164. Pauline Nguyen | The Way of the Spiritual Entrepreneur

Hello, Book Thinkers family, and welcome to our personal development podcast, Book Thinkers Life-Changing Books. During each episode, we interview one of the world's top authors, and as a listener, you can expect to discover new books, new mentors, and new resources that you can use to achieve more and live better. In today's episode, we have the pleasure to interview Pauline Nguyen, author of The Way of the Spiritual Entrepreneur. Pauline is a conscious entrepreneur who has owned many businesses, including Red Lantern, which is an award-winning restaurant in Australia. She is also an international keynote speaker, author, and life coach who integrates science and spirituality into her life, her teachings, and her coaching. In this episode, you'll learn about Pauline's story and where she came from, what joy is and how to have it, finding fulfillment, what spirituality has to do with entrepreneurship, why becoming more heart-centric over mind-centric is one of the most important things you can do in this life, and the importance of living your life in your true values. This episode is so powerful, and if you let it, it can change everything for you. Now get ready to learn and enjoy this absolutely life-changing conversation with Pauline Nguyen. Pauline Nguyen, welcome to the Book Thinkers Life-Changing Books Podcast. We are so excited to introduce you to our audience and talk about your book, The Way of the Spiritual Entrepreneur. You're such a dynamic person from being a refugee to creating a world-famous restaurant, the Red Lantern, and becoming an international bestselling author and many other remarkable achievements. We will certainly talk about all those things, but I want to start with asking you to paint a picture of your childhood and then asking how you chose to be empowered by your past instead of a victim of it.

Um, hello, Luke. Hello, Nick. Hello, everyone who's listening. I would love on this journey to find out what resonated with you when you read my book. So many different things resonate with different people. Um, my origin story. Okay, and the book is an autobiography of sorts because it all merges together. My family and I are boat people. We are refugees who escaped the Communist War in Vietnam in 1975. So my father built a boat and he smuggled us out to sea, and my grandmother begged him not to leave. She couldn't understand how a parent would want to risk perishing their children out at sea, but my father would rather die trying than risk imprisonment or a fate far worse, which was the re-education camps where they would brainwash the soldiers and, and the prisoners. And he'd tell me, it's not enough that they want to take our freedom, they want to take our ports as well. So we spent 9 days out at sea and we ended up in a refugee camp in Thailand. And it was where my mother gave birth to my brother Luke in a lean-to tent. We were only meant to stay in— you may know my brother Luke, he's quite the famous chef, he's got quite the profile around the world. And we were only meant to stay in the refugee camp for 3 months or so, but we ended up staying there for a year. And then in 1978, Australia finally accepted us. And coming to a new country, my father had a lot of pressure. We didn't know the laws, the language, all the systems. And because of the war and because of his own father and his father's father, there was a lot of trauma going on in my father. And he— I guess he didn't have the tools that I have now, or the tools I teach now. And so we had a very violent upbringing because he didn't know what to do with all this anger. And it wasn't long until he offloaded his anger on my mother and then offloaded his anger on us kids as well. So growing up emotionally and physically How can I say? We were a mess spiritually. We were a mess. He also made us work very hard. I started working full time in the family businesses when I was seven. My father had an ice cream parlor, a restaurant, a video library, a cafe. He also operated a driving school on the side. You know, now we're talking mid eighties, and us kids provided the child labor. So he instilled into all of us a ferocious. Work ethic. And that's where I learned, I would call it the habit, learned the habit of mastery, because everything can always be done better. The soups can be made better, the ice cream can be made better, the cappuccino froth can be made better, service can be better. There was always this sense of mastery, this sense of constant evolution. But amongst all of this, the undercurrent was the undercurrent of a lot of trauma from my father. And so I would say, you know, physically, mentally, we were strong, but spiritually, we were a mess. And so I ran away from home at a very young age. I spent many years hiding from my father. I put myself through university. I worked in some of the finest restaurants in Sydney. I learned how to be a sommelier. I learned fine dining, and I learned what it meant to give really good service and hospitality. And then that's when I started playing with the rich and the elite. And, um, I was a very naughty girl in the '20s. You know, I'm sure most of us who are listening, you know, we do, we do naughty things. We, we, you know, party a lot. We— I, you know, lots of, um, drugs and alcohol and just played a lot with, with the elite. And I became a member of their inner circles. And it was a very indulgent, tumultuous, uh, fun time. And so, and then I got a glimpse of the entrepreneurial world, the high flyers, the high rollers, the, um, the influencers. And then I thought, wow, why do you guys have all this money? You have all this money and you have all these privileges and opportunities and you're unhappy? You don't have the right to be unhappy. My parents and all us, uh, the community who escaped Vietnam and all the immigrants and started with nothing and working their asses off in a new country— these guys deserve to be unhappy. You don't deserve to be unhappy. And how could this be. So that really started this, um, uh, thirst and curiosity for how does it make sense. I, I thought money equates to happiness, but it obviously didn't. And so that started my quest to, um, uh, find out what it is that's, that's missing. And during this journey, I only also had to do so much of my own healing. And I think this is why my students and my clients really go on the journey and they get their results fast because I've walked the walk. I've, I've, I've been through it. I've been through the entrepreneurial journey. I've been through the trauma journey.

