MoneyTalks: Digital Marketing One-on-One

of stopping and starting, but I'm glad we're connected. Is Grant with us?

I am, yeah.

Great. Oh, I can barely hear Grant. Are you in the same room?

He rolled over to his desk. He's going to roll back.

Fantastic. Well, thanks very much for setting the time. I'm looking forward to it. I used to listen to Michael Campbell's show many years ago. Yeah, a few years ago. I would listen because I'd catch the last 10 or 15 minutes or so because he used to be up against the technology show, or maybe he was after it or something. So I would always kind of tune in and get a few minutes of some sage advice as well. So it was nice to see that. Now we are connected through Kathy Hurst, is that right? How do you know Kathy?

Because she repped Mike for quite a while when she was with Speaker Spotlight.

Ah, okay, great. Excellent. Well, I'm looking forward to it. And let's sort of chat about— I think the best way to start is talk about what you're trying to achieve, or what sort of top-level questions you have, and we can dive in from there.

Okay. Do you want to go, Grant? Sure.

Yeah, the timing is excellent, Todd, because we're actually just sort of going through that strategic review with Mike and the rest of the team in the last week or so. And we are looking at making a fairly across-the-board brand shift. And up until now, the website's been, and by extension, the database communication and very preliminary with the social media, has been an extension of the original radio model, which was, you know, delivering the best analysis and financial market information possible through introducing people to analysts and through Mike's specific comments. And so we were pretty much 100% dedicated to providing a free online service that was an extension of what people came to expect from the radio show. And what's changed and what we want to move towards is our actual business model was driven primarily by our live event component. So we put on one big event every year called the World Outlook Financial Conference, and then we would put on smaller events through the year. And that was our primary revenue generator. Our relationship with Corus is a very, very good one, but it's not a huge revenue source for us.

And how does that model work? Are you sort of like similar shows on the network where you buy the hour of airtime and you sell the ads yourself? Or are they paying like a fee to Michael for the time?

Yeah, exactly. We're actually— still working on the model that Michael negotiated almost 20-something years ago. He's still an employee of, of Corus.

Ah, okay.

And the business has, has built out from that radio platform significantly over the last 20 years, but he still has that original relationship where he's paid on-air talent And then everything— and Corus sells, you know, obviously makes their money selling airtime around the Saturday show, which is syndicated throughout Western Canada and parts of Southern Ontario, the Monday to Friday market commentary that he does, which is also syndicated throughout most of Western Canada. But what's happened over the last few years is A good chunk of that ad revenue is actually coming through us. It's our clients that are buying sponsorship packages that include radio. But the other major shift is we are now selling online product directly which is sort of the new factor there. In the last 2 years we sell Michael's Market Commentary which is a paid subscription service, and then a lot of online video from our live events. And we kind of crested this past February, or this February, about 3 weeks ago we did our World Outlook Conference and we're probably going to sell more online video than we did tickets. Which kind of was a tipping point for us to say, okay, well, it's probably time for us to revisit the actual intent of the website overall. It's probably not in our ongoing business, it's not to our best advantage to just strictly be a source of free analysis and information. We want to shift to it being a destination for people that are looking to improve their investment results and are willing to pay for that opportunity.

Yeah, of course. So I'm just looking at the website now. Can you see it up on my screen? Yeah, for sure. So this looks like— is it a hard-coded site, like something you generated yourself?

Yeah, so we built this ourselves. We have a a full-time IT group that's contracted to us, plus we have a full-time web editor. So we are paying essentially the equivalent of 2 full-time salaries just to manage the website currently.

Yeah, sure. Gotcha. Well, there's lots we can talk about. Why don't we talk first a bit about the website itself and then talk a bit about social. Is that helpful?

Yeah, absolutely.

Did you have any sort of specific things you wanted to achieve on the call, or do you want to sort of do a massive brain dump of suggestions and recommendations?

I think that would probably be most helpful, because then we could filter out and then circle back if we'd like to talk about specific development from there. Yeah, for sure.

So tell me a bit about what is the highest revenue generator off the website?

The highest revenue generator right now would be online streaming video. So we sell two types of video, either direct recordings of the live events or what we call our how-to style video, which is just that. It's a video that we produce on a specific topic, how to trade options, how to How to make money in currency, that kind of thing.

So these are pre-recorded videos, I guess, are they? That once you subscribe to, you get access to a page somewhere on the website where the video is embedded?

Correct.

Okay, gotcha. And where are you finding the leads for these? Most of them coming because they've heard it on the radio, or most of them are they— did they hear Michael at a conference?

No, it's still primarily through the radio.

And at our events.

And at our events, but the primary audience is still the radio audience by quite a large margin. The listening reach right now for the various things that we do, that Michael does, is somewhere between 400,000 and 500,000 people a week depending on the time of year. For the website, we're looking at sort of 3,500 5,000 unique visitors a day, again depending on the time of year.

Gotcha. Great. I'm just making some notes here as well. And by the way, I'm recording this session, so I'll send you a complete video copy of it afterwards, so you'll be able to review it at your leisure if you'd rather not take notes right now.

Okay.

So the first thing that strikes me is the website sort of is showing its age. It doesn't look like— it's got lots of information in it, but it's not very strong when it comes to conversion. And there are some great website tools out there to really enforce, to really kind of blow that conversion through the roof and get more sales. And part of the challenge that you are dealing with is you've got so much stuff, and yet you are putting all of your free content is the one driving stuff. If someone had said, "Oh, I just went to see Michael Campbell at this great conference," or "I heard him on the radio. I want more," there is nothing on this page that drives me to those products. And this is obviously what I'm seeing which is the top-level page here. In fact, the only conversion thing that I can see here is this which is the which is the forum which I guess is a free newsletter, right?

Yeah, we offer that as well. Your point is very well taken and it's basically right where we are at from a development standpoint. The driving rationale like literally until now has been to be a destination for free information distribution. And the back end of the store has really just been a platform for people to buy. The site has not, as you pointed out, has not been looked at and designed and approached as a conversion tool.

Yeah, definitely. So one of the things you'll want to do obviously is move some of this stuff up. And perhaps I would avoid banner ads like this one up top. Obviously there is a revenue generator there. You are selling those positions. But people tend to not really see those anymore. So I would actually avoid using buttons like this, but rather have some sort of a stronger conversion area. Like you may actually want to blow— a lot of this stuff, so all of this up-to-the-minute analysis, is that Michael's analysis or is that pulled from an RSS feed of someone else?

It's almost all pulled from people that we have a relationship with. So we have a full-time editor who just basically mines his relationship of analysts to solicit.

And the point of that initially was so that there was always fresh content on the website to drive people to check it a few times a day kind of thing.

