Closing The Loop as Fast as Humanly Possible w/ Ondrej Sedlacek @Satismeter

I'm sitting in a conference room, I have a CEO on one side, a COO on the other, which I'm sure you can appreciate. And we've got a live dashboard up and I'm giving them a walkthrough bling live response from someone complaining. And my CEO looks at me, goes, haha, you got a problem. And then my COO is kind of giggling also like, oh, I guess you got to get to work. And within seconds there was already a response from the manager that they're on it, they're walking out there to have the conversation and you know, and then within a minute of me showing them the interactions, there's already notes in there from the feedback they receive from the customer.

Hello everyone and welcome back to another episode of the Account Experience podcast. And today we're excited to welcome Andrei Solacek Andrej is the co founder of Status Meter, an NPS and experience software.

Business based out of Prague.

CustomerGage and Status Meter recently solidified a.

Great partnership we're all really pumped about.

So we're happy to have them on today. In this episode, Andre talks about the importance of closing the loop as quickly as humanly possible. And he even gives a couple really cool tips of how you can do it in real time while your customers are either still in your product or still using your service.

You won't want to miss this one.

So. So without further ado, let's dive on in.

I'm here as always with my co host, Kerry T. Self. Say hello Kerry.

Hello everyone.

And today we have a special guest we're very excited to welcome. Andrei Shidlakic. He's the co founder of Satismeter. So Andre is one of our recently minted partners which we're really excited about. And he runs an NPS and Experience software based out of Prague. Very exciting news. As I mentioned, we have a great partnership in place. We're really excited to talk to you, Andre. So welcome to the show.

Excited to be here.

Yeah. So let's kick off the way we always do here. So tell us a little bit about Status Meter and how you help your customers.

Sure. So basically we help companies with online presence to automate feedback gathering through different online channels, typically in app inside the web app inside web product inside the web portal, plus inside mobile apps and also by email. And we combine all these channels to get as much feedback as possible. Typically as this channel is mostly about NPS. So I would say 90% of the feedback we gather is NPS feedback back followed up with some kind of some additional questions, but as I mentioned, the combination of different online channels gives us great way to precisely target each user at the right time. So we get good response rates and we get feedback in context of the product itself.

I know we're going to jump. I was going to say I'm excited. I'm sorry Ian, go, go. I'm eager to jump in here, you know me. So it's fascinating because again Ian and I have really been looking forward to talking to you and I know we're going to get into the meat of how this works and how it can really help businesses. But what I'm curious is before we even get there, how did you get to this point? What was that path or that journey that got you to the place where this, this is a need and this is how we're going to create that.

Thanks Kate, that's actually a great question. So as quite a lot of startups or a lot of SaaS companies, the need came from ourselves. We are co founder brothers, me and Jakub who is the technical person, technical mind behind Saddest meter and in 2015 he was the head of front end engineering in Good Data which is a big data company. And they were designing new dashboard. They had like the standard setup of analytical tools so they knew exactly where each customer clicked each user, how they behaved, but they figured out they did not know why in some cases. So they searched for a simple solution that would ask them, ask users if they're satisfied with the current setup and what they would improve. They did not find anything and they actually developed first super simple pop up inside the dashboard and they saw this amazing value of like feedback inside the product specifically tailored to like certain point in the user experience. And as, as this seems to be an issue with quite a lot of online businesses, we decided to build a product out of this need, you know and basically it's been almost six years ago and we are still, we still think this is important enough to actually dedicate our time to.

I'm genuinely getting goosebumps and excitement over this because I think this is one of like so many companies we talk to their challenge, they're moving from this phone call or face to face relationship to this automated, you know, SaaS online platform. And you said something really important. I heard one word in there that just screamed why? Why did you click that? Or why did you go that route? And being able to ask them at that point is so powerful and then expanding that out to just different parts of the relationship is just amazing. When did you know, you were onto something. Was there a light bulb moment or an aha moment where you said, okay, this is it, we've got it.

