What If I Can't Sell the Land?

Sam. Foreign. Welcome to Lamb Geek Nightcaps. Welcome, everybody. Thanks for tuning in. So tonight, here's what we got going on. Mike Zano, John Burnett. I'm Scott Bossman. But, Mike, John, what if I can't sell the land, man? What if I buy the wrong property or I spend too much or I make a mistake? These are some of the questions that keep newbie investors, maybe even older investors kind of up at night. So tonight we're going to tackle these issues head on. And the truth is, you know, when you buy land the right way, you really can't lose. I don't know if you guys remember. Mark always tells the story of his wife asking him, you know, what if this doesn't work? And his answer was simple. Worst case is we own land. Right? So we're gonna unpack this all tonight. Grab and drink, settle in. And remember, we go live every Tuesday night, 9pm Eastern or the Land Geek Nightcap. So, fellas, good to see you. Mike Zano, the Zen master. Cheers.

Cheers.

John. Eight is enough for net.

Cheers.

Or is it enough?

I can tell you in front of all of our thousands of people, they're. It's probably enough.

It's probably not. Oh, yeah. I think we can all imagine that Six children is enough. And eight people in the household, that's for sure.

That's. It's very exciting. It's. I like to say that my children are very creatively destructive, so I love it. Good.

We want to have that piano. I know. I think it was. Wasn't last week your daughter was playing. That'd be great in the back.

Soothing.

Yeah, it'll be good. Well, you know what? We'll put together a theme song. I imagine it starting with. And then we'll.

It'll be great.

All right.

Speaking of tickling the ivories, they know, like, where's the piano tonight? That's what it's called, playing the piano.

I. I've never heard it before, but it certainly makes sense to me, you know, I don't know. I guess I'm in the office tonight. I'm in the office tonight. Figured make this a working show.

What are you.

Your.

Your old school land investor Tonight you got the. The. The plat map on the wall behind you. Nobody does this anymore, dude.

Oh, I love plat maps. Look at.

Yeah, that's exciting. That's exciting stuff. Now you're making everyone feel a little bit inferior and probably a little bit nervous thinking they need to acquire these plat maps from counties and that type of thing. But Mike's just special.

We happen to do a lot of work in one area, so it's kind of cool to throw the maps up.

Yeah, everybody's zooming in right now. They're trying to figure out. You better blur it out. Zano, I think you're good. We can't see it.

We don't compete. We don't care for the people.

Compete.

There's no competition. Come on, come everyone. Come one, come all.

I love it.

I love it.

Yeah. And come, come on. Come all to the nightcap. We got. We got some people. Chime People tuning in here tonight. Daniel Bryan is here, excited for the topic of the week. Everybody else is pretty quiet right now, so. So drop in. The comment, you know, where you're from is silent. Or say hello. Yes, the hive mind is silent. They're very, very quiet. Quietly buzzing right now. All right, so let. Let's get to the topic and then we'll get to some fun. I'm sure, I'm sure we'll get.

Jump right in.

Yeah, let's just jump right in. You need to jump right in.

Some segments we just can't dive right in. You gotta have.

Yeah, we'll. We'll. We'll dive in and then we'll get to the fun stuff later. How's that sound? All right, we'll stay on target here.

Isn't it all fun?

It is all fun. Don Thrasher's here. Shannon Morris is here. Good to see you, Shannon. Anna S. Is here. Andrew Pond is here. We got. Listen, we got Florida, Alabama, Nebraska. Where else we're tuning in from? It's. It's a global. It's a global event. This show.

It's a global phenomenon. It's great.

California, Utah. We're hitting every state, every state of the nation.

I'm just trying to think of that song, John. Do your kids. Maybe yours did as well in the younger. Scott, but your kids do. My daughter used to sing a song about all the states.

Yeah, I'm thinking of like, there's the one with all the presidents.

In the states. Alabama.

Oh, yeah. Yeah.

I'm trying to think of it. Just when you were saying that, Scott, I could just. That song just started bubbling in my head.

I think you should. I think you should come up with your own rendition, Mike, and sing it at the Dirt Rich Summit here in a couple months.

Yeah, we need some, like, mimetic songs for us. Mnemonic. Whatever it is.

Mnemonic.

Mnemonic.

Dirt Rich Summit is coming up.

Judging. Anybody here? John?

Yeah, anybody on the Call. Going to the dirt Rich summit. First week, first week of November, we are in Austin, Texas. Seats available. Join us. I think it's gonna be a lot. I think it's gonna be a blast.

We're gonna have three of us are going to be talking about a variety of things.

A variety. You can shake these hands. It's great.

Oh, man.

Yeah.

You better come up with your topics of your variety of topics here.

So when I watch his presentation, I'm probably gonna be sweating at how good it is.

I'm just waiting for. I'm waiting to get Mike's. Mike's outline and then I'm just gonna present it. It's gonna be great.

Artist copy.

Yeah, Jeff is here. I don't know. I don't know which Jeff that is. We have lots of Jeffs. It could be Jeff Storley, could be.

Jeff Cutler, one of the Jeffs.

One of the Jeffs is here and it sounds like they're maybe going to. To Houston. Don Thrash is going to Houston. Anna S. Is going to Houston. So that is awesome. Anna is excited about tonight's topic because. What's that?

Look at Mike.

What are you doing over there?

He does thumbs up and then fireworks come.

What? Why do you get all the special effects?

I don't know what's right.

I've known that.

I don't know what happened. That was amazing, huh?

Is that a good enough warm up for you, Zaino?

