What 10 Years of Bipolar Misdiagnosis Actually Does to You - #179

I had been misdiagnosed my whole life. My hormones were out of control and my highs, you know, were wild, and I had manic episodes, and they confused that with, oh, well, she's going through puberty and she just should be on antidepressants, which made my highs higher and lows lower. I was never depressed. It was more just, oh, I could stay up for 3 days straight and just drive a car for days on end, you know, with irrational thoughts. I, I could go 3 days of no sleep. That doctor came and He's like, you're going to be okay. This is like a normal feeling. When I was like, no, I'm having a stroke. I'm dying. You don't understand. I had a complete, you know, suicidal attempt of, you know, rage driving and, you know, turn the wheel one way. And that was a really tough period for me.

Hello, welcome back to the Dr. Joy Kong Podcast. And you know, my mission here is to help you to live Longer, Better, Happier. And, you know, I'm bringing all kinds of amazing guests. And today, I'm so excited to speak with Alessandra Tor—

okay, I'm gonna say it. No, don't worry, because on my podcast, I mess up everyone's last name. It's Torassani.

It's Torassani.

I'm so sorry.

Yes, Alessandra. So, I want to introduce Alessandra a little bit. And, first of all, welcome to the show.

Thank you for having me. This is so much fun because we just recorded my podcast and Dr. Joy Kong was on and we got to talk all about stem cell therapy and anti-aging and youth and beauty and fun and taking care of ourselves. So this is wonderful.

I know. And now we're going to have a whole different conversation. So Alessandra is an acclaimed actress. It's fantastic. And you think she has a diverse career spanning over two decades. Best known for her role as Zoe Greystone in Caprica, and she has made her mark in both television and film with appearances on popular series like The Big Bang Theory, which I love it, and American Horror Story, as well as movies like Step Sisters. Beyond her onscreen talent, Alessandra is a vocal advocate for mental health awareness, using her platform to promote discussions on mental wellness. She's a creator and host of the podcast Emotional Support, which follows her journey of self-discovery living with bipolar I disorder. Her captivating performances and dedication to important causes continue to make her a prominent figure in the entertainment industry. So I— there's so much to talk about. And of course, you know, I was a psychiatrist. For 11 years before I ever got into the anti-aging and stem cell field. So, so this is totally like my realm. Yeah. And it would be really interesting to talk with you and see what your journey is like.

Sure.

Everyone has an incredible journey. And to be, to be honest, it was so funny. There was a time I secretly was wishing that I had bipolar disorder. No, stop it. Because, uh, have you heard of, uh, I think her name's Jamie, uh, what's her name? Uh, she, she wrote the book Touched by Fire. She's one of the most famous, um, she's a, I think, psychologist. Um, she has bipolar disorder. She, gosh, no, she was talking about how bipolar is connected to creativity, how they, they, they, they come hand in hand. And in so many incredible people throughout history who who are, you know, who have shaped our culture and, and are, you know, enriched our heritage, and they have bipolar disorder. And I was, I was, I was like, yes, I think I have a little bit of feature here. Maybe I have it.

Cultured and be a name in this world. Wow, I can't wait to check that book out. Yeah, By Fire.

Okay, it's incredible. It started with her talking about her running like a crazy woman in the parking lot of UCLA and just being completely delusional. Um, yeah, so went through her journey, but she's one of the most famous advocates for bipolar, you know, awareness. So, but it is funny that, that, you know, to me it's like, oh, there's, it's kind of glamorous.

Yeah. And I think also now it's like, it's, it, you know, it was something when, when I was first diagnosed, it was, I was told by, you know, some people that represented me and some people, you know, producers and stuff. They were like, you probably shouldn't tell anyone about it because it's going to make you sound difficult and hard to work with on set. And so I kept it hidden for years. And then finally it came to a point where I was just like, I heard other people share their stories and it had moved me so much, particularly I'm an ambassador for NAMI, which is the National Alliance on Mental Illness. And I had gone to one of their speaking engagements as just someone who was invited through a mutual friend, and I didn't know anything about it at the time. And I remember being so moved by these people that were coming up there and sharing their real-life experiences. And they weren't just doctors, they weren't clinicians, they weren't like, you know, it wasn't factual, right? It was like, this is just their life and their lived experience. And it resonated so much to me, and I related so much to it that For me, I was like, I don't really care what this does for my career at this point because these people are saving my life just by knowing that I'm not alone, that I'm going to start talking about it. And that's how the podcast kind of started. And it was me just sharing my lived experience and interviewing other celebrities, actors, musicians, doctors, you know, um, specialists like yourself, you know, sharing their own personal journeys with mental health and mental wellness. And just to know that we're not alone and, and how important it is that when you are ready to share your story, how you really can save a life, whether you know it or not.

