Episode 221: Hiring Wise The First Time with Sid Upadhyay

Welcome to the Unstoppable Profit podcast. This podcast will give independent insurance agents all of the tools to grow your business and live life on your terms. Wherever you are today, if you're starting with nothing or well on your way to the success you desire, with the right people, processes and promotions in place, you will be unstoppable. And now I'd like to introduce your host, Mike Stromsol.

Greetings, everybody. Welcome to the next episode of the Unstoppable Profit podcast. This is going to be a very special podcast because in the pre session that I just had with Sid, get ready, we're gonna bring some, not only valuable content, but some energy and beyond. Because getting to know Sid in the last couple minutes, he is high energy and high achieving. Sidupadier. Welcome to the podcast, Mike.

Thanks for the opportunity. We love supporting the community. You know, we're here for entrepreneurs, you're here for entrepreneurs. It's a, it's a journey full of ups and downs. Let's make it a moment easier for everyone.

Exactly, exactly. So if you get something to write with and write on, don't think it, ink it, or, you know, whatever you need to do to get this information because I'm going to ask Sid to share a little bit about who he is and his company. Wisehire is one of our partners that we help people with to recruit, interview and hire the right people for your business because we're only as good as our weakest link. So we've enjoyed the partnership we have so far and we're building that partnership. But Sid has his own phenomenal, amazing company. Sid, tell us a little bit about who you are and your phenomenal, amazing company.

Mike, you're way too kind. Wisehire is what feels like our life's work. Like every entrepreneur, we got into this for a passion. It is for us to help Main street businesses win against Fortune 500s. Like every entrepreneur, we fell into this man, our initial product was so much smaller. It had basic aspirations, but it's conversations like this, the community that you and I support, that inspired us to do what we're doing today. We started out as a personality assessments company and here we are today. Fast forward almost a decade and we help thousands of people find great jobs with people like our audience today. Our job is to make the hard work, the most critical work of finding top talent a little bit easier. We take on the busy work so you can focus on what your magic is, which is assessing and screening that talent to make sure it's the right fit for your business. We'll help you write a great job ad pre screen candidates, coach you on that interviewing process. And fundamentally, when you think about today's market retaining talent, we want to help you win talent, but also set them up for success with an amazing onboarding. So it's been such a journey, man. So much fun. Happy to talk about the business building but you know, your community, working with independent brokers like they need and deserve better and it's our two organizations together, that's how we help them get there.

Yeah, and I was talking with one of your teammates earlier today about the difficulties that we have in our industry right now and, and that just raises the bar in the fact that we need top talent that is able to handle what's going on in the industry, not only today, but into the future. So Sid is way too humble and he didn't drop the goods. So I'm going to do it on Sid's behalf. He's responding to the market need. In the 10 years of his company, Wisehire, he now serves more than 15,000 customers, he and his team, he has a hundred teammates. Plus they doubled the company again, which was their goal in 2022. They've been named Inc's best workpl in both 2022 and 2021. He led the company through a 30 million Series B funding round, bringing the company's total funding to a very respectable amount and valuation. And he's carrying out the vision to the world of helping entrepreneurs have excellent people.

That is why we wake up in the morning every day, man.

Yeah, exactly. So, you know, that's why we do what we do. That's why he does what he does. And it's a perfect alignment with what we do here at UPP to help people. But today I want to dig into Sid's vast past and we want to talk about building and.

Nurturing, I guess, if you will, amazing business teams and cultures and everything around that, engaging with employees. He's got deep dives on that and I'm going to see if I can pull it out of Sid. But, you know, to, to seed one other aspect of what we've already discussed, we believe, because that's one of the things that kind of led me to your company was I love the fact that you believe in assessments, number one. Number two is you have coaches. Yes, I believe in coaching personally. And so you have coaches that help agents or business entrepreneurs, period, on the interviewing process. And we believe, we believe at our heart of hearts at UPP that the war for marketplace talent is one at the interviewing table.

Yes.

So, anyway, let's take it away. Let's help some people talk a little bit about building and leading teams related to hiring, team building, leadership. Take it away, Sid.

