“We’re married. Why do I have to ask him for money?”

What do I have to do for us to join accounts?

That's a hard question for me to answer. And the reason being is because I feel like that all of the financial burden falls on me within the relationship. She spends all of the money available to her, and then she wants more. I'm trying to be a team player. I don't even know what we're spending on groceries, but you keep wanting money from me.

It went back to the feeling like a child or something, or like a inferior. Maybe just like a boss versus like, the employee. Any comparison like that is how I felt. I felt lower than Dan.

I just feel, like, alone in it. I feel like it's just. That's. Yeah, I just feel alone. We're gonna go to bed and I'm gonna feel like it's all my fault again.

Meet Allison and Dan. They're in their mid-30s. They've been married for about four years, and they have a two and a half year old and a one year old. They live in a very expensive city, Bozeman, Montana. And Alison first approaches me because she's concerned that they don't combine their finances. But as I start to ask more questions, it turns out that the real issues here are way more complicated. Let's listen to Alison and Dan.

Sitting in our living room. Kids were asleep. We were kind of going through, I don't even know, our third, fifth, tenth fight about the fact that our finances are separate, how much that bothers me. Dan makes double the money. So in my mind, I think that he should have the money to take care of whatever it is. And so I get frustrated in those moments because I wish I could see the money. I wish it was all just our money instead of my money and his money. But I do remember worrying about resentment, feeling like it was going to cause some problems in our relationship moving forward.

What was the first thing you said?

We started it because I wanted to talk about money in couples counseling. So we did that. And the conversation often went down a way that made me feel kind of child. Like a child. And he's the father type thing, which is, you know, not great in a romantic relationship. And our last couple couples therapy session where we talked about this, it got pretty, like, heated. And I think that Dan left that session feeling blamed, essentially.

What would cause you, Allison, to bring up money in the evening with Dan? Did something happen where you need more money? Did. What was that?

Yeah, So I need $300 or whatever it is. I'm not going to be able to afford this. So then I have to ask Dan for money, so that's always a challenge. That's. Honestly, that's actually probably when we're in the shower. That way I don't have to make eye contact, you know?

Got it.

One of the most recent things that I'm thinking of that happened where I was in the shower asking about this class I wanted to take. It's like a $400 class, and I didn't have the money for it. In my mind, I kind of felt like, well, I don't have the money for it, but we have the money for it. I should be able to take this class that I really want to take, because I know we have the money. And it's like a sadness, I guess. I don't know exactly how to put my finger on that feeling.

Sadness.

Yeah. I know I cried. I know that. Just thinking about that, not being able to have this thing made me cry.

All right, so when you have these evening conversations about money, you know, they've happened several times. Do you know they're coming?

She likes to start with, like, statements like, so I was gonna buy this. I realized that, I don't know, like, the dental bill, you know, was more than I thought it was, so I can't afford it. And I'm like, this is. We just got on the road. Like, we're about to. We're about to start going down the road. And so, um, you know, and then I just kind of. Just kind of like, okay, we're gonna have this conversation again.

What's the feeling you have when you hear the kickoff phrase?

My initial reaction is like, we're gonna go to bed, and I'm gonna feel like it's all my fault again.

All right. How long you been married?

Four years.

Four years. How long you known each other before that?

A year and a half before that.

Oh, okay. All right, so basically, you've known each other about five, five and a half years. And I understand you have two kids. One years old and two and a half years old. All right, Congratulations. That's a full house.

Yes.

Walk me through. First of all, what do your account set up? What does it look like?

And.

And then, just out of curiosity, how come your accounts are separate?

The way they're set up. So I pay 70% of the household bill. So I pay, like, the bills, right? Like the mortgage, you know, all the subscriptions, electric bill, et cetera. That comes out of my checking account. And then I also have a savings account attached to that, but I just throw 250 in a month. And then the joint checking account is what Allison. Because Allison pays for groceries. That's kind of like her thing that she pays for. And so that's where that money comes from. And then she has her own checking account for whatever, I guess, you know, whatever she. She wants to spend it on bills or, you know, I don't know what she. She uses it for.

Who pays for the baby stuff?

Me.

Okay.

