Secrets to Success in B2B Sales and Negotiations with Mark Raffan

What does the legal backlog look like? Look, here's the reality, folks. Like if you're dealing with internal counsel and you're not an important product or service, you are bottom of the pile, right? Like immediately you get triaged into a completely separate pile. That is we'll deal with it when we deal with it pile. And for a lot of salespeople, that's really difficult to understand because they automatically assume that their thing is the most important thing in the world. But. But it may not be right because there are limited resources internally within that large organization and things are getting triaged accordingly.

Hello my fellow negotiators. Did you know I once had a listener share that after listening to our podcast, she was able to negotiate a $53,000 raise. And you know what I told her? Where is my commission? Just kidding.

But the real story is this was.

After years of being too afraid to negotiate. But after listening to a couple of episodes on Salary Negotiation, she felt equipped with the confidence and tools to ask for the payment she deserved. And that, my friends, is the power of negotiation. And through a subscription to our new membership community, Negotiate Anything Premium, we're taking that power to the next level. With customized playlists based on our most popular topics, you'll be able to find the episodes you're looking for much faster and much easier. A tool that comes in handy as you're getting ready to prepare for an important negotiation. Even I find myself asking, which episode should I listen to before heading into a high stakes negotiation? And you might be saying, but Kwame, you're the ones having the conversations.

But I forget. So I listen to the episodes multiple times.

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I'll catch you later. Mark. Welcome back to the show, my friend.

It is such a pleasure to talk with you again, man. Thank you so much for having me.

Yes, man, it's our pleasure. Thanks for coming back. And so for those few listeners who don't know you, can you tell them a bit about who you are and what you do?

My name is Mark. I am the founder of a company called Negotiations Ninja. We train procurement and sales teams how to negotiate, get better value, and drive down risk in their organizations.

Amazing. And by chance, do you have a podcast or a book?

Yeah, by chance. It just so happens, Kwame, that just by chance I do. I just recently released a book called Nine Secrets to Win Deals and Influence Stakeholders, available on Amazon. And I have a podcast called the Negotiations Ninja podcast where we talk to many of the same guests that you have on your show, all about how to negotiate and get better deals from their perspective. Because we all negotiate in different ways to be able to achieve great outcomes. And I think that's something that's really important for a lot of the listeners to understand is oftentimes you'll hear people say things like this is the way to negotiate or the only way to get something, or use these three things to get to that. To which my response is, that's nonsense. There is no the way. I am presenting a way to negotiate, but it is not the way to negotiate. There are many ways to get to the end state of whatever it is you're trying to get to within a negotiation. We're going to present our way, someone else present another way. And that's great. And that's exactly how you should approach negotiation learning in general, because negotiation is a practice that we like to say. So it's about learning a bunch of different ways, figuring out which pieces and which different avenues work best for you and then applying that to whatever you're Doing. Doing.

Yeah, man, I agree. And I think that's the beauty of being able to be a professional podcaster. For us, it's we get to chat with the greatest minds in negotiation and learn all of these different ways to do it. I love that perspective, too, because there's no one way to negotiate. But when you're able to learn from the best, then when you run into these unique situations, you can say, okay, what tool do I have in my toolbox for this? Oh, I remember this episode. I don't know about you, but when I still negotiate, I run into these situations. And sometimes I recall episodes, I'm like, I know this episode. This is one of those situations where that episode would work for me.

Totally. Yeah. It's neat to be able to have that level of conversation. I know that you had Yuri on your show recently, and I had him on mine. It was just like, what an amazing experience. Right? Like to be able to chat with the guy that basically popularized negotiation for the modern world. What a pleasure. What a blessing to be able to speak to someone like. And even though I disagree with some of his ideas, it doesn't mean he hasn't had an impact, and it doesn't mean that his ways are wrong. It's just not the way that I approach negotiation. So, yeah, just. What an amazing opportunity to be able to talk with someone like that.

Absolutely. Well, listen, since the last time you were on the show, this book is brand new, and I know that's really exciting. And so for me, in this episode, I just want to dig into the book. So first, let's just talk about general inspiration. What really motivated you to write it?

Money and fame. Those were. And I was sorely disappointed.

There's only one Yuri.

