Holmberg: Highmark Commitment to Hiring People with Disabilities

Welcome to Disability Matters with your host Joyce Bender.

All comments, views, and opinions expressed on the show are solely those of the host, guest, and callers. Now the host of Disability Matters, here's Joyce Bender.

Hi everyone, happy new year! Welcome to the show. I hope you had a wonderful and a healthy Happy holiday! Can you believe it? This is the 21st year of this radio show! 21 years! And thank you, Voice America. Tacey Trump, my executive producer, stood behind me, and well, here we are, 21 years later. So thank you, all of you in the United States. For your support of this show. What great listeners you are, and around the world. So, a couple new countries, but I want to thank China, Taiwan, Canada, Japan, United Kingdom, Saudi Arabia, Hungary— new Hungary, thank you, welcome— Ireland, Australia, Brazil, Egypt, Sweden— new, welcome Sweden— Russia, India, Spain— welcome Spain— Germany and New Zealand. All listeners of this show, these countries, thank you so much. You know, I always say, as you all know, I'm living with epilepsy. And that's why I founded Bender Consulting Services, a for-profit company that focuses on the competitive employment of people with disabilities. Why for-profit? No pity. No pity. People with disabilities want paychecks, not pity. But getting back to epilepsy, I always say, if you have a seizure which of course I have had. It's the same. A seizure's a seizure, different types, but a seizure's a seizure anywhere in the world, which is why I look at you as my brothers and sisters. And once again, thank you so much. You remember I said how my radio show has been on all of these years, and I want to tell you that the lead sponsor of this radio show is Highmark. Highmark, headed right here in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, but with locations across the country. Um, you know, David Holmberg, who you'll be hearing from in a moment, the CEO, is just awesome. And so all of you with disabilities know Highmark hires people with disabilities. You know what, I— you've heard me say it before, that is where the rubber meets the road, employment. I also want to thank ABLE Now, a new sponsor of the show, and ABLE Now works to help eligible individuals with disabilities save for the future without endangering disability benefits, you know, that are critical for health and independence, and it is called a trust account. One of the people behind that, by the way, was Senator Bob Casey, said that, for example, people with developmental or intellectual disabilities Parents were worried what will happen. And so this trust account was set up for those people in the families, and it is so awesome. So thank you, ABLE Now, for being a new sponsor. But there is only one, of course, lead sponsor. And as I said, that is Highmark. Health. And every January we call this the Powerhouse Month. Like in a few weeks, Valerie Jarrett and Tony Coelho will be on the show. But do you know I start every year with David Holmberg?

Why?

Because he is a powerhouse. And because to me, a real champion, once again, Hires People. So David, welcome again to the show.

Well, thank you very much, Joyce. It's always an honor to be on and, uh, to know that, you know, I'm with Valerie and Tony and I'm first in your heart. I mean, that just makes my day. So now when they're on, I'm sure they'll be first, but that's okay.

Now you are the first of the month every year because you're first, period. Uh, and I want to also— I also want to congratulate you for being named again by Modern Healthcare Health as one of the industry's 100 most influential people for the second time. I know you're recognized for transformative healthcare that we'll talk about in a little bit, and The chair of the board of Highmark Health, chair of the board of directors said, "In his 9 years as CEO, David has led a profound organizational and cultural shift, making Highmark Health a nationally recognized leader in health industry transformation." We're excited that Modern Healthcare again honored him for his dedication to improving health experiences, access, and quality. And David, before I move on, in the early '80s, when I very, very, very first moved to Pittsburgh and began my career in executive search, oh my goodness, Like Highmark had this little building, this one-level flat building that said Blue Cross of Western PA. And wow, look at you now in Fifth Avenue Place and Penn Center, plus all these other locations. So proud of you and so proud of the accomplishments of the company. For example, and this is why I gave that example. You have grown the organization from $15 billion in revenues in 2013 to $26 billion in 2023 and expanded insurance markets as well as grown government business segments. So you know what that says? Nan de Turk was right. I remember when Nan, the former the CFO of Highmark, said, "I want you to meet someone." And there we went to Sculio's, when it was still there, for lunch, and she introduced me to David Holmberg. And afterwards, when she called me, she said, "You watch him. You watch him. He's going to take off." Boy, Nan! Nan de Turk, I know you'll be listening now or later, and you were right, Nan, once again. Nana's always right. She was right about you, David. And how does that feel? I can't even imagine. I'm trying to imagine I'm CEO of some corporation and you go from $15 to $26 billion. I mean, how does that feel?

