Finding Energy for Your Business Amidst Chronic Illness With Diane DeJesus

I am so excited for you all to join me for this episode with my client, Diane de Jesus. We are talking about her journey from dealing with and healing through PMDD. And when I say healing, like, you guys know I don't mean like we are healed, like I don't not have endometriosis anymore, I don't not have fibromyalgia, but feeling more whole living with our chronic illnesses so that they don't stop us from creating what we want to create. So in this episode, I get to talk with our client. You get to hear how she has been able to bring alignment into her life and in her business through working with me as a coach and using one of her favorite tools that she loves helping her clients with, which is mindfulness. We talk about how she has been influenced in her life personally and professionally and deciding where she wants to go and what she wants to do when it comes to living with her chronic illness and how different aspects of trauma and PTSD and things like that have affected her circumstances and how she made the decision to support others living with PMDD. The thing I really want you to pay attention to is that none of my clients, and specifically in this episode you will hear, are perfect. These are not clients that don't still have flare-ups and challenges and things going on with their life. What they do have is support, and they do have people, and me more specifically, helping them to design the type of business that serves their life. Diane will share with you in this episode how she has moved and been traveling, taking care of a son, taking care of her own family and her husband, all while dealing with the ebbs and ups and downs with her chronic illnesses, while still being able to launch a podcast within 30— I think it was in like 90 days— being able to get asked to speak on a world stage talking about her expertise and her niche, and now serving others even more in her, her own business, as well as sharing her knowledge with other communities. So much has happened, and this can happen to you too. So many of you already know, like, you already know— this is something I hear from all of my clients— you are like, I already know I want to work with you, but I'm waiting for the perfect time. I'm also waiting for my situation to feel better. And I challenge you to listen to this episode with ears and hearts open so you can see that it's not gonna be a perfect time ever to invest in working with a coach. But if you want to get to the next step, even while dealing with what you've got going on and feeling more empowered to do so, feeling okay with taking a break and still creating results, then you want to stay tuned and listen to how Diane and I have been working together and how this can help you too. Also, you'll get some tools and tips just from Diane's own personal experience of living with her own chronic illness and how she's been able to navigate that from her own journey. So stay tuned. Welcome to Crafted to Thrive, the globally ranked podcast for entrepreneurs living with chronic illness. I'm your host, Nikita Williams, and after being diagnosed with multiple chronic illnesses myself, I figured out the surprisingly simple missing links to growing a profitable business without compromising my health. Since then, I've helped dozens of women just like you learn how to do the same. If you're ready to own your story and create a thriving business that aligns with your health and wellbeing, you're in the right place. Together, we're shifting the narrative of what's possible for entrepreneurs with chronic illness. This is Crafted to Thrive. I am so excited to have Diane, my client and just awesome woman. She amazes me in so many different ways. She does not even know. But anyway, I am so excited that you're here. Please tell us who you are and what you do.

Oh my goodness. Thank you so much. Well, first of all, thank you for having me. This is so exciting. Yeah, my name's Diane de Jesus. Well, I'm currently living in Austin, Texas, but I'm originally from New York and spent several years living in London. And I am currently a mindfulness teacher specifically for people living with PMDD, which is premenstrual dysphoric disorder.

Yeah, and I am excited because your journey of us working together has been One of the most interesting ones when it comes to alignment. Every time I think of you and I think about your journey, like in our coaching container and like getting to know you, I have just— I feel like it kind of reflects a bit of my journey of entrepreneurship and life, of like the intentionality of alignment. And you literally, literally, it happened for you in a way that it happened for me. So before I— I don't want to tell the story because it's your story, but when we— now She's like, wait, what are you talking about?

What do you mean?

So when you first came into my world, I think you had an idea of what you thought you wanted to be doing with what you currently had already known and all of that stuff. So tell us a little bit about your background, like your history in your career and your profession.

Oh, sure. Well, so way back in my professional history, I was working in marketing, marketing and media planning. And somewhere along the way, I realized that I was looking for more of— and actually, this was my first inkling that I was looking for alignment. I was looking for more of an alignment between the things that were important to me and my work. And so now I realize that that's more of a, you know, a values alignment that I was looking for. At the time, I didn't quite understand. It was just kind of a feeling that I was going with.

Yeah.

And so what I did was I went back to school to study nutrition, to become a dietitian because sort of like preventative health was really important to me. I was really into nutrition and dietetics just as me, like that was the thing I was fascinated by. Yeah. And so I decided to go back to school. I continued on in the marketing industry while I did that, went to school at night. Eventually went full time to do my dietetic internship, which is something that you have. You can, you know, take your exam to become a dietitian. And I started working as a dietitian, but in within the marketing space.

Okay.

It was a really, really cool for me hybrid of still being in the marketing space, but doing it as sort of someone who was the specialist within a particular area, really like an educator and a translator, like translating the science to the general public. Yeah, kind of like the nutrition properties and health benefits of certain food brands. Okay. Yeah. So I moved to London and I'm still doing that. And after a couple of years, I have my son. I have a 6-year-old son, and, um, with the birth of my son, I developed PTSD first, and I went into therapy for that after, after a while, and the therapy was working really well. And then about a year into that, I realized like all of a sudden it wasn't working the way it was. It was kind of strange. Symptoms would come up that I was like completely powerless against. Like all the tools in the toolbox were just not working. And I discovered, and then it was confirmed by a doctor, that I had PMDD, which is a condition where in the simplest terms, your brain just sort of hyperreacts to the normal hormonal shifts of the menstrual cycle. So like everything's going along like normal in the menstrual cycle, but your brain can't handle it and just has crazy responses. And, you know, it comes with really debilitating physical symptoms, you know, psychological and emotional symptoms, and then even cognitive symptoms, which can make it really hard to work or to learn or to process information. And so, as you can imagine, that can create a lot of challenges for someone who has PMDD and is trying to live a normal life, going to work every day, interacting with people, you know, and having to like kind of, you know, ask their brain to do what they want it to do when they want it. And the brain's just not responding.

