Recover From Hypothyroidism's Symptoms by Reversing Hashimoto's, with Dr. Anshul Gupta

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Welcome to another episode of Five Journeys podcast, Live like youe Matter.

We're privileged to be joined by Dr. Anshul Gupta. He's a best selling author, speaker, researcher and world expert on Hashimoto's disease. He's board certified in family medicine with advanced certification in functional medicine, Peptide therapy and also fellowship trained in integrative medicine. Through his innovative approach towards Hashimoto's disease, he has helped thousands of patients to reverse their unresolved symptoms and live their life to the fullest. Dr. Gupta, welcome.

Thank you so much for having me on the show. It's a privilege to be here.

We're delighted. So I think we have to start at the beginning, right? What is Hashimoto's?

Yeah, wonderful. That's a good question, I think, because a lot of people kind of, you know, think Hashimoto's and hypothyroidism or low thyroid issues are exactly the same issues, but I want to let the audience know that they are not. So Hashimoto's is an autoimmune condition where your body is actually producing antibodies which is destroying the thyroid gland and that actually ultimately leads to hypothyroidism. So Hashimoto's is the one reason that people get hypothyroid of, but they're not exactly the same. Now in the current scenario, actually, Hashimoto's is the number one reason of hypothyroidism. Initially, when actually people got diagnosed with hypothyroidism, the number one reason a decade ago was iodine deficiency. But in the current scenario, because we have iodine kind of fortification in our salt and everything else, that reason is almost obsolete. We don't see iodine deficiency anymore. So the number one reason is actually Hashimoto's. Now, these days, so one thing, you know, like a lot of people have this question and maybe a lot of people do not understand is they ask me this question, well, what does actually thyroid do? Like, I understand that you Know I have a thyroid that produces thyroid hormone. But what does actually do? So thyroid I call is a metabolic hormone. Basically this is responsible for taking care of the metabolic needs of the body, which means basically energy production. You know, like our body is responsible for energy production. If there is no energy, we will not be able to function. So thyroid plays a key role in actually helping the mitochondria and other body to function in the appropriate manner, especially like, you know, taking care of the metabolic needs and the energy needs. So that's the main functioning of the thyroid. But the thyroid receptors are present all over our body. Each and every organs of our body has thyroid hormone receptors. So that means thyroid hormone binds to that receptors and, and is responsible for optimal function of that organ system. So basically if you do not have thyroid hormone, literally we will not be able to live. So that's the key and that's the importance of thyroid hormone.

Yep. No, that's great. I really, I want to back up and go to the basics of what is some of the symptoms of Hashimoto's and like how do people know that they might have Hashimoto's and what, what is hypothyroidism? Let's get first to the basics and then we can talk about how to help it.

Salt.

Salt, right, Absolutely, yes. So the most common symptoms of people that present with Hashimoto's is that they have issues with weight gain or inability to lose weight. Then they feel tired or fatigued, then they have gut related problems like constipation or ibs. Then they have mood changes like feeling depressed or anxious. Then infertility actually is a big issue that a lot of females are seeing because of Hashimoto's. Then we have other issues, you know, like skin problems or hair problems with hair falling or hair thinning. Again a major complaint that a lot of females have with Hashimoto's also. And then brain fog, that is another symptom that, you know, I see a lot of females coming to me that they're presenting with brain fog or ADHD like symptoms. So I think those are all like, you know, a list of symptoms that happen with Hashimoto's. Now these are very, very common or like, you know, symptoms with hypothyroidism also. So in hypothyroidism basically what happens is that your, you know, thyroid gland is supposed to produce this thyroid hormone. And in hypothyroidism your thyroid gland cannot keep up with the demand of the body of thyroid hormone. So the low thyroid hormone is Responsible for giving us all these symptoms.

Your description of hypothyroidism and Hashimoto's kind of like every human walking or every female I see with weight gain, brain fog, fatigue issues, getting pregnant, hair loss. I mean, it's kind of like everyone.

Yeah, well, that's where I was going to go everywhere. How do we distinguish that versus herbal bowel that has a gluten sensitivity? What are the testings? Or how do we distinguish Hashimoto's from all the other things we do in functional medicine?

