Culture, Connection, And Resilience With Gail Davis
In this episode of the Proof Podcast, host Adam Markel interviews Gail Davis, founder and president of GDA Speakers. The conversation weaves through Gail’s personal trait of loyalty—both a blessing and a curse—and how it shapes her leadership decisions, especially when letting go of long‑standing relationships. They explore the importance of clear expectations, the role of empathy, and the practice of reframing challenges as opportunities, drawing on insights from Brené Brown and personal coaching. The dialogue shifts to the evolving speaker‑bureau landscape, contrasting transactional order‑taking with true partnership collaboration, and examines how the pandemic and AI have accelerated industry change. Gail shares anecdotes about AI‑generated content that missed the human touch, the limits of AI in replicating empathy and common sense, and the need for human‑plus approaches. Throughout, they stress that authentic connection, empathy, and adaptability are the differentiators that will sustain businesses amid rapid technological disruption. The episode concludes with practical advice for speakers and agencies: be empathetic, reasonable, and maintain strong human relationships to thrive in a fast‑moving world.
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Life happens, and not always the way we expect it to. Every single day we face change, stress, and uncertainty. What if you could learn to thrive no matter what life throws your way? Resilience expert Adam Markel and his inspiring guests explore breakthrough strategies to fully embrace change and build the resilience required to become change-proof.
Hey everybody, welcome back to another episode of the Change Proof Welcome to the Proof Podcast. I'm your host, Adam Markel, and you're going to love the guest I've got for you today. Her name is Gail Davis, and she is the founder and president of GDA Speakers with a career defined by leading high-impact corporate events and building a premier speaker bureau from the ground up. After 25 years at EDS as a corporate event planner, her discovery of Nando Parrado, the hero of the 1972 Andes plane crash. Helped shape GDA's foundation and longstanding success. As past president of the International Association of Speaker Bureaus, an active member of EEO, of Entrepreneur Organization Dallas, Gail has earned numerous top industry honors and is widely recognized for her leadership and her influence. I will say all of that is true. And she, in addition to being an amazing entrepreneur herself and an amazing leader, She is just a sweetheart of a person. So without further ado, please welcome Gail Davis. Okay, Gail. So yeah, I've just read your bio. I just shared with our audience a little bit about your work history and all that good stuff. But my question has, it's really the opposite of that. What is one thing that is not part of your bio or your introduction that people should know about you, or one thing you would love for people to know about you that we that we don't know?
Well, I was going to say that I can still do the splits, but that is my ultimate party trick. But what would I want people to know about me? I would say that I'm very loyal and that has been a blessing and a curse.
Ooh. Oh, you just made, you just made my job so much easier. Holy smokes. I mean, loyalty is a blessing. And, um, if you've ever been a, if you've ever been a loyal person or know a loyal, loyal person, you know why that is, right? Because it, it really, you know where you stand with somebody like that and, and other people know where they stand with you. So the blessing part we get. What, what's the, what's the other side of that, Gail?
I at times hang on for too long. So, um, Particularly in a small business, everybody is so connected and something's not working, but you love the person or you know all the good things about them and you just hang on. And, um, to the detriment, I've learned as I continue to experience life, you know, it can be to the detriment of the team at times when people can see that it's no longer working. So. That's one example. And I have a thing from one of Brené Brown's books, you know, a quote where it says, clear is kind. And I've had to personally work a lot that I can be loyal and I can be kind, but I can also make tough decisions. So I think hanging on for too long, that could be, you know, an employee where they're probably not happy either. You know, that's the funny thing. Or a vendor, maybe a vendor that has been there for me for so long, and then it's just not working anymore. And so, um, the loyalty causes me sometimes to hang on for too long. I think that's the curse. And then, you know, relationships matter a lot to me because I'm a loyal person and, you know, sometimes clients decide to go a different direction, but I can take that so incredibly personal and just cause or create so much angst around wanting to understand why, why it feels like we did everything right. You know, we've, we've worked together for 16 years. We supported their cause. Why, why? And so, you know, fortunately I have a group of people around me that help balance me and And we try to celebrate the 16 years we did have and know that the door can be open and they may come back. But, um, I've had to do a lot of work in that area. Yeah.
And that's, that's very, I mean, that's really personal work, right? Because it's
for sure
that letting go pieces, um, it often means that when we're attached, I mean, I feel like when I'm attached to things, it's, it's Painful. It can be painful. And then, and then the, there's a realization that I guess that, that the pain is somewhat optional because we get to choose if we continue to suffer.
