Mark Fleischer/Brady Patsy: History of Pittsburgh CLO, Partnership with Bender Leadership Academy, and Upcoming 2025 Production of A Christmas Carol

Welcome to Disability Matters with your host Joyce Bender. All comments, views, and opinions expressed on the show are solely those of the host, guest, and callers. Now the host of Disability Matters, here's Joyce Bender.

And hello everyone, this is Joyce Bender on Disability Matters. As always, I have to start by thanking all of you. Who knew this show would be on 22 years? When I started, I was wondering if it would be on 1 year, and here we are 22 years later. Why? Because I have the best listeners. I have great listeners. Thank you so much. As you know, I'm a woman living with epilepsy, and I'm on a mission for quality of life for people living with disabilities. And so make sure you share this show with others. All you have to do is go to Spotify or Voice America or Apple, and it's so easy to grab the post and share it. And wow, we now have listeners in 74 countries. 74 countries from Russia to Australia to countries you probably have never heard of before. But we have a lot of listeners around the world. Germany, really big listening audience there. So thank you. Now, you've heard me say this every show, but around the world, If you are, for example, Saudi Arabia, and there's only one person listening, don't be thinking, but I'm only one person. One person can make a difference. What you have to do is talk to everyone you know and get this show somewhere where they have English translation. So thank you all. And listen, I am learning Mexico Spanish, but I'm not going to try it right now because if I do, you'll think, don't try anymore. But thank you all, and Yoshiko Dart. Boy, Yoshiko, it has to be 8 years maybe I've been giving this shout out to you, but everyone knows we all love you in the disability community. Yoshiko is the widow of the late, great Justin Dart, who you can see on the photograph with President Bush when he signed the Americans with Disabilities Act, you will see a man seated in a wheelchair wearing a cowboy hat, and that is who Justin Dart is, a great leader. I always tell Yoshiko, you know he's famous when he was a Jeopardy question. So Yoshiko, we're gonna keep him going because people don't know enough about our history, and I'm gonna make sure they do. And thank you. Hi, Mark. I told them they can use this, getting them a free marketing ad. Highmark sets the high mark for other companies to follow, and they do, especially in the world of disability. So I have to tell you, oh my goodness, like, I'm so excited today. I am on the board of the Pittsburgh CLO. You have no idea. How much I love saying that to people. I love it. And you need to know all about it. It's everywhere. But may I say, especially right here in Western Pennsylvania, if you don't know who they are, the CLO, you need to know who they are because they are dynamic. You know, I feel like we have this hidden treasure right here in the city of Pittsburgh. We have this with incredible musicals that are fantastic. And by the way, my favorite is coming up, A Christmas Carol, which I have now seen for, I'd say, 12, 12 years or more. Um, every— if you know me well, you know Charles Dickens is my favorite author, so of course I love A Christmas Carol. But we have two superstars with us right now today. We have Mark Fleischer and Brady Patsy. And Mark, welcome back to the show. It's such a pleasure to have you on today. How about if we start by you telling everyone a little bit about yourself? And by the way, you were on years ago. It seems like you were just on the other day, doesn't it? I mean, it seems like you were just on. But anyway, a little bit about yourself and how you got into the role you're in today.

Well, thank you, Joyce Bender. It's good to be back. Yes, I was on the show a while ago, um, and so I hope I, uh, I'll take this as an honor that you're making me a repeat guest. Um, I'm the executive producer of Pittsburgh CLO. I've been in this position since June of 2020, but it's actually my third job at CLO. I arrived in 2014 to start a program, uh, for developing new musicals for our small space, the Greer Cabaret Theater, and, um, fell in love with Pittsburgh and this organization. I had been working in upstate New York when I was recruited down to this position, but I've been here now I think longer than anywhere else I've been, and there's some exciting things here. This city, this region, with what it has to offer its citizens and people around it, not just of course the arts, which I'm, you know, biased towards, but from lifestyle and sports and education and everything. So I'm thrilled to be here. I guess, you know, to give you a little more, I'm a native— I grew up in Texas. I'm not a native Texan, but I lived there for most of my life. But I've said I've been here in Pittsburgh. That's where I'm— that's my home now. That's what I call my hometown.

Well, thank goodness we got you here from Texas. Yeah. Mark, the CLO, I tell people another reason they should go is it's historic. I feel it's historic. You know, you've been— we've been here a long time. And if I'm right, there were some very famous stars involved from the beginning. I wonder if you talk about that.

Yeah, we're about to enter our 80th year. We were founded in 1946 by Edgar Kaufmann of Kaufmann's department store and the owner of Fallingwater, or the builder of Fallingwater, Frank Lloyd Wright's masterpiece not far from here. He and a councilman, A.L. Wolk, as World War II was ending, said, you know, we need to bring the community together. And what we need to do that with is musicals, or at the time, light operas, which is where the LO of our name comes from. And so they decided that they would produce big outdoor musicals or operettas at Pitt Stadium up by the university. And again, its idea was, let's bring the community together for a shared experience. And they did that. It happened 9 months after the end of World War II was the first performance. Like, they—

Wow.

