A Transformative Conversation With "The Retired Spy" JJ Brun

Have you ever been in a situation where you made a decision, you thought it was the right decision and then it turned out to be a big mess? Well, that happened to me in September of 1999 and I'm going to share with you on today's podcast, Becoming Wiser what happened in that experience 25 years ago this coming September.

Welcome to becoming wiser with Dr. Robert A. Rome, author and world renowned public speaker, as he shares stories, his experiences and lessons learned in a good spirited, positive and fun way. Here's Dr. Robert A. Rome.

Hi, I'm Dr. Robert Rome and thank you so much for joining us on our podcast today. We have been doing podcasts for a little bit over a year and they have taken off. And thank you so much for not only tuning in, but also downloading and sharing with others. We considering that I don't really know exactly what I'm doing in podcast land, I'm doing my best to make sure you feel edified, loved, challenged, taught, and all the other good things that we want to have happen in our life. Well, In September of 1999 we were having a training, Personality Insights. Does training teaching people the model of human behavior. And we had advertised and we usually had, you know, 20, 25 people show up for a training. But this particular one, back In September of 1999, one person showed up, one person registered, one person just let us know they were coming. Well, I, I, I made a phone call and said, listen, I think we better just postpone this and we'll do it another time. Thank you so much. Well, today's guest let me know in no uncertain terms. No thanks, I'm not going to put it off. I'm coming. I've signed up, I have registered online. I want to come get this training. I've already bought my ticket and you are going to have the training whether you want to have it or not. Well, there you go. Put that in my pipe and smoke it. So the next thing I knew, J.J. bruin left Ottawa, came to Atlanta, and the next thing I knew I was doing one on one training for about a week. JJ is our guest today. Welcome JJ and tell us a little bit about your first memories of Personality Insights and me back in 1999.

Well, back in September of 1999 was my first experience with Personality Insights. Just to clarify a few things.

My claim to fame, the Personality Insights is I was at the first training with your daughter Rachel. That was In September of 1999, a defining moment in my time in my career in the military. I had Specialized in the field of human intelligence. And I had come across your book, Positive personality profile. I hated it. I. I hated the color of the book. I hated the fact that the graphic was crooked. Personality Insights. Whoopee. What's that? I looked in the back of the book, and it had a website, personality insights.com. and when I went to that website is where I saw that there was a certification program on becoming a certified human behavior consultant. And the fact that in the military, I was specializing in the field of human intelligence. And my claim to fame back in. When I was serving is I was the first one selected for the role of a contact handler during. Since the second world war. For those of you who don't know that, a contact handler is a person where he or she is sent to a hostile environment. So for me, it was the war, the first war during. In Bosnia, where you had to cultivate sources within that environment. You know, cultivate sources, build relationships, determines people's intentions and modify their behaviors if and when required, you know, without the use of any Jedi mind tricks. So the fact that I had specialized in that field, I was studying and looking at everything and better understanding human dynamics is when I come across personality insights, the book Positive personal profile. I saw that there was an accreditation certification to me, just made sense. And I went there, fast forward two years. That's the year. Fast forward two years. That's the year where you were offering advanced disc behavioral studies. And that's when you cancel the course on me. And I was talking to Carl Smith at that time, your training director, and he was just like, oh, my gosh. And at the end, I think it was a blessing because you said to Carl, my memory recalls, well, you tell JJ that I'll pick him up and I'll bring him to his hotel, that he will understudy me for a week. I'll pick him up in the morning, I will bring him back at the hotel at night, and he will understudy me for a week. And I remember thinking, darn right.

So I forced myself to. You are on you for the advanced behavioral studies. But our first experience, it started back In September of 1999, when I first met your daughter. We're sitting side by side.

A defining moment in my life. And.

On my. Our last trip in February of this year, we were in Cancun with your daughter, with Rachel. And it was funny. We took a picture together, smiling picture. And in our normal.

Picture. And.