Yeah.
In that way. Or we, or we, or we do something about it, right?
Yeah. Oh,
that's so interesting. My God. Um, and, and who knows, maybe we'll come back to that. More in this, in this conversation, because I would imagine there's a lot of people out there going, yeah, I'm dealing with that right now. It's, um, you know, what are the things that we are attached to? Right.
I'm, um, very involved in EO, the Entrepreneur Organization. And, you know, have had this conversation so many times with fellow entrepreneurs where they know what they need to do, but they don't want to do it. And there's a line that usually goes with that conversation and it is, Rarely do you let someone go or change the context of a relationship that you don't later say, oh my gosh, I should have done that sooner. So your instincts are usually right, but you know, sometimes putting it into motion isn't always easy. Well, it's never easy. It wasn't meant to be easy. If it was easy, everybody would do it, right?
Totally. So I know this is completely, uh, this is like a tee-up. We didn't arrange it. Um, so it's self-serving as well, but I'm going to hold this up. So people watching on YouTube, right? This is a brand new book here.
It's
called Reach Culture. But the reason I'm bringing it up is because literally on page 25, so very like right out of the gate, nice versus kind, nice versus kind in 25. So And you, you and I did not orchestrate that.
We did not talk about that.
No, no. But it really is. Um, and, and a lot of times, maybe, maybe you find this too, like we've done work with health organizations. I, I've got one in mind, but I'm not going to name them. I'm not going to call it out. Um, and one of the things that, so we did a keynote for them and then they brought us in to do some follow-on workshops. And the thing that they were struggling with, funny enough, was that they, their culture Was nice. Was nice. Meaning, so it was polite. They're, uh, they're, yeah. And they prided themselves on that, as I think all of us would love to be thought of as polite and even nice. Right. But what they really were, another word, you know, we get to play with these things, but another way to describe that culture was that they were a culture of avoiders. Yeah. They were constantly avoiding confrontation.
Yes.
Have you seen that?
Well, yeah, I have. I mean, I think I need to get a membership to that organization. Now that, that was at the core. I mean, if I'm totally honest, I like to frame it that I'm a loyal person because it doesn't sound beautiful. Uh, it doesn't sound near as flattering to say I avoid For years I avoided conflict and just, so yeah, that's the truth. That's really what it is. And it's kind. You know, today I had a conversation with, um, my EA who supported me for so long. And I used to hem-haw around when something wasn't working and she's really taught me a lot. But today I was like, hey, I need more predictability on when you're doing my stuff. And I mean, she came up with the most elegant solution. I mean, it's like, I'm going to give you the first hour of every day from 9 to 10. You'll know 100%. You can call me during that time. You know, it was so easy.
Right.
But in the past versions of myself, I might've just avoided, like, she's so good. She tries so hard. I, you know, oh, just the stories, you know? So avoidance, that's really what it is. That's the truth. There you have it.
Interesting. My wife and I, we're going to celebrate this summer our 37th anniversary. So we've been very crazy fortunate to have met each other in college and it to have worked out right. Because there's a lot of ways it can go. And so I consider being fortunate and blessed and all that to be among the reasons why. But one of the things that she and I used to do, um, haven't done recently, but we used to do some, 'cause we're part of some of those organizations like the Transformational Leadership Council and stuff like that. Right. And so we would occasionally get up on stage in front of these authors and other people in the, in leadership and, you know, personal development space and, and do a presentation as a husband and wife team. Yeah. On real, on relationships.
Awesome.
And one of the, one of the funny things that we would have this conversation about in front of this audience would be on expectations. And I, I tell this story, I say, oh, I came home one day and I said to my wife, hey, Randy, I think the problem in life, the problem with people in relationships is that they have expectations. And she's like, and she looks at me, she's like, you're an idiot. So I'm like, oh, okay. Maybe I, Man, this is not quite fully baked. I gotta go back to my, my thinking chair, you know, come back. And then I came back to her later and I said, oh no, no. All right. I wanna amend it. It's, it's unstated expectations. Yes.
Yes.
That's the issue. And she looked at me and she said, I think you're onto something there.
Yeah. Yeah.
Like we expect people to be mind readers often, don't we?
Yeah. 100%. Yes. One of my business coaches, she, she noticed a pattern in me saying how frustrated I was with the situation or frustrated with this person or frustrated with this. And she said to me once, frustration is nothing more than unmet expectations. Have you clearly defined those expectations? And I'm like, well, no, I haven't. Good point. So that, that, that is huge.
