In this conversational episode, Vanessa and Antoinette discuss the challenges nonprofit founders face when wearing multiple hats. They reference Michael Gerber’s The E‑Myth to explain the three core roles—entrepreneur, manager, and technician—that founders must juggle, especially when operating as solopreneurs. The dialogue highlights the emotional toll of constantly switching roles, the risk of burnout, and the need for balance, including taking time to “play” and pursue personal projects. They share a concrete example of a standards violation that required the technician, manager, and entrepreneur hats to act in concert. The hosts also explore how founders can identify which role they prefer, set clear standards, and consider alternative career paths (e.g., becoming an employee) when the nonprofit workload becomes overwhelming. The episode ends with a teaser for the next show, which will examine the personal qualities needed to succeed in each of the three roles.
Chapters
Hi, how you doing?
I'm good today, and you?
I'm good. I'm tired. I'm not— I don't say I'm tired. I am, I am, I'm low on energy this morning.
Yes, you have been doing a lot of work. Yes, you've been doing a lot of work for the club, and we're going to talk about a little bit of it today. I know you've been creating a new, um, process and projects and You have a lot going on.
It's really good though. I'm excited, I'm excited, and I feel no different than any other, um, person who's starting, building, and growing their business. You know, I'm— it's, uh, as I'm building the club, I'm, I'm building a new business. As I'm transitioning out of running my nonprofit and being a part of my nonprofit I started, I'm, you know, transitioning into new. So it's so much work to do, but I love it. I'm learning. So, um, yeah. So how are you doing?
I am excellent. So I just will tell you real fast, this morning I decided to start a whole new home project. So I am going to DIY my kitchen counters and marbleize them. I get to play with, um, uh, resin, resin, and spray marble paint, which is like Silly Putty. I can't wait.
Please, please, please record it so I can see, because I wanted to do that with some of my— with my countertops. I just want to do it. So please show me the process as you do it.
I sure will. I'm gonna have some fun. I've been trying to recruit people to come play with me, but they're all like, I've never done that before, what if we ruin it? I'm like, how can you ruin Formica cabinets? You can't ruin from making tops, you know.
If you do, you just throw them on, get another piece of wood. You know, I'm glad you said that because that's some of the things that we don't do as, as, um, entrepreneurs or business— we don't take as much time to play as we're starting up. We're so busy, we're so focused, and that's all we have on our mind is the time to play. And that we need that balance, but we got to remember to talk, really talk about that balance and that playing. So I'm glad to hear that you're taking time to play. Because one of the things that's really, you know, been on my mind is I'm working with people and talking with people, and as I'm going back through my history, it's like, okay, so when you start your business or your nonprofit or whatever, it's like, what's your title? What do you do? You know, what's my role? You know, and, um, I love this book, The E-Myth. I'm gonna, I'm gonna give The E-Myth a shout out. I love the book The E-Myth.
Okay, you gotta hold it up one more time. And yeah, there you go. The E-Myth Revisited by Michael Gerber.
It's a great book. It's a great book because what it talks about— the entrepreneur, the manager, and the technician. Which one are you?
And before you— I'm so sorry, I was going to just explain, like, the manager is the person who runs the business. The technician is why most of us get involved in this good work in the first place, is because we want to do the work. That's right. And that's the technician. And entrepreneur is the person who is always trying to think like, how do we grow this business? How do we keep moving it forward? Not so much how do you change it, but just how do you keep moving it forward?
That's absolutely right. And when you're starting your business, you have to play— you play all the roles. Most of 99% of the time you play all the roles. And especially when you're starting a nonprofit, because you're like And like you said, people started because they want to do it. Oh, I want to provide mentoring. I want to provide counseling. I want to, I want to. And so we start off and we're the technician, right? And as we're the technician, then we start writing policies and procedures so we know how to manage the programs, manage the service, manage this, and then start bringing people on and managing them. And so then we hopefully become the manager and no longer have to be the technician because you have people taking over that role. But at the same time, as you're doing that, you have to keep— you have to be that entrepreneur. It's like, okay, now how do I get funding? How do I create more of this? How do I get the building? How do I— so you have to put that entrepreneurial cap on, and you're always having to change hats. And it takes so much out of you when you're doing that. You're like, it takes much out of you. And so there's certain qualities that people need. If they don't have them, they need to incorporate it in order for that success.