Exactly. Again, a very good question. The re. So the question is really good because we do not do appropriate testing for thyroid in general, conventional medicine. You know, we are all taught up just to check one lab, which is the tsh, which only text, you know, like, tells us whether, you know, like our body is not able to keep up with the thyroid hormone production or not. But, you know, if you actually look for Hashimoto's, then we have to do much more detailed thyroid testing, which includes a T3 hormone, the T4 hormone, and along with that, antibody levels. So there are two antibody levels which are the thyroid peroxidase and as well as the thyroglobulin antibodies that needs to be checked. So these are the basic tests. Whoever has any of these symptoms that we mentioned, which you literally said almost every second person or every second female that you see has these symptoms. But these tests, the good part is that are available in all the labs and they're covered by majority of their insurance. So everybody should get these testing done. So. So that they can know they have Hashimoto's or not. If these tests are negative, then this is. Then obviously they have to look for other reasons for their symptoms.

So obviously Hashimoto's is gonna be treated differently than hypothyroidism, which does not have an autoimmune component. So first off, it sounds like you're testing on everyone. So you're gonna know upfront whether it's straight up hypothyroidism, Hashimoto's or something else. So how are you treating them and is there a difference?

There is a big difference. And that's where again, the conventional medicine kind of is not very helpful for regular folks. Because in conventional medicine there is no differentiating factor between hypothyroidism and Hashimoto's. The treatment is the same. Just giving everybody levothyroxine, that's the only treatment they have. But in functional medicine, we have actually differentiating factors. Hypothyroidism, the main Problem is low thyroid hormone and they need thyroid hormone supplementation. But in Hashimoto's, the underlying problem is actually totally different. It is this autoimmune component, these antibodies which are destroying the thyroid gland. So in functional medicine, we actually make protocols to help lower these antibody levels so that the destruction of the thyroid is stopped. And we can sometimes actually able to recover the thyroid so that the body starts functioning the thyroid hormone which is needed by it.

So let's pause for a second. You're basically saying you have found a way to tell the body to be kind to itself and stop destroying itself. Right?

Right.

So can you have normal thyroid function then, but still have an autoimmune disease? And how do you approach those people?

Very important question, you know, and that's the reason the complete testing is very important. Because again, if you only check the tsh, then you only are checking for that amount of destruction that the thyroid needs to stop producing the thyroid hormone. But I see so many folks that the thyroid hormone levels are normal, but the antibody levels have always been high and nobody has done anything about it. So if we actually, you know, like work on these folks, you know, like on a timely fashion, we can stop the destruction of the thyroid gland. And these people actually can be safeguarded from going to the hypothyroid side.

So what do you do for them?

Good. So that's where my three step process comes.

You make it sound so easy.

It's all in three steps, five minutes, right?

Three major steps, right?

Yeah, just three steps and you'll be all good, I promise. So basically these three steps, you know, like first we are actually looking at what is causing the trigger or what is causing the destruction of the thyroid gland. Because most people think, well, one day I just got autoimmune disease. Well, not really, you know, like your body doesn't think one day that okay, well, I'm just going to start destroying myself. That never happens. There has to be a reason. And that's where, you know, we functional medicine doctors are trained to kind of find the reason why, you know, why body destroying. So that's the very first step of finding the right triggers of those folks, you know. So I've divided these triggers into the five different categories. So these, you know, triggers are. First category is food sensitivities. You know, food is medicine. But food can also harm your thyroid or can lead to destruction of the thyroid gland. You know, so food sensitivity is number one. The second is nutritional deficiencies. Our body needs certain vitamins and minerals to function properly. Lot of times because of a poor lifestyle or even the environment we are living in, our body gets low on certain vitamins and minerals, which triggers Hashimoto's. The third, you know, like the underlying problem is toxins. You know, our body, time and again, you know, in our environment, you know, is being pounded with more and more new toxins every day. More chemicals in our environment. So that again leads to the trigger of Hashimoto's. The fourth is stress or trauma. You know, we are living in a stressful world. You know, sometimes work is stressful. You know, sometimes it can be relationships or divorce or even pregnancy.

That never happens. Relationships are, Relationships are never stressful.

I know, right? So even pregnancy, you know, like can be so stressful for like, you know, for female bodies. And we see that trigger of Hashimoto's that happens after the delivery because that's a big change in female's body.

I think people think of it like, well, it was a joyful event. And my response is, but it's still a stressor. Even if it's not stressful, it was a stressor. And people forget that those major life changes, even when joyful, can be extremely. They can tax the body.

