How to Inspire Employee Loyalty to Create Superfans (feat. Brittany Hodak)

Hi, I'm Susan Drum and welcome to the enlightened Executive where your personal evolution sparks your leadership evolution. Each episode we feature groundbreaking techniques and strategies to help you get the edge in personal and leadership effectiveness. Today we're focusing on creating superfans of your employees as a way to improve employee retention. And I'm excited to introduce my guest, Brittany Hodak. Brittany is an international keynote speaker and an award winning entrepreneur working with organizations including American Express, WeWork and the United Nations. She's published more than 350 thought leadership articles for media including Forbes, Adweek and Success and has been featured on cnbc, Bloomberg, NBC, CBS and Shark Tank. Brittany co founded and scaled the Superfan company, a fan engagement company whose roster included Walmart, Disney, Amazon, Luke Bryan, Katy Perry, and she's been named to advertising Age 40 Under 40 list, Inc's 35 Under 35 list and Billboard's 30 Under 30 list. So welcome Brittany.

Thank you. That was a mouthful. I'm sorry, Susan, that was so much for you to read. But I am thrilled to be here and so excited to have this conversation today.

So am I. So look, employee retention is such an essential, important topic right now and from whether or not companies are deciding to bring people back to the office and what they're doing about that. But just in general, we've been separated for quite some time. So how do you create the connectivity, the community, the sense of belonging that will keep people through the challenging times? And that's really what we're going to focus on today. So I would love to hear from you your thoughts on employee retention and how do you create super fans of those employees?

Yeah, well, you know, I always like to say that super fandom is a two way street. And if you want your employees to be super fans, you've got to be super fans of them. People these days, especially younger people, really want to work for a company that values them as a full person, not just an employee, somebody who cares about their family, who cares about their work life balance, who cares about their mental health and their physical health in addition to the productivity that they bring to the team. And this is a trend that we're going to see continue to rise. And you know, we're seeing it right now with this great relocation of people from one career to another, one industry to another, people leaving the workforce, deciding they don't want to be back in the workforce trying their hand in entrepreneurship. We're going to continue to see great disruption for a while. And the thing that companies are going to have to do to get those employees to want to be a part of the team is prove that they're the type of company that values their employees and will help make their lives better, not just give them a paycheck.

Now, I feel like a lot of companies say, well, of course we value our, our employees and we think we do a great job showing them, but what more could they possibly want? What would you say to that?

You know, I would say that if you're not collecting the voice of your employees on a very regular basis, you may not know what it is that they want. And the only thing more important than actively collecting the voice of your employees is acting on what they're saying, making sure that you're not just collecting that information, but you're actively analyzing it, and then you're acting in close to real time to make sure that they feel validated and appreciated and engaged in your company.

Gathering the voice of the employee, meaning what is, what are, what are they saying they want? And sometimes there's initial reaction to surface level things, like we need a foosball table in our break room and we'd really like to have the seltzer machine flavored seltzer machine access. And those are things that I say they're nice to have and they're kind of surfacey. There's an opportunity to dig a little deeper. Like, what do those things represent at? What is it? Right.

Yeah. Culture is not a foosball table. Culture is not a happy hour on Friday. Culture is the alignment that your employees feel because they understand the value that they're providing to the company. They know what they're doing and why, and they feel valued and in that role. And when I talk about collecting voice of the Employee, it's looking at all of the moments that matter. So take the totality of your employee journey from the first time they consider maybe applying to be a part of your company as a partner or an employee all the way through their exit interview after they've decided to go in a different direction with their career. What are all of those touch points? What are the opportunity for you to make every experience matter more and then to collect real time feedback at each of those important touch points so that if you find that there's something that you're doing wrong, you can fix it very quickly.

Yes. And what is it that has people feel most connected? I once saw a survey of people that did real exit interviews. There's the exit interview that HR does, and people don't necessarily give the straight answer.

Right.

They want to maintain a good relationship. And they usually say that they were leaving for better pay because they feel like, well, that's easy enough to. But the reality is when they actually did a study where they interviewed people outside of that, they said, okay, why did you really leave anonymously? The number one reason was I wasn't provided development opportunities that I thought would advance my career. And number two is I didn't like my boss. Number six was pay. So you think about that. Those are two things under your control. I wasn't given developmental opportunities and I didn't like my boss. Wow. So we're talking about leadership challenges there.

