Mental Fitness, Burnout Recovery & The Mindset Shift That Reduces Stress | #184

Well, what if I just got up 10 minutes earlier and just read positive content first thing in the morning? Just 10 minutes of positive mental nutrition. For me, the definition of mental fitness is anything that you do to train your mind to work for you instead of against you.

It feels very much like pampering yourself, but it's work. You're exercising deeply every organ of yours.

If we think of any professional athlete, They're going as hard as they can, but they're also recovering. And most of us, and it's like we're doing a high-intensity workout for our minds and with zero recovery and then wondering why our minds seem like they're exploding. Before you start injecting email, news, social, like all that stuff, answer this question when your mind's clear. What am I pretending not to know?

Hello everybody. Welcome back to the Dr. Joy Kong podcast. I'm so happy to be back here with an exceptional guest. To help you to live a better life. Because why are we here anyhow? To really learn and enjoy, right? So how can we best enjoy our lives? And who are under stress? And I am one of them sometimes, you know, wondering when is it going to stop? And how can I recuperate and become the best version of myself? So today, I have an expert with us, uh, Mark Champagne, who is a mental fitness strategist. So that sounds just lovely. Um, Mark, thank you so much for being here.

The pleasure is mine, Joy. It's so great to be here. Thank you for the invitation. And yeah, I mean, who, who isn't operating with some level of stress? Me, me and you both, right?

So I want to introduce you just a little bit so people know who you are. You are the best-selling author of the book Personal Socrates and the host of top-ranked podcast Behind the Human, where he has spent the decade interviewing and studying high performers, longevity leaders, and world-class thinkers on the practices that keep their minds clear under pressure. So he has been drawing from a background in business strategy and has worked with Fortune 500 companies like Google, LinkedIn, and Mark helped individuals and organizations build intentional mental fitness practices that improves clarity, resilience, and decision-making. So his work increasingly bridges the worlds of longevity and mental performance, exploring how stress, overwhelm, purpose, and mindset shape not only how long we live, but how well we live. So, thank you, Mark. I can't wait to dive into this because I myself would love to get some tips on how— what do we do? I mean, we are— life is not easy. I mean, that's like an age-old adage, right? You know, being alive is not easy anywhere in the world for as long as we know, seems like. So, stress is part of life, but modern life has more stress than what we had in the past, right? Would you, would you agree?

Well, I, I think, I think we have different stress because, and the only reason I say that is because, uh, for, I'm, I've been working on my second book and a lot of that, uh, has been around interviewing and, and studying a lot of the ancient teachers from the past, whether they are indigenous elders, uh, still philosophers, samurai, um, you know, uh, Buddhists, uh, a whole bit— like, really, Lao Tzu as an example, Maya Angelou, a whole host of different people, and trying to understand, you know, as they were navigating their lives, like, how did they reduce some of the, the stress and live with a little bit more grace and ease before everyone knew of them with their, their teachings? Because like all of us. I mean, uh, at one point, I mean, someone like a Yogananda, who is really well known as The Autobiography of a Yogi, I mean, before writing that book, you know, he was in India teaching to 15 people and wondering, how do I get this out to more people? As an example. So, you know, but we forget about those things. So I say it's, it's, it's different because definitely modern day, I mean, I think we have more content and a lot more entering into our mind, uh, which, which is very stressful. Um, but then, you know, there are, there are examples where, you know, you have giant wars and famines and all these different things that were also happening. So it's just like we all have to deal with things.

Yeah.

And, and a lot of the practices, ironically, that, that I, I call mental fitness, and even that we use today, like breathing or meditation, journaling, That stuff literally has been around since the beginning of time, like in, in those eras. So it's, it's not like this stuff is new. I think what's shifting, especially for our modern lives, is we can't just, we can't just do nothing for our minds. Like, we can't just let them run wild and on default mode because then that leads to us becoming mental health statistics. And I don't wish that upon any of us. Um, but I just unfortunately know the data that's out there, and if we do nothing, that is actually what, uh, what happens. So we have to do something. Like, that's where we have to start shifting.

Yeah. And when did you even become passionate about mental fitness?