Yeah. So how stable are you in your bipolar?

Yeah, well, it's funny, I— we talked about it on, on my podcast, but I had been misdiagnosed my whole life. I— it actually started when I was very, very, very young, but probably the first sign for me was when I was 5. I had a problem crossing thresholds. I couldn't go from one side of the front door to the other side of the front door. I couldn't go from one side of the karate studio to the other side of the karate studio and the dance studio. Who was blocking you? Well, I did hypnotherapy, and that was the thing that actually helped me. And what we realized now after all these years was it was perfectionism. I was so afraid of not being as good as the time before that I'd rather not even try. And so that was— and it was wild because my parents were not pushing me to do anything. So it was my own internal, you know, issue. And when I turned 15, I— my hormones were out of control and my highs, you know, were wild. And I had manic episodes and they confused that with, oh, well, she's going through puberty and she just should be on antidepressants. Which made my highs higher and lows lower. Um, and so we—

to do—

it's very dangerous. And that's why a lot of people have these suicidal ideations and, and, and actually follow through with these suicidal ideations, um, when they're just wrongly medicated. And so it's something that I, I forgot exactly what it is. My friend who's a neuroscientist knows exactly, and he talks about it on my podcast, so I should know this. By now, but I think for bipolar disorder, it's something like 10 to 12 years for you to get a proper diagnosis. It's one of the hardest things to diagnose. I've interviewed a lot of people as well who have ADHD who were diagnosed with bipolar disorder, and that's something that can be very confused with ADHD as well. Very similar, similar symptoms and outbursts and episodes. It's something that's not easy to diagnose. And I think when you do get diagnosed, then you have this sense of relief because you're like, oh, this is actually what it is. So cut to now at, you know, 38 years old, I'm actually not on any medication at the moment. I had to get off my medication for my own personal journey when I got pregnant, and I actually breastfed and didn't want to get on my medication breastfeeding. And I was the crazy person that breastfed for over 3 and a half years.

I see.

So I did not get back on my medication in that time, and I just finished breastfeeding a couple of weeks ago. And so I'm now kind of slowly waiting to see, you know, where I'm going to get on that spectrum of getting back on medication, how I'm going to do it. What is going to be the proper dosage? Do I need it? You know, and I am someone that wants to be very clear. I go to a psychiatrist. I have a therapist. Like, I'm being very well monitored. But, you know, as you know, our brain is plastic, you know, and it changes all the time and it molds. And, you know, That's why I, I'm a firm believer in you shouldn't be on the same medication for your— in the same dosage your entire life. Everything is changing constantly, and so you have to constantly be reevaluated and, and reseen. So, you know, we shall see what, um, the next immediate future is gonna hold for me. But I've found, um, different types of modalities have helped me from Transcendental Meditation to acupuncture to, um, Understanding, I think, also my cycle more than I ever have and understand—

How did your cycle affect the bipolar disorder?

Oh, I just, you know, there are certain, you know, phases like, you know, week 3, like I noticed my highs become higher and I become really irrational and I become short-tempered and that that could sometimes trigger a manic episode if I don't kind of check myself, eat properly, get the right amount of sleep, you know, really like do the work. And I think also exercise has been something that's been very huge in my life to helping control my, my episodes and my— not even my episodes, but just my emotions and regulate. I'm a dancer and I had stopped dancing for a really long time. And I had stopped exercising for a really long time because when I was pregnant, I essentially couldn't go around the block walking more than a block, otherwise I'd go into labor. And they told me that they were like, you otherwise you're gonna be on bed rest. So I never exercised. I never did anything. And then I dealt with severe postpartum anxiety afterwards and, and OCD, and I just couldn't get my body to even focus to wanna take a class. And then I slowly started doing ballet again, and I've noticed just the change of my sleep patterns, my, how I feel, what I'm craving, the good foods that I'm craving to eat. Just everything has changed so much in such a short period of time, just from getting active again. And it's, it's wild how much that can help.