Yeah.

So for me, it was a ton of brain fog, inability to access information that I knew I had in there, even like difficulty reading. You know, I'd be like, I'm reading, I'm looking at the words and I just can't process what I'm seeing. Some people have like speech issues. They may get like slurred speech or just can't find the words to articulate what they're trying to say.

Yeah.

And I continued working in the way I was working while living with PMDD for a while. But oh my God, it was a constant source of like, even it like exacerbated all my symptoms. It was like a constant source of like even more anxiety.

Yes.

More panic attacks, even more stress, even more self-doubt, and then self-loathing. Because what would happen is I would get a request for a particular job, and instantly I'd panic. I'd have like a panic attack, you know, like I'm, I'm playing all cool, and I'm like, yeah, that's great, and like the timeline sounds great, and then yeah, oh God, How am I going to do this?

Yes. Yeah. Yeah.

Am I going to be able to make it on time? How am I going to feel? Like, you know, it's my bad time. I don't know if I can do it. Yeah. And this was a constant, never-ending cycle because I would be in these symptoms for up to 2 weeks every month. It was inevitable that there were going to be times where I'm going to have to work and I'm going to feel like I have zero capacity for it. I'm completely incapable of work. But what else am I going to do?

Yeah.

And I kind of chugged along like that for a bit.

Yeah. It was like the acceptance, like what I call it, of it's like the numbing acceptance. It's not true acceptance. It's just like the impossible— I don't even know what the word is. I know what you're saying. Like, I have been there where it's like you're in this defeated there it is, is the defeated acceptance where you're like, well, my life is going to suck, and this is going to suck, and this is what it is, and I don't— there's nothing I can do to change it, right? Like, yeah, just got to operate like this.

Yes. Like, resigned to the fact, yes, that this is what I've got to do.

Mm-hmm.

There can't be— this is just what it is. There cannot be any other way around this, right?

Yeah, totally have been there. Totally have been there. Totally.

Yeah. And because it's not true acceptance, and because you're in a cycle of all these painful, challenging emotions, you're stuck having to reconfront all of that over and over again.

Yeah. It's like getting slapped over and over again when you know you're going to get slapped. It's like the worst. It's the worst feeling. And then, like, at the same time, you're bracing for the slap because you know it's going to happen. You're not even— you're not even trying to move out of the way of the slap. You just are like in the slap. Like, it's happening. It's happening. Like, I totally know that feeling. Yes, absolutely. 100% get you. Yep. I'm right with you.

For the slap.

Yeah.

100%.

Yeah. You know it's coming. You know you could bob and weave technically, but you're like, why? Why would I do that? It's just going to be more complicated. Like, no. I'm just going to stay here, right? Yes.

Yeah. So I, I did that for a while. I'm not sure how I pulled that off, but I did that for a while. And then I started to think, actually, prior to, prior to that, prior to like where I really started to approach trying to find alignment again, I did have some success with some symptoms with the help of my dietitian. And so at that time, I remember feeling a little better for a brief period of time and suddenly thinking I was just going to dive back into all the things and it was going to be great. Problem solved. It's over. Done. I did that PMDD thing for a while. Moving on.

That didn't hap— I mean, it happened, but like, I'm over it now. Totally.

I briefly went searching for roles locally where I live now that were in the space of dietetics or lactation consulting. Because when I was in London, I had also worked with a, a mostly volunteer-based organization for breastfeeding support. And while I was still living in London, I went through all the steps to become a lactation lactation consultant. So here I am, I'm thinking I've got some symptom, some relief from symptoms, and I'm going to try to get back there and like just work, work in that, work in that way. And like in kind of the— I keep saying like the traditional sense, but that's not what I mean. But you know what I mean? Like going out, going out to a place.

Yeah.

Here's my job. And I very quickly realized that wasn't going to work because there were so many elements I would come across with different job opportunities that I realized, oh well, even though I'm feeling a bit better, I don't think I have the capacity to handle that, or my cycle is going to keep coming back around and most certainly there's going to be like a conflict as far as timing with things I need to do, or if I've got to be sort of like on call or as needed, you know, and So at this time, I decide, okay, I'm going to look into working for myself again, which I had dabbled with quite a lot over the years on the side of my regular work. And I went looking to see if there were any resources out there for starting your own business or growing your own business when you've got a chronic illness. And it was mostly like a barren desert.

It was. It still kind of is. I'm over here still in the corner like, I'm here, I'm here.

Seriously. I mean, you know, there was like a blog post here of, I don't know, maybe one podcast interview there. You know what I mean? Like such a dearth of really good resources.

Yeah.

And then I found a workshop you had been doing on Facebook. I started looking into, I think at like your website and things and maybe like interviews you've done on other podcasts and things. And just was really drawn to your work. And we had a call together. And I remember I was laughing earlier when I said, oh, I thought, oh, this is over. I'm going to jump back in because I remember early on in our work together, you said, remind me, how long ago was this that you killed that? And I'm like, oh, I don't know, 2, 3 months.

Baby.

And, and your point was I really didn't sit in that time at all to really kind of recalibrate and reassess and really see how I was feeling and really think about what I needed next. Yeah. And so early on, yes, I came to with one sense of what I wanted to do. And as we worked together, that began to, to evolve.

Yeah.

And transition. Because every time we work together, even as we followed the path of kind of trying to get to that first idea.

Yeah.