—had a plan and they got it done. Wow. And we've been doing that ever since. And I say, you know, while musicals are what matter to us, really it's the underneath. It's the bringing people together. As I've told people, sometimes you have to go through the word civic and Pittsburgh before you get to our art form. And it's those words, Pittsburgh and civic, that really drive what we do. The art form is the medium. The musical is just something we happen to love, but it's what happens, whether it's in the classroom, whether it's in the rehearsal room, the auditorium, or out in the community with some of the programs that I know Brady will talk about. The goal is just to bring people together for dialogue and conversation, but at the same time, have a great time together celebrating who we are as a community.

And Julie Andrews was involved.

Uh, Julie Andrews is our honorary chair, but if you go back in our history, we're part of the launching the careers of Shirley Jones, Billy Porter, Patrick Wilson, Zach Quinto, and many, many others. Also, many just kind of came through in the old days. This was sort of the phrase was, it's where Broadway spends the summer. So if you go through our old programs, You'll see a Carol Burnett. You'll see Jerry Lewis. So many amazing people that performed on our stage. And sort of what makes us special now is this sort of mix on our stage. You'll have young kids from our CLO Academy of Musical Theater on stage with local professionals, on stage with people emerging into the career, their first jobs coming out of college, as well as Broadway professionals and Broadway stars. And it's that mix that I think makes it special, that it's made here in Pittsburgh. What you're seeing is produced and created using that mix of talent and offstage and musicians, and now all professionals creating something for Pittsburgh that most of the time, once it's done, is done. It's this sort of like, you know, to use a musical reference, it's like Brigadoon, right? It shows up, it does its thing, and it disappears. But at the same time, what stays are those memories and those connections and, you know, being in an audience with your neighbors or someone you don't know. And again, that's what matters to me really, Joyce, is the sort of connections that we can build through this amazing organization that does shows, education, community engagement for all of Pittsburgh. It's very important to me that there's an entry point for anyone who's interested in musical theater, be it performer, audience member, aficionado, or just, Hey, I've always wanted just to sing a song. Come on down, we have a place for you.

And you know, listeners, everyone gets so excited to go to the CLO because A, it's part of history, B, it's right here in Pittsburgh, C, it's very well known, but the music, oh, so good, so good. I've seen musicals there and I thought, wow, I feel like I am in New York on Broadway. I mean, just really, Great musical. And may I say about A Christmas Carol, oh, they do a great Fezziwig. They do a great Fezziwig. It's as if he's right out of the Dickens novel. I always think, oh yeah, that's him. That's how he is. But what is the website, Mark? Pittsburghclo.org.

Org. Remember that our Pittsburgh is spelled with an H, Pittsburghclo.org, and you can find out about not just Christmas Carol, but we have Rocky Horror coming up, The Rocky Horror Show. We have a fun show called Yippee-Ki-Yay, which is a one-man retelling of the movie Die Hard, which many people think is a Christmas movie and many other people don't. So we're hoping that that show will be the debate. Is it or is it not a Christmas show? But the reality is, as you can see, even in those 3 shows, Joyce, there's something for everyone. Not everyone's going to want to go see Rocky, but someone may want to see Christmas Carol, someone want to see Yippee! And that's that idea that we're creating something for everyone here, especially for you, Joyce, given how— what an incredible Dickensian scholar and fan you are of that story.

Oh, when I was in college, Dr. Peyton, who's now in her '90s, I took a Dickens class and Shakespeare, but Dickens won. Since then, I'm not kidding, I love the books from Pickwick Papers to Bleak House, all of them, David Copperfield, right? And every year I read A Christmas Carol. And now I'm gonna have to get this news out, now that I think about this, to my alma mater Geneva College. And I'm actually gonna put that on my social media. I want you all to know that President Calvin Trump told me at breakfast a couple days ago, every year at Christmas, my wife and I read A Christmas Carol. Well, now I can tell the president, and he's going to be on my radio show in December, hey, remember how you read it? Well, now you can go see it live at the Pittsburgh CLO. What I want to happen is I know you're not a— grew up in Pittsburgh, but for anyone listening to the show that grew up in Pittsburgh— and Brady, did you grow up in Pittsburgh? Yes. And we're coming to you next. Well, then you would have been a child now with this story, maybe 5. But in Pittsburgh, at the Kaufman's Clock on that street, they used to have a fundraiser every year for Children's Hospital. And so, and they would give out their famous cookie called a Farkle Berry Cookie. So you would see people in line, they'd give $5. Then you'd see a big corporation come up and give $100,000. And this was for one week. And I told some of the board members, I wanna be out there next year. I want the CLO to be out there. And that way we can have Brady singing. Songs for My Christmas Carol, right, while we're outside. And that is PittsburghCLO.org, correct? Correct. Okay, you know why I'm telling you all this, right? I want you to do something. You're going to hear in a little bit how they are helping me help high school students living with disabilities, doing something that no one else does. But you know A not-for-profit, you know, I, I remember this one CEO, they were getting all these restricted funds, which is great. But he used to say, I have all these restricted funds, but I can't turn the light on, meaning that you also need money just to run the organization. But I want you all to help me. I want you to make a donation, although I hope it is $100,000 or more. I would accept $5. I don't care what you donate, but you've got to help me. You've got to help me help high school students living with disabilities, and you have to help this— keep this precious jewel right here in the city of Pittsburgh. What would I do if I couldn't see A Christmas Carol? I would cry. So here we go. I'm going on to a real superstar. We have Uh, Brady Patsy, welcome to the show.