I pay for anything medical with them, obviously. Like, my own gas, like, stuff that I buy. I feel like so far, I'm making myself sound like I spend lots of. Lots of money. But I like to buy, like, treats, like, unnecessary. Like, we have. Dan. Dan always calls me out. Cause our pantry has a whole corner of just junk food.

Like, what's an example? What's your favorite?

My favorite's just chocolate. Anytime, something seasonal. So, like, Christmas time, there's always chocolate mint stuff. So I gotta buy the chocolate mint stuff. I fall for that thing.

All right. How did you come up with this system that you have?

I don't think we came up with it. I think it just kind of happened.

To be honest with you, nobody sat down and mapped this out. Because if I were to map this out, this thing is really confusing.

Yeah. I mean, honestly, it's more so just, you know, we moved in together and made a large. A far move together six months into our relationship. And at that point, you know, I've just always been. I make the majority of the money in our relationship, and that's just kind of how it's always been. And, you know, everything's auto pay. You know what I mean? It's just kind of set it and forget it and move on with life kind of a thing. Yeah.

What happens when you have to ask for money? Like, what does that feel like to you, Allison?

It definitely feels like I'm a child asking for some help from a parent. It doesn't feel good. Like, I messed up. Like, it give. Brings, like, a lot of shame, those types of feelings. Like, I'm like, I should have done better. I could. I could have done this. I could have not spent this money. What did I even buy? Did I really need that thing?

You feel shame around money a lot.

I think. You know, I don't know. I've talked to my therapist about this. I do in these moments, but, like, not when I'm on Amazon looking at stuff I don't know.

That tracks. All right, Dan, what does it feel like to you when Allison comes to ask for money?

I mean, I think that's kind Of a poor way to put it, to be honest with you, because she hasn't like, directly been like, hey, I need to borrow. Well, one time I will say, she. She's like, I need money. It's not like that. Cut and dry, like, hey, Dan, I overspent. I'm going to need 300 bucks. She's upset because the accounts, like she mentioned before, like, we know she knows the money's there. Like, she knows there's a few thousand dollars in my checking account. She wants access to that because it's upsetting to her that she doesn't have any money. And so she knows that money's sitting there. So that's kind of where it goes. It never really is a outright asking for money.

Gotcha. So even with all that being true, how does it feel when she comes and asks, how's it feel to you?

I mean, to me, it's kind of like, how did we get here?

Tell me.

I'm the type of person to a fault sometimes where I ask a lot of clarifying questions. Not to be, you know, an a hole or anything like that, but just more so because I like to have an understanding of, you know, what are we talking about here? It's more so like when I. Then I ask those clarifying questions, and then she typically gets frustrated with me.

What's an example of one of those questions?

Why, when we're having. Not necessarily an argument, maybe just a discussion about how she feels like a child when she has to ask for money. You know, my. My thought that's where my head goes is, so you're mad at me for asking why you're purchasing this, but then you feel like a child when you overspend money. It just doesn't add up. It doesn't make sense to me. Yeah, I get frustrated from that stuff, seeing that stuff, you know, new items in the house every single day. It's kind of like, why does this keep happening?

There's a recurring pattern among a lot of couples I speak to where one partner has to ask the other for money. It never feels good, and it creates a really weird, awkward dynamic. Dynamic when it comes to money. But the real answer here is often a lot simpler.

Did you catch it?

The real answer is that Alison and Dan don't have a cohesive financial philosophy. He pays for certain things, she pays for other things. They never really recalibrate when their income goes up or their expenses go up. It's just arbitrary, episodic decisions about what he pays for and what she pays for. We'll be right back.

Now, there are lots of other clues.

But I wanted to dive into why they haven't combined their income.

That's a Dan question. So my original vision was we make a joint account, and then we put whatever we want into that joint account. I actually put 50% of my paycheck into the joint account and 50% into my personal account and kind of was waiting for Dan to get on board.

Okay, Dan, what do you say?

