The Hidden Psychology Behind Building A Brand

What I learned with working with bestselling authors is that it was all about making sure you could mobilize an audience to buy the book. Because when you're selling a book, it isn't really the $25 or the $35 for the book that you're selling. What you're selling is that people care enough to read the book, and that's like 8 to 10 hours of their life, or they're comparing it against all the books they haven't read sitting on their shelf, and do they really need another one? And so you're not really selling— it's not a $25 product. In fact, books are probably the hardest thing ever that you'll sell.

Welcome to the Speakeasy Mastermind Podcast, where the real conversations happen behind closed doors with the boldest entrepreneurs, creators, and growth minds in the game. No fluff, no filters, just the raw strategies, personal stories, and mental models that move the needle. I'm Eric Berman. Now let's get into it. In today's episode of Inside the Speakeasy, I'm so excited to bring with us Andrea Rendell from Calgary, and you're going to learn some of the latest and greatest tips on really branding. And Andrea's got such a killer way of breaking it down to two very simple, small steps that you're going to walk away from watching this and saying, I got it. And it's going to totally change the way you're thinking about your own brand and messaging. Plus, she's going to share some of her experiences with anybody who's out there trying to launch a best-selling New York Times bestselling book. She's going to drop some nuggets and what's worked in the past. As well as tell you all about the beautiful world of Calgary. Welcome, Andrea.

Hey, I'm so glad to be here. Thank you. Thanks for having me.

Yeah, thanks. And you know, our journey's been cool where you and I met each other, gosh, probably I think about maybe 10 years or so ago at, at various big masterminds, marketing masterminds and other groups, and then kind of went on our little journeys. Then we got rekindled again through a friend in common in the community, and I'm so glad we got to touch base again and it's been so much fun working with you and Gemma and just loved, and I got a chance. I'm excited for anybody who hasn't been to Calgary yet and Banff. Had such a fun experience out there. What a full town.

Yeah, it's good.

Good.

Thank you. I like it here. We like the mountains, the fresh air, not very many people. It's all very good.

So now you grew up there your whole life?

I have. I've been in Alberta my whole life. Yeah. Not Calgary. I grew up in a much, much smaller town, but I have been in Alberta my whole life.

I love it. I love it. It's beautiful. Well, cool. Let's get into, cause I, you know, I know a little bit of your backstory and you were just like, You know, we had some talks in the quote green room about, you know, the education we all spent a lot of money on. And then where so many of us entrepreneurs ultimately are just like, well, that was sort of interesting. I learned some cool social skills, but it's my street-smart MBA that really made a difference. Is that kind of, you know, tell me a little bit of your journey and what you've been through.

Yeah, totally. I always say I have a street-smart MBA. I grew up in an entrepreneurial family. My mom and dad owned a motel, a restaurant, and a campground. So when I was really little, from like, from the time I was born, I was around business and I was required to contribute in whatever way I could. Or I was like the little kid that sat in the restaurant while my parents did the things they did to run their business. So I grew up in an entrepreneurial family and when I was 16, I started selling custom fit bras, which cracks me up now because I can't even imagine doing it now. I would like walk into people's houses that were clearly way older than me and size them and fit them for a bra. And then I would order up their bra size and go back and deliver it. And I learned a lot of like basic door-to-door sales skills, I guess it would be. I didn't sell door-to-door, but it was kind of the same set of skills when I was 16.

Oh, you gotta wait. So how does that work? I was just gonna take a step back. Like, how do you start that at 16? Like, where are you at? Like, are you just like, I just need to do something? And then how, how does it work?

It was actually my mom's idea. My mom got all like, she heard about it. She was like, oh, this would be a great thing for Andrea. It would give her great skills. I was still 16. I was going to school at the time. And so it was really my mom's idea. That this is what I should start as a business. And I guess I was persuadable and coachable, and so that's what I did. I actually ended up doing it for about 3 years. And sometimes it was like Tupperware parties where people would get their friends together, and sometimes it was me— like, I once went on the local TV station to talk about bras. I went to gyms and, you know, like, advertised to gyms and ran info sessions at gyms when I was 16 or 17 and just did whatever I could to hustle clients. Of course, that was in the days before there was like automated marketing or even text messaging, so I did everything by phone. And I don't even remember how appointments, but I must have done it by phone and Daytimer, frankly, probably actually is how I hustle appointment setting.

