Attracting Love As A High Achieving Woman - Sami Wunder with Mel Wells

So in this episode, we really go deep into dating, especially if you are a woman who has been very in her masculine energy or a woman who is an extremely high achiever and crushing it at life in all areas. We talk about the dating world, we talk about getting into relationships, we talk about emasculation, we talk about polarity, and so much more. This is a really juicy one, guys. So buckle up and get comfortable.

Cool.

Hello, my loves, and welcome back to another episode of Love, Sex and Magic with me, your host, Mel Wells. Today's guest is Sami Wunder. She is a leading international dating and relationship coach who specializes in helping high-achieving women attract and keep romantic love. Her comprehensive approach shows her clients how to embrace strong relationship boundaries while still emanating an inviting, feminine energy. Sami has enabled more than 237 single clients to get married and more than 300 partnered clients to bring their marriages back from divorce in the past 5 years. So, Sami Wunder, the one and only, welcome to Love, Sex and Magic. I'm so happy to have you here.

Thanks for having me, Mel.

Oh, it's such a pleasure. Honestly, I remember the day that I stumbled across you online and I really remember thinking to myself, this woman is talking about something that is so needed in the world, and no one is communicating it in the same way as you are. And that is really— I mean, everyone's talking about feminine energy, everyone's talking about polarity, masculine and feminine dynamics. But the way that you do it is specifically in relationships and specifically for high-achieving successful women. So let's just dive straight into that. Why do you think the high-achieving woman who has got everything going for her seems to struggle when it comes to love and relationships or dating?

Okay, so let me start with my own story, Mel, because I think it's highly demonstrative of the struggles of the successful woman in her love life. So I was always an A student. I have always been a high achiever. I've always been ambitious, got all my gold medals in economics, and then got a full scholarship for my master's in Berlin. And whenever I set my goal, I would achieve it for the most part. And if I did not achieve it, then I would just, you know, tell myself this or something even better, which means I'm never going to accept defeat. I'm going to move forward. I'm going to pave my way. That meant I was forceful. I was assertive. I was in control of the things that I wanted to achieve in my life. And I had a lot of empowered masculine energy. I could do, initiate, organize, plan, get shit done. Now, this was amazing in my career. This was amazing for my studies. This was amazing for getting top grades. But when it came to my love life, it wasn't my best friend, this energy. Because what happened when I took the same energy, like let's call it the boardroom energy, the masculine energy, when I took it to my dates and my love life, what I started to see was that things would grow very quickly with the men I had chemistry with. So, you know, I would lead the connection because I liked a guy. So, I would initiate contact, I would pursue the connection, I would ask him out in a flirty, sweet way, thinking that he's, you know, we're living in an equal world and women are so successful and, you know, who's gonna wait on a man to ask her out? If you like a man, go ask him out. And so, I would do all this leading, pursuing, chasing, connecting through this masculine energy with men. And so, I would end up in really intense connections with men I liked. Only to see that they would either fizzle out really soon, so it would go get really intense for a few weeks, and then the guy would suddenly ghost on me, disappear on me, tell me that he wasn't feeling it for me, he loved me but wasn't in love with me. I'm sure every woman can relate with all those dramatic lines that men throw at us just to sort of get out of the pitch and not to play the game anymore. And so what I started to realize very quickly, that something was not working out in the way I was doing my love life. Something was off about it. Especially what was off about it was that when I did all this hard work to pursue, lean forward, get the connection going, I attracted men who were very passive. And they would go from wanting to impress me to becoming really lazy in the relationship, becoming really lazy at dating, so much so that— I remember asking this guy one time. He's like, yeah, you know, I've been thinking about you the last three days, and so good to hear from you. Here you are. And then I thought to myself, it takes two seconds to pick up your phone and one minute to write a text. If you've been thinking about me for the last three days, why didn't you just pick up your phone and write me a text? Why am I the one doing it? Right? So. Through a series of such events, I think we need to get into that place of pain before we really decide to make a change or really decide to make any kind of transformation. So for me, it led to when I was doing my master's in Berlin, I was meeting all these men, having lots of these connections that are intense and then fizzling out. And then at one point, I met this man who I thought would be my one. He was the one. We had an electric chemistry, electric understanding. You know, we spoke about the same things. And my inner, you know, little child who got excited, she went like, oh my God, we have so much in common. We think the same way and we speak the same way. And then this man as well, you know, 2 months down the line, just sort of suddenly got slow in his texting. And then 10 days later, when I had not heard from him, I reached out and I said, hey, what's up? I'm here alive. Is everything okay? And he wrote, you know, it's been really so wonderful getting to know you, Sami, but I don't think I can can give you what you want. And I think that was the time when it struck me that the way I am approaching my love life, which is more or less like I approach my career, my business, you know, I show up, I talk, I initiate, I organize. This is— there's something really off about it. And I have to learn how to do this differently, because if I keep doing this, I can see what it's going to lead to again and again. And I think that was the beginning of a really huge transformation for me. I can say the process I've developed for high-achieving women today, it really gives them like a 180 turnaround because I show women how, you know, you can be a kick-ass boss babe at your work, but when it comes to your love life, you've got to embrace your feminine side. You've got to let men be men around you. And if you're going to go into this whole equality debate, and I'm a strong woman, and why can't I pick up a guy and carry a guy and pay for a guy, you can. I mean, there's nothing standing against you doing that. It's just going to give you the kind of relationship where you attract men who are projects and men who are lazy. So a lot of my clients, you know, the high-achieving woman who can give so much, do so much, when she's not practicing intentionally the principles of polarity, it's not hard for her to attract men because she's successful, she's sexy, she's attractive. But what ultimately happens is that she ends up picking the slack. You know, she picks up the slack, the guy gets lazy, she ends up paying the bills, she ends up taking care of the kids, she ends up managing work, and she ends up becoming the entire director and president of the relationship.

