Jonathan Lovitz: Advocating for LGBTQ+ and Disability Communities

Welcome to Disability Matters with your host Joyce Bender. All comments, views, and opinions expressed on the show are solely those of the host, guest, and callers. Now the host of Disability Matters, here's Joyce Bender.

Hi everyone, welcome to the show to everyone in the United States and around the world. Around the world, special shout out To Richard Roberts, oh, I love him so much. He's with the State Department, as the others are that I'm going to mention, and he is in Brazil. I will be seeing him this fall. I'm telling you what, he is a disability rights leader on his own merit and just a great person. Gangyang, Gangyang Cho in South Korea. I hope everything is going great for you. Cheryl Smith at the U.S. State Department, right here in the United States, but I met Cheryl when she was in Libya— I mean, I'm sorry, Tunisia. But then we were able to do a program for Libya from the Tunisian Embassy. I hope you're doing well. And then we have my disability rights fighter with an NGO in Kazakhstan, Venyumin. Now I just want to tell you about all of this. State Department is helping me change lives, the U.S. State Department. What happens if people in a country go to an embassy and say, we're looking for an expert on the employment of people with disabilities to come and speak to us? They frequently ask me to go, and then when I go, I go throughout the country, morning to night, because you know how I am. If I go and I'm representing this country, I want to give it 100%. But you see how they're changing lives by having me go do that. So it's an honor to work with the State Department. And now to the countries around the world, from China to Australia, that listen to the show, I've got to tell you, Wow, China, you're really getting a big listening audience. It means so much to me that all of you listen to the show in all of the countries. Just want to say that I don't care if it's one person in Saudi Arabia, as it was. Hey, that one person, you can make a difference, you know that? Just by encouraging other people in your country that speak English to listen to the show. And by the way, for the deaf population, this show is open captioned, which means the transcript could be translated. So I mean it, thank you all. And then, oh, in the United States, I have the greatest listeners. You know, I love all of you. What I really like is when I go somewhere and someone says, Joyce Bender, I listen to your radio show. Oh, it just makes my day. So thank you all. And a special shout out to Yoshiko Dark, disability rights friend and leader, and Highmark. Highmark is the lead sponsor of this show and just an absolutely great corporation run by David Holmberg, a great CEO. So thank you all. And I gotta tell you, you know, I was really— I'm really excited, really excited about the radio show today. Uh, did you ever meet someone and like when you meet them you have instant chemistry, an affinity of spirits, and you know right then I like this person, I'm really gonna like them a lot? That's what happened when I first talked to Jonathan Lovitz. Who is a public policy and advocacy advisor and hangs out at the White House and is just a great person. And Jonathan, welcome to the show.

Oh, it's great to be back with you, Joyce, and the feeling is mutual. From the first time we ever met, I said, this is, this is my kind of person. You are such a fighter and such a, such a bright light for so many, and I'm just so proud to know you.

Well, feeling is mutual. And Jonathan, we are celebrating Pride Month, and that's why it's also so great to have a national leader on the show. But here's what happens. I hear from our listeners and they'll say, "Boy, that person's awesome, but like, who are they? What do they do? What's their background?" So I thought we would start by you sharing your story, you know, like where you grew up, where you went on with your education, what you did on Broadway, you know, what got you here? What was it like for you? Would you mind going over that with our listeners?

I'd be happy to, my friend. Well, I consider myself the luckiest guy in the world that I get to make my entire living telling stories. That was true from since I was growing up in South Florida, where I was a young theater performer and then went to the University of Florida where I studied both theater and political science. And I thought I was going to go right out into the working world and start working on political campaigns and, you know, living my West Wing TV show fantasies. But I happened to be that very, very rare and very fortunate and blessed lot that went right from college to a tour of a Broadway show. And I got to see so much of America over a couple of years, went and worked in New York and theater and television for many years after that, and along that journey started doing a lot of volunteering and then some paid speaking work and then in-house copywriting and press work, and before you knew it, the role I was playing more than any other was Jonathan as fighter. So I have gone back to my university, University of Florida, go Gators, I've gone back several times to teach and to guest lecture, and I tell them all the time, I said, If it wasn't for the theater, I never would have found my voice to work for so many others. So that's why I tell people all the time, "Let your kids pursue whatever creative outlets they want. It will serve them great in life wherever they go." Because now, in my years since the worlds of the arts, I have been in political communications and public affairs for LGBT organizations, disability rights organizations, women's groups, voting rights and gun violence prevention groups. I even started my own consulting company to help corporations and governments do better on their diversity, equity, and inclusion policies, which I got certified as both an LGBT-owned and disability-owned small business. An important reminder to everyone out there to take advantage of programs like that to make sure you're advocating for growth for our own communities in the business world. And now, after 10 years of leading both communications and public policy at the National LGBT Chamber of Commerce. I am recently appointed by President Biden to the United States Department of Commerce, where I work at the Economic Development Administration, helping to put grant money directly into communities across America to do good and help some people live a better life. So I'm, I'm one lucky man, and I get to do it in conjunction with great people like you and the people in your world, Joyce.

