Navigating Career Transitions with Alli

Welcome back to the Ally from Corporate Podcast. If you're interested in learning more about career development, job searching, and growing as the badass professional I know you are, you've come to the right place. So sit back and relax. Let's get into it.

Welcome. Welcome back to the Ali from Corporate Podcast. Today, I'm going to interview Ali on a career transition, and we're going to chat about questions that you had on Instagram or LinkedIn.

So.

So if you're not, follow us there. We just started a new broadcast channel on Instagram where we're going to talk about career growth and whatnot, and this will be the first episode that's going to be posted in that channel. And today we're talking about career transition. So, Ali, what did you transition from? From where to where? How did you do it? Let me, let me know.

All right, so I transitioned from biomedical engineering to program management. Long story short. So you're asking how I did it, how I proved that with the skills I was doing in one job, I could still excel at the other job, plain and simple.

Okay, so for some, for other people out there, how do you, first of all, how did you say, I want to be in program management, and I'm an engineer right now, and this is where I want to go. How did the connection between. From. I'm here, but this might be where I want to go.

When I was in engineering, I remember my coworkers asking me, what are you doing this weekend? And I let them know what I was doing, and I'd say, what are you guys doing? And they'd say, oh, we're going to go work on our car. We're going to go work on our bikes, in our garage. We're going to go build something like an engineer would in their free time? Because that's how their mind works. That's how they're passionate. You know what I was doing in my free time? Remember when we were remodeling our house and I had a spreadsheet about when the painter was coming, when the baseboards came? You know, this event is contingent on this event. What order things happen in, what our budget is, the dates, the schedule. That's what I do in my free time. Naturally, I thought, you know what, I should probably get out of engineering and transition into something like project or program management. That's how it happened.

Okay, so you saw that you wanted to transition, right? And so you saw that. So how did you acquire these skills? How did you go from, I'm an engineer right now and I have these sets of skills, but program manager utilizes a different skill. And yes, we all kind of have those, but how did you display those? How did you make sure that the interviewee at the new place is going to be like, yeah, you have those skills?

Yeah. So I looked at program management, which is what I transitioned into as this new role, and I thought, what are the skills required? I looked at a bunch of job descriptions and I thought, yeah, I can do that. Yeah, I'm already doing that in my daily life. Yeah, I already do that for my projects. I had to have a really open mind, though, when I was looking at those job descriptions through the lens of my engineering experience. So let me ask you this. Have you ever planned a birthday party or what? Have you ever planned, like, a birthday party or like a dinner event for friends?

Yeah, but how does this correlate onto a resume?

So when you plan an event, you do the timing, you invite the list of attendees, you hire the caterer, you plan the food, you do the timing around when the beans are going to be done, when the meat's going to be done. That is project and program management. And I thought, I do that. And I do that for my engineering projects as well. I keep track of the timeline, the schedule. I'm already doing these things that I'm seeing on these program manager job descriptions. So I made a document that basically outlined my transferable skills in case anybody were to ask me, what makes you think you can be a program manager? So I made that document. I had that handy for every time I applied to a job. And actually, I didn't apply to any jobs. There was one opportunity for me in program management at the company I was at. So I changed careers within a company.

Sweet. But you still had to go through the hiring process. Correct.

Still had to interview, still had to meet the new hiring manager, negotiate with him, and come up to speed. There was probably a lot more training for me in that role than there was in my engineering roles because they had to show me this new software. I would be using, new projects I'd be on, new people I'd be reporting to. I had stakeholders. So it was a whole new ball game.

So you basic. So was that an email document or did you print it out and hand it to people with the transferable skills? How did that. Did you bring that to the interview and said, hey, I have these sets of skills and on a email. And so if somebody had it, you're like, hey, I have an email with all my transferable skills? Or how did how did that go? Did you just hand it to people or did you hand it out?

This was in 2019, right before COVID So I did an in person interview and I brought that document and I slid it across the table real smooth to the hiring manager.

Must have been super impressed, huh?

I think so. I got the job.

Yeah. So is this what you would recommend other people to do if they do try to do a career transition, to a list?

Yeah. So if you're going to do a career transition, I recommend that you make a Venn diagram. You know those little overlapping circles we used to make in elementary school?

Yep.

On one side is the skills of the job you've been doing. On this side is the skills of the job that you want. And then find out where they overlap. Write your resume through that lens so that people read it and they go, oh, they've already been doing this stuff, just with a different title, different responsibilities. They'd be perfect for this job.

