A Conversation About Fashion ft. OpenWardrobe CEO and Founder Julia Dietmar

Hi, my name is Brooke Littman, and I'm Dr.

Deb Littman, and this is Wine Together, a podcast where we drink some wine and have a chat.

So sit back, relax, and get that corkscrew ready.

Okay, okay. Well, Brooke, exciting time. Into the—

I'm excited.

Yeah, we have a special guest, very special guest.

We teased it a little bit ago.

Yeah, we did give a little tease out about this.

Yeah.

And so, but so our guest today is Julia Dietmar. And Julia, where are you located?

I'm located in San Francisco Bay Area.

Oh, San Francisco Bay. Oh, fantastic. Yeah. Give me a good reason to go to California.

Yes.

Okay. So, and Julia has an app that she works with. Her app is called Open Wardrobe. And I hope I didn't get anything incorrect about that. But Julia, we're going to just kind of turn it over to you. Tell us all about your app.

Well, we started this app during the pandemic. It was kind of a compilation of my experiences over the last 15 years working in retail tech and with many apparel brands around the world and working on my previous company. Previous job was we were making AI for retailers to help them personalize experiences for their customers online mainly. And that kind of, all of that experience came together in Open Wardrobe. And it's a platform, I'm calling it platform for mindful dressing. So really what it is, it's a tool that helps you make decisions on what to keep in your wardrobe, what to bring into your wardrobe, how to dress a little bit better for your body shape, for your colors, how to make decisions around If I want to buy something, is this something that I'm actually going to love and wear? Or am I going to— especially when we buy online, right? We return a lot of things, like 30% of things bought online, especially apparel, gets returned. And that is because we either do not kind of think about it upfront around, am I going to wear it with things that I already own? How am I going to use it? So we make all of those decisions much easier. And then, um, for— we are very sustainability focused, although we don't hit you over the head with sustainability. If you choose to be sustainable, we have all the tools. Um, or if you just want to feel a little bit better about your closet and about what you wear, we have the tools for you as well. So that's, that's what we're about.

Okay, well, that's— well, you kind of segued right into one of my questions because sustainability is important to me. Yeah, um, I think financially sustainable and also environmentally sustainable, both of those are, um, important, um, aspects of anything for me. So I want to understand, how, how can you— how can we as consumers With all that we're kind of inundated with as far as advertising, how do we become more sustainable? And when thinking of our environment around our wardrobe, because we're just consumed with so many, so much— Brooke was calling it fast fashion. And I— it's hard for me to say no. Yeah, I am easily— advertisers, I feel like they, they know me and they just kind of— I mean, I know they don't, but I'm just the kind of person, my personality is, oh yes, I want that, I want that, I want that. How do I tell myself maybe I don't need that?

Yeah, it's, it's difficult because with, with the modern advertising industry and, and influencers, The value that's being placed is on newness. You need to have this new stuff instead of placing the value on quality and placing the value on things you actually will use and love. And that's, that's where this whole problem is coming from, right? Overconsumption leads to overproduction and vice versa, right?

Yes.

So, so, And this is exactly what we're trying to solve. Our big mission, of course, is to help keep clothes out of landfills, but we're not working with industry, we're working with consumers, and we're trying to empower consumers. So, and all the tools that we have are designed to just stop or think for a minute, right? If you think about this from the environmental sustainability point of view, I don't know if you've heard the statistics, but there is a number has been floating around and that is 30. So 30 times an item needs to be worn, at least 30 times for it to be considered sustainable regardless of how it was produced. I mean, it's already produced, right? So now let's wear it 30 times for it to be sustainable. We as consumers, apparel consumers, wear our garments on average 7 times. And that's, and that's average, right? So a lot of garments are worn even less. So, um, in, in, and of course you're saying, yes, yes, I want that. So you probably see it on a friend or on a model or on a person and it looks amazing. And you said, I want that. I want to look just as amazing. You buy that actual thing, you try it on. And more times than not, it doesn't look as amazing on us. Or maybe something else will look amazing on us, but not as amazing on our friend or our sister or whoever. And that is because we're all different, right? Like, your style personality is different. Your, your coloring is different. Like, you're sitting next to Brooke, you look super different, right?

Yeah. Right?