Well, it, it's interesting because, I mean, I, I wasn't calling it this, but when I, when I started in the corporate world, I had my original, uh, role, I was in sales, and I remember thinking Okay, we're all being trained in the same way. You know, we all have these products and, you know, the same tools and so forth. And because it was a sales function, you know, there are incentive plans and bonus plans. And if you were the best in the country, you know, there are trips that were linked to it. So obviously, you know, the incentive is to be the best. But then I'm thinking, okay, but we're all being trained in the exact same way. So for whatever reason, the thought came came to, came to my mind around, well, what if I just got up 10 minutes earlier and just read positive content first thing in the morning? And so I started doing that, and nothing crazy, like not an hour before. I wasn't running around the block, jumping in cold plunge or anything like that. All great things, of course, but just 10 minutes of positive mental nutrition is what I call it now. And quickly started to realize that No, no matter who I was studying, if I was reading about Oprah or Steve Jobs or Tony Robbins, all of these people were asking themselves powerful reflective questions personally and professionally. And they were using those questions to help guide their decisions in their lives and so forth. So I would write down the question, grab a notebook, and then journal using whatever that question was in relation to where my life was at. And did that for well over a decade. And I mean, I went through different roles, and I did win this sales trip that year, and, you know, then I started working on these massive brands and, and product management and so forth, but always had that consistent practice early in the morning. And it just allowed for, at least for me, to start the day kind of on my own terms and with a clear mind and a mind that was a little bit more focused, because I started to notice that with my friends and colleagues that, because we're doing, you know, same roles, but not that I was immune to stress. Like, of course there were some long days and things got intense, but it wasn't the norm. I think that was the thing that was standing out. And the only difference I could see was I had this practice in the morning that I don't think they were doing. And that was, that was the, that was the deciding factor.

So you were just pulling up different books, or you just found online positive things?

Yeah, there was books. Like, at that time it was pre-podcast, so I mean blogs, Success Magazine, and then, you know, I'd get into biographies and so forth. And what that all led to, like, the whole— the, the, the, the, the jump-off point was, okay, there was enough practice with, with these tools that— and then, and validation that really everyone that we were reading about, they're doing something like this. Um, at that time, there was nothing that existed in the market that would help guide you in, because essentially my practice, the primary one, primary one was journaling with good questions. And there was nothing that existed like the meditation apps at the time, Calm and Headspace, where they would guide you into a practice using content. So there was nothing for journaling, and that, that was the kind of the aha moment or the gap in the market, at least for me, that's like, well, what if we created something that would guide people into a practice like this? And then that's when I left the direct corporate space, started Kio, which is the Japanese word for today. And we were trying to bring moments of intention and calm to people's mind on a daily basis. And it, it was pretty wild. We reached almost 90 million people in the first couple years with that product, and that, that's what kind of catapulted me into, okay, I'm doing— this is the work that I'm meant to do. And there's a bit of a but to that story, but, um, it, it started like most entrepreneurs, as you— as I know you can relate. Um, but that launch, you know, that, that then started this podcast, the Behind the Human podcast, that started the books, that started the work with companies directly in the mental fitness space.

I see. Yeah. So everything started with that 10-minute journaling, basically.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And, um, and what, uh, what other strategies did you develop along the way?

Well, I mean, especially of, of late, like the, the ones that work really well come back to— I mean, the majority of my corporate career was in building strategies for, for companies and brands. And all of us running companies or working for a company are usually operating off of some kind of strategy, right? It's not like the product or the company is just saying, hey, let's see what happens this month. No, there's, you know, there's a direction and then there are tactics and things that we need to do to support that vision and that strategy. And we're really good at that from a business perspective. But I started to notice that where we're really not the greatest is we don't do the same thing for our minds. And our minds are the things that actually execute on the business strategy. And that's been my focus the last while is because what happens, Joy, like I'll speak or I'll be within a company offsite or something and people come up and say, yeah, meditation is great for me, but I try it, then it falls off and I need to restart or yoga's my thing. And it's always the same story. Like, people start and they stop, they fall off. And what I've noticed that works a little bit better— I mean, it's not the end-all be-all, but it's def— I've seen the results here— is that if we could just take a look at what we're focusing on over the next 90 days professionally, whether you run your own company or you're working for someone else, like, you have things that you know you want to be focused on. And take those things and then ask the next set of questions around, okay, for the next 90 days, for me to be at my best self and to feel great, to feel energized, not depleted, what does my mind need over the next 90 days? Right? Because no one says, no one says, yeah, you know what, the next 90 days I want to show up scattered and stressed the whole time. Like, of course not. But most people, that's how they're checking in. So what's the reverse of that? You know, if you want to feel energized and want to feel well well-rested, well then, okay, well, what are, what are the, what are the, the, the levers that we can pull for the— not me, but for you personally, right? I mean, sleep obviously is a big one for really anyone, but, you know, sleep. Or for me, obviously my practice is journaling, and I like breathwork is a big one for me, but that's not for everyone. So, uh, you find your, you know, the things that work for you. And questions like You know, when is my mind most still? Or when does it, when does my mind feel like I'm coming up with ideas or I feel motivated? Like, what are those practices that support that? And then you take that and you link it to what you're trying to achieve professionally. And then now that, now the plans are, are one, right? And it gives us the opportunity to, I'm just going to test some things out for a quarter. Or for 90 days. And then just like we do in our businesses, you get to the end of that period and then you do a bit of a review, like what worked, what didn't, what do I want to adjust, versus, yeah, you know, saying things like I'm going to meditate from now until the end of eternity. It sounds great, but we just don't— we're not consistent with that. So the plan, the plan for your mind is key.

