Satya Robyn, a Pure Land Buddhist teacher, combines Buddhism with Internal Family Systems therapy to explain how our minds work. She uses her dog Ralph to show how reactive parts protect us, and teaches how to respond to your inner critic with curiosity and compassion instead of judgment.
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So welcome everybody to this talk on being gentle with ourselves. And, um, I'm Satya. I run the Pure— the Brighter Buddhist Temple here in Melbourne. We're Pure Land Buddhists here, and I wanted to attempt to meld together two things that have been hugely important in my life, Buddhism, and the way of practicing therapy that I use, which is called Internal Family Systems. So I've got some people listening who are experts, some people who know a medium amount, and some people who possibly know nothing at all about, about Internal Family Systems. So some of this might be revision for some of you, but hopefully— I think even when we hear things that we know again in a different way, sometimes it can be helpful, hopefully. And I was going to use the example to begin with of how much I beat myself up over not doing more. I was going to talk about when I have to time free, which is quite rare, then all of a sudden voices start up that tell me that I should be cleaning that disgusting, uh, dusty corner behind the sofa or the fridge or, um, whatever. There's many things that I should be doing, and, and, and that starts up very insistently. Um, but before I came to the talk, Ralph Dog came and just sat and looked at me for ages, just looking up at me, and I think he was saying, can you talk about me in your dharma talk tonight, please, Satya? So it'll be about him instead. And I wanted to just flesh out how it is in my head, at least, when I'm not being gentle with myself. So Ralph Dog is now a year and a half, something like that, and he came to us when he was 7 months because his family couldn't look after him anymore. And when he arrived, we didn't really know that much about dogs. We only have one— we had one dog from a puppy before him, and he seems like a very resilient chap. He was very chilled when I went to fetch him in the car, which was a few hours' drive north from here. He was with his family, with his two little children and the parents, and when it was time for us to go, they were all crying, it was awful, I just said, "Come with me," and he just kind of came with me, trotted along, got in the car, and seemed to take it all in his stride. He was quite barky when we got him, he was quite easily startled, but he seemed very like he was settling in well. And then we noticed that he was getting more and more reactive around other dogs, and he would— he started going up to other dogs and shouting in their faces. And I didn't really know what was happening, and so I'm sure that that didn't help the problem because he was actually frightened. He was getting more and more frightened of other dogs and trying to scare them off before they ate him or whatever he thought they were going to do. And we got to a place where he was very, very reactive. Even if a dog was a long way away, he'd start lunging and screaming at it and It was all very stressful. So I started trying to learn about what was happening and how I could deal with the situation. And there were lots of different parts of me that were having a conversation about what was happening. So there would be— I had a whole team in there, actually. So there would be a part that would try and minimize the problem, and it would say, oh, 'it's not really that bad, he'll get over it, he's met dogs before and it's been fine.' There was a part that needed to know everything about reactive dogs and how to deal with them, and that part bought probably 10 books, watched lots of YouTube videos, went to see trainers, was always thinking. And there was a part that was quite despairing and thought that he would never change and we'd never be able to go on ordinary walks with our dogs because we couldn't go anywhere narrow because he'd go crazy if a dog came. And there were also some parts that were very loud that were telling me the whole time that I wasn't doing enough. I wasn't doing enough, I wasn't doing it properly, I didn't have enough information. I wasn't doing enough training, and it was really quite a painful time because there were also other parts of me that were listening to these voices that were giving me a hard time and just feeling really hurt by it. Just as happens when someone else has a go at us, there's parts of us that are vulnerable that, that are the recipient of that ire and it makes them feel bad. So just to introduce Internal Family Systems, the idea is that this is a way of seeing people and a way of helping people. And the idea is that, as I've just described my experience with Ralph, that we all have different voices inside us, different parts of us that have very different jobs and very different motivations and very different experiences and opinions about things. And that all of these parts inside us have relationships with each other. So it's like a family, it's called Internal Family Systems. It's like a family system, but it's inside our head. And the idea is that there are broadly 3 different categories of parts. There are the 2 categories that help to protect us and keep us safe, and then there are the vulnerable parts. And the vulnerable parts are often younger parts, so maybe something happened when we were 3, we couldn't handle