And, and, and that is what we're saying. Like, yes, you like that item. Just stop and think, is this gonna flatter you? Are you gonna be able to wear it at least 30 times? And the tools that we provide are very simple. So if you choose to digitize your wardrobe, and then when you shop, by the way, we don't sell anything. We don't sell clothes, we just provide tools. And, but one of the tools is a browser extension that you can install on your Chrome browser. And then when you shop online, You can access your digital wardrobe and our AI from any website. So when you are on your favorite store and you're looking at a blouse, you can very quickly say, okay, first of all, do I have something similar already? And show me, and our AI can do that, show me how I can wear this with what I already own. And it starts spitting out bunch of outfit ideas, and you can at least visualize, okay, yeah, I, I will wear it for many different occasions. I will, I will use that. Um, and then the same thing is we have a bunch of tools that can help you see, does it flatter my body shape? Does it flatter my coloring? Um, so it's really just stop and think, and that's the first step.

Okay, and so you're throwing away that number 30. I actually have clothes in my wardrobe that I've had for 30 years. Now Some, of course, I have some that, you know, I've only worn once. And in fact, I was just looking at the Brooke award here, or the dress I wore to your graduation. Yeah, I've only worn that dress once. It was to Brooke's graduation. And it's, it's a pretty dress. I thought, well, I don't know. I think my issue is I don't know when I'm going to wear things again, like really nice things, because I don't go out much. I mean, when we go out, it's kind of here, you know, going out is in spring, summer. We have nice, nice little outdoor seating at cafes and bars. But yeah, you know, I hike. That's my going out. And so, and so I don't— I needed the— I needed to stop and think. Kind of command from you. I needed— I really needed that. And I'm really surprised that 7 times is the average. What would you—

did you think it was more or less?

I, I would have thought more. I would have hoped more. I think, I think because as an environmentalist, I, I do concern myself with— it's not just the financial sustainability I concern myself with. I am concerned about, you know, our environment and what we're doing. And I've seen documentaries where, um, clothes end up in other countries just piled up on, on the beaches.

Yeah.

And, and they're just piles of clothes. It almost looks like a landfill on a beautiful beach, um, in a developing country. And, and so, and I know that there are people, you know, fortunately there are people in those countries that are saying, hey, we're going to take this and kind of see what we can do with it. But a lot of times when those clothes end up on those beaches, they're torn, they're molded, they're, you know, so a lot of it is just— it becomes trash.

Exactly. 11.3 million tons of textiles are thrown out every year. It's a lot.

That is a lot.

Yeah. So, uh, so, okay, so let's, let's talk about, uh, about that. Um, So part of our mission, as I said, is to help alleviate the problem. And what we do is, is really one thing is helping you utilize clothes you already have and, and then make and help you make better decisions for when you want to bring something new into the closet. And when I say new, I don't mean always buy new, right? It's new to you. It could be buying secondhand, it could be you know, taking something from your sister or mother or whoever. So, and then what do you do with it? So of course we show you how to wear it in many ways, right? Through our outfit suggestions. And by the way, the AI that we have, it's not designed to always be perfect. It's designed to spark creativity in you because a lot of times you, we don't even go beyond what we usually do, right? Oh, we bought this blouse to wear with this skirt and we don't go beyond that, right? And then, and this is basically just to show you other possibilities. They may suit your personality, they may not, but they open up this kind of spark, this creativity in you. And then what do you do with stuff that doesn't fit you anymore?, or you just outgrew it, or it, it just doesn't belong in your closet. So we also help with that. We have integration with, uh, resale, reseller, uh, marketplace. We're gonna have more soon, but right now it's, uh, Poshmark. Uh, it's available in US and Canada. Um, it's very easy. Uh, if you already have stuff, stuff digitized with our AI, we create a listing for you. You just press a button and it pushes it directly into your account on Poshmark. You do have to have that account, and then you take care of shipping and everything. So we, we're just help list. And then if, if, let's say you gain weight, you lose weight, lost weight, or you bought something that needs to be hemmed or waist needs to be taken in, we have alterations and repairs as well, which is very, very easy to do. You can just say, oh, okay, this is pair of pants, I need to hem it by 2 inches. We give you a shipping label, shipping's free both ways. We make it as easy as possible to give you all these tools. And of course it's up to you to use them or not, but it's been helpful for people who are writing to us. You know, some, some people are saying, oh my God, you cured my shopping addiction, or I used to have a huge closet and felt like I had nothing to wear, and now I have a much smaller closet and can go a whole year without repeating an outfit. So it's, it's really very rewarding hearing that, but it's up to us to decide, do we want to be conscious about and more mindful about how we get dressed or, or not?