Thank you so much for having me. Yeah, I—

let's start with your background.

So yeah, you mentioned I was born in Allegheny General Hospital right here in Pittsburgh. I was adopted, so I grew up about an hour and a half north of the city. I'm actually Brady from East Brady. It was a rough childhood, we can talk about it later. Uh, it brought up a lot of things, but, um, yeah, so I grew up and, and I found theater when, when the high school would actually bring their high school performances to the elementary schools, do little segments of the show. And it was for a couple reasons. One, they're trying to sell tickets to the high school show, but on top of that, they were trying to get young people interested in the program for when they got into high school. And it certainly worked on me. I remember when I was very small, they brought The Sound of Music, and like, I completely and totally went from being on the gym cafeteria floor to being on like watching this, like immersed in this story. And that is when I knew, man, I have to find a way to do this with my life. I was very fortunate when I was in high school. Our director was very connected in Pittsburgh. She actually did a couple of shows with the Pittsburgh CLO and a few other theaters in Pittsburgh. So she kind of brought us down frequently to get used to and see these amazing productions down here in the city. And then I kind of became a professional actor, started working, started doing teaching and everything, and worked at Disney for a while. I was very fortunate to have a job down there. Absolutely loved my time at the Walt Disney World Company. That's a place that I tell everybody, if you want to learn how to make magic, work at Disney World, because that is your job. It is just truly to make magic for people every day. And it was a joyous experience. Um, came back, jumped right back into the professional theater world, started acting, started performing. Um, I led a school over in the West End for a while for theater. Left that job, moved to Omaha, was an artistic director in Omaha for a while. Moved back to Pittsburgh when we had our first child just to be around that village because both my wife and I's family are both from around the area. So we moved back to be with the village and thankfully Mark said, "Well, I have a couple things for you." And one of the very first things that I did with the Pittsburgh CLL was their Gallery of Heroes tour. It is a program that we have that goes through not just Allegheny County, but all over the place. The year that I did it, we were doing a show called "Hero: The Boy from Troy." It was the story of John Lewis and how he became the Congressman and the extraordinary human that John Lewis was. I got the unbelievable pleasure to play Martin Luther King Jr. in that whole story. And it was just, it was, yeah, we took the show from, I mean, West Virginia to Franklin up in Pennsylvania. I mean, we were all over the place. And it was one of the most rewarding experiences of my life, just getting the chance. It was hard work. I mean, we're loading the set in, we're doing all of that, but we're also getting the chance to take education and theater and put it all together in one big thing and throw it out to these kids. And some of them are getting their first experience with theater, but also some of them were getting their first history lesson on John Lewis and getting the chance to offer both of those things while, you know, people are running around and acting like chickens because one of my favorite things one of the things about John Lewis is that he grew up on a chicken farm, and he used to talk and give sermons to his chickens in the, in the field. And that's one of my favorite stories about him. Wow. That was— yeah, that was part of the story that we told too. Like, he became such a great preacher because he preached to his chickens when he was young. Well, so to get to do that— practice. Yeah, exactly, right? Somewhere, uh, to get to do that. And then right out of that, I actually auditioned for the summer season and To Mark's point, I mean, the very first show that I got cast in, in their summer season was Into the Woods. And, you know, first day of rehearsal, you're walking in with Broadway legend Carolee Carmelo playing the witch and you're like, okay, I'm a local actor from Pittsburgh getting the opportunity to work with this Tony-nominated extraordinaire. And to watch her do that over the process of the week was one of the most rewarding and fulfilling masterclasses I've ever been a part of.

And I didn't have to pay for it, they were paying me.

