Steven Wolfe Pereira: “It's very a false dichotomy that you cannot have something be both entertainment and education and deliver it through technology.”

Good Company is a production of iHeartRadio. It's really a false dichotomy that you cannot have something be both entertainment and education and deliver it through technology.

Hi, I'm Michael Kassen. Welcome to Good Company, where I'll explore how marketing, media, entertainment, and tech are intersecting, transforming our lives and the way we do business at a breakneck speed. I'll be joined by some of the greatest business minds and strongest leaders who will share how they've built companies from the ground up or transformed them from the inside out. My bet is you'll pick up a lesson or two along the way. It's all good. It's a great pleasure today to welcome to Good Company a very longtime friend and a partner and somebody that I have enormous respect for, and that is Steven Wolfe Pereira, the CEO and co-founder of Encantos. a direct-to-consumer creator platform that helps kids.

Thank you so much, Miguel. Uh, it's great to be here, and, uh, obviously a big fan, so thanks for having us.

So Steven, it'd be great to kind of walk our audience through your background. You know, in 2015 you co-founded Encantos, so give us a little walk down the SWP story.

A little walk down memory lane. Look, I feel like I was born to build this company. And it's really taken kind of all of my experiences across all those industries and kind of channeling it all into Encantos. But I'm a Dominican-American kid born and raised in Mount Vernon, New York. My mother came to Washington Heights in the '60s, so back when there were very few Dominicans there. It was largely a Jewish neighborhood, actually.

Ronnie went to school in Washington Heights.

There you go.

At Barnard School for Girls in Washington Heights.

I mean, she was there on 173rd when they came after all the, you know, unrest, um, with Trujillo in the Dominican Republic. And my father was a New Yorker, you know, born and raised in the Bronx. And both my parents were teachers. So I feel like education, it's always drilled into, you know, kind of any immigrant family. But, um, it's always the thing that no one could ever take away from you. And, you know, kind of not really knowing a lot about, you know, kind of the educational system in the US. But I eventually ended up going to Tufts for undergrad. I majored in economic development, and I was fortunate to get an internship through this program called Sponsors for Educational Opportunity, which was, you know, at the time, you know, the largest source of diversity on Wall Street for summer interns. And thanks to that program, that exposed me to finance. I got, you know, very early on working on technology, media, and telecom. So I ended up working at this little startup called the Blackstone Group in 1994. I ended up working at Smith Barney, and then I did Latin American private equity, and it was all in kind of the telecom space. And then in '99, I got recruited by this little startup that came out of MIT called Akamai Technologies, and that was really kind of my first real foray working at a tech company. And I've been in tech for over 20 years since, and it's always been tech and something. So when I was at Univision, I was doing, you know, kind of technology and data analytics, and eventually I got kind of exposed to this whole marketing world. I eventually got recruited to Publicis where we definitely worked a lot together. I was running the Walmart media business and all of the multicultural media business, and I did that for about 4 years. And then I went back into tech. I was the CMO for DataLogix, which got acquired by Oracle. I ended up helping to launch the Oracle Data Cloud. And then I was the CMO for Newstar, which was a public technology company. And then finally, I was the CMO for a data analytics company called Quantcast. But along the way, unfortunately, both my parents had passed. My father died in 2011, and my mother ended up passing the year after my son was born in 2016. And it was right around that time that you just kind of Realized that life is short. What are you going to really make your mark? How are you going to have impact? And then ultimately, what are my kids going to learn in this 21st century? Especially having worked in tech for over 20 years, you know, this is the AI era and anything that can be automated will be. So I really started doing a lot of research around 21st century skills, and that kind of led us to this idea that if we could build a creator platform where where we get the best creators from around the world to help kids learn 21st century skills, that would be something really innovative. And that's how we formed Encantos.

And Steven, in a pre-COVID world, because you were having these conversations and I certainly took notice and invested with you pre-COVID, full disclosure to our listeners, I am a proud and happy investor in Encantos, but it was a pre-COVID world. What were some of the indicators that you saw that told you we were actually ripe for this disruption in e-learning before we realized it was an imperative?

