Life Is Unfair, Now What? How To Heal Childhood Trauma | Liz Swail @WellnessAndWisdom

What is the meaning of all this? For some of us that experience so much trauma and so much pain, that.

Goes back to asking yourself the right questions instead of saying, why them? Why not me? Why didn't I have this in your brain, constantly trying to answer this unanswerable question and expending energy on this thing, that it's just unfair. Life is just unfair. Do you want to be a victim all your life and sit around feeling sorry for yourself and blaming others? Are you going to say, okay, these were the cards I was dealt. What can I do? And place yourself back in the driver's seat. Place that ball of empowerment back in your court and taking it and running with it and surpassing all those people and really proving you can do anything.

Liz, what a treat. I get to have you here in the studio in Austin. This has been a long time coming, actually. I met you multiple times and when I hung out with you and Michael at Runga, I thought these people are so real. Like, it's fascinating to me when people become wealthy and successful, but also they're real. They have a groundedness to them and you definitely have that. You know, alive and well is the place that I've gone for multiple healings here in Austin. We're going to link it in the show notes. So, Liz, tell people alive and well. I love it. Like, yes, we're alive, but are we actually? Well, I think so many people in the wellness space, they, they have a good looking body, but there's so much going on on the inside that really points to trauma and healing and how we're feeling from an emotional and ment. So we're going to go deep today. You have quite the story, but thank you for being here and just share with people real quick what is alive and well if they haven't heard of it before.

Yeah. So we are, I would say, like the marketing buzzword is an integrative wellness center, but it's so much more than that. It's a healing center. We have a functional medicine clinic that's kind of a newer endeavor, but we're really seeing the most impact with that in the future, what we can do for people. So functional medicine is just at the base of what we. Because it gets to the root causes of why people are experiencing themselves in a certain way. So that's a huge part of what we do. So we have some nurse practitioners, functional medicine oriented. They are functional medicine nurse practitioners and they run testing. So we do all that as well, lab testing. And we really just get to the foundational core of what's going on with people. Included in that sometimes is medication. So we have a compounding pharmacy as well. And we can compound whatever medication. We do that for all over Texas. In fact, we ship out and we can overnight stuff. We're working on doing another big or lab that we can do some things that require it to be sterile. So that's kind of in the works.

It's basically the next level of a holistic wellness center. I thought I knew about them in LA and Encinitas. This is a whole new level. I mean, the types of services that you have there, they're so. I've never seen them before. Like the EBO2. That's what I just did.

The newer. Yeah.

Oh, my gosh, you guys. I'm gonna link that in the show notes. We actually took a little Instagram story, so I'm gonna post that too. I'm just. I'm overwhelmed with gratitude for you both. It's.

It's.

It's been so beautiful to come to Austin. We've been here for a year and a half. And when we first got here, I was homesick. Like, I really. I was. I was California for 40 years. And so when I got here, I was like. I met a few people, Cal, our mutual friend being one of them. And I really felt like I was wrapp in love. I felt like I was hugged. And you and Michael have been that way for us, so it's been amazing. And it brings up this point for me. Like, when I first met you, I thought, wow, she really has her shit together. And it goes to for all of us. Like, just because someone has their shit together, don't judge a book by its cover. Especially with you. And when I had more conversations with you, I started to understand you have had one of the deepest, darkest vacuums and contrast to become who you are, to get to where you are. Do people, at first glance, do they just usually assume that you've always been successful, always been healthy? That's kind of a heuristic that we create as humans. Right?

You know, and part of that has been looking healthy on the outside, but not necessarily being it on the inside. And that's, of course, people's first impression, like, oh, she's fit and looks healthy. And I've always been energetic, even on the. No matter how bad I felt, I've always had good energy in that way. And people just assume when they discover a little bit more about me, they're shocked. Like that I come from a multicultural background or that I Grew up super poor, and certainly that my parents were teenagers when they had me, and just peeling back those little layers and finding out what's at the core of all that, and. And I don't think a lot of people do make that sort of leap. And we hear a lot of stories like that kind of in our world, and we're exposed to a lot of that, but more often than not, those people just stay right where they are. Right.

Yeah.

And so I just feel really fortunate to not be that way because I have a sibling who is still the same.

It's surprising to me in so many ways why some people are, quote, successful and why some people aren't, because with your background that, you know, we're going to go into with respect, obviously it's very sensitive. So I want to make sure that anybody that's dealing with mental health or drug addiction or anybody in your family that has that going on, that, you know, we all treat this with sacredness and respect because your story deserves a lot of that. And I think about my own journey with my mom having bipolar, my dad leaving home when I was really young, I chose something different because inside my soul, inside my gut, I always felt like there was something more. I just knew there was something more. When did that awareness start to come online for you and just give us a brief glimpse into how it was when, you know, Your mom was 14, when she had you, your dad was 17 when you were 6 years old, you found needles around the house. Like, it's been. It's been a pretty gnarly journey. Take us there. Just emotionally, mentally, Physically, Yeah.

So, you know, I was born to teenage parents. My mom was 13 when she was pregnant with me. Turned 14, had me. My dad went to the Coast Guard shortly after I was born, so she was kind of trying to do it, and my grandparents stepped in and said they were picking me up from random people's homes where they were babysitting for my mom. And she's out kind of running around just being a teenager, and my dad wasn't around, and they said they would pick me up and I would just have, like, the dirtiest, smelliest diaper on and be dirty. And so they stepped in and adopted me. And that's amazing, but they're both, like, immigrants from Mexico. And, like, I think they picked cotton when they first moved here. Just hardworking, really solid people with great values. They weren't necessarily the best parents in sort of a modern sense of, like, helping me do my homework and making sure I had lots of Rules and went to bed at a certain time. So but they were very, very loving. So that to me is super lucky that I was able to have something loving. Yeah. But within that they were still loving toward like my uncle and my dad who lived with us. You know in Mexican culture you don't kick your kids out when they're 18. And they had all kinds of like drug addict friends in and out of the house. I just, I didn't have my own bed when I was a kid. I slept on the living room floor and there's just a really no routine but lots of love. So I do remember like you know, my uncle and my dad's friends. They're teenagers really because they were all very young. So we're talking about 18 to 22 year olds just in and out of the house on drugs, stealing everything. We had nothing in our home. We couldn't even keep a phone on our wall because all these drug addicts would just come in and steal everything. They stole the wedding rings off my grandparents fingers and their sleeve. They stole all my clothes. I used to find, you know, when you're on things like speed and methamphetamines, some people that affects in it like really sexual ways. There's a lot of like porn and masturbation and people were watching those things in our home and I would like walk by things like that. And you couldn't keep lotion in our. I mean like little things that at the time didn't seem so weird, but now I'm like, that was effed up so. And they get perverted and my dad's friends and uncle's friends would try to touch me and have like really vivid. I don't have a lot of memories before I was like five or six. But the ones I do have are not all good. They're like me sitting on a stool with some pervert trying to touch me. And feeling that frozen feeling is even at that age like knowing that's wrong and just knowing it doesn't feel right. And I'm so glad that wasn't normalized to me. Yeah. And then so it's just like random people in and out of our house all the time. Dysfunctional in that way. My grandparents clean movie theaters so they would take me to work with them and that happens overnight. So they would get up at one in the morning and then go clean movie theaters until like 12 the next afternoon. So they would take me with them. I would sleep in the car, sleep on the floor at the movie theater with like people Vacuuming around me and then I would get up and go to school the next day. So that probably wasn't super functional either.

Yeah, there was some point when you were in high school too, like, and obviously there's so much more that happened. There's no way we could unpack for sure. Everything. But. But I wanted to have you speak to this because when I was diving into your story and I was exploring more about you, I thought 99% of people, I don't know the exact percentage, 99% of people that come from that don't end up where you are. Yeah, they just don't. And it's not like you're better than anyone else. But there's something that I guess you could say God's love, higher power brought through you that allowed you to transition. And because you actually were in high school and you said, okay, I'm going to take a bunch of pills, I'm going to end my life.

Yeah. So I was like a junior in high school. And I think that age is just really hard for a lot of people.

It's hard regardless.

