Mark Johnson: Disability Rights Leader and Advocate

Welcome to Disability Matters with your host Joyce Bender. All comments, views, and opinions expressed on the show are solely those of the host, guest, and callers. Now the host of Disability Matters, here's Joyce Bender.

Hi everyone and welcome to the show today. I hope those of you in the United States all had a great Labor Day. Oh my goodness, summer is over. How's that possible? I call from now to the end of December the Santa Claus slide because we're going to slide right into Christmas so quickly. It's just amazing how fast time goes, isn't it? I remember when I grew up and my mother would say to me, 'Just so you know,' when I'd complain about the time to go back to school. 'Just so you know, you have no idea how much time flies.' And me thinking, 'Oh, brother, there we go.' In the meantime, guess what I say? 'Hey, you don't know how much time flies.' Isn't that the truth, though? Well, I mentioned to all my listeners in the Americas But I have listeners around the world, from Indonesia to China to Russia to Australia to the UK to Brazil. Thank you all for listening to the show. I appreciate every one of you. Listen, I just want to mention something. If you have any English-speaking people with disabilities in your country, Make sure you share this show because there are so many people that feel they have no value or so want to work but don't know what to do. Please share this show. And of course, to all my great friends in the United States, oh my goodness, you are so awesome. I love every one of you. And every time I meet a listener, I hug them. You are just so, so awesome, every one of you. And to my sponsor, hi Mark, thank you. And now for my special shout out. Hello Yoshiko Dart. Oh my goodness, Yoshiko, I've said this on every show now for years, but you know how I love you. And oh my goodness, are you ever gonna love this show today. You are going to love it, Yoshiko, because we have a great disability rights advocate and leader that— you know why I say shout out to Yoshiko? In addition to the fact she's awesome, I want everyone to remember our history. You know, I go out on the street, who's Justin Dart? What's the majority of people going to say? We have to work harder to get our history out. Like today, when we have a great leader that has done so much in our history, the great Mark Johnson, who he says, I see on some things that he's retired, but he has never retired from advocacy. You know, some people, that's it. They're like a missionary. That's their purpose. And that's Mark. I so admire him. Mark, welcome to the show.

Oh, welcome, Joyce. I appreciate that. You know, as you were talking, I was reflecting on the first time I met, um, Yoshiko and just in person, it's when they were going across the country. I think the first time they went across country, a couple times, but when they were collecting the stories for the ADA journals to be given as testimony of why we needed our civil rights. So thanks for bringing back those memories by mentioning those names.

Absolutely. Absolutely. And I know she's going to send me a note telling me how much specifically she loved this show. Now, Mark, now that this, this is the 21st year on the air, and now that we have so many listeners, in addition to these listeners around the world, people are always saying, wow, that, that person sounded great. I just wish I knew more about that person. So, I ask everyone to tell their story, you know, like where they grew up, about their family, where they went to school, and how they became involved in the disability arena and then advocacy. So, would you mind sharing with our listeners your story?