Can we get to the top now? We're into it. We're into it. We're 10 minutes in. We start.

Okay, start. I did find a button that says I did just find a button that says that I can enhance my skin appearance, so.

Well, you just did it.

Look at this. This is great.

10 years younger.

All right, sorry. We digress.

Where's that button?

This is now my regular skin. Believe it or not. There are no filters.

Here it is.

Yeah, here. What is? All right.

My skin.

John Burnett, I have a question for you. Okay, what? And this is a question that we all have when we first start buying land. Every single one of us experiences this. Every single one of us has this little fear, this. This little, you know, this little feeling of discomfort. What if I get stuck with this land and I can't move it? Don Burnett. Have you ever had that feeling? Have you ever been stuck with land?

I mean, I have that feeling where sometimes something feels like it's moving a little slow. And the question is always, why, right? Why is it moving slow? And. Oh, did I freeze?

No.

My back.

You're back.

You're good. You're cutting out a little bit audio wise.

You never left in my world.

I guess, I guess we're in our own world here, Mike.

John, is he frozen? Like he's blue?

I don't think he's frozen. He's not frozen. He just can't hear us. So I'll go to you, Mike, have you ever, Mike, ever had that, that, that feeling, that fear that this land barely bought is never going to sell?

Yeah, I had the feeling, but it's not true. You know, I definitely had the feeling though, like, oh my goodness, this isn't going to sell. You know, mild panic might set in. Not now, but in the beginning, I'm saying, you know, you don't realize that when we say all these properties sell, they all do sell. Sometimes it might take a while, particularly in the beginning when you're building up your buyers list. What's that? Well, we can talk about that after. You know, when you're building up the marketing, you know, it could take some time for it to sell and so you could definitely feel that way. So yes, of course, of course I'd be lying to say if I haven't felt that way in the past, but I also found that it's not true.

Yeah. And I think that just comes with the territory, right? You're learning a new skill. You, you, you're buying this property out in the middle of nowhere compared to where you are, and you're like, is anybody ever going to buy this thing? And it's, there's just a lack of confidence associated with that. I think there's this feeling of, there's this unknown. Right. Associated with this land parcel you bought in the middle of Arizona or New Mexico or wherever you're buying. And you know, some of these areas, you look at them and you're like, man, who would really want this? Right. So then you have your own biases as well, contributing to that fear. And it's definitely something that, it's definitely a hurdle that we all have to get over and we'll talk about that as far as like strategies to get over that. But, but John Burnett, have you ever, have you ever felt that, have you ever experienced a non sale?

I have experienced a non sale before in the sense of like having that, that period where I'm like, why isn't this one parcel moving? Or it just, you just feel that weight. Right. And sometimes the answer's just been like, I mean, especially early on, it's like, am I advertising? Right, Right. How are my Ads looking right.

Right.

And so sometimes you just need to. If you feel like something isn't moving, you just need to take a look at what you're doing and see kind of what the reason could be behind that, whether it's the pricing or the ad. Are you posting enough ads? Are your ads looking stuff like that just to. To validate kind of where you are right now in terms of positioning that property effectively? So.

Yeah, well, let's. Let's talk the fact that also when we buy these, you know, we should have done some careful research about the area prior to buying these. Right. Not only about the property characteristics, the characteristics of the area, you know, what, what amenities are in the area, what attributes are in the area, what scenic activities are in the area. Why do people like land in this area? So I think you can avoid this fear by doing really careful research before you go out and purchase the land. But the other really great thing is when we buy the land, Mike Zano, we're buying it at such a deep discount that even if you do buy it, like Mark told his wife back in the day, the worst case scenario is we own land at a deep discount based on our research.

Yeah. You have an asset with instant equity.

Yeah. I mean, can we go so far as to say, you know, Mike, could you park your money in land right now and feel better about it than maybe a savings account?

Absolutely. We have people that buy from us all the time for that very reason.

Yeah, the. The land bankers.

The land banker. Absolutely. That's good. You got.

Was that good?

Yeah, it was very good.

I've been hanging around you long enough. It's. It's starting to wear off.

He's taking courses. He's got Duolingo on his phone.

They now offer New England. You know, sometimes it's the expectation, you know, just like, you know, remember the boot camps? We, you know, we. We do them virtually. We used to do them live before COVID and we get people together and say, you know, we're going to do some exercise, and here's a piece of land. You're going to buy it, then you're going to sell it. Inevitably, people will be like, yeah, so I bought this $2,000 property. I'm going to get $2,000 down. That way, all my money's out. And then I'm going to get like. They set up these unreal expectations, and sometimes a property isn't moving because you created some unreal expectations. So. So once you understand what yield really looks like and what's good in Our business, you can start playing with that and see, oh, wow. You mean I could actually just get a few hundred dollars down and still have a great return on my money and I could change my expectations. So a lot of times these properties aren't moving initially for many of the people that start out is because they have an unrealistic expectation of what the pricing should look like.

What other maybe unrealistic, unrealistic expectations might we have, Jim? Anything.

I think one thing could be that, that you're gonna post one ad and that's enough.

Right?

And so, you know, I posted this ad. Where's my sale? Right. Why aren't the people flocking to me? And the reality is that the One isn't enough. Right. You've got to market that. That property really consistently.

So, yeah, the one and done fallacy.

No, I love that. And I think we probably all have our own stories regarding this subject, Right. Like, I'll never forget one time I bought a property for really cheap, and I'm like, why would anybody ever buy this thing? So it sat in my inventory for a year, I think, before I marketed it. And then I marketed it and it sold within a couple weeks. Right.

