How To Make Your First $100K Online (Tiny Challenge) ft. Richmond Dinh | The Dept. #72

Would you rather make $100,000 helping 1,000 people, or would you rather make $100,000 helping 10 people, maybe even one person?

No one has ever been able to crack the code on how to scale one on one Coaching. The future of marketing is a demonstration of competency, and that's exactly what you're doing through this model here. I just did one a month ago and that was a $290,000 tiny challenge.

On today's podcast, we have Richmond Din, who's going to help you unlock your business and, and get you paid more. Helping less people. Most people have this conception that you need a large audience, a large email list to make large money.

Tiny challenge is a challenge that's done one on one with just you and another person and that's it.

High level people, they want that intimacy.

The close rate is insanely high because there's so much reciprocity. And you can tailor your offer exactly to what they want and need because you know everything about them.

Is there any industry that it doesn't work for?

I really believe that probably in about two or three years time, it's just going to be the, the number one. Go to Framework to help someone make their very first dollar online, and then when they master it, their first 100k offer will be through a tiny challenge too.

So.

Richmond in. Thank you for being on the department.

Thank you for having me.

I've heard incredible things about you and what you do for entrepreneurs and business owners, primarily from Myron golden himself. We went golfing a couple months ago and he said, dude, there's this guy who teaches this really cool way to sell high ticket offers or premium value offers. And I was like, what? And, and he said it's something called like tiny challenges. So.

I believe most of my audience are always wondering how they can sell their genius. And so you've been able to help multiple people in various different industries apply this thing, which is tiny challenges.

Yeah. Including Russell Brunson, too. He ran two of them. He ran $2,000 each.

That's crazy. Okay.

Yeah.

Can you just define first and foremost from a, from a 30, 000ft square, you know, point of view, what is a tiny challenge?

Yeah, good, good question. Good question. So.

Or maybe let's just go Challenge.

Yeah, exactly. Yeah. What's the challenge like? I mean, most people. It's funny you say that because most, some people don't even know what a challenge is. Like a fitness challenge. Well, there's business challenges or, you know, you do the content challenge and Myron does his make more office challenge? So challenge is to be five days working with someone and it's in a group setting and there's one specific outcome and people do the homework and get the outcome through a five day challenge. Kind of like a fitness challenge, but more for our space. And so that's what a challenge is. But a tiny challenge is a challenge that's done one on one with just you and another person and that's it. And I know you're looking at it. No. Yeah. Like who does that? Can you do that? Is it scalable? All that kind of stuff. It's the like, I mean you can run a challenge, you can run a webinar, you can run a masterclass, you're on a workshop, you can run all these other things. But a one on one challenge is the easiest challenge to get started in with the least amount of friction. You don't have to launch it, you don't have to have a big list. You only need one person, 100% show rate. Because if you. It's all locked in the calls. Five calls, five days. Generally done over the five days. But you can do it over seven days if you want because sometimes the schedules don't align and it's just, you don't have to have much experience to get started. It removes all the imposter. If you're a beginner and you don't know your offer, then it's the best place to get your offer down pat. If you don't know what your messaging is, you'll know your IHELP statement after the first three calls. Cause you hear everything. And so from that point of view, it's great to get started. But also we can talk about the advanced version as well.

No, dude, it's so good. I, I'm just thinking because most people feel like they need. Most people have this conception that you need a large audience, a large email list to make large money. Correct. And. And if I sometimes I actually pause, even people in my inner circle, I say, hey, don't do a challenge. Like it might be too much to chew or to, to like attack, you know, because, because yeah, you don't want to sell five tickets. And like you said, one person shows up, now you're showing up discouraged. So all this like all this mental hoops, which I think this is what is really cool about this solves.

Solves all the problems. Yeah.

On an internal standpoint and external standpoint and something that a light bulb came off to me and you probably know it is that.

Like.

Like High, like income earners or high level people, they want that intimacy.

Yes. And so they don't want to be in a group challenge with everyone else. Like if they're a hype, like big player. Yeah, like, like we're talking about Rick. Like, you know what I mean? He's not going to go on a big group challenge. Like tiny challenge is perfect. Yeah.

So, okay, so, so, okay, so we defined what a tiny challenge was. It's a series of calls. Let's just boil.

Correct. It's a series of calls done over consecutive days, ideally one. One on one. Typically the gold standard is five calls over five days, one on one. The calls are about 45 minutes each. And you take them through one specific outcome, get to the end, present your offer, and then the, the close rate is insanely high because there's so much reciprocity and you can tailor your offer exactly to what they want and need because you know everything about them.

So, okay, so how do you, let's just go. How do you market and sell the tiny challenge?

Yeah, it's, it's so easy. I mean, you know, if you were to run an ad, I mean you'd spend $30 because you only need one person. But so we don't say like don'. Why would you run an ad for just, it's organic traffic and you're the, you're the king of organic marketing, you know, and so it's just really putting out a call to action to your list and get someone to apply to work with you one on one. It can be free or it can be paid. I think if you're more at the starting phases, just, just do it for free or with a $97 fully refundable deposit that gets paid back at the end. It's just easier to fill up your first couple. But you can do a paid version as well. And you just do a call to action to your list, you'll get like, I mean, if you got 100 followers, you're going to get 10 people to put their hand up. And now you got the, you got the luxury of having to pick which one you want to do.

And I think something really cool is.

Like you said, just do it for free if you're starting out. One reason people need to do things for free when they're starting out is for the data. Like you said, the people just showing up on Zoom. People don't realize if the problem is in, you know, we all know the problem we're trying to, you know, solve. If it's very Clear. They're just going to tell you all your future marketing language. They're going to tell you all the problems that they're really dealing with. You thought it was like the surface level thing, but it's like, oh, this is what they really need help with. And so no, I just. That's really good. Is there, is there any industry that it doesn't work for?

This is, this is great. Like, I, um, I haven't figured out an industry that it hasn't worked for yet. Like people like, I'll give you an industry. So it definitely works for real estate agents and real estate industry, but the personal training industry, I feel like this is going to be the biggest innovation and to personal trainers, because personal trainers, their business model and you know, most of them are broke, right? And so their business model is you go to the gym and they'll approach you want a free 30 minute session. And so they'll give out free 30 minute personal training sessions. And at the end of it, if you like it, you might buy 10 sessions and normally it's $80 a session and they'll buy 10, sell you 10 sessions for $600. And that's a broken model. They'll probably have to give out 10 free sessions to sell a $600 package. Imagine a personal trainer went to you and said, hey, I'm doing this one on one, five day challenge. Just one on one dude.

