The Synergee Podcast: Motherhood, Mindset & Avoiding Burnout with Daffnee Cohen

I've worked with people who are like, oh, my gosh. I've been working on my new membership, and it's been two months. It was supposed to launch a month ago. And we've done this with book launches, podcast launches, you name it. And I'm like, okay, let's just stop everything, like, for, like, three days. Let's just stop everything we're doing, not patience, but, like, everything else. Let's stop and let's think about what we actually need to get in place. Let's make a list. What's outstanding, what can I do? What do I need from you? And it's like pure panic. Like, oh, my God, we. But we have to keep. And I'm like, no, it's fine. Like, Instagram will be there and your email list will be there, and it's all good. Like, nothing's going to catch fire. And it allows us some space to regroup and to communicate, to collaborate, to make a plan, to decide, hey, actually, we can't launch this right now. We need another month. That's okay, too. To give yourself some grace there. I think. I think from my experience, practitioners, you guys are so smart. Oh, my gosh, geniuses. I am always in awe of you and the problems you can solve for people. I truly. It's amazing, but it's also a matter of saying, okay. Like, I can slow down, and I'm not less of a person or a provider for that. And so I. I do that regularly. Like, it's hard for me to slow down, but I do. I say, okay, wait a minute, I need to look at the week. What do I have this week? You know, if. If it's Monday and I already have a lot of meetings. Sorry, I'm not free till next week.

Back synergy listeners. And, Lori, thank you for that introduction. I am so excited that Daphne's here. I have been playing around her and her podcast, Better with Daphne, and I do recommend that you hop over there and listen to a few episodes, because they're funny, they're entertaining, but also they're just very, very grounded. And I think they're real and raw and just the everyday, everyday things that we are struggling with, dealing with, fun with in our life. So we're so, so glad that you're here, and we're so glad you're willing to share your story and just help inspire our listeners.

Thank you for that. That made me really happy. I'm so happy to be here. Thank you again for having me.

Absolutely. So, you know, we always have to start out is, you know, what's your story like, Daphne? Like, where did you start all of this? Where did you become inspired and passionate to do this? Like, what's the backstory?

Sure. So, um, I was graduating from college and I was like, I don't know what the plan is here. I always had this entrepreneurial bone in me. I don't know, you know, just. I don't know. You know, you don't have to explain it, but like, just from day one, I kind of just knew that eventually I'd do something of my own. And I was really, really fortunate and had a great connection to Mark Hyman, lo and behold. I mean, at the time I didn't even know. And he was so, so kind, so generous and was like, hey, Daphne, I think I need help with the Facebook. You know, this is like a long time ago. And I mean, really, like, it just started there. So. I never took a marketing class in my life. I never took a business class in my life. I was a sociology major. Yeah, I know. And I was like, you know, this is a thing. Like I'm. This is a thing. So I, I really, I dove in and I taught myself everything I possibly could and I read books and I listened to podcasts, which were like, not really a thing back then, and just tried to learn everything I could about digital marketing and realize that there was such a space for this particular. For this marketing to help integrative and functional practitioners and that there's so many amazing practitioners in the world and most of them don't know how to market themselves very well. I say that kindly and with love. So it just evolved from there. And I think two things I'll say about that is one, we really grew up in kind of a functional, integrative lifestyle. I didn't know that as I was growing up. So, like, in hindsight, I'm really grateful for, you know, to my mom for this, but I live my life this way, right? So we're like hyper aware of all the things. We live our lives that way. We try to raise our kids that way. So it's very. It hits home for me all the time. I love that I get to learn all the time. I'm such a biohacky person. I know people don't love that word anymore, but I love it. And that also I'm really a mission based person. Like, I care so much about helping people whenever I can. It's really, I think, at the forefront of how I run my business. So I feel like when we help practitioners, marketing Their clinic, their services, anything that can help people. I feel like we're helping people. So for me it's always just been a win, win, win, win. And it's something that I absolutely love doing.

Yep. And the majority of functional medicine providers that we have encountered do tend to be women. Yeah. I mean, I know you did get the chance to meet the best and meeting him really did change your life, it sounds like. But there are a lot of women. And I know in Kelly and I's businesses, both integrative practices and then in our consulting where we work with other practices, one of the biggest challenges is burnout. And it's because a lot of times we are trying to do so much that of which we haven't been trained to do. But also life just lives, you know, we're women in practice and trying to, not only because we are mission guided as well and just genuinely care not only for the people that we serve, but the people that we love and care deeply for. But in that we. There's a lot of burnout and they aren't able to do that which they love to do for the length of time in a sustainable way. Basically.

Yes.

Yes.

