Neighbor Marketing Masterclass: How We Sell Properties FAST

Oh, now wisdom has taught me, so simple, so grand. Eat baloney, buy land. Oh, eat baloney, buy land. Trade the fork for the deed in your hand. Skip the filling, let the sandwiches stand. Your fortune will grow when you buy your own land.

Now can I say that? All right, intro ever.

That was amazing.

There's someone new at the helm. When DudeBuddy, the Nightcap OG Scott Bossman, is not here, we're gonna have technical difficulties, so please bear with us. Who's, who's doing the intro? Am I doing the intro?

I can do the intro.

You want to, John? You do the intro. Okay, cheers to the intro.

Cheers to the intro. All right, so most land investors spend hundreds of dollars on marketplace listings, Facebook ads, and email blasts while completely ignoring the single most motivated buyer on earth: the neighbors. Think about it. Neighbors already know the land. They've driven past it 100 times. They want to expand their lot, protect their view, keep strangers out, or simply control what gets built next to their home. They don't need to be convinced the land is valuable. They already know it is. In today's episode, we are giving you the complete neighbor marketing masterclass. We'll cover the psychology behind why neighbors buy faster and pay more than any other buyer type, the exact letter formula that generates calls and, uh, and turns cold contacts into warm conversations, and price anchoring techniques that move deals without negotiating against yourself. How's that?

I love it. Welcome to NICAP. Mike Zano, who are we? What do we do?

Well, we are the Land Geek guys. Uh, we buy land pennies on the dollar. You know what, a little niche— we typically buy land $400 or $500 to $400 or $5,000 because we can offer that competitive owner financing, uh, payment plans where people can easily afford them. But we can also recoup our investment within the first 12 months, 10 months, and then we have months, years of recurring payments afterwards. That's all profit. And if we do that one time, we create a land note. If we do it multiple times, we create a land portfolio. And land portfolios can retire people from their 9-to-5 jobs. That's it.

There you go. I love it. So we are live right now on YouTube. We're supposed to be live on Facebook, but for some reason it's not working. We don't have Bossman, but guess who's on? Paul Bilotti! Can't believe he's online live for this after so many years of being away. And John, he loves the intro. Cheers to John Burnett and our intro. Brad Kelly, cheers. Mike Javier, hello. Hey Mike.

Oh, Greg Moon. Yeah, nice to see you.

Brad Kelly's here. Chastity Hooks, good to see Chastity Hooks. Um, Chas Johns 1970, hey from Atlanta. So please leave comments, please ask your questions. Let's talk about the neighbors. Let's talk about the neighbors. But when we talk about the neighbors, can we just like properly introduce you guys? Yes, John 8 is enough. Bernette is here. Mike, the Zen Master, Zeno, breathe in the mailing, breathe out the marketing. These are 7-figure land investors who've been doing this a long time. If you don't know me, I'm Mark J. Podolsky, the Land Geek, and I've been doing this full-time since 2001. So, the neighbors, guys, Neighbors. What's so great about the neighbors?

I've got great neighbors, but also some of my properties have great neighbors who want to give me money, which is great. So, um, yeah, I think that there's like, uh, it— I actually didn't send neighbor or neighbor letters until, uh, I came on Nightcap and Scott Bossman was talking about neighbor letters. And then I sent out neighbor letters and I sold property. Yeah, but, uh, yeah, I think that there, there's definitely a lot of opportunity there where, um, you've got a piece of land that is next to neighbors. If there's a house, those are the hottest neighbors, right? If there's some kind of a structure on their property, because they want to protect— like, they want to control their neighborhood, right? So they want to be the ones that, that own that property, whether that's just making their lands larger, right, and having a bigger yard, or whether it's, uh, basically controlling their own privacy, right? Making sure that, that nobody's coming who's going to be camping in an RV on the neighboring property for a few weeks every so often or something like that. And so I think it's a good value prop to reach out to them. So yeah.

And Mike, were you ever skeptical about reaching out to neighbors?

Skeptical? No, no. I think, you know, one of the very first properties I sold, Mark, I had someone go out and they were gonna put a little for sale sign on it. I just hired someone in the area. And then they called me up and they said, hey, I was putting the sign up, but this lady that lives over here next to us, she's asking, if she can buy it. How much do you want to sell it for? And I, I mean, I was literally like my first, second deal. I had no way. I think I paid $800 for it. I had like no idea. I was just like, I don't know, um, tell her like $3,000 or something and see what she says. And she's like, yeah, she'll take it. And I was like, what? Like, okay. So for me, it was out of the gate, it was just like an irony of, you know, the neighbor saw someone putting a sign up on it and bang. Uh, so I, I think I fell in love with that idea out of the gate, Mark.

Yeah, I mean, I did too out of the gate and it was sort of this like amazing revelation that raw land has this built-in best buyer unlike anything else. Like think about housing. I couldn't sell my house to the neighbor. They don't need another house. But the neighbor wants to protect their privacy, want to protect their views. They want to know their neighbor. And so oftentimes they will buy. And it's, and, you know, back in the day before we had all this software that could help you find the neighbor, that was an issue as well, right? Was just, you know, trying to locate them on a GIS map. Chastity Hooks has a question. Do you guys have a template neighbor letter?

I, I mean, I could talk about the, the, um, I wonder if I could pull mine up actually.

But don't we have one in LG Pass?

There is one in Land Geek. I just don't know where exactly since my team accesses it, not me.

The chassis is hurting my feelings not using LG Pass. Okay.

What?

Okay, I know I have a fragile ego.

Oh, I've got— yeah. I've got my last neighbor letter that I could do, or I could read.

All right, yeah, go ahead, read it. Okay, so let's do it.

Uh, let's see. Oh, uh, okay, sorry, this is— I'm running into technical difficulties because we don't have Scott Bossman, so I'm blaming it on him.

Everything's breaking tonight.

