Revolutionizing Accounting: The Impact of Profit First on Small Businesses

Foreign. Welcome to Profit first beyond the Book, a podcast that takes you beyond the book with Profit first brought to you by Tim Duncan and the rest of the Profit First Professionals UK and Ireland. Hello, Vicki, how are you? It's really good to have you with me.

I'm loving the intro first of all, by the way, but, yeah, I'm really good. Thank you very much for having me.

You're welcome. You. I'm glad that you took up the offer to come and join us or join me today. And yeah, it's horrible listening to your own voice talking, isn't it? The intro comes on and I have to listen to it every time, but never mind, we get over these things and we move on. So, Vicky, look, you're one of our newly certified Profit First Professionals, so I really appreciate you taking up the offer to join me on the podcast today. And for people listening, Vicky joined us at the very beginning of March and within six weeks, Vicky certified. Now, normally people certify between eight and 12 weeks and I would say Vicky is one of the fastest people that's gone through certification in the last sort of three, three and a half years that we've been running Profit First Professionals in the uk. So I wanted to give you a special bit of praise and congratulations on that, Vicki.

Thank you very, very much. Yeah, January was when I originally wanted to join, but as many of us accountants know that January is a really busy and stressful time and I didn't want to overstretch myself, so I was raring to go. By the time March came around, I just couldn't and stop myself.

Fantastic. Well, you know, I, I often talk about how Profit first changed my life, which is true, joining Profit First Professionals changed my life. But actually when you really break it down, we change our own lives by taking action. So the fact that you've first of all joined Proper First Professionals, then you've whiz through certification and now you're taking things to the next stage with us is, is amazing and testament to your, your character, I would say so. So well done. So, Vicky, I want to, I want to talk about you and your business to start off with. So, you know, tell us about your journey and how you came to set your business up. You know, maybe what you did before that, what led you to running an accountancy business?

Well, I never wanted to be an accountant. My business partner, Millie always did. So we came at this from very different angles. I worked in insurance, then in banking, and then naturally accountancy just came from there. When I first got into Accounts I was doing, I suppose basic bookkeeping, basic spreadsheet work, but then it would always go off at the end of the month to someone else. And I never saw what that looked like. And it just got my interest then and I thought, okay, right, here we go, let's sign up to see what accountants has got to offer. And then I've never looked back. So I've been in various jobs, various industries, government bodies, small businesses, large businesses, international businesses, kind of everything. And then you get to a point where you've qualified, you want to move up the career ladder. So obviously there were some natural changes in industry there. But you do get to a ceiling where you are the most senior person, senior accountant, senior finance lead manager or whatever. And I thought I was a bit sick of making money for other people. Don't get me wrong, I did make money and I also worked for quite a few tyrants back in the day. And so then we started taking or I started taking smaller bookkeeping clients and kind of studied and qualified along the way. And then I met some other people. So I met an old director at uni. We did our first round of qualifications to get and then I went on to do the next level and met what is now my current director, Millie. We were various stages of our lives I suppose like my kids are older so I've got a 16 year old and a 22 year old. They either didn't or they were just starting on their kind of family journey. And so we would trade clients between each other and then we got to a point and thought why are we doing this? And so in 2016 people we set up together. So I left full time employment. They then were working part time, evenings, weekends, until the point that we had so many clients that we could all work kind of full time or work for no one else. And so yeah, that was back in 2016. Lots has happened along the way we are, we've never seemed to take a dipping clients. It's gone from strength. They've got a really loyal client bank. They constantly keep recommending us. So word of mouth is really key for us. Cheapest and best form of advertising. We do the normal stuff, network social media, all of that but we just haven't stopped having client inquiries and it's, it's wonderful rolling forward to how profit first that came into our lives was. I can't even remember how I found it but I someone told me to read the book and so I took the book on mine and Millie's annual holiday. So we always go on holiday for two weeks every year. And I couldn't put the bloody thing down. Like, I was reading it, reading it. I was like, a few days into the holiday reading it. I was, like, itching to get home to get my laptop, like, get a spreadsheet going, like, started working out some figures. I was obsessed. So sat on the said lounger and I was opening all the bank accounts right there and then and, like, counting down the days so I can go home and actually start looking at my numbers. So kind of October, I think I started to really look at what can I do with this? Started following you guys, started conversations, and then as you said, yeah, it came up that we can commit to the January cohort. Joined in March. And I, yeah, love a life. I look forward to Fridays when I do my applications. Yeah, it's great. And that's how we were born and how now Profit first has entered our lives and it won't be leaving anytime soon.