Hmm.

Wow.

And so when you were a little kid, you saw that there was some kind of mental or behavioral issues that were strange, right, as a young child. That's different. And then what, what else did you notice? And how did you— was there a lot of depression, or were there any of the manic—

no depression. That's what was wild. There was definitely no depression. The, the type of bipolar that I have— there's bipolar 1, bipolar 2, and now bipolar 3. Bipolar 2 is is more of the depressed episodes for long periods of time. Mine feel like, you know, you, you shoot up an emotion and you crash. You go up and down, and it's in short periods of time. But I never had— I was never depressed. I was never, you know, wanting to not get out of bed for months on end. It was never like that. It was more just, oh, I could stay up for 3 days straight and just drive a car for days on end, you know, or, you know, I relate to the woman that you say who, who wrote the book, who was running around like a wild maniac, you know, on the street, like, you know, with irrational thoughts like that. That was more me. Um, but, you know, when I, when I was younger, when I was 15, that's what was so confusing is I wasn't depressed. So I don't know why they put me on an antidepressant, but I was feeling just these manic episodes of You know, I, I could go 3 days of no sleep and my mom would be like, I'm shocked that your psychiatrist never asked you that question. Um, no. And something that I recommend everyone do that, you know, was not talked about at the time because there was no one sharing information about mental illness. It was so, you know, when my mom was having me and I was 5 years old and these things were happening, you know, there was no talk of behavioral therapists. There was none of this. That was so huge of my mom to, you know, take me to therapy, take me to hypnotherapy, do all these different types of modalities and help and take me to yoga, like anything she could with breathwork. That was unheard of. That never happened, you know. So something that I recommend now to people is write down and keep a journal every day, you know, because I think that when you go into a doctor, right? Let's say that you have stomach pain, right? You go in and you're like, I have pain and it happens at this time, blah, blah, blah, whatever. You're not talking about the other times that you're not in pain. And I think like when we go into a psychiatrist, we say, you know, for me, I'm like, oh, you know, I, you know, I'm feeling really angry today, but we're not talking about the good days where my mania made me feel amazing. Which was not normal to feel that good. You know, it wasn't normal to feel like I was untouchable and you, you know, come at me, you know what I mean? This like empowerment because it was like so much energy and so much the, I didn't think the no sleeping for 3 days was a bad thing. I just thought like, oh, well, I had this like superpower, like whatever, you know? So I, if I would have written these things down and, you know, it's not just the doctors. Fault. It's no one's fault, but it's, it's communication and it's about painting the entire picture of a diagnosis opposed to just the issues and the problems that you're having.

Yeah. And then, so you got into, what was it, a pretty serious manic episode after you were given antidepressants?

Yeah, I had a complete, you know, suicidal attempt of, rage driving and I was on Mulholland and I turned the wheel one way and someone must have been looking out for me because it went up the mountain opposed to down the mountain. And that was a really tough period for me because I was so ill medicated and just, it made my highs higher and lows lower and that continued and then it dissipated. It went away for a little bit because once the manic episodes go away, you think everything's fine. You think everything's normal.

Were you still taking the medication?

No, I had gotten off the medication after that point. Yes. Okay. Um, but they didn't know what it was, you know, and I was like, I don't want to be on anything. And I started getting panic attacks and, and numbness on the side of my, you know, arms and legs. And I had had MRIs and they were like, there's nothing wrong with her. Like, you know, so there were a lot of different incidents that had happened. That accumulated. And I remember being on the set of Caprica in Vancouver, and I wasn't around my normal, in quote-unquote, normal team of doctors or specialists. And I had a panic attack on set, and no one knew except for the hair and makeup team. And they had to come and they gave me a beta blocker. The set doctor came and he's like, you're going to be okay. This is like a normal feeling. You're just having a panic attack, and I never been able to identify what that was. And it was my first time having a really massive one. I was like, no, I'm having a stroke. I'm dying. You don't understand. Like, I was like, this is a big deal. And so when I had finished set and I had come back to LA, I was like, I'm going to go to my acupuncturist. Like, I'm feeling like out of whack. My body's like not feeling right. And I had mentioned the numbness on my side of my body. I had mentioned my migraines. I had mentioned You know, the not sleeping I had mentioned, you know, these outbursts and, you know, temper. And he was like, you know, seems really like easy to me. It sounds like very similar to bipolar disorder. I have a lot of creative types that live with this, you know. Has anyone ever told you this could be it? I was like, what? You know, I went to a new psychiatrist and he was like, oh yeah, that sounds about right. Like, let's put you on this medication and see if this evens you out. And it did. It was crazy. It was like immediate relief. And for someone to identify what the issue was, was just like a breath of fresh air. Hmm.