Everything's breaking down. Yeah, he's in paradise in Hawaii while, while we're doing this. So we're wishing DudeBuddy Nightcap OG well.

What time is it in Hawaii, Mark?

It's early. It's like, what, 3 o'clock there in the afternoon? They're probably on the beach having a nice drink, relaxing, maybe at the pool.

I bet he's watching. He's probably watching.

He can't resist. Hey, DudeBuddy.

Yeah, he can't stay away.

All right, I've got it pulled up despite Scott's absence. So, uh, let's see. It's, hi, insert neighbor name here, we own a property right next to yours in county, county, state. Ours is parcel, parcel number, next to your parcel, other parcel number, and we're listing it for sale. Just wanted to reach out and see if you might be interested in picking it up yourself and expanding your property. We can offer owner financing as well. If you'd like to chat about it, please feel free to call me or text me at number or email me anytime at email. Hope to hear from you soon. Thanks, salesperson contact information. So that was mine. That's pretty basic. I don't even know if that was that good, but I did.

I don't think it needs to be like the offer letter we talk about, the offer letter in LG Pass, the offer that we all use. There's nothing super complex about it. It just gets the message out that we want to buy your property. So I think, John, that's why it's perfect. It's simple.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah, exactly. Um, so, uh, Brad Kelly has a question. He has, I have 3 acres under contract here. Watch, I have no idea why I've reached out to the neighbor that owns 4 acres. Thanks for making me Think, haha. Not a question, a statement. Thank you, Brad.

John, Brad's got it.

Yeah. Well, this is interesting. Chas John's 1970. I would think most neighbors would buy with cash, not terms. Is this accurate? What is your experience, John Burnett?

I think that— I mean, I've sold to neighbors for cash and I've sold to neighbors on terms. I don't know. I think they're probably— I, I, if I were to segment them, I would say that probably a higher percentage of them would buy cash than like my typical buyers. But I still think like terms just makes it very achievable for them.

Right.

So if I'm reaching out to a neighbor and they own 5 acres next to mine and it's off-grid, right. And mine is listed at $15,000. They might not have $15,000 liquid. And so, you know, I still offer terms and I'll sell on terms.

So yeah, I mean, you're going to get your biggest buyer pool as well when you do terms, and that's kind of the name of the game. We want that cash flow. Yeah. Is that masterful? What's your experience?

Well, even if they have the cash, like I was thinking, Mark, like I bought my Mac Mini the other day and it's like it was 0% for the free I don't know, sometimes I just don't want to put all the money out. I have it, I could buy it, but hey, I'll spread it out over a year or so if they're not gonna— so we do the same thing for people. They may have the money, but they might be like, huh, you know what, it's just, it's an extra little motivator. That's why Apple does it, right? It's like there's a little, oh, 0% free, like, that makes sense. Okay, let's just do it. It's just like it removes one little barrier that could be mentally sitting there. So I think it's a great option. If they have the cash, they might buy it. If they have the cash, they still might just love to finance it.

Yeah, no, absolutely. And Chastity Hooks is thanking you. Love the gratitude.

You're welcome, Chastity Hooks.

Tony Sanders, are you sending neighbor's letters if all the land around you is empty?

Absolutely. Yeah. They still wanna grow their parcel, right? This is like, You know, yeah, the district, you know, Mark, I guess it's a great little segue here if you don't mind. It's like I was talking to someone the other day, and I know that we didn't really talk about it much during COVID because probably didn't feel right to say we were selling more land than ever and we were making a lot of money when a lot of people were having hard times. But I think that's still the thing is true today. People in the back of their minds think, hey, there might be a time where I need to kind of get away from it all, and I might have to be isolated. And if I I'd rather, and I could do it on my 5 acres, but heck, I'd rather do it on my 10, making a bit, rest of the family, or I could do it up, you know, so doubling the acreage makes sense. Yeah, so vacant land, absolutely. The neighbors are interested.

Yeah, I mean, this is gonna be a short episode. I don't know why we go the full hour here. Mail the neighbors.

Do it.

Well, another point, Mark, is that, Most of the people that when they're buying from us, I think they're looking at, um, you know, oh, what's the price? And they have all these little factors in their mind where the neighbor is. And I think John, you might have already alluded to this. It's an emotional buy. And emotionally, it's not like they're putting out comps. It's like they want that land, right? So it's just, um, you're not dealing with as much aggravation. This is like a built-in buyer. There they are waiting, buying on emotion, not buying on comps. Not that we're gonna rip them off or anything like that, but it's just like, it's an easier discussion, you know. Um, so yeah, I think, John, you might have said that though. I was just kind of paralleling off it. I was, I was, I was actually concurring.

I was gonna say, I'm just counting this as a concur.

The concur. Cheers. Oh, by the way, um, Charles Jones, we gotta give him some love. He is the one That is, uh, that's him. He just can't— Chaz Jones, 1970— can't change his handles on his new iPhone.

Gotcha, gotcha. Well, thanks for being here, guys.

But West Mantis has got a great question: do you discount the land, or are you just giving them first dibs?

To me, it's just like the buyer's list. The buyer's list always gets some sort of special little something, right? These people— because we don't have to go market it to the you know, in the traditional channels and pay our VAs to go out doing this and that. So yeah, there's going to be a built-in discount for sure. It's just no different than being on our buyers list. They're, they're just the preferred buyer on that list for this particular property.

No, yeah, yeah, absolutely. Um, you know, we're talking— we talked about the intro price anchoring techniques, so What is a price anchor, John Burnett?

That's a good question.

And Brad Kelly thinks your camera's really cool.

I know, it is cool. Look at this, it follows me.

It follows you. It's— Mike, what are we doing wrong technologically? Why is his camera so much better than ours?

That's very nice.

John has the best of everything, I've come to find out.

He's just—

I know. He's just— and you know what makes you even like feel like, because he's so relaxed about it.

About my, about my fancy camera?

About everything.