I mean, you can see that happening in the world right now. We're gender confused, we're confused about what we want to be and kids are committing suicide in numbers we've never seen before. And part of it is this identity crisis that you have at that age and you feel very lonely even if you're surrounded by love. A lot of people still feel very lonely at that age. And I certainly had that where it was an age where you were very. I was not very self aware. And many years before that in a lot of ways as far as like what my life must look like to other people. And I think at that age you gain a lot too much self awareness. Right. And you're just like very worried about your image and what that looks like. And I started to realize and other people started to see that I just had a really messed up life. And even though my grandparents were awesome people, it was not looked upon as a positive thing that they worked hard because they worked from 1am to 12pm so there was no supervision at my house. No one was allowed to spend the night at my house. There's rumors and people would talk about how my dad was on drugs or something. I was able to still have some good friends, but I just couldn't have them at my home. I was embarrassed by that. I had a really good friend betray me who really coincidentally committed suicide herself recently. I just found out and I was insane to hear. But she was so nasty to me. She just tried to ruin my life. And it was crazy because my parents were letting her live with us because she had so many issues at home. And my dad was taking her all over the place. My grandfather was taking her all over the place and helping her run errands. And to have her betray me was horrible. And I just thought everyone, the whole world hated me. I felt very alone. Like, of course, no one gets me. I'm this complex creature. No one's ever felt these emotions, which I think a lot of teenagers feel. And I just had 100 pills that I knew would do me in if I took them. And I just, out of desperation, took them one night. And they definitely almost did me in. My granddad found me on the floor and, you know, had multiple seizures at that point in my own urine and took me to the hospital. And I was in a coma for several days, about three and a half days, and came out of it. They pumped me full of charcoal right away. And I had taken a medication called Tegretol. And it's a time release thing. So it wasn't like you could just pump that out. Was kind of already in there. And so they didn't know what was going to happen. They didn't know exactly how much Tegretol was in my system. And so, you know, after several days, I guess it fortunately worked its way out and. And I had to kind of stay in the hospital and do all this stuff. And the same friend that had betrayed me when I went back, I played soccer and she's in the locker room and she's like, making fun of me, like, in front of people. Hey, Liz, do you need. What do you need some. Your head hurts? Do you need. What do you need, like 80 Advil? I mean, just nasty person. I think she tried to pick a f. Fight with me at school. It's like, what is wrong with this human? Obviously deeply unhappy. Yeah. And was just such a betrayal because my family has taken care of her and I don't know. And I think I was able to find a really good group of friends after that. And in a lot of ways, by pretending not to be totally myself. I was a really good athlete. I was really good at dance. And I. I think that saved my life in a lot of ways. Having that talent, a really good gymnast, kept me sort of straight. And enough people caring about my outcome for their own, you know, benefit, really.

It drove you to achieve in some ways. And I can relate to that. I know so many people can Relate to that. And there's probably most of the buildings downtown in Austin that are built by trauma that's either unhealed or healed. And I reflect on your story, and your story is a mirror of so many other people's stories. But to me, I'm just like, what was it about your soul? There was something about you. There was some kind of soul contract, or whether you want to use esoteric language or not, there was some unique faculty, either in your heart or your soul, that allowed you to choose something different. Most people would probably take a different path. And there was one point actually where I think even before you were born, the contrast was already put in place because a lot of people were telling your mom, oh, you should get an abortion.

Everybody told her, you should get an abortion.

So with that, your mom was told to get an abortion. What does that bring up for you? When you see conversations now about pro choice and pro life?

That's a hard conversation for me to weigh in on because I just see, like, I see a baby in a mom's belly as a life with potential and not a potential life, right? And I, you know, I'm Christian, and so I believe that in a lot of ways. And. But I also understand the injustice of life, right? Like, what's worse? To have the baby gone before a problem can occur or to have a six year old getting cigarettes put out on their skin? Like, I mean, that's a real thing that happens or totally neglected. But at the same time, like, who are we to decide what great thing could come from that person's life? How many people are healed by people who have been broken and then found a way to transcend that brokenness and find joy even in miserable situations. And how many. How they impact other people's lives? And you know, there's just such a part of me that's like, give them a chance, you know, and who knows, like, having a baby can change your life. Like, and I think it gives you purpose. Which. One of our missions at Alive and well is to help people live out their purpose. And you can only do that when you're. Well to, to a very large, like, to the greatest extent possible. And I'm like, just give that, give it a chance. Give yourself the chance. Like, give yourself the credit that you can do this. And it's sad to me that we, we've said, like, let's. We'd rather have women in the workforce and, and you know, being a stay at home mom is such a waste. And I think it's an Amazing thing. I love being home with my kids. I love working too. I'm glad I have the option. I'm certainly glad I live in the society that we do. And if a woman doesn't want to have kids and wants to go work and be a lawyer or be an entrepreneur or be a cog in a machine and make her money and then go home at night and not have to worry about her job and travel when time, like that's your choice and so grateful we live in a place where that's an option for you.

It's such a heated topic and it's. And honestly it needs to be heated. I think if you look at Hawkins scale or just how we understand emotions and what processes through us when it comes to making decisions, especially for the welfare and the safety of others, there has to be a low level anger or despair in order to get to courage, in order to get to service. And I think about how you even were brought into the world was this massive vacuum, this massive contrast that in a way, I've heard this analogy before, it pulled the arrow so far back that by the time you had left high school and you met Michael and I believe you're in the banking industry at that point, something let go. Was there an event where your potential was actually shot, where the arrow was released?

I think it was. If I had to say, like just a moment would be when I realized that making money and having a title wasn't success. And it allowed me to then say like, well, what is it? There's. What is it the word? There's a term, it's called instinctive elaboration. Have you heard that?

No.

And it's kind of this idea that when you ask a question, it hijacks your brain, right? Like if you say, you know what color is so and so's car. This is very simple. And you're like, can't remember. And even if you can't remember, you, it's like in the back of your mind because your brain wants to close the loop on the question, right? It doesn't like to leave loops open.

Especially if you have OCD like me at times where I'm like, I gotta tick all the boxes.

I know. And you're like in the moment, like, why can't I remember with the color?

Yes.

And then you have to move on, because you have to move on. And. But the. Your brain still has that question floating. And one day in the middle of a conversation with someone else, you'll be like purple. And you. Because your brain needed to close the loop. And it's still, like, in the filing system back there, trying to figure it out. So it shows you the power that questions have on you over your whole, like, being what you're thinking about, what preoccupies you at just in the deepest levels. So if you're asking yourself, like, why did this happen to me? Why me? Why won't anyone help me? And I've kind of heard Sean Stevenson talk about this. I love his podcast, too. And if you're asking those questions, those questions aren't answerable. The world is filled with injustice. It's part of the equation.

Plus, there's so much mystery in the world. And this is why I understand. I have compassion for people that are atheists because they want proof that God, you know, exists before they believe. I just think that's flawed logic. Because if you're trying to find evidence that doesn't appear for any of us, whether you have faith or whether you don't have faith, you're never going to find it. It's something from the inside. And so I love what you said about, like, the question that lingers and the question that's been lingering for me for my whole life is, what is the meaning of all this? For some of us that experience so much trauma and so much pain, the only sense I can make of it is that we have to have contrast that's so deep. Otherwise it wouldn't be the propulsion that allows us to serve in the way that we serve. How do you feel about that?

As a society, we're in this pursuit of zero discomfort, instant gratification, zero discomfort. And without that contrast, without that journey, we can't show up in an authentic way for other people. We can't show up in a powerful way for other people. And, you know, I think that's what is. If we can change those questions, it allows us to feel the things we feel, but then. But be empowered by them, allow them to let that arrow go right for us. And. And I think a lot of this stems from insecurity, right? So part of my realization and letting that arrow go was dealing with a little bit of insecurity and just kind of this bouncing. And when you grow up the way I do, and then you find yourself in a cubicle next to kids who went to Wharton Business School, and you're like, I don't belong here. I went to Crowley High School, graduated in the bottom quartile of my class, went to college just by the skin of my teeth to do ballet. And then eventually did do really well in college. I mean, ballet's in college and did great once I figured out the school thing. But you just. There's like that imposter syndrome, right? Of like, do I really belong here? How did I get here? Instead of saying like, wow, I did some amazing things because this person had everything handed to them throughout their whole life, and I'm sitting in the same place as they are.

I found people, though, that do have silver spoon in their mouth, to use that metaphor. Or people that have been gifted everything, trust funders and whatnot. They don't always have the successful story either. So I guess it would be easy for most of us. And I used to have this view about money or people that came from money, which I did a lot of work on, to let go of it because I saw it as the judgment that was holding me back from money.

I've had that.

I realized that, wow, okay, if I'm angry and triggered and judgmental about somebody that's been afforded more opportunities than me, I'm actually blocking myself from those same opportunities. And it's more of an inside job, it's more of an awareness job. Because so many people that come from money, they become drug addicts, they are not successful, they go to the values.