Happened to me as well. With lots of properties in the beginning, it's like just sort of feel the same way. And then all of a sudden realize what a gold mine you have. You've just been advertising it correctly.

Exactly. And. And your advertising is going to hit the right person at some point or other, right? Yeah, I've, you know, and then our biases are so huge. John, have you ever. I mean, I'm sure you've had a property where, where you're just like, you know, no one would ever buy this. I wouldn't buy this. Like, why the heck did I buy this? Am I ever going to sell this? I'm sure you've had a property like that. We, we oftentimes I, I get properties sometimes that I'm like, yeah, I'll buy. Like, we'll buy from somebody and they'll be like, hey, I have these other properties over here. Will you buy these also? They're like, I may not be excited about it, but yeah, I'll do it. Right. But anyway, John, what are your thoughts on that?

Yeah, I mean, I think, like, yeah, I definitely have kind of stories like that. Like, there's this one area, I. There's one property once bought, and I bought it kind of outside of the land. Geek areas. But it was like this great opportunity, you know, I was like, oh, my goodness, this property retails for. Should retail for 35,000 and I'm gonna get it for 5,000. And and so I bought it. And, and the margins were good. And then I came to find out that in this particular area of this state, it was impossible to get a septic system. Like absolutely impossible. And so it just wasn't buildable. And so I was like, I don't know what I'm gonna do. And I ended up selling it for $17,000 cash to a guy who just wanted to build a barn to put his like, his supplies up. And so, and, and that was within like a month, you know. And so it was like one of those things where the moment I found out about that, like I felt this pit in my gut. I'm like, what have I done? But I bought it, right? And so I ended up making a great profit, just not the profit that I was anticipating at the outset.

You know.

I love that. And again, it really just all comes down to numbers, right? I mean, we buy these at such a margin of safety that we have some protection in our numbers. And then. But when we're doing, when we're determining whether or not we're gonna buy these properties, we also have to be very careful in our due diligence to make sure we are getting a good deal, right? You know, we work in these areas we talk about all the time. They're very cookie cutter, right? You know, one property, you know, em all a lot of times, but every once in a while you get one, you'd be like, oh, I don't know, like this one might have a little bit of an issue with it. And is that going to affect my ability to sell it? Sometimes it might. That's why we want to get it even deeper discount, right? So I think we can all think of instances like that as well. And somebody was posting in the Facebook group today about, you know, he came into this opportunity to buy land, but there's a wash going through the middle of the property, right? So a wash is basically a little seasonal stream through your land. Typically in Arizona because they get a gushing rainfall once a year, right. And the water's got to go somewhere. And so it follows the path of least resistance. A lot of times it follows this wash pattern through properties. And that's something John, that and Mike, that I know all of us have, have experienced as well, right. And we have these conversations with ourselves like, okay, this thing has a wash going through. Am I going to buy this thing? What are your thoughts on the wash, Mike? We get this question a lot. It's got a wash going through it.

Yeah. That's something that you would use to your advantage when buying and use your advantage when selling. And I think you framed it correctly. I'd be telling the person I'm buying from there's all wash through it. This is really a major issue.

I once heard a friend refer to. There was a property that was like, just all wetlands, and he referred to it as a juicy deal, which was my favorite thing ever. Yeah, Yeah.

I mean, you. You could say, hey, John, I love to buy this property from you, but, you know, there's this big wash going through it, and it's really, you know, I don't. I prefer whatever. I can negotiate a great deal, but then when I turn on, sell it. Hey, this is seasonal river or pond? I'm not river pond, but seasonal stream coming through the property. And you could use it as, you know, on the opposite side, you know, in that sense. So, you know. Yeah, I bought properties with washes in them, you know, for sure. You just got to understand what it is you're buying, and that's part of the due diligence. Use that to negotiate a good deal. And now you can reverse that quality to help sell a property.

Yeah. You know, it brings up something. Oh, go ahead, John.

Oh, I was going to tell the story that I probably told five times already on Nightcap about this one time I had this opportunity to buy this property, and there was an issue where, like, basically there was. I had. Well, getting overly technical, but I had to buy it on a special warranty deed and sell it on a special warranty date because there was a treasurer's deed recently in the title. And then it was also, like, underwater. Like, I mean, it was a floodplain, but it flooded. Like, we're not talking like 100 year floodplain. We're like talking like every eight months floodplain. Right.

Okay.

And so anyway, so but I got this smoking deal from this guy. I was like, look, there's all these issues, you know, I can give you. You know, I think we were offering two grand or something, and I was like, I can give you 750 bucks for this thing. Right. It's kind of like my make me buy it price. And so the guy ended up saying yes. Right. He wanted out. And so I bought the property. And then, like, I had it listed. It was kind of a weird property. It was listed for maybe a couple months or something like that. And then I ended up finding a buyer, and it was these guys that wanted to throw a musical festival, and they had talked to the county about everything that was required and all this stuff. And they're like, we want your property because it's cheap. And so. And so I sold them this property for four grand, right? And so I made 32.50 off of that. And so kind of a thing, you know, if you buy, right, like, you can negotiate those deals down and. And you'll find the right buyer in the right circumstances.