It'S funny for me how she's the reason why personality insights exists. She's also the reason why we exist as a company. If it wasn't for Rachel, for your character building moment with Rachel, I wouldn't be here today, 25 years now in business helping, equipping peoples for work of service with the disc model of human behavior. So thank you for tough for, for. Thank you for all your perseverance in my directiveness towards you.

It, it has been a great journey. It was challenging. I'm glad you clarified that because I do remember that you came to training in Atlanta and I do remember we break the room up or in this seating arrangement in D, I, S, C order in order to enhance the training experience so people can actually watch and observe how these behave, how eyes interact, how S's seem to want to be supportive in the and helpful in the class experience and how Cs tend to be very cautious. And you are over there in the D group where there's the dogmatic, domineering, driving, demanding, determined, decisive group. And you and Rachel were sitting beside each other. And that was for not only you. It was kind of a defining moment for me as well because little did I know the greatest marketing strategy I have ever been taught is one thing leads to another. And because of your interaction with Rachel and coming to training and then two years later coming to the advanced training where you were the only one who signed up and I did get to spend that time with you. It, it was like a turning point, you know, if you'll remember, and I hope everyone who's listening will really pay close attention today because something happened on that trip, the one where you spent a week with me and I'll never forget. Now for our listening audience today. JJ is his first language. He's bilingual. His first language is French. He's French Canadian. And. But he speaks fluent English. And every once in a while he'll miss a word or pronounce it wrong or say something. And of course I always laugh and say, your English is a lot better than my French. So I, I'll never forget after being with him for a week, it was a, it was a bittersweet experience because he's a high D and Ds tend to be a little pushy. I tell people you will not be as successful as you could have been if you don't have a D in your life to help pull you up or push you forward to the next level. Well, anyway, we were at the airport. I'll never forget. We were getting ready to part ways and JJ was in the front seat and I had been with him for right at a week. If I'm not, if my memory serves me correctly, he came in on a Sunday. We did training Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday. And then we had a little extra time together. Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday, right along in there. But when you were leaving, it had been more than, you know, three days. It had been an extended period of time. You were the only one in training, and you wanted to develop something for personality. Insights represent us, our interest in Canada. And then being bilingual made it even better so we could enter the French market. But I remember you getting out of the car and I said to you, I would. I would like to work with you because I believe you are anointed. Now, for our listening audience, anointed is just for those of you know, my background, I've been a school teacher, I've been a pastor. I've been in the field of education my whole life. And now, even with the disc model, continue to be a teacher and a trainer. So I told jj, I felt like you were anointed the world. Anointed means special. It means God's hand of favor or blessing is upon your life. It's a compliment. It's something we all should desire. Every day of my life, I want God's anointing. That means his hand of blessing and guidance and favor is upon your life. I'd rather have one day of God's blessing than a thousand years of my own labor. So anyway, I said to jj, I'd like to work with you because I believe you're anointed. Well, he didn't say anything. He sat in the car a few minutes, then he got out and we said goodbye. Well, a year later, he came to our next training right around a year later, and we were having dinner one night alone, and he said, can I. Could I ask you a question? And I said, sure. He said, what did you mean when you said that I believe you're anointed? And I recalled it as soon as he said, I recalled the conversation and I said, well, it means that I believe that, that you're special. I believe you're different. I believe God has his hand on your life and on your future and on your family. And as hard to explain, it's kind of subjective, but I just wanted to work with you because I believe that you will fulfill the destiny for which you have been designed. Well, J.J. sat there for a minute and he said, so it's a good thing. I said, yeah, it's a great thing. He said, well, you know, English is my second language. He said, I thought you said to me.

I will like. I would like to work with you, but I just want you to know I believe you are annoying.

And I hope everyone's getting as much kick out of this as I did, because there's a big difference between being anointed and being annoying. And so he had spent a year worried that I thought he had annoyed me for a whole week. But the funny thing, and I'm going to turn it back over to him, is I believe, based on his personality, he was kind of rough coming out of the military, kind of high D, little bit out of control at times. I believe he needed to hear that you are annoying, because he spent a whole year trying to understand the model of human behavior better, understand disc and represent the D type personality much better. So what was your recollection of all of that experience?