Yeah, exactly. Well, I'm gonna also just add, it's even— you play all three of those roles when you are a solopreneur. And, um, a lot of us start our nonprofits as solopreneurs, um, and you play all three of those roles. So you are creating the— you are creating the policies for your organization You are creating the policies for how people will interact with your, you know, with your business. And then you're out there also performing, you know, doing the, the tasks. And, um, and, you know, like, yeah, what am I trying to say? You're the one out there doing the work, you know. And what you want to So I was just sharing with Vanessa before we started, I had a situation in my business, and I'll just tell you this, how it looks practically. So I had a situation in my business where, um, um, somebody else outside of my, my business violated my standards. And standards are like the first thing you, you know, you create when you create a business. I'm only working Monday through Friday 9 to 10, you know, I'm only working, you know, whatever, and my work schedule will look like this, my, my vacations will look like this. Those are your standards. Those are things you put around your business to say, this is what's going to help me do my business. Well, someone came in and violated my standards, and so as the technician, I was taken aback, like, what do I do? But quickly the business manager hat went on and it was like, you don't stand for it. And so the business manager had to step in and had to say, I'm sorry, you know, um, sir, ma'am, whatever, you know, like, I'm sorry, but I'm not gonna allow my technician to work under these conditions, so you'll have to find someone else to do the work. And, um, and that was it.
And so, yeah, and then that's when the entrepreneur steps in, because you're like, okay, you need to find someone to do the work. So that means when you told them that, it's like, no, I don't want to do this work. So I know, but I still know that that's part of the operating in my business. And so that's when the entrepreneur had kicks in and say, okay, now I gotta go get this other business to replace that business. So right then and there, you just— that was just 3 All three of them working together. Yeah.
Yes.
And how do you do that and keep yourself balanced? And we don't really, you know, how do you— and if any of you out there that are doing this and you can keep yourself balanced, how do you keep yourself balanced when you're doing this? Because that is really important, because you don't want to get burned out, you don't want to quit. Because like she said, that the, the, the technician was doing it and enjoying doing the work And then somebody came and did something, and the manager's like, no, you know. And what do you do in those situations? So as you're building your nonprofit, you know, think about the roles that you're going to have to play, you know. Think about the roles that you love playing. And you may find out as you're building it is that I really prefer being the technician. Yeah, I really prefer being the manager, you know, or I just prefer being the entrepreneur. And you really will be able to determine where you fit at it And then you're going to really have to make some really decisions of what are you going to do with your business, you know, how are you going to operate your nonprofit if you decide, I just really want to just be the technician, and that's okay, right? I really just want to be the manager. I don't want to go out and do fundraising, grant writing, um, schmoozing, doing events. I don't want to do any of that stuff, you know. I don't want to do capital campaigns. I don't want to do building camps. And you may realize, you know what, maybe I need to do something different.
So anyway, yeah, well, I want to just add to that too. You may need to do something different. You know, there's no harm in looking at being an employee because sometimes, you know, being an entrepreneur and a solopreneur and running a nonprofit, it's, it's hard work. And we've said that to you. We say that to you all the time. But it is hard work, and we're about to, um, you know, like economy— the, the sun is coming out and it's summertime now. We're hitting that time of the year, and you know, people want to be out more than they want to be running a business or working. So you may even find business will slow up, but this is where you just kind of have to hang in.
So yes. Yes. And so I think next week we're going to be talking about, do you have what it takes? Because it takes a lot. It takes a special type— it takes a special type of people, but it doesn't mean you cannot get what it takes if you don't have it. So next week we're going to be talking about what does it take to be that entrepreneur, manager, and technician to start, run, and build your nonprofit organization. But we're going to start at the, at the lower level versus just jumping in and doing it. Okay, so So thank you, Antoinette. Thank you everybody for listening, and, um, I hope everyone has a wonderful, wonderful weekend. Oh yeah, I hope you have a wonderful weekend.
