Effective Follow-Up Strategies in Business Communications with Karen Briscoe

Hello, my friend, and welcome to another exciting episode of Negotiate Anything. Thanks for joining us today. With over 10 million downloads and listeners from more than 180 different countries, it's dedicated listeners just like you who have made Negotiate Anything the number one negotiation podcast in the world. I'm your host, Kwame Christian. I'm a business lawyer, mediator, author, and the proud CEO of of the American Negotiation Institute. Now, before we get into today's insightful conversation, I have a golden opportunity for those of you who recognize the power of negotiation in your professional lives. Have you ever found yourself wishing that you could navigate those high stakes conversations with more confidence? Or perhaps you're looking to empower your team with the art of persuasion and conflict resolution? At the American Negotiation Institute, we've crafted specialized keynotes and workshops tailored for those very needs. We've transformed the negotiation skills of professionals worldwide and we're eager to do the same for you. We believe the best things in life are on the other side of difficult conversations. And our goal is to help you improve your lives and the lives of those around you one difficult conversation at a time. Don't let another challenging conversation leave you second guessing. Click the link in the description to discover how we can help you find confidence in conflict, negotiate better deals, and have stronger relationships. Because in the world of business, every conversation counts. And now, without further ado, let's jump into the interview. Karen, thanks for joining us today.

Well, I'm thrilled to be back with your community and the idea of negotiations is something that everybody does at different points of their life. And so I'm thrilled to be here to visit with you about it again.

Yes, we're excited to have you you back. Honestly, it's been too long, so we are overdue. And so for the folks who might not have heard your first episode, can you tell them a little bit about yourself and what you do?

Well, I am a residential real estate agent in the Northern Virginia Washington D.C. metro region. I what's known as a mega agent, which means I lead a team with Keller Williams and Our team in 2020 closed 100 transactions. 100 million. So you can do the math. It's about a million dollar average. So we have a very sophisticated clientele. So I really get to practice my negotiation skills frequently because again, people who buy and sell real estate at that level are usually very sophisticated. I'm also an author of four books and the host of the five minute Success podcast.

Fantastic. And everybody, we're going to have links to Karen's podcast and all of Karen's books in the description as well. And Karen, that's one of the things that, that brought us together again because once I got that email saying that you had a new book, I said, oh my gosh, why haven't I had her back on? So this was a good opportunity for us to get this back together. And so can you let the listeners know about your latest book?

So the latest book is consult to sell 66 day challenge. And the book's original book, Real Estate Success in Five Minutes a Day, was written with a V, usually mostly for the real estate professional. Although people, you know, that have an interest in sales and real estate, they certainly can get a lot out of it. But when I was writing the book, I wrote it for the real estate agent and what I found was the original book is set up as a daily reader. So every day there's a topic, so there's 365 of them. And some people said to me, oh my gosh, that's a big book. And I'm like, but it's only five minutes a day, so you should be able to handle it and be like, I want to focus, you know, I want to be able to focus. So my first 66 day challenge book was the Commit to Get Lead. So that's the business development, prospecting, lead generation aspect of the business. And then I found people wanted to focus on the consult to sell, which is in the sales, you know, vernacular we call conversion. And so that's what came out this year, is the consult to sell 66 day challenge, those people who want to focus on that area of business. And like I said, you know, the idea of negotiations is something that we all do. And I would say most people consider conversion to be, you know, the, the key component of negotiations.

Absolutely. And for those who might not be familiar with the idea of the consultative sales process, what does that mean for the, the person who might be new to that?

Well, if you think of like the idea of conversion, it has actually several different definitions. You know, in the sales it has, you know, I'm going to convert you over to my side and then you're going to do this deal because I won you over. And then if you think about the religious conversion, right, again, you're converted over to that way of, of thinking and living and doing. So if you think about it from the consultive side, it's more of a seek first to understand, you know, the Stephen Covey idea that the sales professional is looking to provide the counsel, the wisdom, the recommendations based on what is in the best interest for the customer, client. And when you consult meeting their needs, then there really isn't any need for a true conversion experience because they're buying or they're taking action or they're doing whatever it is because they recognize that it is meeting their needs or in their best interest or the best outcome for the situation. And so it is a much, many people look at as more of a win win type of approach. And the, the idea in my business, real estate, we talked about really there isn't any way to make someone buy a house. They have to have the money, get the loan. You know, there's a lot of paperwork, there's a lot to the process. So I always was like, how could you possibly just, you know, have someone think that they had just been made to buy a house? Same with selling. So I was like, what the professional approach is, when you look at it from the consultative angle or approach, then it takes away that pressure, if you will, and people are moving forward, recognizing that it's in their best interest.