In a world where like one on one is, is actually a way to stand out right now.

100, 100. And so, I mean, if a person was trying to approach me at the gym, say I've got a one on one, five day challenge with me, one on one, whether it's free or fully refundable, deposit, whatever it is. If they took me through that process or even like anyone through that process, they'll know everything that you've tried, what's not working, what are you not willing to do? Where have you found, what are your pain points, what are your goals, what are your, what are your sticking points? Everything, right? And then at the end they're not going to be offering a $600 program. They'll offer like 2, 3, 4, $5,000 thing for six months. Particularly if you're like a female saying, look, I can help you get back into that dress that you wanted to fit in again before you had kids that you've tried for the last six years. And now I know exactly why, if you like this, would you like more of the same? And they're going to be selling two, $3,000 programs just like that. And if they do two tiny challenges, that's 10 sessions, they're going to convert at least one of them. They're going to be making two or 3,000 a week.

Yeah.

There'll be no more broke personal trainers from this model.

Yeah, dude, I'm, I'm in. My brain is trying to break it, but it's also, it's if it's even scaling it. Because that same person could do to. In the same week.

Yes. Yeah.

You could do three in the same week.

Yeah, exactly.

If you're doing an hour or two hour zoom call.

Yeah, yeah, exactly. Exactly at the cause, about 45 minutes. If you follow the framework, you'll get down pat to about 30 to 45 minutes. But, but even then, if they're an hour or two hours, it's. That's okay too. Yeah, yeah.

Just out of curiosity for the audience, because there are people that, they know that there's money to be made online. They know that they have a passion and they, they've helped people in the past and they've never charged for it. But like, how do you encourage people to know who they're called, they're supposed to serve?

Yeah, this, and this is the best thing about a tiny challenge. So for example, if you're like, oh, you know, I could do corporate women, I could do single moms, but I also could do like, you know, women of abuse. Maybe they could be all those three categories. They're a corporate woman, they're a single mom, they're. They're a victim of abuse. And I guess do three tiny challenges on each avatar and guarantee after that you will know who you want to serve. Like your niche will find you through the model.

Yeah.

Okay. It's in the safe. You don't have to run this big group challenge. Fill it up, no one shows up. And then if it bombs, then you have to wait another month because it's not like you can run it again tomorrow. Right. And, and this just allows you to find your niche through the framework.

That's good. And I just want to like where this fits in your business model. Listener or watcher is this is what you call the vehicle, the sales vehicle, right? Yes. It doesn't matter what business you have, you must have a vehicle that puts, I mean, you can use the word vehicle, you could use the word room, you can use the word environment, but you need to reverse engineer the environment people have, are in or have gone through when they hear your. Your actual offer.

Correct.

And this is why the the challenge, generally speaking has worked really well for me is because I just decided that this was going to be the vehicle. Now some people can do just 15 minute discovery calls.

Yes.

But when, when you're talking like one of the best ways to sell your genius is, is to do it in such a high value exchange where people are, it's not about over delivering, but it is about like I got way more value than whatever the price was paid or if it was free, you know.

Yeah. Reciprocity is huge. Like huge reciprocity. And, and I think that's, that's underrated. Like hard work is underrated, but the reciprocity is huge. And if they, if they do sign up, you get a raving fan from the go. And if they don't sign up, you still get a raving fan. So either way you are creating raving fans whether they sign up with you or not. And so you're right about the vehicle though, because you can't just, you can't just have a website book a free discovery call. That's not going to happen. You actually need a proper vehicle. And discovery calls, you know, they're very discouraging, I think.

Yeah.

And you, if you, you have to do at least a dozen discovery calls, particularly when you're starting out maybe to get one sale, but you just do two tiny challenges and you'll, you get a high ticket sale very quickly.

Yeah. Could you talk through. Yeah. Our friend Ricky Carruth, who is like a real estate coach, walk through how you helped him unlock this. Because I know his journey. He's reached mass audiences, low ticket monthly communities, making tons of money, which he's killing it. But he was like, man, there's something about this whole challenge, high premium value offer thing. Yeah.

So for his level, I said, okay, probably do a paid tiny challenge, like, I mean, and charge quite a lot for it. So he put out a call to action. He charged $2,000 for it. And because he's got such a warm list, got so many people work with me, one on one, five day challenge, $2,000. That's like, pick me, pick me, pick me. Like that's, that's a still like imagine Marin did that because he would never do that. But you know, and so it was an irresistible offer. One on one tiny challenge, five days for 2000. And at the end of it, the first one he did, he pitched the 25k and they just said yes, like that. And then, and then he did another one and he pitched 100, his first 100k offer. And they just said, yes, like that. So the people who go through a one on one tiny challenge, extremely committed and that's why the close rate's so high. So like, we go back to the personal training example. If you got approached at the gym by personal training and said, hey, would you like to do a five day one on one challenge for me? You got to be ready to.

Yeah, go all in.

Yeah, I don't, I don't really feel like getting my ass kicked today. You know, I mean, like, I, I don't. You know, you got to be really, really ready that week to really push hard, otherwise you're not going to do it. So the commitment is a lot higher. And so from that aspect, that's why he did it. And it was just basically belief being in the right room. Yeah.

Did you help him at all with that 100k offer?

No, no, I didn't. I didn't.

He just lobbed out the number.

Yeah. Yeah. I don't know exactly. I don't know if you know. I don't know if exactly he knew what was going to be in it. And that's when I sold my first few hundred K offers. For me, it was like, well, I don't know exactly what's going to be the deliverables. I knew the outcome, which is like a 10x guarantee, but I didn't know how I was going to deliver it. And so the delivery was so good. Yeah, exactly.

No, I think people just feel like it needs to be dialed. No, it's like it, it actually is. It's how I've even discovered what I'm going through. It's like, let's just put it out there. People say yes. It's like, oh, okay.

Yes.

And just so you know, if you think somebody isn't faking it, they probably are or they have at one point for a long period of time.