It freaks me out because, like, with the conversation we had before where she happens to overspend, it makes me really reluctant to put all of our money in one account. Because if we're just going to overspend and not think about it, what could that potentially have happen in the future? Because, like, on the flip side, I don't spend money. I would love to, but I don't really. I can't, because I'm the one who pays for any big thing that happens. Like the tires, for example. She never asked me for money. I just noticed she had tires that were bald and one was flat. So I was like, okay, this is going to be fifteen hundred dollars. I have to cover that expense. We had a dumb, stupid little legal thing that popped up that was $2,500. I had to cover that expense. The H vac broke twice. Each time was 500, but you know what I mean? So, like, it's that type of stuff that I'm trying to plan for, you know, because I want to be warm in my house. I would love. It'd be an easy system, right? To have everything in one pot and then maybe have, like, our own little allowances. It'd be a super easy system. I just don't feel comfortable with it because I haven't been shown there's any discipline with money. It scares me to put ourselves at financial risk, potentially. If we're spending an additional $300 per month, which that's more than. That's almost two mortgage payments at the end of the year. Right. That's when she feels like, I'm assuming. That's when she tells me, at least, that she's starting to feel like I'm talking to her like a child or, you know, she feels like she needs to prove something to me in order to. To do these accounts, doesn't she?

Isn't that what you want?

Yeah, and I've expressed that to her, and she doesn't. She has. She doesn't really feel good about that.

Yeah, we kind of had this whole thing where he wanted me to tell him what all the spending on my credit cards were. And I very spitefully, reluctantly did go through my credit card statements and did, okay, Amazon, Walmart, Costco, whatever, and gave him the numbers. Like, it went back to the feeling like a. Like a child or something, or like a inferior. Maybe just like a boss versus like, the employee. Anything. Like, any comparison. Like, that is how I felt. I felt lower than Dan.

Okay, and then what happened as a result of that? You showed him where the spending was going. Then what happened?

Well, it's a little. I think it's a little more complex than that.

Tell me.

Well, because she didn't want to put the list together, and she told me that.

Why do you think she didn't want to do it?

I'm assuming probably because it would make her feel small. Maybe that, like, I guess, like, speaking, like, talking it out, maybe that would make her feel like I'm a parent or like, like a father figure.

Do you resonate with that? Do you understand that? Perspectives that she has?

Absolutely.

Okay.

But I think the. The purpose of that wasn't to do that. And what I expressed to her was, is we don't even know what we're spending. Let's get to a square one, and let's figure it out from there. And she didn't want to do it, and she told me no. And then she. Like, she said she spitefully made a list I don't even know about. And then I had asked her, and she just did not want to do it. And I'm like, wow, you know, it just kind of hurt me a little bit, because it's like, I'm trying to be a team player here. Like, I don't even know what we're spending on groceries, but you keep wanting money from me.

Dan is worried that Allison is overspending. Notice he uses words like freaks out, which is not the sign of someone who has a healthy, cool, calm, and methodical relationship with money. To tell you the truth, if I were in Alison's shoes and my partner said, okay, show me where you're spending your money, I would feel insulted. I would feel resentful. I would wonder why I had to justify my expenses to my partner, and I would feel small. Now, let me put myself in Dan's shoes for a second. Maybe I would be concerned because I don't know where my partner's money's going or what their priorities are. I would reframe the whole thing. I would say, you know what? I want for us to be able to have better relationships about money. I Don't want for you to have to come to me and ask for money that can't feel good to you. And I don't want to set up that dynamic. At the same time, I want to make sure that we are spending our money sensibly towards the goals we have. So what do you think's a good way for us to do that? The key reframe here is from you're not doing it right to how do we do this together and feel good about it?

I looked over the list. I thought it was. It was great that she. She put it together and I was like, cool. I really do think, you know, fifteen hundred dollars seems like a lot for groceries. Is there something we can do to reduce spending? Like, is this just groceries? Am I reading this wrong? Like, is this also inclusive of gifts or whatever? You know, and then it just turned into the same old fight.

We know that this is a hot topic. You know, the words kind of being thrown around are quite evocative. They're hot emotions, you know, spiteful and father figure small. Let's just acknowledge this is a hot topic. Regardless of how you got here. You got to the point where you were talking about real numbers. You were looking at real numbers. Regardless of how difficult it was to get there. It was there. Was there any compliments, any acknowledgement from either side in that conversation?

I know I thank her for putting it together and giving it, you know, showing me know that I actually felt good seeing it. Cause I'm like, cool. I know where we're at. I know what we're spending on groceries.