That's all. Exactly. And you know, like that's what I always like whenever I'm working with a client with Hashimoto's, I say, well, why don't you go back to the time where actually you were diagnosed with Hashimoto's. Look like a year before that, you know, what kind of was happening in your life. And almost like 70 to 80% of people will go back and they will say, oh yeah, this happened or that happened or that was a stressful moment in my life. So the stress and trauma is such a big trigger that most of us basically ignore it. But that's a very, very important reason that people do get Kashimoto's. So that's my fourth category. Well, the fifth category, which is the infections. Okay. So, you know, like we deal with a lot of infections like viruses, Epstein Barr virus infection, or like, you know, infectious mononucleosis. Then there are a lot of parasites can trigger Hashimoto's. Then obviously like Lyme disease and other things can also do that. So these are the big five categories which are responsible for triggering the Hashimoto's. That's the very first step of identifying what all triggers are present, what all the root causes of the patient is there. And then actually the second step is, you know, like, start fixing the problem. The second step is, you know, we have developed this mitothyroid diet. So this mitothyroid diet. So interestingly, like, you know, as you guys might know, like, there are so many different diets in the market, like AIP diet, paleo diet, you know, sibo diet, and all those things. But interestingly, nobody has made a very, very specific diet for the thyroid gland. Right. You know, we can use an AIP diet for thyroid patients. Yes. You know, we can use a paleo diet, but the thyroid gland has specific requirements. Right. As we already know about it. So this, in this mitothyroid diet, the very first step that we do is what we call as elimination of things, which we kind of consider, like, you know, are the triggers for majority of the folks. This is similar to the elimination process where we are removing foods. So that's the very first step. So certain foods which I feel are triggered for majority of the Hashimoto's patients, you know, are the gluten, dairy, soy, corn, you know, sugar, processed food, processed meats. So all of those foods, you know, that we know are triggers for majority of the autoimmune diseases are also triggers for Hashimoto's. So that's the very first step that you do. Or that can easily be done by anybody who has Hashimoto's.

Food's a huge trigger for people. And so you're gonna get people from all walks of life. They're gonna either be the people who already said to you, yeah, I've been doing AIP for years. And then you say, oh, well, you can eat more than you're eating, or you have the people who are like, what's gluten free? So what are you recommending to people who have not done any elimination of foods? Is there a system that you say, start with this, move to this, or do you just wipe the slate clean? How do you recommend they approach that?

So if the people are totally naive to what the healthy diet is, then I generally start them first with introducing the concept of like, you know, what is the quality of food? Because a lot of people come to see me and they feel that they have been doing a healthier version of the diet, which is basically, they said, well, you know, I'm following a diet which is a thousand calories or less, but I'm still not able to lose weight. But on those diet, you know, whether they're eating an ice cream or whether they're eating blueberries is exactly the same. It's just the calories that matters. So I help them understand it's not about the calories. It's about the quality of the food. Ice cream and blueberries are not the same.

They go well together, though.

No heckling the guests, please.

I'm just thinking out loud.

Yes. So you're talking about nutrient density and the quality and phytonutrients, not just calories.

Exactly. So that's the first thing I introduced to them. You know, like, okay, we'll help them understand that, make better choices once they're ready for it. Then I actually introduce a concept of actually removing foods which are totally unhealthy or a trigger. So that's where I introduce a concept of gluten, like, why gluten is bad and how they can be gluten free and then the dairy free. So those are the things that, you know, definitely I start eliminating first before I go into the other, like, detailed things for those folks.

So you start with the food, and then what happens.

So food, then definitely. We work actually on some supplements. So, you know, like, there are certain supplements which could be helpful to supporting both thyroid as well as the mitral mitochondria. So that's what we start off with. So some of the supplements in that situations will be. Zinc is a very important supplement for thyroid. Selenium is an important supplement for thyroid. Magnesium is good for both thyroid as well as mitochondria. Then vitamin D. You know, like, a lot of people, most of the folks are low in vitamin D. So that's another supplement that we introduce.

D or B. D like David or B, like buzzing B.

So both, but definitely D. D for David, the first go, and then B for, you know, like a boy in the second step. Okay. Because, you know, the problem is that how many supplements can you introduce into a person? You know, I'm not a fan of introducing, like, 30 supplements, you know, like, to my clients in one go. Generally, you start with, like, a few supplements and then, you know, like, add a few more, like, you know, as we go along, depending on the needs. So that is what we do.

Do you use things that are blended or are you doing 1 zinc and 1 B12 and 1 vitamin D3? How are you approaching that?

Yeah, no, no, no. I definitely use the blends. You know, I like the blends so much, you know, because these all work synergistically. You know, like, these are not standalone vitamins. What I call is that, you know, our body is a symphony. It is made with so many instruments which are kind of, you know, going on together, so we cannot kind of differentiate, you know, like one or the Other So we have to use these blends in of all these supplements together so that the whole system starts working again. So definitely I'm a big fan of blends. That's what I use.