Yeah. And one of the things that's a challenge in this process in sales in general is the reality of skepticism. Because when we were preparing for this interview, that was one of the things that you mentioned when I said, well, what is something that people often overlook in their sales process or when they're thinking about how to get to that stage of conversion? And it's the fact that people are skeptical of you as somebody in a sales role. So can you speak a little bit more to the reality of that skepticism and then we can transition into what you can actually do about it.

The salesperson is vested in the outcome because their money is on the line. Right. And so that's why I think that comes about that skepticism like, okay, well, you're getting paid, so you're only doing this because you're going to get paid. And then I also say on the other side, well, but if you don't do anything, I don't get paid at all. So I mean, so I invested. Yes, of course. And not vested to the level of the participant because ultimately if I don't sell the house, it doesn't change my life. Right. So whereas if the seller doesn't sell the house, it, it is a, you know, that it's going to change your life. And if the buyer doesn't buy the house, that is going to change your life. But it doesn't change my life if you buy or sell a house. So, you know, the chicken and the, you know, difference between the chicken and the pig, right. So I'm not as invested in that sense. And it does give me the objective third party in a way. Because if you. Well, maybe not third party, but an objective party. Whereas you, for example, like in law, you know, the person who represents himself, you know, it's hard to represent yourself because you can't see what it is that oftentimes people need to see and you frequently don't do it as often. I mean, one thing I'll share to people is, you know, even if you bought and sold houses before, if you haven't done it recently, the market changes, practices change, laws change. And so it's hard to have a skill level that would allow you really to in many cases successfully get the best outcome. What people, the skepticism. What I hear, and I felt this too, okay, when I'm with a salesperson, is that you're only saying that to me because it makes it easier for you. Right? So if you sell the house fast and that's easier for you, and frequently it's easier for the client too, because the recommendations that most sales professionals are making, if they're taking the consultative approach, are based out of experience of what creates the best outcome. Really, it's challenging to stay in business long if you're frequently giving counsel and advice to people. That is not good for them. Right. I mean, how long would you stay in business if you frequently advise people incorrectly? And so when the house sells quickly, this is what people frequently say, well, you saw my, you undersold my house, you sold my house too fast, I left money on the table. Oh, that's easy for. Good for you. Easy for you, because now you don't have to pay for all this marketing, you don't have to do all this work. And what is frequently the case is that selling it quickly is actually good for the seller. It's good because the longer house is on the market, more perception there is that there's something wrong with the house or the seller needs to adjust the price and in order to regenerate interest or do something to the house. So it really is in the seller's best interest. And this has been in the, in the current market environment in most market areas in the United States, the demand has exceeded the supply such that many times there's bidding wars. So I, I point out to sellers, it really is very rare that a house sells for under market in the age of the Internet, where everybody has access to information. Because if the house is truly underpriced, what's going to happen? It's going to create more demand and. Right. And so the market is the ultimate market study. So that's one way I help people, counsel them, consult with them through the process. And over that seller's remorse that, oh my gosh, I just gave my house away. It happened too fast. And the other thing I share with people is, so we did everything right. So be happy. Would you rather I'd done everything wrong and it not worked? I mean, it just helped them, help them see different. Okay, so let's say we'd done that. Let's say we hadn't priced it correctly for the market. Let's say we hadn't prepared it correctly for the market and it had stalled and just sat on the market. That is not an outcome you would have wanted. Yes, it benefits me, but I can see how it benefited you as well. And so help them just talk through what may be causing this seller's remorse. And then buyer's remorse is if they feel like they've overpaid, get caught up in the frenzy. Oftentimes they feel like, oh my gosh, what I just do. My agent told me to do this. And you're like, no, I didn't tell you to do this. I advised you based on the market conditions, what was going on. And so those are some ways to help people through the skepticism.

