you want, you go to another store, and, you know, you're in control. And I think when people typically are in the healthcare space, they feel a real loss of control. And so, you know, having started my career in retail, you know, one of the things that I saw as an opportunity was to treat people in healthcare when they have interactions with the healthcare world, treat them like a customer, treat them as though they have a choice as to where they get their care, and make sure that we deliver on that. And so what we've tried to do with the Allegheny Health Network and with Highmark is give people a different experience. We introduced 24-hour or same-day appointments, making sure that people had access to care. We introduced what we call journey maps, customer journey maps, which are about mapping out what an experience is like for somebody who has epilepsy or somebody who has cancer. And what does that look like? And what are the touchpoints? And how do we make sure they have the right information and that they have a good experience? When you come here to Pittsburgh and you come to AHN's Cancer Center at Allegheny General Hospital, Typically, there's somebody waiting at the door for you who takes you right to your first stop. And we've made changes like that that enhance the experience, make it easier for people to follow their treatments, and with any luck at all, help them have a better outcome.

Mm-hmm. I like that analogy that you used. Instead of being forced to accept just one thing, Being able to say, wait a minute, I don't like this, you know, let me do this. That, that's good. I really like that. Interesting how you made that correlation with your background in retail, but that, that's a good, good example. So I saw on the website when I was looking at mission statement, vision statement, and goal, it says that Highmark's goal is to reinvent health. Now, what does that mean? Like, you know, what are you trying to do and what is your goal?

Well, Joyce, I mean, the current system as it exists today, you know, when you're in retail, you try to figure out what the unmet needs of your customers are and provide products and services that meet those needs. And so maybe it's a style of clothing or it's a style of jewelry or a product type or service. And, you know, in healthcare, there's a lot of folks out there who struggle to navigate the system. They struggle to get access to the care that they need. And, you know, and when they do, they're uncertain as to what they should do. And what we're working really hard on at Highmark and the Allegheny Health Network is what we call our Living Health Model, which is essentially empowering people with the information in a simple, easy-to-understand way so that they can make the best decisions that are right for them and they can take action. And we're working hard to do the same thing with our clinicians where they have the information they need to give you the best advice. So you talked earlier about having epilepsy. I mean, if we can empower through data and through digital access the ability for you to interact with your clinicians and they know how that's affecting your life or they understand the kinds of things that you like to do at home, work, and play, they can better advise you on the kinds of treatments and the kinds of actions that you should take in order to get the most out of your life. And so it's things like that that they're working on that we think are really important. And by doing that, it's changing the relationship from a transactional relationship where you're sick, you go see a doctor, the doctor prescribes you something. Rather than doing that, it's about treating the whole person, being proactive, and keeping people healthy.

Mm-hmm. Well, so much change. There's been so much change in the healthcare or insurance world, but I feel that what you're doing, being innovative like that, that, you know, that we're— here's an example: telehealth. I remember when you and I first talked about that, and it was COVID, you know, it was stay home, can't go out. And I remember when you when AHN and Highmark first really launched that out. How has that— now that everyone has for years now been back to work, how is that going?

Well, it's a great question. I mean, during the pandemic, it became very clear that if patients wanted to be seen at the time, they needed to embrace telehealth or telemedicine. And if clinicians wanted to see their patients, they needed to embrace it. And so there was a real dramatic adoption of it. And I think where we sit here 4 years later, we understand better where telehealth can be helpful and where it is a distraction to taking care of patients and helping people make decisions. Number one reason why people go to telehealth is to see a primary care physician., you know, and, you know, to get access, and maybe they have a cold or maybe something else is going on, and it's a rapid way to, you know, to reach people. And by the way, you know, I mean, if it's in your palm and you can talk to your doctor, you know, that way, particularly for people with disabilities, sometimes that's a better answer because, you know, it eliminates the barriers and burdens of trying to get from one physical site to another site. So it's a real plus. The other place that we're seeing a dramatic acceptance of telehealth is in mental health, behavioral health. You know, there's such a dramatic need. People are much more anxious and having more episodes of depression than we've ever seen before. And there's a whole generation that's grown up on their iPhones and using various telehealth tools. And they're very comfortable working with a behavioral health coach or a psychologist or a counselor online and, you know, in video rather than sitting and waiting in an office until the doctor can see them. Now, we think the answer is it's a blend of both. I don't think you can have one-size-fits-all in this case. But, you know, I mean, in between in-person visits, telehealth has become very powerful. And again, if you have, you know, certain conditions, you know, being able to reach your primary care physician at 8 o'clock at night and avoid an emergency room visit is a real satisfaction generator for both patients and the clinicians.