Yes.

So that's good. And I don't like to say, I won't say the word faking it, but like, just, just throw the offer out there. Omar, what's an offer? It's. It's a promised transformation or outcome with a price attached to it. And, and so, yeah. Can you talk to the mental, emotional cycle that you went through to get to a place where you're like, okay, I'm going to charge 100k for this.

Yeah, well, this is, this is. Well, there's a story for that because I had dinner with Myron and this was around October last year at Russell's Inner Circle. Okay.

And so here In Vegas.

In Boise. In Boise.

Oh, yeah, because he did one in. Was that September? He was okay.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And. And so we're. We're at, you know, at Russell's Inner Circle. And there you. You go. Present, you know, something valuable to the room. It's a mastermind. But also, at the end of it, like, what's your biggest problem in your business right now? And for me, it was just getting people to shop to my events, like, increasing shop rate. And then Myron's like, richmond, what's your value ladder? And I showed him my value ladder. We got a 1k, we got a 25k, and it's a very simple model. It got us to $6 million last year. And that's. That's it done, right? And it's like, where's your 100k offer? Like, no, no, I just want to help. Help me increase our shop rates. I. I don't want 100k offer. I don't need 100k off. This is the value model that's generated millions. Millions means. And it's simple, and it's scalable, and I just couldn't fathom that. And so it was really getting to me. And then. And then finally, funnily enough, I caught an Uber to dinner that night with Eileen. And then Eileen's like, richmond, how come you don't have a 100k offer? And I'm like, what is going on here now? Now Eileen's in my ear about 100k offer. So we had dinner that night, and then Myron just wouldn't let it go. And so he played this $100 game with me, and I'll show you the video later. It's really cool. And that game, I lost. And it was the best lesson that I ever had because I realized the value of.

My worth after that game. And that night, I messaged a person who I thought maybe would take up on the 100k offer. Names, Kaylee. And I said, hey, Kaylee, I've got a 100k offer for you.

But I'll tell you more about tomorrow. And she's like, no, no, no, tell me now. Like, all right, I'll tell you now.

You're giving us the copy and paste text right now.

It is. This is like this. You watch this and you do that. And it was just. And then she wanted to know, obviously, you know, I just did a bit of a cheeky kind of dm. So tell me. Tell me now. I was like, how much do you trust me? He said, I trust you with everything. Because we know each other a very long time. Yeah, she's a raving fan. I helped her get to $3 million, you know, and, and I said, okay, cool. I just need you to wire me to deposit now at 10,000 down and I'll tell you more about the offer tomorrow. But I did not know what, what was going to be in it. And here's what I learned. Wow. The moment that happened. Creativity precedes commitment. To that again, creativity precedes commitment. You can only become creative if you commit first. And what. The moment you commit to 100k offer or whatever it is, you start brainstorming in your mind of how am I going to do this, what I'm going to put in it, what's going to be in it. And then my mind could not stop that night because I had just been transferred this $10,000 for this first 100k offer.

Wow.

And now I was just. Otherwise, if I had not sold that or committed to it, I wouldn't be up all night thinking, what's going to be in it? But because the fact that it's real now and it's done then, but that's, that's for everything. Like what? The moment you commit to writing a book, the moment you commit to a UBI Channel, like, just do that first one and suddenly you start thinking, okay, what else I need to do? What else? What else? What else you have to commit first.

Could I, could I challenge you with something?

Yeah.

If somebody's thinking to themselves, like, isn't that a scam? Isn't that like scamming people that you sold or something?

That's a good challenge. Yeah.

What would you say to that?

Well, first of all, I knew the outcome. I knew, like, okay, I'm gonna, I'm guaranteed. I knew the outcome. I'm going to guarantee a million dollar return. And I knew I could do that because, I mean, I already did it with her anyway. But also we've done it with ourselves. And I know that I'm a good person, meaning that I would do whatever it takes to help it get the outcome really good. The only reason why Tiny Challenge was born because I've been up so obsessed with getting our students results. Yeah. And originally we were teaching them kind of like group challenges like we've been. And then, you know, they were struggling. It was overwhelming. How do I fill it up? No one's showing up. Then I had to learn the skill of tech and speaking and selling one to many and, you know, facilitating a room. And it's so hard for them. And I thought like there has to be an easier way. And so when you're, when, when someone's struggling, it's not, it's usually not the.

It'S not them. And I say that, you know, obviously you've got to take responsibility but it's because they, they haven't been taught the fundamental like components of what's going to work. Like you know, you always got to break things down to the lowest common denominator when you're teaching someone things. And so otherwise they're not going to be able to graft it and become successful. And that's partly how the tiny channels were born because I was thinking what's the lowest common denominator that they need to do for them to make money online? And so I'm just obsessed with student results and I know that about me. And so I don't like, I put it upon myself really hard to get our students results. And that, that's, that's my personal integrity. Yeah.

Which is great. Yeah. Something I've learned as a believer is like I had to get really good at sales, marketing, offer creation and calling people to a higher place because, because people who didn't have integrity were doing that. People who didn't have character were doing it. And it's like who's wrong here? You know, like no one will know because it's on the other side is what really matters.

And so that's correct.

That's why getting really good at language and the words. That's like the first thing I did was I jumped at your like DM text. I'm like, there's words right there like that you can copy paste that. Hey, I have a. Maybe it's not 100k, maybe it's 25k.

Yeah, it's fine. Yeah.

But it's there, there is so much, there's compassion in that. It's like I want to help you. Yes. And you know, and there is a two sided street when charging higher prices. And it's, it's, it's so that people when, when they pay, they pay attention. When they pay more, they pay more attention. So it's really good. I just wanted. Because I just know there's skeptics, you know, for sure.

And I mean, you know, unfortunately not everyone has integrity.

Sure.

And everyone has probably been scammed at some point in their life. And you know, you paid the money and they're suddenly, they ran off and you know that happened to us one time with a holiday we paid for A holiday company, like, silent on us. Like, what? This is a travel agent? Like, where did. Now we have to pay for another holiday? Like, so if you're a highly integral person and you got high character, then I believe when you commit first. Because this thing about congruency, right? So congruency happens when you commit to a promise or commit to an outcome. And then it's like, oh, my gosh, now I got to step into that identity because I just promised someone that. So you got kids like, you, you know, you promise your daughter, I'll be there 3 o', clock, and it's like, oh, I forgot I had something on. But you have to be there at 3 o', clock, so you make it happen. So.