Idea. Yeah. Every time I would step away with a better and clearer sense of what I really wanted and really needed. And ultimately what I discovered was that at least right now, what I needed is what I've been calling for myself recently, radical alignment.

Yeah, I remember that Voxer message when you were like, I have finally come to the acceptance. And I was like, whoop, okay, we are aligning this whole heck out of everything now. Yeah.

Yes. And to your point, yes, that was right before that. I started to re— what happened was I started to realize that no matter how many tools I've got in my toolbox, no matter how many skills I've learned, no matter how much symptom relief I find at any point in time, life's going to keep moving and changing. Kind of all the different pieces that I'm working with are going to keep kind of changing and moving around. My body's going to respond. I'm still going to come up against times that are really, really difficult and challenging. So, okay, then how can I work with that? And just before that moment of like, I'm going to have protocol alignment, I decided, okay, Actually, I think I need to stop more things to do to, and instead focus on my mindset. And I think I got to that point because for a long time I had been using mindfulness and developing my mindfulness practice as one way of managing through my experience of PMDD.

Mm-hmm.

And then. I had the really pleasant surprise and good fortune of having multiple people that I was working with actually sort of, from my perspective, almost folding in this mindfulness also for me and work together. So there was you, there was my dietitian, there was my therapist. And I realized, yeah, it's not— it's no more about like the supplements and the walks and the vegetables and now it's time to work on like really accepting where I am, whatever that means, and like going with that instead of fighting it. And I thought it's gonna be like a pro— like more of a process. The crazy like moment of realization for me was like the second I said it out loud, like, I'm gonna accept this, it was like a light switch.

Yep.

It changed everything.

Everything instantly.

Yeah, I was shocked.

It is amazing how that works. Yeah.

And so from then I decided, yeah, I accept it. I'm going to like lean in all the way. And what for me, what that meant was what I wanted and needed was just to align my life so that— and we've talked about this many times before— so that I didn't feel like my energy had to like be separated into all these different silos.

Yeah.

Because for me, that was the biggest struggle, feeling like I had to shift, shift my focus and shift my energy all the time. That was very exhausting and depleting.

Mm-hmm.

For me, the way I came to bringing everything into alignment was realizing that I wanted to share this wonderful thing that I had discovered of how to apply mindfulness to PMDD. To live better with PMDD, to navigate all of the psychological and emotional and physical symptoms that we experience. And then on my end, it meant that also I get to just live my life as I'm living it, and that informs my work.

Yeah.

And then my work— and then I get to benefit from my own work.

Yeah. And it's, it's so cool how you did that, Diane. It was so I felt like— so going back to where I was saying in the beginning, I felt like this must have what it looked like from the outside when I went through this process. Because literally, I had— like, even you talking about it right now, I remember my friend saying, was like, literally saying what you just said. It seemed like it was just like a light switch when you decided that you're going to, like, coach people with chronic illness. Like, it just kind of— the way you showed up, the way you talked about things, the way everything just felt so much easier. And we were like, what is she doing? And it was like, I think it was only because she decided. And that's the hugest thing with acceptance to me. It's actually an actual decision versus what we were talking about before, which is not really a decision. We kind of felt like we were pushed into making that choice of like, I'm going to get slapped. OK, great. Like, I can't change anything versus like, yeah, I'm going to get slapped. I'm going to bob and weave, right? Like, I'm going to figure some ways out of like not always it just gets smacked in the face. Like, there's a better way. Maybe this— the slap has a glove on it, it doesn't hurt as bad. Like, I don't know, but it's gonna be different. I'm deciding now, right? And I think that's what you're saying, is like realizing like this is here and that's okay. First, that's okay. And I also enjoy like when I've seen you like one of the challenges I feel like you kind of really work through is like the feeling of picking up, starting over, picking up and starting over. And it's a mindset of like, it's never starting over.

100%. I absolutely— yeah, I think especially because I made so many, or what felt like so many transitions in my work time, even as I always grew closer and closer to feeling like I was finding alignment. I was honoring my values. There was always a part of me that felt like, oh no, but now you're abandoning or giving up on that last thing you did. Now also you're starting fresh from scratch.

Like, literally from scratch. And I'd be like, you're not starting from scratch. I promise you, you like have so much more momentum than you give yourself credit for. Just because you decide to pivot, just because you decide to really grow through what you went through, doesn't mean you're starting over. Like, I think about it— I've been getting into plants recently because we have to plant our flower bed this— in the front of our house. And I learned something, and I was like, this is so fascinating. So certain plants have like these bulbs in the instead of like the root system, they're more like bulbs. And so if you slice them in the right way, you can literally just take that bulb and like plant it and it becomes its own plant. So you didn't start over even though it's in a completely different area of a different place. It needed that bulb from the center of all those things. And it's the same thing I think for most of us is that we have to kind of go through all of these different seasons of discovering, of growing, so that when we're ready to be planted into this new place, we can thrive even more so, right? And so that's what I have been seeing with you is just seeing this beautiful alignment of self-compassion and love and grace with, yeah, I'm flowing through this. I don't feel like I'm starting over. I need to prove anything to anyone. I'm just doing what feels good for me right now in this season. And I'm OK if that might change later, but this is where I'm at today. Right?

Yes, 100%. And now these days I totally see how it's not starting from scratch. I see it all the time now. For example, like in the various trainings that I did when I was doing lactation support, I learned a great deal of counseling skills and how, you know, how to just be in front of someone who's asking for your help. And, and that's such a skill that can be translated to, gosh, so many areas, like every area of life. I wouldn't have had that without, you know, going through that, that process of being like a breastfeeding peer support person. There's many other ways that I've, I've you know, now been reflecting on, and I can see the connection. It's not like, oh, I did that, and now that I want to do this thing, all that time is just wasted time. Yeah, like, not at all.