Mike, you know, if you think about an entrepreneur's journey, it is so often you're in a job, you're working for someone else, and you're inspired by one part of the job, and you want to make that your life's work. So many of us step out and we have a passion, but then as the business grows, there's so many more responsibilities that we have to take on hiring being a key one of them. And the challenge that I see day in and day out is I needed top talent three weeks ago, and I haven't had a moment to think about how to do it. And so what I love about what we've done together is, you know, build a platform where the coaching that you are giving your clients, this community, we get to put that into product, we get to make it automatic so that you've got Mike's advice, you've got the best advice, because, you know, put our products and systems and services aside. If you're an entrepreneur, what do you owe yourself and your team? You owe yourself the best guidance and all the lessons from the mistakes of others. And that's how we compound the business. Right? Because if you're making mistakes yourself, you just lost a day, you just lost a week. And what my kind of viewpoint on entrepreneurship is, you know, entrepreneurs are heroes, and they need and deserve all the hard work of others. Fast forward it, right? They don't have time to go read the 50 books that you and I are going to go read. They don't have time to talk to all the people that are going to have made that challenge. Let's make it one step easier. And that's why what we've done at wisehire is, I think, try to build the most personalized hiring process where we ask you only the questions that you know the answers to. Hey, I'm looking for an independent agent. Are you giving them leads? Are they bringing their own leads? What's. You know, let's ask the real questions that they know the answer to. Let's appraise them on how difficult the role is. Is it easy to hire? Hard to hire? And then with that, our team of coaches and our platform will write that first job ad for you. We'll put it on all the top sites where we can find that talent, whether it's going to be LinkedIn or ZipRecruiter. Or indeed our partners. So you don't have to spend your precious time. And you could be on the phones working with customers, posting on website 1 website 2 website 50. And then as candidates come in, that's where we really start this partnership with coaching. Because you know, everyone talks about automation and process and software, but ultimately hiring is about talent and people and relationships. And what we do is give you that guidance. We'll do some pre screening, we'll talk about personality assessments in a bit. And we use all those insights to help you have that, you know, Fortune 500 level experience so that when that person walks in the door, that all star that you've been waiting for, you aren't losing them to that other company. Because we want to give you all that advice. That's where our coaches come in. And you know, I think from there there's so much more that we can do and ultimately we have aspirations to help you make that higher, get them that offer, maybe even pay and give them better benefits. But that's why I think of this as like a long journey and our partnership will continue long into the future, man.

Yeah, absolutely. So love that great, great platform you've got. I'm going to throw you a curveball, please. We talked about baseball coming in, so let's talk about the, the ability to attract talent as an organization. I would love to hear your thoughts on that. You mentioned talent, people, relationships, which are the key. But we attract exactly what we are and who you become. So what's your view on that?

So first off, I think when we're thinking about attracting talent, we really have to go into it with like eyes fully clear and recognizing it's a challenging market. This is not the market of pre pandemic where our industry was insular. We were looking at only people that were licensed and experienced. All of the great talent in this industry has it with one button click, access to 500 other options. And we as entrepreneurs need to like take a step back, look around and recognize as we're driving, listening to this, that business that we just drove by, that's our competition. That big Fortune 500 is our competition. And in some sense that has made the playing field very uneven for small businesses. You know, we have to think about the tactics and a couple of these just to like pepper them out. When you think about attracting talent, it's writing the best job ad that speaks to that best talent. And so often I find that entrepreneurs who haven't applied for a job in a while will almost not give themselves credit for what they have in front of them. They have a business where they're investing in people, they've got career paths, they've got long, deep relationships. And those are critical, critical reasons that someone is going to want to work with you. And yet you don't write it in a job ad. We call this the employee value proposition, which is where we, through our coaching, through all the materials, really want you to step back and think about, okay, I have this need in the business, but let's not make it all about me. Let's make it about the two way street and the dialogue that we got to have. What am I giving to this individual that is beyond this compensation? Yes, that is going to be the number one search filter on a job site. But there's so much more that the right person is going to dig for. The wrong person is just going to look at the headline and move on. And that's what you want. You want to instead focus on that right person and speak to them. So think deep on what you have. And so often it's benefits that we don't give ourselves credit for. The development, the training, the interaction, the opportunity. Do you want to be an apprentice to build your own business? Like that is an incredible value add for the right person. And so that's when it comes to like attraction. Think big, think long term. Let's bottle it up into that job ad. Let's get it posted and let's post it everywhere where we can get in front of the right talent, not just the job site. Let's get it on social, let's get it on a career page. Let's get it where all the candidates are. Because prior to the pandemic, we talked about this idea of active candidates, passive candidates. That's not the case anymore. Everyone is active whether they're employed or not. And if you think about our industry, so many of us are needing more licensed agents. We're willing to make the investment. People don't realize that. Let's get the word out for that. We need to bring more people in. And that's why I think attraction is key, where you're taking an active approach and you're casting a very wide net going well beyond the tactics of the prior years.