You know, sometimes you don't even know your schedule, but you got to make. You got to fulfill on your promises, right? And if that's the person you are, then, yeah, you don't need full clarity on your offer. Good.

Say that one more time, just for the people in the back. You don't need.

You don't need full clarity on your offer. The funny thing is, even if you did, when you fulfill an offer, it always changes how you deliver anyway.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I think it's just because what most people. We're all perfectionists. Like, when I put myself out there because I was making videos on, like, gear for a long time, people know me a lot for, like, how to set up a studio and all that stuff. And I was able to put all my chips on the gear and the brands and, like, that was what I was selling. But then when I started selling, like, me, I. It was like, all on me. And it was a very emotional, you know, crazy thing, because now I need to be. I need to sell myself. And in a weird way, I had a friend tell me, like, omar, this is going to sound really weird, but you need to feel yourself not in. Like, that sounds really weird, but, like, bro, you're. You're the goat. So, like, act like it. Sell yourself. Like, no one's. No one's gonna. You know, no one's gonna be confident in trusting you with their money if you don't sound like you're the best decision, you know? And so. But I say all that to say that, like, we. We get in our little dungeons and then we start creating our offer, and it's like, yeah, just put it out there. Like, one of the best things you could do is like, say. Say what would. If. If. If.

If.

That's what if, you know, I can help you with that. What would that be to you, like, worth for you?

And that's what you can do in a tiny challenge. Yeah, you can literally ask them, okay, well, if you don't have any clarity in your offer, you're like, hey, well, if I was to offer you a $10,000 offer or $20,000 offer, what would need to be in it for you to say yes? And then they'll tell you, and you're like, I can do that. You know, so good.

Okay, you broke down, like. Or you didn't break it down yet. I want you to break it down. Yeah, you said, like, you. You structure these calls for, like, 45 minutes.

Yeah.

Okay. Can you break down that structure?

Easy. Yeah. The first call is the most important. That sets the tone for the whole tiny challenge. And so the first call, we go through the 4F framework, which is you gotta. So you open the call. You know, you build some rapport. But the four Fs, number one, you want to elicit their future. So where they want to be in the next five days with you over this challenge, but what's their goal? What's the outcome? And will be a great outcome. But also, 12 months from now, if we were sitting down, having a coffee together, and you'd like to report to me what happened in the last 12 months, what would you like to say? And so now we know the future. Dig deeper. Why is that important to you? All those kind of questions. The second thing is we want to know what their frustrations are. So what. What's getting in the way? What are the roadblocks? What. What are you struggling with? Like, I mean, what's your biggest problem right now on getting that goal? And then the third F is, where have they failed in the past? That's important. What are they willing to try? What are they not willing to try? Are they in another coaching program? Have they been, you know, have they been scammed? Or, you know, know a bit about their history, and that would tell you more about their skepticisms or their willingness or their hunger. And then the fourth F is, what are their fears? So any limiting beliefs getting in the way, any hesitations, you do that call in the first 45 minutes, you know everything about them, and you already know what to offer them.

Wow.

Like, that's. That's. That's how powerful it is. You know, your I help statement, you know, the messaging, you know, you know so much about them. And then you say, well, at the end of the call, great. Awesome. So here's what I'm going to do. Over the next five days, I'm going to go through this three step framework to help you reach this 505 day goal that you're looking at. We're also going to do this and at the end of it, if you're loving it and you don't want to, you know, you don't want to continue working with me, would it be okay with you if I present to you what a 12 month offer might look like and everyone says yes and you know that's, that's how you structure. And then day two, day three, day four, you go through the content, assign some homework and then, and then do the offer on call four or call five.

Hey, department fam, wanted to take a brief break from this conversation. I hope you're enjoying it as much as I am. And if you are an entrepreneur, content creator or somebody looking to make money online, I want to encourage you to come to this online event called the Content to Cash Challenge. This is a special five day event that's going to give you access to the system I use in my business to make multiple six figures with my content. If you've been desiring to either get your business and brand more exposure, grow a YouTube channel, whatever it is, when it comes to video, I would encourage you to jump into the content. Content to Cash Challenge. We'll be sure to post the link to the challenge down in the show notes or the description. And I want to encourage you to jump into the VIP experience. This will give you access to a 1 hour Q& A call every day of the challenge. This will guarantee myself to answer a personalized question you may have. So I'll see you on the Content to Cash Challenge. Now let's jump back into the conversation.

So good. Okay.

And then.

What would you say that I have a guy in my program who teaches leather workers like how to, how to draw on leather and create patterns on. For belts and stuff.

Yeah.

And they do a challenge. It's like the drawing challenge.

Yeah. And I think I saw that. That's so cool. So many different challenges. Right?

Like.

I'm just, I'm. I just want to. Because I, again, I'm just trying to break it because now, now this is somebody who like needs demonstration and like you know, if we're doing it virtually like h, have you helped somebody do it where there is an element of doing, like if I were to do. Let's just say if I were to do it. How about let's just do that?

Yeah, yeah.

It's like let's dial in Your content studio for, in your office.

Yeah.

And we'll do that in, in, in five days and then we'll come up with the next 10 YouTube ideas that should work for you. We'll come up with your lead magnets and we'll do all that in five days.

Yeah. What?

I, I guess, I guess, I guess the thing is like why would somebody feel like they're down to continue if, if you help them accomplish something like that?

Yeah. Well, that. This is the key you need to elicit their 12 month goal because otherwise you're not stretching the gap and otherwise going to leave. Oh wow. You did such a great job with these five days. I don't need you anymore. But hang on a sec. They've got this 12 month goal. So that's, that's the key there. Number one. And at the end of the day, if you can't change someone's life in five days, you know that. And so.

That'S number one, stretch the gap there. And number two, listen to what they're saying. Like they're telling you what they want but also telling you what they need. And perhaps maybe your offer is not matching exactly to what they want or need. And so be flexible with your offer. If you already got a pre, like you know, got offer that's already been selling. But just be flexible and think about how can I create this or even change the messaging to hit the mark with that person. Sometimes a change in message in the same offer makes all the difference. Like you know, 100. Yeah.

