Debra Germany: Helping Current/Former Incarcerated Adults and At-Risk Youth Reach Full Potential

Welcome to Disability Matters with your host Joyce Bender. All comments, views, and opinions expressed on the show are solely those of the host, guest, and callers. Now the host of Disability Matters, here's Joyce Bender.

And hello everyone, welcome to the show. This is Joyce Bender with Disability Matters on voiceamerica.com. Hello to all of my great listeners in the United States and around the world. You know, every show I tell people that I am so— I so appreciate you. I really do. I appreciate you because guess what? This is my 22nd year 22nd year on Voice America. Unbelievable. And with over 100 company countries with listeners, I am just thankful not only to everyone here but around the world. You know, whether you're in Australia, which I just saw, Germany with the biggest listening Audience, no matter where you are, you are making a difference in the quality of life for people with disabilities. Spread the news. You know what? You really, in Germany, oh my goodness, what a listening audience. What I wanted to say to you, thank you. I'm not going to try it. I'm not going to try to do it. I know the word for thank you, but I know I will just not say that correctly. So I will say thank Thank you. And please, anyone you know where there is English speaking, make sure that you share this show with them. Hey, Richard Roberts in Brazil, it won't be long till you're back here in the United States and I'll get to hug you in person. You know how I love you, Richard. And Gyeongyoung in South Korea, and really all of my friends. I just spoke today to Ruby. Hello, Ruby, from the State Department. So hello to everyone. Thank you. And a special thank you to Highmark, the sponsor of the show, the lead sponsor for years. Do you think I forgot you, Yoshiko? No way! No way! Special shout out to Yoshiko Dart. I love you, Yoshiko. Uh, lead on, Yoshiko, and stay inside if you have that cold weather with ice, because I don't want you to have a fall there. So hello everyone. I want to tell you about our guest today. I met her many, many, many, many years ago.. And I, I was just so impressed. I've never forgotten her. I never have, because she just is one of those people that took something terrible and turned this into something wonderful. Don't misunderstand me. The terrible will never go away. You know, when you lose someone, it's with you. It's always with you. I know when we lost Mary, I always said, I'm the Joyce after Mary, because it changes you. But here we are, here we are, moving forward, making things happen as we celebrate Black History Month with Minister Deborah Germany from Divine Intervention Ministries. Deborah, it's a pleasure to have you on the show today. Um, you know, and thank you, you know, for the beautiful, uh, gifts that you sent me. But I'm going to tell you, I have never ever forgotten you, Deborah. Never. And it's such a, such a pleasure to have you, uh, with us. You are a blessing to so many people. But as I just alluded to about You know, something moving from a tragedy to moving on from there. Why don't you share with our listeners around the world a little bit about who you are and then about what happened to get you on this road?

