Creative on Purpose Live with Leekei Tang

Please fasten your seat belts. We are zipping across the ether at the speed of bytes. And as soon as we land on the— since we are already live, so I say let's go. Welcome to Creative on Purpose Live. To learn more about Creative on Purpose, visit creativeonpurpose.com and get going with the difference only you can make. Remember that this broadcast is also an iTunes podcast. Check it out. Leave a 5-star review. 30 seconds of your generosity helps spread the goodness delivered by my guests. Let's get to today's show. Welcome to Creative on Purpose Live. These conversations are about flying higher and the difference only you can make. Endeavor better. It's time to be creative on purpose. Are you ready? Let's go. I'm your host, Scott Perry, author of Onward and Difference Maker Coach at Creative on Purpose and Akimba Workshops. Visit creativeonpurpose.com to start doing better work by making Better decisions. This season, we're drawing insight and inspiration from guests who are successfully embracing uncertainty, navigating adversity, and making things better doing work that matters. Let's meet today's guest, Liky Tang. Welcome to the broadcast. Please tell our viewers who you are, what you're up to these days, and where can they go to learn more about you and the difference you make.

Right. Um, my name is Liky Tang. And I'm based in Paris in France. And people, well, actually I am launching a new website which is called betterbusinessfounder.com and you can find me at betterbusinessfounder.com.

And tell us a little bit about what, what, what does, what's this work that you're doing at betterbusinessfounder.com? What is, what is the change that you're making and who is your work for?

Right, I believe that the purpose-driven fashion business is impactful only if the business and creative goals are always balanced. And I realize that fashion business founders often believe that they do not have the business skills to bring their brand, their company to the next level. But in fact, we all have the potential to acquire those skills. So I launched Better Business Founder with a mission to enable the potential of purpose-driven creative brands by demystifying the mechanics of running a business so they can grow their business in the way they have decided, in their very own way.

Fantastic. So is it primarily consulting, coaching? Is it a little bit of both?

Um, for the moment, um, the— it's mainly, uh, well, actually I've been doing consulting and coaching for a couple of years around that, that, um, that topics. And now I'm trying to go bigger. And so I have a podcast, I have a website, and, um, I soon will be launching, uh, courses and coaching programs.

Yeah, and so I'm very aware of your podcast, which is a fantastic podcast. Um, you've even lowered your standards to allow people like me to appear as guests on your podcast. Um, tell us what— just go ahead and share the name of the podcast with our viewers so that they can check it out and tell us a little bit about the conversations that you have on your broadcast or on your podcast.

Yeah, on my podcast, actually, um, at the time you— I had the honor and the pleasure to have you as a guest. It was called Mindful Business Founder. Now it's been rebranded as Better Business Founder. And the Better Business Founder podcast is for fashion business founders that are purpose-driven and that are seeking to build a successful business in their very own terms. Because there are different ways to be better. And, but it depends on who you are and how you define success or how you define better. You could be, you're better by if you want to, if you grow sales, you could be better if you make more impact, you could be better in fashion, you could be better, you could be the best if you have, if you have, you sell everywhere. But I think that this is, um, there's no universal definition of better, and especially in the fashion industry these days, because everything has been reshuffled. And so we are all searching, and we're all searching to exist and to become better and create our, to leave our marks and to see how we can do better. In every sense of the way.

Well, I love how your definition, because better is a word that we use a lot at Creative on Purpose, as you know, and it is open to interpretation, obviously, but the idea is making progress in whatever your endeavor is, to be stepping into better possibilities in whatever domain that you happen to be in. So I think that's, uh, and I just want to encourage viewers to check out Leakey's podcast. It's a really fantastic show. And I had a really amazing time talking with you. And the time that I spent with you there, Leakey, one of the things that I notice, and I know this from, from working with you, is that if you're doing important work, work that matters, if you're trying to make a difference in whatever domain and with and for the people that your work is for, that's a fraught enterprise. There will be challenges, there will be misfortune, there will be obstacles to overcome. What's the— what are the, the biggest obstacles that you see, or the biggest challenges that you find in this work that you're doing at Better Business Founder?

Wow, there are a lot of challenges. Um, what should I start with? Um, maybe Maybe it's making progress. Making progress is— thanks to you, I learned what making progress is, which is very different than being productive. And so making progress on an everyday basis and being consistent in your work, in my work, I think it's one of the big challenge, one of the biggest challenge, because like in any creative work, you know, you are swimming in unknown waters, so you have no idea where you're going. And we have a lot of doubt, you know, is that thing I'm creating is going to work? I don't know. And I guess that we need a lot of reassurance to keep on going because it's quite frightening. Yeah, there's no guide that says, okay, y'all, step 1 is this, step 2 is this, and then you're going to succeed. And yeah, I think it's making progress and trust, trust in yourself and trust in the work and trust in the process. Yeah.

