Top 10 Supplements for Health & Longevity You Must Try Now

I've been experimenting with supplements for years, and I think I've tried over like 400 different supplements in my lifetime. Some of them help with insulin sensitivity, others help with sleep, others help with gut health, some of them help with skin health. Like, there's many different pathways we can sort of tweak and manipulate. And that's what I just love is like, what does the research say? Let's experiment, do the blood work. And that's like a cyclical experiment.

Hello. Welcome back, Everybody, to the Dr. Joy Kong podcast. You know, I'm here for you to help you to live your best life, the healthiest and happiest. And today I'm so excited to invite a distinguished guest, Lucas, who is a leading biohacker from Australia. Lucas, welcome to my show.

Hey, Joy. Yeah. Stoked to be here. And I'm looking forward to chatting and providing your audience with a ton of value.

Yeah. So let me just introduce you a little bit because you specialize in nootropics and hormone optimization and energy optimization. All these are great, great subjects. So you yourself is a qualified naturopath and you have a background in exercise science and you founded Boost yout Energy and IMB4, a leading supplement formulator. And you're also a YouTuber advisor, international speaker and philanthropist. So it's really wonderful to have you here and have a great conversation with me.

Yeah, it's exciting. I mean, we were just sort of saying before how, you know, we're both always interested in starting new businesses and I guess we're just both go getters. We want to just try and, you know, make an impact on the world and particularly in the health space. Like, my ultimate goal and vision and mission is to bring forward new and cutting edge ingredients, supplement ingredients, to the market that will be talked about, you know, for the next 20, 30 years.

Wow. Yeah. I love the fact that you are an expert in supplements because that's a huge area and I think. I think it's very confusing. I would love to have your take what's going on with all this trend, because I've seen people taking 100 supplements. You know, it's not uncommon for this ultimate longevity group, such as people who are connected to the rad fest, you know, the radical longevity. They want to live forever. Right. They don't want to die. So they're pumping all these things into their bodies. What are your thoughts on that?

Yeah, so there's. There's quite a number of individuals out there that are like, using big dosages of. And they're using Many different supplements all at once. And the common, I guess like the common belief is that, oh, you know, what's going to happen to your liver is, is your liver able to process this? What about your kidneys? Is there going to be kidney damage? And the reality is a lot of these supplements, when they've undertaken blood tests, a lot of the time there actually hasn't been any real issue unless the individual is taking the wrong dosage or the wrong form. Like we know that high dose vitamin B6. This is a really common issue we're seeing in today's society is that individuals are taking far too high dosages of vitamin B6 and that can build up in the body and that can lead to toxicity and it can actually cause peripheral nerve damage if taken for too long of a period of time. So there's definitely some little tricks that people need to be aware of. In particular even around like the fat soluble vitamins. So like vitamin A, D, E, K2, specifically vitamin D. I've seen a number of individuals that have been taking, you know, like 20, 30, 000iu of vitamin D every single day for months and they get their blood tests back and their, you know, their vitamin D levels are above the reference range, like above 250. Oh, and that's, that can be an issue, you know.

Do you see what kind of symptoms they exhibit?

Yeah, they get sleep issues, anxiety, muscle fasciculations, where they get like twitches, muscle twitches. They get a little bit of just like typical symptoms of like high calcium because vitamin D increases calcium in the blood. So if they're not combating that with enough vitamin K2 and magnesium, which I know you talk about, you know, that can be an issue.

Too much of a good thing?

Yes, yes.

Yeah. So you know, you start to lose touch with nature because nature has this built in balance. And how do you enhance that balance instead of tipping things over?

Yeah, I definitely think like for example, if we're looking at an acute flu or a severe sickness or an infection. Yes. Like a bolus dosage, a very high dosage of vitamin D might actually help to like give the immune system a bit of a boost. But it's those individuals that are, I guess like blindly using different supplements without, you know, without the proper care and guidance of a healthcare professional like yourself or myself.

Yeah. So. Well let me ask you, how many supplements do you take?

Well, that's a great question there Joy. I. It depends on the day, it depends what I've got on. Like for example, on Mondays when I film, I try and film five YouTube videos on the Mondays. So I try and like, all condense it into one day. I'll take about maybe like eight or nine different supplements that morning. It's nothing. I wouldn't say that's like, overkill. It's not over the top at all. I've tried to, like, streamline, you know, like, I'm trying to cull and remove anything that doesn't serve my biology or doesn't have an impact on the way that I feel. I'm a big believer in, like, yes, we can look at blood work, but the other thing that I like to, to take into account is how do you subjectively respond to that supplement? Right. So if we're looking at something to boost energy, if you take a particular supplement that's designed to increase energy, let's say it's creatine or vitamin B12 or PQQ, coenzyme Q10D, ribose, anything that helps with mitochondrial function, and you don't really notice an impact, then I think it's just means that you don't need to include it in your protocol. So I'm a big believer in. I've been experimenting with supplements for years, and I've. I think I've tried over like 400 different supplements in my lifetime.

Wow. Okay. Well, I assume most of them you don't feel much. I mean, I'm guessing.