And, you know, I mean, really, like, I'm not Chris Voss, and I'm not William Ury. Let's get real. No, you know, the. The main motivation behind the book was primarily just to create more education for folks. Right. That was more accessible. Some of my stuff is just not as accessible to the average person because it's quite expensive. So a way to be able to get to. A lot of the knowledge that we talk about is through the book. And so that's what I wanted to do. It's a way that we approach negotiation specifically through A procurement and B2B sales lens. And so the whole purpose of the book was to teach salespeople how to negotiate from the perspective of a procurement person. And so if you were a B2B salesperson and you're thinking how do procurement people think and how do they approach negotiation? This is my attempt to be able to educate you on how to approach a negotiation with a procurement person.

That's unique. That is really unique, Mark, because I'm thinking about all of the episodes that I've had on the podcast and the books that I've read. I don't recall anybody who has approached negotiation through that specific lens and put it into a book. Is there anybody else who has done that?

I don't know. That was the only idea I had. So I'm kind of hoping it hits, but we'll see what happens.

Yes, it absolutely does. It absolutely does. Because. Because here's the thing, right? We understand there's some general principles of negotiation, of course, but when you start to get more specific and nuanced, that's when things get really interesting.

Totally.

And so I tell people all the time, if you can find a negotiation trainer who actually has hands on experience in that industry, you're going to be ahead of the game. If you are a salesperson looking for how to negotiate with procurement with specificity, I mean, this is the only option, Right?

Right. So the. And this. I get approached about this all the time where people say things like, hey, Mark, can you train my real estate team on how to negotiate? And I'm like, no, I'm not a real estate guy. Right. Like, I don't know anything about. I can give you like a general outline on how to approach a negotiation, but you need to go to someone who is much more well versed in that or they'll say something. Mark, can you teach my car sales team how to negotiate? No, I'm not your guy. But if you're in the procurement world or you're in the B2B sales world, I'm your guy.

Absolutely. And I think what would be great is to start off with what are the elements of this particular negotiation that make it so unique?

I think it comes down to what I see as the major difference between B2B and B2C negotiations in general is that B2B negotiations are a lot more complex. There's a lot more moving pieces, there's a lot more trading involved in it. There's a lot more managing concessions and building value through the negotiation. And the reality is that you're probably going to have to maintain a relationship with this person after the fact. Right. Like in a car negotiation or a real estate negotiation, you may only ever work with this person once, so there's less need to be. Be polite, kind and courteous. However, in a B2B negotiation, there's a significant need to be able to do that. Now, I think for a lot of people, when they hear this, they'll say things like, oh, Mark, are you saying that we should be generous in our negotiations? No, I didn't say that. I said polite, kind, and courteous. And that's very, very important to be able to understand. I'm also not saying that sometimes you need to know how to grind and push and be a little bit aggressive in the negotiations. That's perfectly fine. But I do believe that there is a need to be able to do that as well. And so what the book does is it outlines nine secrets to be able to plan for your negotiations and strategize for your negotiations effectively so that by the time that you get to your negotiation, you are ready to negotiate. And we offer sort of a flexible framework to be able to allow for that. And so if you want to tie in tools that you've learned in other negotiation books or other negotiation training, the framework is flexible to be able to allow for that. In fact, we encourage that in everything that we do. Don't just do this, add in a bunch of other stuff as well to be able to enhance what it is you're doing.

I've got a quick story for you.

So I was at this keynote and I talked to a listener and he said, kwame, I love the podcast, but my favorite part, man, I love those commercials. And I said, I don't think this is a true story.

And now let me tell you about.

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I was going to say what I love about this, I love everything about it, but I, I love the fact that you can, I can see like the podcasting influence in this too, because you incorporate the flexibility. You recognize that every deal is different. And then you also recognize, hey, there are different methodologies that you can put into this methodology to amplify it based on the unique circumstances.

Absolutely.

The. I recognize a lot of books, they kind of Constrain people into a specific methodology. This is the way to do it and no other way. But you're saying, hey, this is a way. And then you can, I will trust you, the reader, in your expert opinion, to know what to add to this to make it better.

Yeah. And so one of the things that, like we're, we're pretty step by step on framework and structure, so you know, step one, understand what it is you want to achieve out of a negotiation, step two, etc. Right. Like very step by step on what you want to do. But what we say at the beginning is this is not a language book, it's not a scripting book. I'm not going to teach you how to say something. You can find tons of amazing books to be able to do that. I'll give you the framework of how to operate, then you get to plug in all of those things that you want to add on top. So if you were going to think about it, you think about this as sort of the operating system that other programs can be bolted into. And that's the way that we like to think about how we approach negotiation. It shouldn't just be this one way. There's. There should be a, a main framework, a main operating system that you can plug things into to make your negotiation that much better.