100%. That's fantastic. And I couldn't agree with you more. They don't need us. I mean, there's so many options out there. So leads me to the next question. What's unique about Wisehire? I mean, if you think about the other opportunities out there, I know in my Mind why I think Wise Hire is unique and I mentioned it earlier. What do you, what do you have to add?

So I'll answer the question, not from our product perspective, but I'll talk about it instead. From like someone joining our business because back to like entrepreneurs trying to win talent. You know, when you've thought about your company, you've thought about the culture. You've probably gone a few years and maybe now you're writing it down for the first time. Be intentional about it and don't make it something that you're just going to write on a wall and like, forget. It's actually the thing that is defining you in your best and worst moments. It's the way you bring that person into the organization, promote them, give them feedback, advice and retain them. But also how, if you have to say goodbye to them, you say goodbye. It is that full life cycle. And so it's embracing that culture end to end. Know your organization is also going to change over time and being, you know, collaborative about it, right? It's, it's in some sense an organic thing that's a shared responsibility of everyone on your team. They have to nurture it. They have to bring their past into it. And you got to question it. If you see something that's like, really like challenging it, dive into it right now. It's not a fluffy topic. Because this is why the best talent is going to vote with their feet and join you, right? They're going to like, learn about you from their friends, they're going to learn about it from the network. And then when they meet you for the first time, if you're the stark opposite of what's written on the website, they're walking. They're walking right there. So culture, end to end is critical. And I would say that's one of the big differentiators if you're joining a business like Wise.

So, so case in point, you know, your website, I mean, I view a lot of websites and I find a lot of business entrepreneurs, they're not paying attention to their website. You know, they're not keeping their finger on the pulse. And so a candidate goes and looks at their website and they go, I, from a vision standpoint, I can't see myself spending a career there.

So I don't know anything about their values. How important, by the way, another left field. How important are core values in today's world, in today's business marketplace?

Critical. Especially when we talk to job seekers. You know, we have gone through a big shift following the pandemic. I. I keep thinking about the market before and after. And you think about one, the resurgence in entrepreneurship and the fact that, like, everyone had a moment to recognize what they were doing and is it the right thing for them. So many people are yearning for the right thing, which varies dramatically, and core values is central to it. You know, you got to another key part of this, which is like writing the mission and making it clear it's in your head as the entrepreneur, but so often it's not clear to others, which is, you know, at wisehire, our mission is to connect communities. We're helping small businesses and people find great jobs. That's a reason to get excited in the morning. And every person listening to this has a key insight into how they're making an impact. And it's all about just crafting a message. Right. Like, Mike, what you're doing is changing the days and lives of so many entrepreneurs. People are taking vacations for the first time because they listen to your advice and up level their business. Right. That's a magical thing. It's not a business coaching and consulting company. It is changing people's lives. And I think, like, that messaging alone up levels who you're getting, really starts that bond on the, on the first.

Step, really well, that's what gets me fired up and gets me out of bed. I mean, I've got stories upon stories. I heard another one today in our team huddle session about an agent's life who's been changed. It's completely changed his mindset, but it's permeating over to his marital relationship of more than 30 years in a positive way.

That's amazing.

That is why it is absolutely amazing. So core values, the message, what you're putting out there in the world, come spend a career with us, because this is what who we are as an organization. Absolutely fantastic stuff. And I agree with that. And a lot of entrepreneurs aren't doing that nowadays.

We're busy. We have too many things going on. And that's where I think, like, partnerships like ours and platforms that are focused on small business are critical. Right. We talked a lot about. It's this, you know, David and Goliath story, Fortune 500s. They've got the playbooks, they've got the professional recruiters. What do we have? We have, you know, hard work and time, but there's not enough of it. And so when you think about the process and you think about how do you find top talent, you want to lean on technology to do the busy work. Right? One great example in this market today, once you've attracted talent, you got to follow up quickly. Much like we talked about with customers, it's speed to lead, right? It's the same thing with candidates.