Just everything. Like, you know what, is, you know what, is it— put in the, in the comments, do you find John's humility off-putting? I do. I mean, a lot of people are like, oh, it's a great characteristic.

I mean, I'm probably the most humble person I know, so I think that like it's almost like a new nickname worthy.

That's how, it's how laid back he is. Like, I don't know what that would be, but it's just like, man, maybe it's because you got to a certain point with all the kids where it's just something just snapped. It's like nothing bothers me. It's like, you know, this, that. It's like you hit 2 kids, 3, 4, boom. It's like you just hit— it's like nothing bothers me anymore.

It's funny, one of my, uh, one of our pediatricians once told us when we had, um I think this was after we had our first kid. They said like your first kid, you treat them like, like fine china. Like if you just like touch it the wrong way, it's gonna break. It's like the next kid is like hard plastic. You're like, with enough, you know, you have to be careful to some degree because it could break. And he's like, after that, everything is just rubber, you know.

So yeah, but Mike, you know, in all seriousness though, I do think you're bringing up a really interesting observation about a CEO like John. Like, when you, when you have John's patience and humility and leadership style, you want to work for him. Like, there you don't feel that sort of intense kind of, you know, CEO founder type of energy. And I, I would make an argument that it serves him, not just in his personal life, where— but I think it's going to serve him professionally as well. You know, the ups and downs of the uncertainty of being an entrepreneur. If you can stay level, your team stays level. You're— the people, the people around you stay level. I mean, Val, his wife, like, she's going to stay level. I mean, imagine if John's coming home freaking out like, oh, this, you know, this is a default, or I just bought, you know, 40 acres. I don't know if I want to make, you know, if I bought it right or not. Like, he's just calm. Yeah, I think it, it serves. And you're called the Zen Master for a reason. Um, I, I, I identify as, as on the more calm side as well, 100%.

And it's funny too, because like, I actually, um, I think that I have calmed down a lot having been I built my land business, um, actually. So I think it was a lot more on edge, especially just about like, like as I built out my land investing business, like at the outset there's just this little, like, I just, you know, you just get like butterflies in your gut like every new step you're taking, you know. You're, you're, um, I even down to sending out your first mailers, right? I remember standing like back then, I wasn't clicking and uploading, I was standing by the post office box with it open with a stack of letters just kind of hanging there, you know. And then you just put it in and close it, and, and then you slowly get used to that. And then the next— and then eventually you're— somebody responds and you have to hop on the phone with them and talk to them about buying their property. And you're like, I don't even know what I'm doing, like I've never bought real estate in my life. And, and so you're kind of nervous, and then you get over that hump, right, just by doing it. And each individual stage was like that, down to posting first ad down to selling your first property. And then gradually, like, now I've done hundreds of deals and, you know, everything's fine. Like, it just— yeah, yeah.

I mean, that, that's, that's that experience. I mean, Mike, what— did you have the same type of experience where you had a lot of anxiety in the beginning in every stage and then just got confident, confident, confident? Now you just deal with everything?

I think it comes through the deal flow, because now when I have people on my team and they like get— they'll get anxious over a deal, and I'm like, yeah, it's no big deal, you know. It's like we've seen the cycle play around so many times that we know they're all going to sell. And sometimes it doesn't make as much profit as we want, but sometimes it makes more than we want. I mean, it goes both ways. So we kind of see the full, uh, cycle of things, and, um, I think it does bring a sense of calm and You know, I think Tate says it best when he says there's no land emergencies, right? I mean, I think that's probably summing this all up, right? There are no land emergencies. Everything can be, uh, everything can be fixed.

Every—

there's no, there's no real issues here.

Yeah, yeah. I think that's the great thing about our community as well, is that if you, if you sort of tend to be on the more anxious side or you're starting and you're having difficulty with the uncertainty and you're kind of amped up, you can go to somebody in the community and they can just kind of like, yeah, me too. I started just like you. And, you know, walk— you can kind of just get that second pair of eyes like, hey, I'm about to write this check. I did all the due diligence, right? And especially if you're in flight school and you have your flight school coach one-on-one coaching, that really helps as well. And sort of modeling that, you know, look, there's no land emergencies, they're all gonna sell, you're buying it right. I remember telling, you know, Jeff Detmer in a boot camp, he was really nervous about the deal. I'm like, well, if you don't buy it, I'll buy it. He's like, oh, and he's bought it, right? And he killed it. But getting back to the neighbor conversation, Price anchor.

What is the price anchor? Oh, let's go.

Let's talk about the pricing because then we'll get to Greg's question.

Well, I feel like, I feel like when you say that, you might mean something like, you know, what I would— what I often tell people is like, you know, probably if we're putting this on the market, we're going to list it for X. But, you know, that establishes sort of a value for the property. But then you're like, but you're the neighbor and I don't have to go market it. I don't have to go pay for this and that. And, you know, honestly, I like when I do a deal and it makes someone happy and figure the other one. So then you say, for you, I give you why, you know, if you really want it and you want to do a quick sale, I can give it to you for why, just so you know, you know. And I think, I don't know if that's what you mean, Mark, but that's what I think of when you say anchor.

Yeah, I think that's what I mean. I think when I think of a price anchor, it's saying the, you know, the price is this, right, to the general public, right? But for you, it'll be this. And so they can't unsee it. And we see this all the time in retail, you know, the little red lines crossed out, you know, for a shirt. The shirt was, you know, $90, now it's $60. Oh my gosh, what a deal!

I'm a sucker for that. Just show me the rack that says discount and I'm on it. Yeah, yeah.

Sometimes I'll joke to Lainey, I'm like, we're going broke saving money. Like, she'll just buy anything that's at a good deal.

I So I, for a long time, I had this routine. I had to cut myself off, but every Friday I would go to the thrift stores here in town that— and they have a day where they stock children's books. And I was coming home every Friday with like 40 children's books. So we've got— we have so many books and now I've— we've redonated a large amount. Of them. But, uh, I mean, it was fun for a while.