Yeah, absolutely. Well, here's the problem with that. That makes a lot of sense, and that used to make sense even more so back in the day when there just wasn't that much content, and certainly wasn't that stuff that was well organized. But there's tons of places for people to get this content, and so we are not really finding what used to be, which is you had the right strategy a few years ago which is put lots of content there and then we will hope that people bookmark the page and go back to it once or twice a day. People just don't really do that anymore because they've got so many different options. A lot of people are getting their news through Twitter and Facebook now. Even financial news, they are subscribing to those feeds. Some are, the more techie people are doing RSS feeds. So I would actually take a lot of this area out. In fact, I would take almost all of this out and replace it with some of that conversion stuff, like moving some of these store things up front. So like a nice graphic around this commentary service, a couple of graphics around the VIP video package. Have the buttons read "More Information" and maybe a second one that says "Buy Now." The buttons can both go to the same place, but it moves people a little further down the pipeline. You certainly don't want to replace the home page with this page, but you need some of this stuff kind of up in the front area. So let me just pull open a really quick graphic maker here, and I'll show you sort of what I'm thinking. Okay, so we'll deal with this. So this area up here I would actually take that and move it off to the right and just put headlines in and keep it to kind of this size. And this area which is the prime area where people are going to be, that is where you would put instead of up-to-the-minute analysis it would be stuff related to what he is selling. So market commentary service with 2 or 3 sentences about that. The video package, maybe all you need is just this text and then a button that says "More Information" that drives people to that sales page. It would be great if these would have, and it doesn't look like they do. Let me just double-check. No, they don't. It would be great if these have their own separate pages so that you can have people go directly to it. It also gives Michael an opportunity if someone, let's say asks a question. I do a lot of keynote speeches as well, so often you will get a question where someone will say, I'm really interested in emergency gold. And he can talk a bit about it. And he can say, also if you just go to MoneyTalks.net/gold you will get the page. Actually, it looks like for that one you've got it. You've got a separate page.

Some of them we have done it, and some of them we haven't been consistent with it, that's for sure.

Yeah, and I would move this form area, I would move this up to the top just so people can see where to buy. It's not very clear. But for each of these, for this World Video Conference, for this VIP package, all of those should have their own page and really should be moved up to the front area. Have you got a professional designer working with you, or are you thinking of going to like a WordPress theme for this?

We've used the IT guys that that we've been working with for the last couple years, but they don't really have a quality graphic designer in-house. So it's one of the things we're talking about right now is whether it's time to bring in an outside designer.

It's time. It's time. I love IT guys. I used to be one. I guess in some respects I still am. But IT guys design for information. And what you need to do is design for conversion, for sales. So you are going to get from IT guys that don't have a design background, you are going to get a page that looks like this. It's going to be full of text. It's going to be pulled largely automated through RSS feeds or some other system. And it's kind of cluttered. In fact, if you notice when I shrink the size of my window down, you can't even fill in this form at all anymore.

Right. Right.

So definitely I would look at having them do a designer. Another option that is really strong is to use a WordPress-based theme. WordPress is pretty incredible these days. It used to be— let me just show you what a basic WordPress, basic WordPress blog theme looks like. This is the way that most people sort of see them. There we go. It's very basic looking. I would argue still probably cleaner than the one that you've got now, but easier to update because you just log into the back end and change the text wherever you want. But the real advantage to this is you can sort of experiment with different themes. So let me show you just really quickly what my page looks like which you've seen because you were on it once. It has sort of a similar similar look and feel. It's got the buttons across the top. But it's got some nice things. So you can see here I can scroll through images, and each of these are clickable. I hate looking at pictures of myself. Ugh. So one way of designing it could be one of these images on this sort of cycling through thing could be about the video series. One could be about a conference coming up. It kind of moves it through. Then all of these can have forms built in. But just to show you the differences, I'll show you my company's website, my digital agency's website. And it looks remarkably different. So now we've got menus that sort of scroll down across the top, big huge friendly images, really easy to put these sort of columns in. You can embed video right on the actual screen itself. And this also is driven from WordPress. So there are so many different options. In fact, you could even just do WordPress financial advisor theme, and you will get like pages and pages of websites that are devoted to people who are selling similar type of stuff. And you see the difference in the design styles, right? There's really quite a few. And most of these, WordPress itself is free to install. There is some setup time. Obviously your IT guys are going to want to set it up. These themes are usually $50 or $60 and that's about it. I'm just scrolling through to see one that might work for him. Well, here's an older school version. That's what we want to avoid. It's sort of a little bit of what you are looking at right now. But it would be nice to kind of have his brand up there. This actually might work kind of nicely as well. Let me just go to the live demo here. So you get a nice image of Michael up at the top because he is the brand. Perhaps down here, so this would be an area where you would put in a "watch video," Subscribe to Michael's thing, nice clean images. It all comes with the theme. And it doesn't break. Because all you are doing is changing just the text, you can't break the design. I will show you what it looks like on the back end for one of my pages here. Bear with me. Have you done much in WordPress? Have you seen what it looks like at the back end?

No, we haven't. I guess my first thought is how would we— our site is unfortunately an older version of Joomla.

Oh, it's a Joomla, okay.

And it has all kinds of— because the editor is not a tech person, we've had to build all kinds of self-pub systems for him, plus the connection from the— to the actual online store. Is WordPress the kind of overlay that we can fairly easily add to that underlying programming?

Well, WordPress and Joomla are similar in the sense that they are both content marketing, or they are both content publishing platforms. So Joomla has a backend where you can edit, you can post your content. And WordPress is very similar. So here is an example of one of my pages. So it's got all the design all laid in. And the back end of that looks like this. So really, excuse me, really all I've got access to is I can change the headline. I can change the text. And that's really about it. If I want to, I can adjust it on the side. But really easily, if you decide that on the right-hand sidebar of a page you want his information about goals, You just select the gold page. So it's really simple. It's kind of point-and-click. And it doesn't break the design. It makes the design kind of stable and everything. It grows with you. But Joomla! is a similar system. Joomla! is actually a bigger system. It's more, I would say more detailed. But the downside of it of course is that because it is more detailed it ends up being quite, difficult to manage sometimes is what you are running into there.

Yeah, I mean just the sheer volume of editorial and content that we are posting is some— I think that is also part of our revision is we are proposing to step away from that where we are going to be drastically reducing the amount of content we are going to offer.

Yeah, I think that's smart. Or put it behind paywalls. Put it behind the newsletter so people can get access to it. One of the things that if you are generating a lot of different leads from it, you can use a service. I use Unbounce for this, and it's a landing page optimizer. So what it means is that you can create different versions of the same page and learn which ones convert best.. So for example, let's go to store because that's a converting one. And let's go down to one of these that you've got like the Emergency Gold Summit for instance. So here right away we've got his brand up top which is great, but you've got to scroll down. You don't even know that you can buy it actually right on the front page. You've got to scroll down to the bottom to learn that. And one of the nice things about Unbounce and all these sort of similar landing pages I'll just log in to show you what my account looks like. You can create these really simply, different variations. So you would say Create a Page, and you get some templates to begin with. So let's just find a fairly basic one. This would be a nice one for you. Save and Start Editing. Let me move my window here so you can see it better. So here you can put Michael's head here. You get a nice image or perhaps a teaser video. The headline could say, "Buy gold or lose your children." I don't recommend that copy. You can move it around. You can change really easily. All I'm doing is I'm just double-clicking on these. Change what it is. Learn more. And then once you've got that, we will save this particular— we call this Variant 1 because it is the first one that we are working on. So we will save that version.

Excuse me.