Yeah, so we actually formed the company officially in 2016 and we set it up, you know, with purpose at the core from the beginning. We set it up not just as a B Corp, but actually as a public benefit corporation. And the whole idea was always to kind of figure out how can we, you know, reimagine education through entertainment and technology? Because when you think about it, how do kids learn best? They learn best through story. They learn best through characters. And, you know, kind of the idea of storytelling, which I know is near and dear to your heart, You know, we all learn through stories, but we just didn't really see a lot being done where, you know, kind of the edtech community probably looked down on entertainment, if we're being honest. Entertainment didn't want to do anything really in education because, you know, that was, you know, probably not the right place to be. And I just thought that those things, it's almost like a red herring. It's really a false dichotomy that you cannot have something be both entertainment and education and deliver it through technology. And so by fusing those 3 things together, we really thought that you could take a page out of what all the great platforms are doing. You know, you saw what YouTube was up to, you saw all these different ways to go direct to consumer. And our whole philosophy was not just about, you know, what's happening, you know, kind of in the classroom, think about what's happening in the living room. That's where, you know, parents are the first teacher. So we wanted to have something that was going to be kind of supplemental, something that would be enrichment at home.

Well, your timing was extraordinary because again, who knew that we would have the last 18 months where so much of this needed to be reimagined? Can you talk about the curated mix that you've launched on the app a bit, Steven? Because I just think if people understand the audio, the video, the interactive games, the books, all living in a different way and in a different format and Just talk about that. I mean, I think it's so interesting where you've taken the concept of Encantos.

Yeah, well, I mean, think about it just from your own personal experience. Like, you have limited real estate on your iPhone, right? Like, on your device. And no parent wants to have, you know, 1,000 different kid apps that just do one single thing. So the idea was, how do you really kind of fuse together all the functionality and really have it be in one place? So think of video and audio and books and games in one app. That was kind of where we started.

You know, it's interesting, Steven. I've got a business philosophy that you've just underscored, and that business philosophy is anytime you find an opportunity to use the 3 following words in a sentence in the right order, there's goodness that will come. And those 3 words are fragmentation, consolidation, and efficiency. If you can find any industry that is fragmented, if you can figure out a way to consolidate it and make it more efficient, somebody will do well, either spiritually, financially, all the -lies. You can, you can tick a lot of boxes. And you just really articulated that. You said this is a fragmented approach to education.

Yeah.

Here's a place to consolidate it. and make it more efficient for the, for the end user, that's a win just, just there.

Well, and now take that same concept and mirror it, because what we just described was the demand side of our platform. So that is the consumer side, which is really the kids and the parents. Think about now the supply side. You have fragmented demand with kids and families and all the different options that they want, you know, kind of a one-stop shop. But now think about that for the creators and think about all the people around the world that want to help kids learn. And this is really where my co-founder Susie, who you've met, she is a world-class creative, you know, Venezuelan American, started her own creative agency, which was one of the top 5 in the country, sold it. So she's a second-time entrepreneur, but she was really our first creator, or as we call our creators, the first story teacher, because we believe in using the power of storytelling and fusing it with education. And we really think that this concept of a story teacher is catching on. And so if you can think of Susie as almost our MVP, she had a story world that she wanted to bring to life, which was our first story world, Confículos. And that is now the number one bilingual preschool brand, Emmy nominated. It's won, you know, multiple Kidscreen Awards for best digital preschool series. But that was what we kind of incubated with, with her as the creator. And so we went down the line. What are all the things that a creator wants? They want to own their IP. They want to be able to find an audience. They want to be able to have data and understanding how the audience is engaging with their IP. They want to get paid. And so understanding if we could build out a creator stack that is truly designed to help kids learn, I feel like that was the insight of this fragmented supply and fragmented demand on one platform. And that truly is the power of the Encounters platform and what we're building.