First of all, Joyce, I just want to thank you for inviting me, and it's an honor to be here, and I've never forgotten you either. So thank you. 24 years ago, my only child, Raymond Germany, was murdered. He was shot 7 times in the Hill District in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. I raised my son right as an only child, but he made a conscious decision to sell drugs and it cost him his life. And as a result of that, now I speak all across the state telling his story, how he lived and died as a drug dealer, giving other young men and women opportunities that I couldn't give him. I never thought anything good could come out of my son being murdered, but as a result, in these 24 years, thousands of souls have been saved for Christ. Hundreds of men and women have been given second chances, family reunification, getting careers. And when it first happened, the Lord said, well, this can either make you better were bitter. So I chose to get better. I made a conscious decision that I wasn't going to let it take me down, but I needed God's help. And the only reason I've been able to do this work this long is because of my faith. Just to tell you, um, how things began, um, I didn't know that God had an audible voice. I'm a Christian. I didn't know he had an audible voice. Back then, I was green as grass. And when your child is murdered, all you want to do is just nothing. Doing nothing is a big deal. So all I wanted to do was stay asleep because I didn't want to feel. I didn't want to wake up to the reality of what my new life was. I would take Ambien to go to sleep and antidepressants to wake up. But as I was resting, I just kept hearing, Divine intervention, divine intervention. And it was like somebody was like shaking my— tapping my shoulder like, hey, wake up, wake up, write this down. I was like, I don't want to wake up because then I got to deal with what I don't want to deal with. But it was like this voice would not stop repeating this name, Divine Intervention Ministry. So I woke up begrudgingly, I snatched this notebook off my nightstand, and I wrote the name, but I kept hearing in my head Divine Intervention. And as I wrote it, it was if It was almost like I was vomiting up what it was going to be. He was like, it's going to be a Christian-based prison ministry. It's going to help people all over the world. You're going to be in halfway houses, renewal, and prisons and talk to children. And I was like, what is happening to me? And when it was over, it was a book. This little notebook was full of what the vision was. And I literally thought I was losing my mind because, like I said, I didn't know. That God had an audible voice. I just— and I took it to my pastor and I said, "I think this is a vision. This is something that I have to do." And it looked impossible going into prisons. I said, "They killed Ray. I'm afraid. I don't got no training. Ain't no book. Ain't no guide." So I just figured, okay, that's something I'm going to have to do later. And then I was going to meetings in a community. I met a lady named Valerie Dixon, and we joined forces, and the ministry started with billboards. We started putting billboards up, which was a very innovative thing we did in Pittsburgh. And I was glad to do the billboards because literally I was running from my call. And when there's a call on your life, you're going to do it willingly or unwillingly. But at the time, I was afraid. I literally was afraid. So I was glad to have behind the billboards, but God wasn't going to let that be. I did— we did the billboards for about 4 years together, very successful. We had a collaboration with the, um, Pittsburgh Police Witness Protection, Crime Stoppers, was very successful. We were on the John Walsh Show with America's Most Wanted. Several homicides were solved, but God was He was— he let me be for a few years, but then he was like, okay, now you and Valerie's season have ended. It's time for you to go into prison. Joyce, one of the biggest fears I have in my life, because when I know when I get to the end of my life, I got to stand before God and give an account of what I've done with the life he gave me, because he put a gift in me. And I didn't know I had a gift. It laid dormant for decades until my son was murdered. So my biggest fear is when I get— stand before God and have to give an account, all I want to hear him say is, "Well done, my good and faithful servant, enter in." I don't want to hear him say, "Part from me." So I'm very particular how I spend my time and who I collaborate with. So I said, "God, now I need to be sure that this is you because you know my biggest fear." So I was a member of Central Baptist Church for 20 years and All of a sudden, Joyce, these letters just start coming to the church from inmates all across the state. I'm like, who gave them my name? I ain't tell nobody I was doing prison ministry. So I kept getting these letters. I was like, I don't know who these people are. I don't know why they writing me. So finally, I said, God, okay. Now here, me telling God off, I'm talking to the ceiling. I said, God, I tell you what. I said, you got these people writing me. I don't know them. I have no idea who they are. I said, but if this is you and you are really calling me into the prison, then this is what I need you to do. I said, I need you to have a young man write me that has committed homicide, want to apologize to his victims, give back to the community, and stop another young man from doing the same heinous crime. I said, but until that letter come, I'm not going. So leave me alone. And I caught myself walking out the room. I said, wait a minute, this is my room, where are you going? So anyway, so next week or two, here comes some more letters. So it was this one letter that came. He said, Miss Germany, my name is Stan Washington, I'm from Pittsburgh. He said, I've been following your ministry for about 5 years, and it's amazing how you took something so tragic and turned it into something triumph. He said, I read an article in Pittsburgh Courier, where you spoke at Columbus Middle School with Marita Bryant. He said, "I'm a young man that committed homicide." He said, "And I wish I had an opportunity to apologize to my victims and give back to the community and stop another young man from committing the same heinous crime." Joyce, when I seen that word heinous, I remember the letter hitting the ground, tears rolling down my eyes, and I just raised my hand. I said, "Okay, God, you win." I'll go. And I've been going into the prison ever since.

Wow. Now I have a lot of questions, but first we're going to go to break and then I'm going to come right back. Wow, wow, wow. So we're celebrating Black History Month with this absolutely phenomenal inspirational leader, and we're so lucky to have her right here in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. Minister Deborah Germany from Divine Intervention Ministries. Don't go away, we'll be right back after the commercial break.

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You're listening to Disability Matters. Now please welcome back the host of Disability Matters. Here's Joyce Bender.

And hello, welcome back. What a riveting show and inspirational show with, uh, my sister, sister in God, Debra Germany, Minister Debra Germany from Divine Intervention Ministries. And before we go on with your story, when you first started going to the prisons, um, I wanted to ask you, what exactly was that project you did with the billboards?