Yeah. So is your app— would you describe it as user-friendly? Because I'm not, I'm not, um, I don't like to do new apps because I think, oh my goodness, I'm, I'm not going to be able to figure this app out.

Most people figure it out, and we have, we have people who are not are not technically savvy at all. So women in their 70s using this, and they're figuring it out. I'm sure you'll be able to figure it out. I mean, we, we try to make it as easy as possible. Of course not, I mean, and, and we have very friendly customer support. So if you cannot figure something out, just email us and we'll, we'll help you out.

Oh, nice. Okay, so good. They've got your customer service, you know, has email and a way to respond to. So is your app, is it a free app?

Yeah, it's a free app. Um, it's, it's free to use. There, there are some paid features. Okay. Uh, so for example, I mentioned we have something called Style Blueprint, and that is, um, kind of determining and giving you, um, tips on how to dress for your coloring, how to dress for your body. So that is paid and that is a one-time fee. And you can redo it as many times as you want. It's, it's yours forever. So you pay once and it's yours forever. Because if you change your color of your hair or you lose weight or you gain weight, things change. So you need to be able to say, okay, what are my colors now that I am redhead or red or I went gray? What should I be wearing now? So stuff like that.

Okay. And so the fees, I mean, so Style Blueprint has a fee, you're saying? So what is the fee to Style Blueprint?

Style Blueprint is $49. Okay. And then you get your color analysis, your body shape analysis, and your style personality. And with that, in, in the United States only, because that's where we have that service, you have— you get with the style blueprint, you get $20 towards alterations or repair service, and you get $20 towards purchase of makeup in your best colors. So you get $40 in perks for $49. Yeah, that's— that's yours.

Oh yeah, that's a really— that sounds, you know, sustainable.

I guess it sounds sustainable.

Yeah, because—

and, and your listeners will get a special coupon from us for that.

Okay, perfect. So Okay, yeah, go ahead.

I'm sorry. No, no problem. And we also have a premium membership that is recurring, and that is just for premium features. So if people, if people want to get some advanced analytics on their wardrobe or some advanced features like, you know, resale value and other things that we're going to be adding to that list, but that is completely optional.

Okay. I said the Poshmark. I'm going to make sure I'm saying that correctly. Is it like two words or is that one word?

It's one.

It's one. That's the weak nose. Okay. So, so this is okay. So again, I'm showing my age.

Okay.

So this is kind of, you're kind of linked with this app. Okay. So that makes just to help me understand that better. I'm sure others listening did not have no problem with that. It's just me. Well, I mean, I know, I know I spend too much on clothes. I know that I need to downsize my wardrobe.

Can I ask you a question? You may. What is a— can you estimate how many items of clothing you buy per year on average?

Okay, well, I could say before last year, you know, when I was not going out to work, I would say, I don't know, 15, 20 pieces of clothing. That would include socks and underwear. But last year I was one, living in the United States for work while Brooke and my husband were all still here in Switzerland, and I bought a lot of clothes. I would say I bought 7 or 8 more, probably more than that, pullover sweaters. You know, I updated my sweater wardrobe completely last year. I bought probably 2 or 3 new dresses. So I Yeah, I think now I don't need to buy clothes probably for 5 more years if they last. But, but my issue was, you know, when I saw it and, and I was working and I felt like I needed to look, you know, fresh and, and at my best, I felt like I spent way too much money on clothing and shoes. Yeah, shoes are a thing.

Well, shoes are, shoes are important. Shoes are second largest category in women's closet, just right after tops. Not surprising, right? And shoes are important. But one thing, you're saying you spend too much money, right? There is, there's one statistic that we track for our users and people obsess about it. I don't know. I think it's, it's understandable. It's very easy to calculate. It's cost per wear.

Cost per wear.

So you, so you spend $100 on, on, on a dress and you wear it 100 times, your cost per wear is a dollar.

Okay.

