An Easy Way To Understanding Your Target Demographic

Hey, it's Mark Podolski, land geek with your favorite niche real estate website, www.thelandgeek.com. and today's guest is one of those creative types that is going to help us supercharge our marketing. But I'd be remiss if I didn't properly introduce my co host. You know him, you love him. Scott Todd from Scott Todd.net landmodo.com Learn anything about anything. Investor ninjas.com Scott Todd, how are you?

Mark I'm great. How are you?

I'm great. I'm ready to supercharge my marketing. You know what they say?

SCOTT Todd, what do they say?

Video killed the radio star. So our guest today is one of those killers. Josh Kohler has been in the real estate investing industry since 2013, has been a part of hundreds of deals as a marketing director. He's the owner of Kohler Media and REI Video. And he focuses his services on active real estate investors and real estate influencers providing content marketing. So, Josh Kohler, welcome. How are you?

Mark? Scott, thanks for having me on the show. I'm doing fantastic. It's good to be on here. Honored to be on the show. Hopefully I can provide some value.

Well, let's, let's just get right into it. We're gonna skip the pleasantry.

Let's do it.

And let's just rewind the tape. And when did you wake up and think yourself, you know what, real estate investors, I can help those poor marketers.

Yeah. So I think there's a, you know, without having to go into a long story, there was a chain of events that kind of happened that led me into the real estate investing industry. And it was really just, you know, I was 19 years old. I was working in a warehouse. And a friend of mine that I played basketball and baseball with in high school, his dad owned about and still does own about 500 doors in our area, which is northwest Indiana, Chicagoland region. And so like, he, you know, I gave him a call. I was fed up with my forklift job in Chicago. And I gave him a call and said, hey, do you guys have any place for somebody that's kind of a little bit of a creative and willing to learn whatever you guys got going on? And they brought me on and I was 19 years old, newly introduced to real estate. It was just a job to me at that point. They had me doing just about anything in marketing from sending direct mail to Craigslist postings back when Craigslist was hot. That was back when the market was more Dispositions marketing, as opposed to acquisitions marketing, because HUD was hot, MLS was high, Auction.com was hot. Like you could snap your fingers and get a deal. And so we were doing cold calling, we were doing acquisitions marketing, dispositions marketing, just about anything you think of. I was going out putting bandit signs and yards and on street corners and everything. And that's kind of my segue into how I got into real estate. And then from there I was with them for about six, seven months, transitioned and moved into another company that was actually competitor to them because there's just some things that weren't going right with them. And I wanted another way to grow. And a buddy of mine, who, his name's Gary Harper, does EOS implementation and business systems and processes for real estate investors. He was partners with a couple other people that had this monster wholesaling company. And so he brought me on and really took me under his wing and mentored me, and I became their marketing director. First. We started off virtually wholesaling in Michigan in the state of Michigan. And the first year I was with him, we did 40 deals without seeing a single one of them both in the process. Like, he and I realized we don't like real estate, we like what it can provide, but we don't actually like walking into a house and getting fleas all over our legs and that kind of thing. So we hired a field, a field person to actually go pre look the properties, put bandit signs out and, you know, meet with sellers and that kind of thing. And so that's kind of like how I elevated into that. And then over the past six, seven years, I've really gone into the more specifically the marketing side of things. And then in the past two years, I've gone specifically into content marketing for real estate investors, whether they're active investors or the influencers such as yourselves. But that's kind of how it happened. And there's a lot in between that. But that's the baseline story.

Wow. Scott, Todd, what are your thoughts?

It's funny because we all have this little niche that we fall into. And Mark, we see this even in land investing. Some people are good at deal deal acquisition, deal selling. Some people are good at marketing. And I think it's really kind of cool to kind of pull out your strengths and do your strengths as opposed to just kind of chasing what someone else is telling you you should be doing. It's kind of Josh's story right there.

Yeah, absolutely.

No, absolutely. So, Josh, that leads me to my next question, because you've done so much marketing for so many different real estate investors and influencers. Everything going on with real estate, we all know if we look at let's just traditional real estate, it's a very visual medium. But I can imagine that when you first start working with a client, what would you say is the biggest marketing mistakes you see them making and that you have to go and fix if we're talking.

