Can AI Help You Live to 170?

What if there was an AI doctor that knew everything about you? Your sleep, your history, your habits, and could give you better advice than any human doctor ever could. Today, I'm talking with Max Marchioni, founder of Superpower, a company using AI to help people live longer, healthier lives. It was a fascinating conversation. We talked about how AI is changing medicine, how to actually live to 120 or, I don't know, maybe 200, and why Max thinks things like supplements are overrated, but he still takes 30 a day. So if you care about living longer and staying healthy in the age of.

AI, this is the episode for you.

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Max, thanks for coming on the show.

Nathan, thank you for having me here. Yeah.

So this is kind of a, you know, unconventional episode for us. Part of my motivation for starting this podcast in the first place was to help people thrive in the age of AI. And, you know, we're going through this huge transitionary period, and normally we cover that more in, like, a business context of how you can use AI and help, you know, help you in your work or how to get ahead in business. But also, I feel like part of that is you also have to be healthy to actually live, to see all these things that are happening. Right. And I saw you guys post on Twitter when you first announced Superpower and thought it was fascinating that you guys are, like, actually using AI to help people know how to live a better life and how to be healthier. Is that kind of the general gist of it?

Totally. So it's my belief that every single person on Earth will have an AI doctor, and that doctor will be so much better than any human doctor was ever able to be. Right?

Right.

We won't just replicate the best of medicine. We're actually going to enter into the golden age of medicine, because now the millions of data points about you can be processed, the millions or thousands of papers about medicine can be processed. We can discover new things. We can start to detect things years in advance. We can start to personalize medicine. So all of these things which for lofty goals, and now on the foreseeable horizon, that's awesome.

I've been interested in longevity for a long time. Like, I watch Andrew Huberman before that, Tim Ferriss. I've met Aubrey De Gray in San Francisco before. But honestly, I've just never really done much to track my own health. Like, besides, like, oh, I try to eat healthy, I take vitamin D, I go for walks and exercise. But I've never done any of the tracking or the sleep tracking stuff or anything. Like, my understanding is you've been tracking yourself since you were like 16 or so, is that correct?

Yes. I went through a long period of misdiagnosis and tested and tracked everything. It would take me three hours to get to sleep every night and I had no idea what was wrong with me. And as you do, you start trying to learn. So I remember wearing a big gen 1 oura ring. This was when it just came out. People used to make fun of me for tracking sleep. You didn't do it back then.

And I every single day wake up.

And score my sleep qualitatively. How did I feel then? I'd score my sleep at the end of my day, at the end and say, how did I feel?

And then I'd look at the quantitative.

Data from the ring and from several other wearables to see what was showing up in the quantitative data.

And then I said, here are all of the different things I did.

Here's whether I drunk alcohol or not. Here is the temperature in the room, whether I exercised, when I last drank caffeine, how much caffeine. And I started to learn what works and what doesn't. And you start to get a really good sense of what works and what doesn't.

What have you learned? This is partially a selfish episode too. I'm trying to learn as much to live as long as possible.

So all the obvious things we already know. Exercise helps, A cold room helps.

A dark and quiet room. Oh, I'm not going to bore you with that. I'll say the interesting things. So half a glass of red wine for me, three hours before bed is better than none. If we're just looking at qualitative and quantitative sleep. Again, that's my personal experience. It might not be true for everyone. Of the different supplements, Pharmagaba is probably the most effective at increasing hrv. Very few of the others increase hrv. Doing either heart rate variability, training before bed or meditation before bed has an enormous impact for me, partially in quieting the mind and partially in lowering resting heart rate. Lowering resting heart rate matters a lot if you want to force Your heart rate to lower.

Do 10 seconds in 20 seconds, hold 20 seconds out.

Like extreme. But that extreme hold, extreme outs will lower your resting heart rate, I find faster than other things.

That's kind of like what Wim Hof does, right? In terms of like holding it in and letting it out.