And sometimes you'll have a buyer go to the property, and they're like, I'm not buying this thing. There's a walk going through it. And then you have another buyer go to the property, and they're like, I can engineer my way around this thing. Right, right. Like Jeff Moore just said here, he's got. He's got two washes going through his property. In Utah, you just put in really large culverts to cross the wash when you built the road. It's not a big deal. So there's really creative people out there, right? There's earth movers out there that can. That can. You know, the wash isn't an issue to these guys. And that's kind of the cool thing about land, right? And, you know, we experienced that on the sell side. We experienced that on the buy side. How many times do we send an offer out to people and we get hate mail, and the next day we get. We get an accepted offer from somebody that we've mailed the same price. So it's. It's kind of interesting. It's just all people on both sides, people.

It's just.

It's a people business, really. And every. Every walk of every person is just different.

I think that's a good. Like, one of the things Mike said about, like, pitching, like, you've got something kind of, like, weird about your property, like actually pitching it in your ad. Because sometimes, like, sometimes you'll post an ad and somebody will, like, people go to the property and they'll mention something. They'll be like, ah, it's really steep, or something like that. And what you need to do is basically get ahead of that, right? And you need to pitch that as a value add instead of a detraction, right? And then you'll find the right buyer and you'll narrow it down to the. To the right people. So.

No, I love that. All right, well, let's. Let's talk one other thing. Have you guys ever needed an exit strategy on a particular property? So let's say maybe you have A property in inventory and like, maybe you've marketed it forever and it just won't sell and it's driving you crazy and you hate it. Like, are there any exit strategies that you guys have utilized in the past?

Yes.

Yeah. John, Mike, anything.

Let John go first.

Okay.

So I've had, like, there was this one area and I was like, man, I'm really, I'm like having trouble resonating with this area. Right. And I think that I probably should have just pushed through, right. Like, given. Given all of our conversations so far. But I also knew somebody who's selling these properties like bananas, right? Just like mine. And so I just reached out to him and said, do you want to buy mine wholesale? Right. So he bought it for me. I made a profit, right. And then I apply those dollars to a different area. Right. The other thing is sometimes you, you know, I'll find myself in an area where like, if I've got, let's say I've got 5 acre sagebrush flat lots that look up at the mountain and let's say I've got 10 of them. Well, I can't really advertise 10 at one time, right. They're kind of the same product and it's appealing to a specific type of buyer. And so if I find myself with too much inventory, then I'm not really worried about whether or not I can sell this product. But it might take a while for some of those to sell. So I might actually just offload those wholesale to another investor and then put those funds into different properties.

I like that. I love that the whole, the wholesaling opportunity is definitely, you know, definitely something to think about. If you're, if you have a property and you just, you know, you need the inventory or I'm sorry, you need the cash. Because we buy it at a good price, we should hopefully be able to wholesale it to somebody. I can think of a story where, like, I felt like I was stuck with this piece of land. Although looking back, this was like my first year, right? Looking back, I know I probably could have sold it, but. But when I had it at the time, I felt like I made a big mistake because I bought this awesome property on one side of the road that was buildable, it was beautiful. Trees, right? Would have been just an awesome cabin property. And I bought the. I bought the property across the road, like, sight unseen because it was the same price or cheaper. And I'm like, this is going to be an amazing property. And it turns out to be one big slab of rock. Like, the entire one acre property was a slab of rock. And I'm like, I'm kind of freaking out a little bit because I'm like, I'm never gonna be able to sell this thing. And I marketed for a little while. I got some bites. People go out there, it's a big rock. I'm like, yeah, okay. And. But I. But I did a kind of a creative deal where I had this property over here. And I basically said it was a bigger property, much more valuable property. And I like, know what? Buy this one, get this one free. But I structured the pricing in a way that made sense to where I didn't lose any money on it. Right. So there's some creative marketing things you can do as well.

Yeah. Makes you think of the opposite. When you and I one time bought a property, Scott, we didn't want it. The guy was selling a property to us, so we were buying another property from him. And we're like, this is wetland. Like, we don't want this property. Remember, we paid a hundred dollars for it, and then come. Come find out the neighbor wanted it for a ridiculous amount of money compared to what we paid for it.

And we made.

Yeah, Money. Sometimes that works out, right?

We.

What was the name we gave to that? What wasn't the $1 Skittle? No, that's when you have too many taxes owed. We had names for all these. What was the name for that one?

Oh, I don't know what that one was. That was a. That was like a neighbor sale. Like a nuclear neighbor sale, man. Like, that was crazy.

Yeah. So John brought up some great points. I think that, you know, the reality is there are some people out here, out there that may have a. A buyer's list full of people that are looking for a particular property that you're having a hard time moving. So you know what? They already have the buyers waiting in the midst. You can wholesale to them, and they can move it quickly, and you can focus on something else. So I think there's real validity there.

There's always a buyer at the right price, right? No, you can't. You can't lose when you buy, right. Or you sell, Right. I also think when you sell, right.

I think if you're in, like, especially early on in your business, like, I remember having a friend that ended up doing a ton of sales in his land business, but he had this period at the outset where he was kind of figuring out sales, and they. And it just. It was. They were going through that. That debt, right? And we went To a boot camp. They brought it up and he just wholesale the property right there in the room.

Right.

To another investor. And I think sometimes, like, you know, like we were talking about, there are other investors that have buyers lists that are able to sell these. Sometimes just having that psychological win rate of moving a property is really helpful in just getting through that. That slump. Right. And just making a little bit of profit and continuing to push forward.

Yeah. So if you're coming to the dirt rich summit, bring your deals.

Yeah, good point, dude. Bring your deals. Just not only to talk strategy, but to talk money.