And then you say duplicate. So we are going to create a second variant of it. So let's go back to create a duplicate. There it is, Variant 1. So now in this case we are going to say, I think we are going to see what it looks like. We will see whether we get more conversions with the video on the right. We will move this down here. We will give more room for the header. I don't want the button to say "Learn More." I want this one to say "Buy Now." And I think the color should be different. So it's really easy to kind of go through and change it. And then we will save that variation. Now obviously you want to make more changes to it. Once we've saved it, we'll go back to the main window and I'll show you how these work. So we have 2 variants now. You can see this, right? So we've got the first variant that we did, and then the copy which was the one that we'll call this Blue Button Video on Right. And then we say, and this is the really cool part, is we say, okay, we want to say that when people come to our website We want 50% of them to see the first variant, but 50% of them will see the second variant, if you are following me. And over the course of a couple of weeks, a couple of months, you will see which one performs better, and then you can pause the ones that are underperforming. So let me show you some sort of real-world examples of what it looks like at my end. Here is a system that I used. It was selling an eBook that I did 400 years ago. Does this one not have— oh, I may have already awarded the winner on that one.

Let's see.

Yeah, it looks like I have already awarded the winner on these unfortunately. But anyway, what you would be able to do is you would see here, you would see— well, actually, sorry, you can see it. So it served this page to 253 people. And I will show you what that one looked like. So not great design. I'm not a great designer, but very basic, very simple. And then this variant, a little bit more information. So I had more content here. I had some testimonials. I had a smaller book cover. I think I probably changed this form a little bit. So we had those 2 variants running. And even though I got roughly the same number of visitors, you can see that the simpler version I got 60 conversions instead of 42 conversions. So over time you get a really good sense of which one is performing better. And you just say, okay, we call this one the champion. This one wins. And you start to move it a lot closer. And they are very easy. You can see it's just drag and drop. Very easy to set up. But yeah, for sure I would definitely look at hiring someone whose specialty is WordPress design. The copy, since it is already in Joomla, it will be pretty easy. I think there is actually even a Joomla to WordPress migration. Let's see. Yeah, so there is already actually a plug-in that will do this for you. It will take all your Joomla posts, articles, pages, images, all your kind of stuff, and it will automatically dump it into your new WordPress structure. So you won't have to recode, or you won't have to redo any of that stuff. But your biggest problem when it comes to conversion is I don't know if I'm coming— if I'm on the website and I want to buy something from Michael, or maybe he said something in a keynote and I want more information on it, I don't know where to go here. I wouldn't actually think of clicking Store, believe it or not, because I would think Store would be books that he has written or something like that. So stuff definitely needs to stand out.

Yeah, from a design standpoint, we are rapidly making notes here and we agree. And I think we have actually already sort of committed to going that direction The guy that we are probably going to rip off is Maldineconomics.com, who is a guy in the States who does similar kinds of products.

M-A-L-D-I-N?

M-A-U. There you go. Maldineconomics. Just because he also has an audience that he generates through his free stuff, plus he is moving into product. It's much more focused on him as a brand. I think one of the things up until this point that Mike's held off on has been a discomfort with the idea of being aggressive with the website being his personal brand destination. I think we've got him over that hump now, so we'll be making those changes.

Yeah, this is a really nice design. Look at this, the investment product. This is the same kind of thing you would want to do on your page right up front. Even if you just take 4 of these, one could be subscribe to the newsletter. One could be tickets to his next event. One could be the Emergency Gold thing, and one could be the VIP video series. Really easy. I would actually put a button that says read more. On there. But still, this is clean, nice big button, Subscribe Now, very simple to do. And I wonder, let's just check to see what he is using. So he has built his own it looks like actually. I don't think this is a WordPress site.

No.

He has built his own here, very interesting. So yeah, very slick. I wonder where this goes to. Let's see if it is on his site. So yeah, he's using— so he's hard-coded this essentially right into it. Really simple, nice clean layout in there, definitely. Yeah, I think you are on the right way. And once you get sort of closer to the design stage, feel free to send me a screenshot or the demo site of it before it launches. I'd be happy to provide you as part of this that we are doing today. I'd be happy to go through it and give you some suggestions of where to move things or different colors that convert. I think you will find a lot of value there once you sort of get closer to it.

Yeah, we will definitely take you up on that.

Now on the social side, I noticed that unfortunately you don't own Money Talks on Facebook. This person, whoever this person is, has solicited Money Talks.

The only problem with Money Talks is The two biggest destinations on the web, which are .com and .ca, which we tried to buy and failed, are both porn sites.

Oh yeah, you don't want to bring that up.

Oh my god. How do you like that? Oh no. Oh no.

Oh no.

Big issue for us. So we actually were offered MoneyTalks.com about 10 years ago.

No, .ca.

No, .com. But they wanted way too much money for it.

I have a suggestion that you are not going to like, but I think it's the right approach. Change the brand.

Well, we are going to change the URL, that's for sure.

Yeah, so where is it now? MoneyTalks.net? Even if— .coms are so important. It's what people remember at conferences.— even if you say, especially that it goes to a porn site, even if Michael says MoneyTalks.net, people remember it as MoneyTalks.com.

Absolutely. So I think the plan is we do have Michael Campbell's Money Talks and Michael's Money Talks and a couple of others that we own. So I think it's Michael Campbell's Money Talks.

Is it activated?

It may not be activated.

And MichaelCampbell.com is some singer.

Yeah. Oh, an artist.

Yeah, okay. There's a singer too.

So I think part of the new plan is also again just to rebrand it Michael Campbell. We've tried to be pretty sensitive to the Money Talks brand because it's a bit of a gray area as far as how much of that does Chorus own and how much of it do we own.

Oh, interesting. OK. Oh, yikes.

So we've tried to be very sensitive to not differentiating that too, too much. We want to make sure people understand that Chorus is our partner. But I think going forward, we're— And I don't think they're going to be uncomfortable with it. It's just that it's not Money Talks. Money Talks will be the secondary brand and Michael Campbell will be the primary brand.

Yes.

Yeah, that's a tough one. That's a tough one for sure. That's unfortunate.

It is. And if it was anything else other than what they were doing, I'm sure we could make them a decent offer, but they're making too much money unfortunately.

They're making too much money off that. Yeah, no, you'll never get in there for sure. For sure, for sure. And unfortunately it's gone. What would be great is to have a name that you can own across .com, across Facebook, across Twitter so that you control that. You have all of it. Let's see if it even comes up here. It doesn't even— Do you have a Facebook page yet?

Yeah, it's under Michael Campbell though, not Money Talk.

It's Michael Campbell's Money Talk.

There it is down there.

Yeah.

Hey, you've got a pretty decent size of a fan base on it for sure.

Yeah, we really haven't— it's just Nina just got on it since the new year. So it's— and again, just the size of the audience is so bloody huge that we feel like, wow, I mean, we've got to be able— if there's half a million people, we've got to be able to mine that better.

Yeah, absolutely. So are you posting? It doesn't look like you are posting particularly regularly to this, like every other day maybe or so.

Yeah, for some reason Mike, Mike not understanding Facebook so well, he doesn't get that. He thinks that posting every day is too much, but what he doesn't understand is that hardly anyone's seeing it. Like, it's, you know, people don't come to your Facebook page, they just see their stream. So, but he, he's very sensitive about that. He's like, oh, don't start going crazy here now. It's like, well, yeah, that's why I find it's easier just for to try and make him happy and to feel like I'm getting anything out of it is I just boost when I I don't feel I need to, but still.