Oh my God, so true, so true.

And it's so exhausting. She's so exhausted at the end of it all, and she's resenting herself for being in that place, and she's resenting the guy.

Oh my God, there's so much in there that I want to pick up on. The first one is, thank you so much for sharing all of that, by the way, and your story, which I just think is so good. And clearly you are living your soul's purpose through doing this work. When you mentioned about guys who seem to be such an amazing match and then they disappear, ghost, or say to you something like, I just don't think I can give you what you need. What do you think has happened to lead up to that? What has gone wrong in your expert opinion now?

Okay, so this is one of the most common scenarios I see with my clients, that men come on strong and then vanish or ghost or disappear or sort of put a brake on the connection, which is ultimately a disrespect to the woman because the man is saying, hey, can we take it slow? So the reason why this happens is because men, at the start, empowered, healthy, masculine men— I mean, I'm not doing man-bashing here because I think when an empowered man gets to meet an empowered, beautiful, sexy, high-achieving woman, he's curious about her. He's curious about her. It's almost instinctive, like when you see a chocolate cake, a piece of chocolate cake, and you want to eat it. It's that kind of an experience that the man is having. But if the chocolate— and in this case, the chocolate cake has to be smart. So if you are the chocolate cake and you give all of yourself to the guy, and you give all of yourself to him quickly, which is you're texting day and night, you are not making any gaps, the conversations are escalating quickly, you're going from small talk to sharing your deepest fears within 2 days, to sharing, to doing dirty talk within 3 days. If it's escalating Escalating at that level, what you're actually doing as the chocolate cake is that you're not valuing yourself and you're giving yourself too much to the man too quickly. And then what happens is that the man eats all the chocolate cake, he satisfies his curiosity, and he gets satiated. And then he nicely strokes his stomach, and then he leans back, he leans back, and he goes like, huh. Do I want this or not? Do I like her? Do I not like her? Now I've tasted what she has to offer. Do I like her or not? Do I want her or not? This is where even the most amazing women get stumped, okay? Because what's happening, and how I like to define it in my work and in my programs, is that there is a difference between intimacy and intensity, okay? So men Come for intensity. They come for intensity. They create intensity through words and actions, but it's not bonding them at an emotional level. What actually bonds a man at an emotional level is intimacy. Intimacy is completely different from intensity. Intensity is getting to know someone over a short period of time, At a super fast speed under falsely created intimacy. It's falsely created intimacy. It gives you the impression that you really know someone when you talk day and night, day and night, day and night over three days, four days, one week. You get the impression, the illusion that you really know someone. But the truth is you can't know someone. Till you have experienced them in various circumstances, till you've seen how they treat the ones they love, till you've seen how they become when they're angry, till you've seen how they deal when you set boundaries, till they see— till you see how they deal with disappointments in their life, you don't really know someone. Yeah. So the only way to really know someone is to build intimacy over time, which is to get to know the man and give yourself to the man in doses, in small, small doses. So, the way I teach my clients to overcome this phenomenon of men coming on strong, which I think you can just expect, is to pace. It's what I call pacing. So, smart women pace men because they understand that no matter how intensely somebody is throwing good words at you, It's still just words. It takes time and experience over time to really get to know someone and to really get to see their instincts, their fears, their behaviors in different settings.