Well, we're lucky to have you, Jonathan, and I'm going to go back to the White House, but I have a question.

Yes, ma'am.

What the heck do people do on Broadway when, of course, if you have a show, you have to do the show, right? And they're sick. What happens?

You know, shout out to the incredible world of swings and understudies. I think we all saw that on display throughout the pandemic as half a company would be out and these incredible heroes would come swing into the show and pick it up like nothing ever happened. They'd been there from day one. It's a real testament for always knowing your stuff. I think there's a couple of really great life lessons in that for everyone about not only knowing your own cues, but being sure that you're ready to jump in and support your fellow— whether it's your fellow actor, your fellow activist, your fellow businessperson— by knowing just enough of everybody else's work to be able to pitch in and lend a hand. It is the ultimate team sport when you're working on a show like that.

Well, why I brought that up is I always tell our students, you know, say you're in a bad mood or you're having a bad day. The show must go on.

Oh my gosh, yeah.

You've got to put all that aside and realize The show must go on.

So there's really— You know what, Joyce, I'll tell you a quick aside about that because that is one of those things, you know, we always joke in the theater and in television, it's only got to be pretty from the front. You don't see all the chaos behind the scenes. You don't see everyone's personal drama or the fact that their rent is due or that they're tired or any of that. But it gets hard and I'll tell you, for years I was on the road for 2 straight years with a couple different shows.— you know, after a while, even the most magical musical can get a little tedious. It's a day. It's just a day at the office. And you have to remember why you're out there. And I used to tell when we'd meet students and we'd do master classes all over the country, "Listen, I'm in this business because at 10 years old, my folks took me to the Phantom of the Opera, and I was— I mean, dangling over that balcony. I was salivating on the people underneath because I was just so in love with what I was seeing. Well, there is a 10-year-old in the balcony at every show. Do it for them, because it was you once. And that's all you need to get through the show that day.

Yeah, how true that is. Yeah, I, I, I think this applies to so many things, but, um, I just wanted, uh, to mention that. And by the way, I too went to Pantages Theater. Ah, Phantom of the Opera. Wow, that is so great. Now there's something you don't know why I have not told you this, and I don't know why, but in case I haven't told all of our listeners, I'm real big on the arts. Okay, like I hate it that the arts are not in schools. I do. I think that's terrible when it's taken out. And you know, in Pittsburgh I support the ballet and the symphony. And I'm on the board, board of CLO. So we get to see all these great musicals. And we've been here for forever. It's over 50 years. So anyway, I didn't get to tell you this, Jonathan, but we went— Bender Leadership Academy, which is my not-for-profit where we help high school students with disabilities prepare for the world of work and fight bullying. With our #NotAshamed video campaign, which you have to do that, Jonathan. Count on it. Okay. Well, I wanted to bring in the arts, and during COVID the CLO had to have their classes, you know, virtual. Mm-hmm. I got— and I got this idea. Wait, what if we got people with disabilities that they could go to these acting and singing classes? What if we did that? And now We have a formal partnership called, ready, ACT, A-C-T, Accessibility.

I love it.

Oh, it is so awesome.

You know, I think COVID, there are a lot of things, some silver linings that are going to come from that, but you just highlighted such a good one, Joyce. I mean, I see that in the arts. I see it in my current work in public service and in advocacy that, One of the things that Zoom, Teams, whatever you used, did was a real ability equalizer. As long as you are able to access that technology, and thankfully more of it is becoming more disability inclusive than ever with closed captioning, with remote click devices, all of these ways that we can make them accessible to everyone, everyone can be included in the conversation, the dialogue, the play, whatever it is. And it's really very special. I think technology has really accelerated the way that we include people of all abilities and also connect, I think, things that were not maybe necessarily open to people with all abilities to enjoy. I'm thinking of just Pride celebrations this past weekend. There was a QR code so that on your phone you could see closed captioning from the stage right in front of you without having to read on the big screens. I mean, there were so many different ways that we're putting literally the world in people's hands and making it so much more accessible. It's a great thing.