Well, trusting ourselves is something we've talked a lot about in the Difference Maker community that you are, you and I are a part of. And definitely this idea of trusting the process is something that you and I have learned from our friend and mentor Seth Godin. And yeah, it just a lot of What you're saying really resonates around, um, the— what I'm hearing in, in what you're saying is the thing that's mostly holding any of us back is ourselves. We have this ability to place obstacles in our own way or to not see past our own biases or our, you know, our own status quo around what we believe and what we think we're capable of. And it's really hard to step through that and into our potential and start delivering on our promise, which is much more than what we're doing right now. One of the things that I have found that kind of shakes me out of the stupor of just doing things the way I've always done them is when I experience, you know, a failure or when I make a mistake. And I'm guessing, although I'm sure you make very few mistakes and have had very few failures. I'm wondering if there's a mistake or a failure that you've had that you'd be willing to share that served as a real lesson for you, or that you were able to repurpose into, into an opportunity that helped you further your endeavor?

Well, actually, one of the mistakes I've made— but one of the mistakes I've just made is the name of my podcast. I haven't found how I can repurpose it yet, but I realized I've made a mistake because when I launched this podcast, I decided to call it Mindful Business Founder because actually it was the name of a blog that I had, and I started a long time ago, long, long time ago, because before the term mindful, being mindful, mindfulness become mainstream. And because, well, I've been brought up in— I don't know if it's— I didn't even know it was called Buddhism, but my parents are Buddhist, and so they have brought me up in the Buddhist beliefs. And I didn't realize that, you know, that was called Buddhism. And I didn't realize that, you know, mindfulness and, you know, how it has been spread around the pop culture. And at that time when I launched my podcast, I thought, okay, I have a blog that's called Mindful Business Founder. So why not? You know, and then I have a lot of people asking me, yeah, well, oh, so is it related to mindfulness, being mindful? Yeah. And I have to explain, no, it's not. Well, it's not Pop Culture Mindfulness. But then I realized that, wow, if I have to, you know, I say the name of my podcast and then has, but it's not what it sounds. It's, you know, it's something, it's not working for me. So I need to do something and change it. I realized that, but I've been trying to say, okay, I have to stick, you know, to stay, to stay with that name for a while because it's, you know, it's me. And, and somehow I need to reclaim the definition of mindful. And then I realized it's not my battle. It's not my battle at all. And so I have to decide to switch it to, and what is really, really my battle, my best battle is to help, really help fashion business founders create better businesses in the way they have decided that to be better. So I just decided, okay, it's going to be named Better Business Founders. So I still haven't decided how I'm going to repurpose this mistake and how I'm going to use it, but I'm sure that I'll find a way because I always find a way.

Yeah, I love your story because it reminds me so much of my own experience. You know, I've been studying I've been reading Marcus Aurelius' Meditations since I was in the 7th grade. I didn't know it had anything to do with the ancient philosophy of Stoicism until I was in my, you know, 30s. It was just a book I enjoyed because Marcus spoke to himself the same way that I spoke to myself. And it was just amazing to me that this Roman emperor had the same voice in his head that I did. And when I started my business, it was called The Stoic Creative because I wanted to marry Stoic philosophy and creativity. Nobody wanted to hear about Stoic— creatives don't want to hear about Stoicism and Stoics don't want to hear about creativity, turns out. So I, just like you, I had to like really, like, I felt like, well, I'm going to reclaim Stoicism from, you know, the Tim Ferriss and the Ryan Hollidays of the world and really promote the authentic kind of ancient philosophy. Turned out That wasn't my battle. And one of the things that I found is that I can— Creative on Purpose can be all about helping people fly higher in the difference that they can, only they can make. And it can be about approaching your work with intention and integrity, and it can be imbued with all these principles and practices of Stoic philosophy. And I don't have to wave my Stoic flag all the time.

Yeah.

And people will actually find it more engaging and more enjoyable to do that without feeling like they're signing on for some sort of philosophy or spiritual practice. So I love, and I love Better Business Founder. I think it's a, it's a, it's a great rebrand. And I'm sure you're going to find a lot of success in it. Well, one of the things that we love to talk about in the Difference Maker community that you and I are part of is, you know, updating and keeping, leveraging routines and relationships to promote your own progress, your own pursuit of better, doing better work, finding better clients, finding better clients so that you can do better work. So I'm just curious about if you'd be willing to share any routines or relationships that you, you know, that you employ and leverage to help you stay on track, stay accountable, and stay making progress. In the change that you seek to make?