So it's very easy to, to figure out. So that dress that you bought and only wore for Brooke's graduation, that is an expensive dress. Cost per wear-wise, right? Yes, it is. But any cardigan or, or a top that you wear over and over and over again is probably very low cost per wear.

Okay, that makes me feel a little better. It really does make me feel better because last year when I bought— I found a pair of boots that I liked. Well, I thought, well, I'm just gonna get, you know, one of each color. I tend to do that. I tend to do a lot of the one of each color. Things when something looks good on me.

That makes me think that you— your style personality, a dominant one, is probably classic. Okay, probably so.

Yeah, I would agree that it is. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because if— yeah, I see a sweater that I like and, uh, oh well, you know, the two with the big high collar that I got last year, two different colors of blue.

Yeah, yeah. And I did that like this summer, the tops that I wore. I got 3 of different colors and I wore them all summer.

Yes. But yeah, but they— yeah, I mean, everything looks good on Brooke though, so, you know, I tend to— yeah, but the benefit of youth, it is right. Oh my goodness. Yes. Oh, to be young again. Oh yeah, because I think my wardrobe has always been I've probably always had more than I needed. And, you know, I've—

as we all do.

Yeah, I think— is that a thing? I don't have to feel bad about that?

Yeah, you don't need to feel bad about it.

I really—

you don't need to. You don't need to. If you wear it and you love it and you use it, why feel bad about it?

That's true. Okay, well, I'm definitely going to get use of my sweaters that I bought last year because it's about to get really cold here. And so, so I do have a good— when I'm here, because sweaters are my favorite thing, pullover sweaters and, you know, high neck sweaters, that's my favorite thing to wear with my jeans. And I can— I think I can justify that, the buying of the sweaters. But then I'll— when summer comes, I think, oh, I shouldn't have bought all those sweaters. Because, you know, it's summer now, you know, I only wore them whatever, however many times. So, yeah, but so are there good places for— okay, I know Poshmark you can sell, but what about our donations, our clothes donations? Do you have information on your web or on your app about, um, the best ways and best places to donate so that we kind of hope our clothes don't end up on a shore somewhere, developing country, making mounds of, you know, clothing?

Yeah, we don't have that yet on the site, but I'm working on, on donation and recycling. Recycling, I think, is super important because for me personally, that's one of the biggest problems I have, like bedding and just textiles in general, right? But let me answer your question about donations. Typically, organizations like Salvation Army and Goodwill in the United States— I'm not sure, I don't know any European companies— they, they are very responsible about how they sort things and how they dispose of things. So those two are definitely worth donating to. There are also other organizations specifically for women's clothing. There is Dress for Success, which is international company. They're also very responsible. And then we have, we have this local charities. I actually have one on my desk here. I get things like this in the mail. Sometimes we'll come and pick up stuff, free donations, and it's not always clothing. It's like small appliances and stuff. So these are typically good because they, first of all, they take time to go and collect. Uh, and then they're collecting smaller packages that they have, and they, they know what they need. So those, those are typically good. Um, that's, that's where I donate mine.

I know also in the US you could just go, like, you can go to a women's shelter and they're always accepting donations. And, um, yeah, like women's shelter and domestic abuse shelters are always accepting, like, donations.

Yeah, yeah. And I think that's That's the word I want to get out to anybody listening or watching is use these types of resources, donate to a place that is going to help other individuals. Yeah. I mean, you know, here we are talking about, oh, I've got too many of this. And that sounds so I, I don't know. It sounds like, um, I'm not thinking of it, so it's not empathetic enough to think about. There are so many others that could use, you know, our extras. And I think that I would love to be a part of making sure that anything I consider extra, that if I'm not going to use it, it goes to someone who, who can. Who will use it, who— I mean, even if they don't necessarily recognize that they appreciate it, um, just, just the fact that they have socks on their feet. We have a, we have a little man around here that even in the winter he walks around with no socks on his feet. And so, you know, and, and I think about him, I worry about him all the time, but, you know, it is just He just doesn't wear socks on his feet. And so, but I think that when we can think of others and always want to help others, I think that, you know, an app like this where it not only kind of helps the consumer that's gone on and logged onto this app and uploaded some pieces of the wardrobe into it to kind of help them feel better about what they have and to help them, uh, look better in the clothes that they have, but also helps in, um, with the recycling, helps with, uh, giving names of places that others can donate to. Uh, I, I think that that's always, you know, a good way for us to kind of put our business foot forward.