Yeah, well, some of them, like, for example, some of them help with insulin sensitivity, others help with sleep, others help with gut health, some of them help with skin health, some of them help with testosterone, some of them help modulate estrogen. Some of them, you do feel, and others, you know, that it's sort of working in the background, you know, altering, you know, fasting, insulin lowering, HbA1c assisting with growth hormone. Like, there's many different pathways we can sort of tweak and manipulate. And that's what I just love is like, what does the research say? Let's experiment, you know, do the blood work. And that's like a, A cyclical, you know, experiment.

Yeah. So you, you like doing it in cycles, taking supplements in cycles.

I was saying this the other day. I, I view the brain as like, have you heard of, like, play doh, which is like, it's that squishy, you know, that kids play with. It's like that. I view the brain in the same way where you can manipulate and, and just mold the brain in a certain way that you want it to, to become. And really, that comes back to a principle that I've sort of been really excited by. And that's a term called cosmetic neurology. So being able to what? Yeah, it's a bit of a, bit of a new one. Basically being able to either increase or decrease certain neurotransmitters in your brain through the use of supplements, peptides, drugs, things like that to suit your needs. Right. So for example, let's say you're going out to a social event and you need to be excited and happy and social and bubbly and fun and outgoing. Then it's all about increasing dopamine and also increasing gaba. And these can be both achieved through the use of supplements.

Yeah. Okay. And what, what supplements?

Yeah, so one in particular that I'm a huge fan of. It's actually an ingredient that I've known about for many, many years actually very, very popular in Brazil and South America. It's a herb called catawba. Now catuava is a herbal extract that's initially a lot of the ancient shamans and herbalists back in the day, they used to prescribe it as an aphrodisiac. So to increase libido and also to help with mood and to help with energy a little bit like maca powder. You might be familiar with like maca powder or ginseng, like Panax ginseng. It works in a similar way but is more so suited to increasing dopamine. So I'm a big fan of cat W. And then another, another one to combine that with is taurine. So taking a cat waba with taurine. Taurine increases gaba, cat fiber, increases dopamine, it helps it basically that stack there can help to replace alcohol.

Oh, wow.

For people.

So you've tried that, the stack of these two.

Yeah.

So it gives you. Is it kind of like me drinking my coffee with Bailey's? I've got a little upper, a little downer and then I feel just right in the zone pretty much.

Yeah, you could say. So the combination of both provides that stimulation and the alertness and the confidence with the anti anxiety effects of the, of the gabber effects from the taurine. So that combination there, I know a number of guys that have sort of played around with that and they say it does a pretty good job. Like they feel, you know, they don't get a come down, there's no crash, there's no toxicity. The next day you don't feel like garbage. It's pretty much like a win win.

Wow. Is there any side effects? I mean, these are, I know herbal extracts Right. Well, taurine, just an amino acid.

Hmm.

With.

With Catoba. One thing I might point out is that it's not that easy to find real Catoba because a lot of the Catawba products on the market could be fake. And so what I recommend is, of course I'm going to be biased, but I spent six years trying to find the highest quality Catawba extract. And I got it third party analyzed and sent off to a lab and decided to make it into a supplement myself. So the one that they should be looking for is Catwa Pure. So it's Catwa Pure. That's the. Well, at least we know for sure that whatever's in that capsule is absolutely going to be Catwaba. Because we tested many different herbs and we tested many different products. A lot of them didn't actually even contain Catawba. So it really matters in terms of sourcing for this one.

Hmm. Okay, so this is in one of your formulas that contains just those two ingredients or do you have more?

Just the Catawba by itself. I decided to launch with just that one single ingredient.

Okay.

In the future, of course, I want to have many different products with many different formulas. But yeah, I just want to start with the first, baby.

So you use that before you go to parties?

Yeah, yeah. I mean it helps with like socializing, you know, get. Getting you in the mood. A lot of people are using it as like an, as a caffeine alternative as well because it gives that energy boost and also replaces things like L tyrosine or alpha and which is also like a, an amino acid that helps with energy. So it's pretty cool. There's some really interesting literature if you look back at like the ancient texts.

Where's the plant from?

It's from Brazil.

Okay.

So it's. Yeah, South American. It's actually really well known in Brazil. If you ask anyone you know at it, it's actually Brazil's most famous aphrodisiac. Really? Yeah.

Well, the Brazilians are pretty excited about life.

Yeah.

So I wonder how much assistance they got.

That's a good point. That's a very, very, very good point.

Yeah. So you are really into nootropics? Of course. I think everybody is interested in enhancing their brain.

Yeah. I've always been fascinated by the space of nootropics. I really. I've just always thought that we can always do something positive for our neurochemistry. Within. Everything is within reach. That's how I perceive the world. If we want to achieve a certain outcome or a certain effect, it's easy to do. So like for example, most people already do it. They, if they feel a little bit flat, go for a run, do some exercise and you know, you come back, you feel invigorated, you feel that initial, you know, low mood state is oftentimes lifted. The same principle can apply with nootropics. I believe that they can be used strategically to help to increase and modulate and manipulate neurotransmitters to help with things like memory focus, concentration, reducing anxiety, helping with mood. There's just, I think there's a lot of misconceptions around nootropics. I think a lot of people also have these like unrealistic expectations that they're going to be really powerful and life changing.