Okay, so you're breaking these things down in a manageable portions of time. You don't have to tell yourself this is forever, but let's do this and see what happens.

Yeah, totally. That's, that's well, and linked to like, okay. Yeah. And if you've already identified what's in the other areas of your life that are important, you're working towards now, you're, you're just setting yourself up to, to give yourself the best chance of succeeding on the things you already said that are important. Right. It's no different than, um, you know, like if you're training for a marathon or something like that, you know, there's obviously a physical training, there's nutrition, but like what else? Right? Like, is it sleep? Is it this? Like what other practices? And you can do the same thing in our professional lives. It's just, we don't, we don't often give ourselves the time and space to just even take 10 or 15 minutes to come up with a plan. It doesn't take that long, but then, you know, we're recording this on a, on a Friday. I always take 20 to 30 minutes every week around midday on a Friday to see, okay, what happened this week? What's coming up next week? Obviously there's some things I have to do. If there's podcasts or company engagements, there's those kind of natural tasks. But then when I, when you zoom out and look at, okay, here's what's coming up, like maybe I have a big strategy session of some sort that I have to do work for. Well, where does— where are my practice, my mental fitness practices there? Can I do 3 minutes of breathing prior to jumping into that? Or if I'm, you know, I have to go into a stage for some reason in front of hundreds of people, like, what will— what will drop me into a flow state? Like, that's where it just takes minutes. But now when, when, when next week comes, I'm not thinking about that stuff. It's already in the plan. That's the key, is being proactive. Because if we do nothing, again, life is just going to come and take over all the time, right? And we're going to get hit with distraction and we're going to be pulled off. And then that's when we start feeling like, I can't get ahead, or I have no energy left by the end of the day, I'm exhausted. Like, it doesn't have to be like that.

Yeah, I'm just thinking about strategies for myself. You know, I mentioned recent high stress. Um, yeah, one part is white knuckling. It's almost like a fortitude, right? It's like Holy shit, this is bad. This is unpleasant. But it may be something that's necessary to move on to a better place. Sometimes, yes, change is necessary. Otherwise, you're just going to be stuck in the same place. So, but then the transition period could be really tough. It seems like your world is upside down and it can be chaotic and uncertain, right? People are afraid of uncertainty. Thank God I'm actually somebody that you know, really thrives in uncertainty. That's why I came to this country. I decided I know nothing about how to survive in America, but I'm just gonna go. So I'm that kind of person. But even for me, that it's uncomfortable, right? It's uncomfortable. So part of it's white-knuckling, and part of it, I think, for me, is a belief that it's all gonna be good. I'm gonna— I'm doing such incredible work for the world. I'm bringing Wonderful thing. So I have guardians around me to make sure I come through because I'm here for the good of the world. And then, right, find what might help, might relieve stress. So for some people, it may be taking a walk, half an hour walk, enjoy the sunlight and just let it percolate through. When you're walking with the rhythm and with the air and the natural just infusion of energy into your body, sometimes things become more clear. Hello, my loyal listeners. I want to interrupt this podcast for just a second because I want to let you know that if you're looking to help solve a major health issue or you're looking for health optimization and just for longevity purposes, you can find us at Chara Health. We are considered the leader in the regenerative medicine and longevity space. And we utilize modalities like stem cell therapy, peptide therapy, plasmapheresis, ozone treatments, laser therapy, all to create a beautiful symphony to get you to where you want to be. You can find us at www.chara-health.com. That's C-H-A-R-A. For sure.