That was the crazy part. So then just more experiences in their summer season. Got to do Christmas Carol, which Joyce Bender, I'm 100% with you. Charles Dickens is one of my absolute favorite. Christmas Carol is probably one of my favorite pieces of literature just because I think it is, it's a story the world needs. I think right now of charity, it is understanding how we, those of us with any little tiny means necessary, can pass those means forward and change the world. And to your point, CLO is one of those organizations that is looking for those means right now, ways that we can move the art forward because we know stories like Christmas Carol do help change charity in the world, right? When that book was released, it completely changed the way that charity was looked at in England. So art served its purpose, and that's exactly what we try to do every day. It's not that we're out here trying to change minds. We are simply trying to give the community experiences that they might not otherwise get. And that gives them the opportunity not to change their mind, but to think. And that's really the greatest gift you can give somebody. Take a moment, quiet reflect. I think Fred Rogers said it right. The greatest gift you can give somebody is a moment of quiet reflection. Well, after these shows, it's that moment to just reflect. What did I just take in? And how do I forward the conversation and pass it forward? So that's, that's what I love about the CLO and why I think it's so important moving forward. Forward. Um, it's something that Pittsburgh can't get rid of because it's the humanity heartbeat of this whole city.

It is. And what do you do now?

So now I am the community engagement manager for CLO. We have so many outreach programs. We have master classes, the Gene Kelly Awards, we're bringing back the Mini Stars, we've got that Gallery of Heroes program. So, and Creative Vision is a program that actually goes into to public schools as well and does 4-week, 10-week, 20-week, and even 30-week residencies in these schools to help teach arts education. You know, the one beautiful thing about CLO has been around since 1946, as Marc mentioned, but in the, you know, '80s and early '90s, Charlie Gray, who was running the company, he saw the importance of arts education. He understood that it's not just giving Pittsburgh shows and these opportunities of humanity. It's teaching children. It's teaching children how to use those voices. It is teaching children how to stand confidently on a podcast and talk to a camera and, and be able to have these deep intellectual conversations. That's what Charlie believed the arts could do. And he started— he thought, let's start that in an education world. So he started the C.L.O. Academy. Next thing you know, all of these academy classes— we have our downtown location, We found ways to take them outward, right? How do we serve communities that can't get downtown? How do we make sure that that CLO reputation isn't just a downtown reputation, but a cultural presence all over Western Pennsylvania? So programs like Gallery of Heroes, programs like Creative Vision, they were created so that way it's CLO mobile and we can really take what we believe in, which is teaching children how to find themselves. And how to stand true in that authenticity and then take that authenticity forward. How do we take that everywhere? Because when a child learns that and then learns how to not only stand in their own shoes, but see somebody else's shoes— I don't have to stand in your shoes to understand, right? That's the empathy side of what we're trying to teach. As an actor, I get the opportunity to step into roles, people that aren't me, but I get to explore their way of life. And the moment I do that, that's when my heart grows. Now I understand just a little bit better where they're coming from.

That's our goal. Yes. And I can tell you're passionate about it. That's the best, but that's the trait we need. Pittsburghclo.org. Make a donation. Mark, you mentioned these upcoming productions at Greer Theater. First of all, I have no clue how I did— was it this group of people? I said, favorite Christmas movie? Elf, Miracle on 34th Street. And all of a sudden, Die Hard, Die Hard, Die Hard. I said, how is Die Hard? You know, if you notice at the holiday season, it's on. Frequently, which is of course is coming up at the CLO. So let's hear about both shows.

Sure. Well, I know Die Hard, you know, is a movie that starred Bruce Willis in the '80s. And, you know, we've actually been thinking a lot about Bruce Willis, who, you know, is now suffering from FTD. And we've been thinking a lot about how to even tie that into the show. But the reality is it's a show that people find as an adventure. Some love it as a Christmas show, others do not, but this show we're bringing was a hit in the Edinburgh Fringe Festival, which is in Scotland. It's this place where theater people go to sort of try new things, and this show became a runaway hit, so we're bringing it to Pittsburgh with its original actor, and it's the story of how he came to love this show, this movie, and the people in his life, and so he actually does reenact a lot of scenes from the movie, and so people love it, but there's also but also a personal heartwarming story as well underneath it. We found 2 years ago when we started with Whose Holiday? that there was a place for not the traditional Christmas show, right? That people came to Christmas Carol with their families, but then the Greer Cabaret, which has food and drink and is sort of an adult environment, they wanted something else to laugh at, maybe without their kids at it. So we said, well, let's try this thing with Cindy Lou Who. Different places. And so this was Adult Cindy Lou Who, and we did that for 2 years. And then this year I'm bringing this one in. So it's sort of, again, something different, but it'll be— I think it'll be fun. It captures the movie. Those who know the movie will love it. Those who don't, I think, will be able to follow it just fine. So if you need to bring someone along— but I think what I would also say, Joyce, is just the experience of the Greer Cabaret. You can park in Theater Square parking garage, take the elevator down, walk through the lobby, get your tickets, go into the have a drink and some food, go into the theater, have dinner, watch the show, have a drink or dessert afterwards. It's really like this one-stop shopping, and I'm finding in our, in our time that people are getting out of their house to come want sort of a true event, and the Greer Cabaret shows, whether it's this one or Rocky Horror Show that opens in a couple weeks, is truly an event-driven experience that you'll get nowhere else.