25 points higher IQ.

Yeah, yeah. Those unrealistic expectations, I think when used strategically in the right dosages and they build up over time, that's when you start to notice the benefits really manifest.

Okay, so what are some of your favorite ones for let's say enhancing cognitive abilities?

One of my favorite ingredients is actually a compound that's, it's a nootropic that's found in broccoli and also breast milk. Funnily enough, it's clearly important because it's found in breast milk. So therefore it's important for brain development and increasing neuro, neurogenesis and synaptogenesis. But it can be used in adulthood and it's been studied in adults to prevent cognitive decline and specifically for early onset Alzheimer's disease. So in individuals that have symptoms of like memory loss, you know, concentration issues, it's called uridine. So this, this, this compound is called uridine monophosphate. It's actually heavily studied in conjunction with high dose omega 3s. So the omega 3s with uridine together combined, it's a game. If you've, I'm excited for you to try it. I'll send you, send you some information on it.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's fantastic. So you mean the woman's body actually makes this, this uridine?

Yeah, it's, it's actually, it's naturally occurring like both in, in, in the body and also found in nature. It's just a lot of the research on uridine is focused on, it's basically builds nucleotides. So it's like a, it's a nucleotide base. It's got some really fascinating research on it. More so around like memory for memory performance. Yeah, it's. If you've Never tried it before. And you try it for the first week. I'm almost. I'm very confident. You will feel it like within a week.

Okay. All right. Yeah. What do you think about all these mushrooms that this huge part of being neurotropics. Right. Plenty of other properties.

Yeah, it's a great, great point there, Joy. I think a lot of the medicinal mushrooms have some pretty profound benefits when used appropriately. So, for example, my favorite mushroom is cordyceps. Cordyceps mushroom is something that I've. I used for two years straight when I was playing soccer. I was playing semi professional soccer before my, you know, naturopathy career took off. But I was using cordyceps because it, it really does help with breathing, like the ability to just get a. Get a breath of air. It helps with VO2 max. It helps with lung, you know, lung functioning. It also has some benefits in terms of boosting motivation and energy, similar to caffeine, but it doesn't really have that. That nasty crash effect. So cordyceps is in traditional Chinese medicine. I love traditional Chinese medicine. I mean, I've looked at the. I know you also.

I grew up there.

Yeah. In Chinese medicine. I actually was studying it back in the day and they, they perceived. They used to describe cordyceps as both a yin and yang kidney tonic. So it rebuilds and fortifies both the kid, like the kidney essence and also the, like the. What is it called? Pre.

I think in Chinese it's a dong chong xia cao. So that means the winter is a worm and the summer is a grass. So like metamorphs.

Yeah, yeah. It's pretty awesome. Every time I come back to Chinese medicine, I'm just completely blown away by how they discover these as actual, like, to be consumed and to be used as medicine. But, like, it doesn't really have too many contraindications as well. So it's like, it's pretty safe. I think they call it a. What is it? They put it as part of their vital treasures or something where they. It's like a. There's a list of medicines like Shudi Huang. Shudi Huang is Romania. That's a really famous herb in Chinese medicine. Then they also do another one's Rukong Rong Luang. It's testing my knowledge now.

There are a lot of them.

Yeah, there's so many. I just love how they formulate products as well. Like just. It's so different to Western medicine. Like, they take the pulse, they look at the tongue, the eyes. Right. It's really fascinating.

And they're the ultimate formulators. I remember when my mom was, came back and she was so disillusioned from getting chemotherapy for six months in the hospital and she just went to a Chinese medicine doctor and of course, you know the diagnosis, looking at the person, look at the tongue, feel the pulse, and gave her the concoction. Of course they all taste nasty.

Right.

There are very few Chinese medicine actually. There's a saying, if the medicine is not bitter, then it's not, it's not going to be good for you. Yeah, you just. The more bitter, the more effective. So.

I agree, I agree. I love, I love that you bring that up because like the taste profile of the herb itself is part of the medicinal effect and the medicinal property. So when they talk about, you know, sweet, salty, sour, bitter, umami, there's like those flavors. When they describe a lot of these herbs, they talk about them as like, you know, sweet and kidney meridian or like, you know, sour and then stomach or spleen dampness, you know, liver chi, stagnation, cooling, warming, spicy, hot, that sort of stuff. I just. Yeah, it's, it's. You're completely right. They are like the original expert formulators, you know.

Yeah, I need a little bit of this, a little bit that. And you know, so I remember going to the Chinese pharmacy. I mean, they have the whole wall of all these herbs and insects. Right. Everything antler. And then they just, according to prescription, they just grab a little bit of this, a little bit of that, and then you can either make it a powder or just, you know, put the, the items right in the, in the bag. Yeah. And you just brew them. Very, very interesting. So when it comes to, okay, what about things for mood, for depression? Like a lot of people are dealing with depression, anxiety, like what, what's your best, you know, everyone is of course not the same. But what have you found that really make a difference for people?