So you're out there knocking on gyms wherever you find people, you're out there and you're trying to get, and then like, were they looking at you like, you know, who's this 16-year-old kid talking about bras?

I don't know that anybody ever questioned much my age. And in fact, it wasn't until I was like, well, they always used to say how great I was cuz I was so young and successful. And I remember the first time that didn't happen in a room. I was about 24, 25. I had start, I read Rich Dad Poor Dad when like the, I don't know, probably the year it came out. And started investing in real estate when I was 24. And I remember the first time I was in a room talking about investing in real estate and nobody said like, oh, you're so young and smart. And that was almost like a little sad for me 'cause I wasn't the young smart one anymore. Yeah. Nobody ever really questioned my age on anything. I just got a lot of, I actually got a lot of accolades for it when I was young. I don't get that anymore, but I used to. Yeah.

There it is. No, no.

I'm like, oh, you can tell me I'm young and successful, but it hasn't happened in decades at this point.

Wow.

Okay.

So, well, what happened to the, what happened to the bra business? And what was next?

Oh, it was ultimately, I just didn't sell very many of, like, I just, it wasn't, it wasn't a lifelong business. I did sell jewelry after that for a long time. I did a lot of sales things and then I started investing in real estate when I had kids as a side hustle while I stayed home with my kids for a couple of years. And I did well in that. Like, I still have rental properties that I own. And then when I was 29 in 2009, I started working with authors in the publishing space and helping them promote their books to New York Times bestseller. And because of that and getting to know them behind the scenes and seeing, like, I realized that I loved branding. I loved marketing. I loved communications. I remember the first time someone sent me some copy because he was, you know how copywriters fall behind sometimes, but they never want to admit it. Somebody sent me, I don't know what I had to write, a sales page or something. He's like, can you just take a stab at writing this? And I sent it back to him a couple of hours later and he picked up the phone and called me and said, do you have copywriting training? And I said, well, not really. I've done. A little bit. And he is like, you were fast and this is good. And so I started doing like copywriting, marketing, branding for authors to help them communicate their big idea and get really clear about what their message was. And the thing about when you're writing a book is that you have to clarify your ideas because it's going on paper or, you know, essentially on paper. And so that's really where I love to work today still. And it's what I do with people is help them get really clear about their big idea and their brand. So that it's remembered by other people.

Love it. I wanna dig into that. And cause I know you have a lot to teach in that. Before we get there, you mentioned something I wanna hit on because I know we do have a lot of thought leaders that might be listening, authors, and you know, you talked about getting to, you know, bestselling books and all that. Tell us a little bit about that experience. I know there was a way to do it. You could buy your way to success. Is that still the game or what's different and what'd you love about that and what'd you learn?

So yes, I think there is still a game that does that. It's not something I personally do anymore, but I'll tell you what I learned and I think I think the principles are still the same, is that the beauty of having a really well-branded, easy-to-remember, good book— like, a well-written book is not necessarily a well-selling book, right? Like, the best-selling book is not the best-written book always. But if you can get the two together, if you can get a really well-written book, one that takes all of your ideas as a subject matter expert and it organizes them in a simplified way so that the average reader can read them— and I'm talking about nonfiction, I've never touched I've never touched a fiction book, so these are all like nonfiction, business, health, how-to, that kind of thing. Personal growth, those kinds of books. What I learned with working with bestselling authors is that it was all about making sure you could mobilize an audience to buy the book. Because when you're selling a book, it isn't really the $25 or the $35 for the book that you're selling. What you're selling is that people care enough to read the book, and that's like 8 to 10 hours of their life, or they're comparing it against all the books they haven't read sitting on their shelf. And do they they really need another one. And so you're not really selling— it's not a $25 product. In fact, books are probably the hardest thing ever that you'll sell. It's much easier to sell something for more money that has a different deliverable or a different outcome, because when you're selling a book, you're really selling— are the people going to trust you? You're selling authenticity, you're selling connection, and you're selling time. Yeah, you have to convince people that it's worth trusting you and that it's worth the time to read the book. So what I learned working with the bestselling authors is that the ones that were the easiest to work with that had the best ideas, they were doing two things really well. They had an audience that they could mobilize, and they were really good at clarifying and branding their idea. And they took the time up front to get clear about their idea and figure out how to put it in the book and like spend the time making sure it was in the right sequence. Like, what do you introduce first? What do you introduce next? And how is the table of contents laid out so that people read the table of contents and understand it? And the COVID and the subtitle and Like all that is where we would spend a lot of time and just being patient in how do we take this idea and make it so somebody that doesn't know anything about your subject matter can understand it. And for a lot of subject matter experts, this means dumbing it down or it means simplifying it. And frankly, I think what my gift is or what, where I've done really well is that I'm smart enough to listen really well. And when I don't know the subject matter knowledge, I can be also dumb enough to have them explain it to me again and then say like, oh no, no, no, hang on a second.