Actually, we had quite a good start immediately after launching it, we were able to get into segment.comecosystem or a couple of months into it where we actually the first NET Promoter Score feedback survey. And that got us first initial customers. And after that, I would say the more and more you see, even large online companies struggle with actually not only improving the customer experience, but even building the product that would actually help their customers do the core of their businesses. There's still a big gap of what the user experience is and what it should be in most cases. So obviously this is the NPS channel.

So.

People hear me out on this and everyone sometimes even, I don't know, you go shopping on Amazon and you just scream at the monitor how this is possible in 2020. So we still, we still feel there's a lot to improve in online world. So.

Yeah, yeah, love that.

It truly is. And you hit a hot topic there with Amazon. I've yelled at them quite a few times, both in enjoyment and happiness, but also in frustration.

Which is quite interesting because for me, Amazon is one of the like, they do a lot of things right, you know, they try to optimize the user experience as much as possible, but still it's sometimes frustrating. So. Yeah, but I'm sure we'll get into these topics later on. So.

Yeah, it's interesting. I mean, Amazon definitely takes a different approach to it. They really doubled down like the effort it took to complete and I think B2B that is applicable, but there's also NPS. There's something about it that just is super simple but also actionable and there's a lot of great stuff. So let's shift gears here and talk about action. Right? So we've talked a lot about closing the loop on this program. I think we've probably done five episodes on that alone. Right, Carrie? At this point, we're big believers of closing the loop, driving real results for companies. And that means, you know, happier customers, that means more revenue for your business. All of that great stuff. If you don't close the loop, a lot of the times that stuff doesn't happen. So. And I know Andre, and one of the main reasons I want to bring you on here is you guys have a really cool product. That's another reason why we partner with you guys, outside of you both being awesome guys, but you have some really interesting use cases that you leverage your product for. Could you give us a couple examples of that within status meter?

Of course. So actually, what do we see? Quite a lot of our customers use us along with other tools that are like live chat or Intercom, Zendesk, HubSpot, these type of tools where actually it's possible for us delivering the NPS feedback survey inside, let's say a web app where marketers monitor, you know, the media presence, for example. They see the pop up, they answer, they're not happy. Right. Why? And like, immediately as we collect the feedback, we can create a ticket in the live chat system so the customer success people or key account managers can actually reach out through the live chat and resolve the problems of the user while they are still using the product. You know, so imagine like, imagine two different scenarios. One is, you know, they write some kind of text that they don't, you know, you know, they answer the survey, it goes into a mailbox and someone reaches out the next day. And the second scenario, you know, they wrote to the bad feedback and in 30 seconds someone contacts them and resolves the problem, educates them how like it has happened. So the, you know, the reaction, the quick reaction usually helps you mitigate the, not only resolve the problem, but also mitigate the psychological, you know, you know, the bad emotion. Because like, if you can switch it like this, you know, super quickly, it's totally different than if it just balls in you for the, for 24 hours before someone actually reaches back. And also some of our customers really like it because during the 24 hours when it was inside you, there is quite a lot of impact on social media, you know, bad reviews and stuff. And with this, with this, you can, you can actually resolve much of that.

He checked all the boxes. I was like, what about social media? Because that's where they're going next. And all this. And we talk about this, the sooner you can close that gap in time and get with them, the sooner you can start being part of the solution and at least listening. And I think that's what most people want. It's, look, I'm not expecting you to fix it, but I want to know you heard me.

Exactly. And this acknowledge that we are working on it. And then you don't need to say, the customer, okay, I resolve it. But if they complain, you need to say, okay, I hear you and we really need to do something about it. And obviously once you resolve the problem, you should reach out back to them and say, okay, we resolve this. And.

There'S something really interesting about closing it quickly, right? And again, I want to harp on that because that's a, that's a very important distinction. We always talk about closing the loop, but if you have a detractor and they give a score, and how many times have we all been there where we're submitting feedback online or like, there's nobody behind this, they're not going to contact me. And then you submit that feedback and then you have somebody on you and you're a detractor and you have that dissonant feeling, but that customer service rep or that accounting executive is on you within 15 seconds saying, hey, I got this, like, I'm gonna look into it for you. That is an amazing thing. And Carrie, it reminds me a lot of the story. I mean, this is kind of funny, but the burger story in the airport. So I don't know if you want to give a quick like 2 second overview of that, but it almost takes that detractor and pushes them into a promoter. Probably better than anything. Even if you close the loop at a standard level, our SLA is like 48 hours to 72 hours is about right. But if you do it real time, I mean, I gotta imagine that moves them past the passive into a promoter, which is a really powerful thing. So kicking it over to Kerry for that one.