And it's so good. Do you, do you have a story where you put yourself out there and you tried something and then you threw an offer out there and nobody bought 100%.

This is when I was, this when I started. So it was funny. Back, back before COVID days. Yeah. Everyone's doing events, like live events in your local area. People come down and that was the model. There was nothing virtual, there was no zoom, all that kind of stuff. It was about eight years ago and I had an event and I had 80 people there, which is like in hindsight, how do I get 80 people to this event? I don't know how to like a live room.

Yeah.

And I was like, I'm excited. And back then I had a fifteen hundred dollar offer.

Okay.

And pitched it thinking this is going to be so good. Table rush. And no one, no one ran to the back. It was so embarrassing. It was.

Yeah. I mean I was, that was definitely a low point. But. But it made me get better. So good. Yeah.

What looking Back now, what did you overlook or not do or what did you do that ruined it?

Yeah, good, good, good. Question number one is market research. Like, and Myron talks about this a lot like, you know, positioning is more important than presentation and understanding exactly what they need to to get the market to message match. And my offer just didn't match the needs of what they wanted in the room. So that's step number one. Step number two is taking them through.

How do I say this? Like friend zoning. Like I, you know, like in the dating scene, the moment your friend zone someone, it is game over.

Yeah.

And I believe there's a correlation between you wanting to please and your ability to sell. And they are inverse. And the more you want to please someone, the less likely you're going to be able to sell them. And so for me I was a massive pleaser. I wanted everyone's acceptance and so I would just, you know, and people can feel that. And so I really had to work on myself internally to get rid of that pleaser so that I could really serve someone. And sell makes a big difference.

It's really good. And then.

What have you done to get better at selling?

Yeah, so I used to success resources, the company which does like multi speaker events and all that kind of stuff like that. And I would crew and my first coach, Scott, so he run big events and I would crew for him for free and all these big events for free. And when I go crew there I said I want to be on the sales table. And so I would literally go work for free for these companies who are selling like stage rush stuff. But let me crew and let me be around the sales table. So I just immerse myself around selling and I watch how they sell, handle objections, take payments, close the deals, sign the contracts, all that kind of stuff. And I just did that for two years. That. And that's how I learned because I knew I had to be good at this or be great at it. And I just surround myself with just salespeople.

Why do you think people believe sales is like I don't, I don't want, I don't want. I don't know. They get, they have a. They say sales is sleazy or icky.

Yeah, it's the conditioning, you know, it's a conditioning of that used car salesman and all that kind of stuff. But also the wrong people are getting to sales. And that's the thing like you know, anyone can sell and unfortunately we're talking about integrity and character before and you know, everyone's Been burnt by someone who doesn't have integrity. And so it's just history of cultural conditioning, but also their past references as well. And what happened to them.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, the reality is, is you have to get good at it. Yeah. Or else we'll have 80 persons, 80 people show up to a zoom call or in person event and nobody will buy.

Yeah. And you know the book by Cialdini, Influence? It's a great book. And he goes through the seven laws of influence, and one of them is reciprocity. And reciprocity is, in my opinion, the greatest law of influence. And so through a challenge. That's why challenges work so well, because reciprocity is so high. So you don't even really need to learn how to sell that well with all the other techniques if you use reciprocity. And that's why a tiny challenge, you know, for people starting out, and they don't really know how to sell, but the reciprocity is huge. That does the selling for you so good. Yeah.

It's made my life easier.

Yes.

And the thing is, like, I. When I was creating content for another channel, I didn't. I was blissfully just delivering value. Like, I. There was nothing in exchange. I was just happy to do it. And I just, you know, make other people's life easier.

Yeah.

But it's funny, when you prioritize making other people's life easier, it becomes much easier for people to buy from you.

100 on that point. I'm not a fan of sales scripts. And, you know, I don't really, you know, we don't really teach that. I'd rather give a philosophy. So the number one thing in sales is intention. And you just have the right intention and everything flows from there. And so people can feel like what you're saying, like, you know, just give, give, give. But if you have the intention to take their money, then people can feel that as well. So setting the intention is the most important thing. Everything becomes easy after that.

Oh, good. If I'm not mistaken, I think Myron told me that.

You can sell tickets to your tiny challenge, if I'm not mistaken, so people can watch the process.

Correct. This is. Okay, so this is crazy. Yes. And maybe even for the person doing the. Was it the crafting that you're talking about? Yeah. Okay, so a hundred years of coaching, since coaching's been around for over a hundred years now, no one has ever been able to crack the code on how to scale one on one coaching. So the problem with the tiny challenge is it's one on one, five days, unscalable. And everyone's like, how do you scale that? And initially it's like, well, you can't. You. You master tiny challenges. You understand your niche, your messaging, your offer. Everything's proven and validated now. And then you go to group, but you don't even need to do that. So this is how you scale one on one coaching. And I've done this. Like, I mean, I just did one a month ago, and that was a $290,000 tiny challenge. So I picked a person and I said, hey, I'm going to coach you one on one. But. And I gave her an irresistible offer and kind of like what rick did, like $2,000, five calls, one on one.

Like, dude, I literally am like, if I showed up because I'm not a fan of selling on social media, like, you know, have something that you get people off the platform and then, you know, deliver. Maybe it's low ticket or something. But I kind of have no problem saying I want to help one person next week.

Yeah, it's like, like a thousand, two thousand, five, whatever. I know.

Yeah.

Five course, five day challenge. Yep. And so.

Now I. So I did that. I picked a person. I said, now I'm going to help her build out her perfect tiny challenge. And I said to her, look, I'm going to give you a great offer on the caveat that you allow me to have people in the same zoom room and shadow and watch me coach you one on one. I'm not. I'm not coaching them. It's not a group coaching call. I'm coaching you one on one. But I want them to have value from it because they're going to get so much value from seeing me coach you and transform your business. And they're going to take notes, apply it to the business. At the end, I'll break it down on exactly what I did, why I did it, and I'll allow some Q A at the end. And so we, for that one there, we sold $197 shadow seats. And then they came in, they watched, they were blown away. They're like, wow. And then at the end, obviously, when you pitch your offer, you're not pitching to one person. You're pitching to 100 people. And that's how you scale one on one coaching. I believe that the future of marketing is a demonstration of competency, and that's exactly what you're doing through this model here.