His is a little bit different.

Is it?

Wims is you breathe vigorously in and.

Out 30 times over and then you exhale and then you hold your breath. So that will increase resting heart rate rather than decreasing. Okay.

So it's opposite what you want. Okay.

Yeah.

Cool. Yeah. I've actually tried to meditate in the morning. I used to do it at night and I stopped. I'm not sure why I stopped. I remember when I would do it, I would have like the best sleep ever and I would just instantly go to sleep, you know, because otherwise I lay in bed and I'm just thinking about a thousand different things and it seemed like it really helped with that.

Yep, 100%. Cool.

So my understanding you had like a cool demo to show me of your company, Superpower. Like I'd love to see it.

Yeah, let's do it. I'll share how the membership works today.

The idea is we want to create.

The one place people come to to take control of their health. And there's three parts to our annual membership today. Part number one is collecting as much data on someone as possible. So at the start of the year, we'll send a nurse to someone's home, collect over 100 plus blood biomarkers, and then allow them to get all of these other tests as well. Gut microbiome, environmental toxins, cancer screening. We'll pull all of that in to a data page where you can visualize all of your past results over time as well. We have these beautiful graphical ranges we've defined, not just normal and out of range, but also an optimal range which we've worked with a PhD out of Oxford to define.

And then we'll pull in all of.

Someone'S past medical records as well, integrating with the EMRs. And this is important because having full context on the person is important in AI LED paradigm of medicine.

And then we'll finally integrate someone's wearables too. So that's part number one.

Collect as much data as someone else as possible. Test the whole body. And people love that experience. We'll visualize and we'll show biological age as well.

Part number two is now that we.

Know so much about people, how do we actually connect the dots? Right?

How do we tell someone, look, here's.

The thousands of data points, but here's what's really going on. Here are the issues you have today, here's what might come up in the future.

So we build some of this, this.

Big protocol which is a combination of our medical team and AI.

And people love this because they get.

To the end of it and they're like, oh, whoa, now I really see what's going on in my body. I never had any doctor connect the.

Dots like this before and we'll tell someone, here's exactly what you should do. And the final part.

What I used to find frustrating about medicine is you'd leave the doctor's office and they'd say, good luck, you're left to your own devices. What we try to do is after.

We tell you what to do, we.

Try to actually help you do it. So any follow up diagnostics are in one place at any given point in time will show you. Here's the exact next step. You should never have to think about it. Here's the exact next step. If you need access to a supplement or pharmaceutical. We've brought only our favorite, highest quality products into one place. All 20% cheaper than Amazon or elsewhere. The idea is if you're a member, it should be cheaper and easier to access the best care within the ecosystem than hunting outside. And then the final thing is if you have a health question, you can pull out your phone, you can message your health AI or send a text message to your concierge team.

Oh, that's awesome. So this is basically like your own AI doctor. You give it all the data about yourself and then now it knows all it's about you versus having to go into a doctor.

So this one here is the AI.

Okay, yeah.

And then this one here is a medical team. There's this three humans on it, assisted with technology and AI. So you have both.

So basically that's what we do today.

Test the whole body twice a year with 100 plus labs, connect the dots.

Tell you what to do, and make.

It really, really easy to take action with a lot of things in one place. And that membership today we're doing for $42 a month or $499 a year.

Which I think is like quite affordable.

So we're growing quite quickly and having a lot of people wanting to sign up.

Yeah, that's awesome. I always thought it's so weird that you go into the doctor and you see them for like 15 minutes, 30 minutes, whatever, and they're on to the next thing and they barely know who you are or anything about you. They glance at this thing, you know, showing all your data, and it seems like this will make it possible where, you know, the AI will actually understand who you are and what's going on in your own body. Like, personalized. How long have you guys been doing this? Like, what was the inspiration for starting it?

I, as I mentioned, went through a challenging personal health experience. Yeah. Chronic migraines, chronic sinusitis, had surgery, was taught to medicate for life.