Did you tell her that?

I did. And. And actually after she showed me that, so we split daycare just because of our messed up, split up account situation. And after that, I started taking on, I just pay all daycare. Now I get where she's coming from. Like, of course she doesn't have any money left.

I like that. I appreciate that. I think that's. That's the right thing to do. That's the beauty of talking about real numbers is you can start to get out of the clouds and down on the street. The street is reality. That's where we live. The clouds is where our worst imaginations run free. Oh my God. It's not fair. Oh my God. I'm being judged. All that that's in the clouds. I always tell my team, we got to go from the clouds to the street. We got to get real, bring it down, get specific with real numbers, real examples.

And then we actually talked about it in therapy. We I remember sitting in his truck afterwards and having a conversation about it, and it did felt okay. Like, it didn't feel bad. I. I actually felt some relief because I also could see the numbers then, too. Like you're saying, like, it's nice to see it. And. And his reaction wasn't like, you suck or anything. He was like, okay, great, now we know. And it was actually quite relieving. And it wasn't negative once we had, like, an actual conversation about it.

I think a big piece of that is the fact that there's a lot of, like, the underlying stuff still happening.

Tell me about that.

Well, separation of accounts, right? She's still upset about that for the reason she gave me. Still feeling the exact same way about. About the spending and still seeing, like, you know, just not like Allison just said it, like the. There's still not. Doesn't seem to be, I should say, from my perspective, conscious decision of, I'm not going to buy this because. But I think there's just a lot of, like, you know, she mentioned. I know in the application, too, she mentioned, like, resentment towards me, you know, in that flares up anger in me just because it's like, what do you mean you resent me? You know, doing the csp, you know, I got really, really upset.

Hold on. We're going to talk about the csp. We're going to get to that. Let me echo some of what I saw in the application. I resent my husband when it comes to money. He wants to save and I want to spend. Is it that simple?

It feels like it sometimes.

Can I just ask a question? Is it possible to do both? Can you save and spend.

If there was money left over at the end of the month? Yeah, I guess the thing. That's a valid question. I guess we do. But I'm this one saving. She's the one spending. She spends all of the money available to her, and then she wants more.

Is that accurate, Allison?

No. I mean, I would never say it that way.

What would you say? Do you spend everything you make?

No, but sometimes. So some months I do. I can think of at least two times that he's had to save me from my own self. But I don't think I. I don't think I spend all my money every month. No. Ever since Dan took over paying full daycare, I'm finally feeling like I'm able to catch up. I'm hoping that in the next month or two, I can actually be ahead of my credit card as opposed to, like, I. I will Spend on my credit card for the month of February and then pay it off in March and be broke. That's what's been happening for me.

No, no, no. We're gonna stop. We're gonna stop talking like this. First of all, you two make too much money to be using the word broke. Number two, how can one partner in a marriage with two kids be broke? That doesn't make sense to me. Alison, does it make sense to you?

No.

She's like, no, but I am broke, so can you explain that to me?

Well, part of it, too, I think, is because I'm commission sales, so she has stable income. I don't. It fluctuates month to month.

Shouldn't you be the one saying you're broke? Then?

You'd think, just as an example, like, we're in the slow season for me right now, right? So, like, my paycheck is going to be double what it is this month, next month, just because we're coming into the busy season and I sell more. So I have to plan for that, those months ahead of time, along with any, you know, accidentals such as, like, lawyer fees, tires, et cetera.

Can I ask you something, Dan?

Yeah.

What would it feel like if Allison also planned in the same way that you have to plan?

I think she would understand the weight of it. She wouldn't spend the way she does.

And what would it be like for your relationship?

That's a hard question for me to answer. And the reason being is because, like, I feel like that all of the financial burden falls on me within the relationship. If she thought the way I did, I would feel really safe.

You'd feel safe. And what would it feel like for your relationship? Look at my hands. Two people. What would it feel like if she understood how you have to plan ahead with finances? What would that feel like for your relationship?

I mean, it would feel really good.

I mean, maybe connective.

Yeah.

Maybe unified. Maybe together. Doesn't feel like that right now, Right. When it comes to money.

No.

Use your hands. Show me what it feels like to.