Sweet. So that is. I feel like that is huge information that for me, that never did it. Did that. That's like an ace in your back pocket. Because I feel like there's always these questions, but when you have that in a document and people are like, so what about these skills? What about these skills? You can just be like, I don't need to tell you here, I can show you. And you hand them a piece of paper. So that's a really great way of doing it. How did you come up with that?

Yeah, I'll tell you how I came up with that. I like answering people's questions before they ask them. You and I talk about this a lot, that sometimes I overshare information that I should keep as an ace in my back pocket. But I like to verge on the other side of the spectrum where I like to give enough information to address people's concerns before they even have them. So it's a little bit dangerous because we know knowledge is power. And I'm giving away information that doesn't need to be given. But sometimes it really works out. Like in this case.

Okay, yeah, because I see that that got you the job. And I see, you know, posting on LinkedIn about, you know, how you did their little. The CNC machine, that little where you turn it. That wheel thing on a CNC machine. So you really nailed these interviews. So how did you nail all these interviews? So you had so many interviews. Job transition, you know, like engineering interviews, technical interviews. How did you nail all those?

I have interviewed so much. I know exactly how any interview is going to go, I've had them all. I've had the interview where the person hasn't even looked at your resume. They're not impressed. They look you up and down and automatically think, you can't get the job. I've been on. I've been in interviews where they're like, we want you. I haven't even read your resume, but I'm putting you through to the next round, so. And then there's everything in between. I have had every sort of interview you can have. I have been asked all of the questions, and I've botched interviews. I've rocked interviews and gotten offers. Everything in between. You name it. You want to hear a crazy interview story?

Tell me.

I interviewed at a company once, and I was interviewing with a guy. I looked him up, and I already knew that this guy had a reputation for being pretty pessimistic and not looking at the positives. I'd heard through the grapevine. I knew some people that. That knew the guy. And of course, I do my research before I interview. Hey, do you know so. And so I'm about to interview them. What should I ask? What are they interested in? So I get into the room with this guy, and we're going to call him Greg. So Greg prints out my resume. He looks at it, looks at me, looks at my resume, puts my resume down, and he goes, I'll be honest. I'm not confident that you can do this job. Why should we give you this role? And I gave him my spiel. You know, oh, I'm a motivated individual, and I have these skills and experience. He's looking over here, he's rolling his eyes, and I'm like. He's, like, visibly bored. So I stopped talking, and I'm like, tell me a little bit about what trouble your team's having. And he's like, well, I just don't know. You can do this job. You know, we're having these problems, and, you know, the manufacturing floor is having these issues, and it's, you know, it's a tall order. It's a tall task. He looks at my resume again. I just. I don't know if this is going to be a right role for you. And I said, wow, Greg, you seem a little jaded. And he. His jaw dropped to the floor, and he kind of sat there and he was like, well, yeah, we. We really need help. We really need. We really need somebody to fill this role who can do a good job. That's when I launched into my elevator pitch about why I'M the best person for the role. Why he needs to hire me on the spot and I can solve all his problems. And they hired me.

Not bad. Not bad. So how did you know. So how did you go about knowing that he might not be impressed to the grapevine? How did you. So if you, if was that an internal role that you already applied to, how did you even know that that person was going to be pessimistic about it? How did you know that?

I knew people that worked there and I asked them. You know how you get to know. You get a. The name of the person you're interviewing with before the interview so you can look em up, you know.

Yeah, yeah.

I have internal contacts at a lot of companies, especially in tech companies in the Bay Area. And I asked around and people have a personal brand whether they like it or not.

Okay, so you basically networked and then they told you through networking. Hey, this might be a difficult spot. Is. And am I correct with that?

Yeah.

So with networking you basically found out how the interview is going to go before you even attended it.

Yeah, the more research that I do before an interview, the better I can perform in the interview. And I call it performing because you do all this research and then you have to regurgitate it in a way that's convincing to somebody. So I'd like to do a lot of research before an interview. That's what I help my clients do as well, which you know, um, yeah, I want interviews, interviewers to drop their jaws to drop to the floor when my clients are interviewing there.

How would you know though, that. So, yeah, so you had contacts there. But if I apply at any company right now and I don't have that information, how would you, how would you go? Would you just contact somebody at the company and say, hey, I have an interview. Do you have time to, to chat? Would you go about that? How would you network with somebody that you don't know yet about the interviewee's reputation?

I would not. That could be seen as gossip, but I already knew these people. But I would probably not ask about somebody else when you don't know either person.

So you wouldn't say. So you wouldn't. So you wouldn't shoot out a message, hey, I'm having an interview. Be super interested to hear your take on it or something and maybe you can give me some feedback on what they're going to ask me just for me to prepare myself better.