So that lowered your highs and then, and you, you never had that much low. So yeah.

And I mean, look, it still continued. It doesn't fully go away, you know, and the, the type of medication that I was on A lot of actors, they told me, were on it because you could still get in touch with your emotions and you could still cry and you can still feel things. It wasn't numbing, you know, but it was, you know, there's only so much that medicine does. And that was something that I kind of learned the hard way is I thought, okay, well, I'm cured. I'm good. You know, but I would still feel like the mania coming on. I would still feel this explosion in my stomach. I'd still feel the stress. And it was about learning all different types of things to kind of help manage that. And I think over the years, that's what I, I, I, I'm so lucky that I think helped me with my pregnancy being off my medication was the right team around me, the right people around me where they knew like, hey, if shit goes bad, excuse my French, like we're going to have to put you back on medication, you know? Um, but I had different types of tools in my toolbox to help regulate those emotions if I was feeling them in the immediate.

And what kind of tools did you have so that when you're off medication, you, you're still stable? Yeah.

I mean, for me, uh, meditation was everything, you know, and breathwork, which got very tricky towards my third trimester because I was so big and I couldn't breathe. And I was like, in so much pain. But, you know, I practice hypnobirthing and I had an amazing hypnobirthing coach that would help. Hypnobirthing. Hypnobirthing is amazing. It's a way for you to give birth. The whole thing is like, yes, you can take medication if you want, you know, and get an epidural and, you know, but it's, it's, it's mostly for a medical-free, you know, not medical-free, a medicine-free birth. I forgot, it's been many years, so correct me if I'm doing this incorrect, like how I'm explaining this. But basically it's a way of like using hypnosis, using breathwork, working with your partner on having this pain-free birth and being in the moment and being present and actually being in touch with your baby and helping your baby get out of your body in the best seamless way possible. And so she would teach me different types of hypnosis, you know, of calming hypnosis, because I had such anxiety and I had, and I had felt that, that mania kind of coming up of, of not the mania, that's not the right word, but I felt the stress coming up of, of the nerves, right? It's a very scary thing to give birth and the unknown, I would say, is what it was that I was scared of. Um, and it helped me so much, that tool, being able to, you know, put the hypnosis on, listen to her calming voice, you know, picture things, visualize, you know, that helped me so much more than just the birth. It's helped me through so many things, through my fear of flying. It's helped me through, you know, the fear of the unknown in life. It's, it's helped me so much.

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Hmm.

I see.

Yeah.

What are the other tools? So meditation.

Meditation is a huge one. Transcendental meditation helped me so much. Just getting out of your head while also being in your head, if that makes sense. I just we, we forget to be present in life. And I think especially with mental health and mental wellness, we get so in our head that we spiral. And so being able to kind of focus, but then release, there's something about that present and being aware of what's going on is such a beautiful thing. To just listen to your body and just listen to your breath is so important and it can really help you. Just breathing can help you so much.

Hmm. Yeah. And what about other things that you were, you were doing? Was there any nutritional support that you felt was making a difference for you?

Oh, absolutely. I feel for, I'm a vegetarian. I've always been a vegetarian. Um, for me, just clean eating, teas, everything warm really like helps settle my body. It was so important to postpartum, just fueling your body with the right nutrients and fueling your body with warm soups and teas and, you know, making sure that I had— I was taking care of my body because I was breastfeeding. I was also taking care of a little person too, you know. And so I wanted to make sure I wasn't just eating crap, you know, and putting that into my baby. You know, it was very important for me to have a clean, clean system.