Yeah, and very few people are seeing this. The difference between Twitter and Facebook— wait, do you have a Twitter account for him?

Yeah.

Is it Money Talks by any chance?

Yeah, Money Talks Tweets I think it's called.

Money Talks Tweets. Nope. Well, it's probably on your site I'm assuming. Here we go. TalkTweet by itself. So you are just using this really for posting. In fact, it looks like it is an automated system that whenever it sees content on your site it is spitting it out. Is that what is going on?

Yeah, that is how we currently have it set up. Basically every time the web editor posts something new it automatically gets tweeted.

Yeah, and that is a great— people complain about that, but that is an okay place to start. The difference between Twitter and Facebook is Twitter, if I follow that page, then I'm going to see, as long as I'm looking at my tweet stream that day, I'm going to see every post, every tweet that gets sent out. It's not filtered. It's one big long list of everyone I follow. Facebook is really different. Facebook only shows people content from those brands or friends that they have engaged with a lot. Facebook uses this algorithm they call EdgeRank. Have you ever heard of EdgeRank?

No.

So what EdgeRank's job is, without looking at this complicated algorithm which sadly I live my days in, essentially EdgeRank is the algorithm that determines what gets to people's news feeds. So if I come along here to Michael Campbell's Money Talks and I click Like, like I've just done, I'm now going to— oh, that's interesting. It recommends Kevin O'Leary's page afterwards. I'm going to begin to see a little bit of Michael's content in my actual news feed. But if I don't engage with the content in any way, if I don't ask questions, if I don't click like, if I don't share it, if I don't click the links, then eventually Facebook says, "Well, you know what? He's not really all that interested in Money Talk." So we are going to show him less and less on the newsfeed. So that is what EdgeRank does unfortunately. So we can measure how many people are actually seeing you. We can get a rough estimate. I can do it even without being an administrator by looking at this number here which is called "people talking about this." And what Facebook determines as talking about this is anyone who has taken any action on a post that has created something on their feed. So if I come along here and I say, "Interesting," now I've got a little bit more EdgeRank with your page. So I'll see a little bit more of your content on my newsfeed. But this is a really low number. Let's just do the math. The way you calculate these is you divide the talking about this number into the number of likes. And this is a 7-day rolling average. 39 people talking about it, 1300 people saying that they are interested in the content gives you an engagement rate of about 2.8%. So fewer than 3% of people who like this page are engaging with your content, meaning those are the people that are going to see more of your stuff. So it's definitely something that you want to bump up.

Does the algorithm count when people click Read More in the same posting, or only if they share or respond?

It does.

It does give you a little bit more juice, but they are weighted essentially. So if I just see this in my news feed and I say click more, it is going to say, he is a little bit interested in the content. If I click Like, They are going to say, okay, he's a little bit more interested than he was by just clicking Read More. Because I commented, it's like, okay, very interesting. If I come along and I share this now to my own timeline, that gives us the highest amount of EdgeRank because it says, not only does he like it and is engaged with the content, he's actually recommending it to his friends. So I get even more juice based on it. And that's part of that algorithm that they've got here which is the affinity score. So actions like commenting, liking, clicking, sharing can affect the affinity. So the more things that I do, the more affinity I get with you.

In your experience, does postings that explicitly ask people to do that get a better result?

Absolutely. Absolutely it does.

People aren't clued into that yet, because I see that stuff and go, "Yeah, right. I know exactly what you are asking me to do." Oh my gosh.

Let me give you a couple of examples. This is a client of ours that we work with. So we will, even if we just ask a question like this, "Is it possible to look fashionable while riding a bike?" You'll get people. And then the key to it, and I see Michael has done this on a couple of that, is to reply. When people ask questions, to get in there and that boosted back up again. But you know, can you name this artist? Any sort of really question works really, really well. Like, click like if you agree. Where is your dream oasis? All of these are questions that work really well.

So questions and explicit requests to take action should be part of what we are doing?

Yeah, not every time, not every time because people will eventually get tired of that. But for sure you should be, I would say anytime there is anything that could require an opinion. So like if Michael is posting something about his emergency gold program, if it is a link to it, learn more about it. What do you think? Do you think gold is going to save us all from economic collapse? Let me show you a couple of other examples here. I'm going to dive in. This is a tool that we use. It's an expensive tool, but it really helps us understand what's going on with all of our client's pages. Unfortunately, it's a little slow to load because it crunches just an enormous number of numbers. But you can see here that the EdgeRank score that we are getting is 10. We can see what— and EdgeRank again is visibility on the news feed. But one of the things that is nice about it is we can with this tool come in and say, okay, based on your last— let me change the date. What is this? This is the last week. Back it up here to measure it over, say, September 1st to today. Oh no, that's the wrong year. Try this again here. I just got back from Toronto yesterday, so I'm still jet-lagged. Okay, one more time. I'll just go from October 1st, sure September 1st to today. So it's going to take a second to chug on it. And then what this tool does is it downloads every single post, every single engagement, even the hidden stuff. Like if people come along to your page, I'll go back to yours here. And if I don't like something in my news feed and I click to hide it, you know you can do that something. This will even measure like if I report it as spam or in the newsfeed, this will measure how many of those we've gotten. So let me scroll down. All right, so one of the things that's nice is it gives us a really kind of a nice overview. And you can get this tool yourself by the way. It's edgerankchecker.com. So the heat map here for instance shows that the green areas are when people are online for the most part, when your Facebook fans are online. And the dots indicate when you have been posting. The size of the dot indicates the engagement you get. So we ran this audit when we first started working with them. And we go back and redo it from scratch every 6 months to make sure the numbers haven't changed. But you can see in the 8 o'clock zone there, there is lots of green. So there are lots of people. They seem to come online, if you look at kind of where the greens start, they seem to come online at about 4 o'clock in the afternoon and stay up until about about 9:00. This is a— which one did I do, Woodgrove? Yeah, so this is a regional shopping center in Nanaimo, so it's lots of young families. So that's why we targeted 8:00 for those posts. You see that line straight down 8:00. We figured most people are online at 8:00. Most of our fans are online at 8:00, so we should be posting at 8:00. So that's another really important consideration for you is learning when people are actually on your page and posting then. We can see I'll just load these up in separate tabs so we can see which posts perform best. This is a great one. So we can say, all right, based on all of the posts that we've done, let's say which one had the strongest reach without having to pay for it? And we can sort it by that. Come on, computer. Now it's just frozen. Let me just reload here and see what's going on. There we go. So here is the photo report for it. And this is tracking the date range that I gave it before. We can change based on how we are measuring it. So right now I want to measure by total engagement, the number of people who have clicked, who have commented, any kind of engagement at all. So we have learned from this that fingernail posts work phenomenally well. But also take a look at this. We asked a question, "Do you like these Christmas nails?" And we got 29 comments from it and 518 people clicking thumbs up. So even just stuff tools like this give you a sense of kind of what is resonating with people. So here is a good thing as well. You can go down and you can say, I want to see just the posts that asked for engagement. So that is when I've actually said, "Do you like this? Click like if you like this." Or "What do you think?" Anything that asks for that engagement. We can then take a measure of that. So I would recommend you look into this tool. I say expensive, I think it is about $30 a month or something. It is not outrageously expensive by any stretch. Negative feedback is also an important one to monitor. This you won't be able to get from Facebook Insights. So this is when people hide stuff or they report it as spam. And we can sort it. We can say okay, Let's get the overall severity. So we haven't had that many. Our top severity was only 1 unlike. So someone unliked our page because we said, "Have a dreamy Saturday," or "cutest thing ever." So there are really some nice tools that will help you understand the audience. And of course, we would be happy to at my firm do a full audit for you that includes all this stuff. Twitter, and all that jazz. But if money is tight or it's not a huge priority, it's easy to just hook this up yourself. We also use a tool— I'm sorry?