Hello, my friends. Before we get back to today's episode, I want to ask you a question. Have you ever wondered how to elevate your team's negotiation game and how you can help the folks on your team have better, difficult conversations? At the American Negotiation Institute, we offer transformative keynotes and workshops tailored to empower professionals with top tier negotiation and conflict resolution skills. Whether it's a keynote for your next event or hands on training for your team, we've got you covered. Don't just negotiate. Master the art with the American Negotiation Institute. Click the link in the description to find out more. Elevate, negotiate and succeed. Yeah, and I think that's, it's. Those tips are really great because what you're doing is you're helping them to see things from a different perspective. And a lot of times, especially when you are in a situation where you're a bit emotional because usually if there's skepticism, that's really an emotional type of thing too. In a lot of cases, they're only seeing things from one perspective. And so with the way that you approach it, what you're doing is you're helping them to see from their perspective as well. And I think one of the Things that people have to recognize is that when it comes to selling, there is an unavoidable aspect of benefit to the person. Right. And so a lot of times people resist and say, oh, no, no, no, this isn't about me. It isn't about me. But it is to a certain extent. Right. It's like, yeah, we're doing business together. And so of course I'm going to do well, but if I do well, you do well as well. Right. And I think that's the distinction. So it's not really resisting that contention. It's leaning into it. Almost like an improv. Somebody in improv saying, yes, and you as well will do well if we are able to move forward.

I love improv and I've actually taken some improv classes. So I highly recommend it for anybody out there in the consulting professions because that approach is very beneficial. That help them recognize that you're on the same side of the table. Frequently times I'll, you know, communicate like, you know, thank you for the opportunity to work together on the marketing and sale of your home because it is done in conjunction. I mean I. The seller needs to prepare the home for the market and having good show condition. And you know, obviously all our staging recommendations are going to be for not if they leave the beds unmade and the dishes of the dishwasher. Right. And so working together. The other thing that I found is there's frequently other people involved in the the transaction that you aren't aware of as a professional. Usually family members are sharing their thoughts, the neighbors are sharing their thoughts. The, you know, people in the office or on the zoom call are sharing their thoughts and what worked for them. And I have a friend, whatever. And so recognizing the fact that there could be what's what this coming is from this other information. People that are sharing their thoughts and it's not necessarily the client or customer's perspective, but helping them clear that so they understand it because otherwise that could cause a concern that maybe they are being truly being represented, that your interests are elsewhere.

Right, right. Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And one of the things that I think it was my friend Beth Bulow said when she came on the podcast. She called it the myth of the one on one negotiation. Because we always think, oh, I'm just talking to you. So it's me and Karen in this conversation and we're going to try to work something out. But it's never just to the just you and the other person. It's always other people. And if you miss that fact, then you're going to be missing out on a very important strategic consideration as you move forward. And so Karen, in your experience, what do you do when you realize that somebody might be being influenced by somebody who is not at the table with you? Somebody who you don't have any contact with.

Appreciate you sharing that. I go into it automatically with the perspective that there are other people involved that I just may not be aware of. It could be the father who's helping with the down payment or the sister in law who's an agent in, in another state or again the neighbor who's watching the house. You thought it was vacant, but they're watching the house and they're reporting everything. And so I go into it with that perspective because then I'm not surprised when something happens. And so whenever any communication occurs, if it's a verbal, you know, by phone or meeting or whatever, I often will do a summary and send an email. Just, you know, this is our understanding, this is where we are right now, this is what we discussed and send that. Because oftentimes what will happen is that email will go to the person who's asking the question and then that way they have a response. Because frequently using terminology that they may not understand really that there is a difference between an appraiser and an assessor and, and, and when they're trying to explain to someone else, they may get confused with that and use the word in a way that it wasn't met or wasn't being conveyed. So if you follow up with an email, I've even seen this happen where then my email gets forwarded and it comes back with another set of questions and then they just start sending it to me and I'm like then I understand, right? Seek first. Okay, now I understand where this coming from. The father who's pay the down payment, helping with the down payment is a lawyer. And that's where this is coming from. This makes perfect sense now. And so that's exact situation. This young woman who's a friend of my son's, I was like where is this coming from? And then it became very clear. So it's part of the client service perspective that again it's not this I'm going to get you to see it my way. It's more of like I'm going to help to understand it on what the way you're seeing it. So that then when I provide counsel and information recommendations, then you'll be able to hear it and maybe even convey it to the person who's Asking the.