Oh, it is. It is. And you know, Jonathan, your present job, people are of course in awe, absolute awe of the White House. Now, I know after you've been there for a while, you're still of course in awe, but you too, you too have a job that you have to do. But yes, what was this like for you when you were first appointed? What did you think?

It is, it is a dream come true. And I'm sitting here, I'm in my office, I'm looking out my window right now. To the right I see, uh, part of the corner of the White House complex. To the left I see part of the Washington Monument, the Smithsonian. I am just in, in such awe and in such, uh gratitude every single day that this is what I get to do, that, you know, I am a part of something big, but the impact is really personal. I mean, especially in the work I get to do in economic development with a focus on equity, we're making sure that every single person in America has the same shot to succeed. And, you know, that's deeply personal to me as someone who intersects with several different minority communities, but also is just An American who believes that good government can help people and should help people and should help everyone equally. So it's just a joy. I mean, and as someone who grew up watching The West Wing and who loves, you know, probably more C-SPAN than anyone should watch, this is, you know, I joke all the time that I'm cosplaying, you know, John F. Kennedy. It's just so much fun to get to pretend every day that this is what I do, and then I realize, oh my God, I'm actually doing it. I'm really a part of something this special, and with the most dedicated and passionate public servants. I work with such incredible folks who love taking care of people, who love helping, who love being a part of something bigger than themselves. And I got to tell you, on a personal level, working for the Biden administration, which really does pride itself on being the most diverse and inclusive, you see America in every one of these federal buildings that I go into. And as someone who is LGBT identified, has a disability, is Jewish, is a union member, I mean, I check a bunch of boxes. It's nice to know that I am part of a very diverse mix of people who bring all of that to the table. And as much as we're all looking inwards to see ourselves across the table, we're also making sure that all of our coattails are nice and long and pulling in all the people behind us who maybe haven't been here in the past, and I think that's the most special part.

Well, Jonathan, you know, just so our listeners get a better feel for it, would you mind explaining again what your role is, what you do?

Sure. So I work at the United States Department of Commerce, a federal agency under the leadership of Secretary Gina Raimondo, and what we do at the Commerce Department is make the American economy as strong and inclusive and as vibrant as possible in this ever-changing modern world and economy. But specifically, I work at the Economic Development Administration, which is a really special part of the government that, you know, we're— I joke that we're the big nonprofit at the heart of the American government because we are the ones that give out the grant checks. We're the ones that give the expertise and the technical support to help communities all over the country create programs that, you know, not only fix roads and bridges but also put people to work in job placement programs, help people find equitable access to opportunities in all 50 states and in all territories and tribal lands. I mean, it is really about making sure every single person in this country has access to the American Dream and can be a part of it. It's just so special, and I am so grateful that this is my job every single day.

Oh, that is so exciting and wonderful. And you know, Jonathan, I can't wait till I'm calling you Senator Lovitz.

How are you today? Thank you, my friend. Well, listen, if there's anyone who should be in office, I think it's you. We, we need, uh, incredible leaders like you and people like your listeners who really care about these issues. Um, if it's something that I have I've really been proud to observe in my time in government, and as someone who's worked in political campaigns for years, is the people with the lived experience are the ones that we need in the fight, because they're the ones who can make sure that others like them are seen and heard and represented. And I think, you know, something being in government has taught me, and that is something I try to remind everyone I work with, is it doesn't have to happen to you for you to give a darn. I don't need a disability to know that it's right for everyone to have access to every program and every opportunity. I don't need to be LGBTQ to know that some people should not be told where to live and where they can work and how they can love. We all have skin in each other's game because we're all humans. I think it's one of the great things about the work you do in the disability space is you remind people we're actually elevating the best parts of people not reflecting on anything that they do or don't have.

Yes, yes, that's so true. But I still want to call you Senator Lewis.

All right, I'll take it.