I didn't really know what was going.

On until I found a genius doctor who connected the dots. And it made me realize there's a big gap between the best of healthcare and what most people have access to. And I've believed for the past decade or so that for as long as that gap exists, someone or some company has to come along and close it. And I didn't think that was possible until November 2020, 22, when ChatGPT was launched and started to show a path towards what was possible with these AI tools. And we started the company with the belief that we could take the very best of medicine that today costs hundreds of thousands of dollars and make that accessible for a few hundred dollars. So that was the initial impetus.

That's awesome. I think how many people that a lot of times with doctors, they're not like, checking for cancer or things like that ahead of time. They're just like, telling you, like, oh, you've got cancer. They're not doing a lot of preventive stuff.

Right.

And yeah, so it's just like they'd be a game changer.

Yep, 100%.

How can people listening to this, how can they actually, like, live a longer life? Just use superpower? Or is there any other, like, practical advice you can give people that they could just get started with today?

Oh, man.

If you want to live a longer.

Life, we're going to need biotech. And biotech might be expensive. It's the unfortunate reality of where the future is going. But biotech will define the future. More than healthy eating. And access to biotech might be unevenly distributed. And insofar as AI can make us more productive. That's interesting. I think today, these foundational models, if it has full context, they're very good at connecting the dots. They're very good at working out what's going on, there are ways to prompt it, to make it more effective. I find the Reasoning models, like O3 are the best. I'll prompt it with something like, you're an elite integrative medicine doctor. You're the Best in the world. You know everything about medicine, you know everything about me. You know everything at the frontier. You also understand traditional Chinese medicine and Ayurvedic medicine. You've seen everything. You think deeply about the root cause. You're my doctor. Here's what's going on for me. Explain everything. I'll give it everything. My upbringing, my life, what I eat, what I do. And if you give it all of that, it's really damn good. So that's just chatgpt. Now, there's a lot of other things you can do with prompting that make it far better. We try to do a lot of that with the superpower AI, but you can do a lot now with ChatGPT. They're pretty impressive.

Yeah, I've been surprised. I had a hand injury and it was like lingering for like three or four months. And I, I started chatting with ChatGPT about it and like it told me exactly what was going on. Now I went to a doctor and they told me basically the same thing. And so I'm like, oh, in theory, I could have just used ChatGPT. I didn't necessarily have to go to a doctor.

Oh yeah, these AIs are better than the doctors often. Now there was this paper that came out that showed Dr. Accuracy, Dr. Plus AI accuracy, and then just AI accuracy. The just AI was better than the Dr. Plus the AI. It was more accurate.

And that's the model today with limited.

Context, without being specialized or set up for medicine specific use cases. Where we're going is models that are more specialized with more context.

Yeah, we are still holding on to.

Humans as the practitioners of the art of medicine. And I think anyone who does that is still reasoning from the past and reasoning from the current point in time we're at. Whereas I think what we need to consider is the rate of change and the directionality of change. And if we think models today are impressive, well, in two years time we're going to be blown away, right? Yeah.

I mean, if you think about doctors, they get paid so much because they go to school for a really long time and they remember lots of stuff and they read so many different books and they probably retain like, I don't know, 5% of the knowledge or something like that that's actually out there with AI, obviously they can like know every single paper that's out there. And then like you said, even other stuff, you know, Chinese medicine, whatever, it can look at the collective knowledge of humanity, you know, with health, and actually apply that. It's a fascinating concept.

Yeah, I think that's such a good point, which is that a large part of medical school is remembering knowledge. Right. And one of the magical things about technology is we don't have to remember knowledge anymore.

So yeah, I, look, I tend to.

Agree and we already implicitly know this is true.

There are people who will hear this.

And be like, what do you mean he's talking? I'm like, we already implicitly know this is true. When you have a health question, what do you do? You go to Google or ChatGPT before the doctor.

Typically what people do then you go.