I love that. So really slowing down the pace. I mean, what about for your scenario? Because you were dating someone for 2 months, everything was going really amazingly. you're spending this time together in person. Like, I think there's everyone in the dating space, I think, has this idea of like, I need to take things slow. I think we kind of know that. But like, once we get into what feels like, oh, we're actually getting into what seems like the start of a relationship, what would you say if like, then they disappear, right? Like, let's say it's like not been this intense thing. Like, that's one scenario. What if it was like gradually, gradually, a couple of months in, like your scenario? What do you think happened with that?

Okay, so 2 months is still fast in my world, okay. I believe anything before 3 months, I mean, it's not a magical number that you have to hold, but it's more or less the time a flaky man will not spend with you or invest in you unless he has serious intentions. So that is the amount of time you really need to be evaluating and testing a man. In my I think what went wrong was not just that I was—it was intense. It was still very intense, and I was meeting him, but it was still very intense and very too much too soon, very quickly. But I think what really went off there, and again something I teach in my programs in great detail, is I did not manage my emotional investment. I fell. I fell head over heels, and I gave. so much of my emotional, mental energy to this person without him having really won it.

Earned it. Yeah.

Again, you know, it hasn't been earned. It's just like, I just give it. I just give you my trust and I just give you my love and I just invest in you. So I always ask my clients, you know, move at a pace At which, if he were to disappear tomorrow, you wouldn't fall apart. You just wouldn't fall apart. You'd probably be a little sad. That's okay. You'd probably be like, "Oh, another one bites the dust." But but you wouldn't feel destabilized, or you wouldn't feel like heartbroken, which is where I was. Heartbroken. It was. Painful. I felt humiliated because I had given so much of myself to this person. And I think when it comes to managing our emotional investment, I have some tips that I give my clients. For example, if he's not in front of you, he does not exist. Continue living your life as if he doesn't exist. So we when we meet someone we like, what we tend to do is day and night daydream about this person, fantasize about this person, check their Facebook profile, check their Instagram two hundred. times, look at all their stories. And we don't realize, but it's all our time, energy, effort that's going into projecting a persona of this person that we really don't know. And our mind just sort of keeps building, who is he, you know, like, how is it going to be if he were to be the father of my kids? And like,

so true.

It sounds funny, but it's how I used to—

No, it's so true. It's so true. And we, we get so swept up in that. And it's so difficult because what I'm hearing you say is like, this is about self-control. And I think if you are a woman who's extremely tapped into her feelings and leads with her heart and wants to be authentic, it might— it's going to feel very counterintuitive to practice some of these things, right? Because we're so— it was so like all in our feelings and like we're this beautiful, heart-centered beings, and we just want to express ourselves, and we want to be authentic. And but, but, but no, but that's gonna hurt us, right?

Okay, so here's, here's how I like to say it, because I think the minute you say no, don't be heart-centered, or don't be vulnerable, I think that feels very restrictive energetically. So how I like to describe it to my clients is be the lighthouse, don't be the laser.

Ooh, I like that. I've not heard you say that before.