Um, it was called PAC, Prevent Another Crime Today. We put billboards up all over the city of Pittsburgh, and, um, there was a $5,000 reward where Stephen Zapala provided the money. There were like 5 different phone numbers you could call: Witness Protection, Crime Stoppers, the police. And if you called in anonymously a tip, you could get the $5,000 reward. But Steven Zapala was very instrumental, and Lamar Outdoor Advertising provided the billboard space, and it helped a lot of people. And then we had did an all-night shut-in, and the Lord said, put them online, because when the billboards would come down in 30 days, the Families would get sad because they wasn't getting coverage. So we— the Lord showed me it in a vision. I put it on a bill— I worked at Carnegie Mellon and I'm retired from there now. And we built the website and they could call in 24 hours. They had constant coverage. So it was a great collaboration with Lamar Outdoor Advertising in the city of Pittsburgh. Lavonni Bickerstaff and Marita Brant were very instrumental with the billboards with us. And Valerie Dixon.

Yeah, what led you to be on John Walsh's America's Most Wanted?

Well, Valerie, that was all her. The billboards was her vision. She contacted John Walsh. They took us, they flew us out to New York, myself, her, Stan Geider from Lamar Advertising. And it was wonderful. They had showcased Taylor Coles. It was a young girl that was killed in Homewood. Tommy's Restaurant, and the billboards helped get her homicide solved. So, um, yeah, it was excellent meeting John and, um, getting coverage. But that was when we started in 2002, is when the ministry started in March.

That's another person that had something terrible happen.

Yeah, Valerie lost her son. We just lost Valerie about 4 months ago. When I started this work, it was 4 of us. It was Kareena Pope, Sharon Daniels, myself, and Valerie Dixon. All three of those women are gone. They're in the ground. I'm the only one from that generation that's left.

Well, we're glad we have you, that's for sure. So I think I remember when you told me this story and it just really bothered me, and that was how the news was relayed to you that your son had passed away. If I recall, you just got a short call from the hospital, is that right?

Yes, I got a call from Presbyterian Hospital, and the lady on the other end of the phone, she said, um, can I speak to Miss Germany? I said, this is Miss Germany. Miss Germany, can you tell me if you have a son named Raymond Germany? Yes, yes. Is something wrong? Is something wrong? Well, ma'am, can you tell me if he lived at 530 Kelly Street? I'm like, ma'am, yes, is there something Well, ma'am, I'm not really permitted to give you that information. Can you tell me his Social Security number? I said, ma'am, look, you are literally torturing me right now. Can you please just tell me, is my son all right? The lady on the other end of the phone, she said, no, ma'am, he ceased to breathe. Ceased to breathe? My mind began to race through my vocabulary to try to comprehend what this woman was saying to me. Ceased to breathe. Then it hit me. I said, oh, that means he's not breathing. That means he's already gone. So she asked me if I could come down to Presbyterian Hospital and identify my son's body. I said, "Yes, ma'am, I'm on my way." I turned to my husband, I said, "Babe, Ray's dead." We got in the car and we proceeded down to Presbyterian Hospital in Oakland. And it was something about as I got closer to the place, as I got closer to the place, my demeanor began to change. My stomach began to quiver. It felt like I had somersaults, butterflies going on in my stomach. My mouth began to water. I got this sweet taste in my mouth. Salty taste in my mouth. You know that taste you get when you feel like you're going to vomit? I got out the car, I went through the automatic doors, swish. I went up to the window and I gave them my name. And the lady, she came out and she summons me. She said, "Come on in the back, come on in the back." When I got in the back, I'll never forget it as long as I live. It was all these white curtains everywhere, all these curtains, all these hallways. And I'm following her down these hallways. Once she got to this one curtain, and when she got to this one hallway, she began to slow down. And then she stopped. She grabbed the curtains. Swish. There lay my Ray, the one and only child God gave me. There he lay. He was laying in a steel— on a steel table in a blue body bag. The body bag was halfway zipped. He had a patch over his eye and a tube coming out of his mouth, and his head was back. And as I stood there, I remember saying, Ray, Ray, you said that things was going to be different this time. You said that you was going to be home for my birthday. You said you was going to take me and Grandma to Red Lobster. You promised. Promise me. And Joyce, as I stood there, I had to unzip that bag. Because you see, I realized the next time I see my son, he would be fully dressed in a casket, and I would never ever again see his feet walking across my carpet ever again. I just had to see his feet. Just little silly things we do as mothers, because you know when your children are born, we count all your fingers, we count all their toes. So I just needed to see his feet. And then I began to rub his head, and I could feel where the life was leaving and the death was coming. It was like, ah. Cold and warm, like you could just see the death coming. And then I said, wait a minute. I said, I just started screaming. I said, nurse, nurse, come here, come here, nurse, nurse, come here. I said, could you get those paddles, that machine? Get the paddles, get those paddles. Come on, hurry up. Bring them paddles out here. Bring them paddles out here. She said, mm. She said, we already done that. We done that before we called you. She said, he's gone. I said, "Gone?" She said, "Yeah, he's gone." So you see, it was in that instant I realized the reality that was facing me. You see, I realized then that this would be the last time that I would shut down an apartment and set one up. As I told you, my son Raymond, he was from 14 to 23, he just kept making left turns, left turns, left turns. I would shut down an apartment, I set him up, he go back to jail, set it up, go back to jail. Task force kicking in my door, kicking in his door. It was never, ever ending. I raised that boy right. I gave him everything. But he wanted that fast money. So I tell these young men, you better be careful what you do in these streets. My son made a decision. He robbed some drug dealers in Philadelphia. They came to my house and tried to— wanted to kill my whole family. Had to leave my house for 5 weeks. I had 4 properties at the time. I couldn't stay in none of them because Jamaicans was watching my house. I mean, I let these young men know, you really— that fast money is not worth it. It is not worth it. And the trauma— every time I walk out my door, in 24 years, ain't a hair on my head been harmed. But the thought of them watching my house— I can look up the street and tell you if somebody's in a car, if the car don't belong on my street, because I'm programmed. Because in the back of my head, they still coming for me. Ray robbed them for $13,000. I set him up in one of my rental properties. He had the whole third floor, freezer full of food, closet full of clothes, got him a pager, got him a job, everything. You got to go rob somebody, Ray? Really? So the devil ain't playing, so neither am I. When I give my testimony, I tell it raw, all of it. And like I said, I speak all across the state because I don't want young men to die like my son. He never left the state of Pennsylvania, never got married, never had children. So my bloodline was literally severed, severed.