Sure, sure. I was, um, Born 73 years ago in North Carolina, um, spent some time in Texas and Florida as well. Grew up actually in Charlotte, North Carolina, um, was at East Carolina University. I graduated high school in '69 and went to East Carolina University, which is Greenville, North Carolina. And, um, my sophomore year of college, I was out, um, swimming and diving in a quarry. Not a, not a sand quarry, but a rock— I mean, not a rock quarry, but a sand quarry. It's kind of where they go out and grab the sand or grab the rock, and when they hit water, they abandon them. And they become real good swim holes where you can hang out. And I hit the bottom of the dive and basically broke my neck. And so I've been using a wheelchair, power wheelchair now, uh, for a little over 53 years. Um, I went back to college after, you know, being rehab and trying to resort my priorities in life. And I went back to University of North Carolina in Charlotte, which wasn't too far from our house because at that time I was moved back in with my parents. And I got an undergraduate degree and then I got a graduate degree, a master's in education with the emphasis in guidance and counseling because, um, I, I figured, you know, when do most of us, um, um, when we're bombarded with decisions that will impact the the rest of our lives, meaning, you know, sex or drugs or, or whatever. And it's usually those junior high, um, years. And, and so I went, I did some counseling at a junior high school, uh, and then I got recruited, um, to do counseling at the rehab where I got my rehab for newly injured folks. And that ultimately evolved into, you know, doing some community education as well because, you know, it was easy back then and is today that, you know, our difference is not the problem. It's society as a whole's inability to embrace our difference. And you mentioned the word value, you know, to to value ourselves and to value our experience and use that experience to educate people and break down barriers. So I did that in '77 and '78 and '79 and in 1980. And I got married in 1981, and my wife was living at that time in Colorado. So I moved out to Colorado in '81. Went to work for a Center for Independent Living, um, and then around '83, a group of us, Wade Blank and some others, started ADAPT. Not an organization, it's a network of people who wanted lifts on buses. And we did that campaign for 7 years until in 1990 ADA became the law of the land. And then we started focusing on a right to community living, which we still don't have. And so it was just a project, you know, growing up in the South, having a younger brother and older brother, having a mom who was left-handed and dyslexic and born in Chile and raised in South Africa. My dad was a traveling salesman for General Foods, which Sold Jell-O and pudding and Tang and Bird's Eye, and it's a really good childhood experience, great high school experience. And then the change was, okay, what— how am I going to get on my life now? And so it ultimately became through the advocacy and then ultimately marriage and a child, and as of about 18 months ago, granddad.

So congratulations.

Yeah, yeah, it changes your life or slows you down, takes a look at the world.

And then you went to the Shepherd Center.

Yeah, I went. Um, Susan and I decided— Lindsay was born in 1984, and, and so in 1986 she moved to Atlanta for a job opportunity. My wife is an expert in brain injury, so she runs, uh, still even retired, runs a free clinic for people with brain and spinal injuries, uh, and underinsured. And we, we moved back south because that's where both our families were, and Shepherd Center hired me in 1987, and I started their advocacy program and ran it for 32 years. Susan started the brain injury program and ran it for 25 years. And in 2019, we both retired and moved from Atlanta up here in South Carolina to be near, you know, our daughter and her husband and their— Hudson, that's his name. And so Shepherd was a good place. It's 49 years old. It'll be— to be 50 years old next year. And as some people that are listening might be aware of, it was started by an individual with a spinal cord injury and his family in the community in Atlanta, and it has evolved now to the largest rehab for people with brain and spinal injuries in the world.

Wow. So much you have done, and we're going to talk about what you're doing now, the great advocate that you are. And you know, if you go to Google Mark Johnson, especially if you put it Mark Johnson ADEPT, you can read so much about him, or Mark Johnson Shepherd Center, you can read so much about him. But right now, you know what you can do? This show is on demand on almost every social media platform, like Subscribe, like, Spotify, like voiceamerica.com, and you can share this with anyone you know tomorrow or the next day. Look for it because I'm going to be putting it out there, uh, for everyone to hear. But right now we're going to go to break. If you just joined us, we are talking to Mark Johnson, disability rights advocate and leader, historic in our community. This is Joyce Bender, America's Voice, where disability matters, at voiceamerica.com. Don't go away, we'll be right back with Mark.

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You're listening to Disability Matters. If you have a question or comment, call in toll-free at 1-866-472-5788. That's 1-866-472-5788. Now please welcome back the host of Disability Matters. Here's Joyce Bender.

Hi, everyone. Welcome back to the show. Who we're talking to, Marc Johnson, disability rights advocate and leader prominent in the history of the disability rights community. Well, Marc, you know, in 1999, I received the President's Award at the White House from President Clinton, which was the highest honor given to a Person Furthering the Employment of People with Disabilities. And I remember meeting different people from ADAPT. They were very nice to me, but, you know, ADAPT, if you had a problem in the disability rights community, egregious, you went to ADAPT. So, um, you were the, you were one of the founders of ADAPT. And the attendance program. So could you tell us, tell us about the founding of ADAPT, uh, great history, and why, how it came to be?