Absolutely. And Mark, what it sounds like too is that there's no one specific way of like approaching the negotiation when it comes to the strategy that you utilize. The framework will stay the same, but you can plug different things in. But even the way that you interact with the other side, and this is something that is very nuanced that I know a lot of people struggle with, because I want to go back to what you said. Being polite, kind of and courteous. That doesn't mean being like generous or naive. And it doesn't mean that you can't be aggressive at certain times. And so for you, in your experience, how do you balance this tension between how you interact with the other side? What reads are you making to know how to approach that individual person?

I think a lot of it depends on the circumstance that you're in. And that's true. Right. So if someone's going to be pushy and aggressive with you, that often determines what you do next. If someone is congenial and polite and kind and courteous, that often determines what you're going to do next. The almost the number one question that I get when it comes to this is like, how do I deal with that difficult person or that person who is like really mean or aggressive right off the hop. And my approach in this is to reset expectations usually whenever this happens. So let's just say that you and I were getting into a negotiation. You started being really aggressive, really pushy with me. I would probably come out and say, hey, Kwame, I can certainly appreciate how sometimes these kinds of things can get emotionally elevated. And I want you to know that I'm approaching this with the best intentions I can and with the best attitude that I can. I've noticed, however, over the last few minutes that your emotions might have gotten slightly elevated. You've gotten a little bit more aggressive. And that's not an accusation. It's just me noticing what's happening. So that's usually how I address it.

Listeners, we have to break down the anatomy of this response really quickly. First of all, pausing the conversation and resetting intentions. A lot of times when somebody's really aggressive, it's that they might be misreading your intentions. Oh, I think he's trying to take advantage of me or something like that. So I'm going to slow this down and say, hey, by the way, let me remind you why I'm here, what we're here to do, and then I'm going to share an observation versus an accusation. And you can correct me, I might be wrong, but this is what I've noticed. I'm going to give you the opportunity to correct. And then going forward, what we're doing is we are renegotiating the terms of engagement. So we're saying, hey, we're pausing the agreed upon agenda for a moment.

What?

We were actually here to negotiate. We're pausing that now. We're going to take a step back and negotiate. How we are going to negotiate. And I'm going to give you the option. We can be polite, kind, and courteous. And we can move through this in a way that can be somewhat enjoyable or at least palatable for both of us. Or if you would like, this can get nasty. Lest you forget, I'm a negotiation ninja and I can take you there.

Right?

I mean, if somebody is confronted with that, what are your options? Because if we want to put like we talked to Yuri, let's put some Yuri isms on this. You went to the balcony.

Sure. Yeah.

You overlooked everything and then you named the game. I see you're starting to be mean. And then I'm going to give you options. We can determine how to go forward. I mean, this just in such a short, succinct, polite and courteous way. You took Control while not being controlling and let him know that I'm not going to be taken advantage of.

Yeah. And I think that that's really important. Right. Like, and I think a lot of people misinterpret when I say polite, kind and courteous. They misinterpret that for super overly friendly. You can still be direct and be polite, kind and courteous. Right. And I think that that's really important for people to understand. You don't have to be mean or you don't have to be overly aggressive, but you can be direct. This is how I usually deal with my eldest when he's losing his mind. Right. Like he's nine, sometimes he loses his mind and he'll say something to his mother or to me that's totally off the rails. Like in the moment, I'm like, hey, is that reasonable? Right? Like based your response to your mother right now? Is that a reasonable response based on the fact that she's just trying to get you to sit and eat dinner? Is this meltdown a reasonable response to that? Well, no. All right, well, what do you want to do now? I'm sorry, Mom. Right, Fantastic. Let's readdress where we are right now. Right? We're about to eat dinner, let's sit down, let's enjoy dinner. You can choose to go the other way, but we both know where that ends. And so let's not do that. Right? Yeah. And so nine times out of 10, he's good. You know, occasionally he'll go off the rails and like have a complete meltdown. But the same is true for adults. We're the same. We're just grown up kids. Right. And so when we go into these kinds of situations, it happens all the time.

And Mark, what I love about this is just how simple it is. There's a lot of nuance to this, but in terms of the execution, what we're asking the listeners and what we're asking the readers to do, the execution of this is really quite simple. And I think that's what makes it so empowering, because anybody listening can say, those are words that I can pair together in a sequence. And I think what's interesting is that we are so afraid of the response that it inhibits our execution and the delivery of the words. And based on what you're saying is that when you deliver that and you set that very clear boundary while at the same time being respectful, the response from the other side typically is not that threatening or scary.

