A podcast-style conversation between Josh Trent and Dan Martell (July 23, 2024) about self-sabotage, fear of success, and balancing ambition with presence. Martell argues self-sabotage stems from subconscious judgments about results (three core fears: judgment, rejection, success), illustrated with personal examples about wealth, body recomposition, and relationship feedback. The discussion also touches on how loved ones and social conditioning reveal where we are "not free" and the tension between drive and presence.
Chapters
The book is powerful, right? But there is no way, and I mentioned this earlier, that people take all the strategies in your book and their shit's not going to come up when they try to implement them. This is where the rubber meets the road. Can you talk about this concept?
This is the coolest.
It's the biggest piece. And I'll just ask it like this. If we go because we know what to do and we don't do it, why is that?
You brought it up. Self sabotage. See, for example, right now I tell my personal journey because I want it to be relatable to people. I'll do a few other ones first and I'll tell the last one. So for example, somebody wants to go and be an entrepreneur, okay? So they're like, I want to be my own boss. I want to make. Right now. It's that 10k a month is like the cool thing to say. I want to make 10k a month. I want to be my own boss.
Cool.
Well, making 10k a month for people that might be making 50 a year and is rich and they want to be rich. The problem is they don't realize that in that stretching of becoming that they have, they have, they have judgment around rich people.
How so? What do you mean by that?
This is where. So this is. I'm going to give you a frame to think about. All self sabotage is a judgment around the result. All self sabotage is a belief around that person and what's true and then a subconscious fear around achieving that. Okay. There's only three fears. Fear of judgment, fear of rejection, and the fear of success. So think about it. I want to be rich, but I have a money mindset belief that rich people steal from people. I have a money belief that rich people are selfish. I have a like and it's subconscious. They don't even realize it. It's the programming from the words they were said in their family member. I have a fear that if I'm rich, everybody's going to ask me for money and I'm not going to like that. So I'm not going to be rich. I don't want anybody. Dude, I was the guy that didn't want anybody to know that I had money. I was a multimillionaire my whole life and didn't give myself permission to buy my first supercar until I was 36. I could have bought it when I was 28. What the. What's wrong with my brain? Because I was worried about the judgment. I was worried about the stuff like what comes with Driving an orange, bright orange McLaren orange car to CrossFit. Dude, my wife didn't even want to come in the car with me. So I'm not getting in the car. I'm driving my own car. And I. But why? Because she was still dealing with the same. The beliefs and mindsets I had. Yeah, but that's where self sabotage comes into place. So everybody knows how to click buttons on a website to create Facebook ads. But why do you know I want to. Well, I don't want to be that guy. Well, what is that guy? I don't want to be Tai Lopez. I don't want to be a Grant Cardone. I don't want to be that guy on the Internet running ads with my face on it. I don't. I. Because what, you judged them? So most people scroll social media and they, I call it. They. They scroll and troll in their mind. It's not. They don't see. They judge the people that leave comments. Oh, that person's so, so angry inside. Why would they leave a mean comment? You're doing it. You are doing. You're scrolling social media and you are judging the. The new. The. Oh, that person got a nose job. Look at that person got this. And this person got that. And why do they have to always post their card? And, and so like self sabotage comes from unresolved belief about achievement from the childhood, the inner child, the trauma capital, teacher, whatever you want to call it. So it's kind of funny because, like, it doesn't matter, like, thinking. So the one, the example that's true for me right now is I wanted to lean out and re. Body comp. I wanted, you know, I've been into triathlons and CrossFit and all this stuff my whole life. Like, not in my whole life. I used to weigh 265 pounds. Okay, so I was a big boy.
Okay, I used to be 280.
Okay, I will give you a picture if you want to put it on. So everybody goes, oh, that was Dan.
Yeah, it's on the screen now.