Question, yeah, that makes a lot of sense. So it's, it sounds like what you're doing is you are communicating to one person while at the same time knowing that your communication will likely go to somebody else. And by sending the follow up message via email, you make it so that your words are accurately conveyed to the other person who's not at the table. And I think that makes a lot of sense. And one of the things that I've done in my practice as a lawyer is sometimes when I recognize that there is that third party who is essentially sometimes completely pulling the strings from behind the scenes, I say if it's appropriate, if it doesn't ruin confidentiality in a damaging type of way, say, hey, how about you bring this person to the conversation? Let's, let's, let's just, let's stop this game of telephone. This person could come and have them ask me any questions they want. And I think that approach is really important, not just saying, hey, let me explain it to them. I'm saying, no, they have questions. I'm an open book. They can ask me whatever questions they want. And sometimes, Karen, what I've recognized is that when I do that and just say they can ask me anything, that alone gives them the confidence they need to move forward. Just giving that open invitation.

I think that's a brilliant strategy. And yes, I would agree that that is something that if you feel like that there's somebody that would benefit from having a conversation that is certainly in, and the, in the real estate, the challenging thing is that maybe it's the same in law, you know, that people have a lot of street knowledge because it's, you know, it's, it's almost too easy to gather a lot of information right now. It's almost a tsunami overload of information. Discerning that information is what the professional consultant, you know, approach is. It's helping people discern that information and to validate that information on whether it's true for this situation. Because, you know, there's a reason why we call location, location, location. You know, the laws are different in different states. There's practices in different jurisdictions. I mean, just in the Washington, D.C. metro region, we have three jurisdictions. We have, you know, Commonwealth of Virginia, the State of Maryland, and we have the District of Columbia. And they all have completely different real estate laws and practices. Just being inside the Beltway, it could be its own set of challenges. Right. So first kind of help clarify where are you in, you know, this information, where is it coming from? Sometimes just helps Knowing that first, because before, the professional used to be the keeper of all the information. Right now the consumer has access to a lot of information and they think that because of that, that they have a certain understanding. Sometimes that's where we really have an opportunity to consult well, is to help people discern it.

See, I like the way that you said that because you said it very, very respectfully and you had many opportunities not say it respectfully. So I respect your, your precision of language here because here's the thing, I see a lot of professionals and people, just people in general, even with their home life too, when somebody does a lot of research because it's something that they care about and they go and they try to read the tea leaves and figure it out for themselves. You have a lot of Google experts out there and a lot of friends who are experts, even though they're not in the field at all, who are influential in their lives too. And what the mistake that I see often happen is that people don't treat that research with respect. They're completely dismissive. No, no, no, no, no. That doesn't make any sense here. No, that's wrong. Because of blah, blah, blah, they don't listen. And the key word that you said was validate. And what ends up happening is that that invalidation causes the person to double and triple and quadruple down on that their ego has been threatened because I worked really hard, because I consider myself to be a smart person. And by you instantly dismissing this and diminishing my contribution to this conversation, you are by proxy dismissing me. I will not allow myself to be dismissed. So now I'm going to shove more Internet articles into your face to get in your way. And we see conversations break down really quickly. And so, so from your perspective and your experience, how do we validate that effort and show that we care and we respect them without saying that yes, you are in fact correct on this very particular issue?

Well, things come to mind, first of all, is the classic script of feel felt found. I can understand how you might feel. Other people have felt that way before what we have found, because as you said, until people have believe that you've heard them and you understand how they feel, if you have a very cerebral person, a very high, you know, C level person, sometimes you could say, I can understand how you would think that way. Other people have thought that way before what we have found, the idea is you first validate how they feel or think is valid. Then you say other people have done that, so that felt that way. Or thought that way before, because that helps them realize they're not alone, that other people have gone through this process before. And then what we have found is not just commiserating with them or recognizing them, but helping them move to solution or to next steps or what they could do sometimes. I mean, that often is what is necessary or needed. I think we did that scripting when I was on last. So the other approach is to agree with him. And I had this happen with a client recently, and he was determined that I was going to. He wanted me to do something. And I explained two times that that really wasn't possible in this market. And so the third time I said, yes, the objective is to sell the house. Yes, if this sells the house, let's do it. Let's do it. Let's just do it. I'm on your team. Let's do it. So we did it his way. It didn't work, but that's okay because now he's like, well, she listened to me. And I was like, if it works, this is awesome. I'm going to do this again. Okay, let's try it. Let's do it. And because what was happening was what you resist, persists. So the more I was countering him in his view, not listening to him, giving him all the reasons why it wouldn't work, we couldn't do it, the more he persisted. Right. And so I had to. I was like, okay, this is. This isn't working, so let's try a different approach. So I was like, okay, well, let's try the approach of agreeing with him. So sometimes it's helpful to let people. We find this in the current market environment where it's very robust in a lot of price ranges and locations. And so there's multiple offers and escalation clauses and waving of contingencies. And that's. A lot of buyers are just like, I want to do it my way. And so you let them. You say, yes, let's. Let's do it your way. I want you to respect the fact that this is your approach you want to take. And then you help them learn from that and see what. Why it didn't work. And then sometimes you can recalibrate. Sometimes it takes three or four times.