You mean money loves speed.

Candidates need and deserve responses because back in the day, it was a black hole, right? They would apply, they'd never hear back from you because you were busy. That other company, as you're driving down the street, seeing that big brand, they're responding right now, there's probably like an automated email saying, hey, thank you for your application. We'd love to have a conversation. We need to uplevel how we bring our process in and treat these candidates the same way that we would want to be treated the same way we treat our customers. So it's very much re examining our whole process to bring in great talent.

Well, I just brought a great idea. Let's give some people some value. If you're responding to candidates, you got this thing called ChatGPT or generational AI, right?

Yep.

Yeah, you can just say, hey, you know, respond to Sid Upadi about his application in the style of etc. Etc. Boom, you got a response.

And it's all about crafting that message. Right. Like, so often it's personalized, right? Exactly, exactly. I was actually just the other day talking to a customer, and it was a funny story because he was using our platform and he was sharing an account with, with one of the hiring managers and he was writing these like amazing personalized emails. And then he has a candidate who he loves comes in the door and they're like, man, I just loved, like, the conversation. I could already sense it. And he's like, man, that was me. You're giving the credit to someone else. But it was back to the point he built a bond with that conversation. It's not just, hey, a robot is saying this, thank you for applying. It's, hey, Mike, thank you so much for the application. I love your history. Would love to hop on a call. When do you have 15 minutes? It's that simple. Let's just hop on a call, engage them, and then take them through a really consistent process. That's, I think, the key back to, like, how you win 100%.

And I, regardless of what happens with technology, into the future, AI and GPT and all, the whole thing, the one thing that we will always have, and I've got people with depths and depths of data and analytics and everything else who say the one thing they will never be able to take away from us is the relationship piece.

Exactly.

So you're spot on. We want to build depth of relationship. Let's jump to an uncomfortable subject. Maybe. And I, I've, I've never been afraid to throw something on the table. And based on what I've learned about you, you're not afraid to talk about it either.

We embrace challenges, man. Let's hear it.

Let's grow. So you got to get comfortable being uncomfortable, right?

Yeah.

Recruiters.

Yes.

So why is it a good idea to have a personalized hiring system versus hiring a recruiter, which you and I both know can be costly.

There are great recruiters out there. I work with recruiters all the time. But if you think about that idea of the deck is stacked against us as entrepreneurs, it comes down to the fundamental economics. The best recruiters deliver an experience that's again, deeply personal. It's hands on, it's tailor made, but it's also out of reach from small businesses. There are great recruiters that probably cost $100,000 and are probably not great for the job that you're about to hire them for. What we have aimed to do is, is to take the insights of that recruiter and through our coaching, which has had about, you know, about a decade of technology investment, we can give you scale and we can make it affordable and accessible again. It is a uneven playing field when it comes to hiring today. We as entrepreneurs and small businesses have to level that playing field. And one of the ways we think about it is with, you know, giving you technology and coaching so you can have an equally fair experience as a company that has a professional recruiter. It is just night and day, plain fact that, you know, there are going to be organizations that are going to out compete you. They're going to have more money, they're going to have more resources, and what do we have? We have great opportunities that if we can get in front of the right talent, we can have the exact same pipeline as a person that can afford that recruiter and their fees. That's my sense of the market. And I know I get a lot of emails from recruiters, but, you know, there's a time and place for them. We're helping customers, you and I, that just could not afford them in many cases.

Well, it'd be unfair of me if I didn't mention this because I spouted a lot and I'm going to continue to say it just because I care about the entrepreneurial people out there, agents and everybody else. Your teammates are being recruited.

Again today.

We have to earn our talent and their ability to Stay in the business every single day. I think that's right. That's a really good perspective, which is, you know, the world of recruiting is going to continue on. I mean, look at what we just said, which is like there was a world where we used to have passive and active candidates. Now everyone is active. Everyone's getting an email and a phone call and like a text message saying, hey, just come join this business. You have to think about this, which is week after week, month after month, you need to have the pulse of your organization to really look at yourself in the mirror fairly and say, are we building a great place to work for this team? Right. And you have to take that feedback and when that person leaves that signal that like you had many, many opportunities to do better. And that's just the raw reality of it. So yes, there will be recruiters. We're going to develop talent, the talent is going to leave. But at the end of the day, it's about the journey that we're on and like being better day by day and we got to get the pulse and like earn someone next quarter, next year or whatever the case.