To quote jj, communication is simple. It's. It's just not easy. Did you understand what I meant for you to understand? So for me, when I heard the word.

Anointed.

I must try. I was trying to translate this in French, and the only thing that came close was ointment. And I'm, well, that's annoying. You know, when you have a wart, you have to put ointment to. And I'm like, I'm a wart. I'm annoying, I guess. I guess I'm annoying. Oh, I'm like, yeah, okay. And I'm not everyone's cup of tea. And I'm okay with that. I'm like, you know, I still want to do the work. I don't have to agree with everything. In the military, you had, you know, good leadership, poor leadership, but at the end, you'd still follow orders because, you know, you didn't have to like the person. And to me, I'm like, okay, so I'm annoying. Yeah, you know, tell me something I didn't know. And I just went with that for the whole year, as in, well, I'm annoying, but he still wants to work with me. Okay. And I just basically moved because I felt it was essential for us to take the model of human behavior, the DISC model of human behavior, and apply it to a program that I was teaching for the senior attaches. At senior attaches, they go on deployment, they go on a post for two or three years, and I was doing training for them, equipping them for works of service. So in the field of interviewing, debriefing and elicitation and understanding, temperament styles, personalities, people's Personas across culture is essential. And Critical for them to not misread the message. So I wanted that information. I didn't want to steal the information. I wanted to use information in accordance to, with permission, with Personality Insights. So for me, I was willing to work with Personality Insights and to be able to apply this to get better results for the clients that I was serving, which in this case was the senior attaches. Fast forward. I did 20 years in the military and the last five years in the military, I was specializing in the field of human intelligence and applying the disk model of human behavior in the as a strategic debriefing officer for the Canadian armed forces. When I retired as in 20 years and I started my own company, that's where it became very crucial for me to be able to run events. So I would have Dr. Rome come up to Canada in the spring and sometime in the fall. And in the spring, it also happens that, you know, it tend to be the cold months, you know, the February, March, April. And I would bring people together, right? Well, hey, I have eight people, and they need to be certified. And then Dr. Rome would come up and certify them. And then this would go on and on and on. After it was 2002, it was February 2002, and I think Dr. Ohm was tired of having his glutamus maximus frozen.

And he said, jj, you know all this stuff, why don't you certify people on our behalf? And that was the birth of the. The master trainer program. So from there, we're able to certify people on behalf of Personality Insights since February of 2022. And I've been doing that ever since and really specializing more into the French market. So I am today a global authority, a French global authority in the DISC model of human behavior. And that's because of my first experience, my first experience in September of 1999. You may or may not recall this, but you said, and I'm me. You were talking to me. You were saying Ds. But I heard, JJ, let me show you how you can annoy.

90% of the general population just by being yourself. And I'm like, yeah. I'm like, okay, I'm not everyone's cup of tea, but I'm doing pretty good in the military because back then I was like, I was getting results, but I was annoying. 90% general population. What I got from that is I was leaving 90% of the sale on the table. And later that day, Dr. Ohm, you said, would you be willing to say or would you be willing to learn to Say the same thing in a different way. What I got out of that, do you want to get better results?

And I was, I was ready at that point to stop having so much of the fighting of getting results, but more of just getting along to get results. So.

I've heard the saying before, when the student is ready, the teacher will appear. While I was ready to receive that, I was, I was that student ready right now at that point to receive that and to be a student and to learn from you and from personality insights, how to apply this within our family, within our community up here up in Canada.

Such a great history and memory of all that transpired. It was February of 2002. You had been coming back and forth for about three years to Atlanta, going through the Level 1 and then the advanced training. And as I was going to Canada coming up, I mean, I'm. I'm kind of a southern boy, you know, and I'm born and raised in the south, and I never seen that much snow in my life. I mean, we can get a light dusting of snow at the Atlanta airport and shuts down the whole airport because there's no snow equipment. And then I come up to Ottawa and there's seven and eight, nine feet of snow everywhere I look. I just couldn't get over it. Not seen anything quite like it. One of the things that I remember that you were so good at was sops, Standard Operating Procedures. And I wondered, is that something that you read a book to learn how to do, or is that something someone taught you? Because everything that we did together, you would talk about SOPs, and you would talk about Standard Operating Procedures. And I know that you learned some of that in the military and then. But it, it permeates everything that you do. Tell us a little bit about how that began to be such an important part of not only your personal life, your military life, but now your business life.