I've said it in the beginning of the love. Yeah. Okay. So Lighthouse is, imagine yourself just being at the harbor, a tall, gracious anchor tower who knows her worth and who's shining this light out into the world of men and sailors and knights and whoever's sailing on the ships. And you just shine your light. This is where all the feminine energy can flow out of you. You can be sexy. You can be, you know, you can be sweet and soft and funny and inviting, and you can be all like in your feelings and express your feelings, which is a huge part of the work I teach, right? It's not about suppressing your feelings or becoming masculine in the way you choose, but it's about understanding that the lighthouse is not like beaming the light on one sailor.

Mm-hmm.

Come. It's an invitation, right?

Mm-hmm.

Living in your feminine energy is an invitation to men versus living in your feminine energy as a laser light that is hyper-focused on one man, trying to convert one man, in which case you very quickly shift from feminine to masculine because the minute you shift from being lighthouse to laser, you're outcome-oriented. You have a goal in mind and you want to convert that man and you want to win him and you want to convince him that you're the catch and that he should pick you. This is where feminine shifts into masculine very, very quickly, from lighthouse to laser, and it pushes men away. Women don't realize it. Women, high-achieving women, think I like a man, I'm going to pull up my sleeves, and I'm going to seduce him with my feminine energy. It doesn't work this way because men pick up on this energy. They pick up on our laser energy. They can see and they can feel when we are performing for them and we are trying to convert them. And this is where being a lighthouse works so beautifully because your light and your sexiness and your sweetness and your softness is not focused on that one man. It's an invitation to all the men, right? It's— you are somebody that all sailors want to rock their boats on the shores for and come for a drink of your light, right? Mm-hmm. So this is where a woman who is truly embodying the lighthouse will always have suitors, always have men who are pursuing her, pursuing the connection, versus the woman who is the laser, And who hyperfocuses on one man, tries to convert that one man, and in the end sometimes ends up being really sad, really miserable, and really feeling helpless, which is hard to imagine because at work this woman is a rock star. So you'd wonder how come she feels so helpless in her love life, but that's because she's turning from the lighthouse into the laser energy, mostly without realizing that she's doing it.

Wow, that's so, so interesting and so true. So when it comes to men, when men are dating, what do you feel that they want? What is the role that they want to play in the dating game?

So I think it depends on the kind of man. You can't put all kinds of men in one box, right? So I, for example, when I started dating and I met my husband and attracted him and got engaged to him within 9 months of of meeting him and dating some other really great men. What I found was that it was really important for me to get clear on what kind of man do I want to attract, because there are all kinds of men out there, right? There are men who want— who will not wait for sex, not even 2 dates. Like, it's very important for them to sleep with the woman that they're dating. There are men who believe in equality and will never pay for a woman, even though they make a lot of money. There are men whose value is providing, whose value is making— I wouldn't say making a woman happy, but seeing a smile on your face really lights him up and makes him happy. So I think it's important for yourself to ask yourself, what kind of man and what kind of relationship I'm looking for? Because all of it is available. All of those kinds of men are available out there. And then when I started dating, I rejected many, many, many men because I'd go on a date and they were like head over heels feels and so nervous around me, which was kind of cute to watch, but then they didn't want to pay. And I was like, oh my God, this feels like friendship. Like, I'm never seeing you again, right? So of course, um, do I, do I judge them for being that way? No. Just like I have the right to define what works for me, they have the right to define what works for them. But I think it really empowers you as a woman that before you get out there and date, you really nail down what you want. So for example, in my program We talk about deal breakers and non-negotiables. So deal breakers are, I will not date a man who has— for some of my clients, who has children, who is bald. You know, like, okay, you know, you get to define all of that. And then there are the non-negotiables, which is, what do I really, really, really want to have in a man so that I never feel I'm settling, right? For some women, you know, it's as random as, I want a man who is At least above six feet two inches. Fair enough. You get to define that, right? Or in my case, I wanted a man with blue eyes. It was totally random, and I manifested it, right? So it's so important to define what you want versus try to worry about what men want, because there are so many different kinds of men out there. There's so many different kinds of permutations and combinations of men who are interested in self-development, not interested in self-development, making big money, not making money. So I think it's about the woman knowing what she wants and then sort of doing dating as an evaluation process versus like, I just fall in love when I see a guy.

Hmm.