Yeah, so let's, let's focus on like the low mood or apathetic or low motivation, like that type of depression where they're just feeling like they don't have the, you know, the enthusiasm, the motivation to get things done. They procrastinate a lot in that specific situation. I would be focusing on optimizing dopamine. Yes, of course. We can use, we can look at using the cat wuba. It's quite a good, good herb for that. But I would like to mention that there's another amino acid that I've been a big fan of that's actually been recently studied as well for adhd, and that is L. Phenylalanine. L. Phenylalanine. It's. It's an. It's an essential amino acid, which means that you have to consume it from diet or from supplements because your body doesn't make it. And. But the body requires it. So you can. If you had. I mean, joy, for example, today, you've probably had protein, right? You've probably had either chicken, fish, meat. Am I right?

Is that collagen? Collagen mixed with some raw milk, and I had some almonds and.

Yeah, perfect. So that collagen is a collagen protein powder.

Yes. From. It's from cows.

Yep. So that. That would have had phenylalanine in, like, as part of the formula. But what happens is if you take phenylalanine, you pull it out and you use it by itself in a supplement, like as a capsule or powder. If you take about 500 to 1,000 milligrams of phenylalanine by itself, that can actually act as a precursor to increase dopamine in the brain. And so for individuals that suffer from, you know, the apathy, the low motivation, they can't be bothered doing things. They're not. They're not feeling that drive. Alpha and Leonine can kick them off their feet and get them a bit more, like, into gear, because it's basically just providing the building blocks for dopamine in the brain.

Okay, and what about compared to something like 5 HTP?

Yeah, so this is. I was actually listening to Dr. Andrew Huberman talk about serotonin this morning on a podcast, and I was. I was really happy with. He has the exact same opinion and stance on serotonin that I do. And I was really happy to hear him say that because it just reinforced everything that I've learned over the years. And I knew I was right. I knew all along.

And that's why you liked it validated you.

Yeah. Confirmation bias. I was excited to hear him reinforce what I was sort of predicting. And it was basically. He's also under the impression that he doesn't deliberately want to increase serotonin. And I'm. I'm the same. I. I personally don't want to increase serotonin on purpose. Why? Because serotonin, for me, actually blunts. It blocks and blunts the effects of dopamine. It basically can make you feel like anhedonic apathetic, like you're not actually motivated. It actually makes you want to just chill. Like, it's a chill.

Was he saying that this could be one of the mechanisms for SSRIs to cause some kind of blunting of pleasure for people.

Correct? Yeah, he's, he has covered that before and that's, that's a really big, big, big problem is that, you know, when people go on these SSRIs, they may not be, they may, they may not, they may no longer feel flat, but they, they might feel just numbed. And the numbing effect on their emotions can be, makes life not as, not as enjoyable if, if they're not able to experience the highs and the lows of life. So yeah, serotonin's involved in that in a big way.

If someone is dealing with low mood, you would advise them to work on the dopamine first and don't worry about the 5 HTP.

Well, let's just say this, it's a great, it's a great point. Let's just say this. I would say there are prescription drugs anti, there are prescription antidepressants that don't focus on the serotonin system and they more so focus on the dopamine system. And if you look at the, the outcomes of these studies, the ones that work on the dopamine system are actually more effective than the ones that work on serotonin. The actual percentage of participants that see remission is interesting.

I don't know if you know that I was a psychiatrist, so I worked as a psychiatrist for 11 years if you count the residency time. So I've written a lot of prescription medications for mental health issues and we always start with ssri and if they don't work and then we may go to snri. That's the, the serotonin norepinephrine system. Right. So you're hitting another different kinds of receptors, but they always start with serotonin.

Yeah, yeah, it's an interesting, like I, I would love to see more research on like some of the impacts of the dopamine oriented compounds, supplements, nootropics, things like that. But it's an interesting space if you look at the like, for example, did you know that, I mean this is for the audience. Did you know that when you exercise, the reason why people feel fatigued and they, they can't keep pushing harder is because serotonin levels have built up and serotonin can contribute to fatigue during exercise. This is a well known fact of why people, some people can keep pushing and others are like, nah, I can't be bothered. You know, like, I just can't really.

Yeah, well they didn't teach me that one.

It'S called the central serotonin hypothesis of fatigue during exercise. So there's fascinating. There's some pretty. Pretty remarkable impacts there. In addition to that, serotonin, when elevated, can actually affect thyroid functioning and can actually affect thyrotropin releasing hormone trh, and also affect tsh. Not in a good way, like, as in it'll slow down the metabolism. It doesn't. Doesn't increase metabolism. It slows it down. So that's an interesting one. And then also another side effect is that high serotonin can increase prolactin. Now, men don't want high prolactin. You know, the side effects of hyperlactin. And. And women in particular, if they have high prolactin, that can affect their fertility as well.

Yes. So breast milk production.

Yeah.

