Episode 07 : Redefining Women's Health in a Matriarchal World with @TheGynarchy

Foreign. To another episode of the Matriarchy Times podcast, Matriarchal Voices, as always. We have a special guest today, an extra special guest because it's Ms. Kirti Patel who is the board certified OB GYN and she has over 20 years of experience in this and recently she has started her own podcast called the Gynarchi. And she was kind enough to give us some of her time to join us here on our podcast too. So if you have tuned in or listen to the Gynaki, you know that she talks mostly about topics related to women's health and women's mental health and feminism also. And she also talks about how health is a big issue when we are trying to balance equality and how these issues kind of are essential and have broader implications to society. So I'd like to introduce Ms. Patel now. Hi, Ms. Patel. And how are you? And can you tell us a bit about yourself?

Thank you. Thank you for inviting me. Thank you for drawing attention to my podcast. I really appreciate it. Well, I am from the US my parents are from India. They immigrated in the 70s and I. But I grew up in the US so I'm American and I'm a doctor there. I grew up in New Jersey. I. Yes, like you said, I've been practicing over 20 years in OB GYN now I mainly practice gynecology part time. And my fun hobby or mission, I guess has become this podcast and to draw attention to women's issues and in particular women's health, but other issues as well that affect women.

And so how has it been like, how has has your journey like, what ways have you noticed that the patriarchal systems have failed women selling? And how does this reflect within our society as a large issue? How does, how is women self like important? How, what do you think?

Yes, well, women's health is so fundamental, right. From my experience of taking care of women individually, I just see that so much. You know, a woman cannot do anything in life without her health. Right? You cannot pursue an education, you cannot work on your career, you cannot have a family, you cannot advance to a leadership position. You cannot really succeed in life as an individual unless you fundamentally take care of yourself and your health. Right. So I see that on an individual level, but I see that societally as well. Right. Women neglecting women's health keeps us weak, keeps us weak and away from, you know, success and in society, broader sphere and keeps us away from leadership positions and really representing women's needs equally. So that's why I think it's so important. It's like the bedrock, I think it should be a bedrock of feminism to focus on women's health.

Yeah. Oh yeah, I also understand what you mean. Like, we have so many issues that men don't understand. Like it's hard for us to explain. Like for example, like ministration, like, no matter how much you try to explain it, it's very hard for people to understand. And it's. How do you think the patriarchy has, like what of the patriarchy do you think has been fundamentally kind of down grading the importance of allowing women to live a healthier life? Yeah. Where do you see the patriarchy coming to this? Like, we know, like patriarchal structures kind of affect things in different ways. How does it affect health?

Yes, absolutely. I mean, under. Unfortunately, if you really think about it, right. The patriarch. The way I think of patriarchy is a hierarchical system, right. It has a lot, it has a few winners at the top and everyone else is pretty much losers. It's, you know, a small number of powerful people, usually white, usually male, and everyone else is striated below. Right. And the way I see this is it, you know, when focusing on, away from women's health or even, even harming women's health is kind of part of the design, Right. It's another way of keeping women poor, disabled, struggling, you know, in life. And that, that weakness, you know, keeps us away from powerful positions, power, money, access, you know, freedoms that other people enjoy, other higher up in that hierarchy enjoy. And of course there's also an element of racism as well, you know, so looking from an intersectional lens, you know, also not focusing on the health and well being of people of color also keeps these groups down. Right. So the women as a group are lower down in the patriarchy and then women of color are even further lower down, you know. So I think, have I answered your question with that? Perhaps, perhaps I could expand, I could keep going. I mean, there's so much shame and stigma around women's health as well. Like you mentioned menstruation and you know, preventing, putting, attaching shame to women's bodies, normal function, sexuality, stages of life, aging, that's all part of the design of the patriarchy. Right. And we're ashamed to speak about these things. So we don't know enough, we're not educated enough, we don't speak to each other. So it prevents learning, it prevents improving our health. And that's all part of the design. I mean, people don't think about it too much and they just think, well, these, you know, I think the patriarchy would like us to believe. Right. As certain people in powerful positions would like us to believe that. That these things are inappropriate to talk about.

Yeah, I feel like, like listening to your answer, that patriarchy causing us to feel shame when trying to talk about health issues kind of translates to larger mental issues more than physical issues. Are you in any way, like, covering women's mental health in this, like, oppressive situation, for want of a better word?