Yeah, we're talking about leadership and we're talking about alignment. I mean, if you think about the fact that you spend most of the hours that you're awake at your job, it's natural that people want to feel like they're making a difference. They want to feel like what they're doing matters. And I think another Covid outcome really forced people to think about the fact that when you're at work, you're trading time with your family, with your loved ones, with your friends. And to make it be worth that time away, you want to feel like you're contributing and growing and being a part of something meaningful and something bigger, rather than just trading time for money to get that paycheck. Because, you know, there are a lot of places that people can go to get a paycheck.

Talk about what your model is for solving this problem. So share a little bit more about your superfan model. And I think there's a wave model, so you've got a couple.

Yeah, well, so the superfan model. I always say that super fans are created at the intersection of your story and every customer story, or in this case, every employee story, because your employees are really your most important customers. Because you're never going to have a better customer experience than your employees are empowered to provide based on the employee experience that they're experiencing every day. You can't treat your employees terribly and expect them to treat your customers well. You can't even treat them fair and expect them to treat your customers incredibly well. They're never going to treat your customers better than you treat them. So when I say that superfans are created at the intersection of those two stories, it goes back to what I said before about super fandom being a two way street. So a model that I like to use is based around the acronym super because I like to say, if you want to create super fans, being great isn't good enough. You've got to be super. So you want to go through. You want to go through those five. Let's do it. Awesome. So the first one s is start with your story. And when I say start with your story, I don't mean lead with your story. I mean the story of what your organization is all about has to be foundational. You've got to be able to explain to somebody, whether they're a current employee or prospective employee, of why your organization is different. What are your mission, vision, values? What is it that you care about that sets you apart from every other organization in the world where that employee could go and get a paycheck? What's your story? Why is it special? So that's the first part.

And so let me ask about that. How would you see that play out in an organization? What would they be doing to start with the story? What's an example of sort of executing on that?

I love that question. So the power of the supermodel is the way that it's executed is going to look different across every level of your organization. So starting with your story from a recruiting standpoint might be in the way that you collect the applications. It might be in the page that you have that you explain the core values of your company and your diversity and inclusion initiatives and what matters to you and what charities that you donate to. Or maybe none of those things are important to your company. And you know, that's saying a lot, too, if you don't talk about those things. So the way that you frame and tell your story, the way that you set up the DNA of your company so that somebody knows it's not just any random carbon copy of somebody that is in your category. It's your company, your brand DNA. I like to say this is where you go from a potential commodity provider to a category of one. What is that special secret sauce that makes your company different? And why would somebody want to come be a part of that story?

And how do you know if that story is resonating with your intended audience?

Well, that's where your voice of customer or voice of employee data is so important. So for the past year, I've been working as the Chief experience officer of experience.com and we have helped hundreds of customers design surveys to collect that voice of customer and voice of employee feedback to make sure that it's resonating in instances where it's not to improve in real time. So you're not waiting until, you know, the end of the year, because that's when you do your Pulse survey of your employees. You're getting feedback in those moments that matter. So in the story, you're going to, you know, chances are if you've got a corporate marketing department or maybe you are in charge of marketing, you're getting some real time feedback based on that, based on the analytics of the messaging that you're, you're executing out there and you're marketing and your advertising and your pr. But when you'll really know when your story is working is when people want to be a part of it. So the second step in the super acronym is you understand your customer story, getting really clear on that ideal employee, who they are, who's going to be the superstar on your team, that's going to come in and fit in that culture and really add value. And then the third step P personalize and connect. That's if you recall before I said superfans are created at the intersection of those two stories. That's when you're really going to know that it's working because people are going to want to be a part of it. People are going to want to join your team. They're going to be doing an amazing job serving your customers and feel really aligned to your mission. So one good thing to do is to ask all of your employees what the mission statement of your company is and what you guys are in business for and see what they say. And if you get 36 different answers from 25 people on your team, then that means you probably haven't nailed your story yet. Or if you have, you haven't done a great job of communicating it in a way that your employees are internalizing that really connects with their story and, you know, they're embodying it in a way that they know how they contribute to this larger narrative.

