A recorded conversation (YouTube) between Josh Trent and Greg Schmaus exploring OCD as a symptom of avoidance—thinking used to avoid feeling—and discussing healing through awareness, integration, and divine timing. They contrast OCD with other conditions (ADHD, anxiety, depression) and emphasize integration over eradication.
Chapters
How does OCD differ from other forms of mental illness? What is it so specifically about ocd, these looping thoughts that so many people have that actually are being quiet about it? What is it about mental illness and ocd? That's really separate categories.
So I think that they're all symptoms. And OCD is a symptom, ADD is a symptom, ADHD is a symptom. Anxiety, depression, those are just two sides of the same coin. But they're all symptoms of mental constructs that we use as a way of avoiding parts of ourselves that we're not yet ready to experience and reintegrate. So if you think of thinking as the language of the mind and feeling as the language of the body, we use thinking as a way of avoiding feeling. They're complementary antagonists. So we almost live from the neck up as a way of avoiding experiencing anything from the neck down. So a lot of the obsessive compulsive thought patterns are a way of keeping the mind occupied to avoid feelings and emotions that we're not yet ready to feel and experience. And the way that differs from something like, say, ADHD is one thing that I feel is very true, is something that Paul stated on the podcast we did together is a lot of the ADHD is rooted in childhood experiences when the child didn't feel safe. Either mom or dad was violent or there was a chaos in the household. So the child is always kind of looking out for all these potential threats.
Yeah.
And the inability to focus on something is because if it focus focuses on one thing, it might miss something over there that might be a threat to its survival. So they are very similar. And obviously anxiety is very similar. Anxiety is a fear of the future where depression is being stuck in the past. And a lot of times anxiety is the masculine energy where depression is the feminine energy. And we usually start with anxiety and we burn that energy out to the. To a certain degree that we then rebound into depression because we don't have the energy to look outward anymore. So then we close down and shut down inward. So they all have their own characteristics and their own patterns. But the overarching theme is using the mind to avoid emotions, using thoughts to avoid feeling. And the feelings that we're avoiding, the parts of ourself that are. That we're avoiding, are usually tied to the wounds that we experience during some sort of trauma.
Let's pause right there, because if you're watching this live, immediately share this with somebody who is struggling with ocd, because the way that you just differentiated that if people really listen to that and do the work to apply it and embody it, that can change someone's life. Just that one awareness, it changed yours. It changed mine as well. And we had somebody that wrote in, Nina said, hey guys, I'm 72, I've been seeking health for 50 plus years. The virus came to wake me up. We do, she said, we do choose long and winding ways for ourselves. And I would like to say, yes, Nina, sometimes we do choose those. But Greg, when it comes to actually choosing the healing path, you know, the ocd, the healing, the healing comes in ways that sometimes we just maybe aren't ready for at that time. Do you believe there is always a divine timing? Is that part of the soul contract where it always has to be divine timing? Or do we say so does the soul say so when we're ready to heal?
I would say that there is certain truth to the divine timing because a lot of times we're not yet ready to heal and a lot of times we're not yet ready to integrate the parts of ourselves that we've rejected or abandoned. And I do feel as though that there is divine timing in terms of when we are ready and the opportunities present themselves. But, but the prerequisite to that is awareness. We have to be aware of when those opportunities and those teachers or those mentors are presenting themselves to you. And I mean, it might not happen in this lifetime. You know, I mean, some are of the belief that it might take many lifetimes to heal a certain wounds and we might be healing wounds from past lifetimes that we're not even aware of.
Yeah.
So we can obviously entertain that perspective. But in terms of this lifetime, I do believe that there is divine timing in terms of when we are ready to heal and when the opportunity to do the work and have the awareness presents itself. Have I gotten rid of everything? No, but I don't have the desire to get rid of anything because I've integrated it, if I've integrated it into my being. And I know that it's the greatest teacher I've ever had. My OCD was the greatest spiritual teacher I've ever had. It's the only reason I can really understand how the mind works and how consciousness works.
Yes.
So the idea of can we heal it? 100% is yes. But the healing, it 100% is the acknowledgement that I'm not here to get rid of it, I'm here to integrate it so it doesn't become something that we get rid of. It's something that we integrate into our being. So paradoxically, by carrying with it. By carrying it with us, we heal it 100% by saying, can I get rid of it for good? You're still engaged in it.