And now you have thousands and thousands of sons and daughters through what you're doing. So you came up with this idea. Well, God came up with this idea and you listened. And now tell me about the very first time you went into the prison.

Well, I started going in, I started at the Allegheny County Jail. I did their, I think it was, I don't know if there was the day of responsibility. I know I did some graduations. When I started going into the prison, I was doing the day of responsibility. So I've been speaking in Somerset, Laurel Highlands. Oh, another thing is that, Washington did, he introduced me to the Pennsylvania Prison Society. So as a result of that, I was the convener for two prisons, Somerset and Laurel Highlands. So I started going into the prisons, giving my testimony, souls being saved for Christ. When they get out, they come to our program, our office. We help them with housing, jobs, careers, and it's been wonderful. It's been really wonderful. I have an excellent relationship with the Department of Corrections and the Bureau of Prisons. Joan Wetzel was the secretary for 12 years, and excellent working relationship with him. We brought our videographer team in and videotaped all of my sessions. You can't tape your face, but it was just awesome. And the letters that I've gotten, some of the home— the way the guys wrote this great big thank you card and they signed it hand stitched with the leather. And I mean, it just brings tears to your eyes. You just think you went in and just gave your testimony, but lives have literally been transformed. And when they get out, they come to our office and we help them. Divine Intervention is dedicated to restoring the lives of incarcerated adults and at-risk youth. We give people second chances. I let them know, you are not your crime. You did your time. Now you're at the Renewal, you're doing your time here, it's time for you to live your best life. You square your shoulders and put your head back and keep it going. And we let them know, come on, your best is in front of you. So we help them get the things that they need. What do you want to be? Some of the ladies, I want to have my own nonprofit. Well, what's stopping you? Well, I'm going to let them know, I hope you know you stuck with me now. I'm locking arms and we're gonna walk forward together. Because sometimes people just need a little bit of help just to get on their feet. One divine connection can change your life forever. And that's what divine intervention is. It's a bridge. It's like, you know, if you're a senior citizen and you sit in a, um, recliner and you got that little lever on the side that you pull and you help you to your feet. That's what we do, help people get on their feet because I— some, some people look at— God has called me to the underserved, the least of these. There's diamonds in there, presidents, doctors. They just haven't had nobody to speak life into them. I'm a mouthpiece for God. I'm an ambassador for Christ. My gift— I sound the— I sound the alarm and expose the devil, because the devil don't want you to make it. He want— he wanna— and the devil is real. He's real. All his employees show up early, they work late, they work holidays and weekends. They never ever take a day off. Their job is to continue to deceive and distract you and, and make sure you never fulfill the purpose for what your life is, is intended. But my job is to, to cast him out and tell people, no, no, no, you, you don't gotta— what, what you dealing with now is not where you gonna end up. We gonna pray, we gonna lock arms, and we gonna help you get where you need to be. Because some people don't have nobody to speak life into them. I don't know if you heard about this, Joyce, but May of last year, my cousin Glenn Germany, he was, he was, um, preaching, and a young man came into his church and tried to kill him. Literally shot the gun. He shot the gun, but it jammed. And, um, that young man— because basically what happens if your basic needs aren't met, you start doing things that are that are not normal. You'll drink, smoke, rob, you'll do whatever you got to do to survive. And this young man particularly, somewhere in his process, there was a breakdown and mental illness set in. And he came before he left home, he killed— his cousin was walking up the steps, he shot him in the back of his head. Then he came to my— he's my cousin and my pastor— to kill the pastor. And ever since then, They wrestled the gun off of him. If you type in Pastor Glenn Germany, millions of views. They wrestled the gun off of him. And then my cousin had a chance to talk to me. He said, why did you do this? He said, the voices, they told me to come in and kill the pastor. So we have to get these young men mental health, mental illness help, help for the trauma and the grief. And they'll be okay, but they got to get the right medicine. One divine connection can change your life forever.