So, when you said 8 o'clock at night, so this is available throughout the evening also with the telehealth?

Absolutely. I mean, you know, we have access through our AHN website and also through our Highmark website for members to be able to reach, you know, clinicians at all different hours. And in the behavioral health space, you know, we did a partnership with an organization called Spring Health, and Spring Health uses a combination of video telehealth and, you know, and in-person visits. The importance of that is it's a curated network of clinicians who can help people in different ways. And so my example I use is if you're a 14-year-old adolescent girl, your problems are different than a 65-year-old steelworker who's about to retire. And if we can match you up with a clinical specialist who has a passion for teenage girls in giving, delivering care and has an understanding of maybe what's different for them versus that 64 or 64-year-old person who's about to retire and has a series of ailments that might be job-related. Matching them up with the right clinician is really important. On average in America, it takes about 3 weeks to be in, from the time you ask to see somebody until you actually do. With Spring Health at Highmark, the work that we're doing there, we're reaching people within 72 hours, and that alone has been a game changer for many people, particularly when they're in a crisis.

And you know, both of those things, going back to the first thing you said about telehealth, If you have epilepsy, a lot of people cannot drive a car. That's the law. You know, the other people live in rural areas and do not have access to Port Authority or paratransit. Other people can't at all because they have a personal attendant, maybe they have quadriplegia. So this would be a whole plan on how do I get, you know, to AHN. Look what telehealth does. I mean, to me, that I believe if you studied that over time, it has increased the health of people with disabilities. Because if you can't get there or it's gonna be like a village to plan this out, you don't go. And you have accessibility, you know, at Highmark, but there are people with disabilities, like women with disabilities have high breast cancer because they didn't have access to the mammograms that were accessible. But all of these things put together, the telehealth, of being able to to get to a doctor. And then what you said about mental health, I mean, that's no kidding, that could be a lifesaver. So, I think that's so wonderful.

Yeah, I mean, thank you. I mean, we have a long way to go in order to get this right, but I think that these are steps in the right direction. You bring up a perfect example. I mean, you know, appropriate, you know, breast, you know, care is really important, and mobile capabilities and using mobile vans to, you know, to do exams becomes, you know, very valuable because not everybody can get to a city center or a city hospital site or whatever it might be. And I do believe telehealth is an important part of the equation. It's got to be balanced with other kinds of outreach. And, you know, and mobile clinics are another way of achieving what you described, which is, again, giving people their best shot at their best life as they choose it.

Mm-hmm. Yeah, like retail.

You got it.