Fantastic, thanks. Thanks, Vicki. I appreciate that. And, yeah, it's interesting. You're not the only person who's told me they took Profit first on holiday with them and read it and couldn't put it back. So it must create the most boring holiday for the rest of our families. But this is the reality. This is what people do and what I like about. Obviously, the book is an amazing tool and a starting point as a resource, and it is interactive, isn't it? There are things you can do from the book, but what we like to sort of highlight, especially with this podcast, is the things that we can take people that you don't get from the book, and that comes from sharing our experience and knowledge of working with members and working with clients for a long time. So. So, Vicki, what have you seen? So since you joined. I know it's only been a short time. You know, we're talking three months, aren't we? So what's the difference? What difference have you seen within your own business with Profit first and implementing.

It into your business? I think the real takeaway is exactly what Mike goes through and many of us actual business owners go through where there's too much money and not enough money. We all feel that burden. You know, many of us start our businesses and we're working from the hobbit hole underneath our stairs. We're working all the hours God sends. No one says thanks. And we hit that place where you just think, why am I doing it? And we. I felt like even after so many years that we were really successful in business until I read the book and heard other people's stories to how they got to where they are. It was like, oh, we all do it. Like, we all go through the same process. And you do almost have to hit the bottom where you're working. You need to pay your bills, but you've got staff, they need paying first or, you know, and yeah, we, we hit a bottom without even realizing that I was at a bottom, I suppose. So I guess the key takeaway is actually having that understanding of when things are bad. You don't need to give up because you could quit your business, go and work in a supermarket or whatever. There's still too much month at the end of your money. Like, you know. But yeah, it's made a massive difference. I. This is going to sound slightly arrogant, but it's really nice to know that there is money, money in the bank account. I've never seen so much money accumulating in my bank account. And that's not to say that like, it's just because of clients coming in. For once, I really feel like I can pay my tax bills, I can pay the staff without worrying about it. I can actually pay myself finally for the, the risk that we take as business owners. So the biggest thing was just that realization that something needed to change. You know, we've all been through it and it's taking that positive action and now I'm seeing those positive things. Don't get me wrong, the money doesn't stay in there long. It goes to the tax man or it goes wherever it needs to go. But not having to have sleepless nights about not having money in my bank account, that is the biggest thing is it's a game changer.

Yeah. And do you feel that because of profit first, it provides more strategic intent on what the money's for and it goes into the different places with, with complete content intent. Sorry.

Yeah. I think when I talk about profit first to clients and prospects, we basically, to anyone, it is, and we know it is a behavior based system. Like I wasn't behaving very well with my money, even though I thought I worked their own. Oh, it's okay. We'll pay for delivery or go out for a team building or whatever. Yeah, I definitely am more purposeful with my money. I, I think it's really important to, to be that way. I, I like all the things that I specifically talk to my prospects and my clients about is, you know, using that money with purpose and being able to be innovative. You know, we're in many different industries, but we're all in the same world where costs are going up, we have to find ways to live a nice life, have a good business, and we have. That comes with that innovation. So, yeah, it's been a master buy opener for me. Profit first. And I'm living my best life with it.

Fantastic to hear. Fantastic to hear. That is. And, and would you say, sorry, grilling you now, but would you say that implementing from the book is different to implementing as a Profit first professional member?

I mean, implementing from the book is a really good place to start. What I've learned as we have our cause and I talk to other professionals, is you have to have that starting point. There are lots of other variables that can influence those percentages, those decisions, but ultimately you need that place to start. I've evolved since the book, not only with our own business, but possibly the way that I would explain that to other people. But I think the main point about the book and then how we function with it now, knowing a bit more, is it's just having that honest conversation with yourself that you've got to start somewhere. And the book is an incredible place to start somewhere.