Yeah, yeah, exactly.

It all got me to where I am now. Even now, even now with, um, launching my podcast, there's so much that I've been, uh, having to, having to learn about in terms of the tech stuff. But back when I was becoming a dietitian, this was like 2007, 2009, so a lot of social media was just kicking off. Like, I remember a friend, you know, we're on like a van from one hospital to another, and she's like telling me about this thing called Instagram. Pinterest, but I don't know how you pronounce it. P-interest? What is it? You know, like, like it's just coming out.

Yeah, I remember. I remember those days. Yes.

And I remember, like, in my dietetics classes, we were being told, like, what— no matter what it is you want to do, no matter what direction you want to go in, you need to start a blog. And, you know, and I'm like, starting a blog? Okay, fine. And then later on, I'm creating my own website and I'm trying to do it all myself. Step by step, and I'm reading articles and I'm watching YouTube to like learn how to do it. And now as I'm going through all these like techie learning curves again, as I get my podcast going, there's a comfort level with dealing with those challenges because I know that like, yeah, I'll figure it out, I'll find the programs, I'll learn, it's fine. Yeah, it's not so stressful.

Yeah, yeah, you're so right. I also feel like also as chronic illness warriors in general, I always personally, and this is also what I think I try to instill when I'm coaching with you all, I'm like, y'all are already like really good at hard stuff. Like you're already really good at figuring out even in the recognition, like even in the the not so good mindset of living with chronic illness, like in the context of like, I'm just going to be here, right? Even in that mind thought, we're extremely creative in how we find the time and energy to do anything else other than sit in bed and being in pain. And so I truly feel like because a lot of times we're beating ourselves up about our enable-ness, like the feeling of being disabled or actually being disabled, we beat ourselves up from that, that we lose sight of our ability to see what we have accomplished, even in all of this pain, even in all of this uncertainty, don't know what's happening-ness. And so I guess one of the questions I was gonna ask you when you were talking earlier is just like, What has been something, now that you're looking kind of back— and not to say that we aren't ever going to go back into the dark cloud, because it happens, y'all. I'm just saying it happens. What has been the biggest mindset shift or aha in regards to your capacity to do something?

The biggest mindset shift or aha in in terms of my capacity. Yeah, I think it's just realizing that if one, if it's something that's true to me, that's really something that I really want, that's one of my values, not something that I'm being pushed, feeling pushed to do.

Exactly.

The capacity is there, and then it's just kind of being like aware of where I'm at in any given moment, one, and being like okay with that, you know, and being like kind to myself about it.

Yeah.

I feel like, for example, maybe my energy is low or like symptoms are really bad and realizing that there's always something I can do that's getting me closer to that goal.

Yeah.

Just may not look Yeah, how maybe I originally thought it should look.

Yeah.

Um, so maybe I work a little bit differently. Maybe I do a little bit less. Maybe I don't do, for example, um, writing a podcast script or recording on days when I've got like crazy cognitive— yeah, going on, because I know that's just going to be harder anyway. Yeah, brain that's not like fully online, you know, like it's just like, why? It's—

yeah, you're not gonna sit there. I think what happens is you're not going to sit there and try to force yourself to do it then because that's what you think you should do.

Yes. So one thing you always say is like, in different ways, you kind of always encourage me to think about like, what's the easiest way to do this? Or, um, I just lost it, but the idea is like, how can we make it happen but just change our view around the way to get it done?

Yeah.

Does it happen in a more elongated timeline? Do we take our time? Does it happen in smaller bits? Do we think about, like, ultimately what— like, if you look at the objective, I think a lot of what we do together is like, what's the, what's the objective of the thing we're talking about? Because I can get caught up in the details and the frills.

Yes, we all do. We all do.

Or like, I'm gonna use this program platform, and you're like, okay, what's the easiest way?

Wait, how can we simplify this? Yes.

Because then what happens is like all of a sudden, before I know it, I am more quickly than I thought I could go, you know, getting those things done that I wanted to do. And so now I can keep progressing and keep feeling that momentum, keep feeling good about myself while still having the time to do whatever I need for myself, whether it's taking a nap or taking a day off or whatever. Yeah. So it's really just like shifting the perspective.

Yeah.

How can we look at this differently to still get this done without, like, getting in my own way? Yeah. Making things harder for myself.

Yeah. And I will say, I like to say this often on the show. It's not our fault, quote unquote, because we live in a society in general that has a very— we have societal norms that we're constantly being told that what something should look like while it's being done or being able to accomplish things. And to your point, from the very beginning, it's like nobody is like sitting over here except for me and now all of my clients who I feel like are like the advocates of the world on growing a business with chronic illness. Like no one's saying like, Oh, by the way, if you want to launch a podcast and you have a chronic illness, it might look different than what I'm telling you right now, right? Like, no one is saying that. Like, not many people. Or even if it's not a podcast, maybe it's a blog post, maybe it's just your business in general. No, you don't want to show up on social media every day because half the time you're in bed. Okay, that's okay. So I think for, for what I'm hearing from you is that was giving yourself the permission to find what's easy.

Yeah, giving myself to find what's easy. But also, like, to your point of how we're so conditioned by the world around us, the other big element for me was like getting clear on what I actually wanted. Yeah, versus all the noise in my head that I thought was my voice, but it was like so many voices that I've heard my whole life.

Yeah, yeah.

And I maybe didn't even realize that I didn't have or was searching for that clarity.

Most of you all don't. Yeah, that's a constant, constant reminder I'm hearing from all of y'all.

Yeah, we like we just go through life on autopilot, following the path or the steps that have been like laid out for us that we think we're supposed to take. And, um, yeah, that like for me, that was another big thing was kind of realizing that I need to just stop first and take a moment to get in tune with what actually it is that I want for myself.