Yeah. So I'm going to go to the power. Say it again, please.

Unpopular perspective given, like where the industry was just like five, six years ago.

You know, all we try to share here is the truth because it doesn't change and it doesn't lie, right? Yep, exactly. So I'm going to do a trifecta on you because we believe in the power of three people, processes and promotion as an example. So what is your number one tip? Speaking to the people and keeping people engaged and involved in your business. So when the recruiter calls, I'm not interested. I'm super happy where I'm at. So you have great expertise in employee engagement and culture. So first of all, what's your best thoughts on employee engagement?

So in a market like today, engagement is going to ebb and flow with what's going on. You think about the industry, you think about the business challenge, people are going to naturally have apprehension about what's going on. Like everyone is thinking like, what's next? What's next? Am I in the right place? There's always going to be some of this unnerved, but as an entrepreneur that wants to build a long term oriented team, one of the best things that you can do is get ahead of the exit interview and instead have a stay interview. So this is a really tactical bit of advice. I believe we have a blog post and some great resources on this and we can Link them. It's all about meeting that person in your business, checking in with them regularly, getting a sense of like what's working and not working. These are very basic conversations, right? Like give me like a start, stop, keep, much as we do for a process, as an example, do the start, stop, start, stop, keep for your manager. One thing to think about is as you build your business and there's hierarchy and structure, some people may not be in a place that are comfortable to be vulnerable enough to give the right candid feedback to direct manager. And so you as the entrepreneur need to like step back and think about the process, the organizational design and make that information flow. So as an example, as you build out like your sales team and now you've got a sales manager, you know, the sales team may not give that advice and that feedback to the sales manager. It is for you, that entrepreneur, to go down to the level and get that insight so you can prevent challenges in the business. Worst case, you're getting great feedback and you're building another relationship. You've spent a little bit of time and you build rapport. That person's excited and engaged. But that's how you solve this, which is you get early insights, you adapt the business, you adapt the culture, you take that feedback and there's not everything that you can control. But just by making that opportunity available, when that person gets that call, they can say, you know what? Unlike any other business that I've been in, this place listens to me. Not everything is going to change. But like I'm not going to take a leap of faith on the unknown versus the known. And that's again just like, you know, having a two way dialogue with cut with people.

Yeah. And part of Maslow's hierarchy of needs as far as humans are concerned.

Right. Yeah.

People just want to be heard.

Exactly.

They want to be needed. It's built into us. There's nothing we can do about it. So just to make sure everybody heard what Sid just dropped the gold nugget. By the way. Sid, I do have gold nuggets here. Thank you for dropping gold nuggets on us. Today. A state interview and I heard you say that you wrote a blog on that at some point.

Yeah.

If you want to find your blog, just, I mean, Google what WISE hire.

Blog wisehire.com resources there's a section on blogs and there's a lot of content on interviews. We've got a stay interview and it's really a lot of the same questions that you would actually ask in an exit Interview, but you're just phasing it forward, right?

Well, you want to prevent the exit. Interview. Interview and keep them there.

Exactly.

Stay.