Um, well, you know, as I moved to obviously to Denver after getting married and, um, you know, went to work like I said at the Independent Living Center, and I met Wade Blank, and then And we, 504, a lot of people, actually Richard Nixon signed the Rehabilitation Act 51 years ago almost. And then Carter came in and obviously people know it took 4 years to get the regulations signed. It took protests in every region of the country with the long sit-in in San Francisco. Regional office, you know, led by, you know, a very cross-section of people. We, you know, historians don't do a good job of recognizing all the people. Sometimes it's easier for them to just only think of a handful. And when I say that, when I think about the historic picture of of Bush Senior signing ADA, you know, they did not know Justin's story or Evan's story or the gentleman born with no arms that hands the President the pen with his foot. And it was easy to say, "Well, they are all white people." And you go, "Yeah." But It's important to know that Evan Mustardisley was the commissioner of EEOC, and Justin, as you alluded to earlier, met Yoshiko in Japan. And if I understand it right, it was Dart Industries, which is Tupperware, and they met and came back. And Justin was not your average Republican, or not your Republican of today. He was definitely, you know,— you know, think about issues. In fact, you talked about how quick we forget it. I think it would be really great if people like you that have a big audience like you do get his manifesto back out there. You know, he's using— you know, he was using the word empowerment before hardly anybody was using it. You know, he was talking about the kind of society, you know, he may not have used the word intersectionality or ableism, or he may not have used the word justice, or he may not even use the word equity, but he clearly is talking about those same principles that regardless of who you are and what difference you're born with or acquire, You still have opportunities in this country. So what we found when Reagan came in, you know, APTA, American Public Transit Association, sued the Secretary of Transportation Skinner, and they won. And so the federal mandate to put lifts on buses in the late '70s went away. When Ronald Reagan got elected, and it became a local option. And so most states or individual transit districts went back to doing what they thought was best, a little bit of paratransit here, you know, door-to-door, a little bit door-to-door there. Um, and so Denver said, no, you're putting lifts on buses, that means all buses, not just the local ones, but the express ones that come from the suburbs. And we won that battle, and people started calling Atlantis and HAAL, Holistic Approaches to Independent Living, where I worked, and saying, "How'd y'all do it?" And we said, "You've got to use all the tools in the toolkit." That means you testify, you tell your story, you write, You do interviews. You show up. You really show up. You're present. But at some point, you may actually have to protest. And so, we looked around, did all this analysis, and said, "Well, American Public Transit Association was coming to Denver, Colorado in 1983." And that was our first protest. At that time, Bob Dole's wife, Elizabeth Dole was the Secretary of Transportation, and she was keynote speaker. Also, Mayor Andrew Young from Atlanta was there as a keynote speaker. Well, Mayor Young came out and spoke with us about why we were outside, why we weren't inside. And ultimately, we were allowed to go in and do a presentation about we felt like every new bus needed a lift. And it just grew from there, Joyce. It never had a staff or a board. It has a board that collects money for a fun run and a legal fund. Um, it does have a building. You're not really going to find ADAPT in the phone book. I mean, now with internet, you can find it on the internet, but ADAPT is just a group of people who are very passionate about a specific issue, like now, a civil right to community living. And they get together a couple times a year nationally. And locally, they do whatever locally they need to do. And it just grew. And so, you're coming up on 41 years ago, this October will be the 41st anniversary. Of ADAPT. And that style of organizing then got used by a group called Concrete Change. Like, why not make every new house have a no-step entrance, etc.? Then that style played out with a group that's still around called Not Dead Yet, because they could see what Oregon did and other states were trying to do to make assisted suicide easier for guess who? Us. Because there's nothing cheaper than abuse and neglect. There's nothing cheaper than, than, you know, uh, terminating our lives. And people— I know people might find this alarming, but, you know, as you mentioned, and, you know, and other people have mentioned over the shows, is there's billions of us, you know, there's a lot of us., and we all have family members. And, you know, we use the minority mindset to get our rights, but now we really are about disability justice and equity. And I think now it's important to embrace what these young folks, you know, the 19 crowd to the 45-year-old crowd, are doing great work. You know, Dom Kelly with New Disabled South, or the folks with, uh, rampd.org, where artists have come together, or where documentarians have come together. Jim LeBrecht, who did Crip Camp, has come together with Day and some other folks and created, you know, fwd.doc.org, which is people in front, behind the camera that are disabled. So you're seeing a whole different youth-led, diverse style of organizing. But when it's all said and done, direct action still works.