Yeah. And I like to say, too, is we have so many voices in our heads, all of these different voices from different people. And oftentimes, we have chosen to listen to them without actually choosing to listen to them. It becomes just what we do because everyone has said it. And so often, when I'm asking questions, is probably Part of the biggest thing that I do with everyone is ask a lot of questions. Like, do you really— so what is it that you— and y'all, like, always look at me a little like, oh, Nikita's asking me another question sometimes. And I'm like, I love you. This is why I'm asking you a question, because we make decisions so instantaneously, right? And to the point about mindfulness, to me, mindfulness is not just we need to be— we need to learn how to teach ourselves to think about the decisions that's feeling good within our conscience, our body, so that we can actually do the action that follows behind that, right? And so in the world, we're constantly being bombarded with the decisions that people tell us we're supposed to do, right, versus the other way around. And like, here's the information. What would you like to do? The A, B, and C, or the open-ended question of like, here's the paragraph bar, now write it out. Like, what do you want to answer? And so the thing I wanted to ask you about, because I think one piece that I find for most of us when we're going through this is the need for asking for help. It's such a hard thing to do. And this is not just in business, like, this is like life as chronic illness warriors. I feel like there's a stigma in our own heads that if we're already feeling like a burden, we're already feeling like we are needing to prove ourselves. So our ability to say, hey, actually, I need help, or I need to ask for assistance, can seem like such a defeat. Yeah, right?

For sure.

How have you, in this journey and working with me, has that changed? That mindset on that belief changed, or has that been something you're working on consistently, like, oh, like more intentionally? Oh, for sure.

I definitely, for a long time, thought it was all down to me. To figure out how to get all the things done and make all the things work all up. And gosh, I guess in some ways, like up to a certain point, that could work, right? Like it got me through a certain time, it got me through like that, um, kind of like in the survival phase.

Yep.

So for example, like at one of my worst times, we had just moved to Austin. My son would have been 4, 5. He's starting in a new preschool and we moved to Austin for, for a new job that my husband was starting. And so he's got the demands of that. And so it fell on me to kind of like set up our home here. However, the stress of moving and making an international move and doing it with a preschooler actually made all my symptoms about a gajillion times worse.

Yeah, I can only imagine. Like any normal— like, yeah, any able-bodied person is like, moving is a feat in itself, but across country and then add a child and then add like— oh my gosh.

Yeah, it was dreadful. And I got to one of my worst periods you know, probably way in the beginning before I had a diagnosis. And so, yeah, I had all these tricks because I thought I had to do everything myself. So I had all these tricks where I was like, I came up with this thing where like, if I can just get through these 3 tasks every day, I can get through the day. Like, you know, empty the dishwasher, do something related to laundry, and like make the bed. Because like that had a trickle-down effect of helping me keep the place tidy, of helping me get out of bed. Yada yada. But what I realized, when even as I started to feel better enough to start exploring how I could work differently, that was no longer going to be enough. Because even as I was feeling better, I was trying to add something now in my life, and it was just too much. To juggle.

And I—

yes, I was very like staunchly defiant for a while. Like, no, I'm just going to keep doing it this way. I'll figure it out.

Yeah, yeah. I'm surviving. I'm fine.

I'm going to do it. It's all good. I'll figure out how to make it work. And actually what happened was clearly it was evident to everyone but me because— because you and my dietitian and my therapist and who the heck knows who else started to kind of drop these hints like, do you— are there any areas where you feel that perhaps you benefit from some help, that you'd like some help, that you'd like to get some help? And, um, yeah, for a long time I, I was so against it, but the more and more I heard it and like leaned into the fact that if I'm hearing this message over and over, it must be for a reason. I, I realized, okay, yeah, maybe this is something I need to try because I felt like ultimately it was limiting. I was limiting myself to keep trying to put my head down and like forge ahead doing everything myself.

That part. Yes. Anyone listening?

Yeah, that part. Yeah, I was limiting myself. I was trying to like be the mom, take care of the home, start the business, take care of my health. You know, I've got this chronic condition that comes back around like clockwork every month, but I'm just going to keep doing it myself. And I realized, well, that's not going to work because I'm not going to be able to expand in any areas that I want to expand because I'm already like overcapacity.

Yeah.

And so, yeah, I leaned in and I Leaning into help is certainly going to look vastly different from person to person.

Yes, absolutely.

We don't have family anywhere near us, so I ended up looking into like afterschool childcare for my son, you know, getting, getting help around the house, but also like Leaning into the good friends that we've made out of our neighbors here. Yeah, that probably would have been the hardest one if I hadn't started learning that lesson back in London where we all also didn't have any family. Um, because it's not like me going to a service for help, it's me opening up myself to another human being, being vulnerable. Yeah, right. And accepting help or asking.

Mm-hmm.

But that's been so helpful. We're so fortunate to have on either side of us people who have children the same age.

Mm-hmm.

And so from the moment we got here, I've been more and more over time just kind of being really open about my challenges with my PMDD and with not having, you know, family around and Yeah, now I'm at a point where I'm happy for him to go, my son to go eat somewhere else or go, you know, they can hang out with him for a couple of hours or something. But that was really hard to lean into quite to the extent that I do now.

Yeah.

Initially.

And I personally, being on the other side of seeing it, it feels— you feel lighter experiencing it. Even when it's like, I'm going to need to ask for more support, it's not like the mindset of like, I'm going to need to ask for help, but I'm really going to hate when I do this. Like, it's like, I'm so thankful that I get to ask for help. Like, it's a completely different embodiment of that, right? And that energy in itself is draining when you are asking for help, but you're dreading it and you're hating it and you're feeling like this is not— like, it means so much about me in a negative sense versus like, I'm just human. Like this is a human thing.