Yeah, well, you've heard me say this a million times. I think of it. I think detractors are your next promoters. I really do. I think they're the ones that have the highest expectations and if you win their hearts over, they move quickly into that promoter world. But you know, it's funny, one of the reasons why we selected customerage, I was a customer of Customer Gauge before I was a gagee. And one of the main reasons why we selected them was because they counted response in seconds, not in minutes or hours. And we always hear it. It's like we're changing the metric on this because now with the immediacy of response that I'm sitting in a conference room, I have a CEO on one side, a COO on the other, which I'm sure you can appreciate. And we've got a live dashboard up and I'm giving them a walkthrough, right? I'm giving them the high level, like, I don't want to confuse my CEO conversation. Bling live response from someone complaining about two people in line who are two people at the cash grab. And my CEO looks at me and goes, ha ha, you got a problem. And then my COO is kind of giggling also like, oh, I guess you got to get to work. And within seconds there was already a response from the manager that they're on it, they're walking out there to have the conversation and you know, and then within a minute of me showing them the interactions, there's already notes in there from the feedback they received from the customer. And it wasn't resolved right there in the moment in front of them. But just to know that we acted, we heard them when they spoke immediately takes that waiting time away because that's what pisses people off, really.

I just gave you something. Now I'm going to sit here and wait. I'm not a waiter, you know, I'm like, I want action. And I just, it's. Yeah, I think it's a perfect example of that story of being able to do that same experience that happened in front of a restaurant now to have that inside your platform where you don't even have to ask for a manager to come over. Someone's already on it. Your message alerted them.

And also for me, these days, as the integration of status meter and Customer gauge and integration with other tools, you can build the whole ecosystem so it works frictionless. So it pops up inside the mobile app, you know, we, we send it into Customer Gauge, so, so you can take it, you know, a couple of seconds after the person submitted it. Also, we, we, we can create a new, new message into your Slack or Microsoft Teams. So even the people who are not sitting inside, you know, the product itself or Customer gauge still know what's going on. You know, so with the whole ecosystem, I think like this is a beginning of a new era that people actually expect this to, you know, and actually, which is quite also maybe a little bit contradictive because obviously once people expect it, if you don't deliver it once it's become a new norm, then people are actually angry if you don't provide this.

This episode of the Account Experience podcast is sponsored by CustomerGage, the leading B2B experience software that ties revenue to your experience data in real time to help you make better account centric decisions that drive revenue growth. Quick question. What do you guys think is the number one reason B2B experience programs fail? Believe it or not, it's lack of C suite buy in. In CustomerGage's research with MIT, they've found the quickest way to align yourselves with the C suite is to actually align with what they care about most, which is revenue. That's why CustomerGage is literally built from the ground up to maximize and track the revenue contribution from your experience program. In real time, companies like DHL, Anheuser Busch, Heineken, OneLogin, IronMountain, H&R Block, SuperOffice and SugarCRM are already using Customer Gauge to maximize their growth by tying their programs to revenue. And with over $10 billion worth of account revenue actively being managed in CustomerGage, yeah, that's billion. With a B, they're the leader in the space. But maybe even more interesting, we found that once you get alignment with that C suite, the needs of these B2B practitioners, practitioners or the program champions are evolving too. In such a complex account environment, it can be really tough to measure and act on feedback quickly across multiple departments, divisions, or even locations. Luckily, Customer Gauge has you covered there as well with account native features that easily help you not only measure the feedback from multiple stakeholders in an account, but act on that feedback in real time. Because at the end of the day, if you're not empowering your frontline staff with the right insights to address customer issues, you're going to be dealing with a churn issue. It's not a matter of if, it's really a matter of when. Customer Gauge helps you distribute this experience data across your entire organization, regardless of department, regardless of location, regardless of division, all in real time. No manual spreadsheets or a team of analysts are needed. CustomerGage's goal is to help you create an entire company committed to best serving your accounts. And that's a powerful thing. If you want to see CustomerGage in action, go ahead and check out CustomerGage.com.