Even 10, like the walk is so, so key. Even, even just taking 10 minutes after lunch. Right. You have your lunch, you know, this in your work, like just moving the body. Now you're going to, you know, you're going to blunt your glucose spike and all that kind of stuff from eating. But I mean, in general, I mean, you're going to help with that digestion and all of that to your point and getting some sunlight. But then when it comes to the mind, you know, you can reset the mind for the, the back half of the day versus what's the alternative. Take the 10 minutes and just hammer out emails. Right? Like, that's what most people do. So it's, it, it's just, it, it— and that feels productive, but in the long run, it, like, it, it just clogs up the mind, right? Like, that's the key, is that we, we just, we try to— we push, we push, we put so much in, right? And we never take the time to recover and clear out. And it doesn't have to be these hour-long sessions. Like, that's what I mean. It can be just a 10-minute walk or some breathing to reset. And even just knowing Yeah, go ahead.

Yeah, another, because I'm guilty of it, of just pushing and pushing, pushing without refueling. It's like driving your car. You just drive, drive on empty and you just keep driving. But that's not the smartest thing to do. So, I think one quick hack I have is a trampoline, right? So, I have some, you know, high-energy music. You get to jump on it. It doesn't take very long until, you know, your system is shifted. Yeah. And I also have this thing, Shiftwave chair. Have you heard of it?

No.

Yeah. They have buttons along the chair that you lie in. And then, you get to hear instructions. Well, you know, meditative music and guiding meditations, teaching you how to breathe. And yeah. So, it takes you into a state. And, the the vibrations along your parasympathetic chain help to shift you into a different state. So that's another hack, but there, people should find their own hack.

Yeah.

That, that, that's the thing.

And that's why I call this stuff mental fitness because you can relate it back to physical fitness. You know, we know that, you know, exercise, physical exercise is generally good for us as, as humans, But if for some reason you don't like to run, it doesn't rule out all of exercise. There's a million different things you can do. So same thing with mental fitness. If you don't like to meditate, then don't meditate. You know, do something else. Like whatever. For me, the definition of mental fitness is anything that you do to train your mind to work for you instead of against you, which opens up a huge— it's everything essentially, right? So find what works for you. Right.

Yeah.

So first, and even with you, like, I know I want to ask you about your situation because I, I, we don't get into the detail of— I know this week was stressful and there was a lot going on, and it's a, but it's a perfect use case. Like, so there's, you were in it, obviously there was a bit of like, you've got to kind of push through and so forth, but then now that you're kind of somewhat on the other side of things, like where most people kind of just continue. And where the mental clutter starts to happen is they don't take a bit of time to release some of the emotion. And, and like everything that you took in, right? Like there was a lot. So is there something, a practice for you that, again, it doesn't have to be long, but even that you can do this weekend that just allows you to just mentally just let go of the experience?

Yeah, I think I have, um, shorter strategies and ones that it's going to take longer. So, the shorter one will be, yeah, my Shiftwave. So, I can meditate for whatever, 15 to 30 minutes, and then I get into my infrared sauna. So, when you are hot and sweating, it's hard to be— it's a little harder to stay stressed because you just physiologically, you just have to get into a whole different state. And then, with the—

Sauna is my happy place.

Is that right? Yeah.

Oh, yeah.

And then, with— so, I have red light panels in the sauna. So, I get into— I play meditative music and I just really kind of just go into a different place. Yeah. Yeah. And I remember there was one time I was really stressed, actually sad, deeply sad about something. And, I got into the sauna and it was so hot, I realized I couldn't be sad anymore. I was like, okay, this really works. That I just physiologically couldn't feel sad because it would try to focus on how hot it was.

Yeah. Yeah.

So, that's really good. But, for like a deep recharge, I, you know, I go to this spa. There's a natural hot spring spot in LA. So, I'll go and just do hot soak. And, it's so hot. And then, I go into a cold plunge, right, the And so that wakes you up. I do that 3 times and then I get a massage. So, that is, I think, deeply refreshing.

But that's, you know, you need that this week, this weekend for sure.

But I have a seminar going on, so I may not have time. So, I do my shorter ones. But that one is, it feels very much like pampering yourself, but it's work, right? You get into this.

Oh, yeah.

Well, these back and forth and back and forth, you're exercising deeply, like you deeply, right? Every organ of yours.