Yeah. I couldn't agree with you more. And I, I have to say that, you know, from day one to today, the evolution of my role in, I think my business and really in my life and as a parent, as a spouse and the person that tries to be a right hand person for our clients that we work with is shifted a lot. Right. I'm not writing Facebook posts anymore. I'm not writing emails anymore. My team is amazing and they're so good at it and that's what they do. But you know, I have three kids under five and you know, so I get it. And most of my clients are females and most of them have children. And so for me, it's really like I'm so passionate about it because I'm the ultra, ultra feminist. We could, I'm like, we can have it all, but no, we can't. And that's something, you know, my husband's like, you need to just calm down for a second. But I, you know, I'm just really passionate about it because in the last 10 years, I can't even count how many conversations I've had male and female practitioners who, the, the themes, the things that I hear over and over and over again. I'm like, do you guys know that you all are saying the same thing? Like you don't know? Right. And so I'm like, and it's always like this, oh, my gosh, I'm wearing all the hats and I'm like, trying to do all of these things. And I'm a practitioner. I don't know about how to do this part and this part. And listen, I will say, as a business owner who started from zero, you know, you have to wear all the hats at some point. Like, that's just the way you grow. But if I could tell everybody in the world who is in this, like, just trying to grow their business or their practice, don't wait so long from that moment that you say, why am I doing this? You know, Or, I don't know how to do this. This isn't a good use of my time. Don't wait a lot longer after that to get help. I think that in itself really is like, if you take anything else away from this is that you can find help that doesn't break the bank. You can find help that really does make your life a little bit easier, that frees up some of your time, and it's. You can't. It's. To your point, it's not sustainable to do everything forever. So I just. I'm really passionate about reminding people that you can absolutely do it and find happiness in that and find peace in that and not be super burnt out and, you know, watch the Netflix show or read your book or whatever you want to do. At the end of the day, when.

I think about this, Daphne, I think about how do we teach people to run their lives like a business? They're the CEO of their body, but they're not running their life that way. And as a result, they're not. They're not outsourcing the things that need to be outsourced within the family. They're not building the resources that they need to have. Sometimes it's lack of community support, too, that leads to burnout because they are trying to do all the things you mentioned. Three kids under five. I mean, that's a lot to deal with. So how do you handle that in your life? Like, what is your perspective on that?

Yeah. Okay, so I will. I am like a. I. I know most people are not like me. And trust me, it's. Sometimes it's to a fault. It. Sometimes it ruins my life. If I'm just being transparent, I am the most organ.

Right?

Like, I pay. Like, I mean, it's. It's kind of a lot. I could afford to do less. Let's just say that. But I will also say that sometimes it's really thinking about Planning or thinking. I mean, I think a lot of this comes down to actually planning. Like if you're on the go and you're just trying to make changes and do I hire this person on the fly? Do I, you know, introduce this new service or a new package in my. Just on the fly doesn't really work that well for the most part. And I think what happens is we think that if we step away from something that needs us to plan that things are going to catch fire. And that's almost never true. Like, truly, most things are not on fire. Right? So, you know, you know, I used to never be able to do that or I'm super healthy. My kids love it. And I'm like, we don't eat out really at all. I make dinner every single night, but there's some nights that I can't. We have tennis, we have Kumon, we have this, we have that. And I'm like, okay, I'm gonna just order Chick Fil A and I don't love it, but I'm gonna do it. And guess what? My kids are fine. So just kind of letting yourself breathe a little bit, Giving yourself some space to say as you guys, sure. You tell the people you work with, it's about the long term, right? We're not eating Chick Fil A every single day. But if we eat it once every two weeks, no one's gonna die. It's gonna be right.

So one of the things that we do in our practice and promote and other practices that we coach is strategy meetings. Right. So it sounds like you wanna have a strategy meeting with your home life too. What's on the horizon, right. For the next few weeks and plan out, like, what needs to be in place to make that happen? Well, versus waiting until you're in the weeds of it. Because when you're in the weeds, you can't see really what needs to be done.

That's to your point, applies across the board. I mean, you can't see your home life, your work life, your business. Like, you just. You can't. And so, and, and that's okay. And I think you guys probably see this a lot too. But just like functional medicine, integrative medicine, it's systems medicine, right. You're not just looking at one piece of it.

Right.

Much that goes into this. And it's something I try to be really mindful of. Like, I do a lot of coaching as well. And I'm like, listen, I am so. I pinch myself every day, okay? I have three healthy kids, my husband, I'M obsessed with him. He's amazing. He's helpful, hard worker. Like, I'm like, oh, my gosh, this is my life. And I know that not everything lines up for everybody all the time that way we don't have a support system in the way of, like, grandparents and stuff. So, like, we pay for all our childcare and help that way. So, you know. But I think at the end of the day, it's. It's about trying to be as well rounded as possible, because I do know how hard it is if you don't have a spouse in the picture to help or if you don't have a parent around to help, or, you know, if you don't have a team in your office or in your business that's going to kind of help you pick up some of that slack. And so I think that's another part of the strategy, right? It's like, are my holes, like, who do I need to help me move on to the next level of whatever it is that I'm trying to accomplish?

And I think sometimes we do try to put the cart before the horse. Who do I need before I really know what I need. Right. And so I really like what you both said, is that I hear you saying that in order to avoid burnout, we've got to take time to stop, take, pause, it's okay to have space, sit down, strategize, strategize our life. Right. Individually and personally, because that does. You know, I think sometimes we try to strategize everything professionally, but we fail to realize that if things aren't great on the home front and personally, all of that's not going to work either. Right. That is a reflection. And I think this really speaks to. Honestly, beyond just functional medicine providers. I think this whole topic really does carry over to. And, and it's, it's. It's women. And yes, I understand men. Right. I do understand that. But the reality is right here, as we speak with three women, we can say higher performers. You said type A, and I don't. I think you're in light company. I think a lot of people who are our listeners are. They want to perform, they want to feel better, they want to be better, they want to do the things they want to do, have the energy to do it, and they want to have the ability to achieve great things, and it's necessary to not burn out to do that. So. Yeah. So having a what, a questionnaire, Right.