Well, you know what, Mark? You know what? My question to you is, is ADAPT still growing today?

That's a good question. I mean, I think a little over 5 years ago, there was an incident in D.C. Around one of the more active members of ADAPT, and he stepped in it. You know, he— you know, when you start comparing, when you start playing, what do you call it, oppression Olympics, meaning, well, I— they do this to me, well, I— they do this to me, or I'm more discriminated against than you, you get in trouble. And back then there was a very hot issue around immigration. And the gentleman said, you know, "I think we're more important than immigrants." And wasn't a smart thing to say. And ultimately ADAPT had a divorce. Some people said, "I forgive you, let's move on." Some people said, "I'm burned out, don't want to be involved anymore." And another group said, "Let's focus on the work." So those of us who are still focused on work are trying to get the Latonya Reeds Freedom Act passed. It's the same bill, it's a Disability Integration Act, um, and got 221— I know your audience is around the world, but all of them understand, you know, you get an idea and it turns it— if you need a bill, and then you got to go find a sponsor, then you got to find co-sponsors, and you may or may not have the House and the Senate, but you have some government structure that ultimately is going to have to, uh, certify things. And so I personally think this month of September is our last shot this year to get a civil right to community living. So to answer your question, yes, ADAPTers are alive and well. Do we operate in a unified manner like we did before? Unfortunately not. Are people beginning to get back focusing on what brings us together, the issues? Yeah. And, you know, I got fond memories in there. In fact, your point, and there's an ADAPT virtual museum that Stephanie Thomas out of Austin does with the University of Texas at Arlington. And you mentioned earlier You know, the rich history we have is starting to emerge and find its way on Netflix or specials or plays or poems or musicals. And as our culture begins to become more public to people, more and more people begin to identify as disabled.

Well, I'll tell you what. Yeah, I, I hope that ADAPT gets together again and strong again because we need them, especially now. We need them. And with that, it's time for our news break with our anchor, Perry Jude Radisic. Perry, are you with us today?

Joyce, I am. Thanks for having me.

Of course.