To the doctor and they might say.

Some things and then you go back.

To Google and ChatGPT after the doctor.

And you know what, during the consult, the doctor's using Google and ChatGPT as well. We already implicitly know that people go.

To the algorithm a lot of the time before they go to the doctor. Right.

It is feel like people are still going to want to see a doctor in a lot of cases. Right. They want to talk to a person and this will probably change over time, but I think as of right now, people want to talk to a doctor and be reassured and things like this. I guess also if you get like a bad diagnosis or something too, right. That's probably where you would want a human telling you, I guess, versus an AI. But in the future that'll probably change. Maybe in the future it's entirely AI. Maybe it's all superpower or other companies like superpower, right.

Today, 100% people trust humans and the.

Opinion of a doctor validates or invalidates an AI. It makes you more likely to follow a recommendation.

That's all going to change.

It's inevitable. I'll give you maybe a hypothetical. Let's say you're boarding an airplane, you're going to do a 15 hour trip and over the loudspeaker you hear the.

Autopilot and the technology is not working.

This flight, the pilot's just going to fly it.

You're going to be like, well, get me out of here.

Where's the parachute?

Right. We're sorry to tell you, but the AI and the technology has broken. The pilot is going to be flying the rest. You're like, no, no. This is like, are you fearing for your life?

Especially if you're going to turbulence or something, Right. You'd be like freaking out.

That's where we're going to get to, right?

Yeah.

And if you said to someone in.

19, whatever, 40, that the AI is going to fly the plane, they would have been no way that's so unsafe. I need the human there. Well, now it's the opposite. I think we're going to see that now. We need the AI there.

We're going to see the same in healthcare people again.

We'll like, deny it and then it will happen and yeah, yeah, yeah.

It feels like younger people embrace it, you know, faster. I talked to people in my family recently who didn't even know that AI helps fly the planes. I think there's actually a lot of people who don't or aren't even aware of that, actually.

Totally. There's a reason why there's still a pilot in the cockpit. The pilot maybe does a couple of things, but if you chat with a commercial airline pilot, ask them about how much they actually do. Right.

It's not much.

Yeah.

I live here in Japan. It's even with the trains. You notice that too. I'm pretty sure most of it's automated. And you see the guy up there and he's like, just really casually, like sipping a coffee, not really paying much attention to anything. He kind of makes sure there's nothing on the track or like, you know, make sure people are okay and stuff. But it seems like it's all just kind of ran by computer Systems.

Yep, yep, 100%. Cool.

So I heard you had some controversial takes on supplements. You know, I take a few supplements. My co host, Matt Wolf, he's super into supplements. I think he takes like, I don't know, 30 or so, but. But I heard you had some controversial takes on supplements. So, like, should I be taking supplements? Do they matter or are they like, you know, are they BS or what?

I think supplements are overrated and many are likely BS.

Okay.

And at the same time, I take 30 to 50 a day in case.

Okay.

Kind of in case. I don't know. I think I'm like updating my views on it. So there's a few things. One is that no amount of supplementation.

Is going to solve for foundational problems that should be addressed by attacking the root cause. And no amount of supplementation is going to reliably guarantee you live past 100.

So right away we know that even if supplements are marginally useful, they're not that game changing. So we can already say if they're.

Not that game changing, then I shouldn't obsess about them too much.

The next thing I'd say is that.

A lot of supplements are fake or dosed incorrectly or have other sorts of additives or use the wrong part of the compound. I was in the UAE last week and I was going to buy some vitamin D. There are all of these things in the pharmacy and you see this in the US as well. All of these vitamin D in the pharmacy with like fancy branding. I'm like, okay, but let's actually look into it. I look into it, it's like 300 IUs. And I'm like, well, no, I need like at least probably 5,000 for what I'm going for. So 305,000. That dosing doesn't seem right. The actual supplement itself has preservatives and colors and fake sugar and other in it. I'm like, well, I don't want that.