And like, shouldn't they know?
Yeah.
Right. I mean, there's, cause it's funny how the narrative works in our heads, right? To be like, how this person's been with me for how long? They know me for how long? Like we've, you know, shouldn't they already?
Yeah.
No. Right. So anyway, I think it's, it is, it's one of those things. And, um, and obviously in businesses, the, when we're looking at, at the workforce and, and how the workforce is performing and how they're doing, which our business does all the time, often what we see is that people leave a business or are unhappy. even, you know, or, you know, and poor engagement and all that kind of stuff. Yeah. Poor scores and, and culture because of a manager and feeling like they're, there's a manager that's almost like blocking their development. Like they're actively kind of in their way and some, sometimes worse than that. And I think a part of that problem has to do with what we're, we're talking about is the, is the idea that That these people that are responsible for leading other people don't have necessarily sort of the skills of how you manage other people's expectations, how you create sort of a transparency, if you will, so that people know what does it look like to succeed? What does it look like? You know, how do we navigate this landscape? And without it feeling like there's just landmines all around. And so I'm just curious, you work with, your organization works with a lot of other organizations and you are placing content providers, speakers, and thought leaders in situations to, to be able to sort of share those insights that might create a light bulb moment for, for a manager would be great. I've found that a lot of times the people in the audience are not actually the managers. They're more senior level folks. often and sometimes, you know, individual contributors, but, but not a whole lot of attention being given to that mid-level. I don't know. This is just an aside note, but—
That's so interesting. There's lots of, yeah, there's lots of C-suite stuff and there's lots of sales stuff. And then there's lots of all hands, but you're right. It is kind of an untapped focus.
Maybe, maybe that's, that's an area to,
yeah,
you know, good.
Yeah.
Because you have tremendous, I think you have influence with the people that are putting events on in terms of how they curate the content for that event. Mm-hmm. Do they collaborate with you on themes and stuff like that?
In an ideal scenario, yes. So it, it, I would say it runs the gamut from being an order taker, which is not inspiring for us, which is simply, hey, we want this speaker. And it becomes very transactional. They don't even want to pick up the phone. They just want to get the booking, you know, that it does happen. And, you know, if that's what someone wants, we can certainly do that. But the complete opposite side of that continuum is a true partnership and a collaboration. And we just had a great meeting like that on Monday of this week with one of our clients and they do events in 4 different cities. And once a year they all come to Dallas and Charis and I go. And we talk about what worked this past year and, and, and try to have an appreciation that it's not the same solution across the board. You know, what you do in Amarillo, Texas versus what you do in Abilene is different. But this collaboration and sharing, and then we work on the proposal together, and then we give them ideas, like you said, on how to, to build or make the unique locations different. So that's— That's true collaboration and true partnership. And that, that still gets me fired up in year 28. You know, I love that. Yeah. So it's so different than just taking an order.
That's a creative opportunity.
Yes, absolutely. Yeah.
That's so cool. Are there things that, I mean, not every, I don't think every agency, every bureau is set up to, to do that from a creative standpoint, but that's a unique Sell. It's a unique competency, I suppose, that you guys all have.
I think so. I don't know. Um, I, I'm sure you know this because we've talked before, but before I started GDA Speakers, I had a 20-year corporate career as an event planner. So it's something that I intuitively love doing and know how to do and I think it's really set me up to be a little bit different than people who started right out in the speakers bureau industry. So then I have taught my team that. And then we have, I know we have at least one certified meeting professional on our team and other people who have actually done event planning. So I do think it's something that does make us a little bit different.
Yeah. I mean, it's, it's important to know what a water setup and a coffee setup looks like. Yeah. I mean, of course, what it costs today to just set up coffee for an hour.
Yeah. Oh my God. There's so many left for the speaker after you do that.
For, for much of anything really. So you've been doing it a minute, as you said.
I, yeah, a minute.