Totally. That's the change. That's the change. Because, yeah, obviously there have been times in life where ultimately I've had to ask for help, but I did it so, like, resentfully and with so much self-loathing.

Yeah.

And then back when we were in London, there were two people who, like, really taught me how to just allow myself to have a community.

Yes.

And let people help me if they're offering.

Mm-hmm.

You know, let them extend their kindness to me if I'm struggling. And one, I don't know if I ever told her this, and now you've just prompted me to go, I'm gonna tell her this, cuz I firmly believe like in telling people how they've affected you.

Yes, me too.

So one was our, our neighbor. In London. My— I was with— between PTSD and PMDD, I often was very, um, had a great deal of social anxiety and, um, just panic and discomfort around like any interactions with others. And, um, this person who lived next door to us, she was always so kind, always extending herself, always engaging with me. Oh, and like, and I was like, how is she still being so nice? I'm so awkward. Like, I'm so like, I know that I can feel the wall that I'm hitting.

Like, I can feel me. How does she not feel this? Yes. Oh my goodness. Yeah.

But she was always there and it was so good and so helpful. And then, oh gosh, my very, very, very good friend in London, I, we just had a text about this yesterday, this morning, because she said that she had started listening to my podcast and she wasn't quite aware with how much I had been dealing with and that she kind of wished that she had been a better friend. And I said, oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, stop right there.

Oh, wow.

Because she was the greatest person I could ever have had in my life at that period. In my life because asking for help was the last thing I ever, ever would have considered. But one, she always made me feel okay to be myself around her despite how awkward I felt with all my crazy symptoms. And two, she was always extending help no matter how many times I said no, or no matter how many times I said Fine. She was always extending her help. And it's not like she didn't have anything to do. She's got 3 kids of her own.

Yeah.

She's out there helping other people as well. We met through the breastfeeding support that we were doing, but Jess was always there. And through them, I really learned to, like, community. Go ahead and accept that community.

Yeah.

Find that community. Make it if you have to make it. Accept it if someone's offering it. But it really just, like you said, makes things so much lighter. Like, my mood is so much lighter accepting the help.

So you were talking— while you were talking, all I could— what I was hearing, and it's such a— something that's been coming up recently, even in my own journaling and coaching and my own stuff, is that there's such a difference between surviving and choosing to thrive. Not thriving— like, you know, we always say, oh, you can thrive. Like, it sounds so like— Yes, my show is called Crafted to Thrive, but I feel like crafted— there's a reason why I use the word crafted is because it is literally being a decision, like a molding into the thriving. Like, you are not just thriving. Like, you have to one, accept and see how you have been molded to thrive. And in our lives, when we're spending so much time surviving, so the things we probably needed at the time, like you were sharing, like needing community and needing all these things. It wasn't that you were choosing them. They needed to happen for you to survive. But now that you've kind of had a different mindset shift, even for myself, when I choose to do something to give me help or to help me expand or grow or whatever, I see that I'm choosing to thrive. I see that choosing to have what is good, what is joyful, what it's— all of those beautiful things, which is very different than I have to sleep because I literally am about to die versus I'm going to rest today because I know and I feel like I need rest. It's completely different.

Yes. My brain is exploding right now with like—

Yeah, I'm just like, yeah, yeah, like, it's so different. And so I—

you're so right, right?

It's different. Like, it's not that these things aren't there. It's not like people were seeing us like on the side of our life hanging on and didn't— they chose to do something, right? They leaned into something. We went to the doctor because we had to go. Like, we, we did all these have tos, should haves, or need tos versus I'm choosing to. The choice to thrive is so much different than surviving. Like someone said to me recently about like really, they were really struggling beating themselves up about rest, right? And they're like, I already have to rest a lot anyway because I have my chronic illness. I have all these challenges. And I'm like, but what if you chose to rest? Rest? Like, it wasn't a have to. It wasn't a like, I gotta do this. What if it was I get to? I get to choose to rest right now. That mind chat of what you're having in your head will be like, you might have some— like, you might have some friction because you're so used to survival sleep. You're so used to like surviving your business. This is what I think is the difference between hustle and like holistically moving in your business is Hustle is like in that survivor fighter fight mode, right? Versus like to thrive or to have a sustainable holistic business is like, I'm gonna choose, I'm gonna lean into, I'm going to— like, it's a completely different vibe and it's a completely different capacity you give yourself when you make the choice. Yes, to thrive than just to survive.

Okay, I have a yes and for you. Oh, okay.

I'm ready.

All right. Yes. First of all, you just, like, blew my mind with the whole, like, choosing to thrive thing, because I think initially many of us think, like, thriving is something that just happens, and it doesn't necessarily just happen. And also, it's like, it's not like— I think we can feel like, oh, thriving is something that some people got lucky and it just happened.

Yes.

Or it just happened.

Yeah.

Lucky them. And however, often I think the thing I always like to kind of remember is that that transition from surviving to choosing to thrive, like, totally happens at different times for everyone.

Yeah.

In different ways. And it's such a stark difference in the mind when you're surviving and you're not quite in the place yet when you can choose to thrive.

Yep, absolutely.

And so there's a place for all of it.

Yeah.

In fact, it's probably— you probably have to go through those.

Yes, some of us.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, but yeah, I, I also agree with you that it's like it's a, it's a thing we can choose and then like take the meaningful steps and the meaningful action to work toward that, that part. And I think that the reason that so many times I'd be working with you and I'd feel like, oh my God, this is amazing, it's like I feel like I'm learning the same stuff here that I'm learning in my mindfulness practice, is because is in mindfulness, what we try to do is to slow down enough or like quiet ourselves enough to take a look at what we're experiencing. And you know, there's steps to that too, right? Like the first step is to kind of just see if we can identify what's there and what we're feeling. Right. And then see if we can accept it. Yeah. Not try to change it, not try to fix it. That's how I could go away.