Got it. Okay. And so what about the rest of the acronym?

So E stands for Exceed expectations. That's probably my favorite one. As I said before, knowing what are the moments that matter, knowing what those touch points are on the employee journey to really create wow at every step, as we like to say@experience.com so thinking about those touch points, thinking about what you can do before an employee even starts to make them feel welcome, to make them feel like they're part of the team from day one. What are the things that you can do that don't cost a lot of money, that make people feel engaged, that make them proud to be a part of your team, making a difference. So you can look at every step of that employee journey and write down what your employees are experiencing right now. And then just ask yourself or ask the members of your team, how can we up level this experience? How can we create an elevated version of this that's going to make people take notice, that's going to make our employees want to post about it on social media. It's going to make them want to call their parents or their roommate or their friend and say, you're not going to believe what my company just did for me. If you can exceed expectations, you're going to have engaged employees and you're going to retain them for longer periods of time and they're going to do a better job of taking care of your customers. So it's a win.

Yeah, for sure. And you know, actually I recently heard a story like this just to give some examples that every time a new employee comes in they get a phone call from the CEO just welcoming them. I also heard of someone you might also know, John Rulin, saying they give each employee a stipend for house cleaning because they know that people were stuck at home and they wanted them to feel like that piece was taken care of, given all the chaos. So little thoughtful touches that show you matter and we care about your wellbeing I think are really what creates some of the wow factor, almost the unexpected. Because then that's a bragging point to go talk to someone else you won't believe. Well really, tell me about that company. Right. And so it is a, it's a free market of, you know, trying to attract employees. So you've got to think about what is best going to show your level of caring connection.

Absolutely. And you know, some people say, oh, I send my employees birthday cards, I give them holiday gifts and I say yeah, you and every other employer in the world. Like that is sort of table stakes, that's sort of cost of entry. So looking for other points that you can turn into impactful moments are going to go a long way an employee in exceeding your employees expectations.

Got it. And so is there anything else in.

Your R is the last letter S U P E R R stands for repeat. So creating the systems and processes that allow these things to be automatic. There's a great quote by Elizabeth Arden that is repetition makes reputation and reputation makes customers. So the repetition is so important. And I always say automate, Automate, automate. Like the quicker you find a way to document, scale and automate something, that's when the magic starts to happen. So again, at experience.com, we're all about creat maps of the moments that matter and figuring out what questions to ask when so that we're capturing that voice of employee at the moment that matters. We want to know how somebody's first day was. We want to know at 30 days how that first month compares to what they thought it was. Have we lived up to the promises that we made on day one? How was their training, how was their onboarding? So all of these things that if you're not capturing them in the moment, you're not asking about them until they're a memory. So you don't want to at somebody's six month evaluation be like, oh, and how was your, your training? They don't remember. Their training was smart. It's too gone, it's too far. Yeah, yeah. And if, if they do remember and they say it's terrible. Well, now six months has gone by. How many more people have joined your company have gone through that same terrible training that you could have corrected six months ago had you been asking about the experience in the moment. And then of course, when you're collecting voice of employee, you can, you can also use leaderboards to show employees how they compare to everyone else in your organization. So are a lot of things that you can do to sort of gamify both the VOE and the VOC side of it, to have those more engaged employees who are then again in turn providing that amazing customer experience to your customers.

So I bet you have some great examples of companies that have instituted maybe some unique and creative ways for improving employee retention. Can you share a few examples of those?