I've—

I grew up in a shitty environment and I have the stories to tell. I've got the awards, the rewards, as well as the battle scars. And so we have to speak from direct experience, right? We have to speak because, um, we have now the lessons to teach and, and pass on. But one of the things that I found over and over and over again is that there is a suffering that has been misdiagnosed as psychological suffering, and that is a spiritual suffering. And time and time again, when they go down this journey— what is it to be spiritual? It is to live your life in spirit and inspired. And it's this force, this spark that lights us up, and we're lit up with this power, this unbridled energy. And so we're not allergic to making money. Um, money buys us more opportunities, money buys us more freedoms. But I believe that it's deep spirituality, deep, deep fulfillment, and joy, joy. And from that creates this power where we can do so many other things. And, and that was a Big, big revelation for me. Okay, there are different ways of doing things. There are different ways of being, different ways of seeing things, and there are different reasons for doing, seeing, and being. And, and this is what, um, the way of the spiritual entrepreneur is all about. I hope that gave you a good origin story for you, for your speaker, for your listeners.

I'm, I'm getting goosebumps, and there's just, there's so much to unpack there. But yeah, I'll let, I'll let Nick, uh, Nick chat.

Yeah, you have such an incredible origin story, and we appreciate all of that detail because it gives us context for the lessons that you're teaching us today. One of my favorite lessons from your story right there, but also from the book, is that because you have such a diverse experience and you've traveled all over the world, you say in the book that you've really seen 4 types of people. Type number 1, they're poor and they're unhappy. Type number 2, they're poor, but they are happy. Type number 3, they're wealthy, but they're unhappy. And then type number 4, they're wealthy and they're happy. And so, I'm curious, why do you think that there are so many wealthy people, type number 3, so many wealthy people out there that don't have a holistic sense of success? They're missing the spiritual peace, the happiness, the inspiration. Why do you think that our world today cultivates so many people that are focused on money But they lack the rest of it.

