Yael Geller: Exploring Heritage, Passion, and Connection Through Kosher Wine

Welcome to The Kosher Teruah.

I'm Simon Jacob, your host for this episode from Jerusalem. Before we get started, I ask that wherever you are, please take a moment and pray for the safety of our soldiers and the safe return of all of our hostages. On today's episode of The Kosher Terroir, we have the pleasure of hosting Yael E. Geller, a distinguished figure and influencer in the kosher wine community. Yael is a seasoned wine writer, contributing insightful articles to publications such as the Jewish Press and the Jewish Link, where she explores the rich narratives behind wineries and the people who bring them to life. Beyond her writing, Gael co-administers the vibrant Facebook group Kosher Wines: Sharing and Experiences, a thriving community of over 8,000 members dedicated to discussing and appreciating kosher wines. Her deep knowledge and passion for wines are complemented by her personal connections, as she is married to Gabriel Geller, a prominent wine influencer and the PR director and manager of wine education at Royal Wine Corporation. Join us as we delve into Yael's journey, her insights into the world of kosher wines, and the stories that continue to inspire her work. If you're driving in your car, please focus on the road ahead. If you're relaxing in your home, please select a wonderful bottle of kosher wine, sit back, relax, and enjoy listening in on this fun and informative conversation. All right.

Yael, welcome to the Kosher Terroir. It's a real pleasure.

Thank you so much for having me.

It's a super pleasure. You know, people see your comments and they basically think you're a hanger-on to Gabriel, and that's not true at all. I know you're a wine enthusiast on your own, even before Gabriel, and I wanted to talk to you about it.

Well, that's nice. That's certainly true. I'm not a hangar-on-er, although I may appear as one because my life has gotten quite busy since we got married. Baruch Hashem. We have 3 very active boys right now. So definitely not a hangar-on-er, but I appreciate the opportunity to talk to you today.

Pleasure. Really a pleasure. Okay. So what I want to start with is, can you tell me a little bit about your earliest experiences and memories with wine and how it shaped your perspective of wine today?

Okay, this is really a loaded question. I'm going to rewind back to my childhood. I would say that there are two very distinct memories in my mind right now about specific wines or wine in general. So obviously growing up in a religious home, wine is at the centerpiece of every single simcha, celebration, etc., life event. So obviously that, Havdalah, Kiddush, like everyone else. However, my father really had an interest in wine culture. He is not the most wine-cultured person, even now after many years of reading books. He's not, you know, he's a busy guy. He was an anesthesiologist. He's now retired. But when I was younger, he came across wines from the brand Gan Eden. I was maybe 4 or 5 years old when he started purchasing wine from, from our friend Craig Winchell, who's now our friend, but back then I was a little kid. So I basically grew up with Gan Eden wines at my Shabbos table almost every single week. We definitely had Herzog wines as well, but Gan Eden really stood out because the label had a beautiful garden on the front. I'm not sure if you've seen them or if you remember them.

I remember it. I'm a little older than you, so I—

Oh, really?

One of the first— that was one of the first wines, really, really well-made kosher wines that had— it just had this beautiful distinctive label.

It's a gorgeous label. Actually, Craig had sent us a few posters of it, but I'm not sure where they went over time. This was years ago already, but we did have them in our first apartment. So I remember the label very well, and my father was a big fan of black muscat. That was his go-to wine for Kiddush. It was great. It was so balanced. Even in my memories, it was amazing. I don't know if I would like it now, probably, because Craig really was a great winemaker back in the day. I mean, he probably still is now too, but he would buy cases upon cases of it, and Craig— directly from Craig, and Craig would ship it to Scranton, Pennsylvania, which is basically the boondocks of nowhere. And I remember once Black Muscat was out of stock So my father bought the Gewürztraminer, which was amazing. It was so sweet. I remember it was a sweeter Gewürz, not a, not a dry one, maybe probably off dry. And that's how it really started for me. Those are my memories. We also had a neighbor, a very elderly neighbor, an old pediatrician, and they were getting older and they decided to sell their house and they invited us to come in and they said, you know, anything you want, you could take. We're downsizing. So I went in with my mom and dad. I'm the youngest of 5 children and I'm like the real youngest. Like I did all their fun stuff with them. And I remember my father picking up some really old bottles of Carmel, not the '76 that you have. That's like the first one that probably tasted good in the day. But these were like syrupy, awful. I mean, oxidized to the core, definitely older than me. And my dad brought them home and every week we would open a different one and that was insufferable. But probably because of the age of the wine. So those are two very distinct memories for me in my much younger years that really started, I would say, the rest of my life. The rest of my life in the wine industry, not that I'm really in it, but you know, I'm living parallel to it, I would say.