So yes, and what I really love is if you look on LinkedIn, you will see people going viral all the time talking about what their company has done for them. And a lot of times it's something as simple as giving them increased leave because they needed it because of something that was happening in their family, inviting people to pursue their passions. So when I ran my own company, the Superfan company, we were all about connecting fans with the things that they loved most. So team sports, teams, whatever. You know, we had movie, movie studio clients as part of, of just our standard operating procedure. We gave every employee a stipend every single month to go do something they were a super fan of. So it was, I think it was like $300 a month everybody got. And they could go see Broadway shows or go to a basketball game or take a trip or whatever. And the idea was just to constantly be connected with something that you love. And that was like one of the most popular things amongst our employee base because they Were like, wow, you know, I'm getting this money to go spend on concert tickets or, or whatever. And there's something in our brains that reacts to feeling like we're getting a gift that reacts differently to money. Right. So having somebody give you something as a gift or set aside for something special feels different than a company just saying here's a performance bonus or you know, we're giving you a cost of living increase or we're doing this or that. So doing those things for your employees, making them feel welcome, doing something special when a baby is born, doing something special when a spouse or a loved one graduates college, just to acknowledge those life events is going to have a really great impact and it's going to make that customer feel like that relationship is a two way relationship. They're going to feel like they're more than just another number, more than just another person filling that role that would be replaced when they gave their two weeks notice. They're going to feel mission critical to the organization, which again of course is going to make them provide that better customer experience. I'm like a broken record, but that's so true.

Well, what about the argument? I'm going to go to the skeptics now around you just continue to build a sense of entitlement in people and by offering all them stuff and then you got to offer another thing and then it becomes like, well, there's an expectation and it loses its juice, so to speak. When you first did it, what do you say to that?

I would say by, you're never going to have an unengaged employee become engaged because you gave them a gift. Right? That's like saying, you know, oh, I don't want to, I don't want to show my wife I love her all the time because then she's going to just expect me to continue to show, to show her I love her. Right? So yes, you should continue to show your employees that you care about them and that they matter. And, and I don't think the entitlement comes into play because again, somebody's not going to, somebody's not going to feel less engaged in the company because they had this expectation that they didn't meet. This is all about, you know, this is all about celebrating when people do more than the bare minimum and keeping people who are already engaged, feeling engaged to your company, if you've got any, like no amount of strategic gifting and exceeding expectations is ever going to fix a strategy problem, an alignment problem, a cultural problem. That's why I like to Say, start with your story. Like, if you aren't clear on that, no amount of like, you know, free card detailing on your birthday is ever going to meet somebody who doesn't feel like the work that they do matters. Want to stay at your company. So that's, that's like the, you know, starting line. You've, you've got to absolutely make sure that everybody on your team knows what it is that they do that provides value and make sure that they're getting that constant feedback and reinforcement. Because as you said before, so many people leave because they don't like their boss or they feel like that there's not real career development for them because the work that they're doing doesn't have meaning.

Yeah. And I've often get asked this question, like, how do we better motivate and inspire our employees? And I usually come back with the question of do you know what motivates? Do you have those conversations? There should be, I would say at least quarterly, a conversation that you're checking in and saying, so what makes you excited to come to work? What aspects of your job do you love? What aspects of your job make you want to stay in bed? What aspects feel burdensome and oppressive? And let's brainstorm what we could do about it. Maybe it's a role that there's an issue that still needs to get done.

Right.

It's not like I love taking out the trash, but it needs to get done. But is there a way that we could support you with that or show what that does to the bigger picture so you understand the importance of it or maybe show you like it's for a period of time. That's what you're doing for now, and here's how it can benefit you. And in the future you'll be doing different tasks. I think sometimes we think like, what I'm doing today is what I'm always going to be doing. Right. And I don't think those conversations are happening as well. And that's where I think the ability to inspire your team through development opportunities can also take place. In terms of engagement.

Yeah, absolutely. Because if you're not having that two way conversation, sometimes you're going to get it really wrong. Previous client of mine who's become a friend was just sharing a story with me a few weeks ago that they had rolled out a survey to ask about what would be most meaningful for their employees in terms of showing appreciation. And it was received so poorly because among the options were like a service day for the community. And so there Were all of these people who were like, okay, so you're telling us that we get to go out in public with our coworkers, be potentially exposed to Covid for some charity projects as a day off, but then all of our work's going to just pile up and be waiting for us when we get back. Like, that is not a reward. That is not something that's making us feel like we earned, you know, this versus like the people at the company were like so surprised because they thought people were going to say, yeah, we'd love to go do Habitat for Humanity or whatever the charity was as a team. So, yes, it's so important to have those two way conversations to make sure that you are, you know, really again, listening to the voice of your employees. Because everybody has different experiences, everybody has different viewpoints. And if you're not inviting those people to have their voice be a part of the conversation, you're going to miss.