So Steven, let me switch gears, but for you it's not a gear switch. For you it's a, a core throughout your career, throughout the whole time I've known you. And I know the industry looks at you this way in a very positive light. The power and the importance of a multicultural perspective is critical. Certainly in our industry right now, it is at the center. And we're looking at the necessity for everybody to open the aperture on their media investment strategy across a multicultural opportunity. And we hear these words BIPOC and the like that is right at the center of the sort of cultural zeitgeist today, but also Business imperative. It's not just a feeling. It's not just a nice-to-do. It is essential. It is core to everybody's thinking. What or who? You know, it's kind of that old question that somebody said you always ask a singer, what was the song and who was the artist that inspired you to become a singer? Steven, I would say to you, who was the person who— what was the song? What was the artist? Who brought, other than your own experience from an immigrant perspective, what was the thing that said to you, this is core to my being, this is core to my business, this is core to what I want to do in this world?

I think it's a real important question. I mean, look, it's the kind of thing where you can't fake it. You know, like my mom has obviously since passed, but if you met my mother, she had a very thick accent. You know, she would not call me Steven. It was called Etheving, you know, because Um, you know, that's, that's the way Dominicans will pronounce the S. But the reality is I lived in this bicultural, bilingual world. You know, we spoke Spanish at home and, you know, outside we spoke English and I didn't know anybody.

So did I. We spoke Yiddish at home and English outside. So I had the same experience.

Absolutely. And I feel like that is part of the richness of, you know, kind of not just diversity, you know, kind of of race or ethnicity, it's, it's diversity of culture of experiences. And I, I didn't know that I was quote unquote different until you kind of get into these school environments or, you know, kind of other kids and, oh, I guess no one else speaks Spanish at home, or you don't have that kind of experience going to different countries. And it was probably not until I got to college that I really realized that this was a superpower. And so I got this incredible opportunity to, to do this internship through SEO. Again, Seizing Every Opportunity is what it's called now. seo-usa.org is the URL. And they're now the largest source of diversity on Wall Street with over 5,000 alumni. And anyone, you know, that's in a position of power or influence of color on the street did SEO. Like the highest-ranking Black woman on Wall Street, Carla Harris, who's the vice chair at Morgan Stanley, she did the program in 1982. Right. And I served on the board for a decade with Carla. and all these other folks. So I would say that what inspired me was really SEO. And I did the program, I was a summer intern at Blackstone in 1994. And, you know, to be clear, there was no Black at Blackstone in 1994, right? It, it was just very interesting that this whole kind of diversity conversation, we've been having it, at least I have for 25 years, and we really haven't moved the needle. And so I think we're at a point where people are now demanding representation. And you're seeing it across every industry. And now, obviously, in the wake of all the tumult from last year, you know, the murder of George Floyd, Black Lives Matter, you see folks really saying, hey, we need to see this representation and it's a business imperative.

So I'm going to ask another question. And this is one of the things, Steven, that you have become treasured for in our industry and famous, but treasured first. And I, and I say that with purpose. And that's the kind of a spotlight series that you've created on your own on Facebook that really focuses and celebrates Black, Asian, Latin executives who are driving big results and calling them out and giving them that spotlight, giving them that focus. And I think it's from the standpoint of a message, both congratulating those individuals, but broadcasting with the bully pulpit that you've created for yourself in that Spotlight series. The importance of having that representation at the executive level. And here's the results, by the way. You're basically saying to the world, here's Sally, and Sally is, is of Asian descent or Hispanic or Black, and look at this. Focusing on the importance of doing what one must do, but actually rendering really good results as a result of doing what you need to be doing anyway.

Absolutely. I mean, look, we've had this conversation, you know, over a decade ago when I was working on the Walmart business, right? Literally, this is math. This is just data. The top 20 DMAs in the country today are all multicultural majorities, right? You can't launch a product and not know how to connect with multicultural audiences. You know, for Encantos, you know, over 50% of kids in America are diverse. And, you know, there is just this thinking that, oh, we can't find the talent, or the talent doesn't exist. And so it just got to a point where, you know, I've been kind of on this journey for, you know, 20-plus years, and I've now worked in finance, I've worked in tech, I've worked in media, entertainment, advertising, marketing. So my kind of cross-section across different industries is just, I think, very unique. And I know that the talent is out there. And so I think in the wake of Black Lives Matter and the murder of George Floyd, it was just like this idea of like, wow, like, don't tell me you can't find the talent. Look at all this amazing talent.