Yeah, we, you know, like John said. I know Scott, you and I have been at boot camp, so we've met back in the day and we have people like down about moving a property. Like you ever considered wholesale. I bet there's someone at this boot camp will buy that from you and they literally move it and make money within an hour or two. So, yeah, that reframing is powerful.

Love that.

I love that. It's the dirt rich.

Dirt rich land swap. I like the idea.

There you go.

We should do a land swap. Everybody just bring deeds and we just trade. Great.

That could be fun. Put them all in the hat and everybody just draws one. Okay, that's awesome. Well, I think, I think we've kind of covered this topic. I think it was a good topic. I think we all face it at once, one time or another. It's one of those things where, you know, after you've sold ten or a hundred or a thousand properties, like John Burnett, these fears just become less and less and less. Right. And you approach these deals with confidence just like you would in any other profession. I mean, if you're, if you're a fire. If you're a firefighter, Mike, how many years did it take you to feel like you were like, on your feet?

Yeah, you know, it takes a while. You know, you're. You just kind of go into the fires and you're following directions and trying to mimic what other people are doing, but eventually you sort of get a feel for it, you understand it, and you become a firefighter. Just like. There was a certain point where I became a land investor. I remember it was like, oh, I'm a land investor. And it was like. It wasn't like. It was just like a sudden realization, yeah, I buy and sell land. I'm a land investor. I've been doing this for a while. So to really embrace that new identity takes some time.

Awesome. What questions do you folks have for us? Does anybody have any fears about, about buying land. Is. Is anybody stuck selling land? Let me go back. We did have some questions come in. So this will help us, help us move forward. Don. Yes. There's a song with all the letters of the Alphabet. I know that one. That's pretty easy. Done. Okay, let's see. Uh, Daniel Bryan made his first sale this week. Congrats to you, Daniel. That's amazing. If, if you're still watching and you want to share the details, we'd love to hear them. As far as like what you bought it for, what you sold it for. Did you sell for cash terms? Wholesale. Love to hear that. Billy Swinton. Good to see you, sir. He has. Oh, this is exciting. Devin accepted counteroffers. Counter offers slightly higher counteroffers. He is deciding to take all or not. Interesting. So questions, Billy. Are these all from one seller? Are they all different sellers? That's what I would want to know.

Yeah. Because you should be getting a better deal, not a worse deal.

Right. We're going to take these hands. We're going to take these off your hands. We're going to make it real convenient for you. We're gonna have a check to you in a couple days and give me a discount.

Right, Right. We don't want to have. I got to have landitis.

Right.

That can screw our thinking and put us in a bad spot.

Right. So be curious to hear some details on that. Billy, Maybe we could help you out.

Five different sellers.

What's that, John?

Five different sellers. And then one is land Art.

Okay, five different sellers. So go ahead, John. What was your advice?

I mean, my. I guess it depends on like where, where inventory is at. You know, are these your first properties you're buying or is it property? Like do you have some property and inventory? If they were like, if these are some of your first deals, I would say like go. Don't, don't feel like you gotta like get. Take all these down. Right. You know, I look at them, make sure that they pencil a like look at what property is selling for directly surrounding these properties. Sometimes I'll go on land.com and do the little map search and it's a giant pane but you can zoom into like right where the property is. Click search this area and look at the most, you know, the, the closest comp. Surrounding and just see what you, what things are moving for and. But I wouldn't, you know, we talked about gotta have landitis. You know, don't feel like these are the, the last deals you're going to get and if you don't move forward on them, then it's going to be a massive missed opportunity, you know.

Yeah.

That'S, that's great advice. He gives us a little more information here. Looks like. Oh no, sorry, this is Daniel. Sorry. This is Daniel's sale. It was one of the parcels he bought wholesale to learn different areas. Bought for three in Mojave county, sold for 6, 500 on a two year term. So that's pretty decent, I would think, selling the same.

That's a great deal.

Yeah, that's an amazing deal. And then Billy says they are all around 35, 35 to 50% value. So I mean, I love the $0.35 on the dollar values, right. If I, if I need inventory, if it's land in a good area that I know I'm going to sell, would I buy for 50 cents on the dollar? You bet I would. I buy wholesale all the time, right. So I think it's just a matter of, you know, are you, are you willing to take a little bit less of a profit on some of these, Billy? Can you talk them into maybe a little bit of a discount? Could you meet in the middle a lot of these counteroffers? We meet a lot of them in the middle, right? Buy, offer a thousand and they, they counter two. Most oftentimes we're meeting them in the middle with a conversation.

And maybe there's a couple that are good as, as is. Like Scott was saying, the 35 and the others, you just reach out to them and say, hey, sorry for my margins. I'm at, I'm at this, you know, and you might find like, you know, I can't tell you how many times I've negotiated down to half of what the person was asking, you know. And so you might find that some of those people come back and you'll get a smoking deal on, on some of those properties that you hadn't anticipated.

Yeah, it helps when you have six kids crying in the background and you're like, man, this is a family business for me. I can't pay you any more than a thousand dollars. I'll have a check in two days, I promise.

That's great.

Oh man. So Billy, hopefully that helps. Daniel Bryan says he found it because it had low light pollution. I've heard that one before. And wanted to own land where he could see the Milky Way. He closed within 12 hours. I love that.

Congratulations.

See, there's a pig for every barn, right?

Yeah.

That sounds, it sounds degrading, but it's not. That's.

We need something with like, there's a horse for every.

Yeah. We should go to Mark's clone and say, hey, could I have some different analogies for there's a pig for every barn that. That put land buyers in a positive light.

Oh, that's a good idea.

I like that.