So I would say, like the biggest thing is as an entrepreneur in general, not just a real estate investor. It's our tendency and a lot of times it's the right way to do it. Most people start this way, but they start into marketing. Doing things on their own and trying to learn things on their own. Anything from putting video content out to building their own websites, running their own Facebook ads, like it's called bootstrapping is essentially what it is. And it's not just marketing. Like we try to do things on our own in everything. Like in your real estate, like you try to do your own closings, you try to do your own pre looks of the properties and the deals that you got going on. And that's a lot of times where you have to start. But the big pitfall that I see a lot of people fall into is they never delegate those things to somebody that knows what they're doing and they're not willing to pay up for that. And essentially that's like the biggest thing in marketing is there's just so many. Like, marketing is literally a quarterly basis thing. I was actually just doing an interview with one of the top marketers in the country, and he works very heavily with real estate investors. And he was telling me, you know, like, every quarter is like dog years when it comes to like, marketing because it evolves so quickly and especially over the course of the past 10 to 20 years, it's just evolved so rapidly. Even if you just dial it down to like just Facebook alone or just web development or just whatever it is you're doing, cold calling, texting, like, things change all the time. And for a real estate investor to keep up with that themselves and have the duties of keeping up with their business, it's. It's a big challenge. And a lot of times it just doesn't work out. And then they end up throwing a lot of money down the, down the toilet. And then you get this, these responses of, well, Facebook ads don't work. You know, I tried it for three months and it just didn't yield any results. I didn't get any return on my ad spend or, you know, Websites don't work. My audience doesn't go to websites and like. And a lot of times they're wrong because they didn't know how to market in the first place. But then take those marketing efforts, analyze the data, make adjustments to that data, and then, like, execute from there. And that's a big pitfall that I see. So what I would suggest, and not upselling at all, because, you know, I'm in. It's hard for me to say things like this because I'm a marketer myself, but.

Right.

Leave it. Like, if you have the ability to connect with somebody that knows what they're doing, then you need to do that and you need to be willing to, because ultimately the amount of money that you would throw down the toilet doing yourself, you might as well hand it over to somebody that knows what they're doing. And I don't run ads. I do all this stuff for my business because I know what I'm doing. But I don't run ads for other people. I don't build websites for other people. But it's important and imperative if you are going to do marketing the right way. And in such a saturated industry right now, if you're going to stand above people, you need to have people that know what they're doing to do those things.

No, absolutely. I mean, in the long run, when you hire experts, because you know what you know, you know what you don't know, but you don't know what you don't know.

Right.

It's always a massive ROI on it. But, you know, initially we're all hesitant to do it. Yeah.

And the question I would ask too, Mark, is, would you. And this is a question that I get asked on a consistent basis and most entrepreneurs should get asked, or at least ask themselves, is, would you rather be a jack of all trades and a master of none, or vice versa? Right. So if you're a master, say you're a master at talking to sellers. Like, be a master and just become even better at that and then build other masters in specific areas of your business around you. And you're just going to have this incredible company. But what a lot of people try to do is just be a jack of all trades. They try to, again, bootstrap and do everything themselves. And that's where they experience no growth. They experience, you know, times like this with COVID and impacting their business, and then they're not getting deals because they're trying to do everything themselves and aren't delegating it to people that know what they're doing.

So, yeah. Scott, Todd, what are your thoughts?

You know, it's funny, Mark, because how many times do we hear someone say, like, oh, well, I'm not doing this because I'm building a website or you know, like, I mean, I love this example because. Because someone once told me, like, oh man, I've spent 50 hours building my website. And I'm like, oh, are you a web designer? No, I don't know anything about it. And I'm like, then you just wasted 50 hours of your life because you're doing something that you're no good at. And I don't mean that like, people like to get creative. Right. But like you said, how many times do people. You give up the stuff that you're good at to do the stuff that you're not good at because you don't want to write a check. And I get it, like, writing a check is no fun. But you know what, when you're starting a business, you should be prepared to write some checks because it's an investment that you will get back. But like, that's the deal is don't find yourself stuck in a trap doing things that you're no good at. Just go do it.