Like, here he comes, quick, price them all down, he's coming, he's coming.

Yeah, exactly.

Well, I think Mark too, it's like if you said to somebody— let's just go with a number— $8,000. If I said, hey, yeah, we're looking for $8,000, then they're going to want to negotiate that. They're going to be like, that's the number, and they're going to want— but if you're like, hey, you know, probably 'If we list this, it's probably about $12,000, you know, but honestly, if you're the neighbor and you really want this, I can probably, you know, I'll tell you, I could, you know, bottom dollar, I'll just, you know, $8,000,' you know. And so then they don't feel like they're gonna beat you up and try to, you know, because if you've anchored it at a higher number rather than just say, 'Yeah, if you want it, we'll give it to you for $8,000,' like, 'Oh well, how about $6,000?' Like, they're going to want to keep— everybody wants a deal.

Yeah, everybody wants to deal. And if they're local, I always give a good deal. Because in my mind I'm thinking, well, they're going to start talking to the other locals and then they'll come back to me. Because if I'm buying land, I'm always buying land in that area. I want the locals to feel comfortable knowing I'm going to give them a great deal as well.

But It's kind of what you said years ago. I know we don't, you know, we don't go to auctions, we don't have to, but I remember, I think it was you telling me that you did, and they were like, don't bid against the locals.

So it's kind of— I never bid against the locals. No, it can go real bad. That was me. I saw it firsthand. You know, this is— they live there. You're from out of town, you're an investor, and you got to deal with that local and their friends after that auction. And it may not go well for you. So, I mean, people are looking at, I mean, it would get very aggressive at some of these auctions. I would just stay out of them. Like, no amount of profit is worth violence with a local. You know, no way. Here's Greg. Isn't trying to sell to neighbors too few or far between? How about the typical buyer? So is it even worth mailing the neighbors if, you know, only 5% of the time you're going to get a neighbor sale, or 1% of the time, or whatever the percentage out of the process?

If it's automated and it happens at a certain stage in the acquisition, then it's just gonna, you know, you're gonna have an answer real quick, right? You know, so I think it can be triggered even prior to you know, you're closing on it, right? There's a point where you can trigger this, where you can even word it like, hey, we're closing on this property. You don't have to lie, you want to be transparent. So, you know, before you would even be really putting it out to typical marketing channels. So yeah, it may not sell, but it's certainly worth having that in the chain of events that will happen as you acquire a property.

Yeah, yeah. I mean, it's a stamp. What is it at the most? $5 for like the 5 adjoining neighbors?

Yeah.

$10 for everyone near there. I mean, it's, you know, it's way cheaper to go after the, the better buyer than, you know, some other—

I was just talking to him today. There you are, Greg. I just realized that was you. Great guy. Um, you know, he's, uh, first time— I'm first time watching the show, I'm guessing, because I just told him about it today. And I told him to shout out, but Scott Bossman's not here, so it's not as impactful. That's why he shouted out earlier, because I love it when Scott gets aggro when people say hi to me. I love you, buddy.

Here's Charles Jones. Is it safe to say that as you all have evolved in the business, they look to acquire more expensive parcels with slightly higher risk and higher upside, or is that not accurate?

It's a good question. I think that I always feel like when I'm talking to people, Mark, I think it, you know, there's always the option when you start out, we buy properties from $500 or $600, $4,000 or $5,000, whatever you can. When you, when someone's going through flight school, which is the 16, no, someone doesn't know, it's 16-week process where we could take you from here you are with, uh, no land business to over here having a land business. Well, the systems, the processes, you could build them out with a $500 deal or a $5,000. It doesn't matter. You're building the same system, the same process, right? But over time, yeah, you're going to develop confidence. You might have more capital and you might move up in the acquisition price, but I don't think it's at a higher risk because we're always buying at 25, 30 cents of current market value. Like Mark, you always said the Warren Buffett margin of safety— we have equity, we have instant equity, right? So the risk is like removed. Uh, so we're buying, we might buy at higher prices still within that in that $4,500 to $5,000, maybe $6,000, but we're not buying with higher risk in my mind. We're still buying in a very safe manner.

Yeah, well, John, I'm not going to say it. You go ahead. What are your thoughts?

I concur.

Ah, there we go.

But I do think like, I think that that's I think that, um, I think that's accurate. Like, I think as long as you're staying within the model, then it like radically de-risks it. Um, the only types of high-dollar properties that have been higher risk have been if I've been inching outside of the model for this one particular deal, right? So I've got some stories about properties like that right? But as I've stayed within the model, right, then it radically de-risks it. And so for me, um, like, eventually, like, I, I still do properties that are like— I don't know, my typical property retails for maybe on the low end, um, $6,000 or $7,000 for me, and then on the upper end maybe $35,000. And there are outliers on either side, and that's just kind of my My typical buy box. I love the phrase buy box, but that's my typical buy box phrase, right? That's a good phrase.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I mean, we're the same way. Yeah, actually, you know, we'll go real inexpensive properties all the way up to— we have properties now that are 5 acres. We're selling for $70 grand and You know, but our buy was maybe, you know, 15, 16 on those. So to Mike's point, the risk, we've de-risked it. And certainly there, you know, depending on capital and depending on confidence, but we're making our money on the buy. I mean, we've got a coaching grad, you know, he buys literally million-dollar properties. And he'll flip it for 2. And if he does 1 a year, he's pretty happy. It just takes longer at that level, but he's making his money on the buy. Here's Charles again. Question, is it too early to start outsourcing the sales side? I haven't even started it yet. Seems like a lot of nuances in the land sales that have a steep learning curve. Interesting. I have my, my thoughts about it.