Yeah, dude. So good.

Yeah.

When it comes to, like, the payment Part. I mean, just how do you make that part, like, not awkward yet?

You mean, like, like, how do you take payment on a sales page or something like that?

Yeah, yeah. Like, when you're saying like, okay, so here's the offer. Do you do, like, the deposit thing? Do you talk that through or do you, like, hand them off once they say yes?

Like, yeah, yeah, yeah. So I know it's so many different processes like this. For us. It's pretty simple because a lot of them, like, they've already paid $97 to be there. And so it's a. It's a paid challenge. This is like the easiest, least friction way to get paid. It's like, would you like me to charge the card on file? Okay, that's it. Good. Boom. We don't want to send them to a page. We have all that. Some people that, oh, can you show me the page? And you know, they want to read it. That's cool. But it's like, would you like me to charge. If you'd like me to charge a card on file right now? A thousand, five thousand, whatever it is. Boom. Because you got that card on file. Yeah, it's on stripe. Whatever.

Really good. Yeah, dude, fire. Do you who's another person you've helped recently that, like, their win excited you?

Yeah. Well, Russell's probably the biggest one. I mean, he ran two tiny challenges, $100,000 each, and he charged $100,000 for it.

So $100,000 to work with him one.

On one for five days. Yeah. Tiny challenge. And then. And then he was going to pitch a 250k offer at the back end of it, but then he decided not to do it. He's like, oh, you know, this was enough. Like, if you're charging 100 grand for a five day tiny challenge. And so he just. He just didn't. He didn't want to pitch a VIP 250k offer.

Because here's what happens. People feel like because they're only helping one person, they're limiting their. Maybe they feel like they're wasting their time.

Yeah.

And there's a girl in my group who's like, I just. She does real estate and she's killing it on, like, her. The way she does home tours on her phone, like doing 100k months in her real estate business. She's crushing and she wants to mentor other women. And there's like this desire in her to want to start off with all the, you know, like just a handful of people when I mean, my thing for her Is like, just beta test whatever you want to do. Just beta test it. There's nothing wrong with just trying things. Put it out there. I think what I think I'm getting from the tiny challenge is this is such a good. Put it out there. Yeah, but can you speak to somebody who's like. Because I. I like helping less people. People would think that I have thousands of people that have given me their credit cards and they're taking my courses. Like, no, I've worked with a couple hundred people last year, made over a million dollars. And so. But yeah, can you just, like, explain, like, to kill the desire to feel like you need to sell a lot of something.

I agree with that. You have 100 loyal, raving fans. You will be on seven figures for the rest of your life because they're the people who just always vouch for you, and that's all you need. And even, like, you know, your. Your channel, your views are so high compared to, like, your subscribers. I. I see people with, like, millions of followers, and they're like, they don't have their 100 fans. Yeah. You know, and so get your 100. Focus on quality, not quantity, because we live in a world where vanity, you know, that's kind of the metric, but it shouldn't be because, like, I mean, what really matters is how much, like, how much you're impacting the 100 people around you, and you're making really, really good income from that. Like, just. You do that one person at a time, and even if you do it through a tiny challenge, you'll get to your 100 law fans very, very quickly. Dude.

So good.

So what. What.

What's your. What's your business called?

Point one. That's my mastermind.

Yeah, it's your mastermind.

Yeah, yeah. Point one.

What is. Yeah. What's the focus in the mastermind yet?

The mastermind number one. I believe there's a. There's a hidden force which I call the eighth wonder, and that governs everything in your life. Your how you. How you dress, what you believe, what you value, what you focus on, what sports you play, what you eat, everything. And that's proximity. So who you spend time with governs every direction that you go to. And that's why we. We hang around like mentors and, you know, cool people. Right. And so that governs it. And your parent. And you know that when your child comes home with a particular friend, they're either happy or they're not. Yeah. Right. And so the environment is everything. So the eighth one is this Force that governs everywhere you go, you cannot, it's impossible for you to. I guess if you're hanging around, you know, 10 overweight people, you're going to become overweight. If they're vegan, you're going to become vegan. If they play golf, you're going to play. That's how I started golf because my friends were playing golf. Like I got to get into this. Yeah. If all your friends are earning seven figures, it's a matter of time. You are going to earn seven figures. And so Point one is a mastermind of high achieving entrepreneurs who are striving for like six to seven figure mark. And when we put people in there, they hit the mark because of sheer proximity. And that's how rick sold his 100k offer. Not because I helped him with the 100k offer, but because he was hanging around with me for so long and it's like I can do 100k offer now because they get the belief because you always become who you spend time. And that's how I sort of hang out with Myron. Yeah, it's like you hang out with Myron enough, you're going to start to sell Andrecao. By the way, we sold our first million dollar offer.

That.

Yeah.

Which is insane. Yeah, it's insane because I'm not there to compute it quite yet.

But the thing is like I have friends that have invested $1 million.

In a one year coaching program and it, it paid off. Like they broke through a ceiling in their business that they were stuck at for three years and they were able to 5x that investment in the first year and then now you have that information for the rest of your life.

Yes, but.

Yeah, okay, so you sold a million dollar offer.

Only because I was hanging around with Myron. You know what I mean? Yeah. Hanging around with him for four days and you know, on the yacht and stuff. And after that it's like, was this.

Like a company like or an organization or was it like just a person?

Like was it, it was a person. Yeah. This couple entrepreneur, they're making eight figures a year. So.

You know, it's just, it's just insane. Like. No. Yeah, yeah.

Did you just hit a new level? Like turn up?

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Yep.

And they really focus on the like the problem in your business. Like it's very problem aware 5k workshop.

Yeah.

Just to get you to feel like what. Look what we're missing out on, you know. And one of the things that they point out is key man risk. Which is if, if, if we're building a business that's built around our brains and if we're not prioritizing SOPs and systems, then when we're out, the business is out. My thing is, is like all businesses have pros and cons.

Yeah. Right.

Profitability, whatever. But like building a business from your brain is one of the most high profit business models on the planet.

Yes.