Absolutely. I couldn't said it better.

Yeah, no, it's true. So let's get into like the fundamentals for you of when you want to help a marketer. Let's just say somebody that is a house flipper and they come to you and they say, Josh, I'm selling two houses a month. I want to sell 10. Can you help me? What would be the fundamentals that you would see that they would need to go to that next level in their marketing?

Sure. So to be clear, where I specialize in is the content marketing side of things. Like, I can, I can run somebody's marketing if the price is right, but that's not. My core business model is being a marketing director for somebody, even though I've been in that seat. It's not like what we're specifically niched in. In saying that as well, I would suggest there's a few things. Again, first of all, like, line up the right people, you know, understand who your target demographic is. Get that nailed down. And if you're a business owner, you already should know. This is marketing 101. Even if you're not doing the marketing for your business, you still need to know who your target demographic is. And you should know them better than sometimes even better than they know themselves. And that's like, that's when you truly will be able to grasp onto and understand how to market to your target demographic correctly. So say, for instance, you're a house flipper. There's, there's really two. There's two directions that you have to go with. Your marketing is, number one, you got to get deals, so that's acquisitions. And then number two is after you flip the house, then you got to dispo the house or whether you're going to keep it, you still got to put a tenant in the house and market for that tenant. Most of the time, fix and flippers are going to be selling retail though, or at least turnkey at minimum. But the thing that you got to understand is that those two directions that you're going to, those are two totally different target demographics. Because the person you're acquiring the house from, more than likely, if it's an off market deal, more than likely, they're going through a pain point, right? They inherited the house or they are going through pre foreclosure. They're, you know, this, that and the other. They have too many repairs that need to be done the house, they don't want to mess with it, they just want to get out from underneath it a whole slew of things, right? So that's your target demographic. You're going after the second target demographic on the dispo side, these are people that want to essentially buy a new house because you've retailed it, you've flipped the house, you've, you know, done whatever that needed to be done to the house. And you are marketing to a homeowner, which is somebody that is more than likely not going to pay cash for the house. They're going to be financing it. This is just a totally different demographic you're dealing with. So number one is knowing those two audiences is important. Number two is knowing how to market to them, which is again why knowing your audience is so imperative. Because if you don't know how to market to them, you're not gonna reach them again. The podcast I was on previously, the guy I was hosting on my show, he mentioned something very intriguing to me. And this is really like not just every type of marketing, it's more interruption marketing. Which interruption marketing is ads. It's TV commercials, radio ads. It's basically when a customer or a potential lead prospect is on platform. Whether it is they're listening to the radio or they're scrolling through Facebook, they're consuming content in some way, shape or form, and you're jumping in, interrupting that content, not asking them if you want to consume my ad and you're saying here's my ad and then you pitch it to them. Here's the thing about that is that you're having, it's a one way conversation. They're not conversing back to you, you're talking to them and that's it. And you have like four seconds, even probably less than that to actually capture their attention. And more times than not that like people just don't build out that the right way. So again, knowing your target demographic, you're gonna use that to connect with them within that first four seconds. So like those two things, who. Knowing your target demographic and knowing how to market to them, which is also included on where to market to them. Because your target demographic may not be listening to radio ads, they may not be on Facebook, they may not be searching you on websites or Google my business, whatever. However you market, it's not the same across the board. But knowing those two things will be able to tell you how to communicate with them in those ads and then also how to market to them. So those are like intangible things that I know you asked me for, like how to market to them. But that's like those are the two things that everybody misses. That's not doing it right. It's because they don't know their target demographic well enough and they don't know how to market to them well enough. And that's the thing that people miss the most. Anytime I'm working with an investor, that's the most common pitfall I see with people. And again, even if you're not doing your own marketing, you gotta, whoever the agency that you hire, they need to know that target demographic as well because it's not the same across the board.

So let's just pick on Scott. Todd and Scott's new to all this and he wants to know whom is my target demographic for this new business I'm launching called Investor Ninjas. I've got this massive market. People want to understand and learn all different types of technologies and accounting and different types of courses. But how is Scott going to get to know his really good target demographic?