Absolutely. Totally agree. Yeah, thanks. Thanks for sharing that, Vicki. I know I put it on the spot a little bit with that one.

That's okay.

So, so I, I also want to highlight, before we move on to the, to the slightly next topic, I want to highlight the fact that I, I was in a situation when I first found Profit first and then I first found profit first professionals became a member and it changed everything for me. But I was stuck in that month to month cycle of money in, money out, yet paying yourself last. The classic. I always think of myself as I was in that classic position that the book was written for. I was that ideal kind of client that Mike was aiming that, that, that too, which is why it's worked so well for me, I guess. And I just want to highlight that there are a lot of accountants and bookkeepers out there that are doing the same thing because we don't know any different. And so we're trying to. Reading the book is a great starting point, you're right, because it is a starting point to actually start moving your money into different pots and having a strategy about managing your cash. So we would urge anyone listening to this to actually make a start with profit first, even if it is just opening up a profit pot and putting 1% of your income into that pot. Because if you can't afford to do that, you've got a serious problem and you really need to talk to Us quickly. If you can afford to do it, do it after three months. Let us know how you've got on. Have you paid yourself your property reward at the end of that? So just thought I'd share that, take the opportunity to share that with the listeners. Vicky so now you're going through certification, you've implemented in your own business. The next stage is implementing with some beta clients. So how did that feel going through that process and how have your clients that you've worked with reacted to the things that you've helped them with?

I think I was quite excited to go through it with a few clients on the beta stage, mainly to just kind of practice what I was preaching. But I was nervous because when you do that assessment, it is like hitting someone with a spade in the face. It's like an awful tax bill, isn't it? It's that realization that, oh, I thought I was doing well. You know, many business owners are bank balanced. They look and think, oh yeah, I've got like 20 grand in my bank and they think, oh yeah, my business is doing great. So I was excited to, to be able to share that opportunity. I was excited to be able to show our experience, to prove that the system works. But I was nervous that I was going to be giving some other business owners the stark reality of should you be in business, like what is happening here. But I went through the process and as you know, I streamlined the way that I do that. The assessments are pretty streamlined and they are the starting position. What I had decided to do within that starting position as well is not go back over previous financials. I didn't want to rub salt in the wounds. I suppose I wanted to look at the last three months alone and use that as our starting point. Because if you'd got to a point where you think you need that help and profit first, what's the point terrorizing yourself and going back over 12 months financials or 24 months financials. So that was quite reassuring that I then didn't want to delve into the potential, I don't know, mess or whatever that was and stir up even more emotions for them. But everyone that I did the testing with, I was met really positively. They also had read the book or I'd given them my book to read. So my book is, I don't even know where my book is at the moment. It's being passed around. It's gone, it's gone on its travels and everyone is really positive when they've got the book. And the thing that comes out most is that, oh yeah, that sounds really simple. Like why haven't I been doing this before? And I've got quite a few business owners that are loosely operating profit first, which are easier to work with in terms of the transition, which is, but it's been met really well and out of the three betas, none of them knew proper first. And interestingly enough, more people I speak to about it, they've never heard about it either. So I'm a massive advocate. Let's spread the awareness, let's get it just firmly in people's minds so that they know that this system does work and does exist.

Absolutely. And I love your analogy. I kind of had in my head that you were like the grim reaper giving them the profit assessment to say this is the story of doom. But it's okay because now I'm a superhero, superhero outfit and saying this is where I'm going to take you. I, I, I love, I love because now I'll be honest, my, my profit assessment. I was very overwhelmed when I first did profit setting for myself. But my profit first guy lives in the U.S. she reassured me, made me feel, actually it's okay. This is the reality. Get over it. This is where you're at now. We're going to move you forward and this is what we're going to do. And I think that's the key point, isn't it? Yeah, you're giving people a harsh reality, but you're actually going to help them move forward with a, with a proactive plan and a sort of forward thinking framework to follow. And yeah, you know, you said.

You.