How much do you guys charge to do that?

A full audit is about $2,500. And we do everything in there. Let me just pull open a sheet for you. Odd. So it's really meant for people exactly where you are at. Last year you set up your Facebook and Twitter page and you poked around a little and you are underwhelmed, right? So it's exactly where we are at with you folks right now. So this is— let me scroll down here. Come on. So you can see the kind of stuff that we do. We do everything from SEO work to find out how you are coming up. Take a look at what usernames are available, which ones you are using, which ones are competitive. We do secret shopper moderation testing, so we will go on as another person, a name you won't recognize. We will ask questions to see how effective you are at it, right through to actionable recommendations. And we've done this audit for everyone. You can see Ivanhoe Cambridge's testimonial on the right. Which is a huge retailer. They own a whole bunch of shopping centers. We've done it for Abbott Pharmaceutical, for O.K. Tire. We do it every 6 months for O.K. Tire. We've done it for the CBC and so on.

Great.

Another thing you may want to look at while I've got you is to use a posting tool that can space that stuff out for you. It will take the workload off. So the content that comes up here, is someone manually going onto Facebook and posting these?

Yeah, I think it's because at the end of the day we are essentially, we are still a media platform. One of the things that we've chosen to go with is the concept that our Facebook audience is a little different than our, or isn't entirely consistent with the folks coming to our website. And we've kind of contemplated the idea that Facebook, to your earlier point, is where we want to go for the heightened engagement, but that it also might be, and again this is just based on some gross demographics, might skew a lot more to a female audience because our website and our live events and our radio demographics still skew very heavily to a male audience.

Yes, probably older.

Yeah, it's 55+. And it's as much, depending on the time of year, it's as much as 65% male.

And I expect that's partially the time topic, but also partially CKNW's audience as well is skewed that way.

Yeah, and all of the CHORUS ones that we're on, so whether it's CHED in Edmonton or QR77 in Calgary or whatever it is, that style of news talk radio definitely skews that way heavily. So one of the thoughts we had had was to seek to make Facebook a more female-friendly if you will, style of editorial. So we have tried not to do what we do with Twitter where we just have it be a direct reflection of what is on the website, and to try and look for ways to make it different if you will.

Yeah, for sure. It's a great idea. One of the things that you can do, and unfortunately I can't show you because I am not an administrator of your page, but you can get very fairly good demographics of who is on your Facebook page. You can do it through Twitter and other tools as well, just with your own sort of tool. So let me just use my page as an example. And what you do is when you are logged in as an administrator of your page, you are going to see this section up top. And you want to click the button that says See Insights. And then you want to go over here where it says People. So what's nice about this is there are 3 different areas. People who are your fans is probably the most important for just getting an overall sense. The gray bars indicate what Facebook's general demographics are, and the blue bars indicate what your fans are like. So you can see I'm underperforming, no surprise. Facebook has got— take a look at the 2 gray bars here and here. Facebook has got a lot of people in the 13 to 24 range, and I don't. But that's okay, because that's not who I'm targeting. Whereas on the 35 to 44 range, Facebook is not that strong. If you just look at the gray bars there, it starts to decline dramatically. But now take a look at the blue bars and it climbs. So I'm getting older people. And then I can tell as well who is on the top side is women, bottom side is men. So you get a pretty nice view of it. The other thing is, and that's just your fans overall. But then when you click People Reached, you are able to now sort of drill down and see who actually has seen your post. Because remember, EdgeRank's job is to filter out content from brands and friends that it thinks you are not engaged with. So even though we've got all these people who are my fans, I'm not necessarily reaching those people. So now the gray bar sort of drills down a little bit. Now the gray bar instead of being overall Facebook, my fans, and the blue bars are fans that are actually seeing my content. So again, even though I've got a good chunk of 18 to 24, not many of my fans in that range are actually seeing my content. And then the further drill down is people who are engaging with your content. So they've liked it, they've commented, or they've shared it. And I tend to overperform in the 45 to 54 women. So of my fans which is the gray underneath, I'm getting more of those in that particular range that are actually engaging with my posts. So you can get some nice statistics just off of Facebook to give you a sense. And that will guide your content. And I hate to— we struggle with this with OK Tire which is a client of ours. We manage all of their posting across Facebook and Twitter. We do it for a couple of their stores as well. We monitor. We engage with it. And as much as it's sort of difficult to do these "Do you eat behind the wheel?" they do resonate with people. Let's scroll through. That one just got posted, so we're not going to see much engagement on it. But here's an example. Can you spot what's wrong with this picture? It stops people. It actually gets them engaged. Not all of it is like that. You can see this one over here. We actually have some brand-specific stuff stuff, but it doesn't get the same level of engagement. But that's okay because we are mixing it up with stuff like this one. Like this one. So let me do— I also want to show you— what kind of time do you guys have? I can keep on going if you have the time. Yeah, yeah, please do. Yeah, for sure. I know we only booked an hour, but I'm happy to stay on the line until whenever. I have a call at noon, so I turn into a pumpkin in an hour, but we can keep on going.

Yeah, please.

All right. And again, I'm recording all this and I'll send you a link to the video privately so you don't have to worry too much about taking notes. So we use a great tool called Buffer. So here's what you are doing right now. You are going to your page. I'm going to use our testing page so I don't post anything on our client's pages. So you are coming along and you are saying, buy gold. Or whatever, and you are posting it manually. There are a couple of things you could do. You can if you want schedule them for specific times, but it is sort of difficult to manage and it's not great. So there are lots of tools out there. You've probably heard of HootSuite before.

Yeah, I tried that and I don't know.

You know what, I'm with you on the frustrations with it.

Because I've got my personal accounts. I've got the Money Talk stuff. It wouldn't let me have 2 LinkedIn's up. I don't know. I maybe didn't give it enough time, but it was confusing.

No, Nina, it's not your fault, I promise.

I sat down with a couple of friends that love it, but I noticed they've only got their— like they're dealing with one mainstream, but I've got my Facebook page, the Michael Campbell Facebook page, My LinkedIn, I'm trying to build a presence for Money Talks on LinkedIn which again is a— blah!

Yes, yeah.

It's not company page but then you have to have a personal page but I don't want to be the person. So anyways, yeah.

Oh no, I hear you. Hey sister, you're singing my song. I totally hear you. And I want to like them. I want to love them because they're local and I actually know a lot of the guys that work there.

Oh yeah, same.

Yeah, and they are great community supporters and everything, but I find their tool overburdens these days. The other sort of problem with it is as you discovered, as you mentioned there, you have to create a separate stream for every potential engagement, a stream for your scheduled posts, a stream for your mentions.

And I can't do them all at the same time anyways, because there are too many of them.