You as far as, like, where we're currently at.

Yeah.

Like, with money. I mean, I don't know if my screen's big enough. Hold on.

Oh, wow. Okay.

So.

So just to describe Dan is he has his hands far apart.

Yeah.

Like, there's a huge gap between the two of you. And that gap. Describe that gap to me, Dan.

It's just me. I feel like this kind of falls back into, like, therapy stuff that we've worked on where I come from. And things like that. I just feel, like, alone in it. I just feel alone because of money.

That's really apt then, to describe feeling a sense of togetherness with money.

When you described that, it made me feel warm inside. Just to kind of put it like, when you were like, if she thought not even that she did the exact same thing I do. But even if she had, like, an understanding and things like that of why I do what I do, it, like, really made me feel good.

I love that. So we know that it's possible to feel good about my.

We know that.

Alison, I want to get your reaction to what you just heard Dan saying.

It makes me feel kind of bad, but also good. So it makes me feel bad that he doesn't feel safe with money when it comes to finances in our relationship, and that there is a little bit of a trust issue there when it comes to money. That makes me feel like I feel sorry, like, that's. I feel at fault for that. But also, it's really nice to hear that how good it makes him feel just to even think about the togetherness.

You can see how Dan's mood just changed. When I speak to couples, they've often rerun the same story over and over for years and years that they've become entrenched in these stories. They forget why they originally got together and how good money actually should feel. So it's a dance. Sometimes I ask one partner to put their foot forward first. Sometimes I ask another partner. That doesn't mean Allison needs to change everything and take on this burden herself. But you can see from the results of this simple exercise that Dan is suddenly way more receptive. Now, let's hear from Alison.

If I were Alison and I were bringing this topic up a lot, I guess I would be wondering, when will we combine our accounts? What needs to happen in order for us to combine our accounts? Allison, am I reading that correctly?

Yes.

Who decides that?

I mean, I would say Dan, because he's the breadwinner.

Dan, would you agree?

Yeah. I just found out about her putting money in the savings account. So this is going to sound. Excuse me, somewhat contradictory, but mine was. I like to see some type of. You know, I use the word contribution, which she got really mad at me for using, but just some type of, like. It doesn't have to be like savings, just some type of, like, what are we doing to better manage our money?

Well, okay. She put. How much did you put in that savings account, Allison?

It was only a hundred dollars.

All right, great. A hundred bucks. She Put a hundred bucks in a savings account. Is that enough?

Again, I just found out about this, so it's. I'm still like, well, let's talk about it right now.

We're here.

Yeah.

Is that enough?

I mean, I guess for me, it's like. It's deeper than that. Right? It's like, well, did you do it because, you know you want to? Is it because of our past conversations? Like, did they resonate with you, like, within couples therapy? And, like, now you see where I'm coming from. So you want. You're like, wow, Dan feels this huge burden on himself. Maybe I can help alleviate that. And it'll make him feel like we're a team. If that's kind of where it's coming from, then that's the motivation I need to be like, okay, cool. Like, we're starting to get on the same page here. With money.

One of the things we didn't mention was that fight that we had about me. Not the reason why you don't trust me with money was that you wanted me to save. You remember me telling you I was going to save? I don't remember committing to it. And then I never saved. So a lot of the reason why.

That was most of it. The other half of it was when I found out. I forget what happened, but I was like, it's okay, because you've been saving, so we have that money. And you're like, no, I stopped saving. And I was like, well, why? And you said, because that's my money.

Yeah. This is a conversation where it goes to two different.

That's what broke the trust thing that you speak of. That's coming from.

So you and I have talked about this conversation, this fight, or this instance multiple times. And one of your things was that you wanted me to save money. That was the thing. So I started saving money because I knew you wanted me to. And I was trying to rebuild the trust from when you said that it was broken. And you're right. I didn't tell you because I was just gonna see if I could do it before I told you.

That's fair. I mean, I get that. I guess, like, for me, it'd be a cool. That, to me, would be a cool discussion between us. I'd be excited if you said, oh.

Telling you that I saved money. Okay.