Said about only working the last three months for your beta clients. Now that's really interesting because if you look at the book, Mike will say take the last 12 months P L, get your balance sheet, get your cash flow forecast and put all the information in and let's see what your profit assessment tells you, how you've been using your cash. Historically, we, we like to think about profit first professionals working in the future. So actually when, when I would do a profit assessment with a client, I must say I only do it with members. Like when I was still working with, with businesses directly, I would take into account their historical stuff, but I would want to know what's happening now and what plans they've got moving forward. You know, are they hiring a new employee? You know, have they committed to renting somewhere that perhaps isn't in the previous figures? And I would build that in. So I'd almost do a profit assessment on what I know about or is happening right now, not what happened 12 months ago.

Yeah.

Key point, isn't it? We work in the. We work in the future. Profit first professionals, not the past.

Absolutely.

So. So, yeah, it stands us out from the normal accountants and bookkeepers, perhaps, that are being reactive. We've got that proactive way. So that is your top tip, that is profit first beyond the book, because you only worked on the current information when you did the profit assessment and I love that.

Yeah, absolutely.

Yeah. And so the clients that you've worked with, it's only been a short time. What's the reaction to. What are their thoughts? Have they said anything if you spoke to them recently?

Yes. So I already know that bank accounts have already been set up with two of them. With the third one, actually, we're going through some structural changes which we will apply a profit first once we have ironed that out. But the other two, they are opening the bank. Sorry, opening the bank accounts and continuing to start, I guess, being more purposeful with their money. So, yeah, it was all really positive and I will catch up with them again soon. But they took it on board. Bank accounts were all open software, all connected. Yeah, it's all really good. I've had a couple of other inquiries about it and also just other professionals that then want to talk to me about it, which is great. So hopefully I'll appear on some other podcasts and talk about profit first because they didn't know about it before I mentioned it. So it's certainly a really good topic of conversation. And because it is flipping accountancy on its head and making a real difference, we all know that money is really emotive when you haven't got it, it's very stressful. But I don't want to be a reactive accountant. I want to have that opportunity where I've done their set of accounts and they have a tax bill at the end, then I can have that conversation. Conversation was with them about, have you prepared for this? Or I can see in your accounts that you haven't prepared for it. This is what I want to do for you. So it's, it's opened up doors for future conversations with my clients to spread the word. Even more.

Absolutely, yeah. And it, that's what it's all about, isn't it? Looking ahead and, and that's where the value is. So, you know, when people say, you know, let's move into advisory, what does advisory mean? But there, there's. There's value advisory straight away, you know, I can see that you haven't got your tax saved up. I can help you with that if we, if we were, you know, sort it out right now and then I can look ahead and see what your future tax bill is going to be and we can start preparing for that as well and we can start building up those pots of money is, you know, even vat, Vicki, isn't it? You know, it's amazing how many people that, like you said, you said just now that you've got £20,000 in their bank. So you look at their bank account and they think it's fine. What they're probably forgetting is maybe 15,000 of that is for their VAT bill due at the beginning of July, you know, so these things happen, don't they? And this is the real world money issues that all businesses have and Profit first can solve all those problems when applied properly and especially with the support of a Profit first professional. Adding that accountability, adding that advice and bringing the framework to life for them. So yeah, fantastic. What does the future hold then? Vic, you said you want to work with people proactively. What does that look putting you on the spot now? What does that look like?

Well, there are some exciting developments in pbthq so we're just about to move offices and increase our staff bank and we now know with Profit first and our money in our bank balances that we can afford it. So that is insane. It's only happened yesterday and I'm so excited.

Congratulations.

What? It also means that we're going to have some structural changes so that I can get out of doing the doing, I suppose and really have those meetings with clients, get under the skin of their finances and then move into that are very much needed advisory role. So not only does it free up my time to do more profit first things, but it gives me that time to really help clients rather than just being, oh, you've sent me your forms in, here's your tax return. Job done. It doesn't give me any opportunity to work with them properly. I want to really get a better relationship with our clients, the ones that want to work with us on a more meaningful level. So, so that's really exciting in terms of our journey. As you know, you said, I'm newly certified, got my certificate, I'm going out and about talking about it. I mentioned to you when we were off air about going to a conference this weekend, you know that I'm part of another networking group. It's our national conference this weekend. And a snippet that I took away from our conversations On Monday with Jason about, you know, just making subtle changes. Well, I made a subtle change to just my bio on the app so all the attendees can now see what I do, what I'm all about, kind of what my journey was. And I changed my job title to Proper First Accountant and now I've got people asking if they can have a meet up at the conference, which is really exciting. I can't see any other accountants in their A, Profit First Professionals or B, even have their title as accountant. So yeah, I'm really excited that it's going to open up some other doors for me this weekend to start talking to other accountants and other business owners about it at a big conference.