it, there was too much emotion, so it just kind of gets put in a cupboard inside us. And then there are lots of protecting parts that come and form around that vulnerability to protect it and to keep it from flooding us. So we might have a part that if it starts to feel emotion, it will give us— it has the job of getting us to a biscuit tin really fast, or it will turn on the telly or it will shout at someone, or it will go and do some press-ups. I don't have any of those parts. So all of these protective parts keep us away from the vulnerability and the shame, the fear, the sadness and grief, the anger, all of that uncontrollable stuff that happens that we can't deal with at the time, and it all gets kind of sealed away somewhere inside us. And so there were the young parts, that's one group, and then the protective parts, there's two lots of them. One lot is reactive and it's like emergency stations, so these are the ones that will shout at someone or shove cake down us or make us leave the party. And then we have proactive ones, which are more kind of like managers, and they'll plan our life for us. They're the ones that deal with diaries. They also are all the ones that criticize us for things and think that if they do certain things, if they manage us in a certain way, they'll keep us away from, from trouble, from feeling like we're not worthy, or from feeling grief, or whatever it is. So just to go back to my example of my experience with Ralph, there were some very young parts of me that felt completely useless, worthless, and that felt shame about how I wasn't good at stuff and I couldn't, I could never, I could never be enough, I could never do well enough. And those young parts were really kind of triggered. So then all the other parts came in which were trying to help me to manage the situation and, and make me feel better about myself and deal with Ralph better. And those parts worked really hard. I felt like I had a whole department that was working on Ralph's training. A lot of them are a little bit more relaxed now, but there was a lot of activity going on. So the title of this talk is Being Gentle with Ourselves, and that— look, for me, when I'm not gentle with myself, it's because there are parts of me that are doing things that they think are really helpful that are actually really hurting other bits of me. So there's a harshness, a criticism, a judgment, pushing too hard. So maybe, you know, there's part— I've got workaholic parts that kind of make me do more and more and more, and then I get tired. Parts that feel like I'm not a very good Buddhist, or I'm not a very good wife, or I'm not very good whatever. All of those parts are the ones that say the things or make me feel the way that I feel, that wounds me, that wounds me a little bit, or wears me down, or gives me a sense of deflation. And I think that what's commonly proposed as a way of dealing with these parts is somehow shutting them up, is somehow getting them to stop being mean to us by either ignoring them or counter-arguments or positive affirmations. I think I did that thing when I was younger of standing in front of the mirror and saying, "I love you," or whatever it is. The idea is that that will kind of run over the top of what these parts are saying about us and to us. For me, they never quite felt right, those things, But since using Internal Family Systems in my psychotherapy practice and in my life, I realized that it's like, it's like having a meeting and there's a person that comes to the meeting that is really anxious about something, and so they pick holes in everything you suggest. It's like just pushing that person outside the room. Or it's like telling them to shut up, or it's like telling them, "It'll be fine, don't worry." If someone's feeling anxious about something and is becoming critical or judgmental or angry or whatever it is, they don't need to be shut up. They need to be heard. They need to be welcomed. They need to be understood. They need to be loved. They need to be seen with the eyes of the Buddha. And I will talk about Buddha later. I know I am— this is a Buddhist talk, she will come into it later. So the revolutionary thing for me was this idea that all of the parts that we have have good intentions for us. They are trying to do something for our system that will help our system stay steady, and that they believe that the way that they're doing it is the only thing that will work, and that the more we shut them up, the more they feel like they need to shout at us. So when I say to myself, "Oh, you're not doing enough training with Ralph," the temptation is for another part to get involved and say, "Oh, you are doing enough, and also you do all these things, and blah blah blah," to kind of— that part's rationalizing with it or doing the counter-argument, and it leaves this one just as unheard and just as anxious. Instead, my suggestion is that we find a place where we can become curious about why we're beating ourselves up. What, what is the job of that part? And we can meet that part where it is and begin to really hear it and understand it, really kind of, you know, sit it down, give it a cup of tea. Say to it, "You've been really active recently, you've been really noisy. Is there something going on? Is there something you're worried about? How is it that you think you're going to help me by doing this job?" And as we do that, the different bits of us feel heard and understood, and they can relax a little bit. Because they're