Fall in love. So I think it has to become a little more intentional. Dating must be intentional. In fact, in my experience, Mel, what I've seen is that if my clients take a little bit longer to get to engage with a man, to like, you know, really evaluate, really test, really take it slow at the start, they end up having really solid relationships. And the more a man makes the effort in the dating phase, the more likely it is that that pattern will continue inside of a relationship, right? And so, my clients are not just marrying amazing men, they're also really happy in their marriages. Right? Like, they get adored, they get spoiled, they get flowers. He can't think of anyone else but them. And that kind of relationship you attract because these women, from the start, decided that they wanted empowered masculine energy men who are happy to give, happy to do the work, happy to lead, happy to pay, and just care about seeing a smile on her face.

Wow, I love that. It really sounds like, yeah, that the key is letting the man actually make that effort and pursue you. And if you are doing all the pursuing, if you are doing all of the effort, there's no room. That doesn't create any space for that to happen. And so that's obviously going to lead to relationships where you are, like you said, you are the the CEO of the whole relationship and still doing everything. So I've got a couple of questions. So I want to speak about, I want to go into rotational dating, which I know is something that you talk a lot about. And then I want to move into speaking about women who have kind of done a lot of the quote unquote wrong things and helping them come back. So let's first of all go to rotational dating. Why is this an amazing thing? I know you've spoken about The woman being the prize in love, in dating. Can you speak more into this and why rotational dating is so powerful?

Okay, so rotational dating is something I personally did after I felt tired of feeling like I was always at the mercy of the man to make me wife. And so for the few relationships that I did end up having, which was always such a project to Create in the first place and have in the first place. I always felt like, oh my God! I need the security of marriage, and then I would start all these conversations about the ring and the marriage, and then I would just feel like the man is putting the brakes or he's talking about yeah, you know maybe in a few years, and I just always felt like they're just test driving me. Now, what does what what does that speak about women's empowerment and love? Because I feel at the mercy of the man. To choose me and to stamp my worth by saying, yes, you're worthy of being wife. No, you're not worthy of being wife. And so I started to date, rotationally date in Germany. I think one of the factors was also that I was a traditional Indian woman in Germany. And so I didn't want to just— didn't want to let men just get into my pants without any commitment. And in India, this is also how we do it. You know, you have a lot of suitors. Yeah, you do a little bit hanky-panky, you kiss, but you don't like, you don't go all the way. And then the men are chasing you and pursuing you until they put a ring on your finger. You're single. Nobody, like, you can't introduce a man to your family as your boyfriend. Um, and so I did that in Germany. I said to every man I was dating that, um, you know, I, I don't believe in boyfriend-girlfriend. I think that's okay for teenagers and that's also okay for university. Early college, but I'm looking to settle down and find my forever person, right? So that's what rotational dating is. It's about seeing more than one man at the same time till you have the commitment you desire. Now, for some women, that commitment looks like buying a house together. For some other women, it looks like let's have children together. He's ready to create a family with me. For some others, it looks like building a house together. For me, it looked like a ring on my finger, like, you're gonna be my wife. And I still remember that evening in Berlin when Chris and I were sitting at this cafe. We'd been seeing each other for 2 months, and he just looked at me, and I just knew the conversation is coming. And I had decided this time, because I always used to lead the relationship talk before, so I always used to be like, oh, you know, where's this going? And this is so good. What do you think about us? This time I'm like, okay, femme energy. I'm gonna lean back, relax, let him wonder where this is going. And so I just could see it on his face that we're getting there. So he's like, you know, this what we have? What is this? I had a little internal giggle of victory. And then I said to him, well, we're seeing each other and we really like each other. It feels really good. And he's like, Well, I think we should become exclusive. I really like you. And then I remember again giggling. It wasn't all so perfect. I wasn't love coach Sami Wunder back then. I was just a girl who liked a guy. And I said to him, I don't believe in boyfriend-girlfriend. I feel really flattered that you feel this way about us, about me, but I am looking for my forever person and I do not want to put pressure on you. I do not want you to hurry this, but until you know that I'm the person for you, not just for now but forever, I'd like for us to keep seeing each other, but I'd also like to keep my options open. Oh my God, I'm almost sweating thinking about that moment because it took a lot of courage back then because I really liked Chris. Like, it would have been— it would have made me really sad if he would not have agreed to this arrangement. And I remember him going completely silent on me. For I think two or three days, he did not text me. He did not say anything, and we he walked me back home, and he was completely quiet on the way back, and I could see he's thinking and he's processing what I've said. And then I went home, and I you know had a little cry, and I felt like I've messed it all up, and I'm gonna lose the guy. Um, but I was at another level really proud of myself that I could pull it off with a man I liked. And then three days later, he messaged me. He said, "Okay, let's meet. Let's talk about what this." looks like for you, you know. And then I met him again and I explained to him what it looks like. I said, you know, I'm not going to be sleeping around. It's rotational dating, it's not rotational sleeping. And if anything gets really serious with anybody else, you can trust that I will let you know. Yeah. And basically how things unfolded from there was that he kept booking all my time. Like, I think he got— his antennas were up and he was like on red alert that there are other men in her life that she's possibly seeing. And every Once in a blue moon, he'd come over and he'd see some flowers from somebody else who'd sent me some flowers or something. He wouldn't ask, but I think he knew what was going on. And he just kept booking me, booking me, booking me. And I think within 3 months, he was like, can I come to India? I'd like to talk to your parents. And I was like, wow, this is serious. That's what it looks like. Because I think rotational dating, it takes courage. It's bold. I truly believe it's women's empowerment and love. I believe it's time women stopped feeling at the mercy of men to be chosen as wives. I think women can give themselves all the options they desire, test all the options, and only settle with a man who's really ready to claim them and who's really ready to step up for them versus give our hearts, get overinvested, get heartbroken again and again. So this is the cycle that rotational dating ends. You stop waiting years at the mercy of a man to choose you. You get in the driving seat of your love life. You call the shots. You have choice. You have power. You get to choose. And does it take courage? Absolutely, it takes courage because you're going to piss many men off. Many men are going to not like what you're doing. But in my experience, in my clients' experience, and we've had what, like 237 Engagements, and that's only the recorded engagements. Like there's far more than that. Happy clients who just go away and live a happy love life. What we've seen is that the right men, the marriage-oriented men, the commitment-oriented men, the men who actually want to build something with you—they're the ones who stay in the field. The rest get the rest all go away because they know like oh she's not gonna sleep with me. She's not gonna you know sleep quickly with me. She's not gonna become my girlfriend. I don't get any benefits. Like I'm just supposed to stick around and effort to win her. And I'm not going to do that because I'm lazy. I'm looking for something quick. So rotational dating actually helps you get rid of all the non-serious, all the douchebags.