Maybe.

Maybe Kelly, maybe giving them a questionnaire. Yeah. Answer these questions because some People don't even know where to start with a strategy with themselves. They've never done that before. So where do they start?

Kind of like building the resilience plan. Oftentimes we'll have with patients talking about a resilience plan. What does that look like? Well, that involves family life, too. That encompasses everything, like their work life, their family life, and then, you know, their self. Like, how are they taking care of themselves daily and individually? So there's a lot that goes into that, and it can be overwhelming when you think about it. So, Daphne, you were blessed with amazing energy. Obvious. That is very obvious in your content and just life speak. And. And I think, you know, in your. In your decade of life, that hasn't started being challenged as much as it perhaps will happen in perimenopause and menopause. And so I think about, like, how do we preserve that energy? If you could just bottle it up and keep it for the rest of our. The rest of our life, that would be amazing. And our little mitochondria want to get a little burned out as we get a little bit older and hormones start to slip and slide. And that doesn't help us out either. And so do you have any strategies that you're using particularly for energy at this point? Have you found anything that you feel like really recharges you so that you can do the things that you want to do?

Yeah, that's a great question. I will also transparently say that I've been like this since birth. Like, I am. I was like, you're a problem a little bit. Like, I literally have one cup of coffee a day, and I'm like this until it's time. Like 10:30 at night. I just, like, really excited about everything, though. Like, I like, again. I'm like, wow, life is amazing, you know? So anyways, I will say this. Two things that I think for me personally are huge. One is that I don't care what anybody says. I don't care if you're spiritual or not or religious or not or what you believe. Read, see, mindset is everything. So I. I like thinking and feeling like I'm 12 because I feel youthful. Fantastic. I'm not in my head, I'm 36. What? All my friends are like, we're getting old. I say it jokingly. I'm like, no, I'm not. I'm great. And then the second thing is that I really do not have a hard time saying I, like, these are the things that I need to feel, like, recharged and to, like, fill my cup back up again. And for me, it's sleep. No questions whatsoever. I do. I am not that person that's like, I'm fine with seven hours. Like, no. I get nine hours a night. Every single night. I have a routine that would make you embarrassed. It's just so long, and I'm like.

I'm, like, in my ugly, bad routine.

Yeah.

Yeah. My husband's like, you. Are you okay over there? I'm like, I'm in. Like, I'm on my grounding sheet. I got my pillow spray, my magnesium. Like, I do all the things. I just. I bought a sauna. Our Christmas gift for each other was a sauna. There's a sauna in my garage now. And it's, like, the best investment I've ever made in my entire life. I'm obsessed with it. I do that every night. So I. I have to sleep and rest to like, redo the next day over and over again, and I feel it when I don't. So I will say everybody's different. Like, some people can do better with less sleep. I. I have opinions about that in the long term, but I'm sure you guys do, too. And, like, for me, I am, like. I am obsessed with fitness and working out. I love it so much. I think that's a huge, huge, huge part of where I get my energy from. I actually crossfit, and I've been crossfitting for, like, nine years now. I compete. I'm like, I love it. I love lifting weights. I love being out of breath. I don't know. It's like, just my thing. So if I don't work out, I'm. I can tell. I just feel a lot more sluggish. I don't feel as good. But again, I think what we all need to remember, whether it's your energy level or, you know, whatever it is that you're doing. Like, what? Think about the things or the parts of your day where you feel really great and think about what made you get there, you know? Like, this, for me, fills my cup. I'm, like, so happy right now. This is the best start of the weekend to me, is be able to talk to you guys, you know, so do more of the things that feel recharged. I think we ignore that sometimes, you know, what is for you?

Yeah, absolutely. I would. I would second the sleep. For me, that's exactly the same. If I do not get my sleep and if I don't get my movement, Those are two very, very similar things that we have in common. Because if I don't get those two things, I do not feel my best.

Yeah.

I cannot function without sleep, but I don't feel my best without exercise. I can function, but I just don't feel my best.

Right.

I just don't feel my best.

Yeah.

And then add a third thing in there, the power of connection. And, you know, it's the same. You know that. That is something that we have talked about is ageless aging. Right. We talk about. Maddie Ditchwald has a. Has a book that we really love, but she talks about the power of connection and even mentorship and feeding into other people, because it's not just the time we have together, but we get the ability to share this information to other people. And I think that really rejuvenates and reinvigorates us, too.

Yeah. Connection. So important. And I was listening, Daphne, to one of your podcasts where you guys were talking about the guilty pleasures of tv, like what you watch for entertainment. And I was struck by the housewives. Right. The obsession with the housewives. Okay.

And I'm just going to go there.