Right? Really, that underlie that. And I've done the same thing where I was resentful and like, oh, this person just had everything. They're so lucky. But that goes back to asking yourself the right questions. Like, instead of saying, why them? Why not me? Why didn't I have this in your brain? Constantly trying to answer this unanswerable question and expending energy on this thing that it, it's just. It's just unfair. Life is just unfair. Do you want to be a victim all your life and sit around feeling sorry for yourself and blaming others? Are you going to say, okay, these were the cards I was dealt. What can I do? And place yourself back in the driver's seat. Place that ball of empowerment back in your court and taking it and running with it and surpassing all those people and really proving you can do anything right. And that's. I think one of my personal missions is like cycle breaking. Like, how do you break the cycle of madness, break the cycle of distrust, break the cycle of addiction? Just break those cycles of poor health. And you do that. One of the ways is by empowering yourself and asking yourself questions that are answerable that you can be accountable for. Like, I can't ask myself questions that depend on other people acting, because then that loop's never going to close. So I have to be able to say, like, what can I do? And then I can answer that question, and that closes that loop so that I'm not spending energy answering unanswerable questions in the back of my mind. I can now ask a bigger question, a better question, like, okay, what can I do for myself now? I'm out of this self thing where I don't need to just try to fix myself. Now it's like, what can I do for others now? What can I give back? And all of a sudden, you're not pitying yourself and sitting around.

Yeah, that awareness comes from doing the work, though. Yeah.

You can't.

You can't just flick light switch. I mean, it's easy in our social media world for people to, like, read books, go to conferences and get all the things and be intellectually smart, but to be emotionally intelligent, to be smart from your heart, from your soul, that is a whole different level of understanding. So you seem very emotionally intelligent to me in the times we've spoken, especially now. And I'm wondering, like, where did that come from? Because, you know, I don't know that your grandparents were necessarily the most emotionally intelligent. They were married for 60 years, right. So from that aspect, they showed you what love was like. You would see your grandfather, like, smack your grandma's ass in the kitchen. And there was all these cool little moments that you had as a child. But what is it about your upbringing that allowed you to have emotional intelligence? Or did that have nothing to do with it?

I think I always had emotional intelligence, even as a little kid. I just remember being very in tune with how people felt and how the things I did could make people feel. And I always have wanted to cheer people up and help them. I've always just every. This is the weirdest thing. Everywhere I go, people are like, do you know where this is? I could be at Nordstrom. I could be at Lululemon. I could be at Costco. I could be dressed in anything from a suit to yoga pants. And somebody will come up to me and say, do you know where this is? I'm like, do I just look so helpful?

You're like, there's no name tag on my shirt.

But I think that comes out. Like, people just. Just think that I'm there to help them. And. And I am. I'll help anybody, anywhere, and just always really in tune to that. And I don't know. Yeah, I do think that's helped me throughout my life. Helps me connect with People. So it's a gift for sure to me. And having. I have a lot of self awareness, which is such a gift too, because I can be acting totally irrational and crazy and tell you like, I know this and here's why. And I'm kind of crazy right now, the action. But I'm very self aware and it helps me kind of move on later. And. But some of it, you can be too self aware to a point where you're. The self awareness makes you insecure. And I did have an experience when I was 19. I lived in the Caribbean. So I was. I went to tcu. I had a ballet scholarship and I went to. Decided that I couldn't go to tcu, couldn't afford it. Number one, it was a very big change from going from being like growing up the way I did to stepping into. There were 7,500 students there at the time. 5,500 were Greek. It was just a totally different world that I didn't understand like what rich kids did, you know, And a lot, they weren't all that way. But in my mind back to that resentment about being born not rich. And so I stepped away from that. And I was very lost at that time. Not lost. I was hard working. I had two or three jobs at a time and knew I should go to school because I felt like that was the only way out of my situation. And my parents sacrificed everything in life for me, my grandparents, for me to try to find that. And I did. And then I just wasn't very good at it at first. I didn't know how to study. I didn't know how to prioritize really well. I knew I needed to make money to live. So I would just prioritize work and eating and paying my rent over, you know, going to school or whatever and sacrificing in that way to maybe give it. But it wasn't even a sacrifice. It wasn't like I'm going to give up shopping. It's like I'd have to give up living in my house. So I had to work because I didn't have anyone to help me. And anyway, so I just had to do all that work and was pretty resentful about it and would drop classes after class. I would load up for a semester and then drop it. And I was like, man, I just don't know what I'm doing. This opportunity to go live in the Caribbean came up and I just moved.

It sounds like there was no real governor inside of yourself as to how to learn, enjoy the Art of learning how to get things done without stressing yourself out. It's almost like the calibration inside of you was never really gifted to you. Maybe you didn't see it because the grandparents, your parents, were working from midnight, you know, through the night. So without, as a child, without the right direction in your own experience, how do you see that play out for the people that come into the center now that need the deepest healing when they didn't receive. And it's not about shaming our parents, by the way. I'm not sitting here crying a story saying because of mom and dad, this is why my life worked out this way. That's actually not the case because you and I are living proof that we can change the direction. We don't have to go that way. But I'm curious how you see that in your own life and in the lives of people that need the deepest healing. How does that manifest for people when they're not born with the skills and the governor of their own emotions, of their own faculties?

Yeah, well, it's just kind of realizing that the people around you did the best they could and not blaming them either, because that's disempowering.

It's easy to do though.

It's so easy to do.

I'm this way because of my mom or my dad. It's like, well, it's not true.

And that's disempowering. So just reminding people that they have a lot more control than they, than they think they do. The statistic I read recently was I'm not sure exactly how they measure this, but this study said that less than 1% of like disease is actually from genetics. That's truly from like a genetic mutation. Less than 1% of all disease.

Yeah.

You know what that means? That means you have tremendous power over your outcome and tremendous out a tremendous ability to change your own path and you just need the tools to do that. Our current medical system does not provide you those tools. It's a sick care system. I don't care to work within that system. It's very broken. I would, you know, heard it. The best reference is to call it the, you know, medical industrial complex. Right. Like it's true. It's a money making machine. How can we get as many people into it and stay into it for all their lives? Make them easy to control. Right. We're starting to get into conspiracy theories.

No, it's all good. I heard someone say this on the podcast three years ago. It was Chris Crowd Kresser and he Said that genetics load the gun, but behavior pulls the trigger. I mean, that is like. Everybody understands that just because you have a loaded gun doesn't mean you ever have to use it.

That's right.

Period. End of story.

So when you understand that in a, in a meaningful way and you start to see it come, you start to see the power that your behavior has over the way you feel. I mean, I hope that's what's empowering to people. And they come into Alive and well. And we, we kind of didn't get into the full. We got into the functional medicine part, but we also have the, the best kind of clinical grade supplements you can buy all in one place. You don't have to go to every little website. We wholesale with Best Partners. We curate the best kind of most bioavailable supplements out there that can help support people in that and help them make changes. And we have all the holistic therapies, right? The red light, the sauna, the cold plunge, and we do facials and things like that. Got to take care of the outside too. Acupuncture, all those different things. And that's what we hope Alive and well does for people is they come in lost and confused and not sure why this is happening to them, feeling like it's unfair that this is happening to them. Not sure why there's a disconnect between what they feel like they want to accomplish in life or feel like they should be able to accomplish in life and why they can't do it. And that's what we want to be there for, is to like, give them that knowledge, give them that grounding. Like, it doesn't matter if you were lost before. You're here now, and we're going to get you on your way and we're going to create this new pathway for you so that you can live out your purpose in the way that you should have and give you power back to yourself.

So by the time people get to Alive and well, they have been in the chrysalis for a long time. They've been spinning around in liquid. Maybe the chrysalis is starting to open and they're about to grow the wings. But the worst thing, and I heard a friend of mine say this once, actually she said it on the podcast, it was Christine Hassler, and she said, never rob someone of their process. Yeah, and I think that's so important. When people come to you, there's probably a lot of emotional stuff that comes out. I would assume that Alive and well people, there's probably somebody Crying there every day, which is a good thing. I used to think, you know, sometimes it's me. Before I started this podcast, I was like the traditional male where I didn't cry. And if I did, I did it in secret. And I wasn't really necessarily intelligent about the things that were going on in me. I didn't have any awareness of my energy and motion, my emotion. So when people come there, they have so much energy and motion. That's stuck with some of the therapies that you give them and some of the healing that you give them. What does it make people change? What is outside tools of wellness make people start changing from the inside on an emotional level?