You're not pregnant. So what about anxiety? You know, that's. I think. I don't know what the percentage of the population that's anxious, but I think it's a high percentage.

Gee, I think it would be.

Especially after Covid.

Yeah, I would say probably more than one in two. It's probably even higher.

There's a lot of anxious people walking around out there.

Yeah, it's like, all right, so the anxiety side of things, from my experience. I'm just going to speak that from my experience, any sort of supplement or amino acid or drug that targets the GABA system, not a benzodiazepine, like, obviously, like a. A natural way to. To boost gaba. In fact, in some cases, I've seen pure Gabber itself be used as a supplement. You know, about 500 milligrams to a thousand milligrams can help with reducing anxiety, particularly when combined with magnesium, which also lowers glutamate and increases gaba. So, like, you've got two fantastic, safe, well studied, you know, minimal side effects, very cheap, probably less than 10 cents a day. Two very simple supplements, magnesium, L Threonate and GABA together. If you want to add in L Theanine, you can do so. Or the taurine between those four, I would say start there for most people.

Okay, what are your thoughts on lithium orotate?

Yeah, it's funny you mentioned that there, Joy, because just the other day I was on another podcast and the guy that I was interviewing was speaking praises and speaking very highly of lithium orotate. And I was like, I've looked into it and I've seen. I know a lot of the studies are focused on bipolar disorder, but the low dose lithium orotate, so like less than 2 milligrams I think it's like only 1 milligram, a thousand micrograms has some. I've seen some pretty amazing reports online about it, reducing obsessive thoughts, things like that. I've got some, I literally ordered some that night.

Oh, wow.

But I, I still haven't tried it yet. I'm, I'm probably going to try it in a few weeks just to test it out, see how I feel. But what, what, have you ever used it before?

You know, I feel almost like cheated by the medical community because I've given quite a bit of lithium, but lithium carbonate, very high doses, we start at 300 milligrams and go all the way up to like 1500 a day. So. And then of course we have to monitor people's kidney function and make sure that we're not damaging the kidneys when really very small fraction actually get to the brain, which is where you want it to be. But lithium orotate, you know, gets straight into the brain, there's very easy access and now you can exert neuroprotective benefits. So I just feel like, why do they make us give this highly toxic form that can't even get to the target you're trying to get to? And that was the standard for care. So. Yeah. And supposedly places where there's a high lithium content in the water, people have lower rate of mental health problems. So that's a really interesting side note about the power of lithium.

Yeah, yeah. I'm really glad you brought that up. I think it's probably time that I, well, number one, see, see how it affects my neurology. I love just sort of, you know, experimenting and, and just reviewing it. What happens is I, I'll research it and whilst I'm researching it, I'll take it. So I've got like the subjective experience, you know, the real life experience and then I've got the science and I'm just doing two things at once. I just love that, getting hands on experience.

And I think it's all very valuable just listening to. Actually Gary Brecke was talking about how we think that things are only valid if it's gone through double blind clinical studies. But so much of medicine is based on experience and based on individuals testing one by one. All those are valid. And just because it's not double blinded doesn't mean that it's not giving us tremendous insight on what something can do. And I just think it's, it's gone to the point of arrogance to think that, oh, let's say traditional Chinese Medicine and there's not enough double blind study, never mind. They've studied that for a few thousand years and you know, with tremendous success. You know, Chinese people are not dumb. It doesn't work. They're not going to keep using it. Like why would you. Right. So if people keep using it for a thousand years, you think that that actually does, really does something. So, and also the complexity of, of the biological system, when you put an herb in the body, there's so much, so much that's going on. Right. There's a system, system that, that's been changed. So how do you, how do you determine there's a lot of individual cases? I think it's all valid. The same thing that's with same what I do. Stem cell therapy is complex. It's like giving a smart pharmacy, all of a sudden you delivering thousands of different kinds of signals into the body. So we have to respect that. Individual cases is worth a lot. I remember treating somebody with dementia and after stem cell therapy, the clock, from a mangled clock that you don't recognize as a clock to actually recognizable with the needles, you know, pointing, you know, fairly good directions that, that now is a clock. And I showed it to actually a psychiatrist. I said, look at this, you have a lot of patients with dementia and cognitive decline. Look at what this is doing. And his reply was, oh, but that's just enough one. And that's just such arrogance because I want to, I want him to show me what can you do to give me that enough one. You can't even give me enough one.

Yeah, I feel you, I feel you. Yeah, it's sort of like how do we classify levels of evidence? And like, at what point do we, do we at least consider the fact that n equals 1 in such case is evidence to build further upon, like, let's look into it further.

Absolutely.

I don't like how we're just so dismissive of so many great modalities in therapy. You've probably been like that your whole life, you know, in this, in this field as well.

Yeah, well, that's why you're a naturopathic doctor, because. Yeah, otherwise. Yeah, I, I, it's very interesting. I think a lot of medical doctors before they went to medical school, they're actually quite open, they're like, oh yeah, yeah, I can see, I can see this and that. But then you go through this grooming process and then when you first come out, you're vehemently against all these alternative forms of therapy. You know, it's very interesting. It's It's a really a. A brainwashing process. There's no doubt about it. Yeah, we, you know, I want to interview somebody on homeopathy. Homeopathy.