Well, thank you very much for all your kind words, Joyce Bender. And I've been blessed to have a lot of mentors in my life, and Nana Turk was one of them who helped shape me and guide me. So how does it feel? I mean, it's humbling when, you know, you think about all these large corporations and success that people have. It's very easy to get wrapped up in, you know, the Twitter version or the Instagram version. But the reality of it is, is if you want to do something special, if you want to make a difference, you have to focus on the people that you serve. And, you know, in my case, I believed very strongly that that our customers, our members, our patients needed something different than what they were getting in the marketplace, and that it was very important for us to be able to create a set of products and services that people valued. And at the end of the day, you know, that we treat people the way we would hope our own families would be treated. And so when I look back at what we've accomplished, I mean, it's absolutely a team effort. It's been about doing the right things when nobody was looking and making sure that we make good decisions for our customers and using that to guide us. And so, and that's what keeps me from getting too excited about the performance that we've had. Again, we're very proud of it, but at the same time, you know, we understand that every single day we've got to earn our customers' our members, our patients respect. And the way we do that is by exceeding their expectations.

Well, as usual, very humble you are. But in addition to these wonderful people and your commitment to customers, what do you personally attribute to— like, this is incredible success. I mean, Is it that you're persistent? Is it that you think big? I mean, what is it?

Well, I think it starts with, you know, I was very fortunate that I was brought up in a family that, you know, that work ethic mattered. You know, so you were expected to show up and, you know, create or build or produce something that then you got paid for. And by the way, going back to your point earlier about being a for-profit organization, Profit's not a dirty word. Profit is the power— if you do something that other people will pay you to do and do successfully, that's the power to be able to take care of your family, to be able to take care of the people you work with, and to do the right things for your customers. And so for me, having that background, having overcome early in my life and career, you know, various roadblocks made me resilient. And I was very determined that today I would be better than I was yesterday. And that was an important part of our equation here. And then the other thing, frankly, was I looked around and said, what are my strengths? What are the things I do well? How can I be strategic? How can I help the organization maybe execute on the things that we had promised to do?. And I quickly figured out the things I didn't know and surrounded myself with really smart people who, you know, were just as committed and had the same values and integrity and were willing to do the right things when nobody was looking. And so that's a big part of it. I mean, we have a terrific team here. And I think in any organization, no matter what you're doing, you know, you want to surround yourself with people that make you better. You know, if you're building a building in Sweden, you know, then You surround yourself with people who have the skills and the work ethic and who are willing to think about the problems and overcome them and not just give up. Those things matter and that's been part of our success.

Well, I just think you're brilliant and I think you sometimes maybe don't realize how great of an accomplishment this is and the buck stops with you. And your bucks really took off. So congratulations, uh, David. But you know what? It isn't just that he's a great businessman, it's that he cares about people, all people. But as you well know, most people, many with disabilities, live in poverty. Many people on Medicaid You know, and it's people like Jamie Protho, African American, very significant disability, difficult to understand him talk, with cerebral palsy. I truthfully don't think I would have been able to get him a position at any other company. Because I know this, because he had tried at other companies, and when they met him, that was it. You know, I even had people say to me, "Oh, Joyce, I didn't know that you were helping people with mental disabilities," which, oh, thank goodness I believe in being professional, or I may have done something to that person. But Jamie has a master's degree in rehab and technology from the University of Pittsburgh, and there's that person in poverty. I remember when his mother met Valerie Jarrett and told her, "I'm so excited to meet you. I went to the Salvation Army to buy this dress so I could meet you." These are the people that you give an opportunity to that are left out, and I hope I'm gonna send this out to all executives because I hope you will see what a difference it makes when you open the door. And David, I noticed when I've talked to different leaders about Highmark, they talk about you and your commitment to transformative care. I wonder, would you mind explaining that to our listeners?