Okay, so you're gonna— that's it. You're gonna— when you run for office again, young man, you're gonna have a big following with all of us. Well, thank you. Um, well, Jonathan, I wanted you to share with our listeners about the commitment from the Biden administration to the disability community. And you were saying about lived experiences. As all my listeners know, I live with epilepsy and had a traumatic brain injury and am hard of hearing. But as you can see, that has not stopped me since that was way back in 1985. But President Biden also has a lived experience, which we'll talk about in a minute. But could you share with our listeners about the strong commitment from the Biden administration to the disability community? Because we are part of REV UP, our company, Bender Consulting Services, Register, Educate, Vote. And I really think people need to know, you know, the stance. So let's talk about President Biden's administration and commitment to the disability community.

Well, I mean, not to speak for the boss or for his team, but I'll tell you what, this is a president, this is an entire administration where belief in inclusion is is not just a buzzword, it is at the core of everything that we do. Thinking about my own agency at EDA where we say equity is our number one investment priority in America. That means everyone should have a fair shot at the access and the benefits of it. And certainly on the disability end, I mean, whether it's support for mental and physical health, whether it's ensuring equitable access to healthcare, you know, this president, this administration, believe that, that, you know, as he always says, it's about a, um, uh, a, a bottom-up, middle-out approach, meaning those who have historically, uh, not reaped the benefits are the ones who should be getting it first, because we are the majority of this country, and, uh, it's, it's our diversities that make us stronger, and it's our commitment to those diversities that reflect our values as a country. And, and just seeing The support for increased disability rights, disability visibility within the federal government, within all the agencies is proof of concept right there that this president, this administration gets it and they center those values in everything that we do.

Yeah, and you know what else? Our president has a disability. He has a stutter.

Yes, he does.

Which he has talked about. I'll never forget, he spoke about this and there was a young boy there that he had with him that also had a stutter. And I'm thinking stuttering. I'm going to tell you this disability, there is high unemployment, high. And now we can look at a president that has a disability and does not hide it. That to me is, you know, there are CEOs that would not admit it, Jonathan. There are CEOs that would not admit they have a dis— and here he is, the president of the United States. So to me, that's a big deal. What do you think about it?

Oh, I think it's an incredible deal. I mean, just, this is something I think about every day, especially this month, as, as, you know, one of, one of an ever-growing number of LGBT visible appointees in the administration. There are people out there who know that you can't be what you can't see. And for a kid out there, for anyone out there with a stutter, with any kind of neurodivergency, with any kind of disability, period, to see people like them leading in this government, uh, is a sign that anything is possible for them, right?

That's what I mean. Anything is possible. One other thing that I wanted to mention, if you're listening to the show right now and you're thinking, oh wow, look at this guy, he's at the White House, Broadway star, political advocate, does it all, I wish so-and-so could listen. For example, a young person a young person, that 10-year-old in the balcony that he was talking about, here's what you do. You go to Spotify, Voice America, benderconsult.com, really almost all social media outlets. Put in Jonathan Lovitz— well, put in Disability Matters with Joyce Bender on voiceamerica.com, and the guest, you can find Jonathan, will be at the top. And share it with someone else. So remember, even if you are not able to have the right person with you right now that you wish was hearing it, they can. So don't forget that. But right now, I wanted to ask you, uh, Jonathan, about— wow— your work, your work and your commitment to the LGBTQ committee. You are You're just a national hero. I mean, you, you— I've talked to Jason. Remember my son Jason Maida? Oh yeah, Mama Bear, folks. He's my adopted son, so to speak, um, but friends with, uh, a close friend of both of us. But I remember him telling you how awesome— telling me how awesome you are and what you've done for the LGBTQ community. So could you talk about that for a minute?

Oh, well, first of all, thank you. And, and Jason, uh, Jason Mehta and his company are just, uh, wonderful people, uh, and I know they do so much work to support you and the disability community and LGBT causes and really just anyone in need of a champion. That's, that's what you all do, and it's amazing. I have had this incredible privilege. I mean, I have been called in magazines an accidental activist, and I think that that's exactly what's happened to me. I, years ago, tripped and fell into a couple of really important advocacy opportunities that just happened to present themselves, and before I knew it, that's what I was doing for a living. And in my years working, particularly in the LGBT Chamber of Commerce my work was trying to elevate opportunities for LGBT entrepreneurs because it is, you know, much like access to healthcare for women or ability rights and/or accessibility in many places around the country. Just because the laws are equal on paper doesn't mean it's equitable in access and that it's all going to work out just the same. So trying to make sure that all 50 states are a place where you can live openly, have a great business, hire a lot to people and contribute to this country just like anybody else. We got to work on MWBE procurement laws all over the country, and while I know that doesn't sound terribly thrilling or sexy, it really was historic because I got to work with our friends at Disability:IN and with other communities on expanding the laws in 22 states to add LGBT, disability, or veterans, or some combination of all three to various procurement codes. And we're talking about billions of dollars of opportunity that are now available to members of our various communities that weren't before. And it's a big deal because, you know, when we're economically strong, we're electorally strong, and we're a force to be reckoned with in the country. So I think that's a really exciting thing to be a part of, and I stand on on and next to the shoulders of giants in my community, in the disability community, and others, because we are all in this together. I think that, to me, was my favorite part of working in the LGBT space, was getting to be reminded and constantly remind others that we are all interconnected. There is no LGBTQ fight that is not also a women's rights, a Black rights, a Hispanic rights, a disability rights, a veterans' rights fight. Because they are all a part of our community and we are all a part of theirs. So there's no such thing as us against them when we all have work to do together. And that was the real blessing of all those years working in the field.