And something, something that's very enlightening is that some people would have like built a business to sell in eight years and maybe, maybe they'd be able to sell it for 3 mil. I have a friend who sold his, his European mechanic shop for I think a little over a million dollars after having it for like 25 years.

Wow.

You know, which is, that's cool. Fine. What you know. But in my mind I'm like my brain's broken. Like like now, now the next. There, there's other levels to just different kinds of offers. When somebody buys a million dollar offer from you, it's just the ability to make a lot of money in a short amount of time is why I love this business model.

Yeah. Agree, agree.

But what did that, what did that sales process look like?

You're gonna laugh at this same thing. No, I'm not even kidding. I'll show you the dm. It's like, I won't mention the person's name, but hey, you know, I've got a million dollar offer for you.

Put a wink emoji. And then she's like, what, what? What? I'll tell you tomorrow. Don't tell me now.

Yeah, what is this? This I'll tell you tomorrow is crazy.

It works. But that's my personality too. So I always say it was talking about sales before. Like, sell to your personality. The mistake I've made when I've tried to sell like someone else. So everyone has a natural selling style. And I like to be cheeky and so sell to your personality. And the mistake I've made when I taught our students is I tried to help them sell like me. And so I'm like, that didn't work. So find out your natural selling style. And so if the cheeky DM works, then go for it. But maybe face to face works for you better. I'm not sure, but for me, that's how it was done.

Yeah, it's crazy. So that wasn't even a tiny challenge. That was just. No, you understood them enough, though. The relationship was there.

Exactly. Anyone buying $100,000 offer or more, the trust is immensely high.

100.

Yeah. So you don't really need to. You're not going to do a value stack. And, you know, that would be weird. Yeah. Here's a value stack and if you start, that's. No. Yeah. Okay.

I will ask you this question. And it's. We're talking about charging a lot of money for our consulting or coaching services.

Yeah.

Can you speak to the concept that just because it's a hundred thousand. A million, or maybe, maybe 10,000 is a lot for some people. But if I'm charging somebody a hundred thousand dollars, like, I have to give them my life, you know, like, we think because we're charging a lot, we have to actually give a lot.

Yeah.

Can you, can you speak to that?

Yeah. And that's the breakthrough I had with Myron. I Like, that was one of my reluctance to. Oh. But then if I do that, like, I'm tied down for a year and I'd rather not. Like, you know, we did well last year and, you know, I felt free. I can play golf, I'm writing my book, I'm here with you, I'm going to Vegas, like, all that kind of stuff. And I just didn't want to lose my freedom. So there's this misconception that the more you charge, the more freedom you lose. And so there's A story so about a dentist. Like, you know, I don't know if it's a real story. Like, this guy had a toothache and it was bothering him and he kind of left it, thought it would go away on its own. And then it got worse to the point where he couldn't eat. And then it got worse to the point where he couldn't sleep. A week went by, now so painful that it couldn't function. So he went to this emergency dentist and he said, I really need my tooth fix. It's. Something's wrong. Can you fit me in? It's like, let me try to fit you in now. Okay, cool. Sat him down on the chair and then put out his tools. Two minutes later, problem solved. The guy and wow, you're a genius. Came to pay the bill. It's fifteen hundred dollars. And the guy's like, fifteen hundred dollars for two minutes. You're a rip off. He's like, okay, let me put you back on the chair. I'll take three hours. He's like, no, no, no. Okay. You know, so people don't want more time. People want outcomes. And so that's what I Learned from charging 100k offers or a million dollars. It's not the time they want from you. Why would they want 20 hours when you can do it in an hour? Right. It's just they want the outcome. And high achieving people who pay that much really don't want more of your time. They just give me the outcome, give me the thing I need to learn, give me my next step. What's the hack? What's a quarter inch turn that I need for me to really take this to the next level.

Right? Yeah, yeah. Which is really something good that you brought up. Not to generalize people, but there is an observation with people who do value their time and they value what the outcome you can provide them, you know, could do for them, so much so that they're just easier to work with.

Yeah, yeah. Like you said about working using your brain, people like laborers, people who use their hands, they think the only way they can make money is with their hands. And then you transcend that and then the next level is people think, oh, the only way I can make money is through trading my time. That's level two. Then level three, the highest level is the only I can make money is with my intellect. And so people get stuck on that time trade level without going to the next level, without realizing they can trade that. And then fourth, fourth level is leadership. It's like, you know, you're not even doing it with your brain. You're hiring people who are smarter than you, who are doing things. And, you know, people ask me, richmond, how do you run your ads? And I have no idea. I have someone that's super smart on my team that's doing it, and I don't know anything, and they're so smart. And how are we running? Even with our. In our. In our business with operations, I don't even know what the SOPs are. Just my. Like, our operations manager is, like, the best, and if she's left, I don't know what I would do, because I don't even know how to do that. So now you can leverage the geniuses of other people and not your own, and that's when you can really scale fast.

Well, how much have you probably, if you're comfortable sharing, how much have you invested in your own personal development?

Well, up until Myron, like, that was definitely the largest, that 350k offer, I would say.

It's a good question.

Probably 1.2.

1.2.

I'd say close to that.

And.

Would you be. Would you have been able to get to where you are as soon as, you know, way.

Like, Since I started eight years ago, we've made $20 million, but most of it has come in the last two years. Like that, you know, exponential growth. Right. And there's no. There is no way, like, no way that we would have made that much without investing yourself. Like, that's. It's. You either pay for it or you pay for it. And. And I get that. Some people, you know, they join programs, they do things, and that they don't get the roi. And some. Some programs out there are really not that good. Right. And you got to take ownership by saying, okay, I've got to cut my losses and move on to the next thing, but you got to constantly just evolve yourself and grow, and that's. That's how you do it. Like, take responsibility.

Yeah. Really good, dude. So this book, what. I mean, we covered what. What did we not cover that's in.

This book right now?

Or is it just more detail or what?

Yeah, yeah. Well, it's got frameworks. It got scripts in there. Because if you're running a tiny challenge, one of the things that might happen is, you know, your course could go an hour and a half long, and it's like, whoa. And then imagine five course like that. And I'm an introvert by nature. I know you are, too. And that could be very draining on a person, especially if they were to say no at the end especially. It is. So it helps you keep the course tight, but also gives you a framework of what to offer at the end as well. So, and so one of the chapters in the offer is this is principle. So actually if, you know, McDonald's. Bad example. But if I went to McDonald's and you know, you go to McDonald's and you order on the screen now and they always have that, would you like this in some sort of upsell option?