Like, because you're almost trying to be the avatar to say, look, if I can't understand what you're trying to tell me, then we got a problem here. Like, you got to be able to dummy it down for me. Only the people that get it are going to get it versus everybody else. I might put you on the spot here a little bit, but is there, again, for those authors of us or people that are wanting to read books, is there any examples of like, either way, like somebody like, wow, like this person, or maybe some of the authors you worked with that you refined that you look back and say, this is a good example of somebody who just nailed their brand and their messaging, like a good model for us to follow. And maybe, and if you can remember, again, this might be harder, somebody who like didn't, like maybe like, oh wow, I read this book and they just totally like, you know, missed it. And I don't necessarily wanna call people out, but I don't know if you have any thoughts on that.

Yeah, I do. I have one that I like the most. So when I worked with Ray Bard, who was the publisher that I spent the most time learning from, he published The One Thing. And when we were working on The One Thing behind the scenes with him, what he would He was always thinking, how could that book be sold in bulk? That was one of the things Ray would always think about with books is how do we sell this book in bulk? And I think a lot of authors don't think about that. Like, they're so excited to write their book and get their idea out there. Maybe they're thinking about how it's going to grow their business, but they're not necessarily thinking about the reader experience or how are they going to sell the book. And, you know, what's the rest of the business model behind the book? Like, I spend— I do 3 things with clients. I help them get clear on their business model. Behind their idea, and then their message, which is the marketing stuff of like how you actually sell that idea, and then also their methodology. So that's their intellectual property and what is their unique way of saying something. Yeah, because there's not really a lot of new ideas. I hate to say this, like it— I'm kind of— there's not, right? Like we're all repurposing some idea from someone else, but there's maybe a new idea for a different target market or a new idea just the way you understand it or whatever that is. So how do you create intellectual property that's branded? So that's what Ray really spent a lot of time going over. And then he'd also think about how can we sell this book in bulk? And so The One Thing did that really well. Like they, they spent the time to slow down and get clear about what the purpose of the book, because really it's a productivity book, but how do you get clear about how you're gonna talk about your version of productivity? And then it turned into like corporate training, relationship seminars, you know, Cool. Like, it's— if you go look at The One Thing right now in terms of their business model, they have facilitators, they have journals, they have relationship seminars. They're like, how do you take The One Thing and build it into any part of your life? And that's all because they slowed down enough at the beginning of the process to start with the relationship.

Was that part of the vision early on, or that just sort of like part of the vision and then expanded? Or, I mean, sounds like you did magic to help them figure that out. As you talk about, it's like figuring out the whole model.

Yeah, I was more of like an observer than I was in terms of in it that was really Ray. But the, yes, they had the vision for like, and that's what a lot of visionaries, I giggle because a lot of visionaries, they all come. Have you ever seen that? I could find it and send it to you, but have you ever seen that graphic of Walt Disney's business plan? It's kind of common in the entrepreneur world and it's basically is like he's got movies and merch and Disneyland and I mean, he looked like a crazy dude.

Yeah.

It's like this weird mind map with arrows going where you don't understand it. Every visionary I've ever worked with, some time in the first like hour when I listen to them, they're gonna draw some crazy face map like that. Like they're like this, and then I wanna do this, this, and I'm like, whoa, hang on. You know this, you work with similar people, right?

Yep. And if I could just get 1% of this market, gonna be a billionaire.