And I just also want to add, in other groups, of course, but I have had tremendous support for our work in the LGBTQ community. I also want to say many young gay people go through such trauma that they end up joining our community, you know, with a mental health issue. However, I'm just saying I have had tremendous support from leaders, people like you, Jason, uh, CEOs, managers all across America, but I know it is time for our news break on the half hour, and our wonderful anchor Perry Jude Radesik is at a conference and will be on vacation, but she'll be back. She'll be back in a couple weeks. So we had to find a superstar person to give us the news and also an update on what's happening at Bender And who would be better than our old own Gerald Palmy? Can't think of anyone. Gerald, do you have the news for us?

Oh, hi Joyce, thank you for letting me call in. I, I can't do as good as the best news anchor in America, Perry Jude Radesic, but I'm happy to call in and share some updates here on the show with everybody. So here we got some exciting things going on. Just a few weeks ago, we hosted a great event here in Pittsburgh for Pride. We had a Pride event here where the Honorable Tony Coelho spoke, and he talked about how important voting rights is, and as a person with a disability, how important it is to make sure you get out there and vote. And this is such an important issue for us here at Bender. In August of last year, in partnership with AAPD, the Bender Leadership Academy, and Bender Consulting worked together to form the Pennsylvania Rev Up Coalition. So this is part of a national effort for AAPD Rev Up to— which stands for Register, Educate, Vote, use your power to get people with disabilities access to the ballot, educated with why they should get out there and vote and make sure they have the opportunity to vote. So we formed a coalition across the state of Pennsylvania in August of last year. And it's going really strong. We've had a great call this morning and we've got representation from Pittsburgh to Philly and everywhere in between with organizations from independent living centers to disability rights-focused organizations, community, small community orgs. We got representation from a lot of different disability groups. We were just talking about continuing to grow our community. So if you're in the state of Pennsylvania looking to get involved, make sure you go to vendorleadership.org, visit our Rev Up page and get, and fill out the form to get engaged in Rev Up because we want to grow and get even more people with disabilities involved. In this effort. We're doing a lot of great things. And we even have our state government consistently attending our meetings every month, vocally participating in voter access for people with disabilities, which is just incredible to see that level of commitment. And of course, Perry Jude Radesik is also very engaged in TA Rev Up as well. So this is going to be a great year for your local elections, for municipals, which are important elections as well. So make sure you get involved in that. And many states have their own Rev Up coalitions, and there's the national effort from AAPD as well. So make sure everybody goes out there and gets engaged. Use Register, educate, vote, and use your power.

And that is so, that is so important. Jonathan, do you want to comment on that, being that you were running for office?

Well, yes, and, uh, I mean, he couldn't be more right. Your, your vote is your power. Don't give it away. And especially when, you know, you look at so many races around this country that are decided by thousands, if not hundreds or even tens of votes. Don't let yours be one of the ones that potentially cost opportunity and safety and access for disability community members or community members of anyone, of any community that you care about. Use your voice. You've earned it. And we gotta make sure we use it so we never lose it.

Yes, amen. Hey, Gerald, Manager of Talent Programs, I have a question. What's going on at Bender?