Let's do this. If we look at the retrospect or the, or the, you know, the trajectory of your career. Is now the most prolific time of change or disruption to the industry? Has there been a time, I mean, obviously the pandemic was a catalytic, you know, kind of change then when we all had to go figure out how to do Zoom and work online and all that kind of thing, right? But I'm thinking about AI in particular. So I guess that's where I'm leaning in the question is, has there been a time when—
Clearly. It's horrific, as you said, just because of the speed of which it's all coming, you know? And I mean, in the trying to understand what's real and what isn't real is just wild. You know, yesterday I had the funniest experience. I consider myself astute. I mean, I have access to so many experts and thought leaders. And I mentioned EO earlier. I Saw a presentation that the president at the LA chapter in EO did about legacy. And a part of his presentation was this photograph of all the past presidents of EO Los Angeles. And I loved that photo so much. I just went crazy. I loved it. I thought, this is the coolest thing I've ever seen. It was probably 16. Past presidents, they're all kind of dressed alike. It's professional, but it just screamed legacy. I loved it. And I immediately shoot it to one of our members who's a photographer here in Dallas. I said, oh my gosh, can we recreate this for EO Dallas? And he's like, yeah, we just need to pick a date and a location and make sure everybody's available. And I'm like, on it. Oh my gosh, I can't wait to do this. And I get on the phone with the guy and I said, I love that photo. I'm borrowing that idea. It's so fantastic. And meanwhile, he's invited me to come to a session in LA next month, which happens to be on AI. And he laughs and he goes, Gail, you know the photo's not real, right? And I go, what do you mean? He goes, that's AI. Like my assistant did that for me just using everybody's LinkedIn photo. And I'm like, what? I mean, are you kidding me? And he's like, no. And I mean, I ran with it. I was, I was ready to. Can you imagine me trying to set up, what, 20 past presidents in EO Dallas to all be in the same location, dressed the same way at the same time? I mean, he's like, send me the list of your past presidents. I'll do it for you. So I'm probably going to have it this afternoon.
Yeah.
But I had no idea. The thought didn't even go through my mind. So yes, it's a tough time of change because everybody's, I mean, are you using ChatGPT or are you switching over to Claude? And are you, you know, are you automating this? Are you automating that? So yeah, it's a huge, huge time of change. I can look back over the last 27 years at GDA and I can laugh at so many things that have changed. I mean, think about when we used to do contracts and they would stage them for me in the conference room and I would go in and sit down and read paper contracts. And then we had these beautiful folders that had our logo on them and we'd put them in that. And then we would put them in the FedEx envelope and then we would send the contract out to the client and we would send the contract out to the speaker and we would patiently wait for it to come back in the mail and execute it and then resend them out. I mean, we didn't know DocuSign was coming, so that's huge. I can remember a wall in my old office that was videotapes, alphabetical by last name of all the speakers. And then we would order blank VHS tapes from some vendor, 30-second, 30-minute version, 60-minute versions. And we had a setup with like a VCR player, I guess that's what that was called, and then another one. And so we needed to send Adam Markel's video out. We went over to the M's, we found it. Oh, he's 60 minutes. Let's find a blank tape. Put it in over here, put it over here, press record. Oh, it's finished. Now we got to make a label for that VHS tape. We got to send another FedEx out. So if you look back, those are huge changes. And I remember my son, one of my sons at the time saying, mom, someday all these videos will be online. And I was like, how's that ever going to happen? Well, it did, you know? So it's almost like you take all those changes that took time that have happened and we've navigated through them. But now AI feels like it makes them happen in 4 minutes or 4 seconds sometimes. Right. And I don't even think our brains can process all the things that we can use AI for. So yeah, it's a huge time of change and it's very exciting. And I think it can be overwhelming, but I just try to hang on to this industry's changed significantly since I started and I'm still standing. Right. And, you know, it's like a, I often think about like a travel agent, you know, um, there are people in this world who've never used a travel agent and probably never will. They know how to self-serve with the best of them. There are people who for very specific reasons will never not use their travel agent and they know what the value is. So you just have to lean into who is your perfect client. What can you provide that AI can't? And that's going to be our sweet spot, you know?
Yeah. It's so funny you just said that too. My mom at age 90, she'll be 91 in 2 weeks, is still a travel, is still a travel agent. I just spoke to her like a half hour ago before I got on the phone with you. And it's just funny you should say that. And she still says to me, you know, I can't deal with email. She goes, I have, I have to meet somebody. I have to see them face to face. I, I need to shake their hand. This is how she, she does business. I understand that on some level because of course we know what it's like. Like she wouldn't, if I said to her, mom, they ghosted you, she wouldn't know what the heck I'm talking about. Right. But, but ghosting has become, it's a part of the communication. Kate's people just ghost other people. Yeah. And, and to your point earlier, it's hard. I mean, like some of us that I guess remember what it was like when that would've been rude, when, when that would've been offensive.
Yeah.