In my experience and my observation, it is that a lot of entrepreneurs have been doing things the old ways. They're very mind-centric. And we're coming into a time now, and for those who are listening, if you've been paying attention, the collective consciousness is shifting. We're changing. Even the fact that we're on this podcast having these conversations, the, the collective consciousness, the consciousness that's, that's, um, existing, we're moving into. And that they say that any movement, you, you just need 7 to 10% of the population to really understand and, and, um, be thirsty and hungry for more for there to be a tipping point. Right? We're almost there. We're almost there. And what's that tipping point? In my observation and my direct experience, having, um, coached and taught so many people, we're coming out of an era where we're so mind-centric. I have to see it in order to believe it. It must make sense to me in order for it— prove to me, prove to me. And so for those who believe that there is another way, no proof is necessary. For those who do not believe, no proof is possible. And so we waste no time on those who do not or don't want to believe. We all have a different level of development. We all have a different soul age. We all have a different life experience. And so we leave them be. We leave them be. We're not here to force anything or, you know, indoctrinate anyone. Everyone is evolving at their own pace, race, and space, right? But the thing is that the collective consciousness, they're moving Moving into a space where we are now more and more heart-centric. Our heart will be the barometer for our future. And so when we are so mind-centric, this is just this this level here, right? We have three intelligences: the heart, the gut, and the mind or the brain. And what connects all three intelligences? Our breath. And so we're moving into a consciousness now where. Oh, I can be all of it. I don't— it's not just my mind. I can now tap into my heart. I can now follow my intuition. But that also means that you can't follow your gut if your gut's shit, right? I mean, I've got to clean myself up. I've got to change my ways of thinking. I've got to change my ways of being. I have to honor this body and this breath. And so that's what it means to be spirited, to be in spirit and inspired. Oh, I can actually choose how I want to feel. I can ask myself questions such as, what do I need to do to feel the way I want to feel? I can ask myself different questions such as, who do I need in my orbit to help me to get to where I want to go faster? But from a heart space, not from an opportunist space, right? From a heart space, it says, who will come on this journey with me to inspire more people so that everyone can evolve? And so it's going to— we're going to come into an era where we're going to be tapping into our heart more and more and more. I believe we're here on this earth to do 3 things. First is to evolve. Constant evolution. The old ways, the mind-centric ways, is I'm done, I've got my money in the bank. You know, a lot of most people, they're not bankrupt, they're spiritually bankrupt. But what have you got in your spiritual bank? You know, and the second thing we should be doing, I believe we are here on this earth to do, is to push humanity forward. So a lot of the, and the really wealthy and unhappy I, I believe that the, the unhappiness comes because whatever they're doing is not really pushing their humanity forward, uh, because from that there's a huge sense of fulfillment if we're doing something to forward our own race, to progress our own race. Fulfillment is the new currency. I think the third thing, and this is what's missing, what's missing time and time again for, for that group who are incredibly wealthy but unhappy, they've forgotten what it means to be joyful. They've forgotten me. They've forgotten what it means to have joy. And joy is not this false, oh my God, everything's amazing excitement. That's called false excitement. Joy, it comes from a centered space. Joy comes from watching the sunrise or enjoying the scent and the beauty of a flower, or really admiring this beautiful tree. Joy is taking that moment to feel the sun on your face and the sand in your toes and how delicious this water feels. And when, and when they've got That, oh, I'm evolving, I'm constantly evolving. Oh, I'm pushing my humanity forward. And I'm doing it in states of grace and joy. That's where the fulfillment lies. And that's when the spiritual bank account fills up. That's what that's missing in their lives.

Making me tear up here.

Um, it gets me emotional too, speaking about that, because it's fundamentally so simple. And yet that's what's missing. And that's what's missing. And then they become spiritually bankrupt.

Yeah, I can feel it. For people that—

I'm fine, by the way. Let me just—

Yeah, no, you're okay.

I'm like this all the time.

It's beautiful. It's beautiful. Thank you for expressing that because that's real.

I hope that answered your question, Nick.

It did. It did. And I am in total alignment with your messaging. I've found in my own life what I'm trying to optimize for, especially moving into 2024, is enjoying the passage of time. And for me, just like you've defined it, enjoying the passage of time includes a number of things. It includes progress, relentless improvement, gratitude in everything. It includes a holistic sense of success, which is a balance between health, wealth, love, and happiness. And I am— it did answer my question. And I just to reiterate, I am totally in alignment with you. Good.

Hello, Book Thinkers family. We are on a mission to change people's lives for the better, and we believe that the right book at the right time can change your life. And the only way we can impact more lives is with your help. If a book has changed your life for the better, I wanted to ask you a quick favor. Could you please take a few seconds and leave a review of our show? Because if you're like us, you want to change not only your life, but others' lives as well. And by you leaving a review of our show, it spreads the word about all of these life-changing books and does just that. We greatly appreciate your help. By reaching more people, you help us change more lives. Thank you so much for your time. And now back to the show. Yeah. So to follow up on that, I just want to ask about for those people that are in this state of suffering, and a lot of people are, there's, you know, the stats don't lie. It's like 98% of people are living paycheck to paycheck. I forget what the stats are, but living paycheck to paycheck, they're unhappy. They're not spiritually fulfilled. They're not financially fulfilled. What are some of the, in your opinion, like what are some of the first steps people can take To get out of that broken mindset that they have in their life?