Well, it's, there's a, there's a series of things. I mean you could go, you could simply go to Google and type in target demographic worksheet or something like that. There's going to be a whole slew of ways for you be able to condense who your target demographic is, you know, specifically. Like what I'll do is when I'm working with a client. I'll actually sit down with them and say there's. There's really like three questions I ask is age group. You don't need to ask gender, because when you're dealing with sellers and buyers, like, there's a mix of them, right? There's not really ever like, specifically marketing to a male or a female. So I ask age group, because that's a really big deal. Because you're pushing them into a group of people that somebody that's 60 plus is not going to be using Instagram, somebody that's between the ages of 20 and 30. They're not listening to radio ads, they're not watching TV, live TV, so commercials are not going to work with that target demographic. So, you know, understanding those things are important. But with, you know, for Scott, like, the thing I would tell you is, you know, figure those things out. But when you're marketing to them, keeping a pulse on it is going to be so important because if you're not keeping a pulse on. And that's. This is why I mentioned the data. And I'm trying to, like, I feel like I'm going in circles here, but this is like, all these things connect. They all come full circle with each other. Because if you are studying your target demographic, meaning you know who they are, you know the age group, geographically, maybe you know where they hang out, digitally, you know where they hang out, those are the things you got to figure out. And there's not really an easy, like, fix for that because especially if you're in a very niched industry like myself, luckily, I've been in this industry for a long time, so I know where my target demographic hangs out. You know, most of my target demographic is hanging out on Facebook. They're not hanging out on LinkedIn, which is not true for everybody. But that's because I've communicated with them on a consistent basis. I've observed them, I've studied them. And this is where a lot of people don't do the homework is because they're not studying them, they're not trying to figure out those details about them. So there's all kinds of worksheets you could fill out. I always like suggesting the book called the One Page Marketing Plan. It's a fantastic book when it comes to actually figuring out your target demographic. He has a really good worksheet that you can fill out to actually figure out who that target demographic is and kind of narrow it down to the group of people you're working with. And then from there it's on you, you have to go discover where are these people hanging out digitally, physically, what are their interests, what are their occupations, careers? Like, what are they actually doing with their time? Is my target demographic working a 9 to 5, getting home and then sitting down and watching, you know, four hours of Netflix, going to bed, waking up at 6:00 clock in the morning and rinse and repeat, doing it all over again. Those are things that you need to figure out, but it's on you to figure those things out. And there's a, you know, and Mark, there's a lot of. That's kind of a, that's kind of a really hard question to ask. Just because there's no specific tactical strategies that work for everybody. It's simply, you got to do your homework.

Yeah, yeah, exactly. I mean, you know, I really pride myself on giving you the toughest questions I can.

That was a tough question. It's good though. It's good. But that's a question that people don't ask themselves when they're getting into their business. And it's so extremely important to understand this. And like I said, going back, I feel like if people would read the one page marketing plan, that book, it's very small book, it's more of a booklet, but it's a really detailed book on creating a marketing plan for yourself. But inside of that, you'll be able to understand how to find your target demographic. There's a specific chapter on that, and I think that's a really good starting point for people that aren't familiar with this territory. It's a good place for them to actually start and get into understanding that. And then like I said, from there, it's your job to do your own homework and studying and figuring out all those details about them and confirming them.

Right, Right. So Scott Todd, he's already kind of given us a tip of the week, but we're gonna have to ask him for another one. So we are at that point in the podcast where, Josh, we're gonna ask you for your tip of the week. A website, a resource, another book, something else actionable for the auto passive income listeners to go improve their businesses, improve their lives. But before you give us that tip, I just wanna remind the listeners that today's podcast is sponsored by flight school. Learn how the next 16 weeks going up the mountain of land investing with Scott Todd as your Sherpa, someone who's done it thousands of times, he's seen it all, will take you up that mountain quickly, safely, efficiently start building passive income with no renters no rehabs, no renovations, no rodents. Pretty soon, once that passive income exceeds your fixed expenses, you're working because you want to, not because you have to. How do you get involved? Go to thelandgeek.com training thelandgeek.com all right, Josh Kohler, what is your tip of the week?