Oh, yeah.

Which. Which we laughed at in medical school. We literally were laughing and making fun of homeopath in medical school, and we're just like, can you believe how ludicrous and. And what a crackery these people? Yeah, we were. We were not kind.

You know what's crazy, Joy, is that I. I want to talk about homeopathy on my YouTube and Instagram because I. Yeah, I believe in it, but I'm too worried about so many people, you know, just being like, you can't provide evidence. It's all quackery. I know it works. I also know it works. I've seen it work. There's many homeopathic arsenicum, album, phosphorus, natfoss. You know, these remedies are. What's the other one? Nux vomica. You know, there's like geranium. There's so many different remedies for different things. But it was a subject that I had. I was forced to study at university as part of my naturopathy degree. So I studied it and I was. It's the repertoire ization. That's how they. They, you know, how they calculate the. The remedy for the. For the patient.

How.

It was such an interesting. Like, first of all, if anyone has any weird sort of headaches or migraines, there's so many good homeopathic remedies for, like, vertigo, headaches, dizziness. I'm sure you've seen that as well.

Right. You won't be a believer until it actually did it for you after you tried everything else. Yeah.

There's even like homeopathic coffee. Coffee. Coffee, which is like, for sleep. I don't know if you've seen that one, but that's. That's really well known.

Okay. All right. So I also wanted to ask you about hormone, because you. You also do this, you know, kind of hormone optimization through supplements.

Yep, yep.

What about. Tell me about testosterone. I mean, that's a huge topic. Right? Everybody wants. Right. And how do you do it naturally? Because the prevailing wisdom is that you inject or put cream on your body and that's how you improve your testosterone.

Yeah. So most. Most guys are under the impression that they need to go on trt. They need to take testosterone. But my, My premise and my belief system is let's try and optimize your body's ability to make testosterone and the processes and the strategies to do so that I recommend and that I prescribe are strategies that make your body healthier overall. It's not like they're just specifically hitting testosterone. Let's do this for most of them are drop body fat, you know, get lean, you know, eat enough, eat enough healthy fats. I know that might be confusing for some people, but it makes sense. Plenty of healthy, healthy protein. Don't cut back on the carbohydrates. You know, you need carbohydrates. Do not cut back on carbohydrates.

What about the whole weight gain and insulin resistance aspect? The sugar?

Yeah, the sugar. Well, the way I perceive it is like if, well, the thing is most guys that I work with are already training really hard. You know, they're, they're, they're already quite lean. And so if they cut back on carbohydrates, it just increases cortisol. Whereas if, if a guy is, you know, overweight, 50, 60 pounds over overweight, then yeah, you know, you want to look at things that drop body fat. So that's where you, you might want to cut back on the carbohydrates. But it depends on the, it depends on, on the person. It's, it's dose dependent, that sort of stuff. But I would say testosterone optimization is the most, is the most confusing thing for, for a lot of guys, they, they think that it's not possible to raise levels naturally. But I can definitely guarantee you that there are many different supplements strategies that can actually help to boost testosterone levels naturally without needing to go on to trt.

Okay, what, can you share a few? Do you use some of them yourself?

Of course, of course. So when I first went down this rabbit hole, I, I asked myself the question, how high can I make my own testosterone naturally? Like what can I get it up to naturally?

Where was it before?

It was sitting at around 680 nanograms per deciliter.

Pretty good. Yeah.

And then I got it all the way up to 900 and 990. So I was almost a thousand nanograms. So I was able to get it to the top end of the reference range. And so what did you do from an exercise perspective? I was doing heavy leg, leg work, so training legs twice a week. I was doing one sprinting like a, a sprinting session per week. I was supplementing with boron, shilajit, tonka ali, fadosia, taurine, magnesium and a few other, and pine pollen. These were like my staple supplements. And then I was also making sure I'd get like, at least 7.5 to 8 hours of sleep every night. Like, high quality sleep. And then funnily enough, I would. I was actually back in the day, I was. I. I still do it to. Today is I was actually icing my testes. I was actually icing.

Really?

Yeah. Yeah.

What does that do?

Yeah. So initially when I came across the research on it, I was like, whoa. Like, how does. Like, no guy has even spoken about this or heard about. This was like four years ago. And I'm like, all these, you know, power lifters are like, icing their balls before they're trying to, like, break a PB in the gym. They want to try and get. Get an energy effect. And then I'm like, okay, hang on a second. There's a reason why a man's testes are outside the body, right? They're hanging outside the body. It's because they need to be kept cool. They need to be cooler than the core body temperature. And then I researched and I'm like, hang on a sec. If the testes are too warm, this will arrest spermatogenesis. It'll block sperm production. It'll basically have an infertility effect. So sauna usage, hot baths, all of these have been shown to lower sperm count. Whereas, on the other hand, if a guy ices the testes, this leads to an increase in fertility and also testosterone. And I've had literally thousands of guys send me their blood test results, and we've seen before and after, and it actually helps to boost testosterone.