So Joyce, today I want to talk about some public comments that are due on a proposed rule from the Federal Emergency Management Agency. So it's important that your listeners hear this show, check out our link at disabilityrightsPA.org, and submit their comments before the close of business today. So FEMA, the Federal Emergency Management Agency, announced a proposed rule in July to revamp its public assistance program. And what they're trying to do is streamline the education— I'm sorry, the application process and expedite aid delivery to local communities that have been impacted by natural disasters. So, the pre— governors declare states of disasters. The president uses that information to declare a federal disaster area. And then the president outlines the kinds of programs that are authorized under that declaration for use in that disaster. So, one of those programs is called a public assistance program.. And what that does is it helps local communities with things like emergency evacuations, sheltering, debris removal, and it also provides financial assistance and reimbursement to organizations for their disaster support work. So, there are two changes here that we are supporting. One is they're going to add disability to the list of protected classes from discrimination when local communities are providing assistance. Yes, these local communities already have to not discriminate, but it's nice to have it in another proposed rule or in a federal rule. Also, the disability and aging organizations currently are not automatically eligible as private nonprofits for reimbursement of their disaster services. So that— what that means is like if a Center for Independent Living is helping evacuate people or helping provide sheltering or doing some other work related to disasters, it's a much longer and more difficult process to get reimbursed for that service that they're providing to the community. So this change, by putting Organizations like the Centers for Independent Living into the rule would make it easier and more quickly reimburse places like the Centers for Independent Living or other disability and aging nonprofits to be reimbursed. We know advocacy matters. We're thankful the Partnership for Inclusive Disaster Strategies is coordinating this effort to get public comment in by the close of business today on this rule. Uh, we really want folks to add their experience or knowledge to this effort and provide public comment on this. So you can find a template for what your comment should actually look like and links on how to submit your public comment at disabilityrightspa.org. If you click on today's Advocacy Matters segment, which is about halfway down the homepage for us, you'll find a link to the proposed rule, a link to submit your public comment, and the template. It's— the template is not even a link. I've embedded it from the Partnership for Inclusive Disaster Strategies into today's segment, so it's much easier for your listeners to review and find and then be able to to submit that public comment. So Joyce, fingers crossed that we all get our information in on this really important public rule change by the close of business today.

All right, everyone, you heard it. When you hang up, you gotta get on there and do it. What do I always say? I say, if you want change, take action. Perry, thank you so much for that news. Thank you for always keeping us up to date.

Absolutely, look forward to next week.

All righty, um, okay, okay, uh, Mark, we are the only place for 21 years that weekly tells the news nationally of what's going on because we don't have CNN, so we have Disability Matters, but it's so important to our listeners. You already talked about, uh, the Shepherd Center, but I wanted to talk to you about our close friend, my close friend and yours, Judy Heumann. Of course, when she passed away, it was shocking, but it was also terribly, terribly sad, thinking of everything she's done for us and would continue doing for us. I remember there was a flurry of activity not long after she died, uh, with you and other people. So I wanted to ask you, what impact did her life and death have on the origins of this massive undertaking that you are leading, the Disability Rights Museum Group?