And can you boil it down to a central theme? And the reason I'm asking is I imagine people do have different preferences and needs. I might really like the Charity Day. You might really like the concert tickets. How do you as a company choose something that's going to appeal to the broadest audience? Audience?

Well, I think the answer depends, right? It depends on if you've got a 40 person company or a 40,000 person company. But I always say when you can to follow the Platinum Rule. Are you familiar with the Platinum Rule?

The Golden Rule? Maybe not the Platinum Rule.

All right, well, the Golden Rule is a pretty great rule. That's the one we all grew up with, right? Treat others the way you want to be treated. The Platinum Rule, which is the name of a book by a guy named Dr. Tony Alessandra, is don't treat others the way you want to be treated. Treat others the way they want to be treated. Because not everybody wants to be treated the same way as you. Not everybody has the same background and beliefs and life experiences and situation that you have. So to the extent that you can ask people how they want to be treated and then accommodate those requests, you're going to create super fans. So for instance, for your employees, maybe it's not a one size fits all for appreciation or for a day off or for whether their work situation looks like how many days they're in the office versus working from home. To the extent that you can show that you're willing to be accommodating instead of just sort of making a top down, one size fits all decree. Those are the types of things that are going to matter more and more to employees as they start to honestly be offered those options as at competitive companies.

So there is some form of customization. It sounds like if you can do a little bit of customization or have a couple of options that people can choose what they would prefer, that that's the better tactic.

Yes. To the extent that you can empower the leaders on your team to make decisions about what works best for the teams that they manage, you're going to see a lot more engagement and you're going to see better relationships between employees and their direct supervisors, which again, as we've said a couple of times, so important to the retention piece.

I love that. So don't come up with just a company wide strategy. How about let your teams give them some range or guidelines with what they could work with, but let the team leads decide what would be best for their team and that will help the bonding of the team overall.

Yeah, exactly. Create the parameters for what your team can work within and then the most important part though is to really mean it. So you don't ever want to say, oh, we're trusting you to make the, you know, the best decision for you and then come in later and tell them why that decision they made was wrong and now you're going to like fix that decision that they made. So you really got to make sure that you have a culture where you're releasing that control and creating the opportunity for people to self select into again within, within a range, within a predefined set of boundaries. What's going to work best either at the individual or the team level?

Yeah, got it. So what's one thing that our listeners could do this week, tomorrow that will help around employee retention?

I would say if you haven't figured out a voice of employee program that's something that you should do. What are the moments that matter? How are you collecting, analyzing and acting on that very important voice which is that feedback of your employees? So if you're not currently collecting information from your employees this week, commit to A Learning more about VoE if it's not something that you have a lot of expertise or familiarity in and B taking the time to design a survey that will collect meaningful information at at least one of those moments that matters.

Fantastic. Thank you. Where can people learn more?

People can learn more@experience.com if you want to watch a short video series that I put together all about creating superf that is@experience.com superfans all right, awesome.

We'll put those in the show notes. I so appreciate you joining us today and sharing your wisdom on this really important topic.

Oh, thank you so much. It was so fun to be here.

And employee retention is sort of the theme of the moment right now for sure. And if you like this episode, you're not going to want to miss my interview with Shep Hyken. Another enlightening episode where we're looking at ways to up level customer experience as well as employee experience and somebody that both Brittany and I also know well.

Yes, I love, love, love Shep. He's one of my favorite people in the world. So definitely listen to Shep's episode and then pre order his new book called I'll Be Back. It's all about how to get your customers to come back. It's going to be released in September and I got a sneak peek at it and it's really, really, really good. So make sure you check out Shep's episode and his name book.

All right, thank you.

Awesome. Thanks, Susan. Talk to you soon.

Okay. Hope you enjoyed today's episode and I'd like to point you to the next important step. Hit the subscribe button and the bell to get notified when we release new content. I'll see you on the next episode of the Enlightened Executive.

Sam.