I think when they regain the. When they gain the awareness that they can control it and that they don't have to give their agency to someone else. They don't have to give their outcome to someone else. And if they can own that right, like, that's so empowering. And most people come to live and, well, I don't know how this happened, but it just kind of came to be. They have autoimmune issues. And that is the most frustrating thing to have because your body is literally fighting against itself. And how do you heal that? It's symptomatic. Symptom control is what modern medicine, like would tell you is the case. And just telling people like, this isn't your fault. It doesn't matter what you happened before you got here. We can change it now. And that's what's so incredible about humans. We have this amazing power to heal and regenerate. Like, my dad has been a drug addict. He's, you know, he's currently going through a program right now. He's been a drug addict for my whole Life for over 40 years. And not just any old drugs, like nasty crystal meth, like losing his teeth, but the guy looks good. Like if you met him, be like, that's a nice looking older man. And he's still very articulate. And for someone who's not educated, he's very smart. And definitely, if you get really talking to him, you. You feel the deterioration, you can see it. And if you're someone who's been around a lot of drug addicts, you can see some in the movements he makes and things. But it just baffles my mind and encourages me so much that someone who's been on those kind of drugs for four decades can have a life still. Like, knowing whatever happened to you before is so you are not unhelpable. And that is so Powerful. If you can realize, like, wow, I'm not unhelpable. I can have this. And people get glimpses of it. Because autoimmune is tough, because you'll feel better, better, better, better. And then something happens. You're exposed to some allergy, you have a someone dies in your life, trauma occurs, stress, and it kind of sets you back a little and you got to keep going. And just when they understand it's a journey and not an overnight thing, and when they can, when they could come to the realization that a pill is not going to fix it for them and that doing the work is part of the journey and it's part of the reward. Like, having this amazing control over what happens to you can be frustrating when you aren't readily ready up for the challenge. And people come to us at various stages. Like, some people have tried everything. Some people just stumbled upon us early in their process. And just saying, where are you? Especially when it comes to food stuff. People are very emotional eaters. They're very touchy about what you tell. If you tell them to eat, that control over what goes in your body, it's very much a control issue for many people. And when you tell people to eat differently and that it's changed their lifestyle in a certain way or to prioritize sleep, and it's hard for people.

Yeah, I mean, control of food, I battled. I was £280 at one point. So I know all about that. And for me and for all of us that have dealt with food issues, it's control is the coping mechanism. It's like the mechanism that allows us to feel safe. If I can control my food, then I can control my state, but it's actually not the case. It's the paradox. Because if I'm hyper vigilant and if I'm trying to control my food so much, then I'm actually missing out on the natural flow of life where I don't have to micromanage my food, where there's not like food addiction or food issues at all. And I could see that manifest in so many other ways, too, because a lot of what we talk about on this podcast is the Pentagon, right? Like, we all live in a house. This is the only house we get. We're not going to get another one. And so there's two walls on my diagram, a floor and a ceiling, and it's the Pentagon. It's the mental, physical, emotional, spiritual, and financial wellness that we all have to manage at all times. And if one of those pieces starts to Lack it's going to siphon life force energy from the other spaces. So I can see it alive and well. And I'm curious how you feel about this. People come in for one thing, but they actually are looking for another.

Right. They come in because they want to try a supplement or they come in for a pharmaceutical drug and they pass by these supplements. And maybe the fifth time they come in there to pick up their prescription, they ask a question or they tell us about some side effect they're experiencing from their medication and we're like, oh, you know what? That's because it's depleting your magnesium. Let's take this magnesium supplement and check back in in a few weeks and see how you're sleeping. See if your cognition's improved, you know, the elements. Hey, have you tried adding minerals and things to your water? Because that's impact you in a great way. And yeah, so they come in there for that and then all of a sudden they're like addicts of doing the cold plunge, you know, or they're making their first functional medicine appointment with one of our practitioners. And so, yeah, they come in there and it's amazing to have the ecosystem there because we don't have to say, yeah, okay, I think what you need is this X and you need to go across town for that. And we just keep trying to pack more treatments into this space. We'd love to get into some more things. Like we're doing the Evo 2, where we can help remove toxins from your bloodstream. And that's kind of a newer thing. We're just always looking for the next thing. We'd love to be able to do stem cells, so just kind of figuring out what's going to be most impactful to people and where we can add on to that ecosystem so you don't have to go a million places and that all your practitioners know each other and they're talking to each other and they know about you and they've spent pouring over your medical history and they know how you feel from day to day and they've seen you change over the over time.

And so I love it so much and I've been there and I feel like in order for us to really live life well, we have to make wellness our fun hobby. Like, it has to be something that you geek out on that, that you just enjoy, like what else is coming. What's down the. You have to enjoy it.

Yeah. And if you don't, you at least need to be protective. Protective of your house. Like must, we must protect this house. Right. Like you built your little house and just say like, no, I'm not gonna allow food in my life that hijacks my brain. Like, I'm not gonna eat fried food inside of processed oils with whatever other sugar additives and colors that are gonna hijack my, my thinking and hijack my taste buds. And just being protective of like what you're working with. And you're just like, you would be a regular house. Yeah, I'm standing outside of my house with a gun. You know, like, you can't. I'm not gonna let anything in here that is going to change my experience of life. Right. And but you have, if you have a lot of trauma, it's hard because you don't want to experience life because it's hurt you. And so I think finding that space for healing those kind of things is really important. And we kind of started down that path when I was telling you I lived in the Caribbean, so we moved there and I was 19 at the time and we went to, I lived in that Virgin Islands in St. Croix and went over to the British Virgin Islands where shroom tea is legal. I've never been into drugs. Not someone who's like really ready to go down that path given my parents history and both being drug addicts and just very judgmental about that kind of stuff at that age for sure. And was like, oh, a tea, what could that do? Little did I know the most potent.

Way to absorb it possible in a tea.

And so, you know, was 8pm 7am the next morning. Well, I'm watching the grass grow. I just had an epiphany in my life that it didn't have to be the way it was. I didn't have to wait tables for the rest of my life and that I was smart and I could go to school if that's what I wanted to do and if I thought that was my way out and you know, long story short, I, I was able to head on, take, take on some of the insecurities that I felt like. I kind of mentioned this maybe in my story that you heard before with was that because I didn't like my life, a way to cope with that was to sort of build another life in my mind and let that be like my life to other people. So you know, at 17, 18, 19 years old, I would, you know, just have these little stories about how I went skiing with my parents and we drove to Colorado in whatever car and spent Christmas in a certain way and you know, That I grew up with certain things that that was the opposite. Like I've never, never barely left the city of Fort Worth with my parents growing up and definitely had no money whatsoever and so just was a made up life that I thought sounded better to people. And when I, when I did the shroom tea, I was like, that is so dumb. You don't need to do that. Like, and I, I had this sort of inner child or which I didn't know that that's what it was called at the time. And I was like, that sucks that that happened to you, but that is not who you are. And those things made you strong and made you who you are now. And you're very. And it just allowed me to see myself good, bad and ugly without judgment. Right. Like it takes that ego down where you can view your life. And it allowed me to confront my insecurities head on in different ways. So, you know, by 7:00am the next day, I would tell you I was literally like 90% cured of all that stuff and was able to just say, okay, now here's what I want to do. I called anyone I'd ever lied to that I could contact and told them because I needed to be done with that and I needed to know that people accepted me the way I was and if they didn't, then that's on them. And so I called people and I said, I just, I want you to know this about me and I'm really sorry if I hurt you and I'm embarrassed and I understand if you don't ever want to talk to me again. And everybody was so awesome. They're like, it makes no difference to me. And people are so much more understanding than I thought they would be. And that allowed me to feel like, let myself be loved and I hadn't really been good at that before. And just to let people love me. Even the ugly parts and the sensitive underbelly, and that's just a beautiful thing. And it allowed me to kind of move on with my life and be authentically. Because when you're hiding behind and untruth and lies, let's just call it what it is, it's hard to say that about myself. I was a liar and now I'm not. So when you're hiding under those things, there's just. You're on alert. Like, what if I get exposed? What if someone knows me or meets someone I knew who I grew up with and they find this out and. And that kind of happened to me. My boyfriend at the time, he caught me in a lie and I had to deal with it. And that's when. And then we did the stream tea. He was so forgiving and so gracious and understood and we cried and, and it was awesome. And that was the first step towards like letting someone love me the way I was. And then we did just room tea together shortly after. And it just like peeled everything else away and it. And then I was able to step into meeting people fully myself, right. And, you know, vulnerable and all. Which is why I'm so open about sharing my story.