Yep.

I mean, because it's not just— that's, that's sustainability in a whole different fashion that's beyond environment, beyond our financial sustainability. That's, that's, uh, our societal sustainability. How are we helping others in our society? And I think that any app that, um, kind of recognizes the importance of that is, is, you know, high, high marks for me. So I appreciate that, you know, you're constantly wanting to make your app better, but better because the consumer has this and one wants to be more creative with a wardrobe, but also two wants to help others and, and you're making it possible for them with these, with telling us about places to donate to and, and trying to, you know, improve your app for recycling and donations. So I think that's awesome. Sorry, I tend to ramble. I apologize. No worries. So, um, so how long have you had your app? I know you said it started during the pandemic. So is it 4 or 5 years old now?

It's almost 4 years old. Yeah, we started in '21 at the end of the year. I left my job, my full-time job, and in October '21, and that's when we started. Yeah, so coming up on 4 years now.

Oh wow, well, congratulations on that. That's a big thing to celebrate, you know, because I mean, I don't know, I mean, we've obviously got some statistics about clothing, but I don't know about apps and this kind of business, you know, how do you know you've made it?

I mean, you never know you've made it.

So, so that, but I think that it's also how many, so How do you describe the people who use your app? Are they consumers? Are they participants? What is a person that uses an app? What would that person be called? A user. That's right. Sorry. I really am telling you the languages. So how many users do you have? I mean, can you, do you have that statistic?

And yeah, hundreds of thousands. Wow, that's fantastic. So people, people use it, people use it for different reasons. So it's actually interesting when we look at the demographics. Of course, we have young people and they are more into digitizing their wardrobes. They're very much into statistics. So cost per wear is a big thing for a lot of girls and We do skew female, although we do have guys. We're trying to get more guys on the platform. We have the same tools for, for guys as girls, so we have Style Blueprint for men also. And the interesting thing is that I am seeing more older women starting to use the app for it's really funny to, to really understand where that shift happens. So it's, it's very early when, um, so technically savvy people, so in their 20s, that have time to digitize their wardrobes, stuff like that, or like 50 plus, so empty nesters going through some sort of a life change, maybe retiring, maybe traveling the world, they need to kind of get a hold of on, on their wardrobe. So it's very interesting, the, the spectrum. And in the middle, it's moms, interestingly, digitizing wardrobes of their children and their own and kind of managing it that way. And yeah, so it's, it's very interesting to see that it's kind of everybody. It's, it's really not just for technically savvy people who can do all of these things. It's for really for everybody. Everybody who needs these tools.

Yeah. Well, I definitely— I'm going to be honest with you. I have not downloaded the app. Brooke has. Brooke has. And Brooke's put some of her wardrobe in there and, you know, is— but, you know, I keep thinking, oh, well, I'm going to do it when I switch out my clothes, you know, my winter, because I have to— I actually have to move clothes around because, again, that's how ridiculous my my wardrobe. So I was thinking, oh, well, you know, maybe when I bring some of those sweaters out, you know, I'll put them in and, and, you know, we'll kind of see, you know, how I might use this app. So I'm, I am looking forward to trying to learn how to do that and, and to see if it can make me more aware of what I have and make me more appreciative. Of what I have. I know that, um, yeah, I, I think that, that I think that kind of could make a big difference is to kind of appreciate what you have kind of thing.

Yeah, this is definitely something I needed when I was in college. Like, I, if I wish I had found this out before because, um, I like, I traveled back and forth, back and forth, back and forth, so I couldn't bring very much with me, right? So I always had to buy new stuff when I went back to school. So now I have a bunch of stuff in the US that I can't bring over here.

And it's like, yeah, that was one thing I was curious about. Would the app help somebody who, let's say someone has a 3-week business trip? I know that's rare because I know when Todd would travel, I don't think he ever stayed more than 2 weeks anywhere.

But still, he stayed for a month, but that's true.

Taiwan. Yeah. So, and so So if, if we have to, because we could only bring so much on a trip, is this app, you know, something that could, you know, help someone decide, okay, I don't really need that. I only need this one pair of boots. I mean, this, the app can also help in something like that, in those types of decisions.