I'm going to go there because I find it interesting, I think, that we watch shows like that for connection. You know, it's all these females. They're. They're connecting. They're bantering back and forth. There's this community, and there's a timeline that we follow with them. And I think they're. They're. They're very. They're very seductive in just dragging us in. Right. I had a really good friend that lived in Southern California, and so the Orange County Housewives, I got obsessed with them. And I'm like, I can't believe I'm still watching 12 years in and I'm still watching the Orange County House. But it makes me feel close to her. You know, that's just the thing. Just being in that environment, seeing that environment and just all the banter with the girls. So I think it's funny the things that we go to for connection, I guess, is why I'm saying that.

Right?

Yeah. And you know what? Like, own it. Like, people get such a freaking hard time about it. I'm like, I check all my boxes all day long. If I don't, I don't feel bad at all. I mean, I just. Whatever it is that's going to fill your cup, as long as it's not, like, hurting you or someone else or illegal, you know, but, like, just do own it. Whatever that looks like for you, own it. Who cares if you binge watch A show every night. Like, that's fine. We do so much. We do so much. I am not sorry about it, but I do watch.

We have some of those guilty pleasure TV shows too, because I think sometimes you just have to watch mindless stuff, right? You just.

You do.

I think, you know, high performers tend to have that brain that's always trying to solve a problem, right? Yeah. So whether it's a book, you know, whether it's something that you watch that completely distracts you, you know, whatever that is, it just. It does need to go on your. What we call your wellness plan. Like, what are the things you need to do daily, weekly, monthly, quarterly to live well, you know, what fills your cup back up and like you said, is making sure you prioritize that so that you. You're getting that, you know, that. That reinvigoration that we all need to get up the next day and do it all over again.

Exactly.

So what other things for connection would you say are empowering for you?

So this kind of stuff. Love it. And I will say, like, I have a community at my CrossFit gym, right. And it's actually a pretty small gym. Like, there's not a ton of people that go at the time that I go, but, like, just seeing them and being with them and like, laughing about nothing really important and just that, like, just that in that hour for, again, like, for the rest of the day, I'm like, okay, because I work at home by myself. My kids are in school, and, you know, I'm pretty much home alone all day. I'm on slack with my team. But so, like, that in the beginning of the day is, like, so impactful for me. And then I really do. I will say, like, our weekends are pretty full of stuff that we do, like, as a family. And I'm actually very protective of that time. So I. My husband works really long days, and, you know, the kids are in school. We're working. So for me, like, my big recharge is like, we're literally sitting on the floor in my kid's room playing games together. You know, like, that sense of community, it's not always outside your home. It can be, of course, but for me, like, my people, my community are my kids and my husband. And then I think also just, I do have, of course, a few of my close girlfriends and friends, and I try to do like a lunch once a week or, you know, maybe every other weekend, we'll go out for dinner or something. But I. Yes, I can tell when it's been Too long that I've done something like that because I really crave it. And I can't stop thinking about it. I'm like, oh, my gosh, I haven't seen you. And I like, we have to catch up on. And it just feels good.

I heard you say in one of your podcasts, and it goes back to what you just said. Maybe not exactly. And honoring that time and really with your husband. I think that's the verbiage, something like that that you said, I picked up in one of your podcasts how you said how even you try to do a lot of the stuff at home, get your stuff done, because, you know, when he comes home, you want to make sure, to the best of your ability to be able to have that connection time with him, because he's not home that much. When did you. There's always that point in our lives where we come to realizations. Was there a point in time that. That you came to that realization? Was. It is. Sometimes it's a hurt, sometimes it's a story. What is that?

Oh, I love that you asked that. Because it's probably one of the things. And I'm a huge advocate for therapy, by the way. I've been in therapy for a million years, and I'll be in therapy. I'm perfectly happy, but I'm still going to go. Yeah, but it's probably one of the things that I feel the most, like, internally proud of was, like, this thing that I kind of worked through. So my husband and I have been together for 13 years, and he, from day one, he's been a workaholic. I knew that the day I met him. He's still that way. And he is. He is moving on up that corporate ladder. Okay. Like, he is running stuff. And then. So proud of him. He's such a hard worker. He's so smart.

Yeah.