Well, it's not something that I knew I was good at. I come from a, an entrepreneurial family.

So Dan had a gas station, had a sawmill, had a whip, a wood chipper, harvest company. And I worked mostly in, at the garage. And when I was working at the garage, you know, dad would say, okay, when you, when you open up, you do this, and then you do this, and then you do this, and then you do this. So I was educated at a young age. What's the first thing to do? What's the second thing to do? What's the third? And. And I just took it for granted that's what you do Fast forward.

I always had a, a way of what's the first thing, what's the second, what's the third? As in what's the, what's the procedure or what's the, the steps? Even going out, dating. Okay, what's the first thing you should do when you date, you know, to date someone. What's the first thing you should do if we're studying for a test or what? I was looking for a roadmap way of, of getting to a desired outcome to that result. I never Knew was about SOPs so much. We are the sum of all our experiences. So I have a lot of experiences at home and then the military provided me a lot of experiences. We're also all the sum of our ancestors. That's our hardcore DNA. And I'm wired in a certain way of looking at things, of taking old information and converting it into new information applicable today.

It's just, I just see it, it's just, it's, it's part of my DNA as a style blend, as a DC style blend. Direct, demanding, decisive, cautious, calculating, conscientious. My brain works in that fashion. So when I see something I'm like, okay, I'm looking at it in order to be able to teach it back, to empower somebody to teach it back. That comes from the military. In the military, when you go and you're, you're going to move up the chain of command and you're going to go up in a different courses, you're going to learn how to take off, take your weapons apart and they will say step one, step two, step three, step four. And they would teach us how to take our weapon apart in, in sequence, you know, step one and you would put it from left on, you know, from left to right. All the parts would go from left to right. So when you put it back together, you go from right to left. It's just something that, that we learned and the fact that I learned it that way, when I became an instructor, they were teaching me how to teach this. So those were sort of like the learning lessons or the SOPs. So I tend to see things in that fashion. So when it comes to accrediting and certifying someone in the four temperament model of human behavior in the DISC certification program, well, when somebody is interested, oh, here's here's the first email that goes out. Here's the second email that goes out. Here's the third email that goes out. Here's the first thing that you teach. Here's the second things that you teach here's the third thing that you teach. I'm all about empowering the other person. I'm not trying to, to impress people of how I look. I'm looking to equip them in order for them to equip others. And for that, for this to work, it has to be a sequence. I came to receive this when I was in the military when I was teaching people how to go through a.

A gas, how to use your gas mask. So I'm, I'm trained in regards to how to run a, a gas hut where you actually train people to respect or trust your equipment. So you would teach them exactly everything on, on the nuclear or biological chemical warfare training. And then from there you have to run them through the gas chamber. And from there they have it. There's a certain things that they have to do. They have to circle around and then they'll have to remove their mask and then put back their mask and exhale all the gas out. But it has to be done step by step by step so that you have a good experience that you can trust your equipment. At the end there was one of the candidate came back and said, that's the best training of going through a gas.

Chamber that I've ever received in my career. And I just did it. Not for them to, to, to, to, to suffer through, but to understand how to trust their equipment. But I was just following the procedures going on the firing range. While I'm in charge of that firing range. One of the range that I love being in charge of was the grenade range. Well, the grenade range, there's some procedures that you have to follow. There's SOPs because you're accountable. So something that I've been raised as a young child in the military, educated. And the third, I'm wired for it. So that's how I see things, step by step.