not just shouting into an abyss. And that's not— of course, that's not always easy. And one of the reasons it's not easy is some of these parts can be pretty harsh. Some of these parts can be quite violent in their manner, in their behavior, and I've talked about the kind of the not being gentle to ourselves parts so far that are quite mild in comparison to addictions or self-harm. Suicide is also a part that the kind of the ultimate protection part that tries to protect us by ending the pain in the only way that it knows how to do it. And to be around that kind of energies can be very difficult. And what can often happen is that the intense part will do its thing, it'll start doing its thing, and that rather than being able to be curious and compassionate towards it, another part of us will pop up that tries to protect us from it or push it away. Or that gets into an argument with it. And most of the time what happens in our heads is parts of us talking to other parts rather than being able to find that space where we can, where we can see the whole picture and feel spacious enough to invite them in and listen to them one by one. So I sometimes say to my clients, it is a bit like having a meeting and everyone's just arguing with each other. There's no space for anyone to hear each other, and there's also nobody kind of holding the space. There's no grown-up in the room. There's no one who can say, "I hear you. Can you pause so I can just hear from you first, and then we'll definitely get to you?" And someone that can care for all the different bits, because I think there's nothing worse than feeling like the person that's listening to you is kind of really interested in what the other person's saying, but they don't really like you so much. So there's something necessary about everyone being welcome, all the parts being really welcome. Yeah, and this spacious place where we can feel compassion and curiosity towards the different bits of us that are beating us up, um, for me, this is Buddha space. This is the kind of energy that the Buddha embodies, that the Buddha exudes. I was going to start this talk with the poem by Inagaki, which I forgot to do, so I'll do it now instead. There's a Pure Land Buddhist called Inagaki who wrote a very short verse that we used to have on the abord outside the temple, And it goes, just as you are, really, just as you are. For me, this sums the Buddha up, that the Buddha sees all of our parts, especially the ones that we maybe aren't so keen on ourselves. And the Buddha is absolutely compassionate towards all of the different parts, that all of the different jobs that the different bits of us do. Because the Buddha can— the Buddha can understand. The Buddha sees straight into us. He doesn't have to ask questions. He just gets it. And, um, there's an effortlessness, an effortlessness for the Buddha. Of meeting all those different bits of us, the bits that are mean to us, the bits that are mean to other people. He sees them all as parts of us trying to do their best in the only way they know how. They're doing their kind of their protection job. Some of them are a bit like bouncers that kind of, you know, they they've got a bit grizzly and grumpy and they take their job really seriously and you don't want to mess with some of them. The Buddha can see behind that into the vulnerability that's being protected, into the loyal nature of some of those parts of us that they just do their thing regardless of how it hurts other bits of us because they believe that it's the only way of of keeping us protected. So Pure Land Buddhism says that very simply that we are accepted just as we are, and that we don't have to do anything or be any different for that to be true. That in this instant right now, we're all of us being seen and the thoughts that we are happy to admit to, the thoughts that we're not so happy to admit to, the little judgments that float through us, all of those the Buddha sees, and there's a space for all of that which is gentle and compassionate. And so when we don't manage to to treat these parts of ourselves with kindness. The Buddha can do that. And even if we don't believe in the moment that the Buddha can do that, we can— even if we can kind of imagine that maybe it might be possible that the Buddha is seeing us in that way, that's helpful. It might not always make us feel better straight away. We might just be completely taken over by a part of us that thinks that we're the worst thing ever, that we're never going to improve, or that we're never going to be enough. Just knowing that there's something out there that can accept all of that and really not just accept it, but feel warm towards it and feel tender towards it, can soak into us. It sort of soaks in like that kind of really fine rain. I know that's a common metaphor in Buddhism, that you almost don't know that it's happening, but it really soaks you, really gets into you. And so there is this, um, there's this relationship between this spaciousness inside us which is calm and curious and courageous, and from which we can see the parts working inside us. And the energy of the Buddha that, that is there regardless of whether we find that space or not. And my experience is over the years as I've worked with internal family systems and had therapy and had a practice and, and had a relationship with the Buddha, with the divine, that's that's continued over the years, is that it becomes slightly easier to catch myself in those times when one of