Okay, we're gonna go to break and then we'll be right back. This is Joyce Bender, America's Voice, where disability matters, at voiceamerica.com. Don't go away, we'll be right back.

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You're listening to Disability Matters. Now please welcome back the host of Disability Matters. Here's Joyce Bender.

Hey, welcome back everyone. We are back on. And you know, uh, Mark, you were talking about the shows at the Cabaret Theater. I just wanted to mention, and again, Pittsburgh CLO, downtown Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. That Greer Theater, I really like that. See, there's the CLO in this beautiful setting, and then the Greer Theater, also very, very nice. But you can have a drink, you can, you know, order food. It's so like, if you're thinking, oh, What could I do different? There you go. Pittsburgh CLO, Rare Theatre. Yippee-ki-yay or Rocky Horror Show. Either one. But Mark, are you going to be dressed for that Rocky Horror Show?

I'll be there. I'm directing the show. I'm very excited. You know, it's its 50th anniversary of The Rocky Horror Picture Show, believe it or not, although the play started in 1973 in an upstairs theater in London with 63 seats. And it's become a phenomenon, right? I'm reading a book right now called Still the Beast Is Feeding on the history, and it talks about how the show has just become a cultural thing that's beyond what Richard O'Brien, who created it, could have ever imagined when he was creating just a little farce about, you know, a spoof rather on B-movies and science fiction. And, you know, I was taken to see the film in high school by a group of friends and had no idea what I was going to see. And it really, you know, as I talk to people, The show means a lot to people in different ways. An idea of, you know, there's a great phrase called, in the show, "Don't dream it, be it." You know, and it's about not just being, figuring out who you are, but having the guts to be who you are in the world. And, you know, and it's, at its heart, it really is sort of a B-movie about a couple that get lost on a road and find themselves in this creepy mansion and have sort of a, life lesson. But it's, uh, you know, definitely, you know, no one has ever seen a Dr. Frankenstein like this one, like Frankenfurter, that was played by Tim Curry originally in the stage and film. And it's also an audience participation show. There's really a community. Again, why I love this piece is it's back to the idea of community, that there are people who have gone and seen it as a movie as teenagers and adults, and now you've got the show, and people yell out things at the stage, and they get up and they dance the Time Warp as part of it. We're gonna have a lot of other events around it. We have a drag brunch, we have a trivia night, we're having a dance party, we're having, what else am I thinking of? We have college nights. And again, the idea of building community around it. We know that these sort of events are part of more than just having the lights turn out on you for 2 hours when you see a show. How are you having a full experience? And so we wanna have that, and we're lucky to have had some support from the Richard King Mellon Foundation, to support these special events at the Cabaret, again, to see if that drives more people to come. So it's not just a show, it's, oh, it's a show and trivia night, or it's a show and a brunch, or it's a dance party afterwards with the cast. And I think it's gonna be a lot of fun, and we're gonna do similar events with Yippee-Ki-Yay! We just haven't come up with what those are yet. But we want it to be so much more when you come. We want you to bring friends, meet new friends, get to know the show, As I said, it's about community and it's about being together experiencing something at the same time. You know, that audience experience that you talked about, Joyce, and Brady talks about, you know, it's been tracked that when you go see a show, your heartbeat and your breathing goes in line with those people around you. And that's just pretty amazing to me that that sort of alignment as a community can happen while watching a piece of art or just some entertainment. So I'm thrilled to have your support and your belief in what we do because it is, I said, so much more than just a play. It is an experience that can change your life and make something a little different. Brady has, you know, tells the story about Christmas Carol. Just to go back, Brady was one of our students that came to see the show as a kid, right? We have 5,000+ schoolchildren through discounted tickets that come down and see the show, and Brady was one of those kids. Now he performs in it for the next generation of those kids. And, and that's what I think is so special about being part of an organization that's 80 years old, that there are multi-generational experiences. I talk to people like, oh, I came with my grandmother, or my, my mom would bring me every year, and now I bring my kids. And so we're, you know, they talk about cultural institutions. We're a cultural tradition, um, for Pittsburgh. And that's what matters to me. And whether that's happening in the theatre, or as Brady's talking about, in a classroom, or kids coming down, or an internship, or our New Horizons program. We want to make sure there's somewhere— if you want something to do with musical theatre, CLA will find a way or a place for you. And, you know, we do, whether it's at the school— people like, oh, you know, can we afford it? Scholarships for kids. We just announced our first winner of the Shirley Jones Scholarship this year, which was raised in honor of Shirley, who turned 90 last year. There's just So much happening here, and some of your listeners may only just know us as shows in the summer, but that's not true. We are a year-round organization that's providing so much to this community thanks to the support of this community through donors and, and ticket buyers and individuals like you who serve on the board. So, um, I appreciate all that we do, and Brady is just another example of people that give so much to make sure that others can have a great experience at CLO.