I believe that you can't do it yourself until you can do it yourself. Sovereignty is so very, very important. So if they were— if you were alone in your home and you don't have a coach, a mentor, a teacher, I think it's important to search for one. It's important to look for one. Connection is why we are here. Connection is what gives our life meaning and purpose. The first thing I teach is power. And when I say power, I don't mean force. When you go to a doctor, the doctor never asks you, how's your power? Right? And, and so if we can liken it to— I'm speaking to the people now who don't yet have a coach or mentor, um, uh, and, and where to start from, from the basics. Like in our physical vehicle as a battery, are you running on empty, um, on amber, or is it green and fully charged? And so the first part is power. So how, how do we get our power back? First of all, standing in our power. What does that mean to you? A lot of people, in my experience, are living in toxic environments. Do an audit on your life. You got to get rid of the shit people who treat you like shit first and foremost, and ask yourself what values are you holding on to. I coached someone the other day who was complaining about having to, you know, see this friend, and her friend's terrible. And I said, why, why are you continuing to see your friend? And she said, because of my values. What, what value are you abiding by? The value of loyalty. And I said, so you hold these— you've held this value of— and I'm sure many people hold these values, right? I believe that your values is what keeps you imprisoned. When we ask someone about their values, they'll rattle off things like integrity, honor, loyalty, all that stuff that makes no sense. Everything in context, of course. Everything in context. I'm a loyal person too. I'm loyal to joy. I'm loyal to those who are coming on this path with me. I'm loyal to those who are in spirit and inspired. I'm loyal to my own evolution. I'm not loyal to some shitty friend I've had since kindergarten, and I forced myself to see them, you know, every weekend because of the value of loyalty. And so I would ask for them to have an audit On their values. What are your values? I value beauty. I value nature. And and so this is what sovereignty means: the sovereign self. It's this idea that that there is no power or authority outside of you. How are you going to snatch your power back? There is no idea that there's the idea that there is no power outside of you required to live your own independent life. And so you've got to take full responsibility for your actions. That's the second part. Okay, so, um, I have to take responsibility for continuing to see this shitty friend every weekend? Yes, you do. And now, now that you're going to take responsibility for that, what are you going to do about it? What are you going to do about it? Because that's part of it, what's holding you back. You know, we've just come through, come out of the Christmas period. I've got to go home, I hate it. So don't go. Don't go unless you've already cleaned up, cleaned it up, and so that you can show up as your best self. And so this is when what it means to stand stronger in yourself. What does— what else does power mean? Power means no more self-betrayal, no more lying to yourself. And then we can speak authentically, we can speak with candor. Power means don't hide any aspects or parts of yourself. And so what does it mean to be authentic? That's That's what it means to be authentic, constantly asking, where is my power? Who's taking my power away? So I think the very, very first step is to do an audit. Where is there toxicity in your life? Because we can't step into the next best version of ourselves. We're here to evolve, remember? We can't step into our next evolution when we have rage and anger and toxicity surging through our veins. That's what we've got to clean up. First part's always to wake up, wake up to the reality that Oh, did I cause this? Okay, what do I need to do in order to change this? And then we go through the process of growing up. Grow up, come on! You can't do it yourself until you can do it yourself. And then we go through the process of waking up. Then we grow up, and then we got to clean up. We got to clean up in order for us to show up. And when we show up as our true self, it takes no effort. It really doesn't. We've gotten rid of all the toxicity. When we come up, when we show up as our true self, it takes no effort. Because you're living a lie, that's why, that's why you're tired, because you're living someone else's dream. I can't encourage enough, because now we're talking not only the mindset, right? We're not talking about just being mind-centric. We have to also talk about our heart. We also have to talk about our health and our body. And now we talk about the spirit. And so it's mindset, heartset, soulset, um, healthset. And so it's that combination of being all of it. If you're sitting alone, the first part— now we've done the semantic part— tap into your body. There's so much on the internet about breathwork. Start to get your sovereign self again. Start to fill yourself up with power again. There are particular breathworks that I teach that have literally changed lives, because now you're all so full of all this toxicity for all however many decades. There are breath techniques that can upgrade your biochemistry. So let's now start getting back into the body. I believe spirituality— it's an idea whose time has come. Let's take spirituality out of the clouds and put it back into our bodies where it belongs. Go out back into nature so that we can remember who we are. Remember is to reattach the member, to remember. Go out into nature, touch the earth, touch the trees, feel the sun on your skin, inhale the beautiful fresh air again. Nature has so much medicine. Never underestimate the power of nature's medicine. And so we go— we don't go out into nature. We are nature. We are nature. That's what it means to go out and remember, connect our member back into nature. Mother Earth and Father Sun have looked after us for eons and eons. And so those are the 3 steps that I would say to someone who is new to this journey and is suffering. It doesn't matter what age you are. Clean up, clean up all the toxicity in your life, and you have to get brutally honest with it. This is when you start to feel your power coming back, you know, having boundaries, speaking your truth, getting into your heart. Breath, breath, change this biochemistry, change your energetics, change your electromagnetic signature. And then the third thing I would do is, um, go out into nature. Connect back to nature and then get someone to help you because you can't do it alone until you can do it alone. Everyone has a coach and their mentor, right? Because that's what we're here for. We're here to do. We're here to see your blind spots because that's a part about blind spots. You can't see them.