So we've got an exciting role I want to talk about today. So as you know, Joyce, we here at Bender, we've become a premier place for the disability nonprofit community, the disability civil rights community for executive search to fill premier roles within the disability rights community, and we are Right now recruiting with our executive search roles with Christine Griffin leading up the search for the— for Disability Rights Maryland. So Disability Rights Maryland is doing a search for their new executive director. This is an amazing protection and advocacy agency, part of the National Disability Rights Network. That's looking for their next executive director right there in Maryland to help run this organization and lead it into its future, working alongside its amazing staff and incredible board. Well, how amazing their board has just been to work alongside as we're going through this process of recruiting and finding a person with a disability, which— how amazing is this, Joyce Bender? An organization is committing to hiring a person with a disability to run a disability rights organization. So this is a great opportunity, and you can apply to this on benderconsult.com/jobs. If you go to benderconsult.com/jobs, you can find the posting, and you can read all about it and how to apply. And get engaged in this incredible opportunity.

Oh, that's so exciting! That is really— that is a tremendous opportunity. Hey, if you're listening, you're thinking, wow, not me, but I know a leader that would love to be in that, uh, CEO, executive director role in Boston. You got to get to that. Get in touch with us. There's a Contact Us on our website, www.benderconsult.com. And Gerald, thank you, and I want to tell you, you would make Perry Jude proud.

Oh, thank you, Joyce.

All right, have a great day, Gerald. Thank you.

Thanks, Joyce, and thank you, Mr.

Lovis, for all that you are doing. Thank you, sir.

So, uh, Jonathan, before we went to break, I, I was mentioning That many— and by the way, if you just joined us, this is the great Jonathan Lovitz, public policy and advocacy advisor, former Broadway, and now appointee from the Biden administration at the White House, celebrating Pride Month. Um, Jonathan, many people in the LGBTQ community have a mental health disability which is where that intersectionality comes into play. And sadly, that is no surprise. So do you think or believe that people that develop anxiety, some, and depression and PTSD is increasing due to the horrific pressure right now in our country toward the LGBT community with at its heart homophobia. What do you think?

Oh, I mean, absolutely. Look, I, I, I am grateful to be, be comfortable enough and have support enough to be able to share that I am a suicide survivor and a mental health care patient because of what I went through with the anxiety and stress and fear of growing up gay in America. And I had particularly easy. So I think about the people who don't have those resources and don't have access to the help that I did, and why it's got to be so much harder for them, and why we have to double down on our commitments to help people like that. I mean, just think about the numbers, Joyce Bender. It's, you know, 20% of all LGBTQ kids have thought about committing suicide. 50% of trans kids under 20 have attempted to harm themselves in some way, and it's all because someone wasn't there for them when they needed the support. And that continues to manifest into lifelong anxiety and stress and PTSD-related issues, not to mention all kinds of issues related to body and image. And there's such a connection between mental health care and LGBTQ success and health. But there's also other elements of disability. I mean, there are entire segments of the LGBT community with a disability who feel very removed from things like Pride because it is very difficult to access when you're in a— if you have mobility issues or even sensitivities to sights and sounds. And thank God they're being addressed. I mean, there are zones rooms that are dedicated not just to be ADA compliant but also quiet zones and sensory stimulation-free zones and places where— and even special programs that are just dedicated to support that intersection of LGBTQ and disability. And that we're centering things like mental health not as a corrective tool, as something that you get after you've been diagnosed as having anything that needs treating, but as something almost preventative. I'm a firm proponent that every student, whether you're LGBTQ or an ally or anywhere between on the spectrum, should have access to someone to talk to, to work through all of life's issues. I mean, just think about being a kid in America today. You know, what was duck and cover maybe in your school years, Joyce, is now lock the door for the shooting drill. You know, that is stressful enough on kids that should just be learning how to do reading and math and science. Add to that too the social pressures, especially the social media pressures that affect young people that are coming out, that are dealing with their neurodivergency, that are dealing with their accessibility issues. I mean, we are not helping, we're not, you know, we're certainly not doing the young people any favors right now, but with this this sort of focus on the perfect body, the perfect mind, the perfect career. And so the best thing that all of us can do is show that there is no such thing as perfect, that there are so many avenues to success. And like I always say, you know, you cannot be what you cannot see. So if you're able to be that beacon for particularly a young person, a young queer person, a young person with a disability, you know, by talking about it, by being open about who you are, about what, what affects you. You're letting other people know, wow, you made it, so can I, and I can probably do even better by the time I'm your age.

Yeah. Oh, I know. And Jonathan, thank goodness we have you with us.

Right back at you.