Okay. Well, before I talk to you about this Joyce Bender partnership. Just for our listeners around the world, you know, I told someone a story that was newly hired at Highmark. They were an executive-level, like, senior director. And I told them the whole— they didn't know this whole Highmark story. So, I tell them the whole story. And when I was done, because they— I did not get them their job. This was— someone in a leadership role, they said to me, you know, I just made a decision to come to Highmark. Thank you for telling me that because now I know I made the right decision. And I just want to tell everyone, going back to David, I have to tell you a couple of stories. There's this thing called the Highmark 30, 30, and it was soon became the high mark 34. And this was a result of David Holmberg. So what it is, is when I met with him at the 30th anniversary of the ADA, he said to me, "You know, let's do this." We're going to hire 30 people with disabilities from UJOYCE. We're going to bring out 30 people to celebrate the 30th anniversary of the Americans with Disabilities Act. And this story has been told everywhere from the halls of Congress to the White House to, you know, CEO— I mean, I talk about it everywhere. That's why Larry Kleinman always tells me I'm the Highmark's best PR agent. But no matter where I go, I have to tell this story about David, that it was the pandemic. And he called me and said, I know it's going to be difficult, but we'll do our best. Well, they did it. And then the next year— it's not like David thinks of things, does it, and then says, okay, that's it, I'm done. Next year, 3131. 32, 32, 33, 33, 34, 34. And guess what? This is the 35th anniversary of the signing of the Americans with Disabilities Act. You will all see, all of you listeners, media stuff everywhere. They're having, already planning big celebrations in DC. But all of those hires, That was all a result of David, who my other favorite story with David is when I went to see him one day. And you know, when you're a small business owner and you have to keep it moving forward and you'll be thinking, oh, I hope everything's still okay. And before I was in my chair, David Holmberg looks at me and says, you know, I haven't seen enough wheelchairs in the lobby. And you know, where are the service dogs? I even said, oh my God, if I could just videotape this, I would show this, you know, across the United States. But I'm telling all of you this so you know when I say this about Highmark, I am so serious. So serious, I have to tell you, a Hallmark story that David doesn't know. And this is like a Hallmark Christmas story. There's a young man that I became acquainted with, oh, 18 years ago or 20, because it's when Anthem was called WellPoint. And a friend of mine— he's a friend now. I had just met him then, Mark Boxer, as the CIO. He was behind getting 30 people hired. It was this one time. Sadly, that didn't continue because when Mark left, but, um, one of the people, Kavith, is a great young man, software developer. And when WellPoint had the layoff and he lost his job, when it was a large layoff, You know, he had to work for IT firms and IT consulting, but he's a project manager. And if you know anything about IT, a lot of people, that job went away in certain areas. Highmark, however, has this other area that's under Tracy Sala, who's under Tom Doran, where they hire product managers and program managers. By the way, I have to tell you, Tracy Sala called me, Joyce, I have openings, I want to hire people. See, that's what's different about Highmark. It's not me calling them. And, and so anyway, she hired Cabot. Cabot had been looking for quite a while. He, he was destitute because he wasn't finding anything. And yet he had this incredible academic background and resume. So Highmark called him and offered him the job a couple weeks ago— last week, actually, on Saturday. They wanted to make sure they got to him, so they called him on Saturday. He called right away, called our recruiter and said, oh my God, Highmark offered me a job. He lives in Indianapolis, but he's remote. Highmark offered me a job, and I was in the parking lot at a food bank, and all of a sudden I realized I don't have to come back here again. Oh, that's what I meant about a Hallmark story. Everyone at this office was so impacted that, you know, they cried. They just, you know, now I don't have to come back to this food bank. That is what it's all about. When you gain employment dignity, respect, not pity. Just like David said, you know, paycheck's not pity. You know, pity— people with disabilities don't need pity. They need to work equal, do a good job, move up. Don't do a good job, you don't have a job. That's how it has to be. And David, I knew you would love that story.

Uh, but I've never heard that story, and, um, I mean, that, that sent chills down my back. I mean, Again, I just believe that all of us have a capacity to maybe give people an opportunity in some form or fashion. There's a lot of different ways you can do it. And it's a privilege to hear about those success stories. And again, you're not looking to interfere with somebody's life. What you're doing is trying to give them an opportunity to maybe create an option that allows them to make choices and, and get there. And, and to help somebody from, uh, who was headed to a food bank get back on their feet, that's, that's a great day's work.

Yes. You also hired, uh, an African-American female veteran with a disability, and when she got her job as a project manager, she called me and said, "Mrs. Bender." She has that old-time military thing. "Mrs. Bender, every day when I go to work, I'll be wearing my work uniform." And that is gratitude. That's what it does. It gives you gratitude. But anyway, here we are, 30th anniversary of Bender. And that is 5 CEOs over their years have maintained the partnership, which is unbelievable. Why do you think that is?