Yeah. I'd be like. I'd be jacked up about it. Like, just even thinking about it now just makes me happy. Cause it's, like, cool. Like, it's important to you to want to rebuild the trust. Cause I know. Very much so, because you've expressed to me that you don't feel that you did from your perspective, and that's fair. But, like, hearing you say that, I recognize that regardless of what I think, I broke Dan's trust in this way. I want to rebuild that trust, and it's important to me. That means a lot to me.

So, yeah, that's accurate. That's exactly how I feel.

Okay. I like all of that. I love hearing the two of you connect about that and also reflect that. Yeah. Talking about money can make you feel good, especially when you're being proactive with it. I think that's awesome. Where do you go from here? This is all a little messy.

First, Dan says that he wants Allison to save money. Then Allison does save money, but Dan says it's not enough, which really reveals that this isn't about saving money at all. It's all too confusing. There's no real shared rich life vision. It's just one punitive action after another, and it's reliving the same stories over and over. That's why I stopped here and I asked him, where do you want to go?

What do I have to do for us to join accounts?

I just need to build my comfortability level with. With your spending and maybe understand you a little more on. And you. Because you talked about this with your personal therapy, maybe I just need to understand where this. This is coming from for you. Maybe that'll make me feel a little bit better about, like, the spending, because I want to be able to spend two, and I don't get two. And I think that I would feel comfortable combining accounts when we can kind of come to an agreement on, this is how we're going to pay bills, this is how. This is how much money we're going to allocate to each other, and then whatever, you know, savings or whatever you decide to do. But I just. I think. I don't know if that answers the question, but I just feel really uncomfortable about it, and I'm working on regaining that comfort.

I was just going to say, do you. Do you know, like, what you need to feel comfortable?

I think no, not right the second. No. It really bothers me because, like, the. The words. And Ramit said this, like, they're big words that you use when you describe money and me. And it feels like, you know, looking. I know. Like, I know you said we're going to talk about the CSP later, but, like, just looking at those numbers, and I was just like, I Don't understand how you can feel this way about me when you know all of my fun money I'd never get to have fun with, ever. It's really hurtful. Like I'm. Like I said to you that night after completing it, like, I feel very hurt and I just. I think you feel justified in my hurt.

Notice that they are living in the past. They have these old stories that they are reliving. Their emotions are vivid, salient, really hot. And I'm glad that they are seeing a therapist. But in this conversation about money, I need to focus on the future. So I decided to look at their conscious spending plan. You can follow along. Get my free template for the conscious spending plan@iwt.com CSP Take a look at their numbers. Assets, just over a million dollars. Investments, just about $35,000. Savings, $7,500. Net worth, $601,000. But there's a very important twist that's about to have a big effect on their numbers.

Doesn't feel real.

Okay. What does that mean to you? Doesn't feel real.

When we were doing it, like, some of it's our cars and like, well, those depreciate. That doesn't really ma matter too much. The houses, like, so we have our house and a condo and we're planning on selling the condo. So it's going to change. It's just, I don't know, it's a lot of money. I would have never thought that that.

Was our net worth, the house thing. I've read a lot of your Instagram posts about leasing and owning, but I think with our homes, you know, with the market that we're in, we're making a lot of money when like we're selling the condo for that very reason, we're able to sell it and allocate those a lot of funds to good things. So I feel good about it. I think it's more than I thought it was going to be.

Before we go on to the rest, I want to make sure I understand the condo situation. So from what I understand, Allison, you owned a condo before you got married.

Yes.

It's actually making you money every single month with tenants?

Yes.

Okay, Can I ask a couple questions about that? So how much are you making every month from the condo?

So we were charging $1,900 a month. We're currently. It's currently empty because we're selling it.

Ah, okay.

Got it.

What's the total cost? Mortgage and all that stuff per month.

So it's on my bills as like a 11 something.

Oh, okay. All right, so let's just say 1,100 for easy math. And you were making 1,900 ballpark gross.

Right.

Let's go to income this time. Alison, walk us through your gross.

Combined monthly income, 15,683.

Did you say you live in Montana?

Yes.

You make $188,000 in Montana?

Well, in Bozeman, Montana, which is pretty.

Expensive here, that was the one place I was like, wait, not Bozeman. Is Bozeman considered high cost of living?

Yes.

Oh, yeah.