21 years old. Yes, I'm in that person. You won't recognize me. And I've done Ironmans, crossfits, Ultras, all that stuff recently. I was like, okay, I wanna, I wanna recomp my body. Okay, I wanna. And I hired a coach and it's called the body recomp. And essentially we go down to the, the lowest body fat, 6, 7%, and then redesign. It's called the reverse diet. We redesign where we want to put things. And I remember Saying, I don't want to look skinny because I've seen some people do this and they look like they're sick, right? They get super, you know, eyes, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. So I had a fear around that. And I. But I at least knew enough. The process is speak the fear out loud, get comfortable, right? Talk to the fear, the pain, the pain cave. Just like. So I would say it to my team, like, hey, I'm going to do this, but I don't want to look skinny. But I'm okay looking skinny because I know it's temporary. And then I'm going to refeed. And dude, I come out of the. I'm at like, the best shape in my history of my life since, like pre high school, teenage years. Even better because I didn't have the muscle structure or the cardio. And I come out of the bathroom the other day and my wife goes, ugh, you look skinny. I'm not like, you know what I mean? And she got me, and I was like, oh, no, I'm looking that way. I don't want to be. And I almost decided to stop. I almost decided to go downstairs and have whatever I want for breakfast and have a bunch of stuff and, you know, just decide I'm good. I don't want to look skinny. She thinks it looks skinny. I love my wife. I don't want to not look good for my wife. Luckily, I was like, let's sit with that. Let's get curious. Why does that hurt? Why is that fear? And I went to the gym and I trained and I lifted and I followed my program. I'm still. I'm still in the process. And I post a picture on Instagram to share with people. Sweat every day, workout, blah, blah, blah. Her reply, I'll send you a screenshot of this text message. She goes, heart, heart emoji eyes. You know, the heart eyes. And I go. She goes, yum. She writes it, message me yum. I go, you called me skinny this morning. She goes, I changed my mind.
That's the feminine, dude. Dude, that is the feminine. The feminine is like water. It contracts and expands all the time. And I heard David Data say this. You are actually only as good as the last five minutes. Now, this is not a knock on women. Like, they're so. I love women. They're amazing creatures. They're so wonderful. They make life worthy. But gosh, we're so different as men. We really are, right? And Alison Armstrong and all the relational experts I've had on, they all point to this Fact, we. We literally, on a hormonal level, just feel and think differently about our lives. Vasopressin and oxytocin. You and I are vasopressin dominant. Women are oxytocin dominant. So when she poked you with the sword in the morning and she said you look skinny, she didn't know that was gonna crush you?
Nope.
It wasn't like she was trying to intentionally hurt you.
And how many people have people they love in their family make these comments and then they use that as ground cover to give up? That's my problem.
No doubt.
They use that as the reason to say, maybe I'm gone too far. Maybe I don't need to work this much. Maybe I should stay in bed. Maybe I should. Maybe. And. And like, that was. That was the big realization. I had a belief and a potential of self sabotage. And I almost did it. But luckily I'm. I'm working through it. And in that moment, I got on the other side of it. And it turns out my wife thinks I'm hot. Awesome, right?
Same day she changed her mind 90 minutes later. Keeping us on our toes, ladies.
Yes. No. And I think that's where, you know, I don't know if you've studied Peter Cron's work, but he, of course he's.
Been on the pod.
Dude. The world will show you through people and circumstances where you're not free.
Where you're not free.
She showed me.
Yeah.
And I was like, hey, worthy, Worthy opportunity.
Okay, well, let me just take this moment. Thank you, baby Carrie Michelle, for showing me where I'm not free. All the time.
All the time.
And actually, that's an unconscious projection. It's not all the time, but it's quite a bit.
Right?
Because as men and as women who are hungry about growth, I even. I was watching a talk of you on stage and you said, I'm just a driven guy. I'm just a very driven guy. And I thought, yeah, but how do we balance being driven with also being present? Like, the reason she threw the ring on the table when you were 28 is cause you were just all drive. You were literally the McLaren, but you didn't know how to park. So, like, how do we hold both of those worlds? This is one of my favorite questions. Because if God is singularity and duality is how God experiences God's self. And you and I are going through cycles of expansion and contraction or love and fear, which is a lot of what you touched on. And it's also how we execute the framework in the book. It's all the same. Then how do we hold both of those worlds? Like what's been the big lessons or the turning points in your life where you can actually hold both of those worlds, your responsibility and be your childlike self, taking care of things and being present? How do we do that? I mean, it's such a complex question, but I feel like on the spiritual journey, as we grow, our ability to meet these complex situations also increases as.
Well as you know, don't go anywhere.
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