I mean, I tell people all the time, suicide is a mistake you can't fix. But for all of the rest of you listening, you have no idea what you do to people when you bully them terribly. You have no idea. I mean, really, gay, disabled, African-American, whatever, but boy, you get a person from the LGBTQ community with a mental health disability, it is probably not always, but also brought on through what they went through, you know, in their life. You need to support them because you know what? When you don't and you're part of this, it's on you. When you don't accept your son or daughter because they're trans or gay, it's on you if something happens. So I am begging all of you, you know, people with disabilities are so brutally bullied on Facebook, TikTok, whatever it is. Gotta stop. It's not funny. You've got to stop doing it. And Jonathan, are you worried because, you know, the Florida Don't Say Gay— I'm telling you, in my life. It's so hard for me to believe all of this could happen. Here I am, a die-hard forever Pittsburgh Pirates fan, greatest baseball player of all time, the great Roberto Clemente. That when I found out that book was taken out of a library, I thought, you've got to be kidding me. And then this whole thing with the gay community is so terrible. Do you worry about that spreading to other areas of the country, Jonathan?

You know, whether it's a pushback against LGBT rights, against women's rights, against voting rights for African Americans, people of color, I mean, these are the dying gasps of people who are terrified of change. Um, and I, you know, I think just like other issues have have ebbed and flowed in American history. This will have its moment. I think, uh, the, the right thing will happen, whether through judicial or electoral action, and people will say, this is not who we are in America. We will not be the— you know, I was just in a roundtable recently with Secretary Buttigieg, and he said, you know, we are the generation that's having to make the choice about being the first in, in many, many generations to take any kind of step backwards in the name of progress, and I just don't think that that's who we are and that that's something that's going to happen. So I think, you know, you'll see young people, people with disabilities, veterans, LGBT people, women, uh, showing up to vote in, in record numbers in, in years ahead because, you know, to, to what we were just talking about earlier, it is your power, uh, and it is, you know, when, when it can feel so powerless, one of the most powerful things that you can do is exercise your right to vote. So, uh, I have hope. I have hope always.

I do too, because I'm the, uh, optimist. But you gotta vote. You've got to register and vote if you want to.

And ask and tell it to others. I mean, make that part— make that part of your, you know, your Christmas card campaign this year. Send everybody registration forms, you know, to it. Because you tell people, look, if you care about me, I need your help. I need you to show up and vote this year. Uh, I won't tell you for who, but I think if you care about me, you know, you'll, you'll do the research and understand why. Um, I think you really have to make it personal for people because it can feel very abstract. And I think when we tell people, look, I, you know, I tell, I tell the story all the time, but my own parents, they, they, my father hadn't voted in years, not because he was sort of, uh, politically motivated any one way or another, but just cause he always thought He's like, "Meh, what difference does one vote make? The whole system's a mess, everybody's crooked, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah." Well, I wrote him a letter and I said, "Look, I would really like it if someday soon you're walking me down the aisle at my wedding, and for that to even be possible, I need laws in this country to change. Please go vote." And he did. And so you have to make these things personal, so to all of us who care about someone with a disability, someone who's LGBTQ, a woman, a teacher, a doctor, people who need our help. Go be their voice. If you feel even just a little bit uncomfortable about things, imagine how bad it is for someone who really has to live in fear, and then go act on their behalf.

Yep, right. Make a change. Make a change. You possibly save a life. Well, Jonathan, look at you. You're so— oh, you're so good. So articulate. Very great appearance, great, you know, just awesome person. I just love you.

Uh, but you know, I'll be right back, Joyce.

Thank you. Yeah, people don't get to be like you without people influencing them. So, you know, you probably have many great role models in your life, but who is is or was a role model, who would you think of?

Well, you know, it's special that we're talking today. We're recording on June 13th. It's my parents' 52nd wedding anniversary today. So I will certainly use the opportunity to wish them a very happy anniversary and to let them know once again that they are my heroes and that I am where I am today because they let me be who I am and who I wanted to be. And so I shout out to them, and a shout out to all the supportive parents out there who are our heroes. I also have to shout out the real trailblazers. I think about heroes like Tony Coelho, like David Mixner, Gemma Bergefeld, people who have put literally their neck on the line for all of us to make things a little better and have taken the heat for it, but have moved this country forward. And I'm only able to say that stand in, in the shoes I'm in and literally sit in the office I'm in because of the great work that people like that have done.

Yeah, yeah, we all have that person, and Tony Cuomo is absolutely— has been for since 1996, uh, the greatest mentor and now closest friend for me. So yeah, you're right, you're right. So Jonathan, you know I had some contact before all of this for some young people who are living in shame because they're from the LGBT community, have a mental health disability, facing great obstacles, listening to the show right now. What, what is your advice?