Yeah. So I know you're doing it right now, John, but definitely doing it. Billy. Billy says my script was. I'm new. There you go. My mentor, My mentor said, don't go over 50 in market value on your first few deals. They accepted that rebuttal. There you go. That's. It's, you know, probably went, you know. You know, and you went into that conversation prepared. Right. So sit down and think about the conversation before you pick up the phone. You know, go through some of these scenarios in your head. But that's all. That's all really great stuff, guys. Thanks for. Thanks for sharing. I think we hit all the questions there. Well, there was one question about a deed, a special warranty. I don't know where that went. What do you see wrong with a special warranty deed? It's not that there's anything wrong with a special warranty deed. It's just, you know, we, ideally, we would love. What's that, Mike?

Preference.

It's preference. You know, ideally we'd like to buy and sell on a warranty deed because that's the strongest of all deeds. But have I bought and sold on a special warranty deed? Sure. Special warranty deeds are used a lot of times when there's a recent tax sale. It depends on the state. You got to look into the rules, that type of thing. But, but yeah, I mean that you guys could look into, you know, go to. Go to the, the all powerful search engine and, and look up differences between warranty and special warranty deed and quit claim deeds. And. And you'll probably see why we prefer warranty deeds. But we'll sell and buy and sell on other deeds as well, depending on the situation. So, John, what do you got for us? So.

So I just loaded up.

Oh, okay. I'm excited about this actually. Instead of there's a pig for every barn, there's a.

Okay. It's thinking. Oh, it says it's not sure about that one. Which means that Mark's gonna get an email from me.

I love it. I love it.

I like that. I like that. Mark is my. Mark is like my va for getting ridiculous answers related to.

To land. I don't, I don't. Did he ever say, did you talk to him ever about the Dr. Seuss rhyme that. That. That he came up with. That he came up with.

I think I did. I think he was proud.

He was proud. I'm sure he was. Oh, all right. Awesome. We do have another question from Andrew Pond. Andrew, good to see you. Maybe a side topic. A. This is very informal setting. We love side topics. We go off the rails. I mean, just what happens. He has a parcel in Arizona. Do you all consider mineral rights and how do you research that? Mike, you're on mute.

Most properties we buy do not have mineral rights. The property I own, my house, I don't have the mineral rights here. I mean, I think it's fairly common not to have those. It's a whole subset of study that you could just. Some people just do that entirely for their investing. So I'm not bothered if they don't have them. If they have them, great. If they don't, it does not bother me.

Yeah, we really don't worry about it a lot. Right. Especially with these. Especially with all these planted out subdivisions and if there's hope homes popping up in the area, like nobody's going to come in and want the minerals all of a sudden. So. So it's usually not something that we put too much weight in. Right. I think. What's that?

We don't perseverate over it. Is that right?

Separate over it.

Good job.

See, I'm rubbing off on you too.

We all just go up like 10 IQ points just being around you. Scott. It's great.

Yeah, I appreciate.

I appreciate that your nickname is Scrabble Warrior.

Jesus. I would kick your butt and Scrabble.

But I could have begun as luck. It would drive you crazy, wouldn't it?

It would. Oh, it totally would. I'm bringing Scrabble to this summit.

Yeah, I like it. I'm a big fan of the word Chi Q I. Yeah, that's the one.

That's the one.

You throw that cue on a triple. Triple word square.

It's the one. It's the one. Oh, man. You got a shout out here, Mike from one. Ah, Juan.

Yes. Great to have you. Yeah. He's thinking about doing investing the way we approach it. So he's. I told him coming here tonight would be helpful. I told him last week's show would be super helpful. We really. No, not just not petting ourselves in the back, but we crushed it. We went through the entire business model.

We did in an hour. And that's. That's a small feat. That's no small feat.

No, no.

Yeah.

Great to see you here, Juan.

We were talking. We even talked biblical units of measurement.

We did the cubit, a qubit.

Remember that, Mike?

I do remember, but I was trying to remember.

Your teacher gave you up your cube.

It he'd say, oh, up your cube.

Yeah. Anyway, it's just kind of a funny thing. Mr. Beerki, if you're watching right now, Mr. Beardy Beer Key, if you're watching right now, Mike Beerkey, you'd left a great impression on me because I have continued to use that. That gesture and phrase since freshman year of high school. Yeah.

I had a history teacher, and he would say, questions, comments, topics for discussion.

I love it.

Mine would say question, comments, accusations. I know, it took a negative turn.

Questions, comments, accusations. Oh, easy. We can incorporate into the podcast, perhaps questions, comments, topics for discussion.

Yeah, for sure. I'll pull it. I'll put a banner up. This is it. Juan, did we see your question? So, Juana, I'm actually looking for your question. Oh, there we go. There it is. Now I see it. If I'm just starting out, if I'm starting out with just $5,000 to acquire property.

Ah, good question.

How many letters do I send at a time? That is a good question. I think a lot of people have that question. They're starting out with 5,000. What do we do? I think we've had a whole podcast on this, haven't we?

Yeah.

If we start out with 5,000, how do we get going as quick as we can? I think that's a podcast topic recently.

Certainly is. But to give one a little insight, I. My. And I. He's heard from me, so you probably hear it like, let me. I'll say my piece. Let the two of you come in, because I think he wants probably a little bit different opinion as well. But when we do the flight school, we recommend 20 a day. I think that's a great number to build just a enough deal flow in the beginning to build your business. So to me, that is a great number that you could do if you had 5k. But what do you two of you think about that?