But I was gonna say, I think it's what's important. What we typically say is to understand something before you outsource it. So too early, I don't know, it's more about do you feel confident that you know what the process is, because you're managing that process now. And to do it a few times to sort of You know, I, I love my analogy. I'm sorry, it's my analogy. I can't say I'm just— it's a good one, I think. So there's a local— there's a local— you've heard this before, Mark— there's a local grocery store chain around here. And, uh, you know, every generation they start off, they do everything in the business so they can take it over and they can manage it. But I always say, how long does it take to become— to understand that, you know, the shopping carts have to make their way from the outside to the inside, be dry and clean? That's deliverable. Bagging groceries, don't put the breakables at the bottom. But the meat department, you could lose a finger. Like, you could— you get getting a little hairy here, right? So hopefully not hairy in the meat department, but you can lose a finger. So things in our business, like, um, you know, it's very easy to understand how to, how to acquire a list for something like Zamplo. Or when you start to get the nuances of dealing with buyers and and how to close out a deal, it might be more like the meat department, right? So it's gonna take you a few reps to feel comfortable about that. So I think that's the answer I have is that it's not too early as long as you understand it. If you don't understand it, then yeah, I think it's too early.

I think there's also like the ability to manage intake and manage sales are two places where people can often undersell that, sell themselves short, right? Like, so I would not have considered myself a salesperson at all, right? And I sold a lot of land, right? Just me on the phone before I hired myself.

Every boot camp, you never stopped selling. You would just walk around and sell land. I don't know if he even attended any sessions, Mark. He's been walking around selling land the whole time.

I remember that. He'd be out in the hallway, I'm selling land. He never— he was never sending— he was never in the sessions.

Never not going.

Yeah, he's never not selling. It's true. Yeah.

So, but yeah, I mean, I think it's just like there's a, um, I think especially when it comes to sales, we kind of have this like idea of what a salesperson is, and then we think of ourselves and we think of that as completely incongruent, right? Because like, I'm not a used car salesman. I can't, like, you know, put the pressure the way that these other people do. But when you're just yourself, you know, and talking to these people, like, you can actually really establish trust and move a lot of property. And that's kind of, for me, like, the— one of the clicking points was, A, like, I did it and got my reps in, and B, I stopped trying to be somebody else, you know, and I was just myself in that process.

Yeah, you know, it's funny that it reminds me of that Netflix movie with George Clooney where he's kind of playing himself. It's called J. Kelly. And there's a line in the movie where someone said, oh, you're just playing yourself. He's like, you know how hard it is to play yourself? How hard it is to be yourself? And it's true. It is hard to be yourself. And yeah, I mean, to get your voice, your authentic voice where you're not performing, you're not in sales mode, right? And you're just sort of completely present with that person. And we talk about sales in the sense of like, if you're playing tennis, you jump over the net, you go on their side and it's not adversarial anymore. It's, is this going to be right for you? Let's play together. Are we aligned on this? If it's not, it's not. And let's move on. And so it doesn't even feel like a sale. It feels more like diagnosing, does this work for you based on what your needs are, what your interests are in this land? So, if John's calling me up, he's like, "Yeah, I got 12 kids and we need a place tomorrow and we want to live 30 miles from town." I'm like, "Bro, sorry, this is not for you. It's just too far." And one of the kids get hurt, Emergency services are going to take too long to get to you, and in good conscience, this is not the right land for you. If I find something closer to town, absolutely, I'll get back to you. And I let them go, right? And it builds trust.

Yeah, yeah. I think that also ties to like what we were talking about earlier, like, um, not being panicky about the sale, right? And about this conversation has to end in a sale and I don't want to screw it up. Right? Like, when you, um, when you're okay with hopping on the phone with somebody and it not turning into a sale, then those conversations end up being a lot more effective and powerful because you're not, you're not anxiously trying to get them convinced, you know?

Yeah, but, you know, but ultimately the money is in two places in this business. It's in county research It's the very first thing you've got to nail down, and then the sale. And so I always say those last two things I would ever outsource. So Charles, I would say get really good at it first, to the point where like you feel comfortable giving up a percentage of your, your profit to someone else, and you have a system, you have a process, you have a methodology. Otherwise, I to Mike's point and John's point, I wouldn't, I wouldn't move too far too quickly off of sales in the, in the beginning. That's just, yeah. Do you guys disagree?

No, I totally agree. I think one of the easiest things to do is just think about this like selling anything else on Facebook too, to kind of take— I talk about this, I bring this up to remove anxiety from people. In fact, I bring up First off, I say, okay, like, you know, there's things that you've probably sold on Facebook, whether a bike or something like that. It's just no different. It's a piece of land. It's still— it's just something. If somebody wants it, they're gonna just ask you a few questions and then they're gonna buy it. It's very simple. And the other thing I use to sort of— while we're on this topic, I think it helps to bring up, because sometimes people think like, they think, um, how do you buy land 25 cents on the dollar? It just doesn't make sense to them. Them, right? And I said, well, how about this? Like, two things I say. One is I have things in my garage that I may have— maybe it's my bike. Maybe, you know, I wanted— I pictured myself being this really fit guy riding the bike everywhere.

I don't ride it ever.

So if somebody came and said, hey, that $500 bike, I'll give you $200, $150— I— if they're gonna go make money, I don't care. I'm emotionally done with it. It's the same reason why when I go to a dealership I could sell that car myself and make more money, but do I want to deal with all the people coming over to my house, this and that? I know the dealer is going to make money. I want to get as much as I can for it, but I'm comfortable understanding that that's what they do, not what I do. So, and if you think of it that way, it makes sense why we can buy land 25 cents on the dollar. People don't want to go out and sell. They don't know how we do what we do. They're like, it's quick cash now, I'm emotionally done with it, I'll take it. And I think if you think of the same thing when you're selling something, it's like Hey, oh, is this the bike you want? Yeah, it's got the tires I like, two of them. It's got the steering wheel. Like, I'll take it, right? This is no different, right? So I think that kind of— I don't know, just kind of thinking of that, Mark. It makes people feel a little bit more at ease about selling something. It's not that difficult. You just need to clearly communicate and ask the right questions.