Yeah.

And so if I ordered a small fries at McDonald's and I and you know, they got some upsell on the screen, they got over 100 menu items that they could potentially push to you, but they're not going to do that because then, you know, no, no, you will never come back. But they push to you like one or two upsells. And it's really interesting. If they don't get that right offer in front of you, they don't make money.

Right.

So how do they know, like, what, what's going to be the best upsell offer that they could push to you that would give the highest conversions? And if I ordered a small fries, people like, oh, maybe a burger, maybe sauce, maybe a sundae, maybe an apple pie, maybe nuggets, maybe the special $2 cheeseburger, whatever.

You don't want to know where the last time I got got at McDonald's was the sausage. Egg McMuffin is like four bucks. And then if you want to buy two, it's five.

That's the principle.

Yeah.

Offer more of the same. When you offer more of the same, that's the highest chance that someone will say yes. Because you are not guessing. You don't know if you offer a Sunday, they could be allergic to dairy. They don't feel like a Sunday. But if they offer, if you order fries, you know one thing about them with 100% certainty, they want fries today. They can eat fries. They're not allergic. So always offer more of the same. Anything else, you are 100% guessing. Wow. I always say guessing costs you money. Guessing is dangerous. That's why we get coaching. That's why you need to invest. Because if you're not getting coaching, you are 100% guessing. And so the principle of more the same, we're going into much more depth about at the end of the tiny challenge. How do we frame it more the same? One of the things is the title of your program should be the probably the same hook as your tiny challenge.

Good.

Because if they came in your tiny challenge, from that hook, then to offer more of the same, it actually needs to be a similar title. Even though the program, like you have a different title. You don't have to change what you're delivering, but at least the title has to match really good.

Before I go, I have, I have a. What is it? A very selfish question. But where can people connect with you and tap into what you're doing?

Yep. So the book's best place. Your tinychallengebook.com tinychallengebook.com Otherwise you can find me Richmond Din on either Facebook, YouTube, Instagram. That's like my name there. I've got the blue tick. There's only one person there. I mean, you know, I think I'm pretty recognizable. Like, you are. Like, you've got a unique look, so. Or you can get a tiny challenge book. That's how you can grab a copy of the book. Yeah.

And we'll link it up in the description. And if you're still watching DME and let me know that you're department fam, you'd be surprised that people are like, literally they're finding me on Instagram and they're like, I watched the whole way through.

Yeah.

Okay. Selfish question. So you said that you were golfing like three days a week and then you're like, I really need to write this book.

Yeah.

So can you just share a little bit about the journey? Because I want to write a book.

Yeah.

There's a part of me, though that doesn't want to write the book.

So.

Yeah. What was your process of writing this?

Yeah, well, I mean, it's my second book. The first one was more of just. I just wanted to write it for the journey of writing it, number one, like, commit to writing it and. Because writer's block is a real thing, but the moment you start writing, you know, things just start coming out and it is, it is a big time commitment. And but these days with AI, it makes it so much easier. And for me, like, I mean, English is my second language. I spoke Vietnamese when I was younger and then, you know, grew up in Australia. And grammatically, you know, I'm not the best, you know, in that. So I got a proofreader and proofreaders are very affordable these days. And so you write it and proofread it and get it done. The thing is the book, I believe. So with AI, with the world changing like someone could, you know, most 997 courses are going to be redundant now because you can just show me how to do it like that so personal branding is going to be your go to and so your book is going to like you. The book is the easiest way to brand yourself. It is easiest way to do it very quickly. Whereas building YouTube channel takes time, building your followers takes time, building your list takes time. All of those things take a lot of time. But a book is the fastest way to brand yourself, period. Today. Like even speaking all that.

Yeah, dude, I was actually told by a friend it's kind of why we moved into this new space. And it sounds so backwards, but it's the future of courses is just in person events.

Yes.

So it was, it was at one point easy to sell a course for $3,000 online.

Yeah.

But you could sell a two day, you know, accelerate a workshop for $3,000 and people kind of want to get around other people and get energy. And I've been thinking, so I've been seeing people crush these like they have these events that they either throw monthly or bi, monthly and then that's actually the first open door to the next thing, you know. Yeah, but I mean that's for people at different levels that can do something like this. I, I actually believe that more entrepreneurs are going to buy old church buildings.

Yeah. I love your building here, by the way.

Yeah.

So good. Thanks.

And, but dude, I love, I love this because I'm always searching for myself and also other people. What is the sure way that you could get the quickest result? And that's just like a constant journey. Right. It's just optimizing and, and, and dialing things down to its pure essentials.

That's correct. And that part of why I wrote this book too. And you know, so stop the golfing for about six months. I do believe that this is going to change the industry because it is the like the lowest common denominator foundationally to get paid in the quickest, simplest, least amount of friction way ever in any framework. It's the number one place to start in any industry in any niche. And so I knew that this was going to be a big game changer in the industry. So part of that was more from an impact goal as well. And, and I just wanted to really get it out because I really believe that more like probably in about two or three years time, the majority of the marketplace, their first dollar online was made through a tiny challenge. Like it's just, it's just going to be the, the number one go to Framework to help someone make their very first dollar online. And then when they master it, their first 100k 100k offer will be through a tiny challenge, too. So the scalability is huge. And it's for beginners, but also for highly advanced people, too.

Yeah, dude. So good. And this is just great for the marketplace because everyone can do it at every level.

Yeah. Yeah. So good, dude.

I appreciate you. Thanks for sharing. Love to have you back and just talk. Kind of like the next level of things. I think the next level of things is probably more deep. Just like more deep stuff for, for other people. I, I, I, I realize that when you put yourself out there to help others, there's a, there's a, there's a journey that we all go through to get to the confidence in helping other people. And there, you just exude confidence. Yeah, dude, you smiled this entire time, which is, which is amazing. Which means, like, yeah, dude, you found gold, bro. And so, yeah, thanks for being on.

You made it easy. Thank you. Thank you, Omar.