The love that I felt in your story, I actually felt like I was there with you on the islands because I could. I could see you maybe even laying on the grass and just breathing. And I had a really similar moment like that where I actually felt God's love. And, and I know a lot of people, like we, we just a few weeks ago, we did a podcast with Ben Greenfield and it was like an exclusive show where he basically told us, here's why I'm not doing any more plant medicine ever again. Or maybe I'll microdose her, I'm not sure. Because there's such a double edged sword to what you've shared. Like, for you, it's so beautiful and so powerful because it brought a new level of consciousness to you. When we open up the portal using entheogens or medicines like that, there can be so much love that pours in because it creates the spaciousness for it. And the spaciousness that's created can also bring in dark energies as well, depending on how we feel served, the medicine and the intention, the set and setting and all that. And I had a moment like that when I was in Catalina on a men's group and I had drank some tea as well. And I was laying there and I could actually feel the earth breathing. And I could feel my grandpa. His birthday is in a couple weeks. I've been feeling him really strong lately. Last night I got hardly any sleep because of the full moon. When there's full moons, it just starts affecting me more. And I just have been feeling him lately. And I remember feeling his presence that. That afternoon on Catalina island, we had climbed all the way up to like this sunny field where there was those big grass things floating to the side and there was breeze coming in and I looked up at the sky and I actually felt his hand. I felt his hand come down and he just said, you know, when it comes to women, I need you to be careful and I need you to be kind. Because I wasn't at that time. And it was like the most powerful wave of emotion. I mean, I can, like, feel it right now. And I. And I think about the ways that we get the medicine we need when we ask for it the right way.

Yeah. And that is something I did want to touch on if I shared that story, because I don't necessarily want to go out encouraging people to go.

We don't think you are. We totally don't think you are.

I do think it. I can't tell you how many people I know in Austin that they're plant medicine gurus. And.

Yeah.

But I'm. It's not the right way to do it. It's. It's a. It's an escape. Right.

It's one way to God, but it's not the only way, for sure.

And I think people do do it too much. And at some point, you're kind of just a drug addict. Like, if you're taking plant medicine weekly, you're not doing. You're not doing it the right way.

Monthly. If you're doing a ceremony every month.

Then you just like to be on drugs.

Yeah.

Or you just like to be out of it. And it's. It's. You're not really. Then you're not having the space in between to unpack what came to the surface. Right. Like, yes, a lot of unpacking happens when you do those kind of things kind of on its own.

Yeah.

But you need time to integrate that in your life, and a month is not a right amount of time. So I think it's really important to look into the. The right one for you. Like, I've never done ayahuasca. Sort of debate whether that's something I need to do in my life. But like, my dad, who's a drug addict, I haven't proposed this to him yet, but I want him to try Iaboga. Like, ayahuasca might actually bring more darkness to his life. And that man's got some demons. So I wouldn't want to be in the same room as him while he's taking. If he's taking something like ayahuasca, I'd just be like, what's gonna come on me? But, like, there's different medicines for different kinds of healing. And. And he needs the right facilitator who's powerful enough to be in the same room with when that evil comes off.

Of him, you know, Liz, also, on top of what you just shared, which is so key, there's also the healing spiral. Like, when you came into the studio today, you were like, hey, you know, I've actually been feeling some stuff since I moved over to Dallas, and I loved being back and being kind of in my groove here.

Oh, my gosh, I'm gonna cry or something, but if I cry, it's okay.

That's all right. We're human beings. I love your honesty, and I love the way that you show up and people use those terms like, oh, brother, sister. I love how you're showing up. Like. No, what I'm saying is I really love how you show up because you, to most people that don't know, you have the success, the trappings. But what I really love is ever since I've known you, and especially in this podcast, you've really told us the truth. And I love that the medicine peeled back the layers for you. It's not something you need to go to all the time, but also there's this understanding. I remember Kelly Brogan shared with me this on a podcast. She said that healing is a spiral. So sometimes you're going to have contraction in your healing. Sometimes you're going to have massive expansion. And I think it's really amazing that we all accept the truth that you could get so far, and then all of a sudden you move to Dallas, things come up for you, and it's actually part of the contraction of your healing spiral again. Because I don't know if any of us, Liz, are ever fully healed in this lifetime. Maybe some of us. Us get to be. But talk to me about that for you, because it seems like you have a beautiful trajectory. There's all this healing, things are good, and then there's a spiral. There's a contraction. How is that unfolding for you? Because it's a mirror for all of us.

Yeah, so we just moved to Dallas because we're doing something amazing. We're going to build a second location of alive and well there. And we. I have two stepdaughters that live in Dallas, and this is going to allow our entire family to be close together. So it's beautiful reasons to be there, and I am excited about that in most ways. And we found a great house and a great neighborhood and a beautiful little cul de sac with a bunch of little kids. Little kids ages and really welcoming people. And I should be so happy, but I hate my life right now. I mean, I'm not happy. And. And I think that's okay. I think people need to understand you're not going to be happy all the time, but I still have a lot of Joy. And even though I actually feel kind of depressed, I feel very depressed, actually. And the way that shows up in my life is detachment. Probably. Growing up the way I did, I did have to detach a lot in order just to kind of survive. Like, I used to pretend to sleep when I was a little kid because my uncle and his friends would be walking through my room naked, masturbating, and I would just turn to the wall and pretend I was. Was asleep. And they would walk from their room across the hall to my bedroom to get into my bathroom and do who knows what they would wear my clothes, I mean, just messed up things. And I kind of go back to that little kid of like, just. Just turn, look the other way. Shut down your emotions. And so I get very apathetic and detached. And I think it's important to cultivate discipline in your life because discipline shows up for you all the time. Once it's a habit. The way motivation is like, a little bit sketchier, right? So right now I have. Because of the apathy I'm feeling, despite the amazing things we're doing, I'm not motivated. I'm not motivated, which keeps me from being creative at a time when I really need to be. And I just feel real detached. But I go through the motions and get it done and no one's the wiser, probably because I have that discipline in my life that I've cultivated. So that just keeps showing up for me day after day, even though I don't show up for myself. And the motivation's not there. But I wouldn't say I've felt suicidal by any means, but I definitely will be driving. And, like, what if I let go of the steering wheel? Like, dark thoughts, really. But I think it's important not to judge yourself for those thoughts and just to let them pass through you and. And know they're dark and know they're not forever. And keep asking yourself the right questions, like, what can I do in this moment to stop this? What practice did I cultivate while I was. Well, that can help me now. Like, I love cold plunge for that reason that hard stuff happens. And my body, my nervous system knows what to do when it's fight or flight time, right? It's like, this is the time to fight. And so I just haven't. I don't like Dallas yet. The people are different. And no, this is not the case. I feel like everyone I meet is one dimensional and they're not. They're certainly not. And I've already kind of met some People that have more going on than I initially thought. Our neighbors are so sweet, but we haven't found our circle yet. We don't have an actual physical place to go into work every day. And being here, when I walked into live and well, yesterday I just wanted to like, hug everyone and cry because I'm so grateful for our employees and you know, kind of talking about it. They're amazing and we're fortunate to have them and that, you know, we must be doing something right to draw them in and have them show up for people that come into our. Walk in our doors and show up for us every day. And just coming here and the, the beauty of Austin, the natural beauty. Like in Dallas, Michael and I were driving around looking for somewhere to work again because we don't have an office yet. And I was like, it just feels like it's building after building. Yeah. And it made a whole new meaning of concrete jungle in my mind. And it's depressing when you're used to living in the hills with beautiful trees. We lived right off of Lake Travis when we lived here in Austin. And you would drive in our neighborhood and you would catch a glimpse of the lake and it was just so peaceful and beautiful and you could drive in from downtown and just take a breath when you got into the neighborhood or just, just driving around and seeing the cliff sides, you know, where we've, where we've created roads now, but you can just see the layers of earth that were there before and they're all around you. And taking that for granted. Driving over the 360 bridge and having the lake on either side of you and moving to Austin. And we live by a lake, but you wouldn't ever get in it. It's dirty and we live right by a trail. But it's, it's all man made. And Dallas is pretty in that way, but it's very man made. And I'm used to Austin now and. And I'm sad. I'm sad in Dallas and I won't be shortly, I'm sure, but in the meantime, I. While I'm getting there, it's. It's been hard.

There's something so powerful about just being honest. And not always. I mean, we're here on a podcast that tens of thousands of people are going to see and listen and you're just like, yeah, this is how I am. I mean, that in itself is the antidote to the bullshit that I think people are eating in this world right now. Now where everybody's got to have their stuff together at all times. And if you're successful, then you have to, quote, act successful all the time. I actually think it's, it's the other way around. I think that the most successful people I know, they're just really honest about what they're going through because leadership like that can be trusted. Anytime I've ever done something from a leadership perspective where I hold something back or I'm not really sharing like with my executive assistant or with my, my team that produces the videos, it like comes through in the content, you know, and so I'm sure this manifests for you in so many different ways where if you're just honest with people, even if it's hard like you were with us right now, there's like a relief. There's a relief for all of us. It's like we feel it when there's honesty present. We all feel the relief of that. Because holding the mask and pressurizing yourself and not wanting to get caught, it's like a never ending incessant job.