And just think like we, for some reason, this makes sense for if we think of any professional athlete, right? Like NBA, NHL, NFL, like it doesn't matter what, what league they're going as hard as they can during their game and their sport and their practices. But they're also recovering, right? Like, you know, there's more and more people that, that are speaking and sharing those practices, and historically it's been— no one really talked about that. But you, you can't perform at that level without proper recovery. And most of us, and for those of maybe that aren't like Olympic-level athletes physically, um, we're doing that with our minds daily. It's like we're— it's like we're doing a high-intensity workout for our minds for 12 or 14 hours a day and, and with zero recovery, and then wondering why our minds seem like they're exploding. I mean, they can only take so much, right? So it's just, I think it's just giving us ourselves the, the permission and not to judge ourselves, but just, yeah, you know what, today was a bit intense, or this week was intense in general. How can I recover? What, what does my mind need? What do I need to do again to show up? Because I just want people to wake up feeling great more days than not. That everything else follows from there.

Yeah. And I feel people do need to take care of their health. That if you don't have the right vitamins and minerals to nourish your brain, and you're— how are you gonna reduce the, the, you know, the, the clutter and the, the chaotic signals, right? You've got to Yeah. Give your body the right foundation. So, at least I try to eat very healthy and try to take some vitamins and peptides. Of course, I do stem cells when I can.

Sure.

To really get your body to a more reparative state, you know, higher ability to repair. So, I think that is really important.

Yeah.

Even so, I— what I I'm doing very poorly on is sleep. And I think I'm so driven and I just want to do more that I end up just keep going and going and go to bed late and still need to get up early because I have things to do. So, that's something I think sleep probably, you know, that's deeply restorative, right? Yeah.

Well, it's probably the number one pillar for— I mean, definitely for the mind and cleaning the mind while we sleep, but then just, it just makes everything else, if our sleep is off, duration plus quality, it makes everything else feel like you're kind of swimming upstream. Um, like we just make poor nutrition decisions, or to your point, you know, our minds are, are, are a little bit more up and down and so forth. And then eventually it leads to, you know, to disease. Yeah, as well. So, but you're— to your point around just health in general, I think like you can, you can— if, if we really just pause in, if we're honest with ourselves, you can see how this starts to spiral, right? Like stress gets higher, so then all of a sudden we turn to the crutches that we have, and, and maybe we'll, we'll pick easy foods and comfort type foods that are there, which are also not good for us. And it just, it continues to spiral, right? But this is where, when, when you're in a good place and you're, you're feeling inspired and motivated, that's when you want to map out your plan. It's like, do that for your nutrition physically, but also mentally, and the exercises and the routine, like the things that you know work so that it's mapped out, it's there. And then when we get into those loops, when life just throws us curveballs, our number one job at that at that point is actually not to trust our mind, and it's to trust the plan. Because the mind is just trying to bring us into the safety zone kind of thing. And, you know, it's all this outdated biology, unfortunately. And then we start making bad choices, right?

But our plan is that response.

Totally.

That's the biology. That's the, the, oh my God, saber-toothed tiger is here, uh, type of thoughts, right? Okay.

Ironically though, I'm looking at your photo in the back with the dinosaur or whatever that is. That looks pretty intimidating.

That ironically, that was my ex-husband's portrait of me. But it's a mythical tiger. It's really power and energy that a person can carry. That's the ferocity that I want to hold on to, to overcome whatever life throws at me, right? That I'm not going to be beaten down no matter what. I'm saying no matter what, no matter how bad it is. So, um, yeah, yeah. But I think we all have that in us. Some people may tap into it more. Um, I think that's the other side of mental fitness, is that this connection with who deeply who you are and the certainty that everything's going to be okay. So if you don't have that, then it's easy to crumble. So yeah, right. And you gotta hold on. The white knuckling I was talking about is actually a sense like I'm holding on still, just like when you're running a marathon. At one point you probably feel really shitty that you want to stop, but you're like, no, I'm holding on to this. I'm gonna keep pushing. So that's that little point that you want to hold on to. So you have to hold on to your tiger spirit, whatever, dragon spirit, whatever that's inside of you. Um, and then you're gonna get through. Yeah, no matter what. I believe, I, I, I actually believe in eternity of our consciousness. So yeah, same. Yeah, eventually, uh, you're still gonna be okay no matter what. Right. You move on to the next life. Um, you know, you're, you're fine. You're always going to be fine. So don't, don't worry so much about this little problem right now. You're always going to be fine.