Are you doing the toxins eval at the outset for people? Because it seems like there's sort of levels and categories, right? So a portion of people are going to respond to just diet. A portion of people need diet and nutrient deficiency treated and then you're left with the toxic group. Right. So do you start your toxins evaluation at the beginning or do you wait to see who's not a responder and then make them do the testing? Where do you put that?

Right, so actually I put, I do that in again in a two step fashion. So everybody who have Hashimoto's will have some level of toxins. So what I feel is that, you know, those, everybody with Hashimoto should start optimizing their natural detox channels in their body. So what I feel is that there are five detox channels, you know, in our body which are naturally present. One is, you know, our sweat glands, you know, like through sweating, you know, like we eliminate the toxins which go out of the body. So that's where the saunas get, you know, they're like in the properties. The second way is, you know, through kidneys. So again, most of people do not drink enough water. So again I tell them, push them to drink enough water, good quality water. So that's the easy way of doing it, right. And then the third is through your gut, right? So having regular bowel movements, you know, everybody, you know, like must have at least one, you know, they can have more. That is great. So then the fourth channel that the detoxifies, you know, is through your liver. So again, you know, like, you know, helping them to pick better food choices which can support their liver. So that's another thing that, you know, definitely we work with. The fifth is the lymphatic channels, you know, like, you know, that's where the dry brushing comes into place which again people can do easily. So these are free things. You know, people don't have to spend a lot of money but they can definitely be very, very helpful in optimizing the detox channels. So this again, when people get started with us, I always tell people along with the diet, if you can start doing these things, this will be nice. And then after that, even if after doing these things, people are not getting better. That's where we actually go with full evaluation of the detoxification and then kind of figuring out what toxins they have and then making a specific protocol for it.

So how long does it take to actually recover? Let's say you all do all this stuff and you get back on track. You take your supplements, you do your saunas, you eat the foods, you eat a good diet that's right for your body.

You're perfect, right? You're always perfect.

Perfect. It has to be perfect. You can't.

You're always perfect.

You can't deviate one bit. How long does it take? What's the range? Obviously everybody's different. What's the range? And of 100 people that you see, how many actually people do you see recover? It's never 100%.

That's an important question, and that's what I ask a lot of my clients. What does that mean by recovery or by reversing? So for me, the recovery process starts with when people start feeling better. Because the quality of life is the most important thing with thyroid patients. So that's what I say, is that a lot of times, if your quality of life is back, you're feeling good. That's one aspect of recovery. The second aspect of recovery is obviously looking at the antibody levels. So improvement in the antibody levels is the second aspect that we work with our clients and getting them better. Now, again, getting the antibody levels back to normal or back to zero is never the goal because once people have Hashimoto's, there will be certain levels of antibodies which will be present. But if we can get them, because people come to see me, their antibody levels are 2000 or 3000 range. Well, they should be like less than 30, right? You know, so like, if you can bring them in a sustainable range of, let's say, 100 or like, you know, 50 or something, that's a win win for me from 2000 to like in 100. That's great, right? So that's the second thing. Definitely improvement in antibodies we're looking at.

How long does that take?

So between four to six months, between when we repeat the like, the levels, obviously within like, you know, a couple of months, their symptoms start improving. That's the first thing. Within four to six months, you know, the antibody level starts getting better. And then within like six to six months to one year, is that the maximum benefit people will see that their antibody levels will reach a trough level, like whether they're back to normal or whether they are actually in the range which is acceptable. And the third thing we actually see is that, you know, sometimes reduction of the medication dosage or Actually, even people are able to get off the medicine doses that again, takes between six months to one year. Because I'm a little bit more gentle with my clients getting off the medicine. I'm not the one that, okay, well, they want, okay, you stop all medicines. I generally don't do that.

What kind of compliance do you have with because food is such a trigger for people? So what are you considering compliant? And what's the excursion rate at which people can still expect to see improvement but not be perfect?