You're married into it.

Yeah, exactly.

When did it suddenly become you and not your family's experience?

So, um, I would say that age was definitely a restriction. However, every time me and my family, me and my parents specifically, because I'm the youngest, uh, we would go visit Israel every couple years, sometimes every year. It really depends on the year because I had siblings who were either learning in yeshiva or in seminary there. So, um, we would go to visit Israel and almost every single time my father would want to book a trip to a winery. We went to Dalton, we went to Yarden. I have a few pictures at Gush. And that was really, you know, we learned about the process there. I mean, I'm sure you've been on a zillion wine tours, so you know what the deal is, but they make it really kid-friendly. I was maybe 8 on my first trip to Israel, maybe 7. So they make it interactive for kids and there's a lot of history, and they really try to engage the whole crowd. So that's where it really, really started. The tour at Jardin is really life-changing. I really would say that, interestingly enough, because it's an enormous winery, enormous, and it's really geared towards tourists. And they have the beautiful displays. I haven't been there in many years. I would say it's been 8 years since I've been there. But they have beautiful displays, and I even remember to this day, from, you know, from when I was 8 years old. So that kind of got me interested in the backstory of the wine, not just, you know, having it at the table, but there's a lot more to wine than just when you bring it home, uncork it, and pour it into your glass. There's a whole history, there's a passion, there's the stories of the winemakers, there's the stories of the vineyard, and especially Israeli wine is a story of our people. And There's so much more to it than just drinking it.

You know, it's funny because I have never— well, not in my remembrance— visited the Ardennes winery.

Really?

Isn't that crazy?

You definitely have got to go.

I've gone to all of these little boutique wineries and some of the big wineries, but I've never gone to the Ardennes.

So one day, one day soon, I'm sure that somebody can connect you with someone there. But it's fantastic. They had— they kept many bottles from each vintage, and they have them like the wineries in France in some sort of temperature control thing where you can look at all the vintages. And they keep them, I assume, for their anniversary, you know, parties and stuff like that. But it's really, really nice. But when we went 8 years ago, which was the last time I was in Israel, um, we had a beautiful tour and we actually had a tasting in like the the champagne barrel room, which was very, very exciting with the winemaker who makes— he only made champagne, but not champagne, but bubbly sparkling wines. So definitely worth a shot.

How has your appreciation of kosher wine evolved over time? Because now you've got exposure to a lot more wines.

Yeah. Oh, it's changed a lot. I mean, When I turned 21, that was really the time for me to have the freedom to explore what was out there. There are several wine stores that I can think of in my mind. Most notably is actually in Muncie at Rockland Kosher. There's a wine store, it's still there. And the clerk there, or the owner, I don't know if he's the owner or not. I'm sure if I went to talk to him today, he would not remember me. But he really guided me onto what I should taste, what I shouldn't taste, what's interesting, what's not. Um, and I would say that at that time I had all the doors open to me. However, I would say in the last 9 years, obviously marrying Gabriel, who opened many other doors in a lot of different ways to kosher wines and to wines that many people don't have the opportunities and they do. Um, I, I think that in general, in the last 9 years, you could disagree with me, but I think you will agree with me, kosher wine has changed a lot. It has evolved into something that we can't even harness anymore. Like, it's very, very hard to taste every single kosher wine that's produced today. Um, so I would say that there was my before and my after. So the before, I tried to taste what I could and tried to learn what I liked, and it was just fun. It was a social thing. I mean, and then after we got married, there was, I would say there was a wine boom, but there was also a personal wine boom where I had access to a lot more than I did before. So I would say that it evolved a lot. The best way people are always asking, like, how do I learn about wine? How do I know what's good? What's bad? Is price a factor? Is more expensive wine better? Things like that. They're always asking these questions and I'm like, you know what, it just boils down to who you're with. That's my personal opinion. And it's like the experience of connecting to the people that you're with over whatever meal it is or whatever occasion it is that really changes the experience.