Right. And that approach is so counterintuitive because I think a lot of people come in with the assumption that I need to get them to agree. The only path to victory in this conversation for me is if they concede, change their way, and come to my side. And what you're Saying is that we're recognizing that we might not agree and that's okay. And in your role, you work for them and for me as a lawyer, I work for the clients. I legally am unable to do something that the client doesn't want me to do. Unless of course, it's like, no, I mean we have to go deep into the professional rules of conduct to find a situation like that. They need to be like murdering somebody for me to be to have the legal right to say, hey, don't do that, I'm telling on you. Right. It is pretty extreme. And so what you're saying is I'm going to try to counsel them to come to the right to what my professional expertise says is the path to victory. And if they disagree, okay, then we can do it your way. If it works, great. If it doesn't, I still have an opportunity to do it my way. Just extended a little bit into the future. And one of the things that I've done in the past was and this some sometimes in law, but more often in more like lower stakes situations, interpersonal situations still in the business world is if then propositions. So, okay, it seems like you really want to do it this way and that's okay. You have the freedom of choice to do it that way. I just want to be on record saying these are my concerns and here's all I ask. If we do it this way and it doesn't work, then the next time we try it, we do it my way. And people usually can get down with that because I like to pre negotiate it. So if things crash and burn down the road, we already know what the plan of attack is.

It's a brilliant strategy. And the thing is, self discovery is always going to be more impactful. The times that people listen to me the first time is really amazing. But it's usually only in situations where they're past clients, really close friends, people that have seen me do this over and over again to the point where they go, I wouldn't be saying that they don't have that skepticism, but many people have to try it their way. And in those situations it is helpful I think what you shared to do that if then to say, okay, if we do it this way and it doesn't work, then the next time let's revisit what my recommendations are. And usually by the third or fourth time they start to listen. It's just the thing I tell people back to like, oh, I see now you said it the first time. Because it would have been easier for me. Right. Again, back to our skepticism. The skeptic is like, no, you're just saying that because it's going to be easy for you. I'm like, yeah, it's going to be easier for you to and you know when you're in a market that's in these conditions where if you're representing a buyer and you don't get the first one and then you go to the second one and all the people who lost out on the first one are now competing for the second one right Then, then it's you're actually going to be in hotter competition and same with each one after that because the comps are going to be based on this new pricing. Right. And you're going to have more people coming after the next one. That's what's happened, that's what's driven this rising market. So really they would have been better off they'd listed the first time. Wow.

No, it's true, it's true And I, and I think it just shows especially in, in your industry now in real estate, but how powerful that that consult to sell model is. I think the, the days of the hard sell are, are, are behind us. People are very resistant to that and so allying with the, the person in front of you and really working with them to create that true win win, I think that's the way to go forward. And so that's why I'm so excited about this new book for you. And so as we, as we wrap up here, I want to give you another opportunity to to let folks know about the new book and also how they can work with you and learn more about what you do.

Well, thank you for having me and I appreciate the opportunity to visit with you and your community. And the books are available on Amazon or wherever books are sold. So there's four of them. The real estate success in five minutes five minutes a day and then commit to get lead 66 day challenge consult to sell 66 day challenge and then the flip time Love Life which is a story format and those are also more information is available on the website which is the number 5 minute success 5 and you can find more about me there as well as if you're interested in visiting with me about working together on a coaching. I offer a 30 minute free consultation and you can go on the website and reach out to me that way. And also there's always social media, five minute success and Karen Briscoe on the real estate front. If you're in the Northern Virginia market area, happy to help you with your buying and selling real estate needs.

Perfect. Karen. Thank you again, my friend. Really appreciate it. Congratulations. You've just joined an elite club by listening listening to a full episode. You're now officially on the Negotiate Anything team, so welcome aboard. What most team members do is they subscribe to the podcast because that allows them to automatically get the latest episodes of the show. The best things in life lie on the other side of difficult conversations. Keep learning, keep practicing, and keep getting better. Your relationships will improve, your career will soar, and you'll have the confidence you need to get the most out of these crucial conversations. Again, thank you for joining the team. We're excited to have you, and I will see you in the next episode. I'll catch you later.