Because humanity isn't perfect and that's what we believe in. Whenever clients come to see me, they want to do everything in a perfect sense. I always tell them it is nothing like perfection. This is life. Life is going to throw things at you. You will not be able to do things perfectly. Not since if you try to be perfect, then actually you're creating the problem of stress and stress will actually make things worse. So don't do that. So I'll just say try to do your level best. If you are 70 to 80% compliant with the diet, that's awesome. That is more than, you know, like, you know, that will give you the benefit. But you know, like, what I tell also my clients is that just listen to your body. There will be specific food, you know, which as soon as you eat, your body will tell you that the worst food, you know, like, that you can consume. So if that is the signal that you're getting from the body, then try to be staying away from it for like as much as you can. Which happens mostly with like gluten or dairy. People will say, okay, well, I gave gluten for four weeks, but you know, like I had like a pizza or something, you know, like when I was like on a birthday party or somewhere else and the very next day, you know, like I actually paid for it. So I said, well, so see, like you listen to your body and if body's telling you gluten is not for you, then maybe it's not for you. But some people, some people come to see me, well, you know, I accidentally consumed some sugar. Okay, well, I did not feel the worse thing. I said, that's okay, you know, like, maybe you don't have to use a processed sugar. Maybe, you know, like you need to have a healthier version of the sugar. You know, that to the situation. So that is, I say 70 to 80% the diet should be followed. And then listen to your body and then the food which doesn't agree with you, definitely try to stay away from it as much as you can.

Got it.

That makes sense.

What are the most common reasons people will relapse? We might have just kind of covered that. But are there other things that throw people off and have them get a setback around their Hashimoto's stress?

You know, like whenever a client starts with me, I said one free advice that you are going to get from me is, is that, you know, like start doing some stress reduction exercise daily basis, either meditation or deep breathing or whatever you like, start doing it right now. And everybody, you know, like, not everybody I will say, but lot of people actually do not listen to that advice and always ignore it.

It was free. They don't value it.

Start charging for that advice.

Charge more for that.

Exactly right.

Do you have a favorite meditation app or website or anything else that you refer commonly refer people to?

Actually a couple of them. So, you know, I actually follow a meditation practice of my own. It's called Heartfulness. So like how we have mindfulness. It's called Heartfulness. So they have an app, you know, like they have several YouTube videos, very easy to do, you know, like just focus on your heart and then kind of just be in the relaxed phase. So that's one of the very easy, like, you know, things that people can do. So that's one of those things. Then their Insight Timer is another one which is a great app that a lot of my folks like it, very interactive and a lot of things that they can play around with doing it. So I think those are the good ones that I like and recommend all of my clients to using it.

That's great.

What are some of the resources you send people to if they think they might, Aside from your book and your website, which we're going to tell people, what are some of the other resources you recommend people look into to figure out where they lie and what might be wrong with them?

Right. So actually, interestingly again on my website I had made this quiz, you know, like a thyroid quiz which again, you know, like hits on all these five root causes that we spoke about. So through like a series of questions, people can actually get a good sense of which like, you know, trigger might be their issue. So that's one thing that you know, a lot of people. I say that again, it's free, doesn't cost any money, will give you like all these different categories where it will give you an idea of where you're lying. But other good resources, even for toxins, you know, like, you know, there is EWG.org you know, wonderful research. So you know, they have an app. You know that our site is wonderful. Like, you know, if you want to live toxin free, that's like, you know, the website that should be like on your bookmark, like every laptop or every computer because, you know, you can look up your products, you know, you can choose better products, you know, you can scan things. It'll tell you like what is good, what is not. If you're on a budget, you know, you don't want to kind of eat like, you know, you cannot buy all organic. It'll give you the dirty dozen and everything. So that's a one like, you know, basically like website. All of my clients, like I refer out to and kind of help them look out to. And it gives good resources.

Perfect.

So where can people find you and your book?

So I'm on social media. People can buy find me on Instagram. I have a YouTube channel that they can find into. So my, so my website is anshulguptamd.com which has tons of information. I have an active blog. You know, I write like, you know, I like to write. So I have a lot of blog post written which is research based. And then, you know, like I have a YouTube channel again with the name of Anshul Gupta MD. So they can find me over there. In my new book, you know, refreshing Hashimoto's, obviously we talk in detail about the diet, you know, like, so they can also know a much more detailed version of it. But my website also has information. I have a YouTube video, actually a couple of YouTube videos about the diet soon for the people with Hashimoto's, you know, I want to get this message across to them that there is hope for them to get better. Don't let anybody tell you that you have to suffer and you have to live this life which is limited by Hashimoto's, you know, you can do much better. Your life and quality of life can be much more better. So look for answers and you will get it. Okay. Do not settle for a life that you do not enjoy.

That's an amazing message. Thank you.

Thank you, Dr. Gupta. You are listening to Dr. Anshul Gupta. We're talking about reversing Hashimoto's disease and and this is another episode of Live like you matter.

Thank you so much for having me on the show.

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