It's basic questions, right? Like, hey, you know, I'm not, not, not suggesting that you're looking at other opportunities, but I'm curious, what would make you want to look at other opportunities? Again, this is, you know, I've built a safe space for you to say anything and everything. I'm trying to make a better business. I really am looking for your feedback. You know, disarm the individual, make it a space, a safe place where they can give you that context and just listen. Another bit of feedback, and this gets back to, like, the tactics and, you know, as an entrepreneur that's, like, gotten into the business for, like, the passion and the outcomes, I think over time, as you build your business, so much of it is just about people, right? You and I were chatting about it. It's all about the people. It's all about the talent. And if you take a proactive approach to building systems, this is how you will retain talent and get the best out of talent. So another great example of this, you know, in corporate America, people do one on ones. They're regularly checking in. They're building a cadence to get feedback and have conversations versus sporadic conversations. It's not, let's wait for the performance review at the end of, like, November. It's, let's routinely have a space where, you know, Mike can walk in the door. We can have a dialogue. A bit of advice for someone that's, like, never done this. There's a lot of templates, a lot of content, but I think the heart of it is focus on the individual. And in the first few conversations, you may not get much out of it, but build consistency and rhythm. Think of that conversation as the most important meeting in your day. Why? Because you're giving an individual that you're investing in that you've put all this time and talent and has potential to the opportunity to meet with you, that entrepreneur, that owner of that business, and unblock them. I actually have a template, and people are free to borrow on this, but it's all about building. The consistency of the template is key, because in a quarter or two, that person's gonna feel comfortable with giving you the real hard truths. Hey, tell me your highs and lows of the week. All right? The first few times, you're gonna get, like, fluffy stuff, but a couple of times in, hey, you know, actually, Sid, here's a low that I've been facing and I haven't had, I haven't had the space to say this to anyone. Right. It's all about building that repetitive like motion where like over time, you know, you've built trust and they can share with you. Another element of this is like building trust. And you as a leader over time are going to have to change a lot. And you know, the one advice and bit of tactic that I give here is lean in. Trust is not something that like, you know, just happens overnight. You know, you have to make it happen, be vulnerable with, with that manager, with that team leader, you know, you're a human as well. And by disarming them and realize, oh wow, this is, this, this person is actually not just the signatory on my check, not just that email address, but a person, they will then open up with you. And trust is that like, you know, you just got the flywheel going. So I know we're getting way into the weeds here, but this is what happens when you find great talent. You want to, you know, be patient for it and then you got to do hard work to retain it. Because ultimately talent is what's going to take our business from, you know, where we are today to being two or three times the size and where we want to be.

Well, I'm going to suggest your pnl. Similar to our PNL and every other business out there. What's the number one line item on our PNL and our expenses?

Oh, it's the team. It's the team that we're developing.

Exactly. So I mean we need to invest in that. It's our number one customers, our team together, everybody achieves more. Right?

Exactly.

Thank you for that deep dive on the number one thing I had for you. Inconsistency and rhythm is another thing I wrote down. Stay, interview, consistency, rhythm. By the way, wise hires W I Z like zebra E H I R e dot com, go to resources, check the blogs and all that kind of stuff. So my, my circle around number two of a three pronged question for you, Sid. Let's talk about positive company culture because I'm a big believer in culture, each strategy and everything else. For breakfast we talk about keeping people there in employee engagement, but talk about the 20,000 foot level culture picture.

Great, great question. So our culture is not the thing that's on the posters, it is the lived experience. Right. Day to day, end to end mean the invisible architecture. Yes, exactly. We have to be very intentional about culture and I think like for many entrepreneurs that I meet, it feels fluffy on day one. We don't recognize it and you know, that's okay. If you go through that journey, what's going to happen invariably is a culture is going to form in your business, whether you are focused on structuring it or not. And in those early years, that culture is going to be critical. The first few people you bring in are going to shape your firm for the decades that are ahead. And that's where I think a year or two in, you'll realize, wow, okay, that person didn't work out and here's like the damage that they've done or that person, you know, changed everything. Oh my gosh. That early group that you're bringing in, if you don't have a clear vision of the culture, have a deep discussion. There's a process for this and it's all about, you know, first thinking about, okay, that, you know, back to like mission vision, of course. But then let's codify it. What are our value systems? What are the things that we are willing to say goodbye to like a great performer for? Because it just is a cardinal sin in our business. Like, think about those really hard questions, write it down. And then the way you live and breathe, it comes down to how you assess and bring people in, how you retain and promote and develop, how you ultimately say goodbye to someone. We're in an era today where so many people back to even Maslow's pyramid and like, you know, the moment people had prior to the pandemic, where they, you know, step back and realize, wow, I want to do this for the right reason. I want to be at the right place. It comes down to culture. People are voting with their feet for this. And if you got to be intentional, if it's not on your website, there's a large percentage of the population that may not take you as seriously. They're going to like, read you, they're going to research you, and then they're going to come and interview you because it's a two way street. So I know we're talking a lot about the beginning of the career, the employee journey, but culture permeates through all the conversations. And ultimately, if you build your firm to what you aspire for and when you finally get that first vacation, culture is what's happening when you're at vacation. It's the way people are making decisions. It's the way that like, you know, your customers are being treated. It's a really critical thing to get right and you know, it's going to change and adapt over time. One thing I say often is as you grow your business. People are joining the business, bringing their baggage, but they're also bringing, you know, a good positive change. They're thinking about the businesses that they've been in, the challenges they've faced, and said, you know what, I don't want that. That's why I joined your company. And here's how I'm going to keep driving it and taking it further. It's a shared responsibility. But you as entrepreneur have to, like, start it. You have to write it down, you have to focus on it.