Sure, Joyce Bender. I mean, Transformative Care is about moving healthcare closer to where people live and they interact. It's about moving away from the big hulking hospitals that we've grown used to. The future of healthcare is much more mobile, agile. It uses informed decision-making. Where we take all this data that we've been creating, all of us, and turn it into actionable information. And so our journey is about making sure that we have best-of-class healthcare delivery systems, so clinicians, hospitals, facilities, et cetera, and so that when somebody needs critical care, that the access is available, but at the same time, You know, the future of healthcare is about taking care of people before they get sick. You know, that's, I think, if there's a lesson to be learned in the last 50 years, you know, it's that, you know, the better we take care of ourselves on the front end, the less likely we're going to have, you know, catastrophic events on the back end. You know, things like diabetes, congestive heart failure, COPD, all of those, you know, are not always, but in many cases, lifestyle-initiated. So, you know, if we can help people make better decisions by giving them the right information, then it's up to them. But transformative care is about moving care closer to where people live in the community, maybe getting back to the days of where we used to have family physicians, you know, who knew everybody in the family and knew what was going on and could, you know, maybe diagnose things a little differently. That, you know, that model worked, and, you know, we've got to find a way to get back there. And so, so being transformative is about thinking about the problems we have and solving them differently than we've chosen to do over the last 20, 30 years.

Well, that is awesome. And, you know, if you're listening now, you want to share this show with someone, remember We have a huge listening audience on demand, whether it's Spotify, Apple, voiceamerica.com, benderconsult.com, really almost all social media venues. You can tell whomever, hey, go listen to this show and you will find out what Highmark is really like. You know, when you're talking about this transformative care for our listeners, that isn't just in Pittsburgh. I mean, Highmark is across the United States in different states, and you own AHN with hospitals and different centers. Would you mind sharing with our listeners how large Highmark has become with these locations?

Well, we have, you know, I mean, we have over 6 million insured members, and you where we manage the risk and pay claims and help facilitate getting care to the right locations. And then in Western Pennsylvania here, we have 14 hospitals, 2,000 clinicians, physicians, and then literally thousands of other clinicians. And, you know, it just gives us a different perspective, Joyce. I mean, you know, the things that we're doing here in Pittsburgh are creating new ideas, new secret sauce or DNA that can be transported anywhere in the world. This is about marrying up how do you deliver healthcare in better sites of care, simplify things, and then also balance out the financing of healthcare on the insurance side. And that's something that can be applied anywhere. So the way we talk about it is we're an integrated delivery system, meaning that we're responsible for the financing of the healthcare, but also for the delivery. And so it creates a different dynamic. It allows us to work together with our patients and our members to be able to get the better outcomes. And that's really what we're after. We're after improved access, better outcomes, and making healthcare more affordable for everybody so that it's inclusive and so that, you know, the people like Jamie, you know, get what they need in order to be able to live their best life.

So, speaking of different locations, first of all, Highmark, from the beginning when I started working, helping students with— high school students with disabilities at the Bender Leadership Academy for over 20 years, I did that as a volunteer. It wasn't until 2018 that I actually founded it. Surprise, surprise, it was Deb Rice at Highmark Health that gave me the grant to get started. But as I said, we have been doing it on a volunteer basis. While we were, we always had Pittsburgh Public Schools at Highmark where I teach the Bender Leadership Academy. We still do to this day actually, Fox Chapel is going to be joining. But, you know, I started in Delaware. That's where I started because of a customer. And so recently we said, oh, we need to move to a company to do this. So off we go to Delaware. Hi, Mark. And just like that, they said yes. So our students will be going to Highmark in Delaware for those classes. So that's what I mean about how you have expanded in so many areas. And look at that, you're now helping people in Delaware, high school students with disabilities, which, thank you, I'm so appreciative of that. And as I said, you are the person that has been leading the way to increase the employment of people with disabilities. So, Many of you know, but if you don't, I have to tell you this story. I found out in the mid-'80s the incredibly high unemployment of people with disabilities. Believe it or not, it was 90%, not in the workforce. Here's what's worse, it's 68% today. That is not a lot of success. It is the slowest-moving needle out of every part of the ADA. And I said, okay, that's it. I'm going to start my own company. I know people with disabilities can work in competitive areas. Because back then, it was only maintenance, stock person, bagger, busboy, but I wanted to work in competitive areas so people with disabilities would have the same chance as everyone else to make money and move up. But how? And the how is I went to Bill Lowry, who was the CEO of Blue Cross of Western PA. While he was there, the merger occurred and it became Highmark. I said, "Bill, I have this dream. I want to start this company, and I need a partner. Would you agree to bring on board 6 people with disabilities from this community college program, entry-level in IT, and keep them on contract for 3 years?" Now, so you all know, that was 1995. You know what that is? Only 5 years after the ADA was signed. This was unheard of, competitive employment, and a huge request. You know how long it took Bill to say yes? One day. One day. And that is why when I'm in Kazakhstan or different countries where I go with the State Department, I always say, wow, he would never believe it. That one decision, look what happened. But, and Keith Katmeyer was the CEO who also is awesome. But when they retired, I'll never forget this, they said, let's go to lunch with John Brouse and Jim Klingensmith. I'm talking about Bill Lowry and Keith Katmeyer. We go to this lunch, I remember saying, wow, talk about a, Power lunch. This is a real power lunch. And the purpose was to tell them, Bill said, I believe in this. I want you to keep it going. And sure enough, John Brouse did keep it going. And then it moved on to Ken Maloney. Then it belonged— moved on to Bill Winkenwerder. But then something unimaginable and magic happened. One man and one decision at Highmark said, let's hire 30 people to honor the 30th anniversary of the Americans with Disabilities Act. But then the next year, oh, let's take it to 31, 31. Oh, no, let's take it to 32, 32, and then 33 to 33. And this year, It will be 34 to 33. So, you know, no one in the United States is doing this, and that one man is David Holmberg. So, David, why did you decide, oh, I'm going to keep this going and actually make it bigger?