Wow.

How.

How many minutes do you need to do that?

So usually what I recommend is 10 to 15 minutes, about three times per day. Wow, that's like. Usually it's enough time for the ice back to fully melt, you know, so usually I suggest it before going to the gym for guys. So, like, you know, using an ice pack before going to the gym. And a lot of guys feel amazing when they do that. They just feel great. Yeah, that's.

That's interesting. I wonder if there's any similar tricks for women. But it's not fair. You got a, you know, a nice trick.

I know, I know. We just, we need to find a little. Yeah. Some sort of hack for ovarian follicles or ovarian function.

Huh?

Yeah, it's probably, I would say the hack for. For women would be certain probiotics that help with, like, the vaginal microbiome. There's some pretty cool research on Lactobacillus rooteri. That's a pretty cool. Yeah.

Yeah. I've been Making that yogurt. It's. It's really fun with El Ruderi. Yeah.

Yeah. I love. I love that I prescribe it to guys as well, because in the rat studies, drinking or using the. That particular strain actually led to bigger, like, bigger testicles in the. In the rats, which is pretty cool.

Wow. I wonder what the correlation, like, what the mechanism is.

Well, they studied it, and they also noted that their testosterone levels increased as well. So it's possibly working on. We. We know now that the microbiome influences so many different pathways. I think probiotics are gonna become, like, more snipe, more targeted for specific things. Um, we're already seeing that. I. I'm really excited to see more research in that space.

Yeah. Right. I just interviewed another biohacker, Valerie Osoni, and she was saying, oh, don't do GLP1, Agnes. You know, take the GLP1 prob. And that can naturally improve your, you know, your ability to lose weight. What are your thoughts on the GLP1 agonists?

Yeah, so actually, it's really funny you bring this up, because I was looking into why is it that when I supplement with phenylalanine, which is what I spoke about before, the dopamine boosting amino acid, why am I noticing a suppression in my appetite? It's very, very, very obvious. I. I don't have as much of an appetite when I take phenylalanine. And then guess what? I found research that indicates that this amino acid is the most potent stimulator of GLP1 in the human body out of all the amino acids.

Wow.

And I was like, hang on a second. This is giving me more energy because it's giving me more dopamine, and at the same time, it's raising GLP1. It's like the most potent stimulator of GP GLP1 out of all the amino acids. And I'm like, this is really cool. Like, more people need to know about this. So I've been trying to create posts on. On my YouTube channel, on my Instagram, sort of educating about that. But look, if we go back to GLP1, I'm gonna say, like, for example, I'm really excited about. About the new one, the retatrue Tide Reader. True Tide. That's the. The newer one. That's the. The triple agonist, the. The gip, GLP and glucagon. I've actually got some here. I haven't tried it yet. I'm a little bit nervous because I'm worried it's just Going to kill my appetite completely. But have you, I don't know, have you actually ever experimented with any yourself?

I did try the Ozempic, you know. That's interesting. Yeah. I don't think I really had much side effects. And besides the appetite. Appetite suppression. Maybe a little bit of nausea. Yeah, yeah. But somehow at first everyone was loving it and then it started to have these bad rep. And then all these people are avoiding it.

Yeah.

But I remember going to Peptide conference how, you know, some doctors were listing the multitude of benefits. Right. In all these different organs. It's not just weight loss, but. But profound other benefits.

I agree. I. So I think time and place for some of these compounds. So I'm not against GL, I'm not against GLP, GLP1 agonists. In fact, obviously I've, I've got some here that I'm about to like. Trial and see how it goes. I think the muscle wastage. Okay, let's dispel the myth. I think the muscle loss issue is, is only going to be an issue if the individual's not eating enough protein and is not doing weight training. Of course they're going to lose muscle, but if they do that, it should offset the side effects. I think that's doable. And you should see most of the weight loss coming from fat right up.

Your protein and up your exercise if you're on. Yeah. GLP1. Yeah. So what, what are your favorite tricks for weight loss for people?

Yeah. So geez, there's. There's been quite a few pretty cool molecules I've, I've been researching lately. I would say the best way to induce more fat loss would be to optimize thyroid functioning. Um, so the goal is not TSH, not T4. The goal is let's get that T3 as high as possible, which is the active thyroid hormone. Now it can be by using natural desiccated thyroid. In some cases that can be beneficial. It could also be using natural supplements. So like Coleus Forskolin. That's, that's been well studied to help with fat loss. Caffeine lotus aspirin has also been studied. Oh, really?

Aspirin?

Yeah. Lotos like baby aspirin can help to lower cortisol and support thyroid functioning. There's a few things there definitely worthwhile looking into.

So what about performance? You know, exercise and endurance? Like, do you have some favorites?

I love this topic because I'm always. Well, I'm a soccer ex soccer player, so I loved anything that could improve endurance. Probably the. I would Say like the safest one for your audience to look into. And, but the most effect, like safe with a, with a, a good effect size is a red pigment that's found from, in, in salmon called astaxanthin. Oh yeah, you familiar with that one?