Totally. Right.

And if I could just get 1% of the people to buy my stuff, right?

Yeah. So if you wanna do all that, just like Disney did, you've gotta have a big enough idea that you can figure out how to nest everything else under that umbrella so people understand it. And I think Spending a lot of time learning about neuroscience in the last 20 years. A lot of that is making it so that the consumer's brain has a place to file it in something that they're already familiar with.

Got it.

Right? Because it's easier to take something that somebody knows and then attach your idea to it than it is to create a new idea and then try to explain your new idea. It's just easier to say, you already know this, okay, it's like this, but it's also like that. And just grab analogy and attach something to it. So. The one thing is framed that way. We all know you can do one thing at a time. And so by taking that and making it the big idea, they were then able to nest all that other.

It's almost like, as you were saying, it's almost like as a recipient, it feels like it's going to be easy.

Yeah.

Right. It feels like I already know this can't be that. Oh, okay. To tweak off what I know, I'll just do something I know better is what you're saying. And that's an interesting angle. And again, if those of us listening, you know, it's almost like, yeah, you just simplify and we don't think it too complicated. It's just. Tweak something that people know.

Yeah.

We want expediency. We want easy. We don't want, yeah. So interesting.

There was a big plan there. Well, and the neuroscience of that is for people to be able to take the neurons that fire together, wire together. And so if you know who your target market is and you know what they already understand when it comes to identifying your big idea, you take something they understand, you put your idea beside it, and then just kind of like duct tape goes around wires. If you can confirm what they already know, but put your idea into what they already know, they're more likely to remember you because of the neurons that fire together, wire together. And that's how memory is created. And so that's really how I see branding is branding's about creating memory for people. And the way you create memory is you start with something they already know. You're not starting from scratch.

That's interesting. Okay. So let's get into the branding because I know that's really, I mean, you know, queen of branding, you know, other things I could call you because you've been doing it so long and you're so good at it. You know, when you think branding, there's so many different ways that could go. Talk to me a little bit about, you know, I think you really hone in on, on that idea, on branding that idea and what are you seeing out there? What's working today? What do you love to do? So let's just get in a little bit.

Yeah, totally. So I think what's working today is branding. And when I say branding, I don't really mean your logo. Like we do logo development at our company, but logo to me is like, an afterthought almost, right? If your branding is really good, your logo just is obvious. It's kind of like when you have a baby and then the baby's born and it sort of named itself and you're like, oh, well, this baby doesn't look like a Susan, but it definitely looks like a Mary. Like, you know, like that's kind of what logos are like. So to me, when I think about branding and ideas, it's how can you take specifically if you are a subject matter expert, somebody who's been, you have some great field of knowledge, whatever it might be in health, in fitness, in business, whatever that is, you take that. and you wanna make it so that you're known for that topic. It's really important that you've put your ideas into some sort of a methodology or a model. Some people call it model, I call it method, whatever it is, some sort of a framework that other people can understand so that the framework becomes what you lead with and the framework becomes how you talk about it. And some of that is just getting really clear about what it is that you know. And that's part of what I spend time doing with people is like listening to the subject matter experts and asking questions that a lot of times they, Usually a really smart person will leave out several steps of what they know because it's so in their unconscious competency, right? They're so good at it. They forget that those of us that don't know their skillset, we don't know what they know. And so they forget to explain.

Does everybody know these obvious steps?

Does everybody know this? And usually what they forget to explain are the basics. Like if we knew step 1, 2, and 3, we could figure the rest out, but they skip 1, 2, and 3 and they're talking about other things and.

You know, back to what you said earlier, and I imagine even on the simple stuff or the step 1, 2, and 3, it's also probably doing it in a way that is, can resonate and is simple for me to understand and absorb, right?

So branding to me comes down to really only two things. How do you make people feel? And what do you want them to remember? Because the way you get people to remember something is they either have to laugh, cry, or get angry. They have to feel. If they feel, there'll be a little hit of adrenaline. Adrenaline creates memory. Short-term memory creates long-term memory. And so really branding is only two things. How do you want people to feel every single time they interact with your company? And then what do you want them to remember about your company?

Laugh, cry, and get angry. You just said those, but are those really three emotions you're going for on the, on the feel?