That's all great. And that all really was not very problematic at all until we had a kid. And then I was like, wait a minute, working all the time. I also have to do everything else. So anyways, you can see, like, that snowballed, actually, pretty fast. Yeah. And I'm sure that anybody with a child or a spouse or both is listening, and it's like, yes, yes, yes, check, check, check. Right. So, you know, basically what was happening and it happened pretty fast was like, I was resentful, which is really the worst place to be in a marriage. You don't want to be resentful. And I was like, you know, I just. I realized that my life Changed so drastically after we had our first and his didn't. And whose fault is it? Maybe nobody's, I don't know. But you know, this is maybe just how things go. I don't, I'm not sure. He's not a stay at home dad. I'm not a stay at home mom. But I, I really was like, he would walk in the door. We joke about it now. It wasn't funny then, but like he. I would hear the door open and I would, I would turn into Shrek. I was like, like, I was like so angry. Didn't even say a word yet. And I was just like, he. And he was scared. He was like, oh my God, like, what am I gonna say or do to like, set her off? Because it was so stressful to be alone. And. And then we added kid number two and it got worse and I was like, oh my gosh, like from the hours of like 3:30 to 7:30, like, I'm lucky my house is not on fire. And I'm literally just took off my like business owner hat and immediately had to put on the mom hat. And I'm doing dinner and there's lunchboxes and they need their butt wiped still. Like, you know what I mean? So it was just. And then I was like, this is. So what would happen is I was so upset about it and I was so resentful. Nothing was changing. And then the kids would go to sleep and like, I wanted nothing to do with him because I was just mad and I. And I really was like, you know, and a lot of my friends were like, that's so messed up. You know, like, they're my cheerleaders. What are you gonna do about it? I was like, I don't know. Like, he's not gonna quit his job. You know, he works in hospitality. We're in Orlando. So, like, it's a late day, you know, I mean, I. I don't know. So I just, I kind of got to this point where I was like, okay, I know I'm not going to change him. In fact, the best thing I've ever learned in therapy is that I can't change anybody but myself. Like, I can't control anybody but myself. So he's not going to quit this job. And, you know, he's not going to all of a sudden. He's not going to step down from his position to like, just, you know. So I'm just rationally trying to think through what does this look like for me long term if I don't Change something about how I am viewing the situation and do I like it? And the answer was, I don't want to get divorced. So I. Or go to jail. I'm just kidding. So I was. I am going to. I need to change something. And what I. And listen, this is not easy. I'm a Taurus. I'm stubborn. I'm alpha. Like, this is so hard for me. But I started saying to myself every single day when I pick the kids up, when I'd start making dinner, when food's being thrown everywhere and diapers are being ripped off, I was like, I get to be here right now with them one on one. I don't have to be here with them one on one. And I just. Every single day, I was gonna say this to myself. I'm gonna say this to myself. And truly, I know it sounds like frou frou weird magic. No, it shifted really fast for me. And one. Everything stressed me out less because I was like, I know how fast time goes by. I know that this is temporary, and I am gonna miss it one day, you know, And I just. It allowed me to. Instead of making it sound like I, you know, was forced into this corner. And, like, you know, I mean, I wanted these kids, too. I just changed all that. And so I just. All of a sud. Became this thing where I'm operating in this path, which sounds a little bit singular for my husband and I. Again, I think people have opinions about this. I feel like, you know, this is like, I. I'm just gonna do what I need to do to be a present mom. And, you know, spend this evening with them. And whenever he gets home, he gets home, and I'm just gonna let it be. I'm not gonna get upset about it anymore. And I. I can't even remember the last time that I was like, where are you? And what do you see the time? And, like, just mad and angry. It's like he walks in, we all run, and we're like, oh, dad's home. And, you know, he jumps in and helps right away. Like, he's great about that. Like, I mean, shoes are still on, and he's running, and he's like, okay, what are we doing? Who needs hair brushed? Who needs teeth? But the way that it changed my marriage is it's the best thing that's ever happened. And I realize that it applies to everything, right? So when you're in practice and you're like, oh, my God, I'm so overwhelmed. I have to do this. I have to do that simple Shifts of. I get to do this. Like, it's what an honor. Like, I get to keep growing. I get to hire more help, I get to offer more services. And it changed absolutely everything. And I. And I know my husband, who's like, thank you.

He's like, what happened to my wife? What happened to her?

I like her.

First of all, I just want to say thank you so much for your transparency and thank you for being willing to tell a story that I honestly believe resonates with so many, probably young women, newer moms, maybe even those that are more mature and never came to that.

Yeah.

In their earlier years.

Right.

And they're out there seeking, why are they so dissatisfied where they're at? That was just really good advice. And I can think of so many people that are going to be listening to this, and I hope that they also step back and listen to that again and learn that they have the power of changing their mindset and that it's just taking a few minutes to shift it and to practice it. You said reiterating it, saying it out loud. And that also, I am sure, changed the way that your children as they grew up, they also receive that. Right.

Yes. I think. Thank you for saying that. Yeah. Again, I think when you get to a point, when you just hear other people say things and you hear people talk about things, it doesn't always resonate until you stop and realize that, like, this could actually apply to your life or like, your happiness or your. And the way that my kids and our and I are with each other after that shift, night and day. Right. Because I'm not so on edge and I'm not waiting for the ball to drop. And I'm not. I'm not anticipating something negative happening and how unfair to them. You know, that's not fair to them. But I will also add, just as a, as an add on to that. I definitely am an advocate of making things as equal as possible and that it is unfair. I don't care what anybody says, that we just will always carry more than typically our male counterparts do. I am the default parent. If someone's sick, I miss work. If someone's sick, I go pick them up. You know, I, I do a lot of that. But again, society is like, you know, evolved from, like, women just do it, no questions asked. And now it's like, wait a minute, like, let's share these. But here's the thing. Like, again, the mind shift applies. I. I get to do it. I love to do it. I'm so happy. I get to do it. So it's not this fight that I'm trying to fight with society and with my friends opinions and with my husband, as long as I feel fulfilled. So I would say that to anybody listening, if you feel fulfilled and you're finding joy in it, hooray. Like you, you win, you won. That's it. But if you, if you are not in a position to speak your needs to your partner, that is still an issue. Right? So my husband knows that most night, you know, most nights I take care of things because I want to spend that time with him. But the other night I was like, I cannot stand up for one more minute. You need to pack lunch. So I sit on the couch and he goes, like, what do I put in here? And I went, figure it out. And that was it. And like, we just moved on. And he did it right. And he figured it out because it's not rocket science. And then, you know, so I can ask for what I need and I can say to him, you know, I need you to be here at this time. And he is, and he will be. But in the 90%, 10% scheme of things, like, I'm doing the things and. But I still have space to ask for what I need for. And I think everybody deserves that at a very bare minimum, for sure.