Yeah.

And then if we can get to the next step, it's about like being curious about that. What— is there something we can— that we need that— yeah, ourselves. Yeah, be nicer to ourselves about it instead of being hard on ourselves. And I think that the way that I found that in our work together were those moments where you would like just pause and just be like, here's a question. You don't even have to answer it now. I'm gonna put it in the universe. You can journal about it when you're ready. You know, you could like ponder it later when you're ready.

When you're ready.

But like, it is something that you can choose at some point when you're ready to then look into what can I do? What can I give myself here? How can I like choose to thrive.

We're thinking too that we have to— we have to do something before we thrive. So what I mean by that is like we're often thinking, I have to have all these duckies in a row before I can choose to thrive. Yes, right. It's a— it's a very common thing. I have— I am guilty of this. I also hear oftentimes with my clients and just people like, well, I have to have all of these things in place in order to get to the place that I think I want to get to. And I always like, what if it's literally that you have decided that even though I'm in this place— and which is why I think people who decide to invest in coaching or decide to say yes to therapy are so courageous, because your brain is probably not 100% on board with you doing this, right? Because you're like, I should probably have all of these other things on deck before I ask or step into this world of like whatever. But that's the step of stepping into thriving. It's like doing it before you think you have all of it together, right? And that is— if you can find that little sliver of wherever you are in the process, whether you're surviving— or even if you feel like you have been choosing to thrive and you're stuck in some areas, like, where's that little step of courage? Or even if it's not courage, even if it's just hope— and hope to me is like everything— like, even if it's just hope that this one choice can help me get out of wherever the dark place that I'm choosing or I am in, whether choice or not, can lead to where you have more ability to choose. To thrive is the most impactful thing I think anyone can, like, wherever they are in that journey, do.

But yeah, because hope means possibility.

Absolutely.

Yeah. But I wanted to say, you mentioned, like, which I think is so common, the idea of, like— by the way, I think I have, like, a piece of lint in my eyelash, and that's what I keep trying to pull out. Um, you mentioned that so many of us kind of feel like we want to have all our ducks in a row before we can thrive, or we think that that's what you need to do, or that's how it works. And in fact, like, then there's this whole other group of us who actually— it, it happens when we hit rock bottom, because that's when we go, oh no, forget it, I'm not doing this anymore, I can't do this anymore, I won't do this anymore, there's gonna be a different way. Not even like, there must be a different way, there's just going to be a different way.

Right.

I'm going to do things differently now.

Yeah.

Right. And then you start slowly making changes in how you move through life.

Yeah.

And to get yourself closer.

Yeah.

To what you want to, you know, step into next.

Yeah. Yeah. So good. So I have one more question and then I'll ask you to tell us where we can find you because you can find everything about Diana on the on the show notes where you can listen to her podcast and all of that jazz. What is the thing you're most excited and grateful for in our coaching container together? Like, what has been like, if I had to do this again, this is exactly why I would do this again. If I was hesitant, I would tell myself this.

Oh, I love this question so much. I think the thing that I have loved the most, I've gotten the most value out of, that is like the reason I would do it again, is that, um, so much of our work together, because there's so much mindset work and it is so much about getting clear on what you want or doing things in the way that work for you, not for some idea of how we think we should to get things done. By extension, it's like, it's been like life therapy because we carry so much stuff through our whole lives that tend to hold us back through our whole lives. And it's just been, um, such a thing that I've been able to work through so many things way beyond my PMDD that came well before my PMDD that have helped me, um, feel clear on how I want to move forward in my business and my life. And I like feel so good about, like, I feel so good about the decisions I'm making. You know?

And you're having so much fun. Like, every time I hear you on Voxer, you're like, the— like, I feel like I'm talking to, like, a younger, excited version of you. You're like, and I— and I'm going to— and I'm just like, she's so excited about this. I love that you're having so much fun doing it. It's, like, amazing.

I'm giddy.

You are.

I send you these messages, and I know that I sound like this crazy giddy person. Like—

I love it, though. I love it. I love it. I love it. I so love it.

I just want to add something to what I just said, because not only like has it helped me get clear so far beyond just my business, but the one of the things that I think is so extraordinary about how you work, from at least from my experience, is never Not once have I ever felt judged, like the thing that I'm thinking is, you know, maybe not the best idea or whatever. It's made every, every, every call we've ever had, I get more and more and more comfortable sharing like the scariest ideas inside me that I don't want to verbalize, you know. Whether it's a goal or a thing I want to try, or I have this idea to do this, you know, like, and I start, I think I started like by telling you, like, because I've had this my whole life where I'll sit on something for so long, I can't get it out because I'm like, it's like the fear of like rejection, right? Or stupid or whatever it is. And I would tell you like, okay, I'm just going to say this thing. I'm going to put it out there because I'm kind of afraid to say it, but it's been in my head, so I have to get it out of my head. Yes, yes, these crazy things.

And I, you know, I'm thinking there's something crazy, but you're like bracing for it.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you're always receiving everything with like such kindness and such an open mind and such an open heart. Nothing's crazy. You can say anything crazy that would shock you, and you're always like, just, you know, me, why it's all normal that I feel this way, or you know, whatever it is. And so that just, you know, makes like the benefit I get out of our relationship like exponentially bigger because I feel so comfortable like sharing with you. So thank you.