Um, so, so just your, uh, your previous— it was Perry, right? Um, Perry, I think the— yeah, um, the, um, you know, that, that importance of storytelling. Um, I mean, you don't have to be a lobbyist or a politician, but, you know, a colleague of ours, Lex Frieden, you know, has been flooded twice. And one time the water came up to almost his waist in his power wheelchair. And I think, you know, when I think the incidence of climate change and, you know, unfortunately, I understand the partnership, Herman leadership and Shalon's leadership and whatnot, are focused a lot on preparing and responding to disasters, but collectively around the world now, you know, people are coming together to address the root of the issue. I mean, you look at what's going on in Sudan now and places like that. It's unimaginable what war and the climate change are doing to disabled people because When you go, well, just move, look at what happened to Katrina, or look what happened to other places. The, the most vulnerable, the people with the least resources, get left behind. So, yep, you're, you're— yeah, you— yep. And your point's well taken from the standpoint of— I mean, you— one thing about Joyce Bender, people, that you need to know is she's always going to be there, and her team is going to always support you. You may not always see her at things or hear from her about things, but you know she's going to be there. From electoral politics to the radio show to economic justice to whatever, you know you can count on her. I knew back in 1998 that I could count on Joyce Bender and her team to mobilize around the 10th anniversary of ADA, and that became the Spirit of ADA Torch Relay, 24 cities in 2 months. And then, you know, again, you could count on in 2012 and go, we're planning the 25th anniversary of ADA. And it wasn't, are you going to be involved? She would just immediately have ideas. And have you talked to this and have you talked to that. And so I, I like to do— I like to think big. It's not always— doesn't all— everything I do doesn't always work, but if you don't try, you, you fail by not trying. And so when Judy passed away, Katherine Ott, who worked for the Smithsonian, was asked by some of the folks that worked for Judy to convene a, a call to talk about what happens to people's stories when they die. Now Judy had already written two couple books, she was in a movie, she was working on a movie, um, she was known around the world through her World Bank stuff and State Department stuff. Um, I considered her a friend. Um, and of course, when we all showed up— I didn't physically show up, but when people showed up to the services and overwhelmed her synagogue, and, and, and the online stuff, people said, 'Well, I thought I was your best friend.' And it turned out, yeah, I was the best friend. Brothers and sisters. So, so the call happened, and, uh, what's his name, Eric Jacobson, I think was— he passed away. He started a Google group called the Disability History Museum, so anybody can join. It was way up in the 300s, just dropped down about 270, and it's historians and professors and academia and activists and service providers, and people who just feel like our story, you know, the Capitol Crawl has value. The protest the day after the Capitol Crawl in the U.S. Capitol, not many people know about. The sit-ins that we talked about earlier are very much part of our history. And so the call step happened every month.. And Katherine Ott would facilitate them, and she ultimately brought in other people to help. And it went from like 19 people, like I say, over 300. And any— you'd have 50 or 60 or so people on the call. And it turns out that there are a lot of what people call repositories. So when Joyce Bender goes off to her next chapter Um, I guarantee some university, if not already, will want her papers. Um, it's same thing, you know, you've got up there in Pennsylvania a rich history with the Thornbergs, you know, Dick and Jenny, and Dick being the Attorney General, and then with Jenny doing her interfaith work. And, you know, those are stories that are— don't get told much if we don't preserve them. And so, a lot of the ADL Legacy Project that came out of 2015 was about connecting people. You know, once again, your previous presenter talked about ADRCs, or Aging Disability Resource Centers. Well, it used to be aging, it used to be disability, now together, but they're not quite together. And it's still pretty much driven by the aging system structurally and financially. So, we're moving in this direction of hopefully someday a single point of entry functionally-based system. And with all that comes a story. You know, the Rehab Act— I mean, excuse me, Architectural Barriers Act, '68. You know, next year, In, I think it is November, is the 50th anniversary of IDEA. So the stories evolve. There is a group working on a virtual library. There is a group working on what do we do with the content that was in the Buffalo, New York brick-and-mortar museum. Fiskardi in New York City area has all those exhibits and they are looking I actually have some ideas about where that would go. And that, that conversation then led in, hey Mark, weren't you involved in the Relay? And weren't you involved in Road to Freedom with Jim Ward? And weren't you involved with Tom Olin? And I said, yeah. And I said, I don't— I'd be an advisor. So if your audience goes to thedisabilitycaravan.com, the disabilitycaravan.com, they'll see pictures of all the places we've been, news stories. And as you're aware, you were, I think, at the stop in Pittsburgh recently.

Oh, I loved it. Yes, I was. I saw that van, uh, and got a photo and bought shirts. I loved it. Where, where all have you been, Mark?

Well, we started in, um, at Mission Beach, San Diego, and, um, on April 1st. And we've been to almost every state. We didn't go to either the Dakotas. Um, I don't think we got over to Arizona. We drove through Arizona to get it there. Um, you know, we didn't get to New Mexico. Um, but basically every state somewhere. Like, like for example, um, you know, a lot in San Francisco, including the federal building where the sit-ins happened.

Yeah, yeah, that was good.