Yeah, it's like a filtering out process. And you can't do that if you're just laser focused on one person. Yeah. And I like that you stipulated as well, rotational dating does not mean rotational sleeping. It doesn't mean that you're sleeping with several people, right? It just means that you are dating and letting yourself be dated by several people.

Yes, and I call it connection dates. So go for coffees, go for cinema, go for walks in the park, get to know each other, right? Some of my clients, you know, they feel really comfortable. I think theoretically you could date many guys, but in practicality, high-achieving women, they're busy. So my clients end up A lot of my clients end up rotational dating at the start, like lots of men at the start that they're talking to, and then the funnel just gets smaller and smaller and trickles down. And at the end, you're seeing like 2, max 3 men who are serious, but you just need one man to find and create the love of your life. So you don't need so many men, right?

Wow. So much, so much in there to unpack, but I do want to move on to For the woman listening that's kind of hearing this conversation and she's like, shit, I've done this the wrong way. Let's say someone's in a relationship, or maybe they're in a long-term relationship now, or a short-term, whichever. But they're realizing that they've maybe been emasculating their partner. They've been doing too much. They've been in the pursuer role. What advice do you have for them to start to turn those tables? And is it possible to reverse damage that's already been done?

It's not an exact percentage, but it's an intuitive percentage. 90 to 95% of our clients are able to turn around the bad dynamics. Okay, so if you're married to the right kind of man, or if you're in a relationship with a healthy, empowered man, and you've been doing all the work, and you've been leaning forward, and you've been giving, and you've been overgiving, What we remind our clients is number one, adopt the mindset that it's possible. It's possible to shift things around really quickly. I tell my clients energy can be shifted overnight, and I'm not kidding. Men feel it like this. So just to give you an example, my client, let's call her Samira. She used to welcome her husband home every evening when he would return from work, and she would like lean forward, kiss him. How was your day, honey? Do you want water? And he'd be like, no thanks. And he would just sort of, you know, be indifferent. And then she would cook all these meals and sort of, you know, let me seduce him and let me, you know, let me, let me please him. Um, And when she came to us, she was like, you know what, Sami? Nothing is wrong in my marriage. It's not like he hits me. It's not like he's cheating, but it's just flat. There's just no— there's no sex. There's no romance. Like, we're just functioning, right? And we're functioning, and I'm tired. Like, I do so much, and it feels like he's— it's never enough. And so the first thing we told her to do was just start with Shifting the way you deal with him coming home. And so she'd open the door, she'd say hi, and then she'd go sit. And then she'd pick up a magazine and read something. She did this for one day. She didn't offer him water, she didn't ask him how his day was, can I give you a massage, what can I cook for you. The first day, it was— he noticed it, but then he still went to his bedroom and opened his laptop. The second day, we told her to— she doesn't even have to open the door. She could just use it, use her Ring app and just open it with the button. So she opened it with the button and she kept sitting. He put his suitcase down. He came, found her, sat next to her, said, I'm making a tea. Would you like one? She said, yes, sure, that would feel good. And that was the beginning of turning the dynamics around. Just an example to show you how quickly men respond Respond to the creation of intentional polarity inside a relationship. So you have to adopt the mindset that this is reversible, and it's not just reversible, you can turn it around really quickly, of course, with the right tools, the right strategies, and the right mindset. That's one. Yeah, and I think number 2 is You know, look at my story. I don't think any client who has ever worked with us has come to us because they feel like they've done everything right and they're perfect, right? Every client who's come to us has had this realization. You know, my approach is not working. I need to try something new. So instead of beating yourself and blaming yourself, I think it's just so much more empowered to say, you know, okay, let's focus on the solution. What can I do to turn this around? And then do that and it's gonna work.