Yeah. I mean, certainly as an ob gyn, I have taken care of women with postpartum depression, for example. I am not a mental health provider, but I agree with you that so much of. Oh, and I've treated women with trauma, of course, you know, who suffered violence and rape, for example, or sexual. Other sexual abuse. And. But it's so much beyond that. Women struggle more with anxiety and depression. And so I'm not a mental health provider, but I understand very much that it is such a core, a problem that needs to be focused on. There's not enough attention paid to women's mental health, you know, and it. It's both physical and mental that we must focus on. You know, women need to. I, I think there's not. We're so much as women trained to disregard our own needs. You know, that is something very important to understand from a young age. We've all been groomed by society. Even if your parents are wonderful and very much centered you, women in soci. Society has trained women to defocus themselves, decenter themselves, and take care of others. You know, it's always about everyone else, you know, in your family or your partner and your children. But I very much, I tell patients this all the time. You know, not everything flows from you. You must take care of your mental health, your own physical health, make it a priority. Everyone's priority should first be themselves. And that is not selfish. That is the fountain from which you can then take care of others. You know, how can you really succeed in anything, really, even being a mother or a partner or in your career unless you have taken care of your own needs first? Right. So, yeah, I'm very. I very much feel that when. That's another fundamental message I like to deliver is that you are important, take care of yourself, you know, and we need to talk about this as women and support other women to do the same.

Okay, so if they're going to start asking women to focus more on their health, like, what areas do you think need immediate focus? Like, what do you think needs to be addressed first? Which areas are being neglected and are causing bigger problems than some Others in your experience.

I mean, so many areas, Right. I mean, of course we must educate ourselves. Right. And that's what. Actually one thing I'm trying to do with my podcast certainly is educate women about the issues, about different issues they may struggle with or societal issues. So education is so important. Supporting each other is so important. And asking your girlfriends, friends, family members, you know, to, to seek help when needed. Like you said, mental health is so important. Preventative care is so important. You know, basic things like getting the HPV vaccine, and I'm talking, of course, as a gynecologist, but the HPV vaccine, getting your Pap smear, getting STD testing, mammograms, you know, going to your primary care provider, doing those recommended screenings, colonoscopy screening, going for regular checkup. So many women don't even go for regular checkups. They don't have the time. They're too busy between work and family. And that really needs to be prioritized. You know what else? Yeah. Making as much time. Another, another thing I like to say is make time for yourself like you would for your children. We prioritize our children so much. We make sure they sleep, they eat, they bathe. They are well taken care of. You know, do that for yourself. Treat yourself as well as you treat your child. Do all the healthcare appointments. You know.

If you envision a matriarchy or a gynaki right now, what areas do you think we can improve our healthcare? Do you think that financially supporting will help more women to focus on health? Do you think finances are a problem now in the patriarchal society? I think it is. For example, in Sri Lanka, it's quite expensive to go and see a doctor. So we have a practice here of kind of going to the pharmacy and telling the pharmacist like this is. I feel this. Do you have something that can help me for that? And we avoid, like going to an actual doctor because of the cost. So do you think cost is a huge problem that we can solve with matriarchy?

Oh, absolutely. So I described what I thought was, you know, what a patriarchy is and how that functions. Right. My vision, like what I imagine matriarchal. Well, I don't have to imagine, actually, there have been matriarchal societies and we know the, how they function differently there versus the higher. Instead of a hierarchical structure, as you see in a patriarchy, matriarchies have been flat structures, so more collaborative, more community oriented, more looking out for the collective. And so that's what I imagine a matriarchy or gynarchy is, is looking out for everyone in society. So, so what does that mean healthcare wise? What does that mean in terms of people's lives? That means supporting universal healthcare access. Right? So we certainly have this problem in the us this is a problem around the world. There are some countries that have shifted to more universal health care and of course no system is perfect and you will hear people complain but about, about those systems as well. But honestly the, the, that should be our highest, that should be our aim, that is the highest goal is to take care of everyone. Why are we allowing this, why are we allowing people to struggle and not have any access to health care? So what you describe in Sri Lanka, that is in a lot of countries, I believe India is kind of like that. From my visit there at least. And I've been to Mexico and it seems like people also frequent pharmacies and self treat. I mean that's just dangerous. That's not right. We should have, you know, everyone should have access, affordable access to a healthcare provider. I mean these days we're getting more creative with the types of providers. There's a shortage of physicians, so but you know, qualified nurses, midwives, things like that. Other, other providers, physicians, assistants can help to cover the gap. But there should be access at some level for everyone. There should be some kind of basic health care. I think that all human beings should have access to. Perhaps the way to shift is, you know, if you want VIP treatment then you buy insurance, you know, or a separate insurance, additional insurance. The insurance industry doesn't necessarily need to die. But I feel that it's just absolutely morally wrong that people are just left to fend for themselves, you know.