Spokane, we went out to Idaho, the Indian Reservation, um, Native American Indian Reservation. We were over in Missoula, uh, Helena. We were over in Salt Lake, and we were down over in Colorado Springs where the School for the Deaf and the Blind just turned 150 years old. Um, we were down in Denver, you know, where was the— where Atlantis got created. And, you know, the stories of, of the Gang of 19. I mean, it's a great documentary if people haven't seen it, but, you know, you just Google the Gang, G-A-N-G, of 19, and the Denver Public Library did a really good documentary about, you know, the founding of Atlantis and the founding of ADAPT. And so it's following a similar route. I went across the Pettus Bridge in Selma, went over to Warm Springs, the Little White House, you know, where FDR hung out. Right now it's at the In Baltimore, at the National Federation of the Blind headquarters, Anil Lewis and some of the other staff there are hosting it. It's been in places like Edgewater, Florida, where the mayor is 20 years old and he declared basically Disability Freedom and Justice Caravan Day. So it's been We are allowing the local communities, you know, when we come to Philly or go to Boston, the 50th anniversary of the Boston Center for Independent Living, you know, going up to Carol Tonks' territory up there in Trenton, New Jersey, a lot of focus on the vote, which I know is something you've been very about. We were actually part of the Democratic Convention. We offered our services and information to both parties, but the Democrats were the only one that allowed the driver who was part of a team that— oh, you were there.

Yeah, it is magnificent. And can they follow that on a website to know where it's going, Mark? How can people know where— how can people know where it's going next?

Great question. TheDisabilityCaravan.com, you can go across the top and hit route, and you'll see Wilmington coming up, uh, Delaware. You'll, you'll see Providence Road, uh, Providence coming up, um, you know, so you'll, you'll even see, uh, Vermont. Uh, we hope to stop by Ben Jerry's ice creams and I have to give a plug there. They used to do the Peace Pop. So when you bought a Peace Pop from Ben Jerry's, a percentage of the sales of the Peace Pop went to Peace and Justice. So I want to pitch to them the Barrier Buster Bar and, and have them create a new Ben Jerry's flavor, uh, you know, Barrier Buster Bar, and have a percent go to people and entities doing the work. So you can follow it on that website. Like, say, the photos were a little slow getting the photos up, but they're getting up. And then we have 5 more weeks, and it ends in Rochester, New York. You know, Frederick Douglass did a great speech many moons ago. He refused to speak on July 4th, but He said it's important to celebrate the Fourth. He says, "I'll speak on the Fifth, and I'll talk about what we still need to do." And as you're aware, we still have a lot to do.

Yes, I read that, because I have his book, biography. That is very powerful. Hey, you know, it's time for a very quick update on what's going on at Bender. Hey, Gerald, are you with us?

I'm here.

Hi, Gerald.

Hi, Joyce. Hi, Mark. Thank you for everything you've done with ADAPT and all you're continuing to do for the rights of people with disabilities and for the legacy of those rights that you and so many others have fought so hard for. So I just want to start by saying thank you for all of that.

Thank you.

Well, thank you. I'm sorry, go ahead, Gerald.

For the news today, I have exciting news, and that is opportunity. That is what the news is— the opportunity to work right here on our team at Bender Consulting Services. That's right, we have opportunities to work in our talent acquisition team, both in part-time and full-time work, supporting the work of competitive employment for people with disabilities. So if you are in the Pittsburgh region and you are looking to work in talent acquisition and to make a difference in the world of competitive employment, if you've been listening to this show and you're like, man, I wish I could work for Joyce Bender I'll tell you from someone who has for 17 years, yes, you do wish you could work for Joyce Bender. Um, you can apply today by emailing your resume to me at ghomme@benderconsult.com and telling me you're interested in working for my team on the talent acquisition team for both full-time and part-time roles on this crusade that Joyce has started. So apply today. Thanks, Joyce Bender.

Lead on. Thank you, Gerald. Hey everyone, send that resume. We're looking for people to help us fight the fight to gain employment for people with disabilities. Thank you so much, Gerald. Mark, before we end the show today, I wanted to give you the opportunity to talk about the vote and how important it is to our listeners that they vote. Um, so what is your message for them?