Yes.

So, so the app is organized so that You can have as many wardrobes as you want. So you can have like my US wardrobe, my Switzerland wardrobe, my college wardrobe, right? Yeah. So that's one. And then you can have your travel wardrobes. So I, if you look at my app, and by the way, we have a web version of the app. So.

Oh, okay.

Big pictures, right? Yes. So that's sometimes it's easier. I use it all the time. And so I have a wardrobe for every trip I take. So I cut my, my little capsule and it's very easy. The item can live in multiple wardrobes. You can move them, you can add them. It's, it's very, very flexible. So you can create your, your packing lists, your, your travel capsules that way. And when you do that, you can immediately see how many outfits you have, or you can even pack by outfits. You can say, okay, I'm bringing, because you know what you're gonna be doing on your trip, like if you're working or you're, sightseeing or you're hiking or you're doing, right, different activities, you can say this outfit, this outfit, this outfit, and then basically put it in your packing list wardrobe, and then it'll move all of the items, and all you need to do is actually physically take them and put them in the suitcase. So for me, packing for trips, super easy.

And that's, that's exactly what I wanted to hear because I'm a checklist kind of gal. I want a checklist. I, you know, normally I have to write it out But now I see I can just kind of put my stuff—

if I have all you have to write, my wardrobe digitized, can help you.

It's—

this whole idea of digitizing my wardrobe is starting to grow on me. I'm really starting to get excited about this. Is a good thing.

And Deborah, I have to say, it's, it's really easy. The only thing you need to do is take a picture. Everything else is done by the app. We categorize it for you and we put all the colors are recognized. We give you the title, like we give, we do everything. So all you think need to do is just put a picture and then obviously what we don't know is what price you bought it for. If you choose to track cost per wear and stuff like that, you can enter that when you bought it and then maybe a brand, right? If it's not visible from the image. Right. A brand is needed if you care to understand the value retention of your wardrobe and resale price. Okay. Otherwise, it doesn't really matter.

Okay. So, so I open the app up and I can take the photo and it's automatic into the app. It just loads right into that. I don't have to like take all the photos, open the app, move them from my photos app.

You could if you wanted to.

You could do it if you wanted to. Work. I want it to be in the app.

Yeah, you can also take the photo from your phone on the app. So like you open the app and it says, do you want to take a photo or choose from your library?

Oh, okay, okay, okay.

You can hire Brooke to be your— yes, advisor.

I think this sounds really like a good plan. I think that sounds like a perfect plan for me. Well, Julia, um, what else do you want to tell everyone about this app? I mean, or about— I really like your mission. I don't know if that— I have your mission statement completely, but if you want me to put that in the show I would love to— maybe we can, you know, talk about that in a few minutes after we're not recording. But, but, uh, I would love to know about your mission statement so we could put that in the show notes. And, um, but is, is there something else that listeners should know about your app?

I mean, it's not necessarily about the app, it's, it's really about how you want to, uh, deal with your clothes. And deal is not a good— the best word, but it's, it's really, it's It's really, do you, whether or not you care about environment, you care about how you're showing up. Most of us care about how we show up. And clothes is sort of like a mirror of your inner self. So your personality comes through, whatever you want to tell the world, you can tell it through clothing without even speaking a word, just by how you put yourself together. And It's such a powerful thing that a lot of people, some people use it completely unconsciously, not realizing it, and some people use it very consciously. So we teach it. We have a workshop that's available if you choose to buy our style blueprint. A workshop is available. We call it a style 21-day style Kickstarter. And when you, when you, we show you how to wear color and it's, it's very, it's like very consumable super short, around a minute long videos that give you an action item like every day if you want to go through that. And it's super, super easy. And just one thing that I want to put out there is we should refocus our value to be on quality of garments rather than newness and quantity of garments, right? So it's really better to buy something that is, um, that it suits you first of all. You're gonna always feel good in it, and you're gonna wear it over and over again in many different ways. And that way it just becomes very versatile thing in your wardrobe, and then, um, and then you love it for many years. Yeah, it's just kind of stop and think, just for a second.