Colleen, we are 100% going to have to have you back for a part 2, maybe a part 3 and part 4. Yes. Yeah, our format doesn't allow for us to cover the whole book, but there's so many things I want to talk to you about. To recap something you just said, I love the idea of auditing your friend group. I heard somebody say recently that if you look at your inner circle and you're not inspired or in spirit, then it's not a circle, it's a cage. Just like you said, you become imprisoned to your value system instead of liberated because of your value system.

Yeah, we become our environment.

Yes.

We become our environment. Our environment becomes us. We become our associations. Our associations become us. I love it when my clients and my students and my friends, we all have the same verbiage, right? We all have the same verbiage, and it's empowering verbiage. And we have a physical aversion, a physical reaction when it goes into gossip. or, um, or mean-spiritedness, and we cut each other down very, very fast. That's that, because we want to keep the circle clean.

Yeah, yeah, that's very true. And as a result, it does a lot of damage. The other subject that you just touched on, breathwork— I wanted to highlight something in your book. You gave acknowledgement and credit to your friends in the biohacking space, and I also love the biohacking space. So could you talk a little bit more about the importance of your health and maybe some of your key tips and recommendations that people can implement to improve energy and feel better? Hello, Book Thinkers family. A quick word from today's podcast sponsor. Today's episode is sponsored by Audible. Audible is the leading provider of spoken word entertainment and audiobooks ranging from bestsellers to celebrity memoirs, business, and my favorite, personal development. And as part of Audible's partnership with us, we're actually offering listeners a free 30-day trial. This trial includes 1 credit good for any Premium Selection titles you'd like on the whole platform. So that's pretty much any book, including the one we're talking about today. That book is yours to keep even after the trial is over. Now, this trial also includes access to Audible's Plus catalog of podcasts, audiobooks, guided wellness programs, and Audible Originals. You can listen all you want, no credits needed. Now, everyone on the Book Thinkers Instagram knows that I love physical paper books. There's nothing better than having a book in your hand scribbling notes everywhere in the margins. I kind of tear those things up, but I've been completing an additional 20 to 30 books every single year using Audible by listening when I'm in the car, doing chores around the house, or while I'm on my morning walks or runs. You could take advantage of this free trial by clicking the link in today's show notes or going to www.bookthinkers.com/audibletrial. You will not regret it. Now back to today's episode.