Yeah, they're the three easiest ways to get people to release a little adrenaline into their system. And when we have adrenaline released into our system, we will create memory. So the more adrenaline that's released into our system, the more the memory will be created, which is why for those of us that are old enough to remember September 11th, 2001, we all remember where we were that day and the first time we saw those planes fly into that building. And like, we remember that incident if you were old enough for it to impact you because so much adrenaline was released into your system at such an odd time. That's why it created a memory of like, for a lot of people, we remember where we were, what we were wearing, You know, who was there, how we felt, like the first call we made to check on somebody we cared about or whatever it was.

Right, right.

So laugh, cry, or get angry are the 3 easy ways to get people to release some adrenaline into their system. And adrenaline creates memory.

Got it. You know, laugh, meet a good comedian or whatever, you're gonna, you know, laugh a lot.

You're a comedian. Yeah. That's why like a clever headline will make you laugh. That's why even like if you think about good headlines that'll get open rate, sometimes they'll make you angry. You'll be like, that's not true. And then you open up the email to like argue with the headline. Right.

So I guess as I say too, And there's sometimes that, you know, bad press can be good press, right? Some people could do stuff, they get so angry, everybody's picking it up, talking about it. And you're like, oh, that was actually maybe intentional or it was a good branding actually. But they did that at times. Okay. So back to, cause I really want to go a little bit deeper here because there's so many, I think a lot of our listeners will be in the world of their brand and messaging. And what other tips do you have for like, all right, so I'm just going to sit down with you. Somebody sits down for the first time. And is it just that simple where you get them to kind of, you know, if I don't have you in front of me right now and I'm just sort of thinking about my own brand and messaging, what should I be doing? Is it maybe like talking to others and asking them to, you know, simplify or what they see when they read my brand or what kind of tips do you have for me there?

Oh, that's a good question. If you're by yourself or you're with someone who's willing to listen to you, one of the exercises I do with clients or people right away is I get them to do what I call a brain dump. So grab sticky notes. And a pen and a blank wall and take your topic or your business or whatever it is that you're trying to brand, and then write down on an individual sticky note all the things that you want other people to understand, or you want other people to feel, or you want other people to know about you. So like write all those things down, like, and stick them on individual sticky notes and just put them in whatever random order they appear, because that's just dumping everything out of your brain. To make it visible. And sometimes, like, once they're there and they're visible, you realize, oh, I forgot to say this, or I didn't say that, or these two things. So step one is just dump it all. Step two is take those dumped ideas and start clumping them together in what sort of, like, same goes together, you know? Like, oh, well, these two things are kind of the same, so take those two sticky notes and put them together. Oh, these three things are the same. Oh, but this is different. And then, like, and you end up usually with, like, 3 to 5 piles of ideas. And from all those ideas, take the one that somebody must know in order to understand everything else and stick it at the top of your wall. So now you have like one sticky note at the top of your wall that says, this is what they must know. And after they know that, what 3 to 5 ideas underneath nest easily, or 2 to 5 ideas. I really try to get people down to 2. That's my like secret sauce.

What people must know about my brand, if nothing else, this is the one takeaway.

Yeah.

Is that sort of the same thing as saying, if you're gonna go tell somebody else about my brand, what is it that one thing you would say?

Like, if I was gonna say anything about your brand, like for me, it's that, and I think you're pretty well known for this, it's that you create connection and community, right? You know, and I think you've been known for that for as long as I've ever known you. Like, you're connected, you create connections, and you remember people. Those all come down to connections and community, and then everything else you do fits underneath that.

Right.

And so I would think we could probably ask 100 people and we get some version of those two words back. Right, right. Eric's well connected. And then even like, you're known for your high follow-through, but no one cares about your follow-through if they don't first understand that you're connected.

Got it. Got it.

But after we understand that you're connected, then your follow-through makes sense. And your follow-through is what makes you connected. So sometimes what people do is they'll put something up at the top of this sticky note board. And then realize like, oh, that's not really what I see. They're not really what I am known for, not what I want to be known for. And so just play around with what goes at the top and then how do you nest everything underneath that?