Wow, that is such good advice. Uh, it is such good advice. So many people do need mental health services that can't— that are denied, and then things like this happen. But time to go to our news break, and we have news that our news today is from Gerald Helmy. The manager of talent programs at none other than Bender Consulting Services. So, Perry is not with us today. She'll be back next week, uh, but Gerald is, and he has some news for you. So that's why I asked him. Hey Gerald, how are you?

Hey Joyce, I am wonderful. Thank you so much for letting me call into the show today.

Oh, I'm so excited. So Gerald, what, what do you have for our listeners today?

Well, it's big news because it is Bender's 30th anniversary this year. That's right. We turned 30 this year, which is awesome. We have so much to do. You know, we're real busy right now and we haven't even hit what I consider really like our busy season for Bender. And I mean, we're always busy here, but there's the times when it really cranks up and there's just so much opportunity for people through Bender with Disabilities right now. And it's so exciting. Joyce decided that we were going to have a new focus this year. We've always had a lot of opportunities in STEM at Bender because Joyce started her career in IT executive search, and IT has been a place that's always been a big supporter of people with disabilities. And we're continuing that going. It has some great IT roles right now you can apply for today at Bender, like the new job we got on Friday. But we're also focusing on roles in healthcare because there's so many jobs out there in healthcare. There's so much opportunity. And man, what a difference it's going to make as a person with a disability when you go get healthcare.

Yes.

And the people providing that healthcare are people like you, people that understand your lived experience and how better they're gonna be at providing healthcare to someone like you. So this is so exciting to get these opportunities. If you are looking for a job in healthcare today, especially a job where You are included, you are accommodated, you have the opportunity to work and succeed and have the chance to move up. Just like it always is at Bender. No pity. A job that gives you that chance to really make it and have a career based on your performance. No, look no further than Bender Consulting. Go to benderconsult.com/jobs. And apply today.

Well, and Gerald, I heard you talking about this. Don't you also have a position you're working on that the person would have the great, great delight of working for you?

Oh, you're right, Joyce. I do. I do have an open role right now on my team at Bender Consulting Services. This is a hybrid role here in the Pittsburgh area. So if you are in the Pittsburgh Pennsylvania region, and you want to work on my team recruiting, placing people with disabilities into jobs, mentoring those people after they've been successfully placed in those roles, and you see yourself in that type of role on this team, on this crusade with Joyce Bender, making a difference every day in the lives of people with disabilities. Give me a call. Call 412-787-8567 and ask for Gerald Homi and tell them, hey, I heard there's a job on Gerald's team, I want to talk to him about it. And I can't wait to meet you.

Oh, me too. We love to be able to have an opportunity to provide employment. In this time, we have all these openings in healthcare and STEM. But we also have an opening right at our corporate office. So Gerald, one more time, if they're interested in that position, any of the positions, how do they reach out to you?

BenderConsult.com/jobs is where our job board is located, but you can also email me at ghomme@benderconsult.com. Or info@benderconsult.com to reach anyone on our team.

Thank you so much, Gerald. Uh, and Gerald's going to stay with us, uh, in case as we move along that he has something he wants to say. But Deborah, I have to give you time to talk about your organization and what you do for our listeners.