Right. Which it, it would be like, you see, you kind of have to absorb that. Yeah. Like I'm being ignored, but also something, you know, like there's something else getting triggered, which we don't have to get into. Right. But it's like something like that that's part of the The age that we're living in is a thing that, you know, you process in your own way, right? But travel agents.
Yeah. There was a time, to your point, that I would never have ignored an email no matter what.
No matter what.
Because it was our upbringing. It was rude. I owed that person an answer. Now you're so inundated. I'm so inundated. We're all so inundated. How people get my phone number
and spammed
and, and, you know, spammed and, and you don't know if it's real or if it's not real. I mean, I just got it. Yeah. Yeah. So it's, it's just a lot. And so now to survive,
you
have to pick and choose where you invest your energy and what you respond to. So, but I couldn't do it.
But Kayak, Travelocity, any number of these companies could have put travel agents, the pre— the people out of business. And, and didn't, and I guess, and didn't. So I want, I want to, because obviously we, well, I mean, we're hearing and we're seeing, because in spending so much time, you and I in, in front of organizations that are made of various, you know, cohorts, but, but the demographic has shifted and most of the, most workers are millennial age now and, and Gen Z and by 2030 and Beyond 2030, that will make up more than the majority of the workforce. So what we're hearing is that there are a lot of people very anxious about AI in terms of their jobs, their job security, and, and especially even coming out of college, people are getting booed who are delivering. And I don't know if you ever place like that speaker, the commencement speaker. Do you ever do that? Your firm ever place a commencement speaker?
Not really, because typically there's no honorarium associated with a commencement speaker. You know, they get an honorary doctorate degree.
Right, right, right, right. That's right.
Yeah. No, a percentage of an honorary doctorate degree doesn't really pay the bills.
You know, as an old lawyer, I could probably—
I get to wear around and say,
woohoo, we could probably construct something. Right. But so they're getting booed, some of these folks by, by the students when they mention AI and they talk about AI. This is become a thing recently. So I want to share a quick AI anecdote, a little story that's really timely from our part of the business. And then I want to just get your thoughts on this because again, I think you've already, we already, we didn't bury the lead. I think what you're saying is that AI, while being this prolific change, part of this sort of velocity of change that people, you know, that people are dealing with, that it's, that we're likely to be, it's net positive and we're likely to come out on the other side going, ah, that was the, you know, that was great. That was the best thing that could happen. And I'm the same way because if you've been around at least long enough to have seen, you know, a fair number of these, the hills and valleys of things in business and in life, you recognize What emerges from it is, is always, it's always growth. It's always feel like the story is always going to be net positive because it's, it's net growth. But we asked somebody and I won't again say who this is, but a video editor that's handled our demo reel most recently. And we love him. He's very, very talented. So, you know, we're, I guess I, that's how I view it. If you, if you look at my demo reel and you don't think it's so hot, then I guess. It's on him, right? But we think the world of him. So we said to him, look, we're, we have a brand new website that's about to launch in July and we wanted to update clips and we wanted to have not only the longer clips as well as the shorter ones, but even do them in video short, like, like a YouTube short kind of thing, you know, kind of something cool on a carousel, whatever. So he said, we have like the last 3 or 4 talks that we had recorded, you know, these big events in the last couple of months. We want you to go through and use your, that skill, that amazing quality you have for finding these, just, just the perfect like soundbite and or segment and pull out the clips and let us see them. And then we're going to use them on the new website. So he says, well, I'm going to also use an AI tool to help to speed that process up and, and get this done for you guys really quickly. So sure enough, he uses the AI tool. And it culls through these videos, you know, these hour-long videos of keynotes, et cetera, and pulls together a list of clips. And there's nothing, there's nothing unique about them. There's nothing so different between that clip other than the stage and some other clip that's already on our website. And so I said to somebody on our team just this morning, I go, yeah, he used AI, but he abdicated his core competency, Gail. Like the thing that was most valuable about him. As, as that will never be replaced by AI, in my opinion. It's like, it's, it's human plus, not human minus. He, he made it human minus, and what he provided to us was mediocre. It was totally mediocre. Like,
uh,
so yeah. And that's, so that's my most recent AI story relative to the speaking, the world of speaking.
Okay. I had an interesting email from a long-term employee. And I got it and she handles our finances. So if she's listening, I mean, I hope she thinks it's funny that I'm sharing this. I read it and I literally thought her email had been hacked. I immediately forwarded it to Charis and said, get with this person and make sure she sent this email. And the answer was yes. I think what happened is it was kind of a long, complicated thing. She, she multitasks like the best of them. And I think it was. I, I, it's clear she used some tool to summarize this and send the email to me, but it didn't sound like her.