Yeah, I. I mean, I really like what you.

Go ahead, John. I'm sorry. No, you're right.

I would say. Yeah, I would say 20 to 30 is probably the number that I would.

That I would give.

And. And then I think that the big question with 5,000 is like, where are you mailing too? Right. You don't want to be buying properties for $5,000 a piece if you got $5,000. Right, right. Make sure you focus on the right budget. And the 5000 is a great budget to buy property and send mail and start building this business. So that would be my thought. What do you think, Scott?

Yeah, I agree. I think. I think just be consistent with mailings.

You concur?

I concur. I do concur. To be consistent with your mailings, I think 20 days probably a nice number, because, you know, if you do 20 a day, that's probably like 500 bucks a month. And with $5,000 to start, you should be able to afford that for a couple months. But here's the thing. After you send out your first 500, about three weeks from now, you're ideally going to have a property or more to buy, right? And you might want. Want to wholesale a few of those properties that you get in the queue initially, right. To create a little momentum for yourself and your business. And then once you wholesale a few, man, and the numbers come up in the bank account a little bit, mailing gets so that, you know, then you should really feel that you're able to be consistent with your mailing, I think.

Yeah.

Great, Great, Great idea.

Oh, thank you. That's really nice of you.

I have some pig for every barn. Synonyms.

I reverted to Mark or do you go to chat?

Gbt. I went to chat. I cheated on Mark to chat. GPT.

So. All right, let's hear it.

All right, here we go. There is a duck for every puddle. There is a. There is a cowbell for every cow. Let's see. Some of these are great. There's a llama for every Drama.

Oh, man, that's great. I love the duck one, actually. There's a duck for every puddle. For every puddle. I love that one. That's great. Oh, well, now. Now, whenever Mark says there's a pig for every barn, we'll just chuckle.

Yes.

There's also a duck for every puddle. This could be an ongoing game for years for sure. So. Awesome. Any other. There's a stripe for every tiger. Look at that. We got the community.

I like it.

Timing in now. There's a stripe for every tiger.

Just one. Just one stripe.

Awesome. Any other questions or comments? Awesome. Any other. There's a stripe for every tiger. Look at that. We got the community.

I like it.

Timing in now. There's a stripe for every tiger.

Just one. Just one stripe.

Awesome. Any other questions or comments, folks?

Oh, topics for discussion or topics for discussion?

Any. What's the. The other thing? Any. I'm having a blank right now. Sorry. All right, well, this is a nice Fun topic. Let's see what we're talking about next week, if you want to see what we're doing here. Next week. September 2nd. Already? September. The year's two thirds over.

All right.

I like this topic. I'm too busy for another. Another side hustle. So next week, tune in, and we're going to talk about time management, probably.

Right.

And. And maybe taking the. Taking a leap of faith as well, to. To get out of the pain that we're in, because we've all been there, too, right?

Yeah. Yep.

Look at Don Thrasher chiming in a fish for every lure.

How about a ring for every finger?

Oh, every finger. Ten rings.

Well, you can think of it as one thing.

Mike's got a lot of bling going on.

I mean, there's a. There's a. There's a person for you out there, right? A ring for every finger.

Okay. I like it.

It's good. It's good.

There's a B for every knee. I mean, we could go on for years. We could. These knees.

A sheep fell for every sweater.

Oh, no. Yeah, I love it. I like that a lot. Boy. We're coming up with all sorts of creative stuff on. On this show, but the most. The most creative thing to date. Oh, I'm gonna see if I can share the. You guys talk amongst yourselves for a minute.

Okay.

Oh, winner has a question.

Winner.

Let's see what your question is. And I'm going to do a little something here on my end to see if I can. Oh, and Don is a question as well. This is good. So you guys address this with Don. While I'm looking for what I'm looking for. How big of an issue is an HOA that advertises no fees? Kind of interesting.

Yeah.

Wow. I'll let you guys chat about that.

I don't generally love hoas. I've done work there. If there's no fees, that's better. But it doesn't mean there'll always be no fees. But, you know, I still try to steer clear of them if I can. Just an unknown variable. You know, they can vote on this, vote on that, up this, up that. Sometimes you'll find, like, let's try to steer clear of them if I can. Just an unknown variable. You know, they can vote on this, vote on that, up this, up that.

Sometimes you'll find, like, there's one area I invest. It's got a property owners association, and there are, like, optional dues of $25, which basically gets you into, like, this, like, club this Community club and you get a magazine and. And really what it comes down to is, like, they've got, like, sometimes. Kevin. Or they'll have, like, some restrictions, right? Things that you can or can't do on a property. Sometimes you'll look at these restrictions for the HOA and you're flipping through page one, page two, page three, all the way to page 28, and it's pretty intense, right? And so you're like, you just ask yourself the question, like, would I like. I mean, a lot of our people. Where did Mike go? We lose Mike like we did. I don't know. I can't see them. But anyways, if. If you're dealing with a POA that's. That has tons and tons of restrictions, then that's usually an indicator that. That that might be a tough one to sell, right? But sometimes I get a POA and it's like, you know, really mild restrictions. It's like, you know, basically follow zoning guidelines and no pigs, right. When I'm dealing with something like that, I don't really care that much, right? I. I would still buy, but sometimes what I'll do in that scenario is I'll just look at other comps. What are other. How are other people advertising properties in this area? Are they mentioning the hoa? How are they mentioning it? And that can be, you know, not a finite answer, but it'll. It'll give you some indication of how other people are treating that.

Very good point. I think sometimes it comes down to, if you're going to do it, what's the cost? What. What do they provide?