Yeah. And it, I mean, it's kind of like when I was pretending to be someone I wasn't and when I was young. And it's, it's the same thing. You're pretending everything's hunky dory when it's not. And that's just life. And I think a lot of what's wrong in our world is this pursuit of total 100% justice for all. It's not possible. It's not possible. And it's, it's so unfair. And if you're sitting in an ivory tower thinking everything has to be equally distributed for everyone and everyone has to have the same amount of happiness and joy and access to everything, A. That just brings it down for anyone who can get it because, you know, everyone just is different. It's just unfair. And I think when you can realize that and then once you've stabilized yourself, then you start reaching out to other people and helping them find those things. And, and it's a sad, sad thing. And it's. You know, you could get nihilistic about it and be like, life is so unfair, but that's not the right attitude either.

Yeah.

And so finding that balance between never stopping, pursuing, attempting to bring those things to everyone and having equality and equity in different things and never stopping that effort, but also realizing you can't fix it all. And the harder you go down that path of trying to give everyone everything, the more you dampen the high. Right. The high can no longer be up here because it's gotta, it comes down here naturally over time when you try to spread it.

Yeah, that's what medication does. It makes people kind of in the midline and it never allows the highs and lows to be felt. And what you're talking about is extrapolated. You mentioned the gender dysphoria earlier and I think that is actually one, one prong of a multi armed monster that we're all being faced with right now in society. And that is the return to normalcy, the return to nature's laws. Like nature is so beautiful, right? Nature sometimes can be very unkind. But nature also isn't cruel. There are certain laws in nature that we follow and our life works out better. But when we fight against nature, for example, if people are over caffeinated, not sleeping enough, gut dysbiosis on the physical side it manifests in disease in an autoimmune. But on the emotional side and on the mental health side, if I'm tacitly going along with whatever my quote leaders say or my community say, but inside of me there's a faculty that goes ah, my somatic experience of what's happening right now is that this is bullshit. I actually don't believe that a four year old boy could be able to change his gender. I don't believe that a 13 year old should be going through the tragedies that they're going through with YouTube and with specifically TikTok and the Chinese Communist Party that's infiltrated TikTok and we've talked about this with Sky King as well. In other words, there's so many dominoes that are stacked against youth right now. I feel like at times it can be overwhelming for me. So I have to be very careful and I'm curious how you feel. How do you and I, how do we modulate how much we care, how much we effort towards the world we know is possible versus how much do we just live and let live?

Right? Because you don't want to sit at home. I mean you could be mad all day reading news headlines and watching videos and you could spend all day just being angry. But I think it's finding your purpose. Like where can you actually make an impact in all of that and not letting everything else go because just like your body, everything's a system, all right? Like you can't touch one aspect of policy without impacting some other aspect of policy. Right? Like if you're going to start messing with the gender stuff in schools and teaching that also touches the medical system, that also, I mean Touches a lot of other systems, and nothing is kind of its own little vacuum. And. But understanding, like, where can I make an impact? And. And that's different. Might be different at different stages of your life. Like right now I have little kids, and my priority is my little kids and protecting them and defending them. And I want to protect other people's little kids too, if I can and where I can. But I do think if you can make small impacts in your community that vibrates outwardly, right? Like, if I can make sure that I'm on top of what my kids are being taught and not taught in school, that that's going to vibrate out to other people's kids who maybe they're in a different stage in their life where they are in a point in their career where they're so focused on that they can't be monitoring everything their kids are doing. And it's a small impact, but it's, you know, like that butterfly effect, right? Like your small impact can expand outwardly to other people.

You mentioned your kids, and for me, that's a big one because. Because whenever I get into my low spots and I loved how you presence this for us when we're feeling low, it's okay to just name it and just be honest about it, because then really by doing that, it takes away some of the pressure or the shame or the aloneness in that feeling. It's like, hey, I'm feeling like shit today.

Everyone.

It's all good, right? But did that shift for you when you had kids? And as a mom, I know for me, on days where I, quote, don't feel good, or maybe I'm down, or maybe it's a day where I'm just like, yeah, today kind of sucks. I still get this love from Nova that's so strong. And it's like, you know, when I hold my son or when I see him laughing or when I see him growing, that creates such a fire in me. That creates such a. A fire of love and a fire of momentum that I really feel like potentially higher intelligence. God brought children here to remind us what life is all about and what the anchor of our being actually is supposed to be attached to.

And it's such a shame that we as a society have moved away from the family. Like, we don't promote that. In fact, it seems to be discouraged.

Why do you think that is? Why do you think we've moved away from the family in this society?

Well, I think it's a lot easier to create allegiance to the government when you don't have anyone to count on. Right. Like you don't have a family member to go to for your problems. Well, who are you going to go to? You can got, you got to get some kind of solution. It's hard to, you're not a, you really shouldn't be just a lone wolf. Right. That's not how we are. Yeah. And so the government becomes the answer to that. I think it's controlling, I think pe. The government wants to control our lives and that's a lot easier to do.

I love that you're like laughing while.

You say that because I know it sounds crazy to say.

No, it doesn't, it doesn't sound crazy.

But I, I, I think, I don't know how intentional it is, is, but I think there is, it's intentional. I mean if you go back and nobody studies history. I started college as a history major. My granddad growing. I love history when I grew up. Yeah, me too.

So fun.

We used to read Encyclop. We had Encyclopedia Britannica in our house. It was like an old copy. And my granddad and I used to just read it every day and he would read it to me and we would talk about history. And I was very into World War II history when I was in college. College before I switched to, I have an accounting degree, but before I switched to that I was really into history and very specific part of history. I loved World War II and I loved gender roles in World War II. And that doesn't just mean men versus women. Like how did kids live in that, how did the rich live in that, how did the poor live in that and what that experience was like. And when you study that, you study, you know, communism and you study about the Holocaust and then you study about the roots of those, where those ideas came from and you just, you see it. The first thing that all of those movements have in common is to divide society, to divide the family, to indoctrinate children, to not respect their parents and to create that divide and to then have. Because whatever you believe, it's, it's so obvious to me that we are beings created to worship. And whether that is money or God, everybody worships something. Self seems to be the new thing that people are worshiping these days. And there's a hole in our hearts and to me it's a God sized hole. And if you don't fill it with God, it gets filled with something. And, and so there's a huge push against religion. And whether you are religious or Christian, I Don't think we could say that. Yes, a lot of negative things have come from Christianity and of course we talk about those. But a lot of beautiful things come from there and values. And we don't see it because our society is founded on Judeo Christian values. So even if you're not religious, you benefit from those values of family and community and not killing people and not stealing. People don't realize in this country because they don't study history. The world was freaking scary before Judeo Christian values sort of became the foundation. People were child sacrifice, multiple wives, abusive women. Like the world was dark before these things came to be. And you know, we don't see it or value it because we don't understand that. And it's just so all around us we take it for granted that people don't kill people. Like that wasn't.

Well, they do, but there's consequences now that maybe didn't exist before.

And then it's immoral. Right? Like there's a moral code to it. And we take that for granted that that moral code existed before and it really didn't in the same way. And so I don't know, I just see that the movement away from God, it gets replaced with something, is my point. And so then we replace it with ideology, right? And we can replace it with science. We can replace it with, with the love of money and pursuit of career, like all these different things. And so that when you fill that hole, that becomes the kind of guiding light for your life. Okay, so I'm gonna chase this job. I'm going to chase this. I'm going to believe in my ideology so powerfully that I would scream in your face and think you're a horrible person because you don't agree with me. Me, it's a new religion. And so I think it. I think it's pretty intentional, honestly. And when you remove God and you remove the family, it's a lot easier to control people.

There's. There's so many things here, and I don't think it has anything to do with consistency.

Garbage.

Yes. That's a big.

Not even real food. And they're constantly sick. That makes them a lot easier to control.

Well, look at all the, the sides of the house that I presented earlier. The Pentagon. If from a mental standpoint, people are being addicted to scrolling and then judging their value off of how many likes or things that they have. And that's starting at like 4 years old, 5 years old, super young. And then also from the media standpoint, from an emotional Health standpoint that's being attacked. Where young kids are being confused about, are they a boy, are they a girl? This is not something like it really. It touches the most fiercest part of my heart, this whole gender dysphoria conversation. Because once you take away the innocence of a child, they can never get it back unless they're called on a spiritual path to come back around as an adult and come back home. I know, but the majority of people don't come back home. So what I'm saying is once you take away the innocence of a child, once you get into a child's psyche and you confuse them about sexuality, you confuse them about the sacredness of sex, it is so challenging for that to be repaired. And that is actually the brokenness that is being propagated right now.