Yeah.
And her core competency is she knows me well. She knows how to communicate with me. She knows what to lead with. And it was not that style at all. So that's kind of a similar story. Like I literally did not even think she sent it. So I'm all in favor of the AI, but don't forget who you are in the process, you know, and don't forget that unique, unique value you bring and the relationship and, and, and you know how people want to be communicated with. So you can't leave yourself out of the equation.
So I'm going to ask you a really big question and a hard one and, and to set expectations appropriately, I don't I wanna just get your gut on this. Yeah. 'Cause I know you don't have a crystal ball. Okay. So how do you think, how do you think AI is going to impact our industry?
I think it will be like the travel agent story we were talking about. Yeah. I think some transactions will be, um, automated, some decision making will become very transactional and it'll just go out and ask Claude or ChatGPT, who's the best speaker in this space for this amount of money? And they'll go with it. And so I think a lot of people who, who tend to already be more transactional and less relationship, it's just going to support that more. Right. And for the people that want something special, that want to rely on expertise, that want that creative component we talked about earlier. They're going to use AI because, you know, one of the things that happens, um, when you have a long-term client, there reaches a point where it's happened to me so many times in the last 27 years, it doesn't feel like I have a good new idea.
Hmm.
You know, I've kind of, they've, they've got the greatest hits and And now they want something more unique because we've been working together longer. And I'm like, I don't, I don't, I don't know. I truly don't know. So good relationships, we kind of acknowledge that, like, I don't know. I mean, you're asking for something very unique. I don't have the exact answer. I'm, fortunately, I work in a very collaborative—
There's transparency.
There's transparency.
Which means trust, right?
And often they'll come back and this is the perfect client. They'll come back and go, hey, you know what? I did a little research, went on AI, went over here. What do you know about these people? So they're, they're going to utilize that tool to come up with this list of people. And that's the other funny thing. If you go on the old World Wide Web, you know, you may get false information that tells you big name. Is a speaker and in fact they're not. Or you may get false information that tells you big name only charges $20,000 when in fact they're $200,000. So the good relationships, when we hit that spot where we're just not coming up with the solution, they'll go do their research, but they'll come back and say, what do you think about this list? And then we can say, actually, I know you'll see that person out there. They haven't accepted a speaking engagement in 20 years and they're not going to. Or, you know, these 4 people are all over $400,000, but by golly, I totally forgot about that person and they're great. And that's the answer. So that's how you can use some of these tools in today's world to make sure that we're not missing anything. I think that might be what we see.
I'm not sure if I'm giving credit to the right person, but I think it was Nietzsche that said common sense is not common. And we all know that, that phrase, right?
Oh my gosh. I love that.
I'm just thinking as you were speaking that, so what, what AI cannot solve for is common sense. I mean, we, we can't solve for it. So they, right.
AI can't solve for it. It's the exact reason that, by the way, I cannot believe your mom is going to be 91 and she's still a travel agent. That is, that is so cool. My mom just celebrated her 90th birthday in April and She's got some pretty cool real estate stuff going on, but by golly, that's so cool. But it's the reason those people have stuck with your mom, her experience, the places she's been, the conversation she had last week about the person that went to that location and didn't like it, or the flowers she got 2 months ago because that person said that was the best hotel they'd ever stayed at in their entire life. You know, that, that's, I don't know what your mom's name is, but her touch. Is what people are gonna keep coming back for.
Irene. Exactly.
Irene, the Irene touch.
So when I, I sent, um, I just sent her that copy of that book I held up earlier, right? 'Cause like a, like being a proud son or, and I, and I wrote in, in the book and I told her what I wrote and I'm like, you know, you've taught me, she, she's taught my brother and I so much about the value of personal, of the personal connection. Yes. And that That's not going anywhere. Yeah. The folks that are worried, you know, we are, we have a pretty wide audience for this podcast, but so if you're, you're worried on a scale of 1 to 10 and your worry is a 1, God bless you and great. And, you know, and if you're a 10, God bless you, but like, hear this. I mean, the things that make us human, the things that, that, that humanity truly is, are, are not going away because Of a tech revolution.
And it
is, it is a revolution. No. Um, so does that mean that, that there's maybe less space for mediocrity? I'm going to try to close the loop on that story earlier. Maybe. And I don't know that that's a bad thing, honestly.