I think what you're saying is marriage is a partnership, right? It is partnership. Right. And in that partnership, it requires that you do have necessary conversations that sometimes can be awkward or uncomfortable. It's a skill. Right. It's a muscle that you develop and you have to practice it. And it sounds like that's what happened. Right? That there's trust. You know, I, I too am an advocate of, of counseling and, and talk therapy and just having a third party just to work together. No matter how good you think your relationship is, I think everyone would benefit. But learning each other's needs and figuring out, it's kind of like, where do you seat in? Right. As part of your team? You know, when even someone comes into a new team of a business, you know, it takes a little while for them to seat into their position. And they also have to feel confident in a team environment that they can have conversations. I mean, that's what makes a powerful team, too.

Agreed.

Right.

In our practices.

Yeah.

And as things shift in your environment, you know, like your addition of the babies. Right. That was a huge shift that needed renegotiation. It needed more thought and planning and probably weren't really prepared for what was to come. Right. No one can prepare you for that.

Right.

So I think it's beautiful that you guys work through that. And I'm with Lori. I think counseling is amazing. I will forever be in counseling. And I think it makes us better providers. Right. When we're more in tune with our own self and what we need and communicate that well, I think that sets a really good example for what others should be doing for themselves as well.

Yeah.

And I love, and I have to reiterate this, that it's not about what your friends say, and it's really not even about what your parents say. Right. Because we're grown up now. Right. We're grown up now. We have to make our own decisions. It really is about what gives. You know, mutually together. What are your mutual goals as a family? So what are your individual goals? What are your family goals? Where do you want to go? And then how do you together. Both come together. Together to make that happen? And, you know, I think society has all these rigid rules for what the, you know, guy should be doing, woman should be doing. And all of that's been. I mean, just. I mean, that's changed over the course of the. The last decades.

Right?

Decades. It's changed. And you just together, have to come up with that yourself and really kind of go, I like that when you say, I might have to start that.

Some people will like it and some won't, but we don't care. Yeah.

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.

That's good stuff.

And I think that a lot of this really kind of flipping back to, you know, burnout is that we do really. I mean, burnout is inevitable if we don't come to those mind shifts, if we don't create that learning, if you will, to look at things differently through a different lens and speak up for ourselves and be willing to be brave and courageous in those conversations, know what we need, take inventory of what we need, and be willing to ask for what we need from those around us.

So a lot of people are using that burnout word, right? They're throwing it around. I'm so burnt out. I want to talk about that more. Like, what is burnout versus what is your strain? Right. And some of that comes down to mindset. Like, we can burn ourselves out with our mindset, telling ourselves every day we have to do this and we have to do that. And it's such a chore that can be very worrying in and of itself. To me, burnout is when you can't do. You know, motivation stops. The ability to get up and go stops, you know, and so Recognizing strain for what it is and correcting for strain early so that we avoid that burnout. Right. That's what we would really want someone to be able to do is like harness those warning signals from strain and navigate through it so that we don't lead to that burnout. Because burnout is hard to recover from. I mean, it's not an easy recovery to go from true burnout back to resilience is where we want people. So I don't know what you guys would say about that, but.