Beautiful, beautiful. I've heard you speak about creating positive tension. Can you explain what that means and how we go about creating it?

Okay, so it's one of my tools inside Leap Into Love or Elevate, which is my group coaching program where I go into detail on this concept. But basically what this is about is it's about creating unpredictability And uncertainty inside a man to enhance desire. Hmm. And it's tension because it makes men anxious. It even makes women anxious when they do it. And it's positive because it's good for your relationship. So, you know, I'm a big believer in— you know, I'm not a therapist, I'm a love I'm a self-coach. I'm forward-looking. I'm about helping my clients get results. And so, I think I always tell my clients, we see what works and just drop everything else, put it to the side. Just work with what you know, what I'm telling you works. And positive tension works like magic on men. It even works so well on Chris. So, in dating, positive tension will reveal men's character. Okay, so when you create tension— so for example, tension is sometimes just created by, you know, doing simple things like taking your time to get back to a guy, you know, not being stuck on your phone day in and day out and chatting like teenagers, you know, 200 emojis, but like just taking your time to get back to a guy. And it's gonna produce something, and a feeling of anxiety in him, a feeling of uncertainty in him. A man who is not capable of handling that tension is going to get back to you and say, I don't play games. How come you've not responded to me in 10 hours? But an empowered masculine man is going to be turned on by that, and he's going to probably double-text you, and he's going to say, hey, when can I lock down a time with you? Yeah, this is the power of using tension, because when you use it, people reveal themselves. Men reveal themselves, right? Imagine being speaking to somebody and looking at their message, and you being at a party, and you're like, okay, I'll get back to them tomorrow. I just saw the message, but I'll get back to them tomorrow. But imagine waking up the next morning and seeing three more texts from them saying, hey Mel, you saw my message, but you never answered. Hey Mel, are you there? Hey Mel, I can see you're seeing this. Why aren't you responding to me? You'd be like, oh my God, claustrophobic! Leave me alone, right? Tension reveals men's character. A man who is able to handle tension is revealing his capacity to engage with you, even when it's a bit challenging, even when it's a bit tough. In fact, men like it. Men are hunters by instinct, and so a woman who's creating positive tension, she's gonna have such a— so much more of an edge than a woman who's just showing up in this this friendly way where, you know, every time he messages, he gets like 10 messages back, and she's always available, and she's always there, and she's not busy living her life. Now, I do want to say something to this. This is a really profound concept. It really works, and it's a nuanced concept which, at first sight, can appear like playing games. Now, this is not about playing games, right? Because what we help women do is we help women see that if they really didn't care about a guy, didn't care about a man, they would do this automatically. It's like the dilemma of the beautiful, sexy woman— all these men messaging her that she's not interested in, and then the one man she likes not moving things forward, right? Now, what we're doing is we're replicating the way you treat the men you don't like with the man that you do like. So you naturally create tension with the men you don't care about. You just naturally take your time. You just naturally don't send them 200 messages. You just naturally don't laser focus on these men. And it works! And what works on those men is what works on the other guys. You know, the successful, handsome, rich men? They're still men. They still have the same instincts, right? And so this is not about playing games. This is about understanding man's psychology. This is about health. helping women see that they perhaps get a little too excited about the men they like, and then they start behaving in ways that they would not normally behave in if they didn't care so much about the man. So this tool, Positive Tension, helps women understand that perhaps the way I've been treating all these men that I'm not into— and it's working because they keep pursuing me and chasing me— what if I replicated this with men that I do like and do want to attract and do want to