Well, set the vision, right.

Yes.

Set the vision for the company. But the other thing I just wrote down, codify your culture. I love that. Can I share that with others?

Of course, please. We have to like shout it over the rooftops.

And I also Learned it was February 5th of 2019. I don't remember the date.

They need to hear it at least seven times. That's why we need to keep shouting on a daily. Is that why there's seven days in a week? Aha.

Repetition is really what drives it. At the end of the day, this is like the journey. If you as a leader are not tired of the message, that means you're not saying it enough and it's not clear enough.

I love that. I, I've already, I already feel we could go on for hours. And we will.

We will.

We may have round two of this podcast. I don't know. It depends on Sid's time because he's a busy guy. So number three, and it's going to be the hardest of the three. Thank you for just gold nugget after gold nugget.

No, I appreciate the opportunity, man. We have to give back to the team. Agree.

By the way, that means I second or I agree for those who are watching the podcast. So recruiting. Excuse me, back up. Attracting, recruiting, interviewing, hiring based on the current environment, which will change in the future. Because change is not a four letter word, right?

Yep.

Okay, what is your number one tip for entrepreneurs out there that might be listening or watching this podcast on attracting, recruiting, interviewing and hiring in today's environment?

I know that's a big number one tip. Number one tip.

I think adaptability is really it. Right. And I hope it's not a cop out answer, but I think it's really the market, you know, here we are recording like in the middle of 2023 is dramatically different than it was six months ago, which is dramatically different than it was even six months before that. You know, you think about. And I'll, you know, we're, we're plugged into this industry and I'll tell you like some fun data points. Our industry is finally embracing remote hiring for one reason, which is like very strange. Like this is us all, you know, accommodating the change around us. Where we were in 2021, you know, the, you know, the economy's opening up again. We, we needed to get hires in. My God, that was like a frenetic moment. None of us want to live that again. So we all have to think about getting ahead of the curve again. If you're driving and listening and looking around, every one of these companies that you see is your competition and they've changed their process. And so one thing I recommend to entrepreneurs is not to think so insularly about their industry and the best practices there, but start to step out and talk to others and borrow, right? Like the way that, you know, when you go to like a buddy that started a franchise restaurant and the way they hire, there's golden nuggets there, the way they retain, the way they promote. Think about those ideas that you could bring back. Maybe not all that's applicable, but that's where I get to adaptability. Because at the end of the day, talent is so transferable today. You know, you could have skill sets in our industry and you can walk across the street and maybe get a job in tech and sales as an example. That's unnerving. I know because it was not the case just five years ago. And as a result we just got to be far more adaptable as a result. I think some of the clear, clear things to do, speed to lead, as we discussed, right. Speed to conversations, having two way dialogues, you know, having a process that's very consistent and also not just inclusive of you as the owner, manager and entrepreneur, but the team. I think that's a critical piece which is when you're screening for talent, bringing them in, they're also interviewing you. And it's not about your relationship and theirs that's going to lead to their success, but it's their peers. If that person that's, you know, at the agency desk that's doing the processing is someone they're not going to get along with and they learned that like five days into the job you just did a disservice. Like you need to ensure that like people are involved in the process because it's all about relationships at the end of the day. So a couple of quick like perspectives. I think it's a great question but hopefully you know, the answer is helpful which is like step Outside of the box, let's look at other industries, borrow best practices and just, you know, continue to be adapting because this, this market is only going to continue to accelerate and be weirder.

I think I couldn't agree with your answer more. I mean, I think it's a great answer and I agree with it. Adaptability. We've got to be agile and go look at what other people are doing and read 50 books. You mentioned that earlier. Nobody's got time for that. I mean, if you sit there and study and study and study, it's like, you know, I was doing a study earlier this week on sales. There's two salespeople, one salesperson. It was an rfp, right? Request for a proposal.

Yep.