I don't think that's a bad thing. No.
Right. If we have to uplevel ourselves or we have to, if, if what we're really valuable, our true value is the value that Irene brings to her travel business. Or that you bring to the speaking business, or, or that, um,
a
speaker brings
to the
stage, you know, a speaker brings to the stage.
We've seen this.
Well, then that's a good thing.
Yeah.
Yeah. Right. That's a thing we celebrate, not a thing that we, we are, yeah, again, are being in resistance to, especially when we know that that resistance in the end is gonna be painful.
Painful.
Anyway, so why, why go through it, I guess? So as we wrap up things, and I just so love that we had time together today, Gail.
I know, it's been great.
I mean, we've talked a little bit about the future of work in this world. Um, any thoughts on, so there are speakers going to be listening to this and people in all facets of the industry too. Is there advice that you give to your team to help them to navigate what feels like, you know, very Times of uncertainty?
I mean, I think, um, empathy, you know, any, you know, sometimes people hang up and they're just like, oh, you know, that person's difficult or they're so challenging or their expectations. And I'm like, it's all coming at us so rapidly and just be empathetic. You don't know what's going on on the other side. And I think empathy is another thing that AI, I don't know that AI can replicate empathy, but I think. We just have to, um, put ourselves in other people's shoes. And, and we have to, we have to all go through this together, I think, you know, I think, I think that, that's what I try to demonstrate. I try to demonstrate it with employees that are having a bad day. I try to demonstrate it with speakers that are having a bad day. But, you know, as all these things get streamlined, the relationships are that much more important. So if I had one piece of advice, to speakers and to agents across the board, it's be empathetic and be easy to work with. Be reasonable. Things are moving fast and it just being difficult or unreasonable. There's not a lot of time for that right now. You know, that is going to be a differentiator, I think, as we move forward in this fast-paced world, you know, being on the same page and striving for the same type of goals is really what makes long-term partnerships work.
Yeah. One of the first questions I ask at the beginning of a keynote is how people define resilience personally and professionally. You've just, I feel like you've provided a great definition. Uh, a great way to look at resilience is something other than grit or bouncing back. We love to debunk Those myths and, and, um, but the idea that, that, that you deploy empathy in this case, it's, it's a, it's a unique, it's not just a unique selling proposition. It literally is a, a human power, a superpower. It's a super, it's, it's a, it's, it's a part of our superintelligence to be able to do that, that cannot be replicated by artificial intelligence. And I also
think re— Framing is so key. You know, one of the questions my former business coach used to ask me all the time, is there another way you could look at that? You know, how can you reframe something? And she was so powerful in my most resilient professional story, which was the pandemic. And I remember her saying to me, This pandemic could be the greatest gift to your business if you choose to look at it that way. But she planted that seed. And so once I got over the initial shock of all of our events had been canceled and our team went from 12 people to 4, I started looking at what's the gift here? How is this good for my company? And I do think Um, I'm a far better leader than I ever was pre-pandemic. Um, the culture at GEA is next level compared to pre-pandemic. There's just taking clients for granted, taking speakers for granted, no more. I mean, every time a date occurs, you're like, oh my goodness, that was so good. So, um, I think that, that, you know, just Reframing and how can you look for what can be good? And I think in essence you were saying that about AI. Yeah, it's scary and yes, it's coming fast, but what can be good and what can be unique on the other side of this?
Yeah, I love that. My wife would call that finding the creative opportunity. It's, it's like you say, it's, it's, it's that reframe. Um, yeah. Oh my goodness. Coaches are great for that sort of thing. I had a, Business coach. And I still think of words she shared with me so many years ago that when things go, go a certain way, you know, that are in conflict with expectations.
Yeah.
You know, oh, it's supposed to be this way, right? I was supposed to get the yes, right? It was supposed to work out, whatever it might be that she would say, when you know what doesn't work, you know what does work. When you know what you don't want, you know what you do want. It, there's so many ways to
Oh,
it's amazing. And so we are looking for clarity. I always, I go back to that tool because the things that, that you find that are not working in your life, the, the flip side of it, we, we often will ask people to just do a T-chart, right? So on one side it's like the things that don't work or the things that you don't like or whatever. But on the other side, it's, well, what does that tell you about what, where do you have complete clarity about what you do want or what you do like or what does work? And it's, it's a fascinating way to, to see it. And the word for it, you just said it, it's a reframe. It's a, like a massive reframe. So that's so cool. I just love talking to you. Really.