So, Mark, how much time do I have on this tip of the week? Are we talking a minute? Are we talking five minutes?

You got one minute and 27 seconds. Go.

Okay. Go create relevant content to your target demographic. The reason, like, I couldn't jump off the show if I didn't talk about content marketing. That's what we do. We're pushing out about a thousand pieces of content a week on all platforms for the clients that we work with. But when it comes down to it, you need to look at content marketing not just as I feel like a lot of people boil it down to just social media, but it's so much more than that. Like what we're on right now, this podcast, this is content marketing. And what Mark's doing, what Scott's doing, is collaborating with me through content. And so when this show goes out, I'm gonna be sharing this with my audience, and therefore, they're dipping into my audience, but my audience is very similar and relevant to these guys audiences. So when it comes down to it, creating contextual, relevant content to your target demographic is gonna take you far above what you could possibly imagine when it comes to competing with your competitors, because not everybody's doing content marketing. So that could be several mediums that could be writing, that could be video, that could be podcasts. And again, this is why knowing your target demographic is so important. Because if your target demographic is not listening to podcasts, don't be putting out podcasts. And if they're not reading articles, don't be putting out articles. And so these are things that you got to use with content marketing. So creating contextual content marketing to your target demographics that's relevant to them is important. And wrapping this up, content marketing, the purest definition that I can give you for content marketing is answering the questions that your target demographic or audience has, has about your industry, your services, or your product. And if you by answering those questions again, you have several mediums that you can play off of in order to answer those questions. And that's all it is. So if a target demographic for Mark has a question about investing in land, how do I get funding to invest in land? Then he needs to put out content, a video about his options on financing Land. And that's content marketing as a whole. So that's my tip. I know I went over, but that's my tip.

No, no, I love it. I love it. Scott. Todd, what's your tip of the week mark?

I'm going to cheat this week, if that's okay.

Of course.

And here's what I'm going to do. Okay, Look. Do you hate money?

Do I hate money?

Yeah.

I mean, I hate touching dirty dollar bills. I love the idea of the value.

Okay, all right, all right. So here's my tip of the week. And look, if you hate money, then ignore this one, okay? But if you like money and one more of it, then you. Then you need to go read the one page marketing plan that Josh mentioned. Like, seriously, you got to go do that. Go do it.

That is the weakest tip of the week.

Listen, I told you, marketing is.

His messaging was so on point. Do you hate money? You asking a question and then given the call to action. It's so great. I loved it.

Look, one, I told you I was gonna cheat. Number two, they framed it. What I think is perfectly like, everybody's gonna go get it now. So it's a great tip.

It's a great tip. You know what, though, guys? I'm not one of those people that just wants to keep one ing up. Everybody. Josh had a great tip. Scott, you stole Josh's tip. But my tip of the week actually can really move the needle in your life. Start blowing up your content marketing. Learn your target audience and where and what is going to be the most receptive message for them. Go to KohlerMedia.com we have a link to it. KohlerMedia.com. my good buddy Mike Hambright has been using, using, working with Josh for years. If you've seen Mike's videos, they are so slick, so professional, and every time I talk to him, I am just, you know, like in a shame spiral because his stuff looks so much better than mine. And now I know what his secret is.

So you know what he's dealing with?

I know what he's dealing with.

You know what he's dealing with.

Yeah, he's been cheating. He's no creative genius.

No, he's not. No. Not even.

Yeah. This whole time I've been deluded. Okay, so Kohler Media.com is my tip of the week. I want to thank the listeners and just remind you guys the only way, the only way we're going to get a quality of guests like a Josh Kohler from Kohler Media is if you do us three little favors. You got to subscribe, you got a rate, you got to review the podcast. Send us a screenshot of your review to support the landgeek.com we are going to send you for free the $97 wholetailing course, how to double your money, 30 days or less. So please do it. All right. Josh Kohler, are we good?

Yes. Thank you so much for having me on. This was fun.

Awesome. Scott, Todd, are we good?

We're good.

Mark, let's do this. One, two, three. Let freedom ring. All right. Not bad. Thanks, everybody.