Okay, there are things that I can share, but there are things that I'm not going to share. Things I can share is that I think it's very important, and it's part also of my upbringing, is to be grateful of things all the time. And so I think that being grateful is very helpful because it helps you shift your mind to positive things in your life. And And so that is something I do all the time, every day, and actually a couple of times a day. So in the morning and also before I, well, before I sleep. It's a very nice way to wrap up the day. The other things that I do as well every day is to do something good for myself. And so I found something recently, which is pushing myself to exercise every single day. And this has become a non-negotiable. And that really helps me. And actually, exercising has been a lifesaver for me many times in my life. So, and, you know, particularly these days, huh, because we are navigating in this very weird world of COVID So having something to hang on is very, very important. And so, yeah, exercise for myself, it's very important. And also connecting with people, connecting people just to say, oh, you know, I love your work, or, oh, you know, how are you? This is something for me, a way to stay connected to the others. And also, you know, send a message to someone that have been in contact in the past on the professional, you know, in the professional world, just to say hi with nothing in return, with not expecting anything. It's something that I do. I'm not doing it on a daily basis because it's— I don't think about it every day, but I'll try to do it maybe once every 2 weeks just to say, yo, hi, I've been thinking of you. And because I believe in building relationship in in the long term, and I believe it's the best way for people to connect. I don't like transactional relationships, and so with time, with age, I realized that, you know, I'm there with building long-term relationships, and I think this is very important. And I also, well, reflect on myself, so I write every day. Oh, wow.

So what I heard is a gratitude practice that you practice every morning and every evening, exercise, connection, maintaining connections. And then I guess I just, just the last piece that you just shared just slipped out of my mind, but these are, oh, the writing practice, which, yeah, which I think is extraordinary. So Is there a particular way that you do your gratitude practice? Do you write down gratitudes, or do you have a specific kind of exercise that you do around gratitude?

Well, I do it actually when I brush my teeth. So that's something—

dental hygiene is also a practice. That's excellent.

That is, yeah, when I brush my teeth, I do my gratitude exercise, but I also do my gratitude exercise with the Kimbo community on the Difference Maker forum, should we call it that way? Yeah, so yes, I find it's a very nice practice because it's a way to engage conversations as well. I like, you know, some of the conversations I had like very quick, um, conversations because I don't want to wait, uh, to spend too much time on it. But just, you know, a little, you know, just a few words and sometimes it starts a conversation. I find it very, very nice.

Yeah, it's, it's so simple. We just— what we do inside the Forward Link community, uh, is we just list 3 simple gratitudes and they can be nothing grandiose. It's just 3 everyday conveniences or just, you know, what's happening in the moment or, you know, being grateful for the moment that we're in or the people that we find ourselves surrounded by. So very, very quick. What I have— my study of gratitude has shown that, you know, there's a lot of good science in psychology or neurosciences that shows that expressing your gratitude out loud or in written form is one of the fastest ways to boost your mood, that you can immediately shift your mindset by simply being grateful. And in my practice, sometimes I will find myself even expressing gratitude for a challenge or a difficult circumstance that I'm experiencing, because I know that these are moments that will help me develop my character, help me practice the virtues of patience, humility, acceptance, or or help me just become a more resilient and active agent of my own destiny. So I love that. I also share with you, you know, this idea of a daily exercise practice, something else that scientifically has been proven to boost our mood. I personally go for a run at the cemetery every day. That's a whole nother story. What's your poison in terms of what's your daily practice around exercise, if you don't mind sharing?

During the first lockdown in France, which started in March, I totally stopped exercising because I don't know if I got COVID, but I've been very ill. So I don't know. And my doctor said, because I am a strong believer that when you're sick, just go out for a run or go for a good swim, and then, you know, it will be you know, the whole thing will be over. But then my doctor told me, oh no, you should not do that. No, don't go for a run because it's a respiratory— you might have a respiratory problem. And so it might go too long and become very bad. So I stopped exercising during the whole lockdown, the French lockdown. And what happened is when you stop exercising, when you used to exercise 3 or 4 times a week and you stop exercising, is that you feel put a lot of weight and you feel exhausted all the time. So I decided that I need to do something, um, something radical. And so, but gyms are closed, and, um, so I decided, okay, I'm going to do it anyway. And so I'm going to find something, um, that is really radical, and I'm going to do it every single day. And, um, I've This is a stupid idea. I started to do HIIT, which is, um, high-intensity interval training, which is very, very efficient. But I did it on a very— with a very stupid— in a very stupid way because I want to have better and faster results. I did it every single day, which lost me— which I, as a result, I was really, really exhausted and started to be depressed and everything. So now I'm switch to something more, um, more, uh, gentle to myself. So I decided to do 2 times HIIT a week, and then, um, and then a little bit of stretching every single, um, every— well, 2 times a week. And then the rest will be like, you know, something, um, like based on, um, on some, some, um targeted to some parts of my body. So yeah. Yeah.