Yeah. I think it's important to try and maintain that as best we can throughout the negotiation, we don't want it to get escalated or anything like that. Right. You know, the amygdala starts shooting off and starts getting crazy with us. But, you know, if we can maintain some sort of civility as we have our conversations, I often find that that's the best approach. And in fact, this is like we're moving into, you know, one of the largest, I think, the largest election cycles globally, across the world. And one thing that is so, so important and has become more and more important to me the older I've gotten, is just civility of conversation. Right. Like we could disagree. It's fine to disagree. It's fine to have philosophical differences or religious differences or ways that we approach things. Can we just maintain a civil conversation if we could, that we can have the best discussions ever? I can come to an understanding of what your perspective is. You can come to an understanding of what my perspective is. And we may never get to a point where we agree with each other, but at least now we've voiced our concerns in a civil manner. We now understand each other a lot better. So the next time you voice a concern or voice your opinion, I go, yeah, I can kind of see where that's coming from. Right. And now we can operate together harmoniously in a sort of global. But none of that can happen unless you plan for those discussions. Like, if you're not planning on what to negotiate for and how to negotiate for those things, it's almost a given that those conversations are going to get completely out of hand.

I love the fact that we're talking about the planning and how it all comes back to the planning, because confidence comes from preparation, and obviously confidence will come from skills. But you will gain in confidence during the negotiation when you've taken the time to prepare effectively for the negotiation. And so when you have prepared and you say, okay, hypothetically, if this person goes off the rails, what am I going to say and how, then you know exactly what to do. And I think there's a power that comes from being able to be the coolest head in the room, even though the pressure is on and everybody's feeling it. And it seems like, well, this. This Mark guy doesn't seem to be affected at all. You know, I think it's a new form of leadership, like conversational leadership, where it' somebody says, okay, well, I cannot be so unreasonable compared to him, I look bad. And so I need to kind of reset. And now let's say, let's say there's somebody Skeptical in the audience who says, but Mark, they do not deserve to be treated with my courtesy. What do you say to that? To the person who says deserve? That's the key thing.

Everyone deserves civility. And I think that's what separates us from the crazy people. If we go into a discussion presupposing that this person does not deserve the same level of respect that you would give to someone that you feel does deserve it, you already automatically judged them accordingly. And then the very nature of your speech will change as a result of that pre assumed belief. Right. Because now I've set the belief structure before I've even had a, you don't deserve this. Well, now my belief structure will determine how I speak to you. So I think it's pretty dangerous for us to say this person doesn't deserve this just by their very nature.

I agree. And I think really what we're talking about is number one, taking responsibility for our behavior in the conversation and number two, recognizing the psychology of this conversation.

Conversation.

Because what we're doing oftentimes is we're creating self fulfilling prophecies. We say, all right, this person doesn't deserve respect. They are despicable. And then we go into the conversation and that undertone of just hatred and animosity comes out and the mirror neurons on the other side picks that up. They're like, you know what? I don't think this Mark guy likes me. And then they respond to that. And then we say, you see, I knew this person.

Yeah. And then it just accelerates and it becomes like a hate arms race to see who can become the most hateful. Like there's, there's no benefit to that. There's no one, no one ever gets out of that going, yeah, I feel better about this.

Exactly.

It's like, come on.

Yeah. And as for us as negotiators too, I mean, the deal is done. The deal is, sure, yeah, like, and.

Like, if I feel like you're going to be aggressive with me and push me, I don't want to, but I can play that game and I'm very good at. And I don't want to be good at it. I am. So if we go down that route and we want to play by that route, that's fine. But eventually you're going to meet someone who's big. Like, it's like picking on kids in the soccer field. Right? Like, or behind the school. Right. When you were a kid, there was that one bully that picked on everyone and pushed everyone around until they came across the quiet big kid, right, who didn't want to be involved. But you know the picture, right? The quiet kid that sort of lumbers around but is obviously bigger than everyone else and it's sort of a gentle giant. And then the bully pushes the gentle giant and picks on him and then the big kid body slams him to the ground because he's frustrated by the whole experience and. Right. Like we don't want that to happen occasionally. Like if you continue to be that bully, then you're going to find the big kid who doesn't like to be pushed around, who is actually a very nice person, but just decides that they're going to body slam you one day. Everything you learned in the schoolyard is how you should be thinking about life and communication in general.