Well, thank you for sharing that. I so receive that. I am so— ah, I try not to cry when I have these And if I don't cry on the call, then I go back later in the night and I'm like journaling how amazing it is and I'm bawling. Like, I'm straight up bawling. I appreciate you saying that because that's really the reason why I will be doing this for a long time because I didn't always experience that from coaches, especially living with chronic illness. I didn't always experience like that understanding that just that compassion of like, I'm not going to do it like how you think I should do it because you aren't in my body. And as women living with chronic illness, we're constantly told how like, oh, that's just in your head. Oh, you don't really experience that. Like, you're just overexaggerating. And I don't ever want to have the space like that with my clients to feel like that in their business that they're doing in order to support their lives. And like, they have these dreams. And so I hope that I'm like offering suggestions or offerings of how you could do something. But if you have an idea, I'm not going to like knock you down. I might share my real thoughts about the idea, but I am hoping to create that space that you are sharing. So I appreciate you sharing that with me. And I hope anyone who's listening who feels unseen or unheard in whatever container that they're in, that know you have the right to feel seen and heard and have this experience. Of being like feeling safe, really. To me, that's— I can't ever make a client feel safe, but I can create the room to allow you to access your safety, right?

Yeah, I think that's all any of us ever want is just to feel seen and heard so that we can feel validated, so we can feel like safe in being ourselves. Yeah, so yeah, I certainly feel that with you.

Well, thank you. And you guys will feel that with her too, I'm pretty sure, because she's amazing and I feel safe being her coach. Like, I wouldn't continue being like, hey girl, let's keep going with this party, if I was like, no, no, honey, you did good, but bye now. No, we're— that's like, we've been amazing. I've been— it's been amazing to work with you. So listen to her podcast, everyone. Her podcast is like like such a soothing vibe. It's so good. Can you tell us a little bit about your podcast and what you're looking forward to in your business, and we'll hop on out of here?

Yes. So the podcast is called Mindfulness for PMDD with Diane. Um, it's currently, I would say, almost everywhere you would get your podcast.

We're working on it, we're working on it.

There's really just two places, probably, you know, very soon. Uh, it'll also be up on— I think it was Google Podcasts and Alexa were two of the places that, um, it wasn't quite up yet. Um, otherwise, you know, you can get it on Apple Podcasts and Spotify and iHeartRadio and all that good stuff. The podcast is where I explore how I have come to apply mindfulness practice to PMDD initially it was to get through that survival phase. So it was like one of my tools in my toolbox, but eventually get to this place of more peace and acceptance that, you know, we've alluded to a little bit in this conversation today.

Yeah.

So it's something that has made such a big impact in my life that I realized I wanted to start to share with other people with PMDD. Because one thing, even though mindfulness was such a help for me in my PMDD journey, one thing that was always missing for me was feeling like what we just said, that I was seen and heard in my own PMDD experience.

Yeah.

You know, as opposed to trying to kind of apply these general concepts and, you know, things to, to my PMDD. So I, I went through this process of figuring out all these different ways that I can make it work for me, even when I'm feeling really crappy and like I can't sit down and do a long 10 or 30 minute meditation. I found many ways to incorporate mindfulness into my life to the point that it allowed me to open up to acceptance. And so that's what I explore in the podcast. And I also get really practical, like with guided meditations and mindfulness exercises and things like that. I chat with people who have specific expertise, including Nikita Williams. Yes. Yeah. About specific topics that I kind of call like mindfulness adjacent. So Nikita and I talked about how I have found mindfulness applied to exploring entrepreneurship as a person with chronic illness. But for example, I also have an interview with my own dietitian and we discuss nutrition and she's like a functional medicine specialist, but she even incorporates mindfulness into what she does. And I found that to be super beneficial to me. But also things like parenting, you know, work in general and just lots of other issues that you may not like at the— on the surface.

Right.

The connection.

If you're a person who lives with PMDD or pretty much any chronic illness, you will benefit from listening to Diane's podcast because it is putting the mindfulness journey in all of the aspects of our lives. Because, you know, one of my biggest things is business is personal. We cannot operate our lives in silos like we are operating in these businesses. So what is going on in our life oftentimes leads into all these other areas of all aspects of our lives. So knowing how to cultivate a skill of being really intentional and in alignment and mindful of what's going on in your body can only make the rest of everything else in your life go better.

Exactly. I can't just talk about mindfulness in PMDD as like the silo of PMDD because PMDD is affecting every part of our lives.

Yes.

So then how can we apply that to all these different parts of our lives that are being impacted by PMDD?

Yeah.

And then the part I'm looking forward to in my business is that I will be starting a membership group that really has a lot more one-on-one engagement with me. And follow-up because another really big issue that a lot of us have, and this is for everyone, is like you hear about the benefits of mindfulness, you kind of want to try it, you do try it, but then we find it's hard to stick with it or figure out how to apply it to our lives in a really practical way.

Yeah.

So that's coming up and I'm working on fleshing that out and I'm super excited about that.

I know it's going to— it's already so good. That's all I'm going to say. But anyway, all of the deets on Diane will be in the show notes. You can also find— I'll also link our episode on there so that everyone can go listen to that one. And just thank you so much for your presence and your story here. I appreciate having you.

Thank you. I will say it's all just developing. So I can also be found on Instagram @mindfulnessforpmdd. And that's where I'll be sharing as things develop and become available. But thank you so much. Thank you for everything, but thank you also for having me here today. Of course.

All right, y'all, stay tuned. That's a wrap, y'all. Thanks for tuning in to Crafted to Thrive, the podcast that helps entrepreneurs with chronic illness to thrive and build a holistic business and life. Check out our website at craftedtothrive.com for this episode show notes and all the gifts and goodies. Connect with me on Instagram @thrivewithnikitawilliams for more tips and behind the scenes and more. Tag me to share what you loved about this episode and I'll feature you on an upcoming episode. So until next time, remember, yes, you are crafted to thrive.