But that's where the, for me, and I'm biased with journaling, but that's, that's where a practice like journaling at least personally helps me because in those moments where, you know, I find my mind trying to question, you know, or asking the like, well, what if, or have I done enough here and so forth. You know, you can easily start to loop in that and, and start to spiral downwards. Where if you can pause, and whether that's in a notebook or taking a walk, like journaling is just— my definition of journaling is just reflection, just to think. So, you know, there's many different ways to do that, but as, as you're alluding to, like reminding ourselves of— yeah, first of all, like I think we've got a lot of people, whether we can see them or not, in spirit or whatever, like there are people guiding us. There's that. You can tap into that, that intuition and that guidance, and then remind ourselves again, like, yeah, everything will— this is just a small blip in the chapter. And like, keep going. And if you're real clear on why you're doing what you're doing, your purpose and all that kind of stuff, and spend time doing that work, then it's another opportunity to like just reset and remind ourselves like, oh yeah, this, this is why I'm doing this. And then you go back to your plan and you've got everything there, right? And it could be as simple as just loading up, you know, a song or an artist that immediately, as soon as you hear their music, puts you in this beautiful, energized, peaceful state, right? Like, it's just small things like that, just having them available to us so that we don't stay in that suffering loop or all these thoughts that we know are, are you know, fiction, but feel, you know, 100% real. Yeah.

So what do you say to some person— I'm sure some of the listeners, uh, right now are stressed and maybe has been chronically stressed, um, would you tell them how to release themselves from that?

Yeah, well, I mean, everyone's different, of course, but I think— and I'm not saying mental fitness is the end-all be-all, but it definitely can help reduce and be, and help be proactive around stress and so forth. But again, there's, there's, there are many practitioners out there and different modalities to tap into that. I mean, experiment with as many as you can, but first and foremost, I think we need to understand like what's the fuel source behind our stress or anxiety or whatever it is that, that you're struggling with and see, okay, well, if these are the elements that are contributing to that stress. What's within my control that I can maybe turn, you know, cut off some of the fuel and just start making some micro changes. But what I, what I see is a lot of people don't check in with themselves. So they don't even know what the fuel sources are. And this is what I mean by, you know, like maybe it's when your coffee is brewing in the morning or a cup of tea or your first glass of water. Something as simple as, if I had to pick one word to describe how I feel today, what's that word? Right. And okay, well, I feel stressed. Okay. That's when you ask the follow-up question of, okay, well, where's the stress coming from? Is there anything I can do to release that? And often just even identifying and going through that process releases a lot of the emotion. And then the follow-up question is, how do I want to show up today?

Yeah.

And like, I think we joked about a little bit earlier, like, I haven't seen anyone say, yeah, I want to show up super angry today or something like that. Right. It's always something motivating. Like if people just did that, so basic, it takes a minute or two. You want to take it to pro level, you throw, um, uh, uh, an inspiring book beside the coffee machine, some Stoic philosophy or someone that is interesting that you just read one page. And you immediately shift your mind. Just those couple of practices that take 5 minutes total, you're miles ahead of most of the population. And over time, that stacks and it becomes more and more, then, because then you want to do more because you're like, wow, I'm feeling a lot better, I'm feeling more clear.

Yeah, that's great tip. So first, identify your stress. If it's your husband, yeah, yeah.

Get rid of them.

Think about what to do. Yeah, you know what to do. And dig deep and you will figure out the answer. Or if it's your job, well, you know, think about what you can change. Or is it your physical health? Well, you know, work on it. So yeah, and then 5 minutes a day next to your coffee, tea, whatever, your morning drink routine, something that's inspiring or just, you know, mentally um, just healthy for you?

Yeah, yeah. It's just a good question to help really identify really, like, truly what's going on, um, especially if it's bigger things with relationships or health and so forth, is to spend time either first, as soon as you get up, like, whenever your mind is most clear, before you start injecting email, news, social, like, all that stuff. Answer this question when your mind's clear. And it's just, what am I pretending not to know? And that's because that's usually the thing. Like, if I think of a relationship that maybe, like, is great, but there's something there that, like, you know that there's something there that's off, but you're— it's uncomfortable to deal with it, right? But then we also know that at one point we're going to be forced to deal with it, and it's going to be way more uncomfortable. And probably a hell of a lot harder and so forth. And it's the same thing with health and business, like all that kind of stuff. So just, you know, give ourselves the opportunity to surface that on our own, and then you don't have to tackle it all in one shot, but at least you have the data or the information. Like, that's, that's, that's the parallel I always try to make on, on the business side. We would never run our businesses without information to then guide our decisions. Right. But we, we do that when it comes to our minds and we just kind of wing it and see how it goes. And often that doesn't work out very well, or it makes it just a lot harder than it, than it needs to be.