You know, yeah, I agree with everything that you're saying, but if someone is listening and they're thinking, okay, this is all great, when are these things? So when, when is the Rocky Horror Show? When is the Yippee-ki-yay? Now we're going to test my memory here.

So Rocky Horror starts on October 14th and runs through November 8th. There are performances, I think, Wednesdays through Saturdays. There might be a couple Sundays here or there. And then Yippee-Ki-Yay opens the first week of December and then runs through the 22nd, Sunday the 22nd. And Christmas Carol opens, starts with some student matinees, but our first official performance is on the 13th, I think 13th or 14th of December and runs through the 23rd. We wanted them— this year we were able to get some shows right up close to Christmas. We call it the "What do I do with Grandma?" challenge. Grandma's in town, let's take her to "A Christmas Carol." Bring the whole family and it's there. And again, as you said, with all those characters, it's a show that's designed for multiple ages. There are some scary moments, there are some joyful moments, but, you know, it's, it's a Christmas ghost story. So there is something for everyone, as we said, and you're going to see incredible performers. You referenced Fezziwig, played by Tim Hartman. Oh, you're gonna see so many different local actors that make their living in Pittsburgh, not only as actors but are teachers and at our schools and in our colleges. And, and that's part of also what CLO provides by having these performances and these, these jobs. It holds on to these people in our community who give back through so many other different ways. You know, you can be a community that creates art or one that just purely imports art, and we're proud to be part of the creation of art in our community and that we share it in so many ways.

Yes, PittsburghCLO.org. First of all, like, I have someone coming in from out of town, and if she is here, my husband and I will be seeing A Christmas Carol twice because I want to take her to see it. It's at that second show that Mark Slaney go up there and be Mrs. Fezziwig. So make sure you have your camera. You don't want to miss that. Joyce, I have to be honest with you.

That's it. I said this to the director too. I remember Mark mentioned me seeing this as a child, coming to see it. Terri Wickline at the time, legendary Pittsburgh performer, she played Mrs. Fezziwig and Mrs. Dilber, and I can truly say she is one of the reasons why I am a performer. Like, watching her on that stage and the way that she told that story, I said, that's a dream role of mine. I want to be Mrs. Fezziwig because Terry Wickline introduced it to me. Oh, yes.

Yes. Okay. And I'm not going to tell all this, so you'll be surprised. But wait till you all see Jacob Marley. Oh! Wait till you see that part. Wait till you see Jacob Marley. Although that the Fezziwig party is my highlight. That's what people always call me, Fezziwig, because I love the Christmas holiday. We have to have a holiday party. We have to have a DJ. And I must tell you, for people with disabilities, sometimes that's the only time that some of the people get out, not because You know, I mean, these are really sharp-looking people, but when you're in a wheelchair, not everyone is accepting, you know, on the dance floor. But we've got, you know, what is the best part is when we dance, the people that are deaf are really good, like they can feel the rhythm. And I always say to my husband, you should be ashamed, you can't dance as well. You should be ashamed, but, um, love Fezziwig.

Well, given that you just mentioned, you know, what you were just saying about people being welcome or feeling they are not as welcoming, Brady, you should talk a little bit about the experience that we added to Christmas Carol a few years ago with the sensory-friendly performance.

It was actually— I wasn't—

another example of something that is there to like make sure anyone can come.

Yes, we do. We do a beautiful, relaxed performance of the show. You know, if there's a lot of sensory things, as you mentioned, Joyce, there's a lot special effects. I won't give too much away either, but, you know, people are coming in through the floor, flying out through the ceiling. It gets pretty crazy. How can we do that for folks that that might be a little too much? The fog that's constantly rolling in, the flashing lights, all of those things. So we, a few years ago, offered with some funding through different wonderful donors in the city and things, we've created what's called a sensory-friendly performance, and we really relax it. We do not take the house lights all the way out, so they're not sitting in the dark. There's a little bit of light in the theater. We cut all of the entrances that are coming in from the audience. We take a lot of those special effects out, but we don't lose the story. That's the most beautiful thing. And actually, it's one of my favorite performances because the very beginning of the show, everybody in the show comes out staring at Tiny Tim, and we're We're singing Silent Night, and there's a moment in the song where you actually turn and look at the audience, and it's during the, uh, sleep in heavenly, and then we pause for a moment, and before we say the word peace, we turn and face the audience. And it's the only performance that we get where when we turn and face that audience, we get to see— I'm getting choked up just thinking about it— we get to see everybody in the audience because those lights are on. It's such a beautiful thing to be able to just give this message of peace and this message of beauty to the world. Knowing that the audience is full of people of all abilities and we get to actually see them. I can't say enough about it. So if it's, if it's an interest of yours that you don't want to maybe get the whole bells and whistles of Christmas Carol and you need a little bit more of a relaxed performance, it is something I highly recommend. Check out that sensory-friendly performance.