It really is because as adults, really we are children without the, the adults to come and stop us from the misbehavior.

Right. We have to police ourselves, which is hard.

Exactly, exactly. And now going back to the book, when you think about salespeople who go up against procurement people and you have that sales focused mentality, what are the biggest challenges you've seen with them when it comes to the negotiation side with the procurement teams?

Well, the incentives are completely different. Right. So sales teams are incented to close quickly and procurement teams are incented to close quality. And so those two, that as the main difference. Right? Because you get incented as a salesperson based on volume, because you get compensated based on what you bring in the door. That's not true for a procurement person. A procurement person gets compensated on in a big way just based on their base salary. And then some of their bonuses are strung to savings and risk reduction and all those kinds of things. But the vast majority of their compensation is associated with how good of a job that they're doing in relation to their base salary. Right. So those two are the two big ones. So immediately, as soon as a salesperson comes into dealing with procurement, it almost feels like you're hitting a bit of a brick wall because there's no urgency. Right. Like a sales procurement person has no urgency and doesn't care about the salesperson's urgency. And so when the salesperson is taught like, oh, we need to create urgency with a procurement person, like, that's the worst, that's the worst advice I've ever heard in my. They have no, you're not creating anything with them. They are going to do what they are going to do and you need to follow and understand to a large extent what their process is and adapt to that process, and I know that when I say this out loud, it's going to make a lot of sales trainers really angry, but that's reality. Like, if you come, especially in enterprise procurement, like, this is it. This is the process that we follow. I'm sorry, but that's just the way it is.

So all of the. For the listeners who are. Who are audio only on this, you did not see me bust up laughing when Mark said creating urgency. Because, Mark, my next question was going to be, I would be remiss for the salespeople out there if I did not ask, how do you create urgency? That's, that's the next obvious thing. And now some people will be listening and saying, well, so, so and so said, we can create urgency. I think this is what's really important to pay attention to with the way that Mark is approaching this. He's approaching this with something that's called honesty. Because a lot of sales trainers are also salespeople and they will sell you based on what you want to hear. And the reality is with procurement people, they really don't care. And it's. It's true. And I think that disconnect of even understanding that fundamental difference leads people to utilize strategies that are ineffective at best and highly annoying or offensive at worst. So I'm really glad that you addressed that.

Yeah, I think, I think it's important to differentiate between creating urgency, which is what I hear of a lot, and understanding urgency and importance. And those two things are very. Are very different than creating urgency. Right. You can understand why this is or is not urgent to me and maybe highlight things that could make it appear more urgent, or you could understand how important or not important this is to me and highlight things that make it appear more important. But you are not creating it. You are understanding it and maybe highlighting some of those things that make me go, oh, yeah, okay, that's an interesting point. The fundamental nature of those two things, they're so different in how you approach the conversation. It's like saying the worst. In my opinion, the worst sales line in the world is like, what do I need to do today to get you to do this thing? If you say this to me, I know that you understand nothing about how my buying cycle works. You don't understand how my budget cycle works. You don't understand how my buying cycle works. You don't understand why this is important to me. You don't understand why this is urgent to me or not urgent to me or not important to me. All you've told me is that this is important and urgent to you. And by the way, I don't care. I care about why this is important to me. And so like, I hate it when I hear that stuff. It's just, it's not real. It's not a real thing.

Agreed. And one of the things you said, you said we have to be able to adapt and adjust to that process. So now what is a realistic approach to. Maybe we could call it shortening the buying cycle. I think that might be more realistic. But since creating urgency isn't something that's realistic, how do we adapt and adjust?