There's one area I invest. It's got a property owners association, and there are, like, options.

And, I mean, it's much easier not to deal with it, but there are some that are worth dealing with or if you can make the profit.

All right. I love it. Where'd you go, Mike?

I don't know. It just. I felt like you booted me out. I thought it was you. I thought the host evicted me.

If I did, it was inadvertent.

All right.

No, no, no additional dues of 25, which basically gets you into, like, this, like, club.

All right. Sorry about that. All right, we have another question from.

This community club and you get a magazine.

And.

And really what it comes down to is, like, they've got, like, sometimes Kevin, and they'll have, like, some restrictions, right? Things that you can or can't do on a property.

Winner, Winner, winner.

Can I quickly qualify many parcels to see if they are a good Fit to place a new mobile home on. Too many variables. What quick advice would you give?

What we do when we target an area is we target properties in one area, one subdivision, same use, same everything.

So sometimes you'll look at these restrictions for the HOA and you're flipping through page one.

Page two, if you want to quickly qualify many parcels mail to one area, you know everything about them like this.

Cool, John.

Yeah.

And I think like, I mean, like.

Like Mike was saying, when you deal with like an area with consistency, right? Like if you're dealing with a rural subdivision, they all have the same legal description, same zoning, same everything. It's pretty like from a. From a restrict, you know, or like a zoning suit. Page three, all the way to page 28. And it's pretty intense, right? And so you're like, you just ask yourself the question, like, would I like. I mean, a lot of our people, where did Mike go? We lose Mike.

We did.

I don't know. I can't see him. But anyways, if you're dealing with a POA that has tons and tons of restrictions standpoint, you're looking at the same thing. You can also just look at it on. If you are looking on Google maps or the GIS and you zoom out and there are 10 mobile homes, chances are you could put a mobile home there. Right. And so that can be a helpful indicator as well.

Like it.

I like it as well. All right.

Brock Edres had a question too.

Okay, what was that?

He said, hey, guys, when you mentioned consistency when advertising and not stopping after one ad, do you advertise the same property multiple times or just update the listing?

Yes.

Then that's usually an indicator that, that, that might be a tough one to sell.

Right?

But sometimes I.

So multiple times. Because if you take one property, try to advertise it to all the different. We call them avatars. Someone who's going to invest in land, buy now, pay use, bill later. Someone who's going to go camp on it. Someone's an rv, Someone who's going to hunt or rocks, collect rocks, or sky gaze. You have to create multiple ads to target those buyers. Even though it's just one property, you have to be very specific. So yeah. Yes.

Love it. You guys are. You guys are wealths of wisdom or wealth of wisdom.

Wisdom. We're a bunch of wow.

You're wows, both of you.

Do you have the.

I have it. I'm gonna see. I'm gonna see if this works. Okay, let's. Let's give it a shot.

Epic. This is epic. Is John all John?

Oh, there it is.

We gonna play that as an intro or an outro, something.

That.

That is amazing. That is amazing. We gotta, we gotta. I gotta do it again. I gotta do it again. The.

The bird get a poa. And it's like, you know, really mild restrictions. It's like, you know, basically follow zoning guidelines and no pigs. Right. When I'm dealing with something like that, I don't really care that much. Right. I. I would still buy.

It's whistling in the background. Just. And is that Mike Sandal? I think it's like that Mike Zano with a flannel and beer and beard and those glasses that I had.

That's epic.

The way you can tell it's AI is he eats his sandwich sideways. He's like, ah, like no human ever would.

You know, it's a very interesting way of eating a sandwich, for sure.

But sometimes what I'll do in that scenario is I'll just look at other comps. What are other. How are other people advertising properties in this area? Are they mentioning the hoa? How are they mentioning it? And that can be, you know, you.

Just did it for the commercial.

Oh, gosh. Oh, that was amazing. Daniel McAllen loves it. That's amazing. John, I, I may task you with coming up with like a 30 second AI opening with.

Oh, yeah, with this.

We might need a little music in the background. Or we can have Mark. Mark has the. He has the AI music generator thing. We should have him create a little 30 second opening for us. Yeah, I like it.

I love it.

All right, guys. Well, this was another fun evening.

Thank you all for coming.

A lot of great engagement. We had a lot of viewers, like over 40 viewers at one point, at one time, which is really cool.

Going viral.

Yeah, we're going viral. So bring your questions next week, I think next week. Again we're talking about what if I'm too busy to do this? And I think we've all felt that at one point or another as well. I mean, John with his 10 kids and Mike with his.

Not a finite answer, but it'll. It'll give you some indication of how other people are treating that.

A very good point. I think sometimes it comes down to if you're going to do it, what's it cost, what. What do they provide? And I mean, it's much easier not to deal with it, but there are some that are worth dealing with or if you can make the profit.

All right, I love it. Where'd you go, Mike?

I don't know, it just. I felt like you booted me out. I thought it was you. I thought the host.

Six, five kids and, you know, four kids. Yeah. Baloney music down. We gotta think about that. I don't know what I'm thinking. Banjo, maybe. I don't know. Baloney banjo music. But no Daniel Bryan. No Daniel Brian, You. You are awesome.

You're awesome.

You are awesome. Yeah. We appreciate all you guys chiming in. Thank you for coming and we'll see you next week. What's that, Mike?

Yeah. Thank you for coming.

Yeah. Cheers to everybody. Have a good night and we'll talk soon. Bye.

Bye.

Bye. Bye.

Bye.

Bye.