That's right, exactly. And I find the sort of, system they use for adding team members to be complicated. I think what's happened is it was a good tool to start with and they haven't overhauled the tool at all. They are just really doing the same sort of stuff. They just added little bits and pieces to it as they've gone along. So we use 2 different tools at my company and I'm happy to share them both with you. One is called Buffer and we use Buffer for posting to pages. And then we also use another— B-U-F-F-E-R. And I think it's actually bufferapp.com. Let me show you here. So it looks like that. I'll show you what the back end looks like. So we use bufferapp.com for posting content and looking at the analytics. And then we use another tool called Sprout Social for monitoring and engaging. Sprout Social is not cheap. It's $100 per month per user. But I'll show you how it works. It's pretty amazing. So let me show you what Buffer looks like at the back end. So we have obviously a corporate business account, so we've got tons. And all down the left-hand side are all of our clients, not all actually, just some of the clients, the ones that I've got the football for. So I've got my business fan page. I've got my personal LinkedIn. I've got my company Twitter account, company Facebook account, company Google+ account, and company LinkedIn account. So it does a ton of stuff. So there is Woodgrove Center's Facebook and Twitter. Let me just add something here, one second. Oops, what have I done? Sorry, bear with me for a second here. There we go. Okay, so are you able to see the sort of spotlight on the page?

Yeah.

Great, okay. So there is Woodgrove Center's Facebook account, Twitter account. Kildonan Place is a shopping mall in Winnipeg. We do work for Oakridge Center. Locally there is OK Tire, the Vancouver Sun Run. So all of your accounts are really simple in one area. And this is what's great about it. Is you set up a schedule ahead of time. So you say to Buffer, and you go through EdgeRank Checker, and you determine wherever that heat map went, you determine what the best time of days are to post. And then you load that into Buffer's schedule. So I will show you— I probably can't show you client stuff, but let me show you my own Twitter account. So schedule, so I've told Buffer that I want to post on Twitter 6 times every weekday, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday at these specific times. And every weekend, every Saturday and Sunday I only want to post 3 times, and this is the schedule. And you can have different schedules for different things. So my Facebook account I actually do every day at these consistent times. So once you've done that, all you have to do is— let's go to the Sun Run Facebook account for instance. So this is content that we've lined up ahead of time for the Vancouver Sun Run. So this particular account is their Facebook page. And you will see it looks just like every other post. You can't tell that it has been posted from a tool. It comes through normally. It shows up in people's news feeds. But it is really easy to use. So you come along and you say, okay, I want to post this on the Bank of the Sun Facebook and the Bank of the Sun Twitter, and we will say hi. And then you can either choose to share it now which I am not going to do because it is going to blast it to their account. Or you just hit Buffer. So watch what happens when I hit Buffer. It is going to take that content and put it at the bottom of this queue. So it is currently scheduled for March 4th. I'm going to delete that right now just so that we don't run into problems. So this operates on a lineup, a queue system. So all it does is it takes— because I have already given it the schedule ahead of time, twice a day. And it looks like this particular schedule, it goes out at 11:30 in the morning and 3:30 in the afternoon. So that is the times that we determined were their best posting times. And it does it automatically. And what is really nice about it is you can actually just rearrange the content by picking it up and dragging it, and it will move that one up there. Or we can pick that up and it will drag it there. And I can see which one of my team members is responsible for it. So there is our staffer Robin who is on this account, so that is her posting there. If I were to go to Woodgrove Center, that's Geneva who is on that account. And you can edit by just clicking right in the box itself and changing it. And it is going to say saved right there. And that's it. So Buffer is a great tool. It's really simple to use. You do get some analytics on things, so you can take a look at what the posts have been like over a certain number of days.

And is Buffer free?

Buffer is not free. It's free for a small amount of— oops, wrong account here. One second. It's free for a limited amount of stuff, but it's fairly reasonable for what you are doing. There is— all right, so it looks like they used to have a free account, but it looks like they don't. But anyway, $10 a month. $10 a month, it's reasonable. You get unlimited posts. You can add 12 profiles in there, so you'll be fine with that. And 2 team members. And then they've got all sorts of business plans. We are on their large account because we've got hundreds of client accounts. But it's really good. We love Buffer for its simplicity. You can change the schedule any time you want. So right now we are posting on every day except for Mondays. I'm not quite sure why. I'm going to change that right now. That one is probably a typo. You can add team members into it, all sorts of stuff. So we use Buffer for posting. Oh, another thing that is kind of nice as well, I don't have any posts lined up, but I can do it from this. If I decide this is my LinkedIn account, so I'm bitching about Air Canada here, but if I want to copy this post over to my Facebook account, you just pick it up and drag it on top. And that's it. Copy. I'm going to delete it because I've already posted this on Facebook.

And then it just moves to a different account.

Yeah. And here's the other thing that's really cool. Let's say that you are on a page of something that you want to— let's see if I can find— where is business? Business here. Let's say you are on a page and there is something that you think would be really good to post. So here is an article that you are looking at. And you think this would be good for us to send up onto our Facebook and Twitter pages, all browsers you get this little button up here and it is the buffer icon.

Okay, kind of like Hootsuite has that with the little owl.

Yeah, Hootsuite has that. And it pops this up and you just say yeah, I want it to go onto this channel, this channel, and this channel. And you can edit it. Same thing, you can hit buffer to have it go. The buffer is very elegant. We like it a lot. And the tool that we use for engagement is called Sprout Social. And this is for monitoring the page. So it will collect all of your content and people talking about you, and then you can reply to them right here. Now here is the difference between this one and HootSuite. With HootSuite, you've got to create a different column, different stream they call it, for every single thing, a different column for every account. And then not just every account, a column for tweets, a column for mentions, a column for scheduled tweets, a column for private messages.

First people mention you, or retweets, and yeah, yeah, yeah.

Exactly. It is overwhelming. What I like about Sprout Social is it puts it all in one column. So all of this is here. You can see I've connected a whole bunch of our client pages, but I can turn on and off. So right now, because I've got great staff members who are looking after some of the corporate accounts, I'm not looking at the Sunrun, or Woodgrove Center, or O'Keeffe Tire Stores, or anything like that. The checkbox is not on. But if I wanted to, I just turn the checkbox on, and now my message stream updates with content that comes from them as well. So I've got someone down here complaining about, What is this? Oh boy, complaining about a post. Yeah, shame on me. So if I want to see it in context, I just click the 12 hours ago. And I can see what this is. So I made a joke about Air Canada's new discount seating, no actual sitting. I actually didn't realize this was a chapel, but whatever. So I can see it right in context. I thought it was funny. I didn't think anyone would be offended by that. You never can tell. But I can do right from here, I can click Like. So I can like it on Facebook. I can reply to the person right here. All of that, you can escalate it. You can send it to someone else. I can make it a task for me to follow up on later. So I'm going to say, get back to this person. If I wanted to, I could assign it to a team member of mine. And then I've got a list of my tasks that are outstanding. So that's that one. I can say I've checked that one off. It's really quite nice. And so I've got all these profiles. And then furthermore, you can say, and of these profiles that I'm looking at, here's what I want to see. I want to see mentions and direct messages. I don't want to see retweets. I don't want to see new followers. And on Facebook I want to see everything. And on Google+ I want to see everything. So I'm going to turn on retweet to see if I've gotten any. So yeah, I've gotten one. So Donna Matrix retweeted that. This person retweeted that. I can turn on new followers. So now it shows up in blue when I've got someone who is following me new. So this person is. And what's kind of nice as well is you can just hover over them to get a bit of information about them. And click on their head to drill down. So we don't have any history with this person. I've never actually had a conversation on Twitter with them. But I can really quickly look at his tweets. He's got a fairly high Klout score. These are people who have mentioned him. I can add him to a list. And how we do this with— let me switch over to— oh, and it's running searches as well, right? So you can always have searches going. So let me show you that in action. I'm going to turn that off. And I will go to Robyn's account. So Robyn today she is at the football for the Vancouver Suns, so we can see people who followed them. So we look for people who have said, we look for people who have said, I just joined, I just signed up, I can't wait. Let's see if I can find anyone. No, I can't find someone. But anyway, let's just imagine. So this person, see this little, what do you call it, magnifying glass, that's picked up not because they mentioned us, but because we are searching for that phrase as a keyword. So it is searching all of Twitter for any mention of this hashtag, this hashtag, this hashtag, or this phrase. And it is putting it in my overall feed as well.