That's very interesting. You're right. Said a different way, what you think maybe, or maybe what you think you want to be known for isn't necessarily the top thing that should be. That could be a secondary thing. You know, what's going to be more appealing to others, I guess. What's going to evoke, back to what you said, what's going to evoke more emotion, feelings, and getting into that side. I imagine a big part of that.

And once you have that top organizing principle of what your brand really is, then 2 to 5 sub-pillars can go underneath that. And they make sense because they're anchored back to the top one.

Right.

But what most subject matter experts do is they dump everything out and then they randomly grab the equivalent of the sticky notes and they start just plastering that all over their messaging. And it just confuses people because people don't care until you make it relevant to them. No one cares about you or I. We have to make it relevant to them. So if you're someone with a big idea, you've got to take that big idea and make it relevant to your audience so that they want to continue to engage with you and they want to hire you and they want to work with you and they want you on their stages or whatever that looks like.

Yeah, I mean, I think what you're saying, it's so interesting because obviously we were somewhat done a lot of some similar work on the branding side, and it just astonishes me when I just look at people's messaging and websites How far off, like, I mean, just the exercise of asking somebody and interviewing them and then saying, now go look at your website and tell me, does it say what you just told me?

Yeah.

And then interviewing like their team and the people around you and having them all like, you wanna talk about that a little bit about like just the inconsistency that you see from people?

Oh, totally. Like the, whether it's like, and I think it's usually because like there's so much inconsistency with how people show up, whether it's on platforms, so like the different platforms and what they're saying, or on their website like you say, or like the visionary will have— the business owner, a visionary will have one idea and their team will have another idea. And that's because there's lack of those organizing principles of who are we trying to impact, how do we want them to feel, and what do we want them saying about us, what do we want them to remember, what's the word. I try to bring it down when I work with clients to just bring it down to like one or two words that people will remember about them. You know, if we think about like Seven Habits of Highly Effective People We know that that organization organizes people and they're very structured and they create calm. Like I feel it's calm around anything Stephen Covey, right? 'Cause they're all about creating that calmness and then organizing. And I think that's what everything Stephen Covey does. Even now when they move into like anything that they do, it still comes under those two basic big ideas.

Yep. Yep. And I think you said something earlier I'm gonna bring up 'cause to me it was kind of profound. I wanna reiterate it. I think some of the visionaries make faulty assumptions that people just should understand what they're saying because they're already 5 steps ahead always of what they're thinking. And like, well, everybody should, and like, you got to dummy it down. And what you think it is not clear to people, how do you clarify that? And going through that, I, and I'm a big believer, like I've come a long way on the whole branding stuff too. And I, and I like what you said earlier, because I've said that before too. It's not just a logo. I mean, the messaging to me is everything and the feelings that you're evoking. And, you know, certainly encourage, you know, everybody to make sure they're going through, whether they reach out to you or anybody else, or just, you know, talk to loved ones around them. But I think you gotta go through that exercise to say, is my message that I'm out there in the world and what I'm saying, is it consistent? And does it actually make sense? And is it authentic to me? So I love all that stuff you said. I wanna talk about now the future. You know, we're now in this scary, exciting, confusing, I don't know, world of AI and how it integrates into you know, the world you're playing into branding, into, and you know, before we were in the Quo Green Room, we talked a lot about the word I'm hearing a lot of is, is authenticity and trust. So tell me your sort of thoughts, vision on that world of where we're going.

Yeah, so I kind of resisted some of that, like, so when we say AI, one is I think we've all been using AI. I've been using it my whole career because really like a spreadsheet is AI. I remember my dad being so excited about Microsoft Excel. He was like, you wouldn't believe what this thing will do, right? Yeah, because he had to do everything on paper prior to that with his business. And so first of all, I'm not super scared of AI cuz we've all been using it. Like a calculator is AI, you know, the original ones from the '70s and '60s and '50s or whatever. So that's one thing. But when ChatGPT and those like generative AI started to emerge, I didn't jump on the bandwagon right away. I really thought, you know, like I just didn't, I just didn't, I don't know why. I had a bunch of reasons why. More recently, like the last year and a half, I have, because I really believe that It's a huge opportunity for real subject matter experts, people who have been in their craft, whatever it is. If you're like a doctor, a dentist, a marketer, like anyone who's had 10 to 15 years working in the trenches of their bit, like they're educated and they have trench work and they're like good at what they do. There's this beautiful world now where you can get really clear about what you want to create. You can get clear about a brand guide. I don't know what you guys do, but we create these brand guides that are long and comp— like not complicated. They're just long and clear. Right? This is how we do stuff around here. And they become a manual for how you want to communicate and what you want to be known for. And then those can train these tools that we have. I just see them like tools. They're tools to help us organize our ideas better. That's really all they are. However, you have to be crystal clear about what you give it because it doesn't think. This is why, as what I find fascinating, like it's not thinking. You need to tell it what you want it to do. And therefore we, the people on the other side, need to be so clear and so aligned about who we are, what impact we want to make. And what our position on something is, that tool can do what we ask it to do.