Okay, so in us like if you don't have insurance, it's really hard to get treated at a medical institute. Is it? For us it's like I won't put down our entire system. We have like government sponsored hospitals and health care centers. Like you don't have to pay anything to go there. But they're so crowded and they're so understaffed and under facilitated that it's like you get like very, you have to wait a long time to get treatment and you have to wait in crowds and wait in line. Sometimes you wait months for a surgery for people who really can't afford it. Like that's the only option. And sometimes people die waiting. So how is it like we all have like medical programs where people can get medical care for absolutely free or is it only like if you have insurance?

So it's, it's well, we have health care that is disproportionate, like it's not accessible to everyone. It depends on what state you live in. Also, you know, we had Obama, President Obama passed Obamacare. But not every state has adopted Obamacare. Right. So in those states, if you live in the wrong state, you don't have access to health care after, you know, if you don't have a job or employer sponsored health care, if you don't buy it on your own, you can't afford it. So that's very wrong. You know, like my state, I live in Massachusetts and we do have a lower, like a basic. We have adopted Obamacare and so we do have a tier for people who cannot afford health insurance. So. Yes, I mean what you are, I think our priorities in society are so warped. It's, you know, there, there are people with incredible amounts of wealth, you know, and I think we don't spend, we spend so much money on the military, for example. We don't spend enough money on health care, providing health care to basic needs to people. And so this is something just such a huge societal problem. And around the world, you know, same. I imagine it's the same in Sri Lanka. So, you know, though you might have universal access, why aren't more resources going to healthcare, something so simple, basic, needed by everyone, you know, and do you want to foster a healthy society? Do you want to foster, you know, the future of your country and children and you know, it's just not, it's just wrong.

Yeah. Then how do you see, like once we shift to hypothetically now we are in a matriarchy. So what would change? How do you think, like things would be better? Do you think, how would resources be allocated and how would overlooked areas get, get more attention? Is it because like, do you think matriarchy won't be more focused on military expense so that we'll have more resources to allocate things that we really need?

I mean, you know, I am not a policymaker. I am not, you know, economist.

No, they're just trying to envision like how the majority would be.

Yes. I mean my, for one, one thing I think is, you know, we probably don't tax corporations and billionaires. You know, there shouldn't be this incredible wealth and income disparity. You don't really need, no individual really needs this disgusting amount of money. Okay. And I feel that if we didn't allow that, perhaps there would be more money, more resources to spend on, you know, improving society. So that's one example. I also Think the resources that we have are kind of misused. You know, why are. I really don't like all this. The military industrial complex, for example. In the US we have, you know, this incredibly large insurance industry, you know, as well. So I wish we could just eliminate that and have, you know, universal health care. But so, so I would imagine it does take a, it would take a huge shift in the way we function now. I, I hope that we are moving more towards that. You know, I have faith in the younger generations that, that, that this is going to be more prioritized. So it would require things like that. And the spending should be on health care or basic needs. We should be taking care of everyone, elder care, child care, supporting women. So much of, so much of societal's needs are just covered by women for free. It is such a strain on womankind know, to be doing things for free like elder care, child care. More research needs, money needs to be spent on women's health. You know, that's been historically very re. Research has been historically clinical research has been historically very man centered, male centered. So that's another area that needs more funding. Another problem is in, that is always in the news of course is reproductive rights. Like this is something that we, we are fighting over a fundamental right, you know, that I think is just so inappropriate, you know, like how can we move forward at all in society when we haven't established that women are human beings that can control their own bodies. Why is a woman's body up for debate? You know, politicize. So I'd like us to be, you know, funding contraception, for example, more education, re, you know, more sex ed, more, more money spent on mental health needs, of course, So I could go on and on.

So as a feminist and gynecologist and gynecologist, what is your take on the reproductive rights issue? Like how do you, which side are you on? There are sides. We can't deny that there are sides. So what do you think?

Yes, well, I would say, I mean most OB GYNs are in support of bodily autonomy, maybe not all. And I actually find that a little disturbing that not all obgyns feel that way. But you know, I think it's a fundamental human right to, you know, control your own body, to, to do what you will, you know, how, and live how you want to live. And it's very, very, you know, of course women should have the right to abortion. Of course women should have the right and access to contraceptive. Contraception. So I think this discussion of whether women should be permitted to have abortion. That is kind of surreal to me. Permitted to do something with my body. Like, why are you. That's very much like, just to think about it that way. It makes you realize, like, your body is not considered your own. It's considered societies, basically. Right. Someone else has to give you permission to do something with your body.

That.

That's absolutely wrong. Women are not treated as equal human beings to men. So that needs to end. That is just, you know, this is a conversation we shouldn't even be having.

So I think that, like you said, if there's an increase in education and access to contraceptive.