Yeah, and I always think— and I don't— you know, it's so funny because it's the first time I've ever really said it. But let's just, let's just go through sandwich shops, right? There's Subway, there's Jimmy John's, there is, uh, what's, what's the one with Danny DeVito commercial?

Uh, I want to say Fantastic Sams, but that's a haircut place.

That's a haircut place. What— it's, it's, it's a sub place. Anyway, someone put in the comment that the DailyVito commercials, Jersey Mike's, Jersey Mike's, right? Okay, how long does it actually take to make a sandwich? Honestly, like you can make your own sandwich. These are multi-million dollar businesses that will make you a sandwich. So that's a sandwich. Think about how overwhelming it could be for somebody to sell a piece of raw land that they haven't visited. They don't understand a deed. They're overwhelmed. A broker's not going to help them with it. Of course they're going to sell you the land. It's going to save them time. They won't even make a sandwich for themselves.

Right. True.

So they won't even, you know, they won't even eat bologna by land. There it is. Yeah. Brad Kelly's got a good comment here. I like being in the pawn shop for land.

Yeah, that makes sense too.

Yeah. Charles Jones, who has a lot of sales experience, He's like, I feel like I'm best at sales. I'm just trying to make a friend and help them, not sell them what I want.

I think that's so—

it's such a great mindset for sales. It's never about you. As soon as someone— like, we're so good at knowing and being like a BS detector. We can sense it when it's about them. But when it's all about you and you make it all about them, what's best for them, you don't care either way if they buy, they don't buy, they feel it. And, uh, it makes a difference. Thank you, Paul. Jersey Mike's. I appreciate it.

Also, one thing that we didn't acknowledge earlier is that Mike mentioned that his bike has a steering wheel, which is my favorite image ever. Mike just driving around on his bike.

I'm not very good at the analogies. Yeah, the steering wheel.

Yeah. Do you guys, uh, uh, you guys ever see those recumbent bikes? I could see Michael on those recumbent bikes with the flag.

Yeah, it reminds me of, uh, did you guys ever, when you're growing up, make your own little go-karts and you had the rope going down to the front so the steering wheel could turn it? Yes, I did.

I got the steering lines crossed.

Yeah, you had Right, there was a reason for that. There was some ergonomic thing. Are you doing that with the kids? You making any go-karts?

I made— I remember when I was in, uh, 4th grade, I made one, and we also, uh, had the brilliant idea of, in the interest of safety, using a bungee cord as a safety belt. And then I got the steering lines crossed and then ended up going and flipping over a, um, over a, uh, like a ditch.

Oh boy.

So I was just like hanging there, and I just remember my, uh, my neighbor's uncle, uh, just standing up at the top of the hill laughing at me. So it's a painful memory.

Yeah. Speaking of bikes, you guys ever sell land to like a dirt bike family? They're going to go out there and build their own dirt bike track?

No, I sold a parcel of land that people would use in Colorado for mountain biking. It was a large tract, you know, and so, you know, it was ideal for that, but not, not for dirt biking specifically, that I recall.

Yeah, mountain biking lands, you know, think about it's got a terrible slope, like, oh, no problem, it's great mountain bike land.

Love it. Yeah, yeah, for sure.

Um, so any— oh, we'll see some other comments here. A banana seat bike.

Oh, I had one of them.

My caveat, yes, for sure. Well, with Balsman not here, I feel like we're just out of things to talk about now. So good night, everyone. Good night.

Have a good night. So you forgot earlier that made me think, Mark, um, we're gonna get Tate on the show. We gotta get Tate on because, you know, uh, it's funny, I talk to people. So when— one of the things that, that I tell people that's really super helpful when they, when they, when they go through the process of building the land business and flight school that we have, they get to run into Tate around week 2. The way I always describe Tate, for those of you out here listening that don't know, is like he literally met Mark out of college. Maybe I always say this way. I say he met Mark out of college, worked a day or two in a W-2 world. I think he's like 36 now, Mark, am I right? I'm guessing 36. Yeah. And I say I'm 54. Not only is he a close friend, but he's a mentor to me. I mean, this— some people just have the X factor, right? Or the, or the, you know, they're the A player, and that's Tate. So We gotta get him on this show. We gotta get him on here so people, you know, he's kind of behind the scenes, quiet and humble, but I think we gotta expose him a little bit.

No, for sure, especially talks, you know, talking about sales. Yes, he loves selling land. So @MrJimPast, Jam Past, JM Past, I don't know, uh, he wants to know, I'm still learning the art of sales conversation, what is the typical flow for your conversations that start with an open-ended question?

Well, typically they're reaching out to us initially, right? So it's not like it's a cold call. So there's going to be something where they're going to ask probably a question of us. They're going to say, hey, you know, I'm calling about this, right? Yeah, great. Well, how can I help you? What would you like to know? What are you looking for? Um, you know, what, what, what type of land you're looking for? Like, you sort of just, again, interviewing them, making sure that, you know, Because the last thing we want to do is sell a property to somebody that's not a good fit because they're going to want to return it, which we do have a return policy. But it's just, why, why go through all that? We want them— and I would even tell them that the last thing I want to do is, you know, sell you a property that's not the right property for you. So just tell me a little bit about what you're looking for, like what, what's important to you in the land, what are you going to use it for, and then just— there it goes.

Yeah, yeah. By the way, if, uh, this little side note If anyone sells land and let's say that they pay you by a debit card, right? And then, you know, a month later, like, oh yeah, I went out to land, I don't love it, but my debit card's gone. Can you just go ahead and write me a check? Don't do it. It is a scam. Oftentimes what happens is someone will steal a credit card or steal debit card They'll buy the land and then they'll call you back during the refund period, say, oh yeah, I don't have that car anymore, can you just send me a check? And then they make money.

So are we frozen or is he frozen?

No, we're here.

We're here. Or we're both frozen and he's live and we're just in an alternate reality right now, you and I.

Yeah, good.