Well, I'm the executive director of Divine Intervention Ministries. I've been doing this work for 24 years. Um, we're currently in the Renewal Center. We've been in here 14 years. They've been an excellent partner for us. Um, we're in 4 divisions in Renewal. Um, we provide, um, Bible study, um, discipleship. We help them find employment. Housing, clothing, furniture. We get them connected to the trades, intro to construction trades, bricklayers. We have collaborations with them. Ms. Chiquita Barnett with the intro to construction trade and the Pittsburgh Builder Guild is one of our strongest partners, getting these men from being, selling drugs or whatever they're crime is to a, a livable wage. We also have an excellent partnership with the Blessing Board. Um, they provide furniture for our residents of Renewal, and also the Treasure House provides, um, clothing for the women. We give them $60 vouchers and they go to their store in North Hills and get clothes, and everything in the store is 60% off. We have excellent working relationship with Neighborhood Resilience Career Links. I like working with people that really do what they say. It look good on paper, but you might only have one opportunity to help this young man or young woman. If they say, you know what, okay, I ain't never went straight in my life, I'm gonna try this one time. And when they do come, you better have something for them, and it better be real, not just no lip service. So I consider it an honor to serve God's people. It's a privilege. To serve his people. When I get a letter from all across the state from inmates, it's not a— not a letter, it's a life that God has entrusted me with. So I take that very seriously.

I'll tell you something, Deborah, uh, that's a hard thing because so many companies do a criminal background check and will not hire a felon. They will not, and no matter what their background is. So, um, you know, if you're listening to the show, just as, uh, Deborah is telling you about these opportunities, if you're in Western Pennsylvania, in the Pittsburgh area, I hope you will reach out, uh, to Deborah. Deborah, how, how do people reach you? What's your website?

It's divineinterventionministries.org, all one word.

Okay. And when you were talking about your organization, you work with, uh, Renewal. Do you see good opportunities for individuals who were at one time imprisoned or have a felony? Do you Do you have success stories where you've seen people, you know, gaining employment and build a family and move forward over those 24 years?

Yes, Renewal provides an excellent foundation for these men and women to get their lives started. They have excellent programming in there, and we're an additional resource in there. One of my, just one of many, but one of my most proudest success stories is Katonya Hall. She came to the renewal and she was attended, because my orientation, I always start with an orientation and that's when I give my testimony. And at the time, there was prostitutes being killed in the Hill District in Uptown. And two of her best friends were killed. One was rolled up in a carpet and set on fire. The other one was killed. She was saying, "Well, why am I still here?" 'all my girls, my ride or dies are gone.' I said, 'God got a purpose for your life.' She gave her life to Christ. Well, first she said, she had shared with me, she said, 'Ms. Jermaine, I can't take enough showers.' She said, 'I keep feeling the men's hands all over me.' She said, 'I can't take enough showers.' So she gave her life to Christ. She turned her life around. I've been mentoring her for the last 13 years. And she did her time, she went to the Renewal, did her drug and alcohol programs, and she went to about 4 other rehabs. And she said, "I'm not ready, I'm not ready." She finally got her place, she got a job, she went back to school. And she used to be in the Power, it's a drug and alcohol program in Swissvale. She was a client there. She went back to school, got her degree, now she works for Power. And I'm like, Katonya, I'm so proud of you. Her, Kentucky, um, there's been so many— there's jewels in there. They just need one divine connection. That's all they need. But she, um, and, and another thing that I want to say, it's very important that you get the help you need if you have someone that died. Get some counseling, get some help. One of the other ladies, she told me, she said, Miss Germany, they had to Narcan me 5 times, like it was a badge of honor. I said, well, why did you have to get Narcan 5 times? She said, well, I was raped with an umbrella. So I just, you know, my life ain't never been the same. So these things you have to deal with. If you better help these men and women that's been going through something, because if not It's a public safety issue. You'll look up and they be standing over top of you in your bedroom. So you better get them some help. And there's a lot of help out there now. There's plenty of help. There is no excuse whatsoever. It's just making sure they get the information. And that's what our ministry is designed to do.

Oh, that is great. Deborah, what— when you first started doing this, how I'm sure you met— well, you have met people that committed murder. How did they react when you told them about your son?