So it's— you're— it's so spot on, so true, at least from my perspective. The people are what it's all about. Um, yeah, the wines The wines are wonderful, but they're just facilitators to connect socially.

It's true. I mean, the truth is that we met you through wine. I remember that you came to our first apartment in Cedarhurst many years ago, probably 9 years ago. And I remember you brought Avi with you. That was not the first time we— was it the first time we met Avi? It could be the first time we met Avi Davidowitz, who I'm sure has been on your podcast. But so many friendships and relationships have blossomed through wine. And I mean, I married my spouse through wine, through the connection of wine on our first date. I mean, we could recall what vintage wine we had and all the special occasions and all those things. So it really does connect people. And we have friends now from all over the world.

Tell me, tell me about it, because people think that, you know, he's the wine guy and you're just there. And I remember you telling me about a closet you had in your room. And yeah, maybe you just want to share some things.

Yes. Okay. So after college, I was looking for a job. I was living in Queens and I had an apartment with a few of my friends. Shout out to them. They put up with my wine closet. And I had a favorite wine store, which was Suheg Wine and Liquors. Shout out to them too. I was probably their best customer at the time. And I would bring wine back to my family in Scranton for holidays or if I went for Shabbos because there's very strict laws in Pennsylvania about having wine sold. It's a state-run liquor store that they have there. And then there's some ceremonial things. I'm not quite sure the laws, but I would bring back wine for, let's say, Pesach, like a lot of wine. And I just got really interested. I noticed a lot of wines popping up in different regions. And it was just, there was a lot of selection there. And I said, you know what, I cannot drink all this wine at once. Maybe I'll save some for a special occasion or for a Shabbos when I'm going away. So I started to collect wine in my closet, in my clothing closet, and I would stack it up very nice and neat. And I had these little shelves. And that's really where it really started getting crazy. I had taken a trip to California for one of my friends, one of my best friend's weddings in LA, and one of the stops that we made was at Herzog. And I had bought a few like limited edition Herzogs there. I had a wine called GPS, which is no longer in service. But at the time it was very cool. We used to have those like Garmin GPS. This is so interesting. What is this? And I had held that for a while. And I had gone to a wine sale in Muncie once where Joshua was selling his wine. Joshua Werth. He used to have a wine tasting every year. So I would go to that. Um, and then one of the wine stores that I went to in Queens invited me. They told me about KFW. So it was the first year I was able to go because I was 21, and I went to KFW the first time, and I was like, this is, this is my land. Like, this is my people.

Welcome home.