Yeah. What about movements? Were you advised to have, do certain exercises?

You know, movement is so important to me and it's the most healing thing, especially with my dance. That's my biggest form of therapy. But the problem was, is because I had such a low placenta, um, I was not allowed to move and I wasn't allowed to even do more than a walk around the block. And so that was very hard for me and very difficult because I saw all of my friends able to keep up and do their normal exercises and do their Pilates and do their yoga and their jumping classes and all this stuff. And I was like, I can't do any of that. And it wasn't that I was worried about weight gain or any of that. That was not the issue. It was more just not being able to get energy flow in your body. Energy is so important to us. And when you're stagnant, things can get very heavy. And so I think that's why I turned so much to the meditation because it was the only form of movement I could have. And that would be in my brain. You know, it was, it was really moving energy through your body. And you're moving energy through your body. But it was very, very, very hard for me. And that's why I find it was an easier transition stopping breastfeeding and the hormones. I mean, it was definitely a week of crazy hormone rush, you know, changing in my body when I stopped. But being able to find my movement through dance and through Pilates and hot yoga, like that really has helped me so much to kind of get my chi in check, if you will.

Yeah. Amazing. So, and what do you think you've, you know, through the process of dealing with bipolar disorder, what do you think are the good things that it brought to your life?

Oh my God. I think it's brought the most amazing things in my entire life. I think that it's brought awareness to mental illness for me of being a better mom and being able to know that it's okay if there is something wrong. Not even something wrong, but if there is an issue that ever comes up with my child where I'm so open and I'm so able to provide so many different resources to my child or to other friends who may be in need. I find that it's by me being open about it, it's created a trusted space with strangers and friends and family who feel like, yes, I'm not the professional who's diagnosing you by any means, but I'm someone that can open and willingly have a conversation with you without any form of judgment. And I find that that is one of the most important things in my life that I am so blessed to be able to provide other people of being this like trusted space where they feel they can open up and be themselves. And there's no, I don't, you're who you are. I love you for who you are. That's amazing.

It almost helped you to interact with people in a way that, that everyone is more real.

Yeah. Yeah. And, and I feel like. You know, there are a lot of, a lot of moms, you know, who experience postpartum depression and anxiety and OCD. You know, I never heard their stories and these were good friends of mine. And then I started openly talking about my issues and they would come forward and be like, oh yeah, I experienced that. And I'm like, why didn't you tell me? You know, I, you know, but I think that being able to be so open with your own mental health can help so many more people than you expect. And, and in that way, it helped me so much because I knew that I wasn't alone in my journey or I wasn't an outcast for feeling the way that I feel. Now, you know, it's also hard because I also have a lot of people that think because I am so open about it that maybe I can hear things that I don't want to hear or take criticism better or, you know, like certain things like that because I am so open. But I'd rather be open than not open because I hope to be the arms that people feel safe coming to and do that. You know, it also— with bipolar disorder, we're talking about like your creativity. Like, I think that it's been— it's funny because I think that there is something that's been said by a lot of artists in the world that think that it's a superpower. And I totally think it is a superpower. Like, don't get me wrong. But I think that it's not just a superpower. It's— you're— that's not an excuse for your superpower. That's not an excuse for maybe being a good writer, for being a good singer, for being a good actor, whatever it may be. Like, it's just something that you deal with, you know what I mean? And it is something that's there. But I don't think that in manic episodes it makes you that much better. I truly don't believe that. I think maybe it gives you a false sense that you're that much better. And I think that that's when things can be very scary and it can be exciting to hear, oh, bipolar disorder. Oh, that's when my creativity is going to come. Yeah, creativity may come, but you also may be at a point where you are suicidal and that's your moment where you lose your life. So I think that a lot of people glamorize it, but it's not. It's just another thing that you live with, you know, it's another sickness, you know, and, and there's cures and there's, you know, Eastern medicine and Western medicine and different things that you do to help, you know, stabilize it. But, um, I think a lot of the time it's glamorized, but I think it's your own creativity that makes you that amazing, and it's not triggered by particularly the bipolar?

Well, there's definitely brain chemistry differences, you know, when people have bipolar disorder and probably certain brain areas are more activated. And yeah, um, so that allows them to be more in touch with creativity.

Sure.