Is that because it's cheaper to make or something like that? Is that why they do that?

I don't know. And then it didn't have vitamin K, which is necessary for the absorption of vitamin D. So it's like, great, the.

Marketing'S good, but the vitamin D is a negligible amount. I'm adding all of this other to my body and there's no vitamin K.

Which is a co factor necessary for the absorption of vitamin D. Now take a correctly dosed vitamin D. Really good source, purely encapsulated, no additives. 3,000 I use, maybe 5,000 I use. They add vitamin K2. Ideally they add vitamin K2 as both forms, MK4 and MK7, and maybe they add vitamin K1 as well.

All of those things now make a form of. That's just vitamin D. You can look.

Across every other supplement and you have a similar thing.

So the second thing I'd say is like, not all supplements are created equal.

And there's a lot of junk out there.

And then the third thing I'd say, which is more speculative and I don't believe this enough yet to stop taking.

Supplements, but there might be something here is that supplements actually drain energy. Our bodies are not used to processing the dry powder. A lot of negative charge goes into actually creating the supplements in a big manufacturing lab. And as a result, through mechanisms we don't quite understand, supplements drain your body of energy. And again, I don't believe that enough to have stopped taking them. I took 30 last night. But I think it's interesting, right?

And some people hear this stuff and.

They'Re like, no, that's bull.

Typically when I hear someone say that's bull, my response is, this is interesting.

We don't have evidence yet, but it might be worth pursuing and studying. Because before there's evidence, there's always no evidence.

Yeah, totally.

Yeah, right. It's just the hypothesis probably for the last two years.

In terms of longevity. Everyone thinks of Brian Johnson now. Like what do you think of Brian and what he's doing and trying to live forever and all the crazy stuff he's doing on his body.

Look, I have a lot of respect for Brian.

Yeah, I think that he's a very good thinker. I think that he's creating a religion which is non trivial. I think he cares about what he's creating as a religion. There are a set of very strong fundamental beliefs underlying it which is that we need to follow the algorithm because there will come a point in time where the algorithm knows more than us, where the only thing we know is that at this very moment I don't want to die and therefore don't die is the most played game in a monica for the religion.

So I really like that. I think at the same time he's.

Popularizing several health interventions.

I don't think he's at the frontier.

I see things he does and they'll have doctor friends say this is dumb, he's going to change this. And then like three months later he like changes it and that's fine. He's learning. You got to remember he's been playing this game for five years. There are doctors out there who have been playing this game of human optimization for like 30 years, 40 years, 50 years.

So I still think there's a lot.

He doesn't know, but he's discovering it and sharing everything he's learning on the way. So a lot of respect for Brian, right?

Yeah, I think that's part that's interesting. And what I found fascinating in a few interviews with him, he talked about one of the reasons for him doing it was that it's kind of like the whole thing I was saying earlier, we're heading into the age of AI. Some of this technology may unlock us to live an extra hundred years in the future. And so hey, try to make sure you can make it to that point so you can actually extend your life. I think that's an interesting point.

Yeah.

And one thing I was thinking about, people always talk about their sleep, like monitoring their sleep. And I think you mentioned you used to do that. Do you recommend monitoring your sleep? Because that's something I've always thought I probably should be doing that, but I'm worried that I'm going to get super obsessed with it and maybe that'll make me sleep less actually, because I'm worried about it.

I think most people should try and see whether they like It. I think most people should do it for at least a couple of months because they'll learn. They'll start to be able to develop a better interoception, such that when they remove the ring or the band, they still have a sense of what's going on with their sleep.

I do think that it can end.

Up making you more anxious about sleep, and that will make your sleep worse. And that's part of why I don't open my Oura Ring app every morning now.

But I also think that even if.

You don't want to look at the data, it could be worth collecting the data, because we're into a world where we never have to look at the data. The AI will just tell us what to do. And in that world, I want to have a lot of data on myself to support the AI. So that's kind of how I think about the sleep question with Superpower.