I mean, you know, sometimes you freeze in a bad way. It's not a bad freeze.

It's not a bad freeze.

You know, if I had to freeze, I want to be something like this.

You know?

Yeah, it wouldn't be ideal.

Yeah.

So John, you're the host now. I nominate you.

Okay. Yeah, we can, we can, uh, I guess like, so yeah, to Mark's point, that's only happened to me really one time that I've had, like I had somebody that wanted to buy a property for cash and then they mailed a check for $10,000 more than, oh, he's gone. Oh, I'm really the host.

Yes. And then they wanted a refund or they wanted the difference.

Yeah, they said just cash the check and give me the difference. And we, you know, didn't. And but one big cue was that the check was from the Children's Foundation. And it was signed by Johnny Appleseed.

So good old Johnny Appleseed.

I know. So if you get a check from the Children's Foundation signed by Johnny Appleseed, it's legit.

Yeah. So you think we nailed it with the, uh, neighbor letters? I don't think there's much more to cover. I had some notes that I took. Um, let's look, scan over here. I think we went through You know, uh, they buy not on emotion. I was going to say they buy on control and emotional attachment. We definitely talked about that. In fact, they might even pay more because they want to make sure somebody else is— not that we would gouge them like that, but you know, I think it's a faster closing, right? They're not going to be saying, is this buildable? Can I do this or that? They know. They live right next to it. They can easily, uh, they easily know what, what what they can do and what they can't do with it. Um, we did a lot of them around owner financing. We— someone had asked us if they pay cash sometimes, but you know, if they have the cash, it might be more motivating and quicker just to offer them some owner financing. Do you do a lot of one-year same as cash, John, by the way? I've done that a few times.

Do you have— like, we always offer, um, we'll often do 6 months same as cash. And so, yeah, and I would say the vast majority of those people don't do it, but it's a really helpful tool to like, if somebody— because what you want is you want somebody to make a decision, right? And if somebody's like on the fence, do I do cash or do I do terms? Like, it's a good way to say, well, let's get you started on terms and we'll give you the option to do the cash, right? And so you can get somebody to make a decision when it's a challenging one for them.

So, you know, it could be interesting too that I think sometimes people think about, and so you can structure your letters to account for this, is that the other thing that might happen is they might want to sell it to you.

Yeah.

And which is good, right? So, you know, you're not always— you don't always have to give the price initially in the first letter, like what you're selling it for. Yeah, you just want to elicit a response from them. Are you interested or are you not? And if you're not, perhaps you'd like to sell. Yeah, Mark, you froze in the best way possible. You know, sometimes you get weird freeze faces. Yours was very professional. Yeah, great. It wasn't a bad freeze.

Very solid.

Very lucky. So my internet just Died. Now I'm back.

That was weird, huh?

He's got the mice running out of space. Yeah, by the way, I say that I saw the most incredible movie last night. Can you guess what it was? In the theaters. What do you think it was?

Project Hail Mary.

Yes! Oh my God, just saw it. Were you mind-blown? I mean, that, that they—

well, I've read it. I read the book.

The book— how much better is the book?

Even better. The book's amazing. It looks amazing. It's the same author as The Martian.

Did you do Audible for the book or did you read it?

No, I did Audible.

And was it read by a good reader?

Great. It was great. And you know, it's, it's in the same kind of— like, if you've read The Martian or saw the movie The Martian with, uh, Matt Damon, yeah, it's the same author. It's fantastic. And then you get all the—

just, I don't— I think kind of— I was arguing with Laura a little bit. I like— I think I had like a double ending. They could have they could have maybe, uh, uh, you know, ended it, but then they wanted to extend it. I felt like— I think it was a little long at the end. That's all I'm saying. But other than that, wow, great. I don't know, I think that's acceptable for kids. What do you think, Mark? John could bring the kids.

For sure, I'd bring the kids. That's very cute. Yeah, I don't think there's any curse words.

Are you going to 4D where you sit in the thing and the whole chair moves? Moves? Did you do the Disney experience?

I felt it in the chair, but I didn't, I didn't go to like one of those IMAX, like it was specifically meant for that.

You gotta take the kids, like you go up in space and you, you feel like you get— when he's doing the thing, he's upside down, you get kind of sick a little bit, like, oh my God, I'm weightless, what's going on here?

Oh, that's super cool. Yeah, so yeah, I, my parents are still in town, so I just went with my parents and, uh, and Laney. They did a little matinee. Yeah.

Matinee. Oh, popcorn too. Oh, anyway, I digress. Mark, we were saying right when you were getting back on that one of the other tactics that I think can be helpful is when you're reaching out, because also at the same time what you're doing as well is you could be buying another property for yourself, right? So it's like, do you necessarily throw a number out on the letter? Because then it kind of anchors like, what are you going to pay them for it? So it's sort of— there's an art to sort of saying Hey, we're interested in selling, and then have a conversation and then elicit from them if they really want to buy. Because if they don't, they might want to sell, and then you double your size of your property, bring more value, make more money.

Yeah, I know that, that, that's happened to me where it gets real awkward. Yeah, where they're like, well, I'll sell you my land for that same price. I'm like, well, I don't really, you know, like, like, I appreciate it, but I'm in the business of buying and selling raw land. Like, I need to have margin.

Right. And so I'm a little different, but I'm like, have you guys ever bought land from people that you've sold to?

Oh, yeah.

Yeah, that's happened to me.

The same land or other land?

The same land. Like, I've had that happen. I mean, yeah, I've had it happen multiple times. And in those scenarios, I'm like, super upfront. I'm like, look, you bought it for what it's worth, right? Like, you know, that's the retail value. For my model, like, I've got to buy it at this, this price point. And so if that doesn't work, I 100% understand. Right. And here are some other options that you could do. And I've had multiple people say like, it's okay, I'll, I'll sell it.