Well, I mean, Joyce, it was an easy decision because, um, you know, first of all, we have a need. We need strong people who are dedicated and committed, who we can train and develop who can get the job done and who are going to stay with us and be here for the long term. And so many of the folks that you've brought to us have fit exactly that mold. And, you know, for me, you know, I think it's— you know, I mean, it's a privilege to be in a job like I have, you know, to run a large organization like we have. And, you know, with that, With that privilege comes the responsibility to do the right things in the community and to, you know, to make things better so that when my time is done, then, and we hand off the business to the next generation, that they're in a better place than, you know, than we are. And so working with people who have differences is an important part of our strategy. It teaches humility to our organization. It reminds them of the purpose of why we're here. And it's just good business, you know, because what we found is that the people who have been able to bring in have done a terrific job. And they stay, they deliver, and they are self-sufficient. As you said in the beginning, there's no pity here. This isn't a charity program. You know, what we had to learn as an organization, and I suspect some of the people listening have the same issue, we had to learn how to bring people on board who had differences and help them not only orientate to the workforce and, you know, and learn how to operate in the workforce, but we also had to teach our managers and our other team members, you know, how to work closely with people who might need a hand up occasionally. And again, these aren't handouts, these are hand-ups. And what your organization does with Bender Consulting is smooths out some of the bumps in the road. You've been able to come in and partner with the people who are joining us. You've been able to partner with our leaders and teach them how to be better leaders. And what we see is that translates to other aspects of our organization. So to do 30 for 30 or 34 for 34 or whatever you want to call it, we think is an important part of our DNA. And again, it's the right thing to do, but it's also the self-serving part of it is we're getting really good people. And they're making a difference, and it's changing the culture of our organization and making it better. And sometimes we all get wrapped up in our own little worlds, so maybe helping somebody else makes them, our team members better and helps them be more productive in the long term for everyone.

Well, and as you know, David, people with disabilities are very loyal, and here's why. They're not superheroes. It's not that, oh, I'm born this way. No, it's that if you've been left out, I don't care you know, what protected class group you're with. If you've been left out, then when you get a job, it's a treasure. You know, a lot of people, I tell them when they go to work every day, they don't realize what a treasure it is to have employment. And we do. And an example of this is one of those people that I got hired late 1995 or early '96. Rico still works at Highmark in the IT area. Another person that we— that moved here on his own from Dallas, Texas to work at Highmark. Neil Cannon is still there. He has quadriplegia. He is moved up as a manager, which I love that, and called us to bring someone on board, which was my whole plan from the beginning, that I knew that if people with disabilities would get jobs and move up, they would give opportunities to other people people with disabilities. But that retention alone, as you well know, David, is a benefit financially to companies.

Absolutely, Joyce Bender. I mean, that is just so important. And again, I think we lose sight of the fact that everybody has a story, and everybody's got something going on in their personal lives, in their own worlds, or maybe how they grew up, or maybe they have disabilities, whatever it might Some of them are more visible than others. And, you know, the key as an organization is to have an organization that's inclusive, one where, you know, you truly are trying to do the right things for the people you serve but also the people you work with. And, you know, we are such a stronger company because of the people that you described. And it just makes everybody better. Takes a little bit of the edge off the organization. And, you know, and it makes you feel good when you know that you're making a difference for people. So sometimes it can be challenging. You know, it's sometimes not so challenging. With the world of Zoom and some of the other technology tools that we have today, it really changes the dynamic and allows more flexibility for people to be able to do the things that they're really good at.