Yes. So I believe— I, I think I was biohacking before biohacking was all the rage. So because that's what, that's, that's what it is to be shaman, right? Um, it's, um, sound medicine, nature's medicine, um, body med— and, and I, I don't call it biohacking anymore. I, I like to refer to it as bio stacking because as I'm doing breathwork, I'm also out in nature. Grounding, having the sun on my skin, building up my solar callus, um, and, and stacking that as well with good nutrition, um, uh, shamanic activation. So it's bio-stacking for me. I'm no— I'm no longer— I, I don't really like to— I just, uh, exited the biohacking space when it became a case of measuring everything. Um, everything was measuring and for me as an observer of that, oh, now you're, now you're not sovereign anymore. Yeah, you've, you've lost your sovereign self. Um, can you train yourself to rather, rather than take out, you know, a little another device that you're going to put on your left ear to measure however much, like, can you tune in? Can you tune into your body? Can you tune into your heart? Do you know the practices so that your body says yes, no, maybe? My body, my heart, do I go into collaboration with this person? Body says no. My heart, my body, will I go on this journey with this person? Body says hell yeah. And so I'd— I, I left that kind of too much, very orange, very measuring world. And it's now about this. And of course, I've, I've studied and trained and worked with some of the greatest spiritual teachers and entrepreneurs in, in my eyes. I've traveled to, you know, China, India, Vietnam, um, you know, not— they weren't necessarily wealthy, but they were incredibly, incredibly spiritually rich. And so, excuse me, um, I do believe, again, back to power and sovereignty, we take what we need. We take what makes sense. I, I want to learn from the best because that's— it just saves a lot of time for me. But again, I don't place them on a pedestal where they're such a guru because I will— I, I lose my sense of sovereignty. And so I'll say, guru number 1, love ya, I'll take that. Guru 2, love you, I'll take that. Guru 3, I'll take that. And now I think we owe it to life to take what works and what's relevant and put our own flavor on it. Um, and so that's what it means to be, you know, I, I do a lot of shamanic practices, and there's an element of ceremony where we need to, um, it makes sense to follow the absolute rules because it makes sense. But I do a whole lot of ritual as well. It's like, I'll take that, that, that, that, that, and I will put my own spin on it. And I think that's, that we owe it to life to create our own flavor so that we can keep creating the new. And Uh, uh, the, the practice, the practice is to make more powerful this one so that we're not abdicating, we're not giving our power away.

Stuff is so good. I like, I have so many questions I want to ask, but do you, were you always spiritual? Did you have a point in time where you had like a very spiritual awakening? Is it something you grew up with? Were you religious or anything like that?

Thanks for that question, Luke. I don't believe that the spiritual— the spirituality that I teach has nothing to do with religion. That's a very separate topic. I am, I'm a practicing Buddhist. I don't believe Buddhism is a religion. Buddhism is a way of being. Um, and I really, really feel that it is religion that needs more spirituality. Spirituality does not need religion. There's a lot of science behind the spirituality that I teach. I think science builds cultures and it makes sense. It makes sense. Um, have I always been spiritual? Uh, I was born that way. I've been shaman for multiple lifetimes because I do Past life work, and it just makes sense why I have all these understandings in this lifetime. I've brought it in with me from many lifetimes. I had many strange spiritual experiences as a child, and because my upbringing upbringing was so violent, I I shut it down. It was I didn't shut it down; it shut down. It shut down until it was time for me to call it on again, until it was time for me to tap into that so that I could evolve into the, the more professional version of Pauline. And when I say professional, I mean professional human being, not the amateur human being that I was for many years. And my thirst for it is, is constant, is constant. But I like to teach it now. Well, I like to, I like to see people really step into their power now. Oh, I thought religion was, you know, giving, um, my power away to some deity or some other god. It's like, no, no, you are God. You are God, G-O-D, part of the grand organized design.

Oh, I, I love that. I love that. I'm So with your coaching practice, have you found that everyone can tap into the spirituality? Is it because of your past life, or is it in everyone that we can all tap into this higher, higher power?

Um, first I would say everyone can, but does everyone? No. Um, um, so many people still fight to hold on to their problems. I am not for them and they are not for me. We never force anyone. So for example, when a spouse or, um, a partner enters my world, I— one thing I always say is don't force your beloved or your partner to come down this road. Don't force them. We don't force, right? We use power, we don't force. You just go on living your life. You just go on feeling joyful and powerful, and they'll watch. They'll watch you become healthier. They'll watch you, you know, reverse age. They'll watch you be a kinder person, a more inspired and inspiring person. They'll watch because people don't have business problems; they have personal problems that reflect in their business, right? And then they'll watch your business grow, and they're going to be watching and watching and watching, and and they will make fun of you, and they will because people. people don't— are always afraid of what they don't understand, right? People are always afraid of what they don't understand. And then one day they're going to say, can I have some of that, please? And that's when we start the work. That's where we start the work. We don't force anyone because it'll just be so difficult for me. I'm sorry, I don't want to push you. Just come when you're ready, and then we can both play. So that permission piece, Luke, is really important. As a coach, a mentor, we have to have the permission first. Then both parties can have this fair value energetic exchange. And from there, it is to get out of your own way. So everyone can, everyone does. We all have spirit. Spirit's been beaten out of us because of the way our society has taken away our power. But the second thing I like to teach is on influence, but influencing through magnetism, influencing through the heart space, not through the old ways of influence and persuasion as we all know it. So to answer your question, can everyone? Yes, they can. But do they? No. And that's okay too.