You're priming for brokenness.

You're priming me for brokenness.

When teenage, young, you know, young adult men were touching me as a kindergartner, like, that caused me to detach in a lot of ways. And fortunately, I didn't have like a slutty phase in my life. But, you know, I hate for my sister to hear this, but she did. And that's. Some of it is from that. And. And I. This movement towards like everything for pleasure at all costs costs. It costs more than people think. It costs your humanity. Sleeping around dehumanizes yourself and it dehumanizes other. And it's all in this pursuit for pleasure. And what will you sacrifice in this pursuit for pleasure? And it's the answer is anything for instant gratification. And if you don't. To me, it's like more masculine and more manly to control your most. Your most base drive. Like that is masculinity. Michael and I didn't have to sex before we got married. That to me, whoa.

That is traditional.

We did once and then we decided not to because he. It was a. I don't know. He just felt like that was a good way for us to have. We had lots of passion toward each other and could you do other stuff?

Yeah, other stuff, but not the thing. Wow, that is such. I mean, I. It might. It wasn't my path, but. Wow. I can totally respect.

And I, you know, I get it's not everyone's path, but what it said to me was that I can trust this man in any situation. Like if he can not give in to this intense passion.

Yeah.

Then I'm not worried about this person fooling around on me one day. I'm not worried about this. If A man can control those most base desires and hone them in and, and then find that person to share it with with. Like, that's pretty amazing. And that level of self control is insane. And it just says a lot to me. But I also think, you know, that doesn't have to be everyone's path, but just being. It's dehumanizing to act like an animal with everybody, you know, and so I just. And there's all kinds of studies coming out about this too, and about, you know, when you do finally find it makes it harder for you to connect with someone in like a marriage kind of situation or a lifelong partner because you have numbed and overstimulated parts of your, you know, your arousal and your different hormones and you actually. The chemical, it's like doing drugs over time. Like you're releasing chemicals when you have certain activities and it dulls things, it heightens things for a little while, but over time those sensors get dull and it's difficult for you to connect, to have a real relationship with somebody. It's difficult for you to. You have to go further and further and further to kind of get pleasure. And the addiction to porn, like if you can keep people addicted to porn, you got them.

Well, this is it, because in 2019, a friend of mine, Drew Manning, he went public with his struggle with porn addiction. And about a year after, so did I. Because it was something that just owned my life for so long. And it wasn't until late 2019 actually, that I was served some very strong ayahuasca down in Costa Rica. And I don't wish my journey on anyone, but it took me two years to like, really heal myself, heal my psyche, and honestly reconnect with God. I had a mentor, Paul Check, that helped me heal. He taught me some very divine prayers and some techniques to get rid of the energy and the entity. But I had a psychic break. And it goes back to what we were talking about earlier, where plant medicine is not for everybody, everyone, right? And I would say it's probably not for most. If you do feel called, just know that you're going to have to receive God's love in that space. And if you're not ready to receive that, then you better be careful of unearned wisdom. Because just because you go to these places doesn't mean that you're ready to actually visit. And I was feeling that when you were sharing because I thought, wow, for me, the 20 plus years of porn, it really came. That was my addiction. Some people have marijuana, some people have drugs. Some people have shopping. Like, it is what it is. And there's so much, like, light. I can talk about it without shame now because there's so much lightness in me just being honest, which has been, like, the anchor of you and I here today. If we're honest about our stuff and we're honest about how we're healing it or how we've healed it, then it opens up that door for other people to do the exact same thing. And that is the most honest, powerful thing that I think we were put here to do. Because anytime I'm trying to pretend like. Like, everything's okay or, you know, I don't. Of course, like, thoughts come. Like, you're in the car and you were saying, oh, what if I just let go of the wheel? Thoughts come for me still with porn. It's not like it's out of my life forever. But I choose to connect with Carrie. I choose to connect with my son. I consciously choose to be with my family because. And this is the key. I have felt the insane amount of despair and pain of what my life would be like if I chose the other way. And so.

But what if you don't have. What if you're the person who doesn't have that? Like, that's those people. That is there. That is all there.

When you say that, what do you mean? Like, the porn.

Who doesn't have the positive thing to go to? Like, that's creating that when you haven't had it. It's so much easier to scroll all day. It's so much easier to watch porn.

Well, they're gonna. Eventually, they're ripe for transformation. Like, something's gonna come along. Whether it's like, a death or a disease or some kind of. Of radical event that's going to give them a sledgehammer. I hope. I actually hope that that happens to everyone. Because when you're leading life that far out of alignment, you are ripe for transformation. You are actually calling in the sledgehammer of change. And sometimes it can be so shocking that honoring the mystery here. I don't know if we're meant to figure it out in one life. I don't. I don't know if everybody's meant to walk the path that you have in any way, because some people obviously choose the other. This has been such a good conversation. We have covered so much ground.

Yeah.

And I think about the areas we've explored, and it's something that I really see you doing. I can see you being on, like, Oprah and other podcasts and like, really getting after it, because this is the message we need to hear. And it's what you were actually told by God when you had the tea. And it was like, I can choose another way. I can actually live another way. What do you think we missed? You know, we. We did talk about quite a bit, but what did we miss about your life story and about maybe what you're even still integrating that you can offer as wisdom to the people that are here.

You know, just that adaptation and being able to say, like, every day is not good. So I think, you know, we can definitely cover that. Not every day is a good day, but it doesn't mean you're not moving in the right direction. And receiving help was something really difficult for me all throughout my life, even to this day, I struggle with. I have to admitting, like, I can't do it all. And we have. We just sold a business, but we've got several other businesses, also run a bakery and we have a restaurant downtown and a meal prep company. And I have four kids, two of my own, two stepchildren, and being a wife and trying to be a friend, and it's. It's hard to do all of that. And I struggle with like, being mediocre at 20 things versus being like an awesome specialist who knows a lot about a couple of things. And. But accepting being the big step for me was accepting that I don't have to be a doctor, but my gifts are, you know, that I can am creative and that I am open. That's a gift that I can share my story and that I just don't have to be great at everything and that I can just accept that my gifts are. And so finding your gifts, like, I hope that I can help people. And that's what we do at Alive and well is help people step into their purpose, right? Like, get well enough to where you can just be that full expression of who you're supposed to be. And I found that. But it's an unending journey. Like, I found it, it, but it's going to change again. And being open to that and being ready for that and allowing different people into my lives to work in different ways. And there's just like, stuff I've never even heard of. And even still. And I love, you know, just the breath work we did to start this off. I'm like, God, I really need to do more breath work. And just knowing the journey never ends and there's always the next level. And when I think about this across the first Time I learned I shouldn't eat glass gluten to today, it's like almost 15 years now. And the layers and the time it took to get where I am and then still have a bad day and just be able to roll with it, you know, and that's. I hope people glean that from this conversation. It's not every day has to be perfect, but there's still. You can have joy in the way you have joy is cultivating those things, things in your own life. But you have to be well to do it. Like cultivating family and friends and not everybody's going to have kids and just finding your community and your people and letting them be there for you and being open and vulnerable and. And allowing, you know, creating space for other people to do that with you. And. Yeah, just help people find their purpose. And I know that's something you want just people to have this just control. I want people to step into the control over their own outcome. And I hope that we give them the tools. And you too, like, you give them different tools, but finding out who they are and what they're supposed to do and how great impact they can have on the world.

I'll put a plus sign on that too. Because a lot of things that I want to control. I realize that I do my best to control the most loving outcome or the best outcome, but also part of the art and science of this is like, okay, well, I actually can. I can't 100% control the outcome, but I can do my very best to use my words as spells, to use my words as prayer, to use my thoughts as meditation, and to really connect with what exactly it is that I truly want without wearing my mask. What is the real me? What is the Josh that's way deep down in there? What does he actually want and why does he want it? And how effectively can he speak that to God and the world and to his family and community. Community. That, I believe is the ultimate deciding factor in all of this. Because my. My thing might change.

That's right.

I might. I might go through where I'm like, actually, I want something totally different now, but at least I'm honoring myself.

I love that. And you kind of said this basically, is that you can't be attached to the outcome. Like, you can go in with a goal, but you cannot be attached to the outcome because maybe it's greater than you ever thought possible.

That's right.