Yes. By the way, Disability:IN does a survey for their DEI where they audit companies with the score— well, actually, if you don't get an 80, you're below, they don't list you at all. But Highmark has scored 100 for years, and Part of that is the belief across the board by the executive team. I wanna say that your executive leadership team, David, is 100% behind our partnership. Now I'm meaning across the board, you know, I'm talking about the Larry Kleimans, the Deb Rice, McMullig, Karen Hanlon, Dan Onorato, oh my goodness, I can't remember, Tracy, uh, Sala, uh, please forgive me if I forgot your name, but I think everyone gets the point is that all of these people are so supportive of Bender Consulting Services and not just saying, oh Joyce, that's really great what you do, but actually bringing people on for employment without David saying to them, "Hey, now you call Joyce Bender." I mean, on their own, they call me. Like Mick Malick is superstar, and by the way, won the Bender Technology Championship Award from Bender Consulting, and like was blown away when he found out that the mayor's office had made it McMalick Day in Pittsburgh, October 16th. And as Karen Hanlon, your COO, said, we will all never forget to remind him on October 16th that it is McMalick Day who has hired so many people from our company. So That's unusual, David. That is unusual.

Well, Joyce, I think what, you know, I mean, what it reflects is the overall organization's commitment, you know, to working with people with disabilities. I think, you know, what I'm proud of is nobody has to tell them. They've seen, you know, the value. One of the things that your organization has done successfully is teach. And help our organization realize that it's not a particularly big lift to bring people on who might need a little bit of extra help in the beginning, but who are more than capable of carrying their own weight. And so the people, all the people you described are champions of the program, and they don't view it, and I shouldn't have used that word, it's not a program. I mean, it's just how we do business. And they're all champions of doing business the right way. There's a lot of organizations out there that make sales. There's a lot of organizations out there who do business, but some of them don't necessarily do it in a way that's sustainable for the long term. And we believe that, you know, having a very healthy relationship with, you know, with team members who have disabilities who might need that hand up in the beginning, you know, that it's a good thing for the entire organization, and it makes us more successful in the long term.

Well, I must tell you, when I tell that story to other executives in corporate America, even they say to me, "Oh my goodness, that's so unusual that you have all of that support across the board." Of course, I attribute a lot of this to you because if you came across with, "Oh, this doesn't matter," I mean, that wouldn't be good. But your team is absolutely unbelievable. I mean, they are. And beneath them, I want to add that the people at all levels, not just at that executive vice president level, but at all levels, are also supportive. And you know, one company Joyce Bender did a survey and they were looking for the characteristic that people have that they equate with being the most successful. And one of them that— when I asked people, what do you think it was? Oh, I know it was attitude. But no, that's not the answer. It was gratitude. And that's what I mean about when you give someone a chance and you have gratitude. It's amazing that you are such an excellent performer. And I'll bet even you know that, David, that even in leaders that shine, that they're grateful makes such a positive difference.

Well, I think, you know, people who have gratitude, tend to be more introspective about their own success and the success of others. And it's my opinion, and my opinion only, that gratitude matters. That if you appreciate what you've accomplished and how you've gotten there and how hard the journey can be, you're more likely to maybe, again, give people a hand up. Who might need it. All of us have had mentors. All of us have had moments in our careers and our lives where things could have gone one way or the other, and we've had somebody who put an arm around us or gave us a nudge or gave us a stern talking to or just gave us a chance. And so, and I include myself in that. And so, you know, I think that the, The people in healthy organizations who understand that, you know, become really good partners in business and in life. And so that's why I think it's so important to have gratitude.