They were— well, they were really amazed, but it made them really reflect on what they done and how they realized that, you know, I didn't realize me being on drugs affected my family. No, if you got cancer, everybody got cancer. If you on drugs, everybody got having drugs or on drugs. So it makes them really think. Like one of the questions I'll ask in my testimony, I say, "How many of you in here know someone who was either murdered or was a victim of a violent crime? Please raise your hand." Every hand goes up. If I'm in a school, every hand. You know, how do you think it would affect your family if your life was suddenly taken? How many of you have children? How would it affect them? So you have to make— put them in your shoes. And they're like— I said, if the phone was to ring at your house and your family was just notified that you were murdered, who would get the call? Oh, that would be my grandmother. I said, well, who would she call? Oh, oh, there wouldn't be no more calls, Miss Germany, because she would drop right there. I'm her favorite. So, okay, so now you realize Picture that. Walk with me. If the phone rings and they tell you, tell your family you're murdered, know how this is going to happen. Well, who's your mother gonna call? It'll be all these phone calls through the family. Yeah, domino effect. So you need to think about that, young man. Or if you snatch an older lady's purse, she's, she's independent, she's driving, you snatch her purse and now she don't want to come outside no more. What if that was your grandmother? What about that? So they really think this. They said, "I never thought about it like that." And then the young men that walk away from the drug game, and a lot of time— now to this date, nobody has been arrested for my son's homicide. The man that killed him, he's in jail for life, but another homicide, he was never charged. So it's important that people come forward with the information because there are mothers and families sitting beside a phone that never rings. Some of us mothers, die waiting on the evidence or witness. But young men, so in my mind, I'm like, did you kill my son? Did you set him up? Did you? So whenever I meet people, I go through this thing in my head like, okay, was you his friend? Was you his foe? He said, oh no, Ms. Germany, you spoke at the drug court. He said, I'll never forget your testimony. He said, after your testimony, he said, I gave up the drug game. He said, I'm back here at John Negro slicing lunch meat. My friends receive me, he said, but ain't nobody trying to, ain't no bullets flying around my head no more. He said, "I made a decision that day. I'mma be here for my kids. I'mma be here for my family." But they got to be sick and tired and sick and tired. So the testimony, God does it. I'm just a vessel that he uses. I'm a willing and able vessel. But there's a lot of young men just turning their lives around. And even the game is changing because now it's like, they call it lived experience. They want you to have a criminal record in some of these places But a lot of times they'll start working 3 months here, then they'll call you in the office, they'll be, "Sorry, we got to let you go. Your record came back." So we're going to create an industry of employment opportunities where we can be the employer, starting opportunities for them so that they don't have to experience that. Because they might only try to go straight one time and then they get deflated, be like, "You know what? I'm just going back to the block." And then they die. They die.

Terrible. That's terrible. Well, you know, uh, Gerald, here's what I was thinking. We are going to be in the next couple weeks putting together a webinar for people across the board that have lost their job, looking for employment, where we can be helpful. And I'm thinking you'll have to send that to Deborah So, so they could use that training, uh, you know, people there, because, uh, Gerald, as you know very well, some people just don't know the basics and they're great. You know, how many candidates have you seen, they were great but they didn't get the job just because they didn't know how to interview?

Yeah, or they don't know from their background, how their background is valuable to an employer because they maybe don't have the traditional background and they don't see what a recruiter sees that's valuable in them that employers would like. And they don't view it from that lens. They just see the linear path instead of the often crisscross applesauce path that is most people's careers.

Yes, I agree with you so much. Um, and Deborah, you said you've worked with the county, but before we talk about that, so everyone knows here, she has won numerous, numerous awards for her work. Because when I was looking through her bio, I said, wow, look at all these awards she has won and how she's been recognized throughout the state by so many different groups. And you also work with the County of Allegheny. Could you tell everyone what you do with the county?

Well, the county had invested $50 million in violence prevention about 3 years ago, and Divine Intervention was selected as the implementing partner to run the program. It was a program It started in Chicago. It was R.E.D.D.I.E. Chicago, and they— it was a successful reentry program in Chicago, and they brought it to Allegheny County to replicate it. And it was in 3 different neighborhoods: South Side, Braddock, and McKees Rocks. And Divine Intervention was selected to do the South Pittsburgh division. And they use cognitive behavioral therapy where— because really, if you don't deal with the trauma that people have dealt with, like you were saying about getting people jobs, it's one thing to get them a job, but can they keep the job? Because they're not used to getting up. And if there's trauma that's unresolved, it will affect every area of their life. So the cognitive behavioral therapy was a big part of it. And then they have transitional jobs. Fortunate to be selected. I was the executive director of the South Pittsburgh ACTS program. We successfully launched it August 26th, '24. We did it for 3 years. We're no longer working with the county. We completed our contract with them, and it was just an honor to be selected for that work, and that was, again, God-ordained. So I was just grateful for the opportunity to do it, and, um, it's very successful. So that was another chapter that God has, um, opened. But again, it was a privilege to see these young men come off the, off the block and give them— get them jobs and help them move their lives along. And the county was paying them $15 an hour, and it was just an excellent partnership. I was honored to do it and proud of the work that we accomplished there.

Well, Deborah, as I said, you have done so much in 24 years, but right now, as you reflect on those past years, what are you the proudest of accomplishing?