Yeah, I have too. I usually give them the jeweler story and I'm like, look, you know, I'm probably the worst person to come back to because it's just like if you bought, piece of jewelry from the jeweler, then he goes, hey, I'm going to sell it to them. They're going to give you, you know, 30, 40 cents on the dollar because that's how they make their money. I'm, I'm the same way, but the great thing about me is I'm going to close tomorrow. And so I'm just a faster sale, but you're not going to get top dollar. And if you're comfortable with that, we'll do it. And they're like, you know, oftentimes they're like, yeah, because like, again, it's a sandwich. People won't even make their own sandwich.

I make so many sandwiches, except for the brunettes. Yeah, I pack all the lunches.

Yeah, but do you do it like, do you put oregano on it and do like the oil and vinegar?

It's ham, cheese, mayonnaise, mustard. So that's my recipe.

You're not gonna be like Potbelly and toast it?

No.

Yeah, Mike, I was talking about you this morning, about your dad makes your— would make your lunch.

Well, we don't want to fight. In fact, tomorrow I'm bringing him to the doctor's. I said, well, afterwards, could you make one of those peanut butter and jellies? And he's like, absolutely. So it's a peanut butter, the jelly layer of butter on there with some fresh bread. It's going to be amazing. I'm going to eat half and bring half home for Laura.

It's amazing. Now, do you do that for your kids too?

No, I don't make the peanut butter and jelly for them. I just take them out to eat.

Okay, okay. What now, does your dad do it for the grandkids?

Oh yeah, they love coming over and he makes the sandwiches for them. My mother makes, uh, her own sauce and meatballs and all that stuff, so the kids get, you know, depending on— she'll distribute it to different ones different times. So yeah, yeah.

Put in the comments, I'm just— I'm just curious, what is your mom's signature dish? You know what I mean? It's like, oh, Mom's making this tonight.

Yeah.

Or like, you know, growing up, you're like, oh, it's going to be a good dinner. She's making this. And like, it like brings you back.

Great.

The Ratatouille.

Yeah. And I'd like— John, what are your kids— what's the best meal that you make they all like go crazy over?

I think, let's say, the, the one that the kids— this is one that, um, we have occasionally is Hawaiian meatballs. It's really like, it's like an Instant Pot recipe. Yeah, it's like sweet. It's got red peppers and stuff. Uh, they like, we'll do, uh, barbecue a decent amount. So Sunday we'll do barbecue, um, or we'll do like some kind of a roast typically. And so I did a pot roast on Sunday.

And then sometimes we'll do like ribs, or we'll do that pot roast, like a loaf of bread or something.

We did— let's see, what do we do? We did a pot roast and then mashed potatoes. All right, it was a nice— it was a nice pot roast. I used ChatGPT. I did it in the Dutch oven for like 5 hours with all the veggies.

It's great. We got clam chowder.

Clam chowder. I love what he said. Can you say it a few more times, Mike?

I just said it the right way. Clam chowder.

I love it.

Oh my gosh, that's so good.

Anybody else? I can't see them all. I think I only see the ones you post up there. So I saw a lot— no, clam chowder. We saw, uh, lasagna. Anything else?

Uh, not that I'm seeing.

What was your— what was your favorite meal your parents would— your mom?

So my mom was not a cook, but growing up, if she made salami and eggs, I, I was like, oh, like for breakfast? Like, no, dinner, anytime. Breakfast, lunch, dinner.

Is it boiled eggs or is it scrambled eggs?

Scrambled eggs.

Oh, with salami inside?

Salami.

Nice. That.

Yeah, that's like— yeah, you know, that's my Ratatouille.

Ratatouille.

I haven't had it in a long time, but it's good. Well, let's, let's, uh, let's land the plane here, fellas. All right, final words of wisdom when it comes to mailing the neighbors. And if you made it this far, thank you so much. Like, subscribe, do whatever you're supposed to do.

I don't know what they're supposed to do on socials, Do something nice for us, will ya? We don't care.

Yeah, we don't really care, but do something.

Oh, breakfast for dinner is good. Chicken stew. Oh, these are all coming in. Breakfast dinner. Grandma chicken. There it is.

Oh, cheers, cheers, cheers, cheers.

Cheers. Thank you guys. So I think Mark, to sum it up, I would say that, you know, a neighbor letter is a great way to sell property, but it's just another, it's another, uh, how do you say that in the wheel? It's not a clog in the wheel. What's the word?

Another tool in the shed?

Wheel. The wheel has these things.

Spoke in the wheel?

Spoke in the wheel?

Another steering wheel on your bike?

Another steering wheel on the bike. Somebody knows what I'm saying. They'll put it in there. It's just another piece of the puzzle to be successful in your land business. So it works sometimes, it doesn't always work, but if it's part of the process, it's just— it's going to get sales for you. You're going to have more sales if it's part of your process.

Yeah, I know, absolutely. And if you guys are just watching this and you don't know who we are, go to landgeek.com/training, learn more there. There we go. All right, well Let's, uh, let's close it up.

In the wheel. Cog in the wheel.

Cog in the wheel.

Wheels don't have cogs, do they?

I don't know. I think they must have at one point in time, because, you know, maybe back in the prairie days there were cogs in the wheel. There's got to be something there. Wheels go round and round. Okay.

All right, so are we taking next week off?

Yes, we are.

Okay, Scott's gonna be gone, Mike's gonna be gone. We're taking next week off. We'll see everybody in 2 weeks. Mail those neighbor letters, send out your offers, and we'll see everyone.

Let's come back fresh. We're gonna come back with some new ideas, maybe some guests. We're talking about— we've been—

yeah, we'll bring on Tate.

We got— yeah, we're gonna get Tate on here. That'll be great because we don't have to say very much. We'll just get Tate on a topic and he'll go in the hour. Exactly.

I love it.

All right.

Hopefully I get this outro right. Thanks, guys.

Thank you.

Cheers.

Cheers. Uh, I'm not giving it right here. Hold on.

That looked like a good sandwich.