Exactly. I was like, I'm so glad he told me about this. Anyways, so then I started going to that, and like, I would meet all these people, and like I just like, there are a few people that really stick out that I had met at these things. I had gone to the City Winery tasting. I remember I met Josh Phillips there for the first time and I said, and Chaim who used to work for Moishe Meyer, I forgot his last name, but I met him there too. And I remember telling him, I need a shiur. And he's like, don't worry, we'll find you someone. Anyways, in that time period, sometime in 2014, '13 to '15, Gabriel was on the other side of the universe living in Israel, doing his thing. Facebook groups started becoming very popular. I noticed a food group about restaurants, which was mildly interesting to me, but I didn't really want to join that. It looked like, you know, everyone's fighting, like being annoying and saying food is gross or whatever. And then like they suggest groups for you on Facebook. And then I see like a group, Kosher Wine Sharing and Experiences. And I said, you know what, I'm not going to join the food group because it came up right next to the wine one. But the wine one looks so interesting to me because I'm collecting all this wine. So I joined that group. And like, I don't— you were not in the group yet. You did not join the group till later. I remember when you joined, that was after you had met Gabriel initially. But there were not many young single women in that group. So almost instantaneously, yeah, all of the single men started falling into my inbox, like every single single man in that group. And there was like maybe 600 members. There was like It was me and like Stacy was the other woman in the group. So obviously I was the main target. So I'm getting a lot of solicitations to go on dates and to share wine and this and that. And I started sharing my collection and like asking people when to drink certain things, especially that GPS wine. I was a big fan of Louis Pascoe's wine. I bought a lot of that, his first vintage of the Pascoe Project, and I had posted that. But I was getting a lot of attention from everyone. Like, every single male that was in that group at that time fell into my inbox. But Gabriel was one of them. And I kept thinking, ah, these guys, they're all such creeps. I'm not hanging out with any of them. I'm not meeting them. I'm going to continue on my course, going on my set-up dates and whatever. But Gabriel was pretty persistent and he was also refined. Let's just leave it at that.

Yes, he is.

Swiss. And he would talk to me, you know, he would wish me good Shabbos. I remember it was like before the Israeli election, he was saying, oh, I just got up, I went to vote. It's very important to me. Just sharing like little bits about him, sharing what he's drinking, where he's going, what he's doing. And I, at the time, I didn't really think much of it because I was, I don't know, I was busy. I was relatively young. I was doing my thing. I was busy with school. I had a full-time job at the time. I was living in New York, you know, I had it going. And then After several months, this was probably like March, he suggested that he's going to come to America and he wanted to meet me. And I was like, oh no, this is going to be a disaster. Like, this guy, I mean, I hope he's making a trip to America anyways, like coming to be a tourist and not putting everything into dating me because I don't know anything about him. He's a foreigner. We could not find— Personally, it was like, I need to find someone in common with him to make sure he's not a serial killer. Um, eventually we did find several people in common though, which is interesting. Um, that's a very interesting story. Um, but I said, you know what, I'm finishing my master's degree in June. Come after I submit, you know, the last of my papers and go to graduation, and then we'll, we'll, we'll meet, you know. And he said okay, gave me his ticket information, and then It came the end of June and he texted me, okay, I'm coming next week, Tuesday I'm landing or Wednesday or whatever. And then literally as he landed, he's like, okay, I'm here, I'm ready to meet. I'm like, what? Now? I just got home from work. Can I go take a shower? I don't know. Can I clean myself up a little bit? I used to work in a hospital, so that was kind of important to clean myself up. And make sure that I was ready for this. Like, you know, we've been leading up to this and I really didn't think much of it. But anyways, I said, you know what, let's, let's, you know, pause a little bit and go to— let's meet up tomorrow for dinner. And he said, okay, that's fine. I'm in Queens. You know, I just, I was excited to, you know, meet up and talk to you in person and all these things. And, and that's how it started. And it moves very, very quickly after that.

Yeah, you know, he's, he's normally really sedate and quiet and what have you. Um, at least that's what I see of him. But he's, he's a serious guy, and, uh, and I think he saw another serious wine woman. Wow, that's like hard to find, uh, a woman who knows anything about wine. I mean, that I don't want to say anything bad about women because we have a lot, a lot of women who follow my podcast now. In those days, it was very rare to have a person who knew anything about wine, let alone historically kosher wine, which is like crazy that you had a history, um, of kosher wine, which is amazing.

Yeah, definitely.

All right, um, How about the wine group? Now you're, you're, you're now, uh, kind of one of the administrators, the administrator, I think. I don't know if anybody else has time to do it, and I know you don't, but you still do.