And that is so awesome. Before we check out the news, I, I want to just remind you, if you have a relative with a child with autism, you've got to tell them about this production because sadly there are people, parents, they would love to go to a musical but they can't for that reason. Well, if you know anyone, tell them. And, and what better thing? What a great holiday gift. Taking your child to be able to see A Christmas Carol. So please spread that news. I know that there are a lot of people that have no idea that we do that. And you, you'd be able to take your children. As a matter of fact, I'm going to let everyone at the Epilepsy Association know that, and anyone you know you need to tell because now they could go. Now, momentary change. We have— yes, I know she's tired of me saying this, but the Rachel of news, Jennifer Mathis, with us. Jennifer, are you with us? And yes, you are with us. I do see you coming. There you are. Rachel Mathis, there you are. Rachel, how are you?

Rachel, I am here. I'm good.

Well, you know, for everyone, uh, Jennifer is known internationally, but here in the United States, she's been in the New York Times, many different periodicals. Every time there's anything related to mental health You call Jennifer. So this show is our news break on every show called Matheson on the Mic. Uh, and Jennifer, before you give us an update, do you not think that having arts in your city is important for young people with or without disabilities?

Oh, 100%, absolutely. It's vital to our culture and our lives.

That's right. And I believe, Jennifer, that that helps young people with disabilities when they are in a class, okay, an academy. It helps them get confidence. It does. You know, it helps them get more confidence. Chris Kobus is like the greatest board member. As Brady said, her whole family's like the COBIS CLO family, but they are so great, as Tal and Hannah is, uh, and many of the board, board members are. But, uh, Jennifer, they are all behind the partnership we have with the Pittsburgh CLO, uh, accessibility, accessibility, uh, where high school students with disabilities from the Bender Leadership Academy are able to go to the academy already in place. And we're the only one to my knowledge in the United States doing this. Once again, if you're the parent of a child with a disability, not only do you have that opportunity, but very quickly, Brady, could you tell everyone about the education program? You know, the academy, the regular academy.

Yeah. So the Pittsburgh CLO Academy, we are wonderful to have this relationship with Bend Leadership and yeah, Obviously art knows no ability. So there's no such thing as a disability in the arts, in my personal opinion. There's ways that we can adapt to anything. We found recently, actually, as we had, we have a program called New Horizons, which is for students in wheelchairs or different abilities and things. And we've learned that we're not necessarily putting new students into that program. It's just kind of the ones that are there are just aging through it because of the whole shift in the world. So these students are, instead of going into New Horizons, they're just going into the classrooms. They're taking the acting classes, the dance classes, the, the voice classes, no different than everyone. And it's been a wonderful shift to see just in the culture of our space here at the Pittsburgh CLO Academy and just in the world as well. As we said, art knows no ability. So we love the fact that we are able to just service every child because as Joyce Bender said, here at CLO Academy, It's not about being— yes, we are teaching you how to sing, act, and dance, but really we're teaching you how to authentically be you and to walk into the world and say, this is who I am, and I'm very proud of that.

Yes. And Jennifer, we can boast that Billy Porter came out of the Pittsburgh CLO, and even better, He actually played the part in Pittsburgh in Kinky Boots. He did. Oh my God, he is so good. Nice. Yeah, but Jennifer and I am going to ask you a question about employment and how all this connects with the CLO. But what news do you have for us today?

So, um, I just thought I'd give a quick update on something that we have talked about before on the news. Which was this effort from the Department of Energy to do what they call the direct final rule. They were eliminating the standards for new construction accessibility for their grantees. This was back in May. Um, that was pretty shocking because those standards have been in place since the 1970s, and all of a sudden, out of the blue, comes this rule that is designed to get around the ordinary rulemaking process that has notice and public comment and is designed— this special process for things that are not controversial and are just sort of technical corrections. And using that process, they just eliminated these standards that have been the bedrock of the law for almost 50 years and, you know, creating lots of problems for both regulated entities as well as people with disabilities, creating inconsistencies with every other agency across the federal government. And so this was pretty surprising. They did it with a number of other civil rights rules as well. So what we saw was that was May 16th they did that, and they said, we're going to do this. The effective date is 30 days from now in June, and if we get significant adverse comments, then we will take those into consideration. We'll either withdraw the rule or we'll do a new rule that responds to them. And so you better believe they got significant adverse comments from the disability community and others, and got so many comments it was overwhelming. And so what they did then with this and a bunch of other rules similarly was to postpone it. First they postponed it by, uh, another— I think the first it was 30 days, then it was another 60 days. And now the latest is they have postponed it again by another 90 days. And so it was supposed to come out in September, I think September 12th, and now we're looking at December 10th. And so we will see what happens. With one of the other rules, they actually withdrew it. So it is possible that they will withdraw it at the end of this. We don't know. But that is where we are, and I just wanted to give people an update because that was an important thing, and we're all watching it because if that kind of thing can happen with that important a rule, then they can dismantle civil rights, you know, without process, without comment, without going through all of the usual protections. And so this is important to people with disabilities. It's important to us. Important to the entities that get federal funding also from the Department of Energy.