And get a demo of account experience today. You won't regret it.

That's a question because you brought this up and I want to dive into this for a couple minutes because I know we have people listening and are like, oh yeah, but it's not that easy. I'm sure it's a lot of work. Or this is going to take me. So talk to us a little bit. Imagine I'm not. I'm not tech savvy at all. Give me the pitch. Tell me how easy this is to set up in my platform.

It's super easy.

Okay, we're done. Next question.

No, no, no, no.

Okay, so, so basically there are two, two ways how to actually start using Sunny's feature inside a web app. Let's say, let's talk about the web, which I would say most of our listeners will use. And that's actually if you use segment.com, which is the customer data hub. Like installing Studies Meter means just clicking two buttons, like Enable Studies Meter. And that's it basically. And it like directly install studies meter code into your, into your product and you can start getting feedback in seconds. Basically, if you don't use segment.com, you can still take the simple piece of code, put it into your web app or web portal website, and usually a skilled developer can set it up in 20 minutes. So obviously some testing. So if you start implementing this in the morning, in the afternoon, you should be able to start collecting feedback.

Yeah, it's funny, we set up like a 30 minute demo for you to show us. I remember you were done like in three minutes. Like, well, what do we talk about now? It's set up and ready to go. And it really was that you talk about it becoming effortless and frictionless for the experience, but really the setup felt the same way.

So I think the setup of the feedback collection is one thing, but then usually people start hitting the wall of the integrations and suddenly they see that, okay, this is a Salesforce environment and I cannot like put something from Microsoft environment or something, something like that. But we try to keep this as smooth as possible. So when we, when we see a requirement for new integration that makes sense for a lot of our customers, like the customer gauge integration, then we just put, put a native integration, you know, you just click the button, integrate, maybe copy a key, you know, from the other tool and that's it. Oh yeah, it should be, it should be frictionless as well.

Yeah, I love that. I think frictionless, going back to the Amazon example, I mean, that's something that, I mean 95% of the time they nail. Right. Is just that frictionless experience. I think. And you also had a really good point is like people are kind of expecting things, but also losing patience. Especially with the whole Covid situation, everybody moving digital. I think everybody's time is precious. Right. So, and that's kind of a question from my end is we, we've been pushing a lot of this, taking care of your accounts and retention. And it's always, we've been saying this for like literally 10 years. And I think just now with the COVID obviously situation, that's kind of come to be very important for a lot of companies. Have you guys experienced a similar kind of uptick from your customers and wanting to collect that feedback? What does that look like for you guys on your own?

Yes, yes, I think it's quite similar to what you said and maybe even like on the note of the, you know, on the previous topic, like the B2B being slightly different for me, it seems that it used to be that B2B were all about like integrating or building these huge, huge systems that you needed, needed 10 people to, and a project to install it in a year. But it seems that the B2B is also moving into the like simple customer experience. You know, being as, as we, as we are doing this, this meeting via Zoom, you know, it's super simple. I mean, a couple of years ago that would be some kind of WebEx, you know, Skype for business. Something, something so true.

I mean, I remember using GoToMeeting just a couple years ago and it was very complex, very spotty. I mean, not to trash them on, on the podcast, but I mean, you're right, it's like Zoom does one thing, they do it very well and it's super reliable. And that's, that's one of the things that I think everybody loves them for. But I also think like you're right when you say the B2B market is gravitating towards B2C style experiences. I think they always do B2B always trails B2C. But I think it's, it's really picking up steam, especially again with the situation that these B2B companies realize they need to be a little bit more agile and serve their customers better. So yeah, it's really interesting stuff, man. So speaking of the whole market and obviously the COVID thing, so where do you see kind of the experience market or NPS going in like the next five years? You've been in the market for a.