I'm the proudest of God giving me an opportunity to serve his people. I, I just consider it an honor because, I mean, whatever he asked me to do, a lot of times it don't make no sense, but I said, okay, I'll do it, and it makes sense later. But just being a child of God and him walking through— because every time I speak, I literally relive his death from beginning to end, but souls are saved, people are getting the help that they need. So the proudest I am is being a child of God and giving people opportunities that I couldn't give my son. It's just an honor to help people because, like I said, somebody— you just need a little bit of help, just one connection that, that might seem so minimal to you, but it's huge for them, and then it just opens more doors.

Um, Yeah, you're just such a wonderful person. Um, I want to ask you, Minister Germany, how would someone donate to your organization? If someone's listening to the show right now, they say, oh my goodness, because we all know how terrible violence is, but losing a child is not even describable. So if someone wants to help with the work you're doing, how do they make a donation?

They can, um, donate to divineinterventionministries.org. We have a website and they can donate right through on the website. Um, right now we're looking for impact partners, people that will partner with us to sow seed into our ministry, because we've been doing this work for 24 years as volunteers and now we're You know, we need more money to hire people. Volunteers are great, but we need to hire people, and that takes money. And a lot of times, some of the grants don't cover operational costs, but we're looking for impact partners, people that'll partner with us, corporations, um, people that might want to give once, monthly, semi-annually is what we really are in need of right now. We're also in need of grant writers, people that are committed to that. Case managers. So people that are retired, they want to give back, and mentors, because these men and women need to see success. People that did— they need to see more than just the, the small view that they have of the world. So we're looking for people that would want to volunteer and sow. It's a good ground to sow into the ministry.

Yeah, well, if you're listening, I hope you will make a donation. It's divineinterventionministries.org. Is that right? Correct. Okay, divineinterventionministries.org. You know, we're blessed and we have so much, but not everyone does. So you must remember the least of these and, you know, make a donation. This is a wonderful thing that Deborah is doing. Wonderful, wonderful. So before you go, I wanted to ask you, where— how do you work with youth? How do you do that with the at-risk youth?

Well, we started— I was— this is how I started speaking, because I didn't know I was was a speaker. I was working with the Center for Victims of Violent Crime. I was on their board for 8 years, and they gave me my first opportunity to speak my victim impact statement to the youth at the SIS program. So it was really, I guess, giving my testimony. And as a result of that, I've been speaking all across the state ever since. And I started speaking in the SIS program. There was one in Wilkinsburg, When the Schumann Center was open, I used to go there and assist at Hill District, Wilkinsburg, Homewood. I spoke at all of them. Then when COVID hit, a lot of the programs changed, but I speak to all the youth whenever they call me, I come. All you got to do is call me and I'll come speak to your youth group, your prison, your boot camp. That's what I do. I'm a mouthpiece for God. But oh, I love working with the youth because they're our future. I don't want them to be my client. So we got to reach them now. I speak in a lot of the schools, is another thing that I do, and I let them know, don't make the mistake that Ray made. If somebody wants you to sell drugs, go in the other direction because they are not your friend. They are not your friend, and that fast money does not last, and you killing your own community. I remember my son, he came to my house one day. He said, "Ma, come outside, come outside. I want you to see my car." He had this big, beautiful burgundy Eldorado with— he said, "Look, I got a TV in the front, TV in the back." I said, "Boy, if you don't get this piece of junk from in front of my house, I'm gonna call the police on you." I said, "I know how you got this money. I ain't raise you like this. Come on, let's go for a ride." I don't want to ride in your drug car. No. I said, get it out of here. You so crazy. Yeah, I will support you, make sure you got a place to live, food, but I do not support this. You killing your own people and it's blood money and it's wrong. These mothers that take the money and get their hair done and pay their rent, don't you dare cry over the casket. Don't you dare. Because now they're obligated to keep selling drugs, to the, um, the, the support the family. And it's wrong. It's wrong. I'm not doing it.

It is wrong. I hope you listen to those words. Um, and remember, you can share this show. Go to Spotify tomorrow and get this show so that anyone you want to share it with, you can. Thank you so much. Thank you, Minister, uh, Deborah Germany. Uh, and before we close the show, we always end with a quote. I have the quote: "Remember those who are in prison as though you are in prison with them." Hebrews 13:3. This is Joyce Bender, America's Voice Where Disability Matters. At voiceamerica.com. Talk to everyone next week. And in the words of Mary Brooker, when you go out, you remember, choose joy.

Voice America would like to thank you for tuning in. Please join us next Tuesday at 11 AM Pacific time and 2 PM Eastern Eastern time for another installment of Disability Matters, right here on the Voice America Variety Channel. We are the leader in live internet talk radio. VoiceAmerica.com.