And I must tell you, I am very grateful and appreciative of everything you and Highmark has done to change lives. And I know you know that, but I just want for all of our listeners to know I couldn't do it without Highmark. You know, when I went to Bill, as I said, Bill Lowry, and asked him if he would stand behind me one day, the answer is yes. So Highmark and Bender are so connected that they're doing some exhibit at the Heinz History Center about me and Linda Dickerson. And one of the things they are including is a lot of information about Highmark because— Highmark, look what has happened and continues to happen. So, so I just want you all to know that that is— you need a partner. You need a partner. So, David, you probably also know very well that there is a huge mental health crisis in America. I want to mention right there, when companies say to me, "Oh, Joyce, I'm so glad you're here because we need to start hiring people with disabilities," I tell them, "Oh, but you already have." Oh yeah, they're working here right now. They have epilepsy, MS, depression, bipolar disorder, post-traumatic stress disorder, diabetes, heart disease. I could go on and on. Hard of hearing. It's just you don't know. So always remember, when you say that, some of your top performers are people with disabilities. They just haven't told you. And isn't it curious that people talk about their disability at Highmark. And why is that? If you don't feel included, you're not going to tell anyone. If you think, "If I tell them, I won't be promoted," you aren't going to tell anyone. So, one of those non-apparent disabilities is mental health disabilities. And that has increased substantially After COVID, as you know, David, many people were in just total isolation. I mean, hi, Mark. I work with Dick's on the front lines here in Pittsburgh getting people vaccinated. But I know you know from being in healthcare and seeing what happened that it's just total isolation leads to depression. So with you as a leader, with your leadership, how do you think you can help battle this issue at Heimwork?

Wow, well, that's a, that's a big question to answer. First of all, I think you're absolutely right. You know, I mean, there's, there's people who would suggest that 40% of people in the world today have either depression or anxiety or some sort of of mental health challenge going on. Obviously, there's two wars going on globally, maybe more. There's the post-pandemic impacts that have had on people, and you see it in a lot of different ways. Some folks are continuing to be isolated. They're not comfortable being out in crowds. Others are, you know, like over— overly aggressive in their activities. And so, you know, so there's a lot of different things happening. And, you know, I think everyone's workforce today is impacted. There's no organization who doesn't have folks already who are struggling with mental health issues. And so, you know, we are working very hard to make sure that access is available, and we're doing it through a couple of different ways. One is where we have the opportunity to expand our networks of of psychologists and psychiatrists were doing that, but there is a staffing shortage there. And so one of the other ways that we're doing it is using digital technology. So everything from interactive kinds of platforms that people can do at home to online examples of working with a counselor or a life coach coach or somebody like that, you know, we're trying to facilitate that. So in our case, our members have access to a pretty broad network that they can tap virtually. And if they need to be in person, which in many cases that's the case, you know, we're working very hard to make sure that those arrangements are available. But I think as individuals, we all have to be in tune and be aware that the people around us may be struggling.. And some of it is easily apparent and some of it isn't. But one of the things you can do is just ask people how are they doing. And then be silent for a minute. Let them tell you. And for some they'll tell you, for others maybe not. But the whole idea is frankly just do something. Don't just sit on the sidelines and watch people melt down. And so obviously there's people out there who need clinical help who may not be getting it, and we wanna try to facilitate getting them to the right level of care. But for others, it may be a friend or a trusted advisor or relative who can help them work through whatever issue it is. And so when you have the opportunity, don't take a pass. I mean, I think that's the real message. Be available, be present, be helpful. And then, you know, hopefully each individual will seek their own level.

Right. And I agree with you so much because you don't know that one person, you could be making a very, very substantial, significant difference. So reach out, be kind, you know, kindness. We don't have to have random acts of kindness. Only over Thanksgiving and/or the holidays. That should be year-round, random acts of kindness, just reaching out to people. David, one of the things at Bender Leadership that we talk about a lot is attributes or characteristics that make a person successful. Especially if they say, "I want to move up. I want to be in management someday." My question is, what do you believe makes someone a person that you would want to see in a leadership position?

Well, first of all, I think anybody in a leadership position has to be willing to, you know, to some level be a servant leader. You know, you have to understand that your success is tied to the people that you're working with. And if you're a leader, that you need to have empathy. You know, you need to have determination. You know, I think for people that are successful, they do have resolve. They don't give up at the first time they run into adversity. They surround themselves with people that are better than them. So they try to find people who have skills that maybe augment what their own individual skills are. I think people who are able to rise through the ranks, in many cases, they're lifelong learners. I mean, meaning that it's never quite enough. They continue to study and learn. When you have an opportunity to go back and get your education, that's an important thing to do, you know, when— but education comes in a lot of different formats. It doesn't mean that it comes with a degree. Sometimes education comes from just asking others to explain the why. You know, I mean, why does something work the way it does? What drives it? What could be different? Those kinds of things. And I think the other thing that you find in successful people is they're driven. They tend to have some level of confidence, but you know, they're not cocky. I mean, you know, there's always people out there you see on television and social media, and they're cocky and people think, well, that's the way you're supposed to be. The truth is, you know, most successful people didn't go to the fanciest school, they didn't drive a Ferrari, they weren't in the movies, but instead, they worked at it. They found something that they were passionate about and they loved doing, and I think that's probably my— would be my closing comment is, you know, you find something that you enjoy getting up in the morning and going and doing because that makes a huge difference in whether or not you're going to be successful at it.