While, so you have a pretty good that's great question. So, you know, I don't want to pose as someone who actually knows what's gonna be happening in five years, but from what we see, a lot of companies switch from the simple two question NPS that closes with a follow up loop to something slightly more personalized and more, you know, they build a customer journey map. They know the touch points where they need to figure something out from each of the customers, each of the users. And they actually target simple either surveys or simple calls, whatever, so that they know that each of the customers or each of the users is either on a way to get to the aha moment or to get to the next step on the customer journey map. Or they can find if there's a blocker so that they can help them move. And this basically, this helps them to build the customer journey across the product, across the service, across the support, across the key account managers, processes so that everything is basically one. You don't have the product and then someone actually on support tries to explain it to every user, every customer. But you build the product so that it, the customer journey is contained basically in the onboarding. Some kind of wizard, stuff like that. So for me, again, flaw, frictionless, seamless experience is what will be dominating. Probably looking at the NPS world, obviously I think the, the time to close the loop will shorten a lot. Also, the survey delivery will be not only via email or like the standard phone calls, but it's going to be through social media, you know, through WhatsApp, through like in app. So definitely much, much more channels because you need to be as close to the user or the customer as possible without. Without bothering them.

There's the key. Without bothering them. Love that. But yeah, you got to be where your customers are. Right. So if they're on WhatsApp, it's going to be easier for them to answer a WhatsApp survey. 100%. I love that prediction, but I think that's spot on, man. I think especially as you mentioned, the B2B thing, we're a little bit old school right now. I think that we're learning and Covid's definitely put a lot of learning into that process for us as B2B practitioners. But yeah, I think you're right. It's going to be living in the same channel as your customers do and kind of integrating with them. And I love the piece, not bothering them. What do you think, Gary? Not bothering?

Yeah. Well, it's got to be convenient. I agree. I think if you make them work too hard or put too much effort in, you run the risk of either getting an agitated answer or no answer at all. And when you were talking, what's going through my mind are like these micro moment transactions that we can survey people on and it can actually be in the flow of workflow. So if someone's moving from one report to another, you can say, hey, did that meet your needs? Yes. Boom. Moving on. So it almost becomes the next button. It becomes the survey itself. Right. And I think what we're doing is we're moving quicker. And I think to speak to what you guys are talking about with Amazon, Amazon has kind of done a little bit of this. Did that's, you know, like when you, when I'm putting in my return. Was that process okay for you? Sure. Are you happy with this result? They're serving me as part of the journey and me getting my job done and they combine that into one button, you know, and if it's no, it branches Off. Okay, let's do some more stuff then or. Yes.

Here, here's some new stuff to buy. You know, let's get on to what's really important. And it's just interesting to think that way. That especially B2B, you know, we're all busy. We have so much to do now in our daily lives. Can we bake that survey into what they're already doing? Because I think abandonment is what we see the most, the biggest struggle with, with an app. Right. It's like, oh, I don't have time for that. I got to get this report from my boss right now where if it was part of the, hey, good job, you printed your report, did that work? Yes or no? Move on. I think that's fascinating.

And actually obviously none of the users think about it, but a lot of thought needs to go into designing the survey so that it, you know, we always say if the survey is designed right, it will not block the customer. It's unobtrusive as possible. So they can finish what they do and then actually answer the feedback. You know, because obviously if the pop up would block the whole, the whole screen. Everyone remembers Windows 95 with, you know, unwanted pop ups, that people just rage, click the paper clip.

It's the paper clip.

Yeah. So, and, but, but if it's actually unobtrusive, it stays, let's say, at the, at the bottom of the page. So you can finish what they, what you do and then actually leave the feedback. Yeah, you get, you even get much more of the feedback because like people just don't click it so to get, get rid of it.

Yeah, that's a great point. It's, it's not just about getting it, it's getting more of it. But making the cut put the customer in the right state of mind. You're asking at the right moment. I love that.

Yeah. And that's got to drive response rates up considerably too. When you're not bothering them, you're hitting them at the right point in their journey. But you can also be prescriptive too. So you can get other customers that are maybe like you said, blocked and have some sort of a solution to get them from point A to point.