Yeah, so right, it's like a, you know, a blessing and a curse.

It's a blessing and a curse because like, you know, some days, you know, I'm feeling like on top of the world and I'm unstoppable, But like the outside world is maybe looking at me and being like, oh my God, is she okay? Like she hasn't slept for 3 days. Like she looks like shit. Like, you know what I mean? And maybe I'm like having great ideas and I'm like, oh my God, I want to, I want to start this show and I want to do this and blah, blah, blah, all this stuff. But the outside world is like, oh no, she's not well. Like she needs to like go sleep, you know? So I think it's, you know, probably difficult.

You make you question yourself, right? Make you Yeah, the harder to trust yourself.

They're like, is this really a good idea, or is this just like, uh, so how long have you been public about bipolar disorder? You know, I, I'd say that I was public a few years before I started talking about my podcast, and I think my podcast has been going on now for going on 7 years, maybe 8 years. Um, I think it started like a year and a half before, uh, COVID. And, you know, it has not been a straight 8 years through, but I have, you know, almost 300 episodes that I've made and, you know, interviewing different guests. And it's— that's what I call like the most public I've been. I've been an ambassador for NAMI for probably almost 10 years now. And that's when I started publicly sharing about it, doing little YouTube clips or speaking engagements. And stuff like that. But, um, but yeah, it's almost close to 10 years then. Almost a decade. Yeah.

Yeah. Do you think from when you first started sharing to now, there have been any shifts and differences in people's attitudes?

Yes, I think that there have been huge shifts. I think, you know, with the popularity of people like Selena Gomez or Demi Lovato coming out and speaking about their diagnosis of bipolar disorder, You know, people have been more aware of what it is and being open to talking about it. You know, I think that there have been, you know, still now I'll hear people go, oh my God, the weather is so bipolar. And I'm like, that's not really how you use it, but okay. You know, I'm not someone that's like offended by it by any means. A lot of people are offended, but I'm like, I think there's other words that we can use. But I think that there has been change in the sense of open conversation. You know, at the time it was so, oh my God, I can't believe that you're going to talk about this on a podcast. And like, I couldn't get a lot of guests at first on the podcast wanting to talk about mental illness, and now people want to come on and talk about it because whether or not they're living with mental illness, they sure as, you know, whatever, know someone that is, you know, whether it be a close family member, whether it be a child, whether it be their mom or their dad or, or a friend or You know, maybe just they're feeling anxiety. I think during COVID more people became open to mental health because we were so isolated and we didn't know what this feeling of isolation was, you know? And for me, I was like, oh, I know exactly what this is too. I've been living in isolation in my brain for a long time, like hiding things. And so I think finding connection has helped us. Um, so much being open about mental health and mental wellness. Mm-hmm.

Yeah. So what would you say to someone that is wondering about their mood and, and maybe going through a lot, a lot of ups and downs? How would you suggest they approach this, uh, difficulty?

I would say the first thing that you need to do is write down all of your symptoms, whether it be the highs, whether it be the lows, whether it be the whatever days, you know, write down what you're eating in the day. Is that affecting maybe your mood? Is that changing the way you're, you're feeling? You know, are you exercising? You know, go for a walk around the block. I'm not asking you to pay for a class. Just go for a walk. See if, like, you can get out of your head for a moment. And with all that information, then take that to, you know, a trained professional and say, hey, You know, I'm really concerned for X, Y, and Z. Here's what my symptoms have been. These are the things that I've been eating. This is the exercise I've been doing. Maybe see, are there certain people around you that are triggering you to maybe have certain behavioral aspects? You know, little things like that. But I think writing down is so important that, that you can provide so much more information to a provider or healthcare provider, you know, and, and learn more about what could possibly be your diagnosis. Or maybe they're just like, hey, you have really like bad friends, you have bad eating habits, and you're not exercising, and just like go for a walk around the block. Like, you know, you never, you never know what—

a lot simpler than you think. Yeah, yeah, that's great advice. Yeah, which is what a lot of people are not thinking about.

Yeah, 100%.

I'm suffering, I'm dealing with something, let me go, you know, maybe I need medication. So without really fully understanding what's going on in their situation.