That's so good. You know, on a practical note, every morning I just, you know, some people might think it's boring, but every morning of my life I do three, three things. You know, I have a. I get up early and I have a quiet time where I kind of meditate and think and pray. I make up my bed and I have a cup of coffee. Now I might have the cup of coffee, I might make up the bed, that I might have quiet time. But those three things, and if I don't have those three things, first thing in the morning is it feels like my day is off kilter. It's like it's jacked up or broken or something. But When I do it, and I'm pretty focused on doing those three things every morning of my life, everything goes better. So I just want to encourage everyone who's listening today learn to develop some standard operating procedures. Stick with them. Zig Ziglar used to say this.

People would say to Zig, and I know you remember hearing this, jj, people would say, well, you, you. You are all about positive motivation. You're a pma, you know, positive mental attitude. Well, positive thinking just doesn't last. And Zig would always say, you know, they would say motivation. Positive motivation and positive thinking don't last. Zig would always say, neither does bathing. You have to do it every day in order for it to be effective. So we just got a little bit of time left. I want to thank you for one other thing you've introduced me to. Not only your consistency and your hard work and developing the whole program in Canada, having me come up there till the point I didn't want to come anymore, and then also teaching me, helping me with our speakers boot camp as the D judge, and also our.

Learning of using standard operating procedures for almost everything that we do at Personality Insights. You were the one who introduced me to beaver tail. Now, I didn't know what beaver tail was because I'm just a good old boy from the south. And then I go to Ottawa and I find out there's beaver tail. And I want to know how long this has been going on. Now, just in case you're listening today, I'm going to let J.J. explain to you what beaver tail is all about. And I got news for you. It has nothing to do with the tale of a beaver.

No beavers have been harmed on this podcast. There's. There's two things that you got initiated with. One, Tim Hortons.

And specifically, you have a sweet tooth for maple syrup. So the maple glazed Tim Horton donuts. I still remember the first time with. With Julie, my wife, and she was like, no, he's not going to do that. No, he's. He's. He's not doing that. And what had happened is I gave him a donut, and Dr. Ohm ate all of the glazed maple syrup on top of it. So it's like all these little chewy pieces were left. But then he gets up and he's walking to the counter because they want them to put some more maple syrup on it. And Julie was just looking at him, John, you got to stop him. You can't do that. It's not.

I.

You can't do that. It's like, come back.

Oh, guilty as charged. I love maple syrup. Especially Tim Hortons donuts.

That's why. And I'll give him two every time he visits. I don't give him one. I give him two glazed maple glazed donuts. So that was Tim Hortons. But the first experience of the beaver tail, it's a pastry and it's deep fried. And then normally they put a type of a sugar and cinnamon. And of course, the fact that Dr. Home likes maple syrup or almost like maple syrup butter, they do have that option. And the last time that he had a beaver tail was the month of May. It was the tulip festival. And we went tiptoeing through the tulips. They had these 4ft tulips in a field. Like, there was like hundreds of these. And I said, hey, Dr. Rome, let's tiptoe through the tulips. And then. And then he got a beaver tail. And it's just. And it's just watching you eat it like you're. You're a child again. As in, you are so much in the moment.

And it's such a fun. As in. For me, it's just a task of, okay, I'm gonna get the beaver tail. For him to experience a beaver tail, I give him a beaver tail, and then I get mine. And then I look and you're no longer there. You're gone. I'm like, where? Where's he gone? And you saw someone juggling Arabian knives on a step ladder. Like, he was. He was juggling knives and you were underneath it. Because it's like you're just looking at it. And I'm like, you're teaching tomorrow. You're going. You're too close to the knives. And. And I'm like, every time with you is an experience I just have to watch so that you don't get into an accident.

That's what I jokingly say. You know, high eyes usually die from an accident. I, I appreciate you saying that because I do represent more of the eye type personality. You represent more of the D type. And we all have a blend of all four of those. And we're all on a journey of learning and growing and learning how to visit each of those traits every day of our life. But I got to tell you, being with you and Julie and your son Joel and your daughter Michelle Mikael, we say Michelle in. In English. It's just been such a treat. I feel like they have been part of my family.