I think because it's making a difference. You know, I really believe, and, you know, to your comments, when we have people on the team who have disabilities, they understand what it's like for many of our customers, our patients, our insured members, what they're trying to deal with. And I think it gives the organization a sense of culture. It helps the organization have a sense of purpose. It helps us all understand what the people that are paying us are living with or dealing with. And so it becomes critically important if we're going to be really good at what we do, we need to emulate our members and patients and customers. We need to look like them, we need to feel like them, you know, and we need to understand, you know, what they're— what's important to them in their lives. And so I just think it's all part of, you know, of how you can run a very successful company that's financially responsible but also mission-driven and purpose-driven. And, you know, and that's why it all is intertwined. And I think that's why, you know, with your help and Bender Associates' work, we've been able to make sure that these folks are successful, that they're just not hired, but that they stay and they have purposeful lives. One of the best things that happened to me, Joyce, was going to one of your events and a young man who was 19, walked up to me and introduced himself. And, you know, he said, he says, "I don't have any disabilities." He goes, "But that's my dad over there." And he pointed over to a gentleman who was in the room. And he said, "I grew up in a normal family because my dad had a normal job. And, you know, and everybody was treated, you know, with respect. And, you know, thanks to Highmark and Bender Associates, You know, you made a dramatic difference for not only my parents, but my brother and sister and I. And, you know, it was a really humbling moment when you realize that all we did was help somebody figure out how to get a job and maybe, you know, how to get moving with it. They carried it all. I mean, they did the job. They did it better than other people. And continued to work forward. And 20 years later, I mean, they've got their own kids and those kids are in a position to be able to, you know, to have opportunities that maybe even their parents didn't have.

I know. That is a powerful story. Well, David, here in your career, two questions. One, what has impacted you the most And two, in the business world or at Highmark, what do you believe is your greatest accomplishment since you served as the CEO, since you've been there?

I think, first of all, what impacted me the most was, you know, it was the people who looked at me and said, you know, I was rough around the edges, but they saw something and, you know, and they gave me a hand up. I mean, they gave me an opportunity. They coached me, took the interest. I think that's been the most important thing. I think that the key facilitator for my success has been a willingness to give credit to others when they deserved it, to give people opportunities to show what they could do, to not hold it against them when they made mistakes, but coach them up. And to take complex problems and get really smart people around me to help figure them out.

Yeah, well, what can I say? Humility. You are like living that quote, I'll tell you that. You live it. Well, since you've been there, even the work you have done that has helped change Highmark, innovative with healthcare, What do you think is your greatest accomplishment?

I think my greatest accomplishment was convincing people to believe in a vision that, you know, we could change healthcare. We could make it better. We could deal with some of the frustrations and frictions that exist today. And while, again, it's not perfect by any stretch of the imagination, you know, I feel pretty good about the fact that you know, access to care, the affordability of healthcare, you know, the improvement in quality of care in the places that we have influence, that we've had an impact. And we got a long road to go. We might be in the second or third inning, if you like baseball. But, you know, we're, you know, we're making a difference because we see a future where innovation, and commitment and pride and empathy and all the things it takes to be a good human, that, you know, that all those things can come together and we can make a difference in terms of the healthcare space. There's a lot of folks out there who are, you know, who see the darkness right now in the world, and, you know, our goal is to be maybe a promising point of light that things will get better, they are getting better, and that we can all do that together.

Oh, I so agree. And that's one thing I wanted to reiterate to all of my listeners. Please tell everyone you know about Highmark and what you heard from their CEO today. You can share this podcast, go to Spotify, Amazon, Apple, almost every social venue. You can get Disability Matters with Joyce Bender on voiceamerica.com. But you should share this because right now, as David said, there's a lot of darkness, despair in this area. And here, look at this, you have a beacon of light. So, you know, you need to share this with other people. Well, David, as we close the show today, what message do you have for our listeners today?

Well, um, keep going, keep moving forward. Um, you know, be purposeful in your day. You know, when you think about, uh, what's important to you and what you're looking to accomplish, whether it be personally or professionally, you know, it's about Being deliberate. I mean, if you want an opportunity, you've got to be willing to put the work in to be prepared for it. But you also have to be willing to put yourself out there and ask for the opportunity, whether it be working with an organization like yours, Joyce Bender, in order to prepare so that you can have a long career somewhere. Applying for a job or just not taking no.

Oh yeah, yep. Uh, what is that in Polar Express about don't worry about the way the train is going, but you've got to get on the train? That is, that is what it is all about. Well, David, thank you. Happy New Year. I look forward to being with you at my favorite place, Kelly O's, and heralding off the Highmark 3535. And everyone with disabilities, you see now why I love this company. They are the real deal. So our theme for 2025, as I said, is humility. One more time, because I had every show with a quote: Humility is not thinking less of yourself. It's thinking of yourself, less said. C.S. Lewis. And in the words of Mary Brooker, when you go out today, remember, choose joy. This is Joyce Bender, America's Voice, where disability matters, at voiceamerica.com. Happy New Year. Talk to you next week.

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