No, I'm not as active as I was. Time constraints. I have a 6-month-old baby, and we also have a 3-year-old and a 7-year-old boy, um, so that's very busy. And we really fell out of posting a lot, but we're gonna try to to revive it if we have anything interesting, which I tried to do a couple weeks ago. Um, so the wine group, it just grew and grew and grew. I think, um, culture in the Orthodox community and the non-Orthodox community, but in the kosher community, has really changed a lot in the last, I'll say, 10 years. Um, people are much more interested in higher-end things. They're interested in culture. They're not you know, drinking King David or Manischewitz anymore for Kiddush. Like, you know, people are like— although we are having a move back to like Manischewitz matzo balls, but for wine, people are interested in home cooking, you know, fancy meats, curing their own. They're interested in like artisanal things, and wine has just gone with that too. And with that, our wine group really has exploded. So Gabriel took me on, I want to say maybe a year after we got married, because he needed help. He has two wine groups, one, and he manages it, he managed it with other people, but they're also very busy with their own businesses, etc. There's a French group, I'm not quite sure because I don't ever look at it anymore. It doesn't really pop up on my feed. But he took me in, and then we added We added Aaron Hollander to be also a moderator and Yedidia. And I think it's close to 8,000 people in the English-speaking group.

Crazy.

It's a lot of people. And there are people who post a lot and then there are random people who are looking for something. Or every once in a while I see in another group that someone's looking for a recommendation about wine and I'll tag the group to add them to the group. So then we get like an influx of like 5 or 10 people that saw it in another group and That's how things grow in social media. And that's basically what happened. In the beginning, I really took no prisoners. I believe one of the journalists wrote an article about Gabrielle and he discussed it and he's like, she takes no prisoners. You know what? I don't have time to like pick apart the wine. I want to enjoy it. I want it to taste good. Once in a while, I want to have a bad wine because if you have only good wines, you have nothing to compare it to. Like, I want my wine to be corked sometimes so that I remember what it's like. But basically just making sure that everyone's behaving in the group, which most people do, and trying to give suggestions. People want to know when to open wines. You know how it is. Everyone has a question. Yep.

Are there any— okay, now I'm going to ask you a loaded question.

Go ahead.

Have you ever had to moderate a controversial or divisive topic?

I wouldn't say that I leave that to me. I usually ask Gabriel if something— if I see something that's not— either people are not acting nicely to each other, or someone brings it to my attention, which happened— which used to happen a lot. It happens once in a while here, here and there, but for the most part, people behave. And if something really is not okay, I make Gabriel deal with it. You know, kind of like if an animal goes through your garbage, you're not going out to pick it up. You make your husband deal certain things you let the dad deal with, or the man of the house.

I agree. Um, did you— can you share, uh, a really particularly interesting or compelling story that came from the group? Do you remember any specific story that was just really cool or compelling?

Um, this one I have to think.

I didn't give you any heads up on these questions.

I know, I'm trying to think of something specific. I can say that a lot of the relationships have become very close. Um, you know, it's interesting when you live in like a metropolitan area, people pass through here a lot. Through this area a lot, and some, some of my neighbors or friends who come over, whatever, they can't believe that we have winemakers at our table several times a year, or staying with us, or stopping in. So that's kind of interesting in terms of relationships. But a specific, um, I can't think of anything.

No, you know, You're 100% right about being in the center, because I feel like I'm in the center being in Jerusalem. There is almost nobody who's Jewish who doesn't come through here sometime. I mean—

That's very true.

Some people come through much more often and what have you. And this wine, the wine groups have just snowballed um, friendships that are just amazing. Friendships in England, the whole UK group of people, um, the— all the people across the United States, like Jerry Parnas, um, is just a doll. There's all sorts of people who I've become super close with who come through Israel and stop by and we have dinner and what have you. And truthfully, the winemakers are unbelievable group of people. They're so sweet.

I think what struck me as really interesting when I kind of— when I married Gabriel especially, is that the winemakers, I don't know, you think of celebrities like totally untouchable, but the winemakers are within less than one degree of separation from us in the kosher industry, which is very interesting. Meaning like they're accessible. Like if I want to ask Amichai a question and I don't know him and I'm not related to Gabriel, let's say in this scenario, it's very easy to get in touch with him. And I'm talking about Amichai from Shiloh for anyone who is not in the wine sphere.