Yeah, I mean, the key comes down to understanding most of and getting a good understanding of how that procurement team actually works and asking better qualifying questions up front with your prospect. Who is not the procurement person. Right. The procurement person is facilitating that process for you internally and helping you with that. And if you can understand that the procurement person's job is to help facilitate that, that's a step in the right direction. But like, better qualifying questions of your prospect of like, who's the procurement person that we need to work with? Let's bring them in early. What do they care most about? What is the legal timeline on this? Look like. What is the procurement timeline on this look like? What does the legal backlog look like? Look, here's the reality, folks. Like, if you're dealing with internal counsel and you're not an important product or service, you are bottom of the pile, right? Like immediately you get triaged into a completely separate pile. That is we'll deal with it when we deal with it pile. And for a lot of salespeople, that's really difficult to understand because they automatically assume that their thing is the most important thing in the world. But it may not be right because there are limited resources internally within that large organization and things are getting triaged accordingly. Let me give you a perfect example. I sell negotiation training to procurement teams for a living. This is what I do. Recently I was stuck in a legal cycle for a very simple three page contract that took three months to negotiate through legal. Here's the reality. There is one internal counsel in that organization, just one, which means that one person is dealing with hundreds of requests on a daily basis. They are getting hammered on a daily basis with all of these internal requests. I understand this, I know this. I understand that this is going to be a very quick and easy phone call for this person. So I'm going to look for the least busy time that this person has possible, pull them up. We're going to bang through this agreement really, really quickly. But if I get stuck in that pile, which I did, then I'm there. That's it. I'm stuck in that pile. They're triaging as much work as they can. I've just got to remain patient, understand what their cycle is. And I understand that this is difficult news for a lot of people, especially salespeople, to take, but this is the reality, right? And this is why having a good, heavy, big pipeline is so important, because you're going to get stuck in this cycle occasionally and it sucks. And that's just reality. I'm sorry.

It is reality. And I think it's important to, to recognize what is possible, because when it comes to negotiation, when it comes to sales, these are skills. It's not magic. We can't magically wave a wand and then it's like, oh, cool, your contract's the most important. And I got it done in two seconds. It's just not possible.

Yeah, it's. It's me and Oracle. Like, who are they going to choose? They're not going to choose me. Guarantee it. Right. Like they're going to choose Oracle first. That's more important. So, look, I mean, at the end of the day, there are just certain realities that you have to deal with as a salesperson when negotiating with internal counsel or procurement or risk or insurance. And part of that means you need to understand what their cycle looks like. And hopefully you can get the conversation to be able to move it to the top of the pile. But. But the reality is that sometimes you get stuck in administrative hell, and that's just the way it is.

That is the way it is. And Mark, before you go, I want to give you an opportunity, just a bit of a layup here when you think about the book, because I know you spent a lot of time on it. There's no way to write a book well, where it's like a short process. And so when you were going through.

It'S a very long, painful process.

Long and unavoidable pain. So as you were going through it, what was the most interesting thing that you discovered as you were researching and writing the book?

The most interesting thing that I discovered was how so many people, especially in the B2B world, don't understand basic process around how large organizations work. Large organizations are like governments, and they're, they're layered with bureaucracy and people and incentives and motivations. And the more that you can understand that, the much easier of a time and, and the much less emotional trauma you're going to experience going through negotiating large enterprise agreements. Because if you don't understand that, then you know getting stuck in a legal cycle for three months is going to kill you you. And sometimes that just happens. So understanding that is really, really important.

Love it Mark. Another masterclass, my friend. Before you go, let the listeners know about the podcast, the book, and how they can work with you.

Easiest way to find me is on LinkedIn. You can just type in my name, Mark Raffin. Or you can find the book on Amazon called 9 Secrets to Wind Deals and Influence Stakeholders. Or listen to the podcast Negotiations Ninja podcast. Add it to your subscribed list along with Negotiate Anything along with many other great ad podcasts in the world of sales, procurement influence negotiation.

Love it. Thank you so much for coming back Mark. Really appreciate it.

Thanks for having me dude. Appreciate it.

Wait, wait wait wait wait.

Now before you sign off, I have something to tell you that I've never told you before. Just kidding. I've told you before, but you should listen to it again. I want you to know about Negotiate Anything Premium. Imagine all of the things that you love about our traditional fees, plus so much more. I know you like our traditional feed because you're at the end of the episode. And with Negotiate Anything Premium, you'll get more bonus content you've been asking for, more of the expert insights that you can't get anywhere else, and more exclusive behind the scenes access into every conversation. Are you ready to get more of what you want out of your life, career and every conversation? With Negotiate Anything Premium, you'll have access to more more high level, custom designed content and insights giving you the tools you need to negotiate higher salaries, better deals and better relationships in your life and career. Once I had a listener share that Negotiate Anything helped her to negotiate a $53,000 raise. Could this be you? What would that mean for your life? I've seen firsthand the impact this model has had on my life and the lives of my corporate clients and I am confident that it can do the same for you. Are you ready to negotiate more of the best things in life? Click the link in the show notes to learn more.

I'll catch you later.