Have you read Power Versus Force by Dr. David Hawkins?

I It's brilliant. I, I love the science behind that. It's, it's, it's so brilliant. And then when we show people the, um, emotional consciousness scale and they're like, oh, fuck, is that where shame and guilt vibrate at? Holy shit.

No wonder people don't want to do business with me, right?

Oh, what? That— yeah, I was— and they need to see it. And I love it when they see that science part and they said, It's what? It's all about frequency and vibration. I thought they were voodoo words.

Okay.

I figured you would love that one.

Whenever you're ready, we'll go on this journey some more. All right.

As we— and we'll have to do another entire podcast episode like I've already mentioned because we've got to wrap things up in a couple of minutes. Here's my last question for you, Pauline. What book have you gifted the most to other people And you have to, you have to exclude your own. So what book have you gifted the most to other people over the last couple of years and why?

Okay, so, um, I don't gift books, I gift notebooks. I gift beautiful, beautiful notebooks because the, um, the act of writing, um, the act of journaling, the physical versus putting it into our phones or digital It sparks an energetics in us. So my work is always the semantic work, the of of the words, of the verbiage. I'm very well versed in a whole lot of modalities, and so we teach first so that they can understand with their minds. And there's always the somatic work of the body, the breath, nature, writing, physical writing. It sparks an energetic in you. Your body says. Says, oh, I've written that down. The mind speaks to the body, the body speaks to the mind, and then it goes into activation, it goes into strive mode. So it's very important to actually write things down with pen and paper or even with paintbrush. Um, so my work is always the semantic, the somatic, and of course the soulmatic— of the soul, of the spirit. That's when the shamanism comes in, that's when the activations and the meditations come in. And so I don't give books away, I give notebooks away, whether they be leather-bound, whether they be patterned, whether they have, um, this very tactile somatic feel to them. Uh, and because, you know, again, the whole, um, standing in your power, sovereign, evolving, manifesting— that's why I give away notebooks.

Yeah, that's amazing. Thank you.

And of course, The Way of the Spiritual Entrepreneur.

Yes, there it is. All right, I have 2 final questions. The first is, where can people go to find out a little bit more about you, to get more involved in the work you're doing, and to find out about your books and courses and etc.?

Oh, amazing. Um, of course, um, my website. Um, I'm on Instagram and LinkedIn. I, um, please do subscribe and, and follow the work that I do because I am launching a brand new course, um, next year called Numinous. Uh, I've been teaching this particular course live for so many years. I, I travel the world and I'm, I'm an international keynote speaker, and so the, um, the call was for those who couldn't, uh, be on live with my time zone. And people were, you know, from Africa and all over the world going, oh, it's 2 AM, this is intense, can you create something online? And so Numinous is going to be a lot of my, um, teachings online as well as the live shamanic activations as well, which gathers it all together and activates in your body so that you get to where you want to go faster. So do follow me and stay tuned. It's going to be awesome.

Amazing. Yeah, and we'll definitely link all that in the show notes below.

The course is called Numinous Transformational Growth Strategies for the Spiritual Entrepreneur.

Wonderful. Well, thank you. And then this is my final, final question, and that's this. If you pass away and all the stuff that you put out there, the books, courses, speaking, Engagements, YouTube, all of it goes away. But you can leave the world with a single piece of advice. What would it be?

Choose thoughts that create more joy. Choose thoughts that create more joy. Choose thoughts that create more joy.

It's beautiful. I'm going to be chanting that the rest of the day. I appreciate it. Well, thank you for your time, your wisdom, your energy. This has been absolutely amazing. I've enjoyed this so much. I can't wait to have you back for another episode. Thank you so.

Thank you so much.

That is a wrap. Thank you so much for listening to today's episode of Book Thinkers Life-Changing Books. It would mean the world to us if you could write a review and share this episode with a few of your friends. I mean, these books truly have the power to change people's lives, and by reviewing or sharing our podcast, you're helping us make an impact. If you have any recommendations for future guests or any constructive feedback for us on how we can improve our show, please feel free to submit a form on our website, www.bookthinkers.com, or send us a direct message on Instagram @bookthinkers. With that, I am signing off, and I hope you have a wonderful day. Don't forget, go read something.