Sorry, yeah, you're right. Amichai Luria, I should clarify.

And you know, it's everyone. It's Louis Pascoe who is at my table. It's Eti from Carmel. Stops in, she, you know, my kids love her, but they're so accessible to everyone. It's not just for the VIPs, you know.

Right.

So that is very interesting because I think in the outside world it would be very unusual for a regular consumer to meet a winemaker and like know that they're at someone's house in Teaneck, for example, for a dinner or something like that.

Alicia Will comes to mind as well because she's awesome. She's just dope.

She's amazing. Did you have her on your podcast? I think you did. I talk to her quite often, mostly not about wine. I consider her one of my very close friends. And I've said to her, and I've actually said to Etty as well, that we should have some sort of alliance of women in the kosher wine industry. It would be very interesting to get us together and just hang out, talk about ideas, something like that. Because there are a lot of women in this industry that are kind of— I don't want to say they're in the shadows, but a really good example, a couple years ago we went to Barcelona and we went to Elvi. And I had no idea that David's mom and Moses's wife Anna is the actual winemaker of Clos Masora. I had no idea. I felt really, like, totally dumb. But she's the one making the wine.

And the sister is now too.

Yeah. And I met her actually last year. She came into Englewood for a tasting and for KFW. So I actually got to meet her. But I was like, how do we not know that?

Because they're, they're so nice. And they're so central to the marketing part of it. That you don't see that in the background. And they're really special. I agree with you 100%. There is a difference between the way men and women approach wine. And I think it's pertinent to have a connection among the ladies.

Yes, I definitely think so.

I think it's actually good. And there are more and more and more, uh, wine people who are female, who are involved in what have you. So it's, it's, it's becoming, uh, really special. In fact, they kind of like the way men, some men used to drag their wives to these wine tastings. There's a number of women who drag their spouses, their husbands to these wine tastings.

Yeah.

It's, it's, they bear with it. They're nice. They're friendly. Just a couple more questions and I promise I'll let you go. Have you noticed a difference in preferences? Have you seen preferences changing in the wine industry, um, you know, over the last few years?

Um, I would say it depends on the person. Um, I don't want to be like you know, super snobby, but there's a lot of wealth that we see growing in our community in general, and people are willing to spend a lot more money on luxuries like wine. It goes in flux with the economy, obviously, but I see a lot more, especially in the ultra-Orthodox community, spending a lot of money on wine, and they're buying a lot higher-end wines. Which is wonderful for the industry, especially if they're using it in a very nice way for a simcha or kiddush or a bris or something like that. So I will say that that has definitely changed a lot. I think that in terms of like trends overall, people are interested in different wines. It used to be that we would go to a wine tasting— I'm sure you've heard this— and many times. Like, someone comes up to you, or in the store even, they don't usually come up to me, but I usually tell them what I think anyways. They come up to you and say, oh, can you tell me the best Cabernet? Now, Cabernet is still king, it always will be, but there are so many different varieties and blends and white wines which are amazing. I mean, we had a Sauvignon Blanc last week, it was reminiscent of the Sancerre that we had together many times at Noble.

Wow, it was that bottle of Sancerre.

Desperate.

Every time, every time people bring out a Sancerre, I go, yes!

And no, no, but this was close. It was the Château Olivier. Okay, you'll get it. But anyways, I, I— Gabriel's doing the same thing to me because I do not really like Sauvignon Blanc that much. I'm okay with it, it's not my favorite white varietal at all. And every time there's a lot of new Sancerres coming out and they cannot hold a candle to that bottle that we shared many times together.

I know. I just, you know, you've got that in your memory and it has a real memory for wines. I don't, but that wine sticks in my memory.

Yeah, there are some wines like that that you cannot. And by the way, it's not just the wine. It was the occasions that we drank it. And there was one time where he found one somewhere. Do you remember this? It was open.

In the refrigerator.

And we drank it together. And it was amazing.