Talk about the power though of people. I mean, obviously, mouth is on the mic, they listen to you. And we did get a huge amount of people saying, no, no, no, we don't, we don't like this. And there you go, one gone, one postponed. So can people continue No, I—

well, I think the formal comment process is closed at this point. I mean, people can always write them a letter, um, and— but the formal comment process is closed. They got many, many thousands of comments. I think there were upward of 20,000 comments that they— wow, so that's good. Yeah, so I think they realized they had a problem. Um, you know, what they're going to do about it remains to be seen. But yes, I think this showed the power of the community that, you know, people turned out and said, we're not going to let you just get away with this and not say anything.

Well, Jennifer, here's my goal. My goal is to get you up here next year so you can go to the CLO.

Excellent. I would love to do that.

See that? We're going to recruit people far and wide and we're going to make sure everyone knows about the Pittsburgh CLO. So before we end the show, um, Brady, do you have any last comments you would like to make?

No, the only thing I know, Joyce Bender and I were talking before everybody got on about just, uh, I know her, her dream is for me to sing a little stanza here from something from A Christmas Carol, uh, and we were talking about the music of the show, and that's one of the things that I just want to if you are thinking about joining us this holiday season. The music is a really special part of Christmas Carol. Of course, we take the Dickens text, which is a lot of the script is truly ripped directly from the dialogue that is given to us from Charles Dickens in the book. But then of course, some creative liberties, but the music is used in such a beautiful way. This is the first time we are going to be doing the show in a very long time without our legendary music director, McRae Hardy. He passed away, we lost him this past year, devastated but excited to carry on the legacy that he had in the music of this show. And I can tell you, as someone who has done it now a couple of times, he made me fall in love with the music of this show. Even last year, the show opens with the song Silent Night. It opens with the big, you know, the big chimes, you know, bom bom bom bom bom bom bom bom. And then the very first line is Silent Night. And the soloist sings Silent Night, as we know. But then McCray last year decided, you know what, I think instead of going Holy night, let's go, holy night, and make it minor. That'll make the whole audience go, wait, that wasn't quite right. What is the world that we're about to go into? What's the adventure? So he was even finding ways to just tweak the music a little bit, to change the dialogue, to change the conversation, to change the way the audience was starting to think about the show that they were about to see. That kind of love of music, that's also what we try to teach at the CLO, right? How does every note matter? Every little thing that the writer writes means something. The words that are created are there. Another one that I brought up was the first time that we see Bob Cratchit leaving the office and Scrooge has left and it's Christmas Eve and he gets that day off with his family. He starts whistling Good King Wenceslas as he closes up the office and the ensemble just kind of looms in and watches him do this and he goes outside and he takes takes this breath and just— and as soon as he exhales, the whole chorus comes in with, "Good King Wenceslas looked down on me," and it's just this sound. Yeah, it just changes.

That is so good. That's exactly what it's like, right? It's the beauty of music.

I mean, it's the beauty of what we do. It's— it is exactly why art has to keep going in these cities. It's why we have to keep teaching it to children, um, because it's a language. I mean, it's truly the language of empathy and love, and I will never stop teaching it. So Joyce, thank you so much for having me on and letting me share those just a little two vocal lines, if that teases anybody to wanna come. I loved it.

Well, thank you, Mark and Brady. Pittsburghclo.org. Get out that checkbook right now and make a donation. And I expect to see you if you're in Western PA at A Christmas Carol. As I said, I may be incognito, but I'll be there. And with that, we end every show with a quote, and today it is, "What art offers is space, a certain breathing room for the spirit," said John Updike. This is Joyce Bender, America's Voice, where disability matters at voiceamerica.com. And in the words of Mary Brooker, when you go out tomorrow, remember, choose joy.

Voice America would like to thank you for tuning in. Please join us next Tuesday at 11 AM Pacific time and 2 PM Eastern time for another installment of Disability Matters right here on on the Voice America Variety Channel. We are the leader in live internet talk radio. VoiceAmerica.com.