And I think medication is thrown out so easily now, um, more than ever. And I see it with children especially. Like, I have friends, you know, who have kids that are 6, 7 years old and half the kids are on Adderall, you know, because they're like, oh, they're, you know, they have ADD, they have this. And I'm just like, They're boys. Let them run outside for an hour and then bring them back inside and then put them in school. Or, you know, you see this.

Medications are for the convenience of the parents.

Sometimes the medications are for the convenience of the parents. And, you know, I just, I feel like we need to just have a whole grasp of what everything that we are doing as a whole human being. From food, from, from, you know, exercise, from our mental wellness, the people we're surrounding ourselves with, television screens, all sorts of things like that can really impact our health. I know I see my child, you know, she watches a, you know, a Disney movie at night. She's fine. If it's during the day and it's put on and you pull it away, she screams. We are not an iPad family like You see these, these behaviors and people are like, oh, my kid's just crazy. No, try to take little things away from them gradually, like, like a TV screen, and you're going to see such a difference. I'm not saying I'm perfect. Like, we watch movies like we do, but there's a time, there's a place, there's— and there's a time. That being the key is time. And you see differences. Like, you see your kid have sugar and chocolate and they're bouncing off the wall. Because of what they ate. You know, it's, it's simple, you know. So if we could see how delicate we are maybe with our children and how we can maybe integrate that into ourselves, that would be amazing.

Right, right. Really be, um, be a detective.

Yeah.

Be conscious of what you're doing.

Yeah.

With yourself and with your child.

Of course.

Yeah.

Do you ever— can I ask you a quick question that I didn't ask on my podcast, which I feel like I, I'm so curious about? Is there any research on stem cells with mental illness?

You know, there hasn't been enough studies. So I was looking for, yeah, for good evidence. But, you know, it doesn't mean that it's not going to help. I heard of it helping. But as far as typical mental illness, depression, anxiety, bipolar disorder, psychosis, there just hasn't been very much evidence. Have I— well, one thing that there is evidence is actually alcoholism, which is fascinating. And I've treated patients with stem cells to reduce pain or to help them, you know, reduce the aging effect, right? Just anti-aging treatment. And then they come back to me saying, well, you know, I used to love alcohol. You know, they were drinking on a daily basis. And I, I lost my zest for it. He said they lost that enthusiasm to drink. And research on animals, on alcoholic rats, actually showed that giving one dose of stem cells to these animals actually reduced their acute drinking behavior by about 30%. So, they drastically reduced their drinking behavior. And, and even when they tested them, almost like a simulation to rehab centers. Yeah. What they do is that they give them alcohol at first, 10%, free drinking, and then 20%, so really escalating. So they drank, drank, drank, and then boom, they cut it off. No more alcohol. On day 4 of no alcohol, that's when they either give them a control, you know, injection. Yeah. Placebo or stem cells. So the ones that got stem cells, what they did was that they waited for 10 more days of no alcohol. So basically 2 days of clean period. Right. And then they reintroduced alcohol. They got alcohol on the, you know, you know, in the cage. They can drink as much as they want. So the ones that got stem cells, their drinking behavior was reduced. Yeah. Close to 80%. So that is huge.

That's so fascinating. Yeah, well, you know, it's interesting because my, my friend who's a neuroscientist who comes on my podcast and answers fan questions, you know, he answers from the intellectual side and I answer from the fluff side. But it's interesting because we were talking about GLP-1s and he was saying how so many of these high-end rehabs now are giving GLP-1s to people as soon as they come in to rehab, as soon as they check in. Because what they're finding is that they are not craving the alcohol anymore because it's sugar. And so it's interesting. Yeah.

You know, um, so stem cells can reduce alcohol drinking behavior, but also antioxidants like NAC, um, can reduce alcohol drinking behavior. And the hypothesis is that they both reduce neuroinflammation. So if you can reduce inflammation, then you can reduce this addictive behavior. And what's interesting was, you know, NAD, you mentioned NAD, has been used for addiction for people who go through acute withdrawal, especially of heroin, right, of opiates.

Wow.

When they— so they go through really horrible withdrawals.

Yeah.

But if they get IV NAD infusion, they have very little withdrawal symptoms. And what's funny was they said in the past, a lot of these addicts would change what they use to fuel the addiction. So if they don't— this is why in AA meetings people are eating donuts and coffee like crazy, right? So there's always donuts, coffee, or people start smoking.