Yeah, I can almost see as you're saying that, like, the natural tendency for us is the law of expediency, as my beloved Brian Tracy would say, is, you know, we all have a tendency to want to go as fast, quick, cheap as possible and be lazy, you know, by nature. So I think there would be a tendency to say, I'm going to leverage AI so much, but they forget to do some of the fundamental things. Like you said, that if you don't think and feed it the right inputs in the beginning, you're going to be going down a rabbit hole of data which may not be necessarily the best output. Would you agree to that?

Totally agree to it. And there's that on a broad global level, like from a brand perspective, right? It was like, as a company, if you're not clear about that high-level brand stuff, but then bring it down into like a day-to-day, like a week, a podcast, even what you and I are doing right now, right? We're having a real human authentic conversation. There's no voiceovers going on. We're not like, yeah, putting weird— I don't know if you've seen those weird videos where people have their AI twin. I can't stand them.

These are our rooms moving in case somebody—

this is really me and these are my real wiggles and all that kind of stuff. But that, I think, if you've got that— this is what I'm excited about— is if you've got that weekly great piece of material that you're producing as a visionary right now, somebody who's writing a book and has an idea, because that's all my world that I live in. If you're creating original good content once a week, and then you use tools and workflows to be able to reproduce and republish that content, you have this opportunity to like lengthen the reach of your arms, like to create impact longer than you ever could have, like so much easier than you could have before. You don't need 8 editors and 10 graphic designers and all the things we used to have to bring to something. You really can, as long as you're creating original, thought-provoking, your original content. So that's why I love working with people. That are those actual subject matter experts. And frankly, the thing that I also find is that the real subject matter experts aren't really good at navigating their phone and TikTok.

Yeah.

So, in some ways, the people who have a lot of noise right now, like the people who are good at navigating TikTok and their telephone, don't have subject matter knowledge. And so, the subject matter experts just need to be more authentically themselves and aligned and clear and have the support. To also put that on TikTok so that they can get some traction. So I think it's a great— I think AI, if we play it right as humans, is a great way to transfer knowledge and wisdom from older generations to younger generations. And I hope we smarten up and use it that way.

Yep. And you know, you said the authentic word and I like— and I was gonna just make sure I caught that tip. It was pretty interesting. So you're saying you're finding the thought leaders and gurus who are able to know how to technically navigate the world of TikTok and are authentic and say, I'm gonna lean into it and get good at it and be, and just talk from the heart, say things I want to say, they're going to have a lot more success than, than those that aren't engaging there.

Absolutely. And I think that— I don't know that they're actually navigating the platform, right? I mean, you can hire young people to do that, but the ones that are showing up and getting on camera and getting and becoming good at storytelling, becoming good at being on camera, making sure that they can communicate clearly, like, that's a skill set that they're going to need to have. But if they have that skill set and they're willing to record their ideas, we now can replicate those ideas with the AI tools. And I think that's what I really like, like a great brand guide, great workflows, and a great subject matter expert who is willing to slow down and teach really well. I actually have this belief that teaching has been decentralized and no one's really talking about it, but in North America, you know, like you have to go to school and then the teachers teach you the things. However, I actually think we have more high-paid teachers on YouTube than we've ever had in the past. And if you right now can master, if you have a subject matter knowledge, you can master the skill of teaching, you can be one of the most influential, highly paid people in the world. We can now broadcast great teachers. You know, like my son had a terrible grade 11 physics teacher, and yet he loved physics. So he went and learned physics on YouTube, and then I heard him teaching his friends physics. And his class had a higher physics average than the rest because he learned it on YouTube, not because he learned it from school.