It was still good. Wow. It is. It's absolutely crazy. It's absolutely crazy. I find that all the time these days with some of the special wines that I drank, like Yakovoria's Old Musketeer.

Definitely. We didn't discuss him, but definitely. Yeah, that's those wines. I mean, we did a tasting with him, and supposedly he's coming here at some point soon. And if he doesn't come visit me, I'm going to be very insulted. So Yaakov, if you're listening, you better come here because we have a very long history together. And he went to yeshiva in Scranton, and my parents remember him.

Really?

So yes.

Wow, I didn't know that at all.

Yes, his— what happened was they modernized their last name to Oria, but I think I forgot what the original was. He'll tell you. But yes, so we have a different connection besides her wine, but I really would love to see him. And his wife is wonderful also. I'd love to see her too.

She's great.

Um, great. But his wines, there's something so like— you can't even describe the old Musketeer. I mean, like It's just like an out-of-body experience almost.

Maple syrup, but liquefied. I have no idea, you know, when I tell people that and they go, yeah, right, okay, you know, it's one of these sweet dessert wines.

No.

And they drink it and their eyes light up and they go, I gave it to somebody at my daughter's wedding. I had a couple of bottles at my daughter's wedding.

By the way, Mazakov, the pictures were amazing.

It was a lot of fun. We had a blast. Especially. We had some great wines, really.

And the kiddush cup was really— I mean, you should bring that as your guest on the podcast.

We use that for brisim. I found that custom from one of the rabbeim I knew here, I know here, and he used it for his son's brit. It holds a Magnum. It holds—

oh really?

Yeah, it holds 2 full bottles.

Wow, I thought 1 bottle, but you can't really tell from the pictures.

Full bottles. And he used it at his son's brit, and then he used it at the wedding. And it's so good to carry something along that way. So I said, I got to get one of these and I got to do this from now on. So that's what I've been doing.

I'm pretty sure that the rabbi of my parents' town has one of those for Kos Eliyahu on Pesach, something like that. I think that's some sort of tradition as well.

Yeah, to have a bigger Kos, to have a bigger Kos. But it's super. There are some preferences that seem to be changing here that I've noticed, and it might be because— it might be because of the warmer climate— where people were focused on reds and especially cabs. I've noticed that a lot of people have started focusing on lighter wines like Grenaches and, uh, Pinot Noirs and what have you, and also whites.

I am here for that. I love that. First of all, Pinot is probably my favorite varietal of all time. Even though I love blends and I love Bordeaux and I love certain Israeli wines and dessert wines and I love bubbly wines, I really do. We need to explore those lighter-bodied reds. Gamay, Pinot. Pinot, we have a lot of burgundies now that we did not have 10 years ago. Yep. Um, actually, I remember you were in the delivery room and I was getting ready, and I said— it was Thursday— and I said to Gabriel, what if I— what if I don't end up going home for Shabbos? You know, nobody brought me wine. You better bring me that Pomard, the 2015. I've been wanting to open it forever. And my doctor looks at me like I'm crazy, and she's like, is this what you're really thinking about?

Yes, it is.

Yes, I waited 9 months for this. So he ended up finding it, by the way, and we drank it on Hanukkah.

So that's great.

But Pinot, yeah, I feel like it was an untapped— not totally untapped, because I used to— I really liked the Hagafen Pinot back in the day. I even now, I tasted a recent vintage of it and I was like, wow, it's back, you know, it's back to what it was. Um, But that was also one of my favorite wines for a very long time.

I also love their label on the Hagafen. The labels were the absolutely beautiful grape leaves that were, you know, that were kind of designed and etched in. That was cool. Very cool.

Yeah, I actually did visit Hagafen winery, um, a long time ago. I forgot to mention that, um, I think I went there in 2008, I want to say. I took a trip with my friends to California and they actually hosted us there and we had a wonderful, uh, we had a wonderful tasting there, but we also had a wonderful vintage, um, bubbly there, a sparkling wine, which was, which was the pre, um, the pre-line, which they only sell at the winery, I think, or as part of the wine club, right? So that was also another memory.