Yes, and I think— I hope for young people with disabilities listening, I hope, you know, focus on that part. You don't have to go to an Ivy League school. You know, you don't have to come from a wealthy family. You have to be a hard worker, believe in yourself, get to know other people, network. Just as David said, surround yourself by people that can help you learn and move forward. I always tell young people, show me your friends and I'll show you your future.

Well, you said it, Joyce Bender. I mean, networking is so important. I mean, you know, so for your listeners, you know, it's really important to get out there and you got to put yourself out there a little bit. And that's particularly hard to do for people who might have disabilities. But, you know, you've got to be willing to, you know, to go into a room and meet other people to— and whether it's virtually or physically, and, you know, and as you were saying, surround yourself with people that are good people. If you surround yourself with people that aren't good people, it's, you know, you're setting yourself up to have to overcome another barrier, right?

Well, David, you have certainly accomplished so much, but what would you personally say was one of your greatest successes in 2023?

Oh my gosh, one of my greatest successes in 2023 is I think we've overcome some big complex challenges in terms of healthcare. We have a program called Living Health where we're building that transition bridge to the future, installing technologies that in healthcare maybe that haven't been used before. And it was a big leap of faith, and I'm very proud of the fact that it's working, that they're starting to come online now. People are starting to use them and it's making a difference in people's lives. And I think the second thing for me in 2023 is I've been able to invest in others. I've been mentoring a number of people both inside our organization and outside. And, you know, through that process, it's made me better. But hopefully I've been able to have an impact on them and give them maybe some insights or some tools or some ideas that help them grow and build for the future.

When you say investing in people, one of the first— one of the things you told me many years ago is that I want leaders, not managers. And I think that means investing in the people, and of course hiring the right people, people like Karen Hanlon. When I talked about gratitude, you know, there— and kindness. Here she is, COO. There isn't one time I've called her where she didn't get right back. Always and always, "How can I do to help? What can I do to help you? Well, what else do you need?" And then here's David, who goes to breakfast with me to the— an illustrious 5-star diner. What more could you ask for than that? I'm not kidding you. The first time he said, Carol, my sister, call and see where we're going to our holiday breakfast. And when she told me, I said, you made a mistake, call back. And she did. She called back. Then she said, nope, I didn't make a mistake. Uh, and so I'm telling you this because David isn't. He has one of the most prestigious positions, but he isn't, "I'm all about me," you know, he is not. And with that, David, what message do you have for our listeners today?

Well, Joyce Bender, thank you very much for the opportunity to be on the show and for the kind words. And again, I would just tell you, never give up. You know, keep focusing, you know, on, you know, the 2 or 3 things that you really want to achieve and do those really well. Focus on problem-solving and critical thinking skills. And, you know, and don't let others define you. You know, many times people miss out on opportunities because maybe they thought that somebody had an opinion or made a choice about them that, that to pick somebody else and you know, you can't just assume that. If you don't get a response to your email, send another one. If you want to have an interview with somebody, be persistent. Be humble, but be persistent and don't just assume that they're making a conscious decision because sometimes papers get shuffled on desks and people get busy and they lose sight of what you know might be in front of them and so, You have to be your own advocate, and you have to really, you know, put yourself out there and present yourself and ask for the opportunity, and you'll be surprised what will happen.

Great advice, David. First of all, thank you so much for kicking off 2024 with us on Disability Matters. Thank you so much.

Thank you, Joyce. It's been an honor.

Well, we end every show with a quote, so here it is. "When I hire people with disabilities, they are doing something great to help us succeed at Highmark. They shouldn't thank me, I should thank them," said David Holmberg. This is Joyce Bender. America's Voice: Where Disability Matters at voiceamerica.com. I'll talk to you all next week, and in the words of Mary Brocker, when you go out today, remember, choose joy.

Voice America would like to thank you for tuning in. Please join us next Tuesday at 11 AM Pacific time and 2 PM Eastern time for another installment of Disability Matters right here on the Voice America variety channel.

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