Yeah, I, I, we actually did an episode recently on burnout and we same thing. So we're definitely on the same page. I think burnout is a very trendy word, right? Like, oh, I'm so burnt out. I get it. It's fun to say it sometimes when you're like venting to your, you know, your friends or whoever. I, I fully agree with you though. I think we're typically mostly overworked and under prepared. And I think one thing that I have started saying to myself that has also really, really helped me. I think that when we feel burnt out, it's, we're exhausted. We're this for that. I also think it's just stressful, right? Like whatever. It could be a work thing, it could be a health issue. It's stressful to deal with problems and solve them. I mean, I think that's obvious thing to say and I think, I think it's actually a matter of also managing our stress and managing how we're thinking about these things. How are we pondering or stuck on them outside of when we're solving them. Right. Or maybe we solved it and it's just something that really bothered us. Like how are we dwelling and letting things go? Like, so I, you know, I have to deal with, I get to deal with people all the time. You know, for the most part. 99 of people that we work with are amazing. We love them, they're kind, they're helping people, they're mission driven. They're wonderful, kind, amazing human beings. And everybody then you get one and you're just like, this is not a good fit for me. And if you're keeping me up at night. No, because we don't mess with the sleep, as we said. Right? So I had like someone like that semi recently and I just was like, wow, I am so grumpy and I am so mean right now to absolutely for no reason to my husband to, because I'm. This thing is just eating at me and it's consum. And it was I was like, I'm burnt out from this. And I'm like, no, I'm just really tired of this situation. It's just not healthy, you know? So one thing when I finally kind of got to this, and I think this is what happens for people, is we eventually get to a breaking point. You're like, something has to change. My recommendation and what we should try to do is do it before we get there. We save our stress. But something that I, when I got to kind of my breaking point in that situation that I told myself, that I've been saying to myself all the time now, is that I exist outside of insert thing, right? So I exist as a person outside my business and I'm an overachiever and I'm always trying to prove something. I don't know to who or what, but like, I'm not happy until we're, you know, servicing half a million people. I don't know, I'm, you know, I'm just so intense like that. But whatever money I make, whatever growth I have, whatever wonderful people we get to work with, I'm still just Daphne, like outside of that. And I'm still Daphne outside of my marriage. And I'm still Daphne outside of mom and outside of the Did I get the best score at CrossFit today? And did I, you know, like, I'm still, still just me. And I really love to read books and I like an old soul and I love to scrapbook and do other and do plants. You know, like, I still get to be me. And actually nobody can ever take that away from me. No situation, no stress, no anything will ever, ever get to do that. And that's actually is my power. And I know we've all heard that before, that our power is that we are us and nobody else's. And I believe that so firmly. And actually it just made me feel so safe. I was like, oh. Like, I don't, I don't even have to deal with any of that. And really, I'm definitely one of those people that likes to go like, worst case scenario. And. But actually, because usually it's still fine, right? So, like, worst case scenario, like what? Every single client we ever had fired. Never going to happen, right? Like, we've been doing this for 14 years. We're fine. But like, if that happened medically, like, I can still feed my kids. Like, we still have a roof over and like, I still have someone who loves me. I have kids who are healthy. I just, I'll never underestimate the power of like, Stepping away from these things that we think define who we are and sitting with what actually defines, and it's really powerful. And since I kind of started saying that to myself, and I say it pretty regularly now, man, problems are just, like, not that serious. Well, yeah, that'll fix itself. It's fine.

I'm so glad you shared that, because I think it's a testament to how we can let one little thing, one little thorn in our side, snowball into our existence of how we think and how we behave. And then what we attract. Right. All the energy that we put out around that attracts more negativity. So I love that you were able to kind of reconcile that and decide, no, we're not going to have that, number one. But also just reframing who. How you see yourself.

Yeah.

And that's part of your life, but not all of your life. There's power in that. Power.

And that's such a growth mindset, too. Right. That whole difference between a fixed mindset and a growth mindset is that's a growth mindset. Willing to learn, willing to grow in all circumstances, seeing them as opportunities, you know, and not being the victim, but being the victor in all of them and realizing, you know, I. I love what you said about going back and reflecting on who I am outside of fill in the blank. And I truly believe. And I love Kelly talking about her younger self, you know, kind of seeing you. Right. I. I have to say, very much the same. I wish I would have done some of this work much younger, because in growing up and in. In my experience, military home, kind of, you know, and just very regimented and, you know, only girl out of, you know, three. Two older brothers, you know, pursue, pursue, pursue. You can do anything. And you. You can. But those things do start to define you, and it happens without you even realizing it. And you really lose who you are in all of it. So being intentional early, it's where you will land.

Yes. Yeah, absolutely. And it's never too late. So to your point, never too late.

Never too late.

Yeah.

It's amazing. I mean, with some of the stuff that I've shared with you, like, I felt a difference. Like, I physically, energetically felt different within days. So we think about just how much time we. And I like to think about it this way, positively. Right. Like, how much time we have left. Like, there's so much time to be happy and at peace and. And I think going back to what we were saying earlier, like, whatever it is that brings you peace, like, that's great. Do that, like, sometimes I felt like I would do things sometimes because it was what I was supposed to be doing. And I was like, is this what I want to do? Like, I don't know. Is this what I want to do? Is this what actually makes me happy? And I was. I mean, definitely, like, always trying to please and, like, you know, check all the. I mean, I was, like, the captain of every sport in high school and, like, the head of rotc. It was too much, you know, I was like, why am I doing this? You know, a lot. And it's just. I really. I'm like, in hindsight, I'm like, I didn't enjoy some of that, and I just did it because I felt like I had to do it. And I think it's really powerful. Like, nothing is more empowering than being like, I love sitting here and doing sudoku at night. This is actually what makes me happy. Who cares? You don't have to do anything else. Like, it's just doing what we. What actually fills our cup so that we can then strategize, so that we can make a plan, so that we can delegate so that we can be a good person in our business or in our lives. Like, that's actually what we're all here for, I think, you know, and show.

Up the way we want to show up. Right. For those things. And that's really the power of all of the research around gratitude. It changes everything in an instant. And I think, you know, yes, we go back to that. Is it frou frou? Is it just, you know, like, oh, how could that be? And I know there are naysayers out there. I'm just going to. I mean, we. I'm sure, you know, there are people probably listening here and. Yeah, like, whatever. And no, you've heard us all say it has not only changed our lives, but it has changed the lives of many others that we've gotten the privilege of being able to mentor and feed into. Right. It's changed their lives, too. Yeah.