Oh, wow. What you're saying to me with, you know, as you know, I have two little ones and I constantly think about the future of school. Like my wife and I'll drive by the high school and be like, well, there's a high school they might be going to if there's still a high school by the time they go to school. Because my belief is exactly that. Like, why wouldn't, why wouldn't we all just be going online or popping in our VR headsets and, you know, with AI supporting us to go learn and saying, like in my mind, it's like, okay, what does your child like to do? What's their personality type? Well, let's just give them a dose of this skill that they're going to enjoy learning from in the way from the best teacher out there that teaches the subject and be happy. And it's funny, I read something in Today and I think it was in Axios or something. They talked about how like they were talking about the future of school and they're saying, yeah, in the future and when kids go to school and the teachers are more like, and just going to be not babysitters, but just basically watching the kids to make sure, you know, like they're, you're there, they're just overseeing stuff like daycare for the kid because are they really going to be learning at these schools, or are they going to be going there from those teachers? Or does the role of the local teacher change to be more facilitator? I mean, I don't know where this is going to head, but it's got to be different.

It's got to be different. And I think the skill of a subject, like the people that are writing books, if you can look at yourself as a teacher, like, how do I teach this content in the best way possible? We now have these massive platforms we can put great teachers on.

Yeah.

And whatever topic you're teaching, if you're teaching to adults or kids, you can become one of the best paid people in the world.

Amazing. And then all the way back to full cycle, but make sure you get your brand right.

Yeah. You got it.

All Andrea's rules are brand correctly. 'Cause when you do launch, and again, a lot of us, especially, you know, I love the big part of our community. We have a lot of brains, some decent amount of thought leaders. And what you're getting me/them excited about is, look, your world might be growing really quickly if you do this right, because, you know, on YouTube and others, you might get, be getting sought after a lot more people that if you are the expert and you are authentic. And again, I think people, I mean, you and I are just brainstorming where this is going, but I just feel like there's going to be this world where people might be getting quickly turned off by the AI bots and say, no, I really want to talk to somebody that's live because maybe I have a question and I want a real answer, not an answer that might be right or 80% right, or, you know, I just don't know, you know, kind of thing.

I also think people will have— I think we're going to go back— this is why I think Speakeasy Mastermind is amazing, is that we are going to trust more of what we know and who we've met in person. And so if who you are online and who you are in person is very consistent, then people will have this like natural relaxed nervous system around you. They're going to feel normal. They're going to feel like, oh, this is someone I can trust. Like, our instincts are not going away as people. So our instinct is to trust people that we know. And so if you're consistent with your brand both in person and online, Trust is gonna be the currency of the future and we're in a trust recession right now. And so the currency is how do you build authenticity? And I really do think it comes back to brand. I feel like if you're clear on your brand, then authentic is obvious.

I love it. I love it. And on that note, is there anything, anything I didn't ask that I should have or anything else you wanted to share?

I don't think so. I think the thing I'd— maybe this one little piece.

Yeah.

People in branding like to make it complicated and I think they do that cuz then they can like charge a bunch more money for it and it really isn't. Complicated. It's how do you make people feel and what do you want them to remember? That's really that simple. And just keep your brand simple, but also keep it like who you really are.

Right. I love it. That's a good way to end it. So I've all said those are the biggest takeaways, feel and remember. And I think if we all do a little bit more of that, we're all going to surge ahead. So thank you so much for your time. And if you're listening and you want to really get some extra help with the branding, definitely reach out to Andrea. All our info is there. But, you know, plus if you just want to meet an incredible person and especially if you're traveling to Calgary, and you want the local tour, the local guide to what to do and where to do, she's so great at helping out. An all-around amazing human being. Thank you so much for being with us today, Andrea.

Thank you so much.

And that's a wrap from the Speakeasy Podcast. If something sparked for you, don't keep it to yourself. Share it, review it, and pass it to the one person who needs to hear this right now. Want in on the Real Mastermind? Tap the link in the show notes to apply. Until next time, Keep scaling, stay sharp, and don't be the smartest one in the room.