Okay. All right, fine. So it's a good income. Would you agree that's a high income?

Absolutely.

So you bought the condo before you got married, Alison, how did you discuss what was going to happen with the condo now that you're married? Did you do a prenup?

No.

Okay.

We didn't do a prenup. We. Yeah, we didn't. I mentioned a prenup. I did, very briefly, but no, we didn't do a prenup.

Wait, how do you mention a prenup and not do a prenup?

Quick aside on prenups. Prenups are appropriate if one or both partners is bringing a significant amount of premarital assets into the marriage, like an investment portfolio, a business, or real estate. I covered my own prenup journey on the Tim Ferriss podcast, where I discussed how my wife and I went through the prenup process. If you're curious, you can search Tim Ferriss, Ramit Sethi, prenup and listen to that episode. In Alison's case, I would have advised that she sign a prenup before they got married, but that ship has sailed. There is another option, by the way, called a postnup, if anyone is interested. We'll be right back. Now back to Alison and Dan.

So how did you decide what was going to happen with this condo once you were married?

Well, we actually moved away from this area and weren't married, so we rented it. Because I rented it and we kind of, like, had it as, like, a. An asset. We didn't really have a plan for it, and then we ended up moving back here, and we actually moved into it. So it was nice to have in that sense. And then we were considering selling it to buy this place that we currently live in. But we wanted to try to get rental income if we could keep both and use that as an investment because we do live in a really expensive area. And the amount I paid for it and the interest that I had on it was. Is worth hanging onto. To see what happened.

And why did you decide now to sell it?

We don't want to be landlords.

Wait, hold on. Why is that? It's passive income, right? Free, no work. Just wake up and the money comes in. That's what they told me.

Yeah, right, exactly. No late night calls or anything. We don't wanna be landlords. We realize, honestly, from your stuff helped me realize that we do not have any retirement savings. We are way behind on that. So my plan was always to put a good six figures towards retirement.

Gotcha. How much do you think you're gonna sell the condo for and how much will you make from it?

We're hoping to sell it for 410. And we should make, after all expenses, assuming capital gains tax is something like 20%, we should make 206,000.

Nice. Okay. And you feel that's pretty realistic with the market and interest rates and all that stuff?

Yeah.

Wow. Okay, good. Nice job. That's great. I like that you got it. You tried out being a landlord and you also were like, hey, we're making a profit, but this isn't for me. There are lots of ways to make money. Lots. I think it's great. If you had told me, like, oh, we're profiting and we're making 700 bucks a month, I would have said also, fantastic. That's great. I don't mind somebody having rental property. That's fine. I just want them to run the numbers. Okay, great. So you potentially are going to make 200,000 bucks. And when is that going to happen?

It has been on the market for less than a week now. We haven't had any offers yet, but we're hoping March or April we'll get that money. Okay.

All right. Are you fine if you make like $150,000 instead of $206,000?

No, not really.

You wouldn't sell it?

Probably not.

Oh, what would you need to make in order to sell it?

Well, I'd want to sell it for 400,000. So we're talking. That would be like $50,000 less than I'd sell it for or than I want. Yeah.

Okay.

Yeah, I want to sell it for 400. That will double what I paid for it.

Who makes the decision on whether to sell it or not?

I would say it's a team, but I think because it's mine, Dan would agree that it's ultimately my decision. But whatever's best for the family would probably be the answer.

We talked about that and I 100%. It's totally up to her. It's not my condo. It's. I mean, plain and simple. So even when, you know, she was having a little bit of cold feet and stuff, I was like, it's your call. I mean, because, like, we share the landlord stuff, right? So we can just keep doing that. I don't want to, but it's totally her call.

And the income that came in before, so the roughly 7, 800 bucks a month. What'd you do with that money?

That just sat in an account, and then we use it here and there. So I think.

For what?

Well, nothing to do with the condo. We did have to use it to buy a new oven, but we bought. We took about. Do you remember how much we took out to buy my car?

5,000.

It was five. Yeah.

And I think we took five out of the savings account.

Yeah. So we took money out of it when we needed to spend on something big, usually.

Otherwise, it just sat there.

Yeah, it just sat there.

I just have to jump in here. Do you notice how the same patterns from their personal finances are also present?