Oh, Sami, you are just a cave of wonders. You are just a wealth of knowledge, and I could honestly just continue this conversation for hours. There's— I feel like we have so much to learn from you and your methodology and way of doing things. Where can everyone come and find you to explore more of your work, your programs, all of your material?

Yes, so just Google my name, samiwunder.com. You have to watch out for the spelling of Wunder. It's W-U-N-D-E-R. It's the German word for wonder. So S-A-M-I-W-U-N-D-E-R, samiwunder.com. And you're also welcome to join my private Facebook community. It's called Wunder Divas. And yeah, it's where all the amazing women hang out and we livestream and talk and engage. And you can also follow me on Instagram. It's @samiwundercoach.

Beautiful. Well, Sami, I always ask my guests these 3 questions just to wrap up our interview. The first is, what is one thing right now that you are loving?

What am I loving right now? To be very honest, I'm loving finding the magic of my body again. So I have given birth to 2 little babies in the last 4 years. I've felt quite depleted. It was beautiful, magical, but I had to go through surgery, stitches, labor, were breastfeeding. I was exhausted and I felt like I had, you know, lost my— in German we say Lebensfreude, like this, you know, like this aliveness and this vibrancy because I was doing so much. And now I'm slowly dropping all the weight, the mama postpartum weight. My little one is still 10 months old and I'm just really loving, you know, getting my power back as a woman and being in touch with my body and And like, just being— feeling beautiful and celebrating my body. I think that's what I'm so totally loving right now.

Beautiful. And what is one thing that turns you on?

I think what turns me on is seeing a successful woman being in love and adored by an amazing man, because I think there is this huge myth in the world of successful women that we get to have one or the other. We can either be 7-figure entrepreneurs or we can be wives and mothers. And when I see a woman, for example, like Priyanka Chopra and Nick Jonas sending her 200 flowers in her suite when she was away from him in London, I think that's the kind of romance when I see it, I get really turned on because I know it's possible. And that's what my mission is to really help high-achieving women see that it's possible for them. I love

that so much. And when was the last time you experienced magic?

Oh, just this morning when my 10-month-old just laughed uncontrollably and we filmed him, but like, he just couldn't stop laughing. And he finds the smallest nondescript, not like nothing extraordinary. And he just keeps laughing and laughing and gets these laugh fits and giggles. So I think that's magic. There's just nothing more magical than that.

So beautiful. Well, Sami, it's been such a pleasure to have you on. We're going to now go into my community and answer 3 more personal questions for you. But for everyone else, Sami, thank you so much for your time. And we can't wait to connect again.

Thank you for having me. This has been wonderful.