And this was— sorry, we're in followers, right?

What's that?

You're in the follower category? Is that where these things are coming?

Yeah, no, this is just the mainstream. This is just all the messages. So this particular person, this symbol, magnifying glass, means that it came up as a search. So we hit on it because they mentioned RunBan. So if I want to, I can reply. Pick the right account obviously. Say, "Hey great, looking forward to having you." These little icons on the right here indicate that there has been a conversation on Twitter. So if I click it on the right-hand column there, I can see what the conversation has been. Which is sort of nice. They are talking to someone else. And you can reply to that particular one, reply to everyone. And it also gives you quite a few really nice reports as well. So we can do an engagement report to see how things are trending across all of them. So right now we are getting most— we are doing really well with our engagement. So we are getting back to half of the people, we are getting back to them in under an hour. And then you can get fairly detailed stats on who is posting when. It is similar to what you would get from Facebook Insights. Twitter has got some nice stuff as well.

So do you, if you are using Buffer app and Sprout Social, are you ever actually going straight through? Do you ever just go to Twitter or go to Facebook or go to LinkedIn? Or do you not have—

No, we don't. We need the administrator access. I keep finding myself just going to LinkedIn directly and then going, God, this is so stupid because I could be doing Well, the problem with it is that it's sort of a pain to log in each time for one thing, and keeping track. And then you can't— different systems have got different ways of scheduling them. Where actually, once you've got a schedule set up in Buffer like I've got for mine, once you've got a schedule, unless it's urgent and you want it on the stream right away, you just buffer it. And it will drop it down to the bottom of the list and it will pop in. And here is the real key behind the thing is that your followers aren't overwhelmed with stuff. They are not going to see 6 tweets in a row from you. It will be spaced out really nicely, really elegantly. And the other reason to do it is you get access to analytics if you are posting through their tool. You can see what this is. So I'm going to take a look and sort of compare that against the number of likes that I had. To comments. And you can drill down into posts specifically. So this post that I bitched about yesterday afternoon when I was in the Toronto airport got 5 comments and 4 likes. And if I click the comments, I can see what those comments were and I can engage with it right there. So we use Buffer. The other really nice thing about Buffer is that It will log in for you, but it can do two-factor authentication, which means that when I log in successfully with my password, it actually will text me a code to my cell phone. So even if someone knows my password for this account, which of course manages a lot of our client work, they would have to physically have my cell phone with them to still be able to log in further. Oh, okay. And two-factor is really important.

Because we noticed that when Grant manages our database through iContact, we realized somewhere along the line that we could post to Facebook from there. But what we also noticed was that those were the lowest viewed So we kind of did a little bit of testing and realized that a lot of that stuff just wasn't even getting through. Does Buffer kind of work? Does Buffer have that issue?

Buffer doesn't have any sort of special posting ability. If people are not seeing it on Facebook, it's because your EdgeRank with them is low. So it's because they haven't been engaging with your page very much in the past, so you need to up that. One way to do that is to promote a post that will generate high engagement. So do something that you think a lot of people are going to comment on. And honestly, here's the secret, is we don't really care what they say. All we care is that they comment or they share it to their timeline. So a really good post for you would be an image post. We find that image posts have higher EdgeRank. Let me show you that algorithm again of what makes up EdgeRank. So it's affinity, right? So that's what are people, or how much are people engaging with you. It's time decay, so the more recent post, more people will see it. But weighting is also really important to know. Different posts have got different types, or different types of posts have got different weighting attached to them. So status updates aren't seen aren't sent to the news feed of your fan as much as images are, which is why you will see on our posts we use big images like this. So we know that more people will see this because it is an image post than will see this one because it is a link post. And you can actually get that information yourself. Let me go over to my page here. I'm sorry, I just can't share obviously the client stuff. I'm just using my own stuff. So you can get that yourself by going to Posts and Post Types. So we can see actually, for my particular, for whatever reason, I'm actually doing really well with status updates. But when I send links out, I'm not reaching that many people. That said, even though photos reach fewer people than status updates, photos get far more engagement. And we care about engagement because that means future reach. It means now that people have engaged with us, they will show up on the newsfeed. This number will grow. And you can actually even drill down and say, okay, let me see the posts that got the highest reach altogether. So it was this post which was a funny one. It was some person who was the closed caption wrote, "I am the closed caption guy and I hate that broad." So for whatever reason that did really well. And we can see why it did well as well. 19 people shared it to their timeline. Sharing is the highest possible EdRank weighting that we can get from it. So what I would do is I would take a look at these numbers here which are getting the highest reach, and then also take a look at the ones that are getting the highest engagement. And use these as a good sort of guide as to what people are engaging with. And then go and put a post out that says, the risks on that. So let's say people are talking about gold because it's the only financial thing that I apparently can do. So let's say that they are geeking on gold. So get an image of something gold. You can do that really easily by just doing images Google search, gold bar. Something nice and clean. So there is one that is clean. So I'm going to drag that out onto my desktop. And then I'm going to go back here to Buffer. And I'm going to go to my page here. Should I buy gold? And sometimes we like to say yes or no because it encourages people to actually type in yes or no. Sometimes if you ask a should I, would I, or would you, people will click like as a way of voting yes. And we don't want that. We want people to comment. And then you just click that and upload the image. It will attach that image to it. And I will share this one just for the— actually, I won't share it on that page. I will share it on our testing page. I will put it on my Facebook page. So share now. So now I'm going to go to my Facebook page. And sometimes it takes a second to get there. Yeah.

Now, are, are fans—

I will be there—

the people that like you, or is that two different things?

That's the same thing.

It's the same thing, okay, because I noticed when we were looking at that John Molden's page, he calls them fans. And so I was like, oh.

Yeah, no, same thing.

Okay.

So there it is. It went through. Why isn't it coming through on Facebook? Sometimes it takes a bit of time. No, for whatever reason it is taking its sweet time to get there. Sometimes it takes up to a minute to actually land there. But anyway, it would show up there. So here is a nice thing that you guys can do that is really quite helpful. You've got that iContact list you mentioned. How many people are on that?

How many are on it, Gregg?