I will say I'm excited today that counseling has now become okay. You know, before I think, in our generation and above, you had a major problem if you went to counseling.

Yes.

Like, something. Something was very wrong. And now today, the position is just self discovery. Learning yourself, learning where you. Where you fit in the world and where what is you and what is them, and just being really intimate with how God made you. And so it's just so powerful. And I'm glad to see younger people embrace that. And. And I think some of our Generation too is embracing it. But it can be a harder conversation to get into. Have you thought about talking to someone? Have you thought about exploring this more? Because there's so much written richness in just making that mindset shift. That mindset shift and making it. I mean it is very physical. You feel it physically when that happens. There's power in that. And then I'm curious, do you use any trackable, wearable devices in your exercise and sleep endeavors?

Zero.

Okay. Yeah.

Because I'm like, I already obsess over too much. Want to add a thing that. I love it.

I love it.

It's part of knowing yourself.

Right.

Knowing whether or not that that tool would be impactful for you.

I did buy my husband an aura ring for his birthday last October. I bought it for him mostly because I was like, maybe I want one, but let's see if he likes it. And I'm not. He'll lay down. Last night, he lays down, he's like, oh, forgot my ring, not getting up. And I was like, I will. I need to know what your score is. I love it. I love it.

I'm obsessed with the Oura ring and I think Lori is too. I mean it really has been a tool. As I did have some major health challenges. It's been a really good tool for me to use to walk myself back to resilience. And I, you know, I think I was so out of touch with some of my physiology. Even I'm in this space, I'm looking at labs all the time. But the day to day data helped me navigate so much better.

Love that. I should probably get one.

Yeah. So I'm going to encourage you to get one. I think it'll keep you out of the weeds.

I'm going to be on the other end and say you do you. And just like there's right food and the right. For the right time, right exercise in the right amount at the right time. I think there's right wearables in the right amount at the right time. And acknowledging that because it can be, it can be more of a stressor if we go into it. If we go into it with that mindset of now I have to fix everything. If we go into it with that mindset of it's just exploration and fun, like that's in.

Yeah.

Curiosity.

Yeah. Yeah. It changes everything, but yes. Yeah. So we'll have to play both sides right there. She'll say go and I'll say ah, Exclude. Yes. But listen, we just thank you so much on so many levels. Just for taking the time today on a, you know, on this beautiful Friday here. And just thank you for taking time out of your schedule to pour into the people that we get the opportunity to share this message with. Thank you for your honesty, your transparency, and I just. I just honestly hope and wish you all the best in all of your endeavors for great success personally and professionally. And I look forward to another opportunity to be able to talk with you.

Oh, my gosh. Stay in touch. I talk to you guys anytime. So fun. I'm just so honored to be here. And when I reached out and I was like, I think you guys actually are interviewing another one of my clients. And I was like, I like their show. And I'm so, you know, it all works out exactly as it should. I believe that, and I really enjoyed our conversation.

And I do want to take a minute before we close out to give you the opportunity to share. How do people get in contact with you? Like, you know, what are some of your. Your website. What is your podcast? I know we've said it a couple of times today. Yeah, please take a minute to share that.

Sure. Thank you for asking that. So the cool thing about my name is that nobody else has my name spelled the way spelled because my mom's a hippie and she thought it would be cool to spell it D, A, F, F, N, E, E instead of ph. So if you type my name into Google as Daphne, it, nothing else comes up but me. So I am primarily on Instagram. I love Instagram. I'm always sharing my little tips and tricks and my insights and this and that for all of my, you know, practitioner clientele audience, but also just for my friends, my moms, my, you know, all of us just working people in the world. And my handle is literally just Daphne because nobody else has my name. And then my website is just Daphne Cohen.com, which, again, if you just type in my name into Google, it'll come up right away. So it's quite easy to find me. That's all.

Awesome. And your podcast is also.

If you just type in Daphne into any, you know, Spotify or itunes. It's just better with Daphne and Tori, and I think, you know, we cover some similar stuff. I like it. We have some there.

And it's a lot of synergy not to, you know, you know, of course, better together. We're better together. Who is Corey? I have to know.

Okay. So I met her in college, and so we've been friends now for over 10 years. She's. She's just amazing. So she's. I don't know if she'll. She probably won't care, but she is. What is the right word? Her family owns a company that you guys all know the name is in your home somewhere. And like, so she does a lot of like, wealth management towards like our kind of like generation of people, family business. She's on the board and so she has like this, all this very unique, like, approach to like career, wealth management, growth kind of stuff. She's also just a frickin riot. Like, she's just one of the funniest people I've ever met in my life. And she lives now in New Jersey. She's from Wisconsin though. And so, yeah, every week we just like get on and we literally open, zoom. We're like, so what's it gonna be today? And pick something and just, you know, dive in and it's honestly one of my favorite things to do.

So we have more in common too, because Kelly and I met just that way and we could honestly just open up and some of our most fun podcasts on, honestly, you're just like, what.

Are we gonna talk about?

I love it. It's.