Do you have something like that for now? Do you, like, submit sleep data or is that something you guys have thought of doing?

Yeah, we integrate with Aura several other wearables, and that allows us to collect sleep data.

Awesome. So you mentioned you already kind of shared, like, one controversial health belief about the thing with supplements. They might drain energy. Is that the most controversial health belief that you have, or is there anything else that's even more controversial?

There are a lot of things that.

I think have a 5% probability, which most people call, like, bull. And there are some that I think are higher probability.

Okay, now my problem with all the.

5% probability ones is I'll say them.

And people say, this is what he believes.

I'm.

No, no, no. I believe the opposite. But I think there's a chance of this thing.

People have a hard time. They're like. They have really binary mindsets. Like, no, it's got to be 100% true. Or he's saying it's 100% false and people have a hard time in between. Yeah, totally.

I guess, like, a classic example of this is vaccines. I do think there's somewhere between a 5 and probably 15% chance the vaccines are linked to autoimmunity and maybe even autism.

There's a low chance.

There's a low but real chance I.

Will say something like that and people.

Will be like, here's an anti vaxx.

I'm like, no, I said there's a low chance and therefore we have to explore it and consider it versus just.

Criticize and turn the blind eye and hate and label. Right?

Yeah, hating and labeling sounds a lot like propaganda.

To me, and there are certainly incentives to obstruction industry that way.

One belief that I am higher probability.

On is one of our advisors and doctors.

She runs one of the leading cancer.

Clinics around the world.

And I asked her what is the.

Number one thing you can do to prevent cancer? And she says pma positive mental attitude.

It's the number one thing.

And I actually agree with that. I genuinely believe that how we think, the beliefs we have, the self talk, the way we relate to ourselves, the amount of gratitude we have, impacts all health outcomes, impacts cancer, neurodegeneration, autoimmunity, pain and other things in our body. And I think that the relationship between the brain and thoughts and biology is not well understood and will increasingly get to a world where it is well understood.

Do you have any theories on if that's true? Like why it's true? Like why would positive thinking and things like that have a positive impact on your health besides maybe like it lowers your stress or there's something else more.

Extreme like like look, a lot of.

Our biology is modified by our brain. We know that like we can through our brain choose to increase or decrease our heart rate. Right? Right. We can choose to do a lot of things. We can tense our muscles and we can do a lot of things via our brain. And we understand how thinking certain things changes biology and changing a biology changes. We understand that mapping. Now what we don't understand is the mapping when it gets to things like cancer.

But I think if the mapping exists.

For very simple things, I think that it's likely and completely possible that it exists for more complex things as well. The exact mechanism I don't understand, I don't know if anyone understands, which is why people still call this woo woo and pseudoscience. But throughout history, many of the things we now call science, we used to call pseudoscience. So again, I think the right approach is curiosity. And that's the first step in the scientific method. Curiosity and hypothesis rather than just being closed minded.

Yeah, I agree. In some ways, you know, science has come almost like a cult. You know, everyone has to agree. There's, you know, what's the paper? If it's not a paper that their peers have reviewed, you can't even discuss it. And it's like, no, you can still discuss it. Like it doesn't mean it's 100% true, but it doesn't mean you should just like completely shut the door and say it's impossible. That's always kind of drove me crazy. Okay, so maybe like a fun question to end Things, you know, imagine you have a time machine, you know, and you step out, it's 2050.

What's different?

What's changed? You know, not just health, but maybe also talk about health.

Gosh, no one knows.

More than ever. No one knows because the rate of.

Change is completely unprecedented.

I think that it's going to be.

Way different to what people think. I suspect that we likely won't think about what we do in our actions. I think the AI would just tell us, and we will blindly follow the AI. I think that just about everything we today call work will no longer exist as jobs.

So you're mostly gonna like. I mean, we almost become the robots. Like the AI is powering us.