Shame is not for— do not let anyone else's fear cause you to live in shame. Any minute you are not spent living your best, truest life is a minute spent, taken away by someone else. Don't cede that power. I think one of the most important things that anyone can remember, and particularly LGBTQ youth when they want to understand, why do these people hate us so much? They don't hate you. They are so jealous that you, at such a young age, are so aware of how fantastic and powerful you are. They are so jealous of your strength and your confidence and that you know exactly who the heck you are. Uh, people would kill for that kind of self-awareness and the freedom to be that in tune with their own hearts. So their problems ain't your problems. Keep living, keep shining, keep pushing forward, because, uh, we need every single one of you to succeed.

And would you suggest, Jonathan, that they work on having, uh, friends or an ally, or what can they do? Yeah, if they feel isolated.

There's, there's, if they feel isolated, look, there's never been simultaneously a greater need for resources out there. There are, you know, suicides are on the rise, fear in the community and in all communities are on the rise, but there's also never been a greater time or greater escalation in the rise of resources, whether It's things like the Trevor Project or the Trans Lifeline, which are 24/7 phone numbers you can call or text to get help. If you're having any kind of depressive or suicidal thoughts, there are people who are there for you all the time. There are resources in all 50 states and territories for LGBTQ youth, for families, for teachers, for parents, for people who want to be good allies at the workplace and in schools. So, you know, there's a great saying that the governor of Pennsylvania, Josh Shapiro, said all the time when he was campaigning, and, you know, he's a real mensch icon for the rest of us, and he would say all the time, "Look, in Judaism, we say that no one is expected to complete the task, but you're not at all allowed to not start." You don't have to solve the world's problems, but you do have skin in the game, and you've got to do your part by helping others, however that manifests for you.

Yeah, I agree. And, and, you know, uh, Jonathan, I'm going to assume that in a lot of cities there are LGBTQ organizations that people could get in touch with. Is that true?

Oh yes. And honestly, it's never been easier to simply go to your search engine—Google, Yahoo, whatever you use—and search LGBT resources near me. There's also great websites out there like the Trevor Project, like InterPride, and other networks out there that have listed regional resources wherever you live in the country. And one of the things that's also so valuable now is with social media sort of being a critical part of everyone's day-to-day life, If you see something like that that resonates with you, you see a resource in your city, your county, your state, put it out there. You never know who needs to see it. I mean, at least once a month I tweet out the Trevor Project Lifeline just because someone knows a kid who needs that help. And so then they can screenshot it, keep it in their phone, and come back to it any time that it might come up. So, you know, between your cat GIFs and your, you know, your music videos or whatever it is you post, try to throw up something that can maybe advance a little bit of help, a little compassion for any community that you care about. That's the best way to be an ally.

Okay, and that is the Trevor Project Lifeline. And what is for the trans? What's the Trans Lifeline?

So there's also, yeah, there's the Trevor Project, there's the Trans Lifeline, And there are several other resources like this. There's also, there are several other similar crisis lines for veterans, for people with disabilities. There are, every community has life-saving resources out there. So educate yourself, screenshot these, bookmark them in your phone.

You never know whose life you could save simply by telling someone, "Hey, I know someone who can listen." Well, Jonathan, I want to thank you not only for being with us today, but I also want to thank you for your commitment to the disability community and your support of me. Uh, it means so much, and I know with all of our listeners, it means so much to them. So, uh, with that, we've got to end the show, but I always end with a quote, and today that quote is 'When all Americans are treated as equal, no matter who they are or whom they love, are all more free,' said President Barack Obama. Thank you so much, Jonathan, for being with us.

Thank you, Joyce Bender. Thanks for all you do for the disability community, for, for, for communities of all kinds everywhere. We are lucky to have a champion like you on the radio and in our lives.

Well, thank you. So I'm getting ready to go. Make sure, remember, you can go get this radio show, this podcast, go to Spotify, go to benderconsult.com, go to Voice America. And with that, this is Joyce Bender, America's Voice. Where Disability Matters at voiceamerica.com. Talk to you all next week, and in Mary Brooker's words, remember, today, choose joy.

Voice America would like to thank you for tuning in. Please join us next Tuesday at 11 AM Pacific time and 2 PM Eastern time for another another installment of Disability Matters right here on the Voice America Variety Channel. We are the leader in live internet talk radio. VoiceAmerica.com.