Well, I love that. Well, exercise, just like anything else, is something that we can overdo. And it actually causes more, more harm than good. It's kind of reminds me about the conversation we had on your show about the difference between productivity and progress, right? Well, as I want to just quickly touch on to what you said about a writing practice, because like you, I have found that the act of writing every day has been a great clarifier for helping me get clearer and more focused and more specific about the change that I seek to make. And I'm just wondering, what is your daily writing practice? A journaling practice? A blogging practice? What do you do as a daily writing practice and how does it help you?

It is a journaling practice. I don't do daily blogging because I don't think it's always interesting what I have to share. But it really helped me clarify my thoughts. And so, and also I realized that by By having this practice of daily writing, journaling, helped me clarify my thought. Because when you write, you have to, you know, it's an— you have to— how should I say that? You have to add another layer of trust in the words that you're using. And that has a positive impact in my verbal communication, I hope. I think now I'm much more careful about the words I'm using. And also by daily writing and really thinking of what I'm going to write, because, okay, it's just for me because it's my journal, but— and I'm not going back to read it, but still, you know, I think it's something that is sacred. So I have to be very careful about what I write and what and how I write it. And so it It helps me get, um, yeah, being a little bit more formal and be more clear about what I want to express and how I choose my words. And, um, and I think in return I've become more careful about the words I'm, I'm using, uh, when I speak to people and with, you know, with other people. Yeah.

Yeah. Fantastic. Well, you and I are connected. I've referenced this a few times in our conversation. You and I connected, in addition to my having appeared on your podcast, we're connected through the Difference Maker coaching and community. And I wonder if you would be willing to just speak for a moment as to what, what effect or what, what help, if any, those programs have had in helping you level up and fly higher in the difference that only you can make.

Well, You remember when I mentioned that in the endeavor I'm trying, I'm set in, that one of the difficult problems is to make progress. Sometimes you just, oh, I don't have to because right now I'm working most, not mostly, but yeah, most actually, mostly on my own too. When I'm not coaching, when I'm not with clients, I'm working on my offer alone. But being part of the group really helps you set target because it's, you know, you have the accountability part of the group. So that's one thing. And the other thing is that there's a group of people that are here for you and they're here for you. They have your back and they help you whenever you have a problem. I don't know if you remember, but there was one day I was talking about, oh, Wow, I know someone say, oh, I'm doing a brain map. And I thought, wow, yeah, that's a very smart thing to do to help me clarify my thoughts. And then I ask, you know, what do you use for brain mapping? So I got like a couple of suggestions of very good software I could use for brain mapping. So I think this is, you know, it's the power of of a benevolent community of people that are here to help you and they have your back and they want you to make progress because they're here, they're there to make a difference and they really want you to make a difference as well. So yeah.

Yeah, I really appreciate that. I love the community. I learn as much from the community as I, far more than I ever teach. And it's just that idea of fellowship, the idea that we're all seeking to level up in the difference that we make, but we're a community of difference makers. And so we all kind of understand each other. So it's just this kind of safe space where we can bravely push, seek the edges of our own understanding and abilities so that we can grow and develop individually. By leveraging the power of fellowship in the group. So I really appreciate those reflections from you. Well, as we're approaching the end of our time together, I would love for you to answer the final question, which is the same question that I give to every guest, which is: What's one tip or piece of advice that you'd like to leave listeners with to help them fly higher in their endeavor and make the difference that only they can make?

Okay, uh, well, do it. Because, um, I remember something you told me, you know, if Scott can do it, why can't you? So just do it. If you want to do something, just do it. If Scott can do it, do it.

Yeah, yeah, I'm pretty famous for saying if I can do it, anybody can do it, for sure. I really appreciate that, Leaky. That's a— and I really appreciate this conversation. I want to thank everybody for tuning in and Leaky and I really appreciate you lending us some of your valuable time and attention. We hope today's broadcast motivates you to lean into an endeavor that matters with greater curiosity and courage. You can learn more about Leaky and the fantastic work she's doing and the difference she makes by just clicking or just looking at that, uh, URL down below, betterbusinessfounder.com. Of course, it's always great to see you as well at creativeonpurpose.com. Now take the insight and inspiration from this conversation and start flying higher and the difference only you can make. Likitang, thank you so much for the time that you spent with us today and for all the wisdom that you shared.

Thank you. Thank you for having me on. Thank you.