Well, I think first of all, I acknowledge, uh, Maria Town at the American Association of People with Disabilities and her team, Alexia and others, uh, that are working on the Rev Up campaign, something that Helena Berger, her predecessor, got going when, when APD was going through transition. Once again, guess who's in the middle of that? Joyce Bender, Tony Coelho, and other folks. So, the shift has occurred, and people are doing more than just registering folks and telling them what their rights are as a voter. The shift is now calling offices and saying, "Who's working on these issues in your campaign? Would you like to meet and talk about them? Would you attend a forum? Would you fill out a survey?" Survey, and then we're going to publish the results. So Rev Up has actually been showing up, their volunteers have been showing up at some of the stops and passing out Rev Up materials. And so we don't have a disability vote yet. People keep saying that. I don't— we don't. We don't. Right now, you can't say the Black— you can say the Black vote does this, you can say 'White women in the suburbs vote this way.' You really can't— even though Rutgers University is doing some great research around the 'this way vote,' we don't have one yet because we haven't proven that we vote in any way differently than like the regular public, half and half. So we have an opportunity this year, November, to show there is a Desiluay vote. There are at least 10 or 12, more like 12 Senate races that are within 3 points. There are at least 25 House seats, um, or within 3 points. And if we can just target certain districts and going get out the vote, an educated vote, then we can actually then begin— if you think about the Democratic Convention, we were present. There were 800 reasonable accommodation requests. There are 120 scooters loaned out every day. There were 60 manual chairs loaned out every day. It was the most accessible convention the Democrats have ever put on. They made mistakes, but Robin Jones and Sandy Hannerick were going to make sure They didn't. And so, so, but we were underrepresented. You know, Senator Duckworth was there but didn't talk about the issues. We met Gus, you know, the, the vice president, soon-to-be vice president's son, but we didn't hear anything about disability issues. We, you know, there were a number of opportunities. There was Tyler on the video, but we were grossly underrepresented. Senate. And that's where we as voters must take ourselves— I personally think we need to take ourselves more serious in going, you know, you can't take us for granted, either party or any parties. And so the vote is incredibly important. It may be— this election may be, for me, the most important in my lifetime. And so next week or within the next week and a half, as you're aware, the ABD's REV UP's Disability Vote Week starts. And it's an opportunity to focus. I mean, every day we do this work, but it's an opportunity to focus on, to me, getting our issues out so that when the average John and Jane Doe go they go, "Oh, wonder how they feel about right to community living or fully implementing the ADA," which is 34 years old. So, I appreciate you teeing it up like you do so well. I think it's our next frontier in so many ways is actually being able to, for for the pundits and whatnot to track the disability vote. A real important— and I'll wrap up because I know you're near the end of the hour— was I'd encourage your listeners to listen to Jesse Jackson's speech in 1988 at the Democratic Convention in Atlanta. And it's about an hour and a half long, meaning the introduction of his speech. And he speaks about, you people in wheelchairs down there, I know it was more difficult for you to get here. Well, that's because there was going to be a protest to disrupt the convention on, on live on TV. And Jesse was saying, do what you got to do. And Paul Kirk, the chair, caved, and the next day they said access would be a criteria for the reflection of future cities. So we've come a long way, we'll get there, and we're getting there. And young folks, diverse leaders— and I'm not just talking about color, I'm talking about life experience, um, you know, all types of different disabilities, you know, getting ourselves together. I mean, I see your show and, and, you know Bear Free Futures and other shows coming together and acting in unison and something. But to my knowledge, you are the only show, weekly show, that actually is more of a news format. So thanks for doing what you've done for 21 years.

Thank you, Mark. Lead on, keep up the great work you are doing. Um, and with that, before we end the show, we always end the show with a quote. Today, that quote really ties into everything Mark is saying. It's Toni Cullow who said, "When you get a chance to take the podium, speak up." Believe me, I speak up. This is Joyce Bender, America's Voice, where disability matters at Voice America. America.com. And in the words of Mary Brooker, remember, when you go out today, choose joy. Talk to you all next week.

Voice America would like to thank you for tuning in. Please join us next Tuesday at 11 AM Pacific time and 2 PM Eastern time for another installment of Disability Matters right here on the Voice America Variety Channel. We are the leader in live internet talk radio. VoiceAmerica.com.