Oh, I know why it's not there. I'm looking at the wrong page. Sorry, I was looking at my Facebook page.

Oh, there you go.

There it is right there. Should I buy gold, yes or no? So how many people do you think are on your iContact list?

17,000.

Wow, that's really good. That's great. So here's what I would do. I would invite those people to your— sorry, hang on. Bear with me. I'm just checking something in another window really quickly. There we go. So I would invite those people to like your page. And what you do is you do it as an ad. So you go over to the Ads Manager on Facebook and you go to Audiences which is over here on the left. And what we are going to do is create a separate audience. So when you promoted posts or boosted posts, it will send it to everyone who likes your page and all of their fans. That's the default boost post. But we don't necessarily want those people. If the goal of our campaign is to get people who are already on your mailing list to like your page, you go to Audiences.

Okay, and where was that under?

It's under Facebook.com/ads/manage.

Okay.

Audiences.

And I'm just going to use our Woodgrove Center account as an example. And then over here where it says Audiences, you want to click that. So then take a look at the— up here it says Create an Audience. Let's back it up. Create Audience. So click that and then upload your email list. So you are going to take those 17,000 people from iContact. You are going to start at iContact and export a list of all their email addresses. So you are just going to get it to dump all of the email addresses in. And then you upload it here, Data File, and you say Michaels, Email list, and it's a list of emails, and then you point it at the file, and it will come along and it will actually look up all of those email addresses, and it will put them in a group. So we did this for Woodgrove Center. Woodgrove Center has a mailing list. It's about 20,000 people, 22,000 people. We did that exact same thing last week, and it found of those 22,000 people or so that are on the mailing list, 14,000 of them use the same email address on Facebook. So now we have a group of 14,000 people we can target. So then you come along to create an ad. And we will call it, we will say this. I'm going to use our Woodgrove although I'm not going to actually do it obviously. And we will create a post that says, Hey, you follow Michael's email newsletter. Now why not follow us on Facebook? I'm not going to actually hit that obviously. So it will put that ad there. You can also see it on what it would look like on the right-hand side. So I would do both. See what it looks like there. And when it comes to audiences, just click there and select your email list. So now that is going to reach those people. In this case, it's going to reach people who are in that and live within 50 miles of Nanaimo. So let's take that out. Let's just put everyone who is on that list. So that's going to get it to that 13,000, 14,000 people. So now what we've actually done just to sort of follow the thread here, is we've taken the email marketing list that you've got We've exported all the email addresses, uploaded those email addresses to Facebook that match them with people who actually use the same email address on Facebook, and now we can target them with messages that say, "Hey, you should follow us on Facebook." And that converts really well. You'll drive your likes up quite a bit.

Wow, yeah. Excellent.

So I know that's a ton of stuff. I don't know if—

That's good. I mean, I think, I mean, at least, I mean, we knew before we phoned you that the, and it's partly why we did, that the face, I mean, the website needs an overhaul. It needs to be cleaner. It needs, but yeah, we're just sort of at that point where we're moving in that direction. And yeah, it's, It's overwhelming.

Yeah, it is overwhelming, yeah.

It's, you know, there's the website, there's all the social media, and the, the, the, it's like, whoa. But yeah, that's, this is lots of good stuff. Now, I think, I think when I, I think I booked, what did I book? Do you have, I noticed on your site you had you have sort of training videos or tutorials or whatever, but they are not up there yet, right? Is that right?

I've got some training videos. Gosh, I wonder if I still do even. Yeah, I think they are down. I did a huge program on Facebook advertising, but the downside is Facebook changes it so often that it's just not there anymore. So a good thing to do is just head to my YouTube channel which is YouTube.com/TodMaffinVideo. And if you scroll down to tips and how-tos, there is a ton of stuff there, how to create ads, how to edit, advanced digital marketing, all that free easy stuff to go through. Some of it is a little out of date now from the user interface, But it's all still there. Here's one that might be under recent uploads, a full Sprout Social tutorial. So you can sort of see how we use it.

Yeah, I find those are good. I basically just get my iPad, get cozy, and just watch one of those.

Yeah, exactly.

Now when I signed up for this, I think I signed up for a, What is it, a one-on-one? Yes. Yeah.

So how does that work? Let me just double-check here, because I think we've done that. Were there two things that you'd signed up for?

Yeah. Oh, okay. A dive-in, check-it-out overhaul, and I think a one-on-one.

Sorry, bear with me a second. That may be— Unfortunately, there's a few different sort of quote-unquote products in there, so let me just sort of see what it is, make sure that we cover that for you.

I mean, it doesn't have to write this out. I think this is good that we got. This is now—

Yeah, oh, I see what it is. So you did the one-on-one intensive. So that's what we're doing right now essentially. It's usually an hour, but I always do an hour and a half. 2 hours or whatever work. And the other one that you did was a strategic review of your brand page. So that is going to be sort of similar to an audit that we talked about earlier, not as comprehensive, but we go through your insights. So remember I was sort of saying you can pull out all your stats and get sort of various numbers from things. You can figure out what the best types of content is. That's what we'll do for you, all of that. So you don't have to worry about going into your Insights. We can pull all that data down and figure out, here's what we recommend. Basically, you end up with sort of an editorial calendar in a sense. Here are some themes that we know resonate really well, so that when you are planning your social posts, especially on Facebook, it will do really well for you. It also will go through and help you find stuff that is— let me just go to Money Talks. Michael Campbell's funny talks. We can also go through and just sort of pick out some stuff that we think might be changed. There is no sense having a map there.

I know.

This needs to be sort of more complete. It's cutting off. What I would actually recommend is putting a subscribe button here instead of the map. So I will show you on my page what that looks like so that people can actually sign up to your e-newsletter right from there. Do you see how I've got my newsletter? Oh, okay. So we can make those recommendations. When you click it, you get right over to a form where you can sign up. I use MailChimp which is similar to iContact. So we can— it's basically auditing the page and saying, we should be doing this. You should be doing that. Here are some areas you are probably missing, that sort of thing. So it usually takes me about a week or so to get through. Unless you have sort of an urgent need for it, I could get that to you by this time next week.

No, that's fine.

That's good.

Okay. And that's just, that's the Facebook page?

That's Facebook only, yes.

Okay, perfect. No, that's good.

All right, any other questions that I can help with?

Probably yes, but I'm feeling overwhelmed.

I'll bet. I'll bet.

This is really good. This is good.

Did we lose Grant, or is he still there?

He's answering some emails, but he's over there.

Excellent.

Okay.

Thanks, Todd.

I appreciate the time, and I'm sure we'll be back I will get back to you with some more requests for your time.

Feel free to email any time if you've got questions. I'm more than happy to help where I can. And I'll certainly get that strategic brand review over to you on the Facebook page by Monday. You'll probably get it sooner, but certainly by Monday. What was the other thing I was going to mention too? Oh yeah, the video of our discussion and everything we've gone through, I usually take It takes a couple of hours for it to convert to video format and everything, but I'll send you a link before the end of the day goes out.

Sure, okay. What, sorry, what, Grant? Oh, okay. Nope, that's good. All right. Okay.

Excellent. Well, I hope the time has been valuable, and I'll be in touch again soon.

Okay, thanks, Tod.

Thank you.

Thank you. All right, thanks guys. Bye-bye.

Bye.