Yeah.

So that's replacing the addiction, right? You're trying, still trying to stimulate the dopamine release. So what happened was that when— so they saw people first day off heroin, people were— or opiates, they were eating candies or all these wrappers, all these things all around. And then 3 days, you know, 2, 3, as days goes on, you know, with the NAD infusion, there's less and less of these wrappers. So they started to release other addictive behaviors.

Right, right.

So, if you think of GLP-1, there's definitely— there's, you know, we don't know how much is addictive behavior as far as overeating, you know, when people are eating too much. So, all of a sudden, that drive, repetitive, you know, feeding your face kind of drive was blunted. And, I have to look into a little bit more in the GLP-1, what it does in the brain with addiction. But, that's really fascinating.

Isn't that fascinating? No, I mean, And it makes sense, right? Because it's curving the craving of sugar. And I mean, that makes sense. Alcohol is sugar. Like, that's what it is, you know?

Yeah.

Just, it's so wild, like how our brains work and our bodies work and how everything is—

It's all connected.

All one.

Yeah. It's all connected. You feed your body junk, your brain is not going to function very well.

Yeah. Yeah.

And if you reduce inflammation throughout your body, your brain inflammation also is going to go down.

Yeah. Yeah.

So, so, um, how— what kind of, uh, work are you doing to promote awareness for bipolar disorder and mental health in general?

I think one of the best jobs I've ever had in my life has been an ambassador for, for NAMI. Um, They, they do so much for the mental health community. From the— NAMI is amazing. It's, it's this huge organization, the National Alliance on Mental Illness. But then they also have little ones that are based in different cities and different, different states. Like they have multiple different, different ones and they just do so much. It's unbelievable. They have free resources, they have events. They have meetups, they have all of the resources that you need for all the doctors. They have just— they do so much from everyone from sports to actors to musicians to, you know, everyday people. Like, it's, it's amazing what they've done. So being able to be like a very tiny, tiny, tiny part of this community has, has helped me so much use my voice in a way more powerful way than I ever thought I could. And, um, being able to be like front of the line and meet different, different people who are willing to help and who you didn't realize maybe have mental illness, um, like you, and that you can relate to. Um, I think having the podcast has been great, but the thing that I'm so proud of right now is meeting different communities um, who— of women who maybe didn't know what mental illness was, um, but then they had their babies and they suffered postpartum depression or postpartum OCD or postpartum anxiety. And having no idea what this is, and all of a sudden you have this newborn, your hormones are crashing, and your life is like falling apart in front of you. Being able to meet those women and having them know that this is like a trusted space where, um, we can all get together and talk has been something that's so important to me. Because it's, it's one thing to know that you have a mental illness, it's another to be completely surprised, caught off guard at 30-some, 40 years old, and be like, and now what do I start, you know? And I have a tiny human.

Yeah, so that's— Ami will be a really great resource for people to Navi local chapter.

Incredible. Yes. An incredible resource. Yes. Wow.

And how can people follow your work?

Oh, yes. Well, you can listen to the podcast, Emotionale Support. You can listen to your fabulous episode that's going to come out. And that's a great way. And then if you follow me on my social media, it's just @AlessandraTorrisani, which is a mouthful. But if you put it Alessandra with two S's and Torresani with two R's. You are sure to find it. And yeah, follow along with my journey. And, you know, I talk all things mental health, mental wellness. I try to make light of the mom community. And, you know, I really want to support women as much as I possibly can who are, you know, going through it. I think it's a really tough age. That I'm in right now of the, you know, going through having babies, perimenopause, menopause. It's a— it's something that's not talked about a lot, and I want to be the voice for the voiceless and talk about it.

Yeah, thank you. Thank you for doing that. Thank you for bringing compassion and strength to so many people around you.

Oh, thank you. I appreciate being on this show. It's been so fun.

Yes, Alexandra, thank you for being my guest.

Thank you.

Thank you for watching and listening. If you enjoyed this kind of content, please subscribe and turn on your notification bell so you don't miss any of my future content. And if you want to learn more about regenerative medicine or other modalities in anti-aging medicine, please go to my YouTube channel, Joy Kong, MD, and there are all kinds of videos to help you keep learning.