Yeah, I've taken some.

So that's good for performance, really good for cardiovascular endurance. So about 8 to 12 milligrams before, about 30, 30 to 40 minutes before endurance activity is really good. Like it's been studied in cyclists, in swimmers, in runners. A lot of ex marathon runners, like a lot of marathon runners are using it. It's a really powerful antioxidant. So it has a long half life, it's fat soluble. That's a pretty safe one. Like it, it helps a lot of things and it's, you know, low risk as well.

I know there's a lot of hype actually about it. People are very excited about this particular pigment from, from salmon and shrimp. Right, the, the red color. Yeah, that's the Astro Jensen. Yeah.

Yeah, it's pretty cool. Another one that's, that's well worth looking into. I mean 20 grams of creatine instead of that, you know, the 5 gram dosage. 20 grams of creatine is great for maintaining like cognitive function and energy during sleep deprivation, like following sleep deprivation. So if individuals, let's say, you know, for whatever reason they've only slept six hours and they still need to be functioning at a high level. Creatine monohydrate at about 20 grams can actually help with that.

And do you find creatine good for muscle building?

Yeah, so creatines probably most well studied muscle building supplement on the market, like in terms of clinical trials and also good safety profile provided that the individual doesn't have any like kidney issues. But apart from that, the kidney issues are not really a concern for most people. The body just, you know, excretes it.

What about other benefits of creatine?

Yeah, so creatine's also been heavily studied to support like general cardiovascular functioning. So helping with the heart to actually providing ATP for heart function. I mean the heart is a muscle itself. So creatine helps with cardiovascular health. It also helps with, you know, reducing that, that fatigue, like just general fatigue during exercise and. Yeah, but most of the, most of the research now is looking at its neuro. Neuroprotective qualities.

Yeah. Okay, so like right now, what are your, I want to ask you about your thoughts on methylene blue since that has become a very popular supplement. I don't even know why it has caught on so much? I guess because it helps so many people. Right?

Yeah. Probably the main reason why methylene blue sort of has hit the scene, you know, it's like very popular. A lot of people are talking about is because R.F. kennedy, he was using the methylene blue on the airplane, he was putting it in his water saying that it helps with jet lag, helping with oxygenation of. Of tissues because it helps to support mitochondrial function. They say it's like an electron donor and can help to prevent leaky electron loss in the. The. Etc sort of electron transport chain. So helping with general mitochondrial function. It's also really well studied because funnily enough it was the very first synthetic drug ever developed by man. It was developed in 1867 which is a long time ago. We weren't even anywhere near being conceived back then. And it was, you know, initially used to combat malaria. So it's like an anti malaria compound. And obviously it stains. It's, you know, it's going to stain. It's a dye. So they use it as a blue dye. It's also been used to clean fish tanks. But I think most people are taking too much and the benefits are, in my opinion, less than 2 milligrams. So below 2 milligrams is what I recommend for my clients.

That's very little.

Yeah, yeah.

What. Where did you get that 2 milligrams?

Because at higher dosages you can run the risk of reducing nitric oxide. So it can lower nitric oxide. And number two is that it's a monoamine oxidase inhibitor. So it's a Maui. And that can actually increase serotonin. And you know, you know my thoughts on rising serotonin.

Hmm. Okay. Okay. I know there was a bit of a controversy between nitric oxide and methylene blue. So I have an article I can share with you that there was another doctor who delved deep into it. But the bottom line is that it seems like really they, they don't conflict with each other. So that's, that's her thoughts. But I, I'll share that with you.

Yeah, I wonder what dosage. Cuz they probably were using. Like the nitric oxide inhibiting effect is only, you know, at very high dosages. But yeah, it's a good, it's a good area to look into for sure.

Mm. Yeah. Okay. So I think we covered a lot of ground. Yeah. Anything else that you're really excited about that you want to share?

Nah, just, I'm, I'm just, I would say keep a lookout for some of the new ingredients that I'll be talking about, some of the new supplement ingredients. I'm. I'm excited to be in this space, and I really want to just, you know, leave a mark and have a legacy. My legacy is my. My goal is to, you know, release ingredients to the market that people are talking about for years. Like, for many, many years. So I appreciate the opportunity to come on your podcast here, Joy.

Yeah. So the supplement company that you founded, give us the name of the company and where they can find it.

Yeah. So if people want to check it out, it's called in before supps. So inb4 so I n b b4 so inbefore subs.com and if they want to check it out, they can go to my. My Instagram. They can just search my name. Lucas Owen. And then. Yeah.

Is it a O u n?

Yeah. A o u n. Yeah.

Yeah. Wonderful. Thank you so much, Lucas. This is so helpful. I'm sure people are getting all kinds of pearls and going to go out there and try some new things to enhance how they feel.

Yeah, I appreciate the opportunity.

Yeah, it's wonderful. I really appreciate it, and I hope everyone found this very helpful. So, Lucas, thank you again.

Thank you so much, Joy. I'm looking forward to chatting again in the future.