I. I hope everyone who's listening today, I want to say Something to you. This is kind of strong. The way to grow in business and the way to grow spiritually and the way to grow as a person is by spending time with other people. And we are all different from each other. JJ has rubbed off on me. He's helped me to be a more organized and more efficient, a more focused person. I hopefully I have rubbed off on him, helped him to lighten up, want to spend more time with his wife and his kids, be a little more light hearted, not to be so serious. And, and so we've helped each other. We have created a mutual.

Beneficial friendship. And that's what I want. For everybody who's on our call today, I want you to learn how to have a mutual beneficial experience in life, with friendships and in, not only in your family and your friends, but at work, because people enjoy doing business with people they like. And if you want to grow your business, learn to like people. If you want to develop a good family, learn to do things together. And then if you want to learn how to really enjoy life, go to Canada and have a Tim Hortons donut covered in maple, a maple glazed donut. And then go to the Tulip Festival and have beaver tail and walk around and stand under the night the ladder with knives. And watch while you're being amazed at the knife thrower as he catches and juggles knives. Jj, it's been great having you on the call today. One last word, if you could, if someone were listening today based on all the things you've experienced through personality insights, your, your, your family, your faith, your business.

Just how much the information is the model of human behavior has worked in your own heart. How would you. What thought would you leave with someone today? What would you tell someone who's listening to say, well, why is it important to understand different kinds of personalities? Why is it important to, to understand and use the model of human behavior? This program is a podcast about becoming wiser. How has that helped you to become wiser?

Well, for me is.

When I was serving in Bosnia.

I knew the mechanics of being a contact handler. But you're dealing with people. And I've come to realize back then because I'm going into a war zone. And if you've ever been in, in that type of situation, you know you will have a coming to Jesus moment from time to time in, in those areas because life provides you those challenges.

The fact that you're dealing with people, you will. I came to realize that I'm, I'm at a disadvantage because I don't understand Human dynamics sure would be nice if there was one way of understanding the tendencies that people have so I can better connect and better understand.

So there's hundreds of behavioral based models out there and I would recommend find one and master it. I just read different books and then from there made my choice that Personality Insights was the, the, the company that I was going to deal with and I deep dived into discovering, experiencing and apply the four temperament model of human behavior as it was designed by Personality Insights. They have a different approach to teaching and I, I, it resonated with me. So anyone, whether you're in your business or in your personal life, you will find yourself at a disadvantage if you do not have a model of reference. And for me, having the four temperament model known as the DISC model, Human behavior is a model of reference where we can celebrate people's differences versus tolerate people's differences. And that is what made a difference for me. I speak three languages. You may or may not know this, but I actually speak three languages. I speak French, English and disconese.

That's something that JJ has kind of coined. That phrase disconnects. It's the D, I, S, C model of human behavior and he speaks it very, very well. We just so appreciate you being on the call today. In case you missed it, his full name is John Jacques Joseph Bruin, but he goes by JJ because that's a whole lot easier for all of us to say. Jj, thank you so much for being on our call today. We love you, we respect you, we appreciate all you've done for Personality Insights and for my, my own family and Rachel and the whole group as well. And then also for me personally, you've been a real friend and a real prince of a business associate and I, I love you and thank God for you. This has been another podcast by Personality Insights. It's called Becoming Wiser. Today you got to hear from someone who I consider to be one of the top three people that I have ever met in my life, who has taken this information and has allowed it to transform their life. Jj, being a hadi, not really into relationships or people very much, has become one of the kindest, most loving, gentle, yet firm, strong, focused individuals. And he's been our guest today. I hope you got a lot out of this. Trust me. Ladies and gentlemen, I've been around the world many, many times. I've met millions of people. I have five college degrees. I am educated beyond my intelligence. When I meet someone and I observe how they change over a period of time, it is impressive and JJ is one of my top three examples of people who's taken the information and allowed it to transform their life. Hope you've enjoyed our time together. We look forward to another podcast so you can become wiser in the near future. Thank you so much. God bless you. Bye bye.

For more information about this podcast, please visit www.becoming wiser podcast.com.