Yes, I like that stopping thing, and I, I appreciate you saying that, uh, focus on the quality of the clothing rather than just the fact that it's new. I mean, you know, I think that that's important. I definitely probably need to hear that, you know, because I— it's funny because I feel like when we first moved here, I wasn't buying a lot of new clothes, and then I went back to work and it just seemed like that's all I focused on was how, and, and so I, I think one thing you were kind of saying also is our clothes really do, they affect us, um, emotionally, mentally, how we present ourselves. And so I think focusing on the quality of your garments really will also kind of boost that. Self-esteem, that, you know, that, you know, your mental health to, to say, you know, I, one, I care about quality clothes, too, you know, and I'm, you know, thinking about, you know, not putting so many on some shore in another country. I think that, that documentary has really bothered me for some reason, you know, seeing that. So I You know, but it also was, you know, it was also a positive message because there are people there, you know, trying to do something with, you know, all those clothes that just kind of show up. So, you know, I have learned a lot. And I'm excited to— I'm, you know, we're going to get all this information about— okay, so we've told everybody the name of the app.

Open Wardrobe.

Open Wardrobe. And what is the website? You said I could do it also on a laptop.

Yeah, it's openwardrobe.com. No, not.com,.co. That's our corporate site. And from there you can sign up. It'll lead you to Open Wardrobe app.

Okay. Okay. Well, that's kind of exciting. So we'll definitely get all that in the show notes and Anything else, Brooke?

Um, I don't, I don't think so because I mean, I, because I, I really love fashion, so, um, I can tell. Yeah, actually it's really funny, this is a new top.

Yeah, sweater, isn't it?

I had to get this sweater, but I'm wearing it with a pair of jeans that I got a couple months ago. Yeah, so I mean, like, I have a lot of stuff that I've been trying to like re-wear and like restyle with some other stuff. So, um, but yeah, like, now that I'm actually— like, even when I'm just at home, I try to, like, dress nice.

You do?

Because I don't know, I feel like it. And, um, also, like, now I've been in rehearsals for a play, so when I go to rehearsals, I'm trying to, like, dress up for it. Yeah. So, um, I think it'll be nice to, like, get everything, because I do know there's a lot of stuff I know I need to get rid of. So, I mean, it'll be a good excuse to go through all my stuff and I think that's, I think that's number one right there.

Yeah, that's a good, always a good reason to, to go through.

It's tough because I mean, it's, it's also tough. Like I do have a lot of sentimental stuff that it's like, cause that's all I used to wear was like sentimental shirts and stuff like that. So that's also tough. It's like, oh, like what do I do with that stuff? And like, I mean, we've been talking about making a quilt.

So yeah, that is kind of a hard thing, you know, especially As a young person, you know, a lot of, I mean, your parents buy your clothes most of the time. And so growing up, you know, there was, you know, the back-to-school shopping and, and the things that we did, you know, because, you know, in the US, I'm going to say one thing about the US, you can just shop like to your heart's content in the United States of America. There are all kinds of stores., to spend money. And here's a little different where we're at because the stores are smaller.

Um, and yeah, they don't stay open all night.

They know, no, they're not open all night.

You're right.

There is, there is, there's a big difference in the way you shop now, or for us now because of being here. But you know, every trip I go back to the United States, Todd and I, my husband, my husband's a shopper. I mean, is he not? He gets new clothes, and we come back every time with more than we left with. And that means we also probably donated some stuff while we were there, but we always come back with new stuff. We were there 3 weeks just a few weeks ago. We were in the US for 3 weeks, and oh yeah, we were in 3, 4 different states that we shopped So, you know, yeah, all up and down the East Coast. And so I think that, uh, I think this is going to help me, you know, think better. I really like the idea of being able to pack better. I just, I love that thought. So I, I think this app is just awesome. So I, I'm really excited to dig into it and, and kind of figure it all out.

Yeah, packing, packing is a big one. I, I always travel with carry-on only. Really? Only carry-on. It doesn't matter where we go. For 2 weeks, 3 weeks— we went to 2 weeks in Sweden in December, and I went with carry-on.

Really? The other country? Yes, because people mix up Sweden and Switzerland.

