Socratic educator Michael Strong with Alana, age six

No, I'm at novel right now.

Oh, got it, got it. So I thought we'd still work on the second verse of the ABCs. Can you go ahead and sing it again so everybody has it fresh in their minds?

Letters have sounds, sounds form words, words form sentences which express thoughts. All you have to do is learn how the letter sounds fit together and formulate words. Next, when you're reading a word to anything, sound it out word by word as reading to me.

Wow, you're really good at that.

Thanks.

So it's kind of— it feels kind of long and complicated to me. Can we figure it out line by line?

Sure.

So what's the very first line?

For me, letters have sounds.

Letters have sounds. What does that mean?

So like the sounds of letters.

Can you give me an example?

Like A, ah.

Got it. And do you remember how you learned that letters have sounds?

He just sounded them to me over and over again until I got the words.

Got it. Do you know if your little brother Logan knows the sounds of any letters?

He knows a lot of sounds of a lot of letters. He loves letters.

Do you teach him the sounds, or do your parents teach him, or how does he learn the sounds?

I don't— so he has a couple word apps that we might teach him, or us.

Okay, great. So letters have sounds. Then what's the, um, what's the next part of the song?

I think sounds form words.

Sounds form words. So what does that mean, that sounds form words?

Like the sounds from letters make words.

Okay. So for instance, as an example, like cat, there's a C sound, an A sound, and a T sound.

Mm-hmm.

Okay. And does your little brother Logan understand that part?

Yeah, sometimes he does that. He's getting words a little bit.

So he puts, he puts different letter sounds. I know he has those little plastic letters. Does he say spell cat and then say cat?

Sometimes he says like other words and sometimes cat, but he doesn't really like— sometimes we spell letters with I mean words with the letters, but I don't know, I don't think we've ever spelled cat. I'll have to do that.

Okay, but you think that he is, he is kind of getting to the point where he's understanding how to put the sounds together to form a word?

Yeah.

Okay, how old is he again? He's 3 and a half. Okay, you know, Yeah, he's almost old enough. You and I started these conversations when you were 4, so he's almost old enough to do these. We tried once and he was not quite old enough, I think. So what's the next verse after, um, sounds form words?

I think words form sentences.

Okay. And did— how did you learn what a sentence was?

I— so first I learned what words are, and then I just kept hearing people say things, sentences. And, um, I think— and I just— I think Logan would probably do that, but I think I just figured out, like, to keep listening to other people say things.

Got it. Does Logan understand what a sentence is?

Uh, I don't know about him, but maybe.

Okay, you might try to see if you can teach him what a sentence is and see if you can understand.

I might.

Okay, what's the next verse?

Which express thoughts.

Ah, see, this one seems trickier. What does it mean for a sentence to express a thought?

So like a sentence, like, is for me, is pouring out a thought. A thought that you have in your head. Like if I said, "Maybe a cat can be blue," that would be maybe like a question and maybe a thought.

I think that's a really interesting example. Do you think Logan knows what a thought is?

Uh, maybe. Okay.

Okay, then what's the next part?

All you have to do is learn how the letter sounds.

Okay, that seems pretty straightforward. And then the next part?

Put together and formulate words.

I see. So in some ways it's reminding us— formulate's complicated. Yeah, formulate's a big word. Do you think Logan knows what formulate means?

No. I don't think I know either.

Oh, you don't? Okay. That's interesting. So do you know what it means to form something?

Yeah, like make something. So maybe formulate means like makes, like to make words or make something.

Yeah, and sometimes it's— do you know what a formula is?

Formula?

Formula.

Formula.

Yeah, a formula. You could have a formula for a chemical or a science equation, like a—

like, like something that you use for an experiment or something.

Yeah, so it's, it's, it is sort of like a fancier version of to form something. So words, or what was the sentence again from the song that used formulate?

That what?

What was the line from the song that used formulate?

Fit together and formulate words.

I see, formulate words. Okay, got it. Um, and then what's the next one in the song, the next line in the song?

Next, learn their meaning. Onward to anything.

Next, learn the meaning and what?

And onward to anything.

Onward to anything. Okay, what is, what is meaning? It says next, learn the meaning. What is that?

I think the meaning is like the meaning of the word.

So you didn't know the meaning of formulate, so we had to explain the meaning of formulate, right? Okay, what's the next verse?

Sound it out word by word is reading to me.

Sound it out word by word is reading to me. Um, and are you still sounding out words when you read?

Some pretty hard words I do, like big ones, like in, like, some difficult chapter books. Sometimes in, like, Harry Potter and stuff. And when I read those 1, 2, and 4 books, there's 4 and a half books, there was pretty hard words.

Got it. And do you remember when you used to have to sound out words even in easy books, or that's so long ago you don't remember?

I think I remember. Like, I don't remember the words that I have to sound out, but I think I remember.

Okay, then what's the next verse?

I think that's it.

Oh, okay. Wow. So do you think that knowing the second verse of the ABCs helped you learn to read?

I think so.

Okay.

Um, that and practicing.

That and practicing. Yep. Well, is Logan— does Logan look at books and try to read them yet?

Yes, sometimes he does. He just says other words.

I see. So he, he looks at the words on the page and he says other words. He's not yet really reading.

Yeah, but he still like reads books just in other words and other sentences.

Got it. Um, does he read some simple words using his letters?

Sometimes, like with his letters.

Okay, great. So he's, he started. All right, and what are you reading these days for fun?

For me or him?

For you.

I'm mostly reading like Turtle Twins books. I have 3 over here.

Turtle Twins books. All right. You like them? Mm-hmm. Okay. Well, I am going to let you go, and then I'm going to take a break and talk to your dad, okay?

Okay.

All right. Bye-bye.

Bye-bye.