That's, that's also here. All of a sudden, I have no idea why, there's a whole bunch of wineries that are now making bubblies, which are so much more difficult to make, take so much more time and effort than anything else, but they're wonderful. I mean, every—

just who's making new bubblies in Israel?

Who's making one? Castelmour. Yakovoria makes one, right?

Raziel is also one. I guess that's the Castel one.

That's the Castel one. No, but actually, well, it is the Castel one, but Castel makes a rosé version and a regular version.

And I think Matar made one, no?

Matar, yes, Matar, I believe as well. Yes, but there, there are a whole bunch. They're proliferating. And wow, there, people are not taking the the easy path, because that is—

yeah, it's hard to be intensive.

It's so much hands-on intensive to create that stuff. It's crazy. So, well, it's fun. I miss you guys. I really miss you. I miss— I know— for dinner, and I miss you guys coming to us for Shabbat. And I really, please God, in the future look forward to doing something where we get together.

I hope so. I mean, I know it's been a while since you've been back here, and I haven't made it to Israel in quite a long time. I've been a little busy in COVID, etc. But next time you're in town, you know where we live.

I really look forward, but I don't want to leave Israel during the war.

And I hear that. I really do.

So many So many kids here now and so many grandkids here.

It's wonderful.

All right. Thank you. Thank you for being on the Kosher Terroir and agreeing to come on.

Thank you for having me. I look forward to coming back.

Yes, I look forward to. I want to discuss some hardcore wine stuff with you, but I wanted to at least get an introduction to who Yael Geller is because I don't think people understand that at all and they don't understand that One of Gabriel's secret weapons in wine is you.

So I don't know about that. You know, it's interesting because people probably— we were discussing this a couple of weeks ago. Gabriel had done a series of events, wine events, and someone commented. I also write articles about wine. We didn't discuss that, but I help him out and I freelance for him basically, you know, for Royal. And he takes care of distributing it because that's part of his job. But someone mentioned to him, one of the guests at the dinner, you know, "I love your wife's articles." And I said, "Really? Someone actually likes them and reads them and pays attention to them?" And I said, "You know what's so funny? They probably think like our whole life is centered around wine, but really we're just two regular people." But we definitely discuss the ins and outs of certain things in wine, you know, as part of our everyday. But we're just like everybody else.

Yeah, but you know what? There's very few people that you could sit down and discuss some of the nuances of wine. And Gabriel is a special person. He's got incredible taste buds.

Oh, thank you. As do you.

And it's very hard to find, you know, a pair of people who could really discuss those sort of things. I mean, I've seen it sitting at your dining table. And having, you know, the conversation go around the table between, uh, between all the, all the people and seeing the two of you, and it's, um, really special.

So, well, it's definitely a pleasure to host everyone and anyone who comes through, um, from our group, from, from our group's friends and the winemakers. It's really an honor to have people stop in, and one thing that You know, I always say to Gabriel is we have this house so that we can be accommodating to our friends and to people who need a warm meal when they're traveling from Israel or want company and a homemade dinner when they're here, you know, on business or visiting or whatever it is from our world. And, you know, I always remind him that even at the drop of a hat, we're always open to having people. So anyone out there who is traveling here and loves wine, please Get in touch with us.

Okay, good. Thank you. I'll make sure, I'll make sure we push it. But thank you, thank you so much.

And please, regards to Gabriel, you know, and regards to all our friends who we haven't seen in a while too. Pierre, I see Amichai, I see Etty, you know, Stacey. Stacey, I saw two weeks ago, she came here.

Yeah, love to everybody.

Okay, shalom.

This is Simon Jacob again, your host of today's episode of The Kosher Teruah. I have a personal request. No matter where you are or where you live, please take a moment to pray for our soldiers' safety and the safe and rapid return of our hostages. Please subscribe via your podcast provider to be informed of our new episodes as they are released. If you are new to the Kosher Terroir, please check out our many past episodes.