I know. I, I felt that the very first time you came into our office and you were like, hey, be on the podcast. I'm like, well, that'll be a pleasure.
And I wanna say not every, in fact, most, most speaker bureaus will not make that space, create a space to come in and meet the team and, you know, have a moment to really, to do what my mom was talking about, which she still talks about connecting face to face, you know, shake a hand, have a hug, take a picture. And you guys, you guys do that. So I think, yeah, there are a lot of speakers out there.
You've done good work for us. So we, we do have a little filter on that and, uh, you've done good work for us. So we do appreciate that.
Thank you so much, Gail. It is a pleasure. Um, as my folks know, I'll, uh, there'll be a little postscript to this, but, um, but I so appreciate all the insights that you shared with us today. So thank you so much. Thank you. Well, I hope you loved that conversation. I thoroughly, thoroughly enjoyed speaking to Gail. I always do. She's just, as I said at the outset in her introduction, she's just a lovely person. She's got a very, um, her, her mind is very fertile. She's got so much experience in business that listening to her and her insights, even when they're just sort of off the cuff because she doesn't know what the question is, I think is something special because her mind just works really well. And to the point of some of our conversation, AI cannot replicate that. It can't replicate it and it can't replace it. So that's a good example. We spoke about so many really cool things about really How it is that great leaders behave. And I think she shared with us empathy being the one thing, again, that cannot be replicated by AI, that leaders today, especially in times of great change, really need to cultivate. And I think sometimes that word gets used, like a lot of words get used and become jargon. But through her story, through the way she created context for or how she deploys and grows empathy in, in her, in her business, I think we can understand it and see where it's more, more applicable for ourselves as well. Um, we really do have to sit for a moment, even when we're feeling like we're being ghosted or when, when someone, um, when, when something is, is interfering with our process or we get an act An outright no, um, to a request or, or when our expectations are not met, any number of things that would frustrate us. And, you know, Gail spoke about how her coach, how her coach addresses frustration as an opportunity, as a, as a, a chance to see where, where there's some new insight that's possible, where there's some new opportunities. Um, creatively speaking, I think Being able to, to really understand for a moment, um, without judgment how someone else might be dealing with stuff and, and pausing to ask questions that lead to greater empathy. Um, that, that's a, that's an actual strategy and one that, that is not the norm. It's atypical and therefore it becomes a competitive It becomes a tool, it becomes an advantage, it becomes something that differentiates yourself as a leader or as a person who's contributing to the team or as an entrepreneur, an operator, an owner, et cetera. So this is a big, this is something again that I think we have to pay attention to. Where are we human plus and not human minus as relates to the technology that is changing the way work is performed and the way that we are gonna interact with work in the, in the present and future. Um, so I love, I love that conversation. I love that we got to chat about my mom and her travel, her, her occupation, her business, and the fact that she's still, she's still doing it at age almost 91, which is just so dope. And, and I am shouting out and just propping up my mommy. My mama, uh, for the fact that she's still, that she's still after it after all these years. And that her secret sauce is again, not, not, not writing cle— more clever emails or deploying, um, you know, OpenClaw or a lobster to, to get, to get her work done. But it's really all about connection, all about connection in, in the real sense with other people. Which for my mom means face-to-face, a handshake and all that good stuff, which we know is challenging, uh, in the world we live in. But man, oh man, if you can deploy and use that, can be a master of connection, human-to-human connection today more than ever, perhaps it is a great advantage to living a good life. Enjoy, I would say having more, more joy in your life, more peace in your life, and to certainly be more successful in everything that you put your, your attention to. With that, I want to say thank you so much for being a part of this Change Proof community. Thank you for supporting the brand new book and its launch, Reculture. You can go to Amazon and just type in Reculture book and boom, there it is. And we'd love to hear from you if you love that book. Uh, please leave a review on Amazon. That's so helpful. We'd love it if you do that. And also let us know your thoughts. You can, you can reach out to us, uh, adamarkel.com/podcast, leave a comment, a question, uh, any, any thoughts for Gail, for myself, or thoughts about the new book, Free Culture. We appreciate you as always being a part of the community. And I will just say for now, ciao.
Thanks for listening. We hope you now have even more tools and greater insights to build resilience and become change-proof. Remember to leave a review on Apple Podcasts and you may be featured in an upcoming episode. For more resilience tips and strategies, including support for building change-proof teams, visit adammarkel.com. To get your own free resilience assessment, go to rankmyresilience.com.
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