Amazing, amazing. Well done. There you go. And one small little change to your bio has already created interest and people want to talk with you, which is fantastic. And this is what it's about, isn't it? Standing out from what is a competitive market. There's a lot of accountants and bookkeepers around, so standing out is really key. Being able to say you're a certified Profit first professional, Profit First Accountant, etc. Is key. Key to that. So well done and well done for listening to Jason. He comes out with some gems on our course on a Monday.

He really does.

Yeah, yeah, it is great fun. So, so if anyone. So business owners, if you're listening to.

This.

Vicki, how can they contact you? We might see something come on the banner. Now look, there's a bit of a clue. If you're watching on video, you'll see this. If you're listening, you might need to tell them yes.

So we've got a dedicated Profit first page on our website. So we are pbt. Accountants say you can find us on, on all kinds of social media channels. LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram. I'm not yet ready to delve into the likes of Tick Tock yet, but maybe. I know Stephen Edwards does a cracking job as a Profit first professional on TikTok. I watch him and I follow him. So yeah, all over social media you can find us on the website. Like I said, we've got a dedicated page first so www.pbtaccav.co.uk and there's a contact us booking a discovery call there various ways to get in touch to see how that we can help you as a small business owner increase your bank balance 1% at a time. I use that load.

You've got it. Yeah, why not? It's true though. Do you know what Profit first is isn't something that's a quick fix but it very quickly shows you what you need to fix in your business and it has the framework to help you do it in a strategic way over a period of time by creating new habits. And it's that simple. So 1% at a time, I love that because everything is in small steps. If we try and do one giant strike, we never take that step. But a small step we can take and I think that works with. It's great advice, Vicki. Thanks for sharing that.

Thank you.

And I'm going to put you on a spot one last time. So we've talked about business owners listening. If there's an accountant and bookkeeper listening, thinking about what's all this about with profit first, what would you say to them?

I would definitely start by reading the book. I would also definitely start by reaching out to another profit first professional. I think one of the things that I've learned, especially from my wider network is that business and accountancy can be quite a lonely place. There's always somebody just at the end of the phone, especially in my wider network and also first network, that won't see you as a competitor. It's about collaboration and sharing the knowledge that we have. So in my network I meet people, lots of other accountants, actually. We're all slightly different. I don't know if we've got a profit first professional anywhere else in my network. So I'm more than happy to share that we don't find ourselves competing against each other. We've also always got a slightly different skill set and the same with any of the property first professionals in our area. It's about collaboration. I'm new to the table. There's plenty of other people who have done things, do things a different way and got much more experience than I do. But there is definitely no competition there. It is all about collaboration. So I guess my point is for other accountants and bookkeepers out there, just reach out to one of us. We are a friendly bunch. We've got a lot of love and a lot of knowledge to share. So don't be afraid to ask the question, even if you're just scrambling, scratching the surface, just thinking about getting involved or you're in the position that we all start with where there's too much month, not enough money, it happens to us all. There's no shame, you know, admitting it. Just reach out, get in touch.

Fantastic. Thanks, Vicky. Vicky, it's been a pleasure having you on. I always enjoy you joining our cause. You get, you're very enthusiastic. I'm very open to sharing your thoughts. And your current situations, etc. And it's so good that you've taken action so quickly to make the change in your own business. I love that you love Fridays when you do your allocations. I did hear that. So that's a great note to end on this coming Friday. Enjoy your allocations. It helps you have that purpose and excitement that you're in control of your money.

Thank you very, very much. I am super excited to have been here today. Thank you.

Thank you for joining us on our podcast today. Profit First Beyond. The book was brought to you by the Profit First Professionals UK and Ireland team. If you'd like to find out more about Profit first or becoming a Profit First Professional, head to our website, profitfirstuk.co.uk.