And you can't get there if you think, think I know everything. Like, and having that humility to say, you know what? I can't control every outcome. And if this outcome that I picture in my mind doesn't happen, is it going to make me miserable? It can't. Like, you've got to just know, like, you've got to leave that space open for something even greater than you could have fathom to happen. Yes, right. And. And just because you'll subconsciously drive toward that outcome. And so I always try to say, like, this is what I would like to have happen, but God let something greater happen because God is greater than me and I can't even. It's so much greater. And I think it's really important to have a God. Obviously, I think there's one right God. But whatever that is for people is there's something so humbling about knowing I'm a moment and there's something eternal, but that what's not nihilistic about that, because it could be, is knowing that. That God cares about that moment and has put me there in that moment, in that situation to create something beautiful and to find joy even in the suffering. And so I just think that's. That's the way to. The way to live.

Well, before I let you go, I have to talk to you about this one thing that we haven't touched on at all, because this is really juicy. So stick around, y'.

All.

I think about the way you balance everything as a mom, as a business woman, as somebody on their own health journey, emotionally in all five sides of the Pentagon. How does fear block you the most? And what do you do with the element of fear as you're balancing? Because I don't ever think there's a perfect balance as you're balancing all your responsibilities and all the things that you want to do and all the emotions that come with that. What has been your relationship with fear as you move through the things that you're responsible for?

Yeah, I don't think of myself as a fearful person, but I do. I do have fear. I mean, I have fear that my kids are going to grow up and be drug addicts, that I'm going to screw up my kid because I yelled at him too much or that, you know, something awful is going to happen to my husband because he's texting and driving to Austin. Just like little fears that come up for me, I think having a really good partner is part of that. Like a lot of the insecurities that I still carried into my 30s, I just melted away when I found the right person. When I found Michael, I was able to just melt into that perfect mold of who I should be. And it's because he alleviated maybe the fears I never was going to get rid of, like the fear of being unsupported, the fear of not having enough money to pay my bills. I mean, I had a good job, but that still was always a fear because I grew up poor and parents could barely pay their bills. And so no matter how much I had, I just never overcame that. Um, so I think having, you know, if that's not a partner for you, like a husband or wife, then finding some way to have that kind of support system that, that complements your fears, right? That can help you because when you're fearful, you can't think about anything else, right? Because it's that, it's that questioning of like, what's going to happen if? And your brain is constantly spending energy on, like, what's going to happen if, if. And it's a waste, like, then you can't think about like creating something bigger and better. And so I think it's just recognizing the fear when you feel it and not being upset about it and just saying, okay, why am I afraid? What, what little inner child thing is this coming from? And even I never understood her child work to its fullest degree until I did this breath work experience and we did the, this holotropic breathing for 45 minutes. It was just like I was like, in a little.

You had the tetany and the hypoxia.

So. And I sobbed like I've never sobbed before. And I literally had a, a flash flashes in my mind where I could see like me being hurt in life at 5, at 7, I did like, little things that people said to me and I was able to like, go and say, like, oh, little Liz, I'm so sorry that happened to you. And that made me understand where those fears come from and not to. And I could say, you know what? I'm. I'm snapping at my spouse because I'm afraid. And just recognizing how that fear manifests itself. So just whether that's a mental note or a jot and, and taking that fear and saying, like, what? Why did I act like that? And almost always is a fear, it's almost always related to like a fear insecurity, some kind of uncertainty that you're coping with. And you know, if you act angry, it's probably out of a fear because you're just like so desperate not to go down that path that you're angry, you know? So I think naming your fear in your life and however you get there, maybe it's crazy breath work that kind of allows you to uncover it. Maybe it's plant medicine, maybe, maybe it's going to a therapist and finding the right person. Maybe it's the somatic work. Like maybe it's whatever. There's a million things. Find your thing. But you've got to uncover the root of those fears because you've got to be able to talk to it and back it down and say, I'm not going to let you hijack my thinking right now because it's not worth it and it's not real. It's not real.

It's so good. But it appears real. Which is why we've heard the phrase, you know, false evidence appears, fearing real, the irrational fear. I mean, look, fear is not always bad. Like if I'm next to a cliff, it's good that I should be afraid. I don't want you to shove me off the cliff. Right. Like we don't, we don't need that. But, but the irrational fear is so interesting because it's, it's a myriad, it's a complex, I guess you could say almost multi thousand layer onion. That depends on your level of emotional intelligence, how much trauma I've honestly processed and how I can self reflect and be aware. Which you had said. Also another paradox. The more self aware you are, the more it can become. Can become challenging.

Yeah.

So I'm curious how you might answer this. And it's a question I ask every guest, which is like, my favorite question is like, because all my life I've been asking questions, but finally now I get to make a life asking questions which makes me feel so good. I'm curious for you, how do you define wellness? What does that actually mean to you to live your life well? And how did that change for you after your own experience, specifically when your mom passed? How did that. That life. Lived well, meaning actually change?

Yeah. To live well doesn't necessarily mean you're happy all the time or that you're pain free all the time. But to live well means you're not held back by some kind of symptoms. Whether those be, whether that be like, like an obnoxious voice in your head telling you you can't do something, or whether that's a chronic pain that you have in your back, whether that's, you know, your stomach being bloated all the time. Like it, those things can hold you back from being the full sort of expression of yourself. I know, I've said that several times. Now, but so to live well is to be uninhibited by those things. And that's kind of like your Pentagon. All those areas in your life need to be, to me, like, functioning really well. 80% of the time. Like you need to be 80% of the time, you should feel good and you should feel like you should wake up in the morning and want to get out of bed. You should have had a good night's sleep. You want to get up and your brain is able to not just be in survival mode. It's not surviving. You're thriving. You wake up and you're able to. To do the things on autopilot that are pretty basic, like get up, do your morning routine, get your kids out the door or whatever, get yourself to work, have your workout, whatever. And that's kind of on autopilot. So then all of your energy can be used to grow and to serve others. And to me, that would be a life of being well. Is that thriving, feeling that way most of the time, 75, 80% of the time, you should feel good. Days like that, where the basic stuff's on autopilot. And it's not just a struggle to get out of bed and do what you're supposed to do and check the boxes. It's next level of, okay, I'm out of bed. I did those things. I didn't even have to think about it. And what can I do today to serve others? What can I do today to make the world a better place? What can I do today to create whatever that is for you? And that, to me would be being alive and well.

That's so beautiful. I love that you ended it like that. Thank you, Liz, for being here in the studio. Tell everybody where that they can go and learn about alive and well. And I don't know if you're active on social. Sometimes we message on Instagram.

No, I am. I should be more active, I think. But I definitely post about. I do a lot more in stories than I do on my feed, but I definitely like to post. So that's Liz Swale at Lizswale on Instagram. That's kind of the only place I am, but I do a lot more in stories. I might not have posted for a while, but I think I want to do more of that. It's self promotion is a little bit tough for me. So why is that? I think it's probably related to a fear of not being accepted. Right. Like that stems from being. When I was a kid, some of it's just time that I don't have time, or. Or I feel like, oh, people don't want to hear that from me. But more and more, I realize they do when I have conversations like this. And, my gosh, could really help some people. Some of that's a little bit of maybe a little fear, a little insecurity, a little inadequacy kind of stuff that I'll probably deal with all my life to some degree. And then some of it's just time. But it has been a goal for me to start doing a little bit more of that. And then at Alive and well, Austin is our elevenwellAustin.com is our website where you can go and you can shop for all the great supplements that we sell. You can get started on a functional practitioner path. You can book services. And, you know, our plan is to expand that to 50 stores in the next 10 years. So, you know, let's go. Let's see if we can do that.

Let's go. Alive and well.

Yeah.

So awesome. 50. 50 places.

That would be ideal. Okay, we'll see. All right.

And unattached to the outcome stars.

Unattached to the outcome, because guess what? 30 would still be a win.

Oh, my gosh.

You know, maybe it's 70. I don't know.

Wow.

But I don't want to limit myself just by my own kind of thinking.

So, Liz, thank you for showing up so honest and being on the show.

Great questions.

Thank you.

Challenging.

Thank you.

Love it.

Well, because I want to know, there's a part of me, there's a part of us that always want to know, like, what is the truth about wellness? How do I get the wisdom in my life that I know know is out there, but I just haven't found it yet? And, you know, hopefully from my heart to yours, today you learned from Liz the wisdom that's guided her in her life. So just like Bruce Lee says, just like all masters say, take what Liz said, that resonates and leave the rest. And until Liz and I see you again, we're both wishing you love and wellness. We'll talk to you next week. Okay. Thanks for watching the podcast. I appreciate you being here. If you haven't done so already, click the subscribe button button and the little notification bell so you never miss any of this free weekly content delivered from my heart with care, right to yours. If you love this video, you love any of the videos on this page. Just click the one you want to watch next.