No, that's it.

It just became organic where I would just, hey, you know, here. And these are all folks that we know. And again, you have been, you know, obviously a champion and kind of an uplifter of talent. And I know it's always been important for MediaLink, but, you know, maybe other companies or other folks, other execs in the C-suite, they might not know these people. And it really comes down to your network. work. And so it's not, you know, a bad thing. Like, if you grew up and, you know, you came up through, you know, maybe business school, or you worked in an industry and you just haven't been exposed to kind of diverse talent, I get that. But at the same time, you know, the talent is out there. And I think that whole Spotlight series was really meant to just shine a light on the talent that we know are out there, and they're ready to serve.

It's brilliant. And the results are extraordinary, both for building— no harm in this— building your brand, but actually building on your shoulders the brands of others. And that's an important thing to do. Steven, I always like to kind of wind a Good Company chat with the prediction question. Based on what you're seeing to date, what does the learning and education space look like for you, for us, 5 years from now, 3 years from now? Pick a number. I know it's always difficult to prognosticate. with certainty, but you obviously prognosticated in 2015 when you started Uncantos, and look where we are today. And I said we. And so in 2021, what do you think happens in 2024, 2026?

Yeah, no, look, I feel, um, you're seeing now just from the standpoint of education, 2020 was not a law school year. It was the beginning of a law school decade. And so the stats are just really, you know, alarming. 30% of kids K-12 did not have internet connectivity during the past 12 months. The percentage of kids that are 3 to 4 years old that were enrolled in school fell over 50%. And you see the enrollment in nursery schools and kindergartens down by 25%. So you're seeing this incredible impact on kind of kids. And that is actually certainly a red flag for the future of America when you think about the future of work. In addition, you were starting to see teachers actually drop out of the profession. So 42% of teachers said that they are considering leaving or retiring from their current position. And you're now seeing, like, where are these folks going to go? So on the one hand, you're seeing this crisis in education. And I think the pandemic, you know, it took a pandemic to make edtech a priority, to make everyone kind of put a spotlight on what the hell are kids learning. But I truly believe that there's going to be a huge opportunity where, you know, people are going to take education more into their own hands, they're going to be looking for more resources, they're going to start to, just like you said about the fragmentation, you're going to see the ability for folks to really kind of do a bespoke version of how their kids are going to learn at home, and they're going to look for trusted brands. And so if you think about the 2 biggest parts of our GDP, healthcare and education are 2 of the biggest. And you're seeing every single technology company try to figure out how do we start to get involved in these 2 industries. And so I think it's only a matter of time before every company starts to figure out how are we involved in education, how do you start to train the future workforce. And I feel like the whole idea of the, you know, kind of degree— you're going to see microdegrees, you're going to see credentials, you're going to see certifications. I just feel like the future of education is going to look a lot different from what it does today.

Well, Steven, knowing you've got your hand, as we say, on the tiller, of helping shape and form that for the kids makes me both as a friend, as a partner, but as a citizen, if you will. You know, my grandkids are the ones I'm focused on now personally for education, and I'm watching it and seeing how different it is for them. I know we're in good hands with Encantos and with Steven Wolfe Pereira. So Steven, it's a great pleasure. I'm glad we had a chance to have some good company today. Thank you. I know our listeners will will be smiling. Thank you.

Well, thank you, Michael. We're definitely going to have to have you become a creator on our platform as well because I know kids would actually learn a ton from you. So let's have you become a story teacher as well.

I'd be happy to do it. I'll do it in Spanish, Yiddish, English, whatever you want.

There you go, Stephen Wolf Carrera.

Thank you.

Mil gracias.

I'm Michael Kasson. Thanks for listening to Good Company. Good Company is a production of iHeartRadio.

A special thanks to Lena Peterson, Chief Brand Officer and Managing Director of MediaLink, for her vision on Good Company.

And to Jen Seeley, Vice President, Marketing Communications of MediaLink, for programming amazing talent and content.