Yeah. Yeah. Very true. Any last words about your mental fitness strategy for people that they can take home with?

Yeah, I, I think I would approach my two things. I would suggest one. One, I wish someone said this to me 15 years ago, because when you read self-help or personal development books or play with any of these practices, your self-awareness starts to go through the roof. And that sounds great, but then you start feeling a hell of a lot more as well. Whereas before you might be numbing out and you actually are like, oh, that, that's anxiety or that's stress. And now you know it's there. So just be cognizant that's probably going to happen, and that's totally normal. And don't judge yourself for that. Like, you're now— like, you have information, and then now you're building up a tool set that you can kind of deploy in those areas. But for some— and I know I struggle with this— and gosh, this almost feels worse because I know where I need to make different decisions where maybe I didn't know, uh, before, beforehand. And then the other thing, it just like physical fitness, like it could either feel like a really grueling workout or you can approach it as fun and something to test or experiment. Like, yeah, I've never tried doing breathwork or all— there's so many different breathwork sequences to explore and play, or sound bath. Like there's a million different things, right? So you can, if you treat the, the whole experience from a place of curiosity, you're going to have a blast and you're probably going to meet really interesting people that are also curious and come out with all of these fun practices that at the end of the day, allow you to feel better and are giving you this massive competitive advantage for yourself and everyone in your, in your direct circle. Cause people are going to notice your energy. It's inevitable that's going to shift. So, yeah, have fun with it.

Yeah. Wow. That's a, that's, that's refreshing. Yeah. Have fun with your mental fitness. I love it.

Exactly.

Yeah. I think, I hope this episode helps some people out there, you know, try some of the things that we were talking about and, and become fitter, you know, not be weighed down by stress, but use that as an opportunity to train yourself to be more effective.

I love that.

For the next stress.

Yeah.

And that's because it's work.

Yeah. It never ends. But we can, we can approach with a little bit more ease and grace.

Right. Because, you know, one thing that's certain is that there's going to be problems and difficulties. So it's better to get fit now, you know, because—

Yeah, because you stay ready then.

Exactly. Yeah. Wonderful. Thank you so much for sharing your insight and these wonderful suggestions for people so they can just become happier. right? And make each other happier too when they are less stressed. I wish my mom was less stressed. Boy, my childhood could have been so much better if she just had better tools to handle her stress.

Oh, for sure. I mean, I'm in the same position as that. And also I'm doing everything possible to work with colleges and universities and students because they're super stressed as well. And again, as you're— I think what we're speaking about, these aren't earth-shattering tools. They're available for everyone and they don't have to be complicated. So we just need to have more conversations to get them out.

Yeah.

Thank you. Thank you for the opportunity to chat with you and share some of this stuff.

Fun conversation. Thank you, Mark. And where can people keep following your work?

Yeah, just, I mean, I'm on the socials @mchampagne or mchampagne.com is my website and everything links from there. And Behind the Human is the podcast I've hosted for the last 8 years, sharing these practices, which I'm excited to welcome you on shortly. So we'll get your take on all these topics as well. And it's just, for me, like selfishly, it's my mental nutrition every week. Every week I get to, you know, share a different story and capture or curate another set of questions that can help us reset in, in any moment.

That's true. I agree. It is my happy place to be talking to, you know, exceptional people like you and bringing positive things to the world. And whenever we do podcasts, we have to be in the moment. And that's very— that's freeing, right? Because you don't worry about anything else. Just talk about what's important right now. So, that itself, is, is good for the— it's good for our mood and our mind. Yes, for sure.

So thank you again.

Thank you, Mark. And I hope everybody is going out there and pick something to make your life better and more stress resilient. Thank you for watching and listening. If you enjoy this kind of content, please subscribe and turn on your notification bell so you don't miss any of my future content. And if you want to learn more about regenerative medicine or other modalities in anti-aging medicine, please go to my YouTube channel, Joy Kong, MD, and there are all kinds of videos to help you keep learning.