the parts of me that criticises me has stepped into the driving seat of the car and is driving the whole car. The idea is that these different parts of us can either all sort of work together, or one of them can panic and feel like it needs to, to direct the whole system for a while. And when that happens, we're just looking through the eyes of that particular part. So when we're feeling overwhelmed with despair, or overwhelmed with anger, or anything that overwhelms us, that fills us completely, that's because one part of us is, has taken over the reins and is in charge. And that as I get more practice at knowing what's happening when that happens, and when you know what's happening there's a bit of you that knows it's happening that isn't in it, so there's a tiny bit of space. And I also feel more I feel more, more closer to the memory of how it is to know that the Buddha's there. It might not be that I feel that the Buddha's there in that moment, but I remember at least that there were times when I did, and that, um, something quite difficult to put into words. About it. I guess maybe it's like living near the sea or something, that you kind of see it and then you don't see it, but you kind of, after a while, you know it's there. And it's— even if you can't see it or you can't hear it, it's present in some way, and it doesn't go away. It's always there as something that you can rely on or lean into. There's a quote that I printed out earlier by Thubten Yeshe Lama, Yeshe, which is, be gentle first with yourself if you wish to be gentle with others. 'Be gentle first with yourself if you wish to be gentle with others.' And I really like that because I think it, it speaks of that practice of being able to meet the ugliest parts of ourselves, or the most frightening parts of ourselves, or the most despairing parts, or the cruelest parts, with that kind of tenderness. And really experiencing how bloody hard that can be, that there's plenty of work there, there's plenty of practice at coming back to kindness towards those parts of ourselves. Buddhism often speaks about caring for others and being kind to others, because it can I kind of like to think of our parts as other people. So when, you know, when Jesus spoke about loving your neighbors as you love yourself, you can think of the different parts of you as your neighbors. They are, they have, my experience is they have their own life, they have their own, they know things that I don't know. About what they're doing and why. So to treat them as other kind of makes sense to me. There isn't much spoken about in Buddhism about self-care. I read earlier this afternoon, Bodhipaksa was saying that he thought that maybe there was something that was just taken for granted, that we look after ourselves as well as looking after others. But I think that it is in there, it's in the great spiritual teachings. It doesn't make sense that the spiritual teachers would encourage us to be kind to others, which they all do, and leave out you. It doesn't make sense that they would— to me, it doesn't make sense that they would want us to sacrifice ourselves or overwork or treat any parts of ourselves as we wouldn't want to treat other people. One of my favorite quotes from— well, my favorite quote from the Bible is I'm sure you know this one, when Jesus said, 'Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light.' And I really love that because it just speaks to me so beautifully about how when we do lean into living a spiritual life and we do put kindness at the heart of everything, we can trust that we're not going to be treated badly, we're not going to be asked to do 20-hour days, because Jesus's yoke is light and there is a kind of a lightness that comes from that space, that spaciousness. Because of course we would be kind to those parts of ourselves, because kindness is just natural, it's just coming out of us, it's, um, we're exuding it. And I do believe that there is a natural sort of spring of kindness and compassion that only gets stopped when we are afraid, when, when there's protection protection is necessary. And yeah, it's easy to talk about it, but much harder to live it. And that's a part of the gentleness too, I think, is to really deeply acknowledge how, how protected we are, how frightened we are, how vulnerable we are, how many wounds we carry from our own life and from our parents' lives and from their parents' lives. And to know that we will continue going in and out of a kind of being able to be kind to ourselves and other people, and chaotic, overwhelmed, messy places that I'm sure that we all know. Yeah, so really what I want to leave you with is that knowledge that we are all made up of different voices, different parts who are trying to protect us in their own way, and that the ones that criticise us and judge us feel mostly that if they don't do that, we're going to do something that will make it worse. They would have learnt from our parents or wherever that that's what they think will help us. And so however much chaos they cause and how much pain they cause to other parts of us, their intention is good. It's to see if we can begin to step back a little tiny bit from those parts when they're active and to get curious about them and to wonder about what their job is or what they think would happen if they didn't do their job. It's about knowing that there are young, tender parts of us that are carrying all kinds of burdens from our childhoods and from things that have happened