So yeah, yeah, did you see the aurora? Yeah, yes, it wasn't good. It wasn't very bright. It was full moon, unfortunately. Oh, okay. Um, but we did see it. We went on, um, uh, like a little Aurora safari on snowmobiles. It was super nice. We stayed at— it's, it's gonna start to sound so gimmicky and touristy, but, um, you know, there is an ice hotel in Kiruna. So we stayed in a nice— the ice hotel, and it. My husband is very much against all the kind of touristy mainstream, and he was blown away. It was just such an amazing experience. It's like you're in the Snow Queen's castle because they hire these ice sculptors every winter to sculpt. Every room is different. It's just mind-blowing. It's amazing. That's awesome. You would love it because that would be like being Elsa's castle.

Yes, yes, I would think Elsa. Yes, that's exactly—

I'd be singing away. Speaking of Elsa, we just came back from a trip to Norway, and we were in a little village that only 60 people live in that village. 60 people and 400 goats. They're very, very much known for their goat cheese. And the, the tour guide, or like not a guide, I don't know if it was official guide, just the guy who was showing us around, he said that that village was an inspiration for Frozen, that that village came from in Frozen.

That's awesome. That is. Okay, so we want to go on that trip too. You guys should go. That is. Yeah. Oh yeah, I do love to travel. Yeah, I love to meet people. I love— I'll be honest with you, this has— it's just going back to wardrobe. I love to go to Iceland because you know what I'm going to get when I go to Iceland?

Another sweater.

Exactly. Yeah, I absolutely love my Iceland— Icelandic wool sweater. That's—

yeah, that's— well, you live in a climate where sweaters are useful, so that's good.

Yeah, it's always been— that's kind of always been, like you said, maybe classic. It's always been a go-to for me. You know, I like, I like a long flowy skirt, tall boots, and a good pullover sweater. Yeah, I don't have a trench coat yet, but I've not gone that far yet.

So I do have a trench coat. I— that was kind of my dream. I treated myself. It was years ago, but I always wanted that classic Burberry trench coat. Yeah. And I— and they were so expensive, and I'm like, I don't know if I want to spend the money. And then there was one time when I felt like I deserved to treat myself.

Yes, yes, good for you.

Yeah. And I, I went— sorry, I went to, I went to a store, and actually I'm glad that I did go to a store. I tried— I didn't realize that they had different styles, and it wasn't just the trench coat is a trench coat. And I tried different colors, and that classic beige one that we all think about did not suit me at all. And I ended up buying a navy, which I love.

I would go with it. I think I would go with a navy or that burgundy. I saw a burgundy the other day, and I thought, hmm, maybe I'm not going with the classic that Brooke— yeah, went with Brooke, went with the classic.

I mean, well, for mine, it's like a fairly— that's a relatively cheap version because it was like an H&M fast fashion version of Burberry trench coat. I would love to get a Burberry trench coat.

I would too.

I would. That is like something when I start making like money, and that is like one of the first things I'm gonna get is like—

and talk about cost per wear for that. That is gonna wear forever.

Yeah, I was gonna ask you, what is your cost per wear? It's—

it— because I mean, my— I want to live in London one day, so then it's definitely— it gets to what, like probably 5 cents is the cost providing all the time.

Yes, there you go. Yeah, I was saying, I, I see your draw. I see your draw to London now, you know. I get it.

I get it. I used to live in London, uh, in my 20s. Not, not for very long, about just under 2 years. I loved it. It was, it was such a great experience.

Yeah, I can see it. For if I were in my 20s, I, I can see. I mean, it's It's, it's, it was fun. It was fast. My goodness gracious. It is a lot of fun.

She did not like Camden very much.

I did not like Camden. No.

Yeah. It's a young people thing.

Yeah.

100%. It definitely is. So yeah. But so, but at least I tried. Yeah. Okay. Well, I think this has been absolutely fantastic. Julia, we really appreciate you coming on to our podcast.

Hi guys, Brooke popping in to say that Julia has been so wonderful as to give us a discount code for Open Wardrobe just for our listeners. The code is wine30.

That's wine30. Let's go. We'll be back next week with a new bottle of wine and a new topic. In the meantime, if you want to join the conversation, follow us on Instagram, TikTok, and Bluesky @WineTogetherPod. Join our Facebook group, Wine Together Podcast. And if you don't want to miss out on our regular weekly episodes along with all of our bonus content, you can find us wherever you get your podcasts, as well as liking, subscribing, and commenting on our YouTube Wine Together Podcast.