B, which is maybe, maybe one point that actually Carrie opened. Also, are the microservice or ad hoc service or service at certain touch points throughout the customer life cycle is that I don't see these as totally replacing the key account managers. I see them as source of information for the key account managers because they can understand where each customer is Much better than with a single. It's one of the sources of the information, the same as the behavior in the product, the same as the nps, the same as knowing they use the service, they log in into the dashboard, stuff like that.

What a perfect point. Because I don't think we talk enough about that as the person who's literally having to do something with all this, that front line. And for a long time they spent a lot of their time trying to collect this information from the customer, trying to pull it from them or send an email. And it was a very complicated system. And I think that's another thing when we talk about the next five years. What a great point. We now are getting that first question out of the way. So when I do have time with my customer, I can get to the meat of the conversation based on what I'm seeing and what you've told me through the platform and through surveys. This is what I recommend, this is what I prescribe. Let me show you a great article.

On that, whatever it might be.

Yeah, and maybe one more point to this is that actually if we look at the usage of the, let's say jobs to be done or user roles in status meter, so we see about only about 30 to 40% of our customers are from Khan management or customer success. And the rest is actually product people for online products that need as much feedback as they can have to improve the product experience itself. And obviously there are also marketers and like C level managers, owners, founders, but. But it's not only about the customer success, but it's also sending the feedback to the rest of the company, you know, so that everyone knows what's going on.

Yeah, I love that. And we are big believers in that. We've built a couple different products internally that do exactly that. Pipe the information to the right departments. That's so important and so underrated too.

And it would be actually you as a NPS guy would be super surprised how many companies just, you know, have the customer satisfaction tool silos. Feedback just stays there without, you know, being sent to the rest of the company.

I completely agree. And there's actually one main thing we run into quite often which is customer success. And I've railed on these guys a couple times and I think overall it's an amazing thing, right, for everybody. But the inherent siloing of customer success with the success style data in their department, I mean, it's like a natural silo that gets created around that experience data and it doesn't do anybody any good. It doesn't get out, doesn't get to the C suite, and then you're fighting the battle, which is a whole different thing. But anyways. But yeah, I completely agree with you, Andrea. That's a great point. And I think maybe let's wrap up with this final question and this might put you on the spot, but what is outside of Amazon, what is one of the best experiences you've ever had with a company? Company?

That's interesting question. So I'm not sure if it's the best experience I've ever had, but about a year ago I actually switched to Superhuman. That is laser focused email client.

Yes.

And I must say they do things right. The interesting thing is that they actually choose if you're the right user for them, you know, so they, they decline quite a lot of their users because they see that the match would not be great. So that's one very interesting part of that. But also, you know, they, they give you an intro call for a tool that is, you know, on, on a $10 monthly subscription or something like that, just to make sure it checks with you. And they craft the whole customer experience so that Superhuman is built a lot around key shortcuts and they even built a simple online game that lets you use the shortcuts so that you internalize them. So I think that was one of, one of the best experience I had switching from the standard Gmail into this like twice as fast mail client because we all live in, or at least I do live in my mail inbox quite a lot.

Yeah, that's really interesting. So I got an invite from a friend that is obsessed with it as well. And I've always been really curious to check it out. So this might be the push I need to jump in.

But yeah, I think there are two kinds of people. One who are obsessed with it and use it extensively and the second one who don't think it's worth paying for a mail client if you have Gmail for free.

Yeah.

But I find that fascinating. Anyone that determines if I can be in there or not, I want it more now. Now I want it just because they can determine if I deserve to have it or not. I'm excited. But I mean, you hit on something though, right? It's all about emotion. It's all about falling in love with the businesses and products that we deal with. And whatever it is, they tapped into you on that, right? They found out what's important to you and it's scalable and you appreciate, you value that for you, it's a small amount to pay for something you love. And I think that's important.

Yeah, that's what it's all about.

Yeah.

So, Andre, thank you so much for joining us on the Account Experience podcast. It's been enlightening. Our pleasure. For sure. Where can people find you?

They can find us. You know, either go to sadismeter.com or they can always find me. Violink.

Alrighty. Perfect. Well, thank you for joining us. Thank you to my co host Kerry T Cell for joining me today. And we'll talk soon, guys.

Awesome. Thank you for having me. Have a great day.