that were too much that we just couldn't process. And it's knowing above all that when we can't do that, because we often won't be able to— sometimes we're lucky and someone else can do it for us, But whether or not other people are there, the Buddha is always there, and the Buddha says, 'Just as you are, really, just as you are.' And we can always lean into that. So I think I will stop talking, and thank you so much for your ears. And I will keep recording if anyone's got a question, and then I'll maybe stop recording if you've got a question you'd rather not have recorded. So any questions or comments? Yeah, Abi. Satya, really lovely talk. Yeah, all of this stuff is just really current for me. My therapist does IFS as well. Yeah. I wanted to ask, something I wonder about is this sort of compassionate loving presence, like sometimes I can offer that to myself, it's me doing it, but then also there's this sort of external, and I wonder, sometimes I sort of think, well, what should I be turning to, my own capacity, or this sort of, do you know what I mean? Yeah. Thank you, that's a really great question, and It's apparently a debate that has raged in the IFS world for a while, with Buddhists and IFS people kind of trying to work it out, and it is a really interesting question. I think that if you're the kind of Buddhist that talks about Buddha nature, then Buddha nature and that spacious, clear inside place could quite easily be seen as the same thing. Because I'm an other power, I'm more of an other power Buddhist, it's a little bit more complicated. I had a client actually who asked that question to one of her— there's something in IFS called guides, which are kind of not quite parts of us, but they're very wise, and they asked their guide that question, and the guide just said, "They're the same thing." So I really liked that. But for me, there's something about imagining that there's a window, and that the Buddha for me shines light through the window, and that our parts kind of COVID up bits of the window, so there's just— there's less space for the light to come through. And what I don't really know is that there's something about the origin of the light that's really interesting to me, which I think is what kind of what you're asking. And your question was, where should you turn? And I guess that I think my answer is probably the same as this person's guide. Is that actually it doesn't matter because the substance is the same. If it's compassionate and clear and spacious and it doesn't have an agenda, it's good, go with it. And I kind of like having something that's more outside because I like that idea of resting on something or against something or into something. So for me, that works for my system. Is that I like to feel like I'm not on my own. And actually in IFS, we're often talking about relationship, aren't we, between self and the part. They call it self, the curious compassionate bit. So there is something about having that space between the two, which is quite nice, which is maybe harder to think about if it's very close to you. So one answer would be they're the same, and another answer would be whichever you can manage. Because I think sometimes if, like I was saying, if you can't find any, if there's no access, nothing in you, there's no space in you, then that's when I think you have to, you're forced to rely on something that's outside. And for me, those moments are more powerful than finding the resource within myself. There's something humbling and connecting and something about unity, something about being more connected to something bigger than me. Yeah, so that— I don't know if any of that helps at all, but that's my— yeah, do you want to say anything about that, Caspar? Because you're also—
yeah, I'll just share an experience I had as a client. As a client, moving towards a particularly painful memory or part that was in a particularly painful memory. And there was some sort of ambivalence in me about whether, how fully I could turn to meet it. And then I had a very strong felt sense of a compassionate presence that wasn't me, that was next to me, that was supporting me. And in this kind of space where I was on the edge of this, looking into this, the, the, this memory, from the edge of this memory, I looked down in my mind's eye and I saw a hand holding a sphere, and I thought, oh, that's Medicine Buddha, um, who carries the ball sometimes. And it was such a strong sense of an other power that, that sort of supported me to go into this space and do the healing work that was needed at a time when actually I had some of that energy available but not enough to do that work. And that is part of the reality, you know. As a therapist, I'm supporting my client to find that in themselves, but as often as not, I'm also lending them my spaciousness. Something different happens when I'm working with another person as a client or a therapist as to when I'm just working on my own, you know. And in a group setting, when there's a demonstration on a training course, for example, and you're surrounded by people people who are each, um, at least setting the intention to find that spaciousness inside themselves, the healing is more powerful because more of that energy is around. So for me, both— if you can have both, have both, because it kind of, it boosts, uh, the possibility, you know, it makes more things possible.
Any other questions? So I'll pause there and say thank you very much. I'm going to stop the recording and namaste.