Well, potentially, yeah. I think that in a world where the AI knows far, far, far more than us, we don't have a choice but to follow the algorithm. So there's totally a world where the AI determines our behaviors. There's also a world where the AI has merged with us and the AI is part of our thoughts. And we are cyborgs. And I think that cyborgs will be here far closer than we think, particularly because if someone who's a cyborg has a survival advantage, then other humans will have to become cyborgs. Because we're reasonably Darwinistic creatures, we care about survival advantages. And as a result, I think cyborgs are here sooner than people think.

Like, by 2050, are we, like, merging with tech, with AI by then?

Yeah, I think so, yeah. If I was doing an overrun. Yeah, I think so.

Somebody's listening right now, like, what the hell are they talking about?

Yeah, I know. Cool.

Oh, yeah, one last question I always like to ask people. You know, my son is 11, and, you know, now with AI, I'm always trying to think, like, what should I be teaching him, you know, to make sure he's successful in the future. If you had a child, what would you be teaching them right now? Would you be teaching them to code or would you, you know, something completely different?

No, no. No skills. No skills, no jobs.

None of it's relevant. I would be teaching them people and relationships and how the world works and leverage and company building.

Maybe I'd get them to, like, play.

Around with AI and understanding it. But, like, the AI is going to do the coding. The AI is going to do the prompting. I would focus very much on people. I think that scarce resources will not be, can you code? It'll be, can you unlock a door that is gated by a person?

Right.

So I'd focus more on Everything that's innately human, rather than everything that is some sort of skill that is constructed by the current nature of our world.

That makes a lot of sense. Yeah. So like teaching them more about culture, comedy, just all kinds of different things that would be useful in personal relations.

Probably psychology, biology, getting them to meet people, host dinners, sales, persuasion.

Interesting.

I think the importance of networks likely become far greater. This whole idea of, like, it's not what you know, it's who you know. I think that that is more true, likely in the next five years than it has been for the past couple of decades.

I agree. You know, I've had this conversation with my friend Greg Eisenberg. You know, it's part of the reason we both have been doing more content. We totally agree with this. Like, in the future, your networks and who you know is going to matter a whole lot. Especially when anyone can press a button and copy a product, it's going to matter a lot.

I think so. But I also wonder at the same.

Time whether we're going to just see AIs chatting with AIs. For example, right now, if someone messages me on LinkedIn, my AI is responding most of the time rather than me now. In a year, that's probably going to be my AI responding.

Is this the first time we've actually talked?

No.

That'd be hilarious. I still got Twitter. Twitter's less noisy, LinkedIn. I get like hundreds of messages a week. Twitter's still quite high signal. So I'm on Twitter, I'm using WhatsApp.

Emails are a mix.

Half, half.

And again, though, we'll get to a.

World where the AI drafts our emails, where the AI liaises with the other AI. It's just like AI is all the way down. I think that the problem with the world today is we treat kids like they're kids. And we never used to do that. Alexander the great was 21 when he ran the army. Napoleon Bonaparte was 22. Julius Caesar was 23, Joan of Arc was like, 20. I might be getting the ages off by a couple of years, but roughly that.

And that's because when they were kids.

They were not treated like kids. And I think that gaming when we're younger allows us to do something like.

This, and then you can start creating your own businesses. I kind of reflect back on myself.

When I was young and I was.

Like, I actually think I was better.

As a business person on Minecraft than I was for the next five to 10 years in real life, because I had zero, zero fear.

And no one told me whether I.

Could or couldn't do something.

Yeah, totally.

There are so many strategies that worked.

To make money on Minecraft that honestly.

Would have worked really, really damn well in the real world.

Right.

I just didn't realize I could do.

It in the real world. And I think about that often.

Right. Dude, this has been awesome, Max. It's been great getting to know you.

Yeah, likewise, Nathan. Yeah.

Be awesome to have you on again sometime in the future. Thanks, Max.

Great. Thanks, Nathan.