No, I would not do that because you can look those things up on glassdoor.com Glassdoor has an awesome feature, I guess you could call it, where you can look up previous interview questions that people have been asked for certain roles at that company. They rate the interview process. It went well. It did not go well. They say whether they got the job or not, what questions they were asked, how to answer them. So Glassdoor is a huge, wonderful resource for doing that before an interview.

Okay. So you wouldn't just shoot somebody a message that works at that company and say, hey, Jimmy, you're the recruiter. You know, this is. I'm gonna, I'm gonna interview with Jimmy the recruiter. Can you give me some feedback on, you know, how I should navigate the. So, okay, that's a no go. Okay. Because that's what I would have personally done. I think I would have just like, hey, I have an interview coming up. Let's network and I'll buy you coffee and see, you know, and get some information. But yeah, that really might come over as gossip.

And, and I would reach out to the person and do the networking before you get the interview, when you're applying or before you're applying. Hey, I'm thinking of applying for this role. I see you've worked there for four years. What do you love most about working there?

You know, I feel like in the right now it's hard because, you know, the job market's so tough. But you know, in a, in a job seeker market, that might go really well. But I feel like right now you just need to be lucky to get a response from people.

Yeah, that's partially because of the job market and partially because for some reason people think it's okay to just ghost you in dating in job searching. It's unfortunate, but it is how it is.

Okay, well, now we're going to go to some questions from our reviewers. I think that was a very cool and insightful episode about how to job transition and how you did it. Now, let's jump into questions. So somebody asked us a question on Instagram. Do you have it pulled up?

Yeah, I'm looking for a job and my boss's boss just requested me on LinkedIn. How do I make sure he doesn't see anything I don't want him to see? I'm not an expert at LinkedIn.

So if your boss's boss requested you to be on LinkedIn, I would say just don't put the open to work banner on there. And if he says, why are you so active on LinkedIn, say, trying to grow a personal brand and I'm trying to be A better program manager. I'm trying to be a better architect. I'm trying to be a better. And I'm networking with the people in my field because I'm just passionate about it. Didn't you just shut up?

Yeah. If you are currently employed and looking for work in stealth mode, do not use the hashtag OpenToWork green banner on LinkedIn. There's another option, though. If you go to your profile and I think if you click more those three dots by your picture, it'll say no. There's a button that says open to and you can do open to work. And there's two options, one for recruiters only, which I would recommend, or the other one is like letting everybody know, hello, I'm open to work. So if your boss's boss requests you, you can accept the request or not, you don't have to. And you can not post that you're job searching, but you can still change your banner, you can still post, you can still comment on other people's stuff. I actually had this conversation with our newest client today, and I said, hey, you're currently employed. Do you still want to start posting on LinkedIn and creating a personal brand for yourself? I think it could help your job search. And they said, yeah. They said, yeah, I'm okay with that. Because benefit of the doubt, yeah, anybody can start a personal brand whenever they want. It doesn't mean you're job searching.

So I feel like it just adds so much more value to any company if you do engage with your fellow peers that are in the same industry and you can share insights, tools, ticks, tricks, all these kind of crazy things that you can do. And so if they, if your company does not want you to be on LinkedIn, you need a find a job and get out. Because if they don't want you to grow as a professional, you're in the wrong spot.

Yep. But there's a couple kinds of posts that are not going to be favorable in the eyes of your company if you do start posting on LinkedIn. So one of our clients came to me and said, hey, I want to work with you. And I said, great, let's get. Let's start and get you posting on LinkedIn. And they were like, well, I'm nervous about that because I got in trouble with HR in the past. And I said, well, what did you post? And they said, I posted that I got laid off. And I said, why? The company laid me off. And I said, ah. And they probably asked you to take that down. I think it's always okay to talk about companies anonymously without naming them on LinkedIn. I tell stories about companies I've been at forever, but I always say a previous company I worked at, I never named the company. So that's why I think HR had an issue with that. I think if this person would have kept it a little more vague and just made it about them. I got laid off. I'm job searching. I think it would have been fine. Also, remember when I got in trouble from HR at my last company?

Yeah. But that was because of different reasons.

That was because of different reasons, but they. I made a viral video about my opinion, and I guess somebody called and complained to the company I work at. And so I got a call from HR saying that the public are calling and complaining about me and they wanted to make sure that the company didn't share the same views as me. So they asked me if I would put a little disclaimer on my LinkedIn saying these are my own thoughts, not those of my company. And I did. And that was it.

Yeah. Sweet. So we're going to cap this episode.