First salesperson, he's going to perfect the proposal. Proposal. He's going to do all the research, etcetera, etcetera. Etc. Salesperson number two. He came up with three great questions for the person that presented the rfp, you know, what are your expectations, et cetera, et cetera. He got the answers. He built a singular page proposal based on the answers and closed the deal. Two or three days later, the other salesperson came back and said, I've got this proposal. It's tailored for you. And they said, thanks, but too late.

That is. That is the journey happening every single day, which is the way we work. The way every customer that we're about to work with, every conversation we're going to go into may be very different than it was previously. That's just what's required in business today. I think at the end of the.

Day, that's why we need to prepare ourselves. Right?

100%. 100%.

By the way, I don't know if you're preparing. Are Astros at home this weekend? Are they away or do you know?

You know, I've been on the road this week and I've not even looked at the calendar. I'm going to check it out.

So Sid is down in the Houston area and we were talking about baseball before we went on. So I said, are you an Astros fan? He said, I am. So you're based. And that's a great place to be because you're right central in the US and you're traveling around helping entrepreneurs, leading your incredible team. And Sid, we could go on for hours and maybe we will have around two.

Definitely. Definitely.

So this has been phenomenal. Phenomenal. Sid. Sid. Siddhu Padi.

Excuse me, is the CEO and co founder of WiseHire. Wisehire.com w I z e h I r e dot com. Check it out. We have built a relationship with them because of the platform that they present for entrepreneurs to attract, recruit, interview, and ultimately get hired. Top talent out there in many, many industries. But I found in my initial research and conversations with your team that insurance is one of the verticals that you guys have a lot of experience in. So thank you.

Oh, we do it for the entrepreneurs. You know, it's all about taking the guidance that you're giving your community, putting it in a product so it speaks the same language. Right. It should be so much easier because there's already such a big challenge for us as entrepreneurs. Entrepreneurs are heroes. They need and deserve more. I think our two organizations are chipping away at a big problem and I can't wait to keep working with you all long into the future.

Man 100. Well, a problem solve is an opportunity for sale, right?

Bingo. So thank you. Thank you for all that you're doing for entrepreneurs everywhere. Again, Sid upadi from wisehire wisehire.com thank you for joining us on the podcast and sharing your incredible wisdom. And I know the future is bright for your company. I mean, you doubled. You've got serious investment behind you to be able to scale and help more entrepreneurs based on whatever you want to do.

Mike, thanks again. It's a journey, like all entrepreneurs, a day at a time. Thank you again.

Of course, of course. And we're here to support you. Keep in touch with me if I can ever help. Just, you know, if you want a third party opinion on anything, please let me know.

I can't wait to catch up in a little bit because we have so many great products coming out. Like the journey of an entrepreneur just starts with the hire. We'll chat in a couple of months time. Man, I look forward to it.

Yeah, reach out to me and we've got our information.

So. All right. Excellent.

Everybody, welcome. If this is your first time on the podcast, welcome. My name is Mike Stromso. I'm widely recognized as a leading author, speaker and coach for the independent insurance agency industry. You can learn more about what we do to help agency entrepreneurs everywhere@unstoppable profit producer.com if you're interested in attending one of our live events coming up, please go to be unstoppablebootcamp.com that's where you get the thrust of all of it over three full days. To grow your business, create wealth so you can have more freedom to live life on your own terms. All based on 36 years of research in your industry. 100 of the time as a proud independent insurance agent just like you. And please, if you got great value out of this podcast, please share it with somebody else you know and care about. Just go To Unstoppable Profit podcast.com share this episode with them and make sure you go to the top and subscribe so you don't miss one valuable episode. Because we bring to you every week incredible resources like Mr. Sid Upadi and his wise hire team. So please, and we're out there on all the channels like Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, Amazon and of course our YouTube channel. Just go to YouTube search, unstoppable profit Producer, go to videos. All of our podcasts are there. And go, if you're listening to this, go view it and you can see Sid's incredible energy come right through the screen to help you.

Sid.

Thank you again, sir.

Thanks again, Mike. Always appreciate the opportunity. Let's get back at it, man.

Absolutely. Let's go help some more entrepreneurs. Thank you for joining us everybody. And remember, you got this. We believe in you. Have a phenomenal one of a kind day and go make something happen for yourself.

We go.

Can't get enough of the Unstoppable Profit podcast. Come join our next live three day boot camp in warm, beautiful San Diego. Invest